I like it too. I've had to take a sick leave for work for my mental health and we don't say, oh I had to take a leave for my cardiac health etc. We just say health/healthy/sick/had an attack/acute onset etc. Not calling in sick because you're too anxious to tell someone you're sick because you're worried they'll think you're lying so you just convince yourself you ARE lying and a fake has cost me a lot in my life.
"It always feels permanent. It always feels like forever. It always feels complete when it's really bad. It feels like this is the whole story of your life, this is the only thing you can ever be, the only life you will ever have. And that's just not true. That is part of the incredibly seductive lie that despair tells."
I've only recently downloaded nocd and I can't tell you how it feels to read stuff like this because it feels so profoundly alienating and when I read this it's someone else articulating what feels utterly alone to me. But we are not alone
“I’m not gonna talk my way out of it, I’m gonna talk my way right back into it” GOODNESS this encapsulates my problem with anxiety so well. Hearing that sentence could have saved me years
It's very brave to talk so openly about your own experience with OCD. Thank you, John Green, for being a voice that so many people need, and for giving people with severe OCD (like me!) hope for a fulfilling and worthwhile life.
No wonder John has talked about in his vlog how difficult this press tour has been and how he broke down in tears a few times. Doing a bit of cathartic crying right now too. It really feels like absolute indescribable pain and torment, it feels inescapable. Thank you for sharing, John ♥
35 years ago I was absolutely passionate about being a feminist scholar at my university; my professors were encouraging me to complete a PHD in Women’s Studies. But my OCD took over, specifically HOCD, and was terrified that my studies would “turn me into a lesbian”. So, I gave it all up and I never found such passionate enthusiasm again. OCD stole what could have been a wonderful academic life. I didn’t know about ERP back then.
What a beautiful interview. As someone who's been through Exposure and Response Prevention therapy, I want to emphasize that it's not just the gold standard for OCD - it's the gold standard for all Anxiety Disorders. After years of suffering from Social Anxiety Disorder and going nowhere in talk therapy, trying exposure was the best decision I could have ever made. Like John, I was going through a time when hours of my day were eaten up by painful anxieties and now my symptoms are very mild and I'm living a full life. It was a bumpy road that took commitment, but nothing else has been more rewarding. So find a therapist you trust and give it a try, I promise that it'll be worth it in the end :)
Thanks for adding this!! I suffer from more generalized anxiety where I don't have many compulsive behaviours but I do have obsessive worries and I was wondering if it could be a treatment option for some of that
@@amberbydreamsart5467 Hey, of course friend. Thank you for sharing :) Obsessive worries are a big component of my sickness too - largely about social situations but also about my health, career, life etc. When I decided to get help, I met with three potential therapists to see who was the best fit for me and the one I chose, he's been excellent. His ERP and CBT approach has showed me how to build better mental habits to replace my old unhealthy coping techniques. What I could do in a day 2 years ago, I can now do 10x more with none of the stress and pain. I'm still on my journey of course, and good luck with this new stage of yours!
@@donnaaranda7175 Oof, I'm sorry to hear that. I've struggled to find a good therapist in the past, but not for lack of options. Have you looked into telehealth therapists? There can even be therapists from other parts of the country who are licensed to practice telehealth in your state. I found psychologytoday to be a very helpful resource when I was searching. Please don't give up, you deserve proper treatment
This interview is exemplary. It's incredibly powerful to hear about OCD from John's perspective and to have that supported by a thoughtful, gracious interviewer who is so knowledgeable about OCD themselves. The end result differs from what we usually see about mental illness in interviews, which is often illness as spectacle--or, at the extreme, an exploitative giggle-fest of just how "gosh darn wacky" the visible manifestations of the illness can be to the layperson. It's just really, really nice to see any mental illness being treated so respectfully. Thank you to both of you!
OCD is a nightmare. I've overcome a lot with it, but that romanticization is a problem. Its not a cute little disorder. It feels like an everlasting hell when you're going through it.
I remember lying in my garden, sunshine on my face, listening to the Anthropocene Reviewed podcast without any SUDS and ruminations in my mind during remission. Now I'm back at it again in the loop of OCD. I'm already doing the work to get out again though. And who knows maybe I will be able to revisit this beautiful experience again this summer. Thank you John Green for what you are doing. Also can you maybe make another episode? I really do love them because they bring peace to my mind 😆 greetings from Germany
@@Gizmosnitto13 SUDS is short for subjective units of distress scale. During OCD usually you experience distress during the whole day and SUDS is a self assessment of how high it is at any given moment. The podcast is made and spoken by John Green, the person that is being interviewed here. I do really recommend listening to it.
