A Fistful of Dollars (1964) Kino Lorber Blu-ray 4K Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ก.ค. 2024
- #AFistfulOfDollars #SergioLeone #bluray #kinolorber
This is my review of Kino's second release of A FISTFUL OF DOLLARS (1964).
00:00 Intro
03:51 General comments about the film
21:29 Massimo Dellamano, Leone's Visual Style and the Techniscope process
23:28 More comments about the film
29:34 Kino Lorber 2022 release
29:45 Package Design and Slipcover
30:53 Explanation of new Kino Disc, 2019 vs 2007 restorations
33:30 Picture Quality
37:57 Image cropping and transfer impressions
39:50 In Camera Scratches
40:38 Opening and Closing Titles
41:00 Final Picture Thoughts
43:21 Audio Quality...oh dear...
53:55 How to find the best sounding original English mono track
01:03:37 Special Features
01:10:48 Final Thoughts - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
Good Clint Eastwood impression!
Thanks I’ll admit to doing that one all the time. It’s hard to do with something imitating the cigar in your mouth!
in my brain, the only true soundtrack and picture are of the Laserdisc editions, the letterboxed versions of course, that's how I first saw and heard these movies!! and it always takes me back when I spin those!
Great video Spencer!! a lot of hard work, I appreciate it! you're a true fan! 😎
Thanks Mike! I still think of the MGM look and feel of the old US elements when I think of Fistful. My first copy was the initial dvd which I watched to death on a crt. It gutted me when I found they weren’t anamorphic on a 16:9 tv and then waiting for the delayed SE DVD drove me nuts. When I got the LD years later it felt like coming home again because it was the original master element the dvd later used. It’s really surprising how good the old pan n scan disc sounds and that it remains the best version of the original English mono.
I wish I could see an original IB tech print of Fistful to round everything off. That’s the only version I’ve never been able to see-but the 2007 Italian restoration print was stunningly good and I think better than the Italian/German BDs.
This release was the first time Ive ever watched this film, and I definitely noticed that the dialogue was a bit hard to make out at times, and Im not one who usually fusses too much over audio, but it did hinder my enjoyment of it a tad
I’m glad it wasn’t just me. It is noticeable and I’m sad to hear even a newcomer hears it.
I've just watched the german release. I'm very happy with it having never owned it before. Its an amazing film. I think I will keep the german release for the foreseeable future it was cheap and it has for a few dollars more too.
The one thing the Kino release will give you besides the new scan is better handled day for night sequences. Otherwise the older master is preferable. Also the German FAFDM was the first modern release to compile all of the missing pieces and has a few seconds Kino goofed on and didn’t include in their version. But keep in mind the German disc was still having to use a version of MGM’s overprocessed master.
@@DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader yeah that scene was super dark i must say. I'm not really fussed about a pristine print but if a definitive edition does appear at some point I will buy it. Same with FAFDM.
Good watch! Watched the 4K last night on my 77” OLED. Looked good. I need to do a mono watch. The disc defaults to 5.1 and got too sucked in and didn’t look.
The 5.1 remixes while not as destructive as the GBU one are just moving the sound around and frequently have some new effects mixed in so the mono tracks are really important. This new restoration mono is really sad because the actual quality and fidelity of the audio is great but someone completely botched it on combining the stem sources together so that the music drowns out everything.
Appreciate you sorting this video into sections. great job !
Thanks, I’m glad people notice. It takes extra time to jot down all the timestamps as I edit-but I feel it’s very much worth it so I can keep things on track while making it easier for people to navigate.
Great review, thank you for the indeph analysis! I think I will just hold for now as my dvd version is still good.
Thank you for the epic review Spencer! Sounds like this wasn't much of an upgrade unfortunately, maybe I should just stick with my German blu-ray but that Tim Lucas commentary is tempting.
I think it’s helpful to have both. There are positives to the Kino and it is inexpensive.
First off, I want to say what a big fan I am of the channel! I love the passion & in depth analysis. It’s the best I’ve seen as a fellow cinema lover myself. I’m curious what equipment you have? What 4K player & what 4K tv you have. I’m asking because these films don’t have HDR. And usually, HDR is meant to be seen in max brightness( or in Sony television vocabulary, “peak luminance on high” for OLED or if you have a LED, “Auto Local Dimming on high”). For these particular Kino discs, am I supposed to be watching them with the max brightness? Does it need to be calibrated in the settings for a 1080P blu ray such as a medium/low brightness? Or the gamma on negative 2 or at 0? I only ask because with these Kino discs IDK if I’m blowing out my picture with the brightness. And I only want to see it as intended. I appreciate your time & anyone else who wishes to comment. Thank you for your time :)
This probably depends a lot on the exact TV you have (and maybe Blu-ray player as well) but I would expect that FILMAKER MODE or the other one whose name I'm forgetting would take this into account and would just stick that on, assuming you have it.
