I worked with a gentleman about 40 years ago who wrote a tongue in cheek book called ‘The rules of design (things I learned the hard way that you don’t have to)’ that he photocopied and shared with the apprentices. He was well past retirement age then. One that I remember is: “Making the top and bottom the same diameter means that the end user will fit it upside down”
Yup. One of the golden rules of design. Kinda like that story about bears in Yellowstone. The intelligence of bears and the stupidest of humans overlaps in the point where some humans can't use the trash cans some bears aren't supposed to be able to open... Hence why you see trash around the trash can, and tissues stuffed in the locking mechanism, which has... written instructions with pictographic details.
Many tears ago I worked for a company that refurbished milk churns. My job was checking they had no splits in the joints. Any cracks and they were scrapped, good ones were stacked separately and then placed on big burners to heat them and melt all the old tin off as well as the band with the handles, then whilst still hot placed on rollers to remove any dents. Whilst still warm they went into an acid bath, then a flux bath and the dipped in a big vat of molten tin. The scrap ones had the tin melted off and this was made into sticks of solder. The good churns had the handles put back on and the tin solder melted all round the edges to seal them. Again no lead was used as it was a food container. To identify scrap ones I'd hit the cracked area and split the churn open. The only time I had a problem was when we had a request for some scrap churns to be chromed for bar stools. It was a reflex tthat when I saw a crack I'd split the churn, so for the chrome ones I carried a lump of wood to remove the lids but it stopped me splitting the churns..
My metalwork teacher at school insisted that when you were filing you had your thumb on top of the file, not your index finger. To encourage his pupils to follow his instructions he would be walking about the workshop observing what we were doing. He always wore an apron with a big “D” pocket at the front in which his two hands would be thrust. What you didn’t know, at least to begin with, was that also in the pocket he had a ¼” silver steel rod about 6” long. If he came across a boy with his finger on top of the file the silver steel rod was straight across the knuckle of the erring boy. Of course, unthinkable today but this was 60 years ago. 🤣
Another great episode Keith! I really enjoy your videos, it always puts a smile on my face when there is a new one. And so I wondered why I enjoy looking at your work so much. I think it's a combination of factors. Of course there is your craftsmanship, your love for the profession, the interesting restoration work, your tranquility and, as I now discover, your commentary style. Somehow you manage to find an excellent balance between commentary-free video and explanation. With quite a few TH-cam videos I hear myself asking: Please explain a little more what you are doing and especially why! And with others I grumble: Would you please shut up, I'm getting so tired of that constant unnecessary monotonous chatter, almost falling asleep. None of these little annoyances with you, you do it perfectly for me. And so I'm as always looking forward to your next video! Thank you! 🤗
Cadmium is toxic. Wouldn't want to use it in this application. Some refrigerator shelves are (used to be?) cadmium plated. People would use them for grills to cook over an open fire and poison themselves. A lot of Boy Scouts got sick that way.
Back in the late 40s, or possibly the very early 50s, I remember the roundhouse machinists pouring Babbitt bearings for the valve gear on Soo Line steam locomotives. I cannot remember much of this except that I seem to remember the inner surfaces being very shiny. Am I wrong in this memory or did they machine the parts after they poured the bearing material? I was trained as a tool maker in the early 60s and finished my apprenticeship with a shop doing injection molds, fixtures, dies and jigs. I also worked for the Great Northern RR just as they merged into the BN in 1970, but that job, being the low man on the seniority list I ended up mostly changing tires on the machines in the bone yard. I do appreciate your use of the older machines which is all I experienced, the new stuff today I would have to have an assistant set them up.
I've used wet thin card stock before the compound and it works great. The card stock is merely spritzed with a water bottle, not dunked in water. Enough to stay the babbitt from passing it, not enough to cause a violent reaction. I use the card stock you get with clothes some times. I have a bunch of those from the missus.
When doing the half shells. Why not a big glob of the packing material and push the half shell, washers and shafts into as a unit. Then you could just lift it out and set the next one in. Additional rings with brass tipped set screws to hold the washers tight to the sides of the half shell.
I was thinking "hmmm why didn't you thread the ends of the mandril and use nuts to tighten the washers?" Then I saw you use it for the caps and had an "ah hah!" moment.
Thank you for your videos, I have learned and been entertained by them. Congratulations on your substantial weight loss. As a heavy man myself I’m aware what’s involved to lose 20 + lbs. just a guess from personal experience.
Keith, Wondering why you dont fixture up those tight poured babbits, heat back up your mandrel w your torch, use some tongs and place it back in the fixtured babbit and let the heated mandrel melt back into the babbit a bit to ensure a closer fit.....and better tolerances.....am thinking that method may work pretty well and save alot of headache .....just sayin.... Don
What material is the drum made of? Do the drums ever wear out from all the cane passing thru? Weld build up and grooving the drums would take a long time on a manual lathe. 😢
@keith, you use such precision for turning the shafts, etc, however it seems the positioning of the mandril in the bearing blocks is done very casually. How does one ensure the bearing blocks and everything is installed square in the final installation?