@@Gizmosnitto13SUDS is subjective units of distress scale it helps with building hierarchy and tracking progress. The idea is that SUDS is trending downwards as you work up your hierarchy. The podcast is from the interviewee.
Just wanted to give you guys an update, after six months of doing my ERP homework and 40 therapy sessions with an OCD specialist I reached subclinical in OCD symptomatic.
I don’t have OCD but I still felt so seen when I watched the movie. I do have anxiety, and the scene with Aza in the hospital writhing, crying and so worried about getting infected with C Dif felt like it could have been a scene from my life. I always feel like such a freak when I have episodes like that
lol I can't wait for the Vlogbrothers video 10 years from now featuring John jumping out of an airplane! I remember when you were afraid to stand on a table, you really have come so extraordinarily far John.
Ahh I'm so happy to see John Green, NOCD, and Nate all together in the same place on the internet! You have all made a huge impact on my life! I've been doing ERP since January and I really do feel like I'm living a different life.
Around 16:10 John talks about the intrusive, spiraling thoughts around human bacteria biomes. A thing I read that helped me manage my spiraling thoughts about contagion and bacteria takeover was reading The Body: A Gyise for Occupants by Bill Byson. He talks about how your immune system is basically derived from your biome. The only reason it works is it can often tell "me" from "not me" and seeks to eliminate "not me." So the biome that males up part of the matter of my body really is me. It's not less me just because other bacteria similar to mine are out in the world. Even kissing can't permanently impact the biome. Within a short time after kissing there's no trace left of the other person's bacteria. I found it comforting that the natural world has an ebb and flow like that.
When I was younger, in middle school, I was really worried that I wouldn’t be able to live a fulfilling life and have a career because of my OCD. I loved watching John Green on Crash course and when I found out that he had OCD, I felt so hopeful about my life, because even though he has OCD like me, he is able to have have a family and a good career and be a force for good in this world. It made me realize that despite the struggles I have with my mental health I could also do amazing things. It really helped me through a tough time in my life, and while continuing to follow John on social media, I continue to feel less isolated with my OCD. Thank you John Green for being you! DFTBA!
I don’t have OCD, but I do have bipolar and have experienced crippling, unrelenting anxiety along with ADHD. Turtles All the Way Down has been the most comforting work for me in my times of illness, because I’m hearing from someone who has lived with serious mental illness well into his adulthood. It helps to hear from someone with experience that it doesn’t necessarily go away, and it can get worse, but even still, clouds do part at times and you can lead a fulfilling life.
As I was going through another ocd episode my boyfriend shared this. I’m starting to watch now while the ocd thoughts are still knocking on my door, threatening to kill me. This thing ruined my life, and is still continuing to ruin my life every day. It has brought me confusion, delusion, absolutely crippling depression, suicidal ideation, health problems, loss of my prior faith, isolation from family and colleagues, inability to work, inability to concentrate, inability to learn boring things, PTSD like symptoms, unhealthy coping mechanisms, etc. I can’t remember what it is like living without the darkness and anxiety and constant feeling that the world is going to end and thoughts that I hate and guilt. I miss not having to fight off my own thoughts from waking up to laying down and sometimes even during the night. Phew. I needed to write that.
When my inability to lock doors, without checking every outlet in the house and the lock itself repeatedly, began to interfere with my schedule and expanded to mail, bills, and other basic necessities of life, I visited a therapist. She told me of another patient (as they do I guess) who checks every single space in her house, including every drawer in her 64-drawer medicinal cabinet, to see if somebody might be hiding in them, meaning a full human being in 4 square inches of space. I felt a rush of relief, followed by a deep, sad empathy for that stranger. I wanted to tell her that she is not mad, and she is not alone.
