Historical Inaccuracy In Movies and Games
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ก.ค. 2024
- What would a movie look like if it were perfectly historically accurate? In this video we'll look at inaccuracy of the plot, arms and armour and combat in movies and video games.
Like this video? Check out my full historical review of the OutLaw King from Netflix.
• OUTLAW KING - WRONG AR... - บันเทิง
I hate in movies where infantry breaks formation or when mail is cut like butter
In the first "Viking" battles they used Shieldwall and Boarhead formations in combat but later in the series ...
Unless the weapons are magic, no armor should cut like butter.
In the movies, it's all Rule of Cool and the hell with the idea that soldiers are trained and disciplined. The only time they should break formation is if the enemy penetrates their lines, and then the surviving captains or sergeants (or their equivalents) better be reorganizing the soldiers to counterattack.
Most movies think armor was just a fashion choice.
@@goran77ish - The Knight of the Dragon (Spanish: El caballero del dragón), a.k.a. Star Knight. There's an alien, and a supposed dragon, and a scene in which Harvey Keitel's character is trying on his new armor. The armorer talks like a stereotypically gay tailor in the dub.
If you park your brain at the door, it's enjoyable.
@@jarlnils435 sorry to tell you guys but "historical" tactics in movies is not what brings the crowd
Anglosaxons in ancient chineese armor and 16th century burgonets, opened machinegun fire on vikings wearing modern biker gear, duel wieldng xiphos and 18th century katanas in front of 21 century Toronto and then...
THE WINGED HUSSARS ARRIVED!!!
I'd watch the shit out of that
sounds like bf5
I would watch the shit out of that.
COMING DOWN THE MOUNTAIN-SIDE!
I would watch the shit out of that
Metatron: "Now imagine knights with guns."
Me, an idiot: "That actually sounds badass."
Metatron: NOOO-
That would be horrifying, a knight running around with dual wield mg 42
*Pary this you filthy Casual *
they actually did use it in medieval times but wasn't good enogh
So bascially Warhammer 40k
Makes me wonder what a modern day knight would look like.
I think movie/TV series makers just don't care at all.
They only seem to concern about the looks of their product and if it looks "cool" enough for the audience (which they think is completely stupid).
Rule of cool isn't the worst thing in the world (I mean, it gave us RWBY for peat's sake), but there's a limit that the rational person can tolerate.
-it doesn't help that the average viewer is completely fucking retarded-
@Big Brother
Agreed.
The stupid thing is the more people are used to see "cool*" leather armor or swordfighting, the more it is accepted as the norm.
So, many people don't even have the chance to see that most things they are used to see in movies is completely nonsense in reality.
And a usual the more over the top a movie gets the more people run into the cinema to watch it. Since movie makers want to top other movies, they make their new movie even more over the top which created a spiral of ridiculousness we saw in the last decades, where some historical movies became flat our absurd.
(btw. is that robin hood movie still a thing?)
*cool in the sense what the producers think is cool.
@@nealsterling8151 Honestly, I don't mind it when historical things go over the top, but I really think directors and producers should take a crash course in the time period they're recreating, which when they've done that can allow them to make over the top things that are feasible. So far, only For Honour has done anything close, which while it isn't the most historically accurate the devs do pay their homage to being practical and having some accuracy, with it's swift and deadly fights that can emulate how a real fight feels even if it doesn't look real.
And yes, that Robin Hood movie is still a thing and honestly, in terms of "historical accuracy," it does do a serviceable job but the mix of modern day and history just something that makes me want to fill my ears with black powder. I still have an old collection of Robin Hood short stories and that reads better than this film.
I think some do care. But the channels they use to find historical consultants probably don't have the youtubers who really specialize into this sort of thing.
I've met a lot of production designers who follow their gut then fail miserably.
schoolteacher, trained linguist, historical reenactor, founder of the Leggio XX, famous youtuber, but most of all Mime. ;)
Well, a mime is a terrible thing to waste.