I understand what your saying. I have all the settings dialed in for my Sony A80J & Panasonic UB820. But when no HDR signal or Dolby Vision signal is detected on my TV/Player, it automatically dials in the setting I put for my 1080P blu rays & DVD’s. I’ve heard others say 1080P & 480P aren’t meant to be seen as bright as UHD discs. But maybe I’m just overthinking it. Lol
I only have the 2 disc MGM dvd, and that's ok for now
This was a great review so I’ll just stick with the 2 disc MGM dvds of the trilogy too
It’s solid but it would be good to get either the German or Kino release to get the image without the heaviest cropping and the old MGM master issues.
Few Dollars More is my favorite as well.
Held off on these two, as I wanted to hear yours and other peoples' thoughts. Such a shame the curse lives on. Curious to hear your thoughts on FAFDM. Already know about the couple seconds still missing, but much more interested to hear your review of the audio.
Had no idea VHS Hi-Fi was typically considered better than regular Analog LD audio.
I do have the 1982 LD of FAFDM, but never spun it as I only kept it for the cool artwork.
Thank you for sharing!
I’m still working on FAFDM-hope to have it recorded and uploaded soon.
I hate that these are such a mixed bag. FAFDM fares a bit better but at the very least this Fistful release could have been a near perfected disc like GBU. It has great positives but I can’t believe so few officially noticed the audio problems. Then it’s cropped for some strange reason.
Finding the old pan n scan mono analog was better than anything else blew my mind. I found it for cheap and bought it on a whim. Now I’m glad I did but it takes quite a bit of audio work to make a complete track since it is an incomplete print. All of this is due to post processing. The new audio is better in fidelity because it was coming from original stem sources-but with the ruined levels and balance all benefits are negated.
Vhs hifi is technically superior to LD analog. Less noisy and on a good vcr it can be astoundingly good as long as the tape is in good shape. I finally got a high end vcr and fell down this rabbit hole when I captured my old Citizen Kane tape and had my jaw drop on the floor. But it’s a case by case basis as sometimes the format master could be messed around with. Here the VHS has some noise reduction and is a slightly different runtime to the LD in spite of it being a year older.
Huh.. this video actually made me reconsider buying this release, considering I already own the German Blu-ray (naturally, as a German) and recently fitted my home theatre room with a 5.1.4 setup, so any audio issues will be extremely noticeable.
It’s a mixed bag with both major positives and negatives. That’s why it’s so hard to describe and why I think it’s up to each person to decide. It’s cheap enough too. The audio issue and the image cropping compared to the 2007 restoration are the biggest drawbacks for me even more than the Ritrovata color poking through.
The clarity of the new restoration audio is impressive but the levels are totally fubar.
I haven't heard the mono track on this disc myself, but based on your description, I'm wondering if they accidentally rendered out a couple of tracks from the master into a single track. Like a music-only track on top of the original mono mix.
It’s definitely cleaner sources for everything and according to the restoration blurb they sourced separate stem elements. Something definitely went wrong somewhere in the process.
I wish they had done the restoration correctly in the first place so Kino wouldn't have to make a best guess on the colors and fix them. Were the elements too far gone to not match the negative scan to a release print. Or was it revisionist color timing on purpose. Sick to death of that in Blu Ray and 4K, the dnr, the teal. The fake new audio mixes. Removing grain because it messes with the HDR grade and so and so forth.
Very true. This new release surprisingly addresses quite a bit of those issues but can’t fully eliminate them entirely. Unfortunately those in charge of doing the work itself or the rights holders aren’t always interested in archival presentations.
That was almost too comprehensive although, I did stay the course because the video review was well put together. However, if you love these films it's a must watch for the detailed analysis and as well as the pretty decent Clint impression. I used to have the Region 1 DVD trilogy collection back in the day but upgraded to the Blu-Rays. Hopefully, in the future they can all have HDR graded versions. Of course, it's all down to money at the end of the day. Maybe MGM's new parent company can dip into their pocket.
Thank you!
The Leone films require so much extra detail and research that I knew the length was going to be greater like my GBU review. I still try to whittle it down in editing but on the other hand it’s my kind of rebuttal to the extremely short reviews that miss so much.
Unfortunately we’re still without perfect releases for any Leone film. Hopefully someday it could happen.
Would you say the italian blu ray is better than 4k in terms of audio?
It’s hard to say. The English mono on the Italian disc isn’t perfect but it doesn’t have the issues of the restoration track. However the restoration track does have nice fidelity so it’s yet another trade off and like everything with these films you can’t just have one release.
Heard the first adaptation of the book Red Harvest before Yojimbo & A Fistful of Dollars was a 1930 film called Roadhouse Nights. But I've never seen it. Also in your opinion what's the best release for the original Italian audio.
I’ve heard that too but it’s still debated whether it was based on Hammett or not. I do need to see it for myself.
As for the Italian mono it’s not on the USA releases and you have to go to the Ripley Italian bd to get a version of it as far as I’m aware. I don’t know why the Italian audio isn’t included worldwide on Leone films as if you were to have any dub it should be the Italian first and foremost since it was the base mix supervised by Leone which all the other dubs were based on.
@@DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader Right exactly, so it's like the Mandarin tracks on the Golden Harvest films. That's disappointing that the 4k's don't have the original Italian. I have For a Few Dollars More on Italian Blu Ray it would be worth it then to get the other two movies.