@@mariang3946 I am sorry to hear that. I am better actually, but it took time. OCD doesn't go away, but you can get it to be really quiet. Therapy helps to recognize the fear and confront the situations that trigger it. Personally, I find it was important to learn to be less hard on myself, trust my decisions more, and recognize that they mostly do not have detrimental consequences, neither physically, nor socially. Positive, well-grounded people and responsibilities in your life can help loads, as well. Hope that helps a little. I wish you well. 🌺
Hi John, I just want to express sincere gratitude for you being so vulnerable and sharing your experiences with OCD over the years- it was the reason I was diagnosed and got treatment back in 2020. I remember being at one of my lowest points and watching one of your videos, and realizing that my lifetime of mental health difficulties could be summed up in a single diagnosis. I ended up getting treatment and proper care, am doing so much better now. Your perspective and wisdom on being able to still live a good life has really brought me comfort as a young adult figuring things out. Thanks for all you do!
I have often told people that I would prefer to be tortured than have severe OCD again. The things you believe about yourself, others and the world are so beyond terrifying it is indescribable.
I've felt the exact same thing. I would gladly endure a lot of pain if it meant I wasn't living half, or more, of my life in the bathroom. Even just that one aspect of my OCD being removed would be worth it.
I really appreciate the attention that John Green is bringing to OCD; I also have OCD and can relate to what he is saying quite a bit. Medication and ERP are so important. I'm currently enrolled in school in hopes to help others in a clinical setting, there are some real options available to manage it. I really dislike when people say, "oh, that's just my OCD."
27:57 "When we're talking about feelings if it feels real it is real" THIS! It's so invalidating to be told (over and over) that something isn't real when you are experiencing it, suffering from it. This whole conversation was so helpful. Thank you thank you both ❤
Brilliant! Absolute gems throughout from both Dr. McGrath and John. While I'm older than John (I'm 66), I relate so very much to what he's saying. Thank you, gentlemen! So glad to know that "Turtles..." has been made into a movie!
I not only became a recent member of NOCD but I watched the movie twice and it will be one I will continue to watch and show my loved ones just a gain a little understanding and it has educated them. I got diagnosed with other themes but I have found it is all similar if not the same. I felt so seen and understood by aza and as someone who was scared to mention it - I am learning the tools and resources. I almost wasn’t able to function.. but I had a mental breakdown that led me to seek help. I was the one who sought help to find out if I had OCD and yeah .. I’ve had it all of my conscious life just like he said but if you avoid it long enough like I did .. you can fake it till you make it till your body just gives up.
I knew really little about what OCD was like before I watched TATWD. I hadn't read the book and hadn't even really heard what it was about! But I've been watching vlogbrothers videos for the last year and decided to watch the movie after all of John's promo (good work John, I've recommended it to a bunch of people). It blew me away. I felt it in my core. The acting and the writing was just so phenomenal. I cried and gasped and laughed. Now I'm determined to learn more about OCD! This video was really helpful! Also, I have anxiety, and this is just convincing me more and more that I need a therapist (and that I need to always be good about taking my meds lol)
i am only 5 minutes in on the video and already feel so seen, the poem quote is such a perfect explanation of how it starts, hopefully with the book and movie people can became aware of what having ocd really means..
When I was first coming to terms with the fact that I have OCD I was reluctant to watch this channel just because of the name "NOCD". Now seeing John Green here, that makes me trust that you guys truly are a good resource. I'm glad, theres not much out there, its nice to have another!
I struggled with my self identity for a few years. It was a bit more extreme though: I lost all concept of “myself”. I didnt think of myself like a person, more just a collection of intermittent thoughts. I was so used to changing my personality (which is either my coping mechanism or my compulsion, depends if I get diagnosed with OCD or not) that I wasn’t the same person as I was even a month before. Nothing was static, everything just kept falling apart and deteriorating and changing Ironically, the thing that saved me was realizing the only thing I had that was constant no matter what I did was a chaotic life. That’s what I made define me: the pure chaos that is my life with the constant regressions and highs and lows, and with that I managed to over a few months rebuild my sense of self. Now it’s strong: I know who I am
While I was listening I heard a lot of descriptions that also fit alcoholism. (I'm in recovery and have been for a while). And then you nod to it, illustrating enabling behaviour with providing alcohol to one such as I. Staying in reality is frequently difficult and relies on interaction with other people to show me when I've taken off into my own universe again. Thank you.