I'm an IT administrator, know three chords on the guitar, and can recite a few poems when sober.
@@neilwilson5785 story of my life but without the poems
3:38 When someone says that *ROME* wasn't pivotal to the history of the mediterranean or the world.
Rubbish, what have the Roman's ever done for us....?
Besides the wine
@@My_initials_are_O.G.cuz_I_am r/woooosh
@@My_initials_are_O.G.cuz_I_am does not get the reference
@@13thcentury The aqueduct.
Your English pronunciation is outstanding! And your videos are amazing too!
Even though I’m Italian I’m writing to you in English 😅
Keep up the good work! ☺️👍👍
Thanks! Grazie!
*If I see Pommel Throwing in a movie*
Its historically accurate 100%
Only if the person on the receiving end is completely obliterated.
In that case For Honor and Mordhau are 100% accurate.
Pommel = Holy Hand Grenade
Starring: Skallagrim
Damn, metatron packin' heat 3:37
Keep up with your work I'm learning so much out of your videos. With pleasure!! An amazing teacher
I'm glad to hear that
Metatron lol I knew you would reply to this comment 🤫
Vikings lost me last season when they ran with the theory that women were a part of the warrior class all because of one burial plot. Having a town full of badass Norse barbies fighting a group of berserkers was just silly.
@starshipeleven Except that WW is pure fantasy (as are Valkyries) whereas in the past the Viking producers prided themselves on historical accuracy (to a point). Still, at least they look hot!☺
Soo... the waterfall in uppsala didnt upset you? Or the magically appearing rowboat they used in lindisfarne? (In the storm before, we saw the entire deck of their ship, they had no small boat onboard, so presumably, someone swam ashore, fetched that boat, rowed back to ferry his friends ashore.. instead of just landing the ship.. then, the vikings left two men to guard the ship... the english then presumably swam out to the ship, in full armour, knocked them unconcious, and dragged them ashore just to execute them as the vikings returned?)
Need I go on?
I don't get the "Norse Barbies" thing. Is it what they were wearing? I don't watch the show so it's tge only thing I can understand because there were some female warriors throughout the ages, some ages and places mire than others, but still, and more importantly, a woman doesn't have to look bulky to be an awesome warrior.
They lost me when they abandoned using shield walls in favor of general melee during battle. And then having main characters pair off for dramatic duels as a circle forms in the midst of said melee. And then having one side call out to retreat, and everyone immediately ceases hostilities as the retreating side runs away without further harassment. Never mind that the sides were so mixed up that you had individual fights on all points of the battlefield. Which means that some combatants were hoofing it for about a quarter mile before they were clear of the winning side standing in place cheering with their swords held aloft.
the show was always been more of a fantasy with similar historical names in the sagas. Even the writer/creator willingly admitted to it in many interviews. That's why it also include a heavy handed supernatural norse mythos stuff in the first place.
thank you very much for your short literal demonstration of the differences between video game depictions of movement with sword/shield vs more realistic. i have never seen it shown side to side like that and it really shows the stark difference and i can already imagine the implications it would have in actual combat (i.e. a much more calculated, timing-based approach). i recently found your channel and have quickly become a fan, please continue to make more!
Plz more of this, greetings from Chile, you are one of my inspirations for my comics, you basically teach me all I needed to draw historical accurate medieval armor and weapons. Thank you a lot Metatron.
Metatron your videos are amazing. I love how you bring out the truth about world history. I can't go a day without having to watch at least a couple of your videos. Its nice to see someone else that loves history as much as I do. Love your channel and hope to see more great videos in the future. Thank you for bringing culture back to the modern day.
I'm glad to read that and thanks for watching
Terry Carrillo a huge undertaking to be sure.
can't wait for your review of the "outlaw king" watched it the other day and i enjoyed it
Hi Metatron! I love learning about movie/video game inaccuracies so I hope you will continue doing more! :)
Hey Metatron, another great educational video, thank you for sharing.