It looks like the german release isn't cropped like the mgm and the 4k.
The Italian master from 2007 and the version of it included in the German release does indeed show the most picture information on all sides.
The one thing visually besides being a new scan that the 4K master does better is how it handles the day for night scenes, which has been a problem on every video release before.
@@DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader the day for night scenes don't bother me really it adds to the charm lol. Anyway its a great movie. I think I like it more than the good, bad, ugly.
@@garyrobinson8665 DFN is hard to time just right and the issue with the 2007 Italian master is that they just made them super dark. The old MGM video masters had light blue and were a bit too bright.
So what would be the best overall Blu-ray in terms of video & audio quality?
Unfortunately, there’s not a clear-cut answer. It really depends on what you can live with if you’re looking for just a single release to have in your collection. In regards to Fistful, the new Kino UHD is the best US modern release to date in spite of still having some baked in color issues and having the messed up restoration mono. Most people haven’t noticed the audio as being a problem. Personally, I’d recommend having the new Kino release plus the region free, and German double feature set with for a few dollars more. That would give you the 2007 Italian master which still has some issues but not the ones you have on the Kino. Plus that gives you a fully uncut version of for a few dollars more without the missing seconds in the new Kino release.
Trying to have better original mono audio is where you get into really complicated territory. For that, you have to source a variety of older releases and patch together your own track and then go through the extreme hassle of trying to sync it to a modern release.
@@DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader Thank you for the detailed answer… shame they did not just take the mono from an old decent source and left it as it was!
@@Manco654 no problem! I’ve been scratching my head and buying all kinds of different releases for years now trying to piece this stuff together. It gets really confusing really quickly. The sad part is the new restoration audio source has really great quality and fidelity, but it was in recombining the elements, and doing some editing work that they totally screwed it up. Not helping matters is all the films having decades of different versions, cuts, and a lack of research and care by all the rights holders, both in Italy, and here in the US with MGM.
@@DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader Maybe we get one last shot with a potential HDR/Dolby Vision release in the future…
@@Manco654 exactly. That will be someone else once Kino‘s license runs out and MGM steps up to the plate to do the job correctly along with the Italian rights holders. All three need to be redone from scratch and there’s no telling what Paramount is going to do to wreck Once Upon a Time in the West when that UHD comes out in a few months, given their terrible track record to this point. And that doesn’t even begin to get into the terrible state of Once Upon a Time in America or worst of all how bad Duck You Sucker is right now in two different masters, that are both terrible.
What did you think of kino's 4k for High Plains Drifter?
I haven’t seen it yet and I was extremely disappointed about their removing original audio and mystified by their response of they refused to put multiple audio options on the disc.
Yeah I read a little bit on that. Too bad! I'd actually appreciate if you got the disc ($20 on amazon rn) and did a video on the movie, if you have extra time lol.
So if I wanted to hear the original English audio while the 4K & mgm blu-ray would have it the original dvd from mgm is better?
I know the mgm dvd from 2011 has a mono audio track; would that mean that those newer dvds also have that poor audio quality since it was released around the same time as the blu-rays or is it still that same original dvd audio the original released dvd had?
I know that they released the dvd in the 1999 originally than had a new press in2000s with the same cover art, than a new release in 2006 with new art and finally the 2 disc dvd you have which the 2011 rerelease from mgm used the same cover for but is a single disc release.
So does the dvd you have in your background from mgm, the 2 disc edition, have the same quality audio as the previously released dvd or is it changed from even that?
I would be trying to get that newest dvd since the pq would in theory be better.
Also if I wanted to watch this film with the Italian mono audio what release would I even get? I don’t think any USA releases has had that.
Only the first mgm dvd has the original mono. All the later releases use a downmix of their 5.1 remix.
The German disc does have a version of the German mono and some US releases have versions in French or Spanish. I think it is very important to have the original Italian mono for all of Leone’s films.
@@DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader Thanks for info. I'm thinking of getting the first mgm dvd for a decent compromise as I value the sound highly. Is the picture quality on that release ok relative to other releases with original mono?
@@rjculliford it’s visually like a slightly improved version of the letterboxed Laserdisc master. It is nonanamorphic and an early dvd before the MGM 2005 master was done. This initial dvd was the first copy I ever owned and was the version I watched for years.
Have any fans made a bootleg scan of a good 35mm print?
I don’t think anyone has found print examples. I’d love to at least see some frames for color reference and especially to be able to see that 2007 print again. As far as I remember it didn’t have as much of the color issues as the Italian and German BDs have.
🤣🤣🤣 that was amazing lol
Really disappointing. Thanks for saving me the money I would have spent on it.
I ended up ordering the German Double Feature Blu-Ray to avoid the 4K release.
It is disappointing and hard to pin down. There’s still improvements and important factors on this release so I think it is good to have both releases.
People throw the term "rip off" around way too loosely these days, I dont think it applies to either A Fistful of Dollars with relation to Yojimbo or to Yojimbo with relation to Red Harvest.