I hope you know how much value you bring to this world, John. You have enriched the lives of so many different people in so many different ways and I truly admire you for it. Never stop being you ❤
This is a great platform to expose the schemes that OCD and create awareness and not be ashame of these intrusive thoughts. Shame and guilt are the cunning ways OCD use to cause delibitation! Most important keys in helping OCD sufferers are awareness and proper professional support. Every treatment journey for each person is different. However, I would compassion and understanding from family members and peers goes a long way! I would just want to share my initial recovery journey of OCD doesn't mean LESS intrusive thought, anxiety, heart palpitations etc...hahaha. In fact, it's the opposite. For me, the way to guage is the QUALITY of life meaning able to basically meet your daily physical needs, driving, going out and just enjoying the things I used to do before OCD became worse. Baby steps matters and never condemn yourself whenever you do a compulsion. I just want to encourage people with OCD out there that whatever OCD sends to us, we still have a winning card in our hands!!❤ Thank you NOCD for your platform
My kid and I have been reading this book on our drives too and from their mother's house. It's probably the most realistic telling of OCD that I've ever read. There have been moments that I've almost felt like I needed a break because it was too real. Both Green brothers are amazing writers, which is nice because I'm going to need a recovery book when I finish this one.
John I hope you can see this. Thank YOU so much for not only this book but ALL Your books they have been a bridge for me and my son. I suffer from severe depression and this movie talked to me so much. I was like talking to Aza take your meds. It's so very hard to get through the days sometimes. Your books are such a light. Thank YOU! Blessings to you.
My ocd is mainly around health like him although it has morphed..it generally morphs from one concern to the other and then once that’s resolved it jumps to another fear..of course this affects relationships and is frustrating for all. Good interview- thank you
Thank you, John, for speaking about your experience and for bringing it into your novel. As someone with OCD, I empathize with your struggle. Its crazy to think how many years I spent believing that “my brain was broken”, not knowing that there was a name for the experience. You’re so right that it is a very isolating and confusing experience, so hearing others talk about it is so reassuring and really goes a long way, thank you❤
Love this so much!! Have been a fan of John for years and hearing about his experience with OCD just fills me with hope that a good life is really possible ❤
Not to be the guy that comments about the first 5 seconds of the interview, but my depression sounds exactly like the song titled, 'with tired eyes tired minds tired souls we slept' by explosions in the sky
I read the book when it first was released. I hate read it as a teen because I was sad it was his "last" novel for YA fiction. But me now watching the movie as a now 22 year old.... I cried the majority through it because I finally saw accurate representation of OCD in film in my eyes. I was diagnosed at 9 along with other mental disorders and this movie made me remember how amazing the story was and I was upset at little me for donating the book to the shelter I was moving out of.
That is the song that Jake Peralta started screaming with a guitar in hand at that one dude he had detained and was trying to break hey like run-on sentences me neither.
First off, this interview is ASTOUNDING! All claps for them both. Thank you for the education and the creative inspiration! I know that this interview has gone through editing, the questions were somehow prepared for. But idk why I feel like there are some questions that felt triggering. I can't exactly pinpoint if I, as in the one typing right now, am being ticked off, or if I am reacting to something subtle that I am clocking from their demeanors? Naah, maybe just reading too much into it
I do not have OCD or any other mental health issues, but I have recently had an experience that really helped me understand it all a lot better. I recently for the first time had a pot edible, I have never smoked or anything and have never had a desire to do so, but I had this and about 40 minutes later I was stuck on the couch and could barely move, and with in minutes was not able to communicate at all. Just occasionally giggle or cry a little bit so the people with me did not know what I was going through. At first it was much more a sensation thing of feeling immense weight on my body and feeling disconnected from my body, but then before long it changed to much more mental issues. First with huge depression and anxiety, or at least huge for me. And then before long became the exact thought spirals being described here. It was such an unpleasant experience, and I kept thinking for what seemed like hours that is this really all there is to life? This pain and suffering. That all that stuff I remember happening before, was there just pretend? Will this ever end can I ever go back to that life on not feeling like this again? Even if the pain stops will I be so traumatized by this experience that I will be a completely different person? But fortunately for me I was always able to talk/think/work my way back to a better place, saying no, I know this is just temporary, I know that I can get through this, I know who I am, and yes this is crappy, but I can get through it. But then I would fall right back off and say no I am just lying to myself, that none of that is true and I am just pretending that things will be better. And the spiral analogy is so apt, every time I would be able to get back on the good path and fall right back off, again and again. And it just seemed to go faster and faster back and forth. It seemed like I could not even finish thoughts before the next one was there ready to take over. Thinking I have been through this whole path before and maybe I can just jump forward to the good part again, but then that made falling again all the faster. And I would now and then get on little side tangents about how I was finally going to have some trauma in my life that I could talk about and use to relate to people and work through. And even going through plans of who I was going to tell about this and how I would describe it, but then faster and faster just get pulled right back into the main part of the loop. And again fortunately for me I did have something that at least helped for me I feel, I am a gamer and a lot of the problem solving skills I have learned in those place over the years, and the sense of being the hero who can over come bad situations, and the idea that darkness and shadow and difficulties may suck, but they can help you grow stronger and there is always hope really helped me get through it. Sorry for that being long, but it was something I really wanted to share as someone who normally does not have mental health issues, but that at least a little bit I think I understand what people with OCD are going through.