Looking forward to your review of Outlaw King!
Starts with the Dragon Age Origins theme!!! epic!!!
Thanks, Ralph! I wish you were my history teacher. You educate people very well. Keep it up!!
The gun at 3:50. That got me. Hahahahahaha. That was brilliant. Well done sir.
I almost fell out of my chair laughing when you held up the gun. That was just so funny!
Another excellent point , thanks for the video. As always, a source of knowledge.
Looking forward to the Outlaw King review. :)
Thank you for your devotion to historical accuracy Metatron!
Thank you for the video!
IS GOBLIN SLAYER HISTORICALLY ACCURATE? DID HE REALLY IGNORE EVERY WAIFU IN HIS GOBLIN OBSESSION?
He prefers goblin waifus :)
Could not agree more! Keep up the good work SPQR from bama
High quality vid congrats!
What an awesome video! When I started to teach my son's real sword play they wanted to spin and twirl like they do in the video games and movies so I get this video. Thank you for setting the record straight Metatron! I loved the ending by the way. Was that a hidden elevator at the end? Lol!
Bravoooo!!!! At least you guys an impact. I am a fan of all of the mentioned creators of medieval/historical channels that are more accurate then "History" Channel ( talking about Aliens is more interesting then history... cause why not) . I praise your contents and often share it with people who loves medieval history and try to make you more influential on our knowledge. Your professional and academic approach is the thing that get me hooked to your channel Metatron. Bravo and best regards.
loved the video but i have to admit, hearing Leliana's theme from Dragon Age origins in the beginning was truly the icing on the cake :)
I will be awaiting for a review of yours on Mount and Blade: With Fire and Sword.
Hello Metatron, i havent been watching your videos lately but im happy to see that you have continued to male quality content and i have a lot to watch now :).
Edit: i think it would be great if you made a video talking more about your reennactment group and how it was created
Hi.
Love your videos, and the videos of the guys you mentioned (as well as those of a few others... Ton Puey, which I have met and worked with once or twice has some really interesting research online about destreza - montante and rapier I think you would enjoy).
I am a modern fencing instructor, I study and practice HEMA as well as some eastern martial arts.
I have a bachelor's degree in acting and work as an actor, director and theatre teacher.
With my mixed training I specialized in stage fighting and artistic fencing, developing work specifically for that effect.
Keeping all this in mind allow me to tell you that, although in most cases fighting in movies, theatre and television could seem a little more correct in therms of what happened in whatever era is represented, it will also always be different. A stage or screen fight is a part of the narrative and a very specific kind of work. It's NOT actual fighting. But it should like it is within what safety and the narrative allow.
In fact you are right, in many cases people choreographing don't know what they are doing. It often happens that they call a martial artist to train the actors and choreograph and then they need a length of fighting that has nothing to do with a real fight and as to include dialogues and then the real martial arts instructor is at a loss, the job doesn't seem realistic and /or is uninteresting.
Sometimes they call a good fight choreographer specialized in eastern martial arts and well.
These techniques both the real as the stage and screen ones (yes there are differences) take time to master, and many movements you cant execute while acting as you would fighting. The distance kept must be different for safety and effect, some targets are not allowed for safety because, in many cases the actors can't be wearing the right gear because the acting would be sacrificed, many things must be done differently because the actor can't risk injury because the show must, quite literally, go on.
Also, you can, like I have done, get to the set, have a couple of actors that haven't ever grabbed a sword, be given two XIX century decorative sabre replicas - not combat realy (one of the actors was a big man and holding that sized sabre was actually injuring his hand a bit) for a XVIII century based on real people story, have 9 hours to rehearse spread through three days in wherever you could have a moment and space kind of deal, have to choreograph 90 seconds of dueling with specific cuts programed and dialogues and actors need in mind, managed to get them to move really well because we all work so hard and i am so damn good at what I do, and then the guys ruin your work in the editing room using wide plans where obviously closer ones would be better for expression and drama, using close plans when a specially beautiful movement was being executed, and inserting long moments of another scene (a birth of a baby that took so long!) in the middle of the fight as to say it was happening at the same time, and ruining the rhythm of the scene.