Keith, you just need a thin piece of the damming material. No thicker than your pinky finger. This will make the dam Babbitt proof very easily. Then you won’t even need the rings.
He is using a tin alloy babbit material. It is usually about 85% tin and 15% divided between copper and antimony. Tin pest would not affect this alloy until extreme low temperature (maybe -30 or -40 C). I feel it is safe to say that there will not be cane grinding at those temps!!
I worked with a gentleman about 40 years ago who wrote a tongue in cheek book called ‘The rules of design (things I learned the hard way that you don’t have to)’ that he photocopied and shared with the apprentices. He was well past retirement age then. One that I remember is:
“Making the top and bottom the same diameter means that the end user will fit it upside down”
You can make things foolproof but you can't make them damnfoolproof.
Good one. I’d love to have that book to see how many of those mistakes I’ve made and learned from.
As Keith demonstrated - taking short cuts makes everything take longer.
Yup. One of the golden rules of design. Kinda like that story about bears in Yellowstone. The intelligence of bears and the stupidest of humans overlaps in the point where some humans can't use the trash cans some bears aren't supposed to be able to open... Hence why you see trash around the trash can, and tissues stuffed in the locking mechanism, which has... written instructions with pictographic details.
Another line for the book, you have many tools for removing metal, very few to put it back.
Anyone else try taking a drink every time Keith says"babbitt"? 🥴
Good morning from Massachusetts 😊
Good morning from the Pacific Northwest
thanks Mr Rucker for teaching us.
Nice job Keith
Thank you for sharing.👍
I've been watching you do this for years, and I still enjoy it every time.
Another viewer once called this "The Cane Mill Channel". I agree ; )
I’ve read where people call it the Horizontal Boring Mill channel and the DiResta Band Saw channel. Lol I enjoy all of them!
Many tears ago I worked for a company that refurbished milk churns. My job was checking they had no splits in the joints. Any cracks and they were scrapped, good ones were stacked separately and then placed on big burners to heat them and melt all the old tin off as well as the band with the handles, then whilst still hot placed on rollers to remove any dents. Whilst still warm they went into an acid bath, then a flux bath and the dipped in a big vat of molten tin. The scrap ones had the tin melted off and this was made into sticks of solder. The good churns had the handles put back on and the tin solder melted all round the edges to seal them. Again no lead was used as it was a food container. To identify scrap ones I'd hit the cracked area and split the churn open. The only time I had a problem was when we had a request for some scrap churns to be chromed for bar stools. It was a reflex tthat when I saw a crack I'd split the churn, so for the chrome ones I carried a lump of wood to remove the lids but it stopped me splitting the churns..
I've seen this so many times in your TH-cam videos.
My metalwork teacher at school insisted that when you were filing you had your thumb on top of the file, not your index finger. To encourage his pupils to follow his instructions he would be walking about the workshop observing what we were doing. He always wore an apron with a big “D” pocket at the front in which his two hands would be thrust. What you didn’t know, at least to begin with, was that also in the pocket he had a ¼” silver steel rod about 6” long. If he came across a boy with his finger on top of the file the silver steel rod was straight across the knuckle of the erring boy. Of course, unthinkable today but this was 60 years ago. 🤣
Nice, good information
Great job thanks for sharing
Great video
Another production from the South Ga. Cane Mill Repair
Another great episode Keith!
I really enjoy your videos, it always puts a smile on my face when there is a new one. And so I wondered why I enjoy looking at your work so much. I think it's a combination of factors. Of course there is your craftsmanship, your love for the profession, the interesting restoration work, your tranquility and, as I now discover, your commentary style. Somehow you manage to find an excellent balance between commentary-free video and explanation. With quite a few TH-cam videos I hear myself asking: Please explain a little more what you are doing and especially why! And with others I grumble: Would you please shut up, I'm getting so tired of that constant unnecessary monotonous chatter, almost falling asleep. None of these little annoyances with you, you do it perfectly for me. And so I'm as always looking forward to your next video!
Thank you! 🤗
I'm always fascinated! Thank you for taking the time to teach. -Curt Kuhns
Awesome as Always...Hope we dont have to wait too long for the next episode...
There used to be a cadmium babbitt for very highly loaded bearings too.
Cadmium is toxic. Wouldn't want to use it in this application. Some refrigerator shelves are (used to be?) cadmium plated. People would use them for grills to cook over an open fire and poison themselves. A lot of Boy Scouts got sick that way.
I love simple machines. Thanks for the video
Back in the late 40s, or possibly the very early 50s, I remember the roundhouse machinists pouring Babbitt bearings for the valve gear on Soo Line steam locomotives. I cannot remember much of this except that I seem to remember the inner surfaces being very shiny. Am I wrong in this memory or did they machine the parts after they poured the bearing material?