Thank you Dr. McGrath for your enormous dedication to treating OCD and educating people with and without it. Your understanding of the disease is almost unparalleled to anyone else who doesn't struggle with OCD. I remember first meeting you at Foglia in Chicago. Ever since you have always impressed me with your passion for treatment and compassion for those you you're treating. Thank you John Greene for being so open and answering these questions so articulatly. I look forward to seeing Turtles All the Way Down. It's worth it to me to get HBO Max for a month just to see it.
I was recently diagnosed with OCD after finally understanding and connecting symptoms that I have experienced for my entire life. This interview has helped me feel so seen and less alone about my own OCD. This disorder can be so isolating, and it is helpful to see it discussed in such a safe space. Thank you for this video, it truly means so much to know that others understand and can relate to OCD.❤️
as someone who struggles with (what im assuming is) undiagnosed OCD (no, not needing to have your pencils in a row or whatever), although I haven't seen or read turtles all the way down yet, im really glad im able to see, and probably come back to, this video it feels so great to hear someone else, especially someone so high standing, speak about these experiences and form such beautiful and accurate analogies around them, thank you for so many things John :) (and Patrick for giving you a concise opportunity for you to share this with all of us
Right. The disorder part is when it stop being a part of normal brain function and it's fundamentally crowing out other functions of life. We all like to be a little more organized tommanage stress, we all get tired and can't focus, etc. but when it's an all the time thing... That's the difference.
This is making me ask questions about and for myself, interrogate things and aspects of my own life. Not jump to conclusions, ask questions. Thank you guys for this talk.
so many times in this video i just have to pause and take in how much i relate insanely to just about everything he says. i understand EXACTLY what he means when he talks about the periods where he's "really sick". there's no real way to describe it in a way so that people who havent gone through it can really get it. but for those of us who have, yeah. it's a lot.
The sad part is OCD usually takes a long time to be diagnosed took 10 years for me they always say oh you are just depressed living with ocd is a different type of hell
while i (probably) dont have ocd, johns book and much of this interview have been impactful in the lack of control i feel as someone with adhd (and who knows what else)
I probably don't have OCD but this is still very helpful and interesting to me. I've had pretty bad problems with health anxiety and had periods of compulsive behaviour when I was younger.
It might not be a bad idea to talk to a psychiatrist about it if you haven't before and have the means. Even if it isn't OCD you may be able to find treatment if your anxiety is severe enough that it regularly causes you grief.
Interesting take on the turtles metaphor. My take is closer to “what if but yeah what if”. The way the mind rationalizes the anxiety in the same way the elderly woman rationalizes her world view.
I had a job once counting thousands upon thousands of components by hand. You never could trust yourself to count exactly 7,342 pieces of something when you had an auditor over your shoulder. The “what ifs” keep piling up and prevent you from ever reaching your destination and you end up recounting something for hours, never being satisfied you didn’t skip one or add one. This is only the tip of the iceberg for sufferers.