I don' want to spend a lot of time writing here because I am really busy with work and I was listening as I did some writing, but I would suggest that, unless they have the kind of mixed training I have, martial arts instructors and history buffs would be great consultants/advisors, but should let the choreographic work for the specialist. It is really different, it has lots of specific needs, sometimes realism has to be sacrificed for effect, and safety has its own requirements. But their help would be of great use for choreographer - no doubt.
Cheers, mate.
Keep up the good work.
Awesome video!
For anyone wondering,the song at the beginning is called "Liliana's Song" By Inon Zur
Metatron the bit with the gun. Hilarious.. You make rich, in depth, good content. At least you and some other TH-camrs do.
Giusto, Raf, hai ragione. Thank you for posting and teaching some interesting factual information rather than the Hollywood-esque style of "fighting". This Magna Greco approves of your channel, sei grande!
I love how eloquent you are in these video essays, if your students are half as eloquent as you are then 5000 words should be no problem for them. ♥
Subscribed... you're hilarious
You forgetting about one thing. The sword combat on the screen must look impressive, not be realistic or practical. IRL all the techniques focused on ending the fight as fast as possible while lessening the threat to the life of the combatant as much as possible. If they used those, there would be no time to pointless boasting, mid-fight arguments or tactical backflips.
Realistic fights can look impressive.
@@doommaker4000I didn't say they can't. But like I said, IRL fights are quick, so you either have a realistic fight that lasts
@@doommaker4000 Exactly. Japanese Samurai movies tend to use a lot more real tactic and they are still impressive.
There is so much acting you can do in those moments. That’s why old Japanese movies are revered on a global level. Because they make samurai movies GREAT care for historical accuracy.
Imagine setting up 1 hour and 15 minutes worth of story for a 10 minute sword fight where 9 minutes is spent talking between the combatants. If you set that up well. That could be the greatest minute of sword fighting in cinematic history.
Remember 13 warrior? And duel between short red and tall in 3s?
You ever think of going over the armours from the Witcher games?
Mail, mostly. And swords used with magic. I love it. The sorceresses don't like swords, but sometimes need a badass witcher to help out.
Good work :)
At least Vikings doesn't have horned helmets.
And if you haven't already, could you evaluate Caesar's Legion from Fallout: New Vegas vs. the IRL Roman Empire?
hello METARTON the ending very creative. saludos
Holy shit, you really got a group going. I'm impressed!
Just 4992 more recruits and he will have an entire legion.
@@jasoncreamer5747 he would still need all the support people that followed the legion
I've been watching your TH-cam channel for a while and just learned your real name lol
Good day sir,
Any chance you'll do a review of the equipment in Robert the Bruce film?
Extremely gratifying to see 303,000 subscribers to Metatron. Quality always shows.
T-series disproves that
For more on this subject, I highly recommend the journal article, "Were the Peasants Really So Clean? The Middle Ages in Film" by Great Austin.
Youre the kind of teacher schools need. I bet you get your kids excited to learn history which is rare in the school system.
Nice dragon age music at the beginning, from the best in the series as well FeelsGladMan
Film makers are starting to catch on to this
The netflix movie the outlaw king is doing it much better than the other movies
The movie follows the life of Robert the Bruce the man who became the king of Scotland and fought off the English and took back all Scottish land
The finale duel between King Robert and the King of England was still very showy. Not to mention the scale pauldrons and scale gauntlets he wore.
But yes, the movie does make efforts to be more historically authentic.