I was trained as a tool maker in the early 60s and finished my apprenticeship with a shop doing injection molds, fixtures, dies and jigs. I also worked for the Great Northern RR just as they merged into the BN in 1970, but that job, being the low man on the seniority list I ended up mostly changing tires on the machines in the bone yard. I do appreciate your use of the older machines which is all I experienced, the new stuff today I would have to have an assistant set them up.
You make babbitt work look so easy! Nice job👍👍
Nice work as always!
I don't think I'll ever use this, but thanks to your video I would at least attempt it with a little confidence, if needs be.
I've used wet thin card stock before the compound and it works great. The card stock is merely spritzed with a water bottle, not dunked in water. Enough to stay the babbitt from passing it, not enough to cause a violent reaction. I use the card stock you get with clothes some times. I have a bunch of those from the missus.
When doing the half shells. Why not a big glob of the packing material and push the half shell, washers and shafts into as a unit. Then you could just lift it out and set the next one in.
Additional rings with brass tipped set screws to hold the washers tight to the sides of the half shell.
I was thinking "hmmm why didn't you thread the ends of the mandril and use nuts to tighten the washers?" Then I saw you use it for the caps and had an "ah hah!" moment.
Love the Babbitt bearing pour videos!
I have found that sometimes the smoked shaft loses its coating when I preheat.
Very nice.
Thank you for your videos, I have learned and been entertained by them. Congratulations on your substantial weight loss. As a heavy man myself I’m aware what’s involved to lose 20 + lbs. just a guess from personal experience.
Keith,
Wondering why you dont fixture up those tight poured babbits, heat back up your mandrel w your torch, use some tongs and place it back in the fixtured babbit and let the heated mandrel melt back into the babbit a bit to ensure a closer fit.....and better tolerances.....am thinking that method may work pretty well and save alot of headache .....just sayin....
Don
My pop use to pour babit main bearings in car engine blocks for random auto repair shops, he was a steam engine repair person. (early '20s) Ron W4BIN
What material is the drum made of? Do the drums ever wear out from all the cane passing thru? Weld build up and grooving the drums would take a long time on a manual lathe. 😢
So. Fla., here.
For anyone who hasn't watched Keith's earlier video on the cane mill, he uses a very interesting tool to get that uniform buildup.
Have you considered metal spray on these parts? We do a lot of aircraft parts this way. Then machine them down to original dimensions.
Little soot bits floating about, I thought there was a bug in front of my monitor.
Why not clean up the crushing surfaces whilst you have them mounted in the lathe (even though I know they’ll corrode more in the future)?
@keith, you use such precision for turning the shafts, etc, however it seems the positioning of the mandril in the bearing blocks is done very casually. How does one ensure the bearing blocks and everything is installed square in the final installation?
The blocks "float" against a set screw on the mill top and bottom covers so they'll self align.
Keith, you just need a thin piece of the damming material. No thicker than your pinky finger. This will make the dam Babbitt proof very easily. Then you won’t even need the rings.
Using less would make it easier to see that you have it where you need it. I've never poured Babbitt, but that makes sense to me.
Is there is reason you did not use a small F clamp to hold the rings snug to the part?
Because there won't be a tight enough seal. However a thin layer of compound on the ring would seal it.
Could you put them in a 4 jaw chuck and bore them ??
Hmm, how abou a disk of metal in the bottom of the cups? What's supporting the weight of the shaft/roller?
The correct name for someone who shoes horses is a farrier, at least it is on this side of the pond!
you should give us links to the weld pac and poured in place bearing materals
Do you ever use Babbit metal with lead in place of tin?
👍👍👍😎😎😎
Keith, you are looking great! How much weight have you lost?
😛😛😛😛😛❤❤❤❤🦾🦴🦾🦴👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Would tin based babbit be safe to use in more cold climates ? Im thinking about tin pest.
He is using a tin alloy babbit material. It is usually about 85% tin and 15% divided between copper and antimony. Tin pest would not affect this alloy until extreme low temperature (maybe -30 or -40 C). I feel it is safe to say that there will not be cane grinding at those temps!!
Chamfer, wasn't he the guy that sold his albums on tv in the '70's and '80's? "Chamfer and his magical pan flute".
Different chamfer, different place, different time…😉😉
How bout an update on Leo's capstan?
Ask Windy Hill Foundry. That is where it was last seen.
abomb always uses hss to turn down weld, i see you use inserts
Did the inserts not work? What did I miss??
@@paulcopeland9035 seemed to work just dandy. was just sayin.
Can you say where in Chatt. this cane mill is going?
Why not fix one end of your mandral, wont have a problem with leaking
Ummm… why 1” 15/16. Why not 2”?
2 inches probably wouldn’t leave enough space for the Babbitt bearings.
C and H pure cane sugar that's the one... What? nobody remembers that?... Probably because you been eating white sugar beets most of your life.
From Hawaii (from Hawaii) Sweetened by the sun….
Nice work !
The rings are definitely a good idea. I guess the adage about Do it right the first time to save time ⏲️ is true 👍 😉 18:32
Keith can you tell us what IS a big deal??
Pouring the babbitt inside your boots while you have them on?