When commenting above, I forgot to make my actual point. A significant and tragic dimension of life for people suffering with OCD is related to a unique sort of loneliness. This relates to the frequent failure of (often very well-meaning) friends, family and community to appraise with accuracy the internal nature of their friend’s emotional response to the content of their obsessive thinking or imagery. Are the thoughts making her friend terrified? Is the suffering friend seething with rage? Or is he feeling hopeless and quite forlorn? For example, if it is a contamination obsession, the concerned friend may have been made aware of the likely content from previous discussions; however, at the same time this particular concerned friend may have no idea which specific emotions their friend with OCD may be experiencing during this, the current moment of having the inescapable thoughts/imagery. The friend also has no way to hazard an accurate guess regarding the severity of this episode, which they themselves are witnessing ; does it seem like their friend’s episode is mild? or, is it moderate? or, is it some sort of severe? Should they be calling for help from a professional ? These are of course, completely innocent difficulties, and in career as a clinical psychologist, the strongest (and often the first) emotional response that my patients would tell me about (at the very start of the very next appointment after such an event) a was guilt; guilt for “making” their friend feel uncomfortable, or concerned, or scared, or whatever they perceived their friend to have felt in response to having witnessed the patient’s obsessive, thinking or compulsive behavior symptoms. So very often, the next emotional symptom set of my patients (continuing to resolve around the friend/witness) was comprised of the myriad, very real worries which my patients felt and maintained about emotional damage done to their friend, or to the friendship; they felt worry or embarrassment or an ongoing distress about their friend and about perhaps the friend still worrying about the incident when there there was certainly no need. A quick second place was self loathing and hatred about having OCD with all other imaginable, emotional responses fitting in there somewhere of course with any number of 10 of people that I knew over time felt emotions such as embarrassed, and more often guilty or sorry for their friend or somehow responsible for making their friend have uncomfortable feelings in a way that was not fair because ‘how could the friend be expected to understand and cope with my symptoms when they’ve never heard of OCD in real life before?’
I watched "Pure" (Rose Cartwright's memoir) by UK Channel 4 / USA HBO MAX during lockdown, and suddenly realised this is what is wrong with me! .... since then I have recognised so many OCD thoughts and behaviours in myself. Looking forward to seeing John's film.
I related to this a lot as someone with intrusive thoughts. I never knew i was having compulsive thought patterns but that completely describes it. I dont have ocd, i have schizoaffective, but ive always thought there were a lot of similarities
The song to describe my OCD would be The Oke Cokey. I put my right hand in, touch it four times. I put my right hand out, because I did it wrong. In out, in out, until I get it right. I do the hokey cokey And I turn about I put my left hand in, touch it four times. I put my left hand out, because I did it wrong. In out, in out, until I get it right. I do the hokey cokey And I start it all again Because it was uneven.
I can describe psychic pain. Anxiety is like walking around with a pair of hands slowly choking you all day. It's like the inside of your skin has recent cat scratches everywhere. It's like someone just keeps throwing balls just past your head all day.
As a retired clinical psychologist who worked with hundreds of patients living w OCD, I find this comment to be quite reminiscent of a common or representative statement made by patients struggling with OCD.
28:10 I follow a guy with schizoaffective disorder who once said something similar to here, something along the lines of, “if I can see it, hear it, feel it, smell it…then what’s the difference?” 49 minutes of John talking about mental health is a dream come true, awesome video 👏
I wish naming it gave me relief. The chemical engineering department reinforces my compulsions for the sake of chemical engineering education. Nobody has ever talked their way out of OCD. And the scientist thinking to himself very clever. I am kind of a collection of infinite turtles.
feeling like an anthropologist in groups of other humans is a classic symptom of autism. I'm guessing other neurodivergent types as well. anybody with ADHD, OCD, Tourette syndrome, and other neurodivergencies know about this?
he main (very very important and often missed by other neurodivergent folks) is that it's not because you feel safe being unatteched to others' reality: it's terrifying and frustrating and ego dystonic. a lot of non ocd folks on socials mention this phenomenon like they don't belong would prefer to have their surrounding fot their brains better. with ocd, the environment you're creating for yourself is incredibly destructive and harms your own belifes ajd self esteem. this is not hate at all, but current autism content creators and communities forget that not all neurodivergent folks feel the same way they do. to us, it is an effing mental illness, it is bad and it surely doesn't mean the environment should adapt
@@lorenabpv that's a really interesting point. i'm curious about ocd because i can relate to thought spirals, feeling different, and intrusive thoughts but not the main ocd trait of needing to do something. ocd does sound incredibly difficult. i believe that autism is quite different, and i am just now learning a bit about ocd. the distinction you made between externalizing and internalizing one's world is really insightful. thanks for the new info! 💜
Did you have insurance I have insurance and I was checking it out, I was assuming it would be covered automatically because my insurance covers therapy but I’m not sure. If you don’t have insurance, have you tried the marketplace? I’m broke af and that’s what I use for insurance
Does anyone here have any advice on how to break the cycle? I find myself caught in anxiety and obsessive thought patterns quite often, and I don't know how to get out. Sometimes it just happens, and sometimes it just doesn't. I could use some guidance.