Yeah those weird golden scale things are out of place but not outside the realm of possibility assuming that he's wearing mail armor under that and it's just a way to show Edward the 2nd's high status in life
I mean he is the son of king Edward the 1st after all
@@agentspaniel4428 Sure, but they gave Edward I nice plate pauldrons and stuff.
Nice plate pauldrons, proper gauntlets, and an early coat of plate would have look really good. The scale stuff is just sticks out like a sore thumb, in a bad way. It is too out of place next to the more authentic stuff.
You think I don't know that
Ofcorse I do
Still that's not that bad by comparison to other medieval based movies and we don't need to talk about braveheart
Kilts in the late 13th century I must be drunk
no the outlaw king fell in the same trap every other action movie set in medival do, chainmail who wont protect against even a wet fart or weapons so sharp they can even cut reality one of the two.
as in almost every fight scene there are fully mail clad knights getting cut down by a single sword cut to anything but their exposed face, and as always, sword beeing stuck clean trough with no effort a knight in mail, gambeson and overcoat like warm knife trough butter.
the movie is okay as an action movie, but the fightscenes was the usual hollywood crap
Metatron, I would like to know your views on Spartacus series. I remember one vid you did with some limited analysis but would love to see more. I understand that much of the combat, armour and weapons are exaggerated, but from what I've seen it does seem to have made an effort to be partly historically accurate.
Aaaah! Dragon Age Music, very beautifull
1) Having watched your videos for a few years, I can't imagine there's more than a couple handfuls of people who are as much history buffs as you.
2) I've never been a fan of games and movies changing things about history to fit their narrative, unless it's something major for good reason. i.e. making Abraham Lincoln a vampire hunter, ok. Assassin's Creed games, ok. Biopics changing the time, place, order of events or even which person did something is dumb.
3) While I definitely want to see more realistic and historical arms and combat when possible, it still needs to be theatrical and appealing to those not interested. In a roundabout way, it reminds me of an old story about Bruce Lee and Kareem Abdul Jabar filming their tower fight realistically/at full-tilt. They found out that it didn't work on film and had to be slowed down and changed. (Oddly enough, I think the Dragon movie changed that to happen during Green Hornet,...see point 2). Maybe we just need to get more choreographers into things like HEMA so they start thinking about it.
3:27 Okay did not expect that you fuckin got me lmao
I live near the set of knightfall, I saw it being made saturday :P do you think I should make my voice heard? I saw high up braseros in a camp, which seemed very reminicent of "torch lighting"
From a school teacher to another you have my like and tumb up! (Da un professore di schoola to altro! 😊)
Me before watching vid, (I wonder if machine crossbows in first battle of Kingdom of Heaven turns up?)
...
after watching vid, proper formations definitely deserve mention in a follow up Metatron. keep up good work
Hi Ralph, I wanted to know if you've done any study on medieval India. It would be really helpful if you could share your knowledge on the subject matter.
Thanks.
what is the music at the beginning of the video?
OI! That Dragon Age music makes me like you even more!
I can imagine that, in virtually all
ancient periods, one would never
be taught to twirl around and expose your back to an opponent.
If those who produced movies
depicting historical people and
subjects actually used whatever
creativity they possess to invest
themselves in accurate portraying
of what occurred they might find
the result even more interesting
and satisfying. After all, the
viewer would really be learning
something. Your work is both
interesting and satisfying. Please
keep it up.
About the topic of historical combat accuracy, are you going to review the 2017 Sekigahara movie? I watched it recently and I found its fighting scenes to be very interesting compared to usual movies or other media
That’s cool Raf! I had no idea you were a school teacher 👨🏫
Do you have any favorite examples of good swordfight choreography, either from commercial film productions or from HEMA groups? (Feel free to point to earlier videos if you've already covered it)
I paused at 6:27 to look at the chart of various stances. I am not trained in HEMA but I do spar with someone who is for fun. And I found myself using SOME of these stances innately, as you stated, through muscle memory most likely. I often use the Middle, hanging left, and High stances offensively AND effectively, and the short stance for defense. If anyone in the comments is a swordsman or practitioner, please share some insight. I'd love to hear your opinions and experiences. And as always, doumo arigatou gozaimasu Metatron Sensei.
So much information is quiet amazing
Will the Stream be up on the channel for anyone who misses it?
Hey metatron could you make a video about the clash of japanese wako pirates vs spanish soldiers that i believe happened somewhere in the Philippines. I couldnt find much on my research maybe you could. I just find it fascinating.
New favourite youtuber spotted.
WHERE IS THE NORMAN SPY
Never before had I considered the idea that your legal name isn’t Metatron.
It would be so nice to see a movie or such that made an authentic attempt to show what real combat in different time lines looked like
Hey Metatron which languages do you speak and do you have any tips for people who want to learn a language or improve their skills in a language?
he had a video on that i believe
Interesting. What do you think about the TV series The Last Kingdom. How accurate is it from a weapon and combat perspective?
Is that dragon age music? I tried to listen to your sayings but the music in the background is pulling my brain, telling me, "Remember me?" a thousand times.
metatron are you going to do a video on Korean weapons
What's the song / theme playing in the background in the beginning? Much love for any wise knight to answer.
Same here!
Hey Metatron, have you and Shadiversity taken a look at Conqueror's Blade. I would love to see you guys analyze it and give your opinions.
Hey Metatron, you should talk about the knights in the tournament from shrek.
The next year i'll start to study history, i wish that someday i can be a good profesor like you.
Greetings from Argentina.
3:33 that was quite a chuckle
For a rant this was actually a quite gentle video. What happend to the aggressive, pissed rant metatron?
I can hear music from dragon age origins! Epic!
Wait wait wait! You're telling me the noble order of the Glock Knights isn't a real thing? I'm shocked! SHOCKED!
Well not that shocked.
Jokes/memes aside, I'm glad you're doing what you're doing making these videos. While I love my fantasy, I like it rooted at least somewhat in reality. As you say, it makes it more interesting and more believable. I'm glad that your voices are being heard and I hope that everyone you mentioned in this video will continue making content for the foreseeable future and beyond!
Wait, wait, did we just find a name that Metatron can't pronounce? Like, it would take him actual effort to speak it?
Behold, the first sign of the apocalypse is nigh! Tremble, mortals, for your time on TH-cam is at an end!
Great video! Love learning like this. However, this left me with just one question, are there any movies or games that actually got medieval combat right?
Like 100%accurate? No, and most unlikely there will be at any time. You have to sacrifice some details for achieving better quality
Mount and Blade Warband is above average in accuracy, and Kingdom Come Deliverance is about as accurate as it can be and still be playable
I think the time gets closer where we can have "what you see is what they saw back then"-movies. I'd even fund movies like that, movies that try to come as close as possible to what it would have looked and felt like back then. @Metatron: what are you fav. movies in terms of accuracy?
Daaamn Metatron, I didn't know you packed heat my man.
I wish you taught my class...
Is that the Dragon Age theme song in the background?
"Biker Gear" lol!
Damn, you got to me from the start with that soundtrack from DIO
I actually know one of the guys they paid to do historical advice on gladiator. They had to hire him but ignored virtually everything he told them for dramatic effect.
Sort of on topic, when I asked my dad what he wanted for christmas, he said he wanted something I'm interested in so he could better understand what I'm talking about. However, I can't tell if a book on medieval arms and armor is accurate unless I actually read it, any suggestions? ( it better not say "medieval armor was super heavy" or something like that)(also, I would like it to cover as much of the medieval period as it can, but accuracy is more important, just as long as it covers at least the 11nth to 15nth centuries)
have you ever review the witcher 3?
Metatron, I completely agree with you on films & video games hiring HEMA or Sword experts for training actors. I think this would be great in the proposed reboot of The Highlander.