Look into the critial psyhology movement. One of the best things that made me rethink of all these mental health movement is the power threat meaning framework. We have alternative ways and I am starting to veer away with the diagnostic thinking thats very glaring on this interview
I like that he actually calls it "being sick" because it makes it legitimate and shows how much it impacts everything.
I wasn't 100% sure whether he referred to the mental or the many -itis diseases John Green has had
@@turoni314in another interview he clarified he means ocd sick
I like it too. I've had to take a sick leave for work for my mental health and we don't say, oh I had to take a leave for my cardiac health etc. We just say health/healthy/sick/had an attack/acute onset etc. Not calling in sick because you're too anxious to tell someone you're sick because you're worried they'll think you're lying so you just convince yourself you ARE lying and a fake has cost me a lot in my life.
",,,but I still can live a good life. That's the kind of hope that stands up to scrutiny." Another John Green insight I hope I remember forever.
"It always feels permanent. It always feels like forever. It always feels complete when it's really bad. It feels like this is the whole story of your life, this is the only thing you can ever be, the only life you will ever have. And that's just not true. That is part of the incredibly seductive lie that despair tells."
Thank you for taking the time to transcribe this. 💗
I've only recently downloaded nocd and I can't tell you how it feels to read stuff like this because it feels so profoundly alienating and when I read this it's someone else articulating what feels utterly alone to me. But we are not alone
severe ocd is beyond hellfire, it is the suffering of hundreds of lifetimes concentrated into one soul. for me at least.
You're not wrong! A living hell is how I describe mine. But I refuse to give in. Keep fighting!
It is, Henry! Please just know you're not alone!
@@setmefree1980 Excellent advice! Keep up your great attitude!
@@setmefree1980 bless you, good luck.
@@BobBurg thanks very very much Bob. Best wishes
“I’m not gonna talk my way out of it, I’m gonna talk my way right back into it” GOODNESS this encapsulates my problem with anxiety so well. Hearing that sentence could have saved me years
Dude I've spent months worth of time arguing with it. Often for forty minutes at a time
It's very brave to talk so openly about your own experience with OCD. Thank you, John Green, for being a voice that so many people need, and for giving people with severe OCD (like me!) hope for a fulfilling and worthwhile life.
No wonder John has talked about in his vlog how difficult this press tour has been and how he broke down in tears a few times. Doing a bit of cathartic crying right now too. It really feels like absolute indescribable pain and torment, it feels inescapable.
Thank you for sharing, John ♥
"The spiral" is a terrific analogy, as well as "it's turtles all the way down".
35 years ago I was absolutely passionate about being a feminist scholar at my university; my professors were encouraging me to complete a PHD in Women’s Studies. But my OCD took over, specifically HOCD, and was terrified that my studies would “turn me into a lesbian”. So, I gave it all up and I never found such passionate enthusiasm again. OCD stole what could have been a wonderful academic life. I didn’t know about ERP back then.
What a beautiful interview.
As someone who's been through Exposure and Response Prevention therapy, I want to emphasize that it's not just the gold standard for OCD - it's the gold standard for all Anxiety Disorders. After years of suffering from Social Anxiety Disorder and going nowhere in talk therapy, trying exposure was the best decision I could have ever made. Like John, I was going through a time when hours of my day were eaten up by painful anxieties and now my symptoms are very mild and I'm living a full life. It was a bumpy road that took commitment, but nothing else has been more rewarding. So find a therapist you trust and give it a try, I promise that it'll be worth it in the end :)
Thanks for adding this!! I suffer from more generalized anxiety where I don't have many compulsive behaviours but I do have obsessive worries and I was wondering if it could be a treatment option for some of that
@@amberbydreamsart5467 Hey, of course friend. Thank you for sharing :)
Obsessive worries are a big component of my sickness too - largely about social situations but also about my health, career, life etc. When I decided to get help, I met with three potential therapists to see who was the best fit for me and the one I chose, he's been excellent. His ERP and CBT approach has showed me how to build better mental habits to replace my old unhealthy coping techniques. What I could do in a day 2 years ago, I can now do 10x more with none of the stress and pain. I'm still on my journey of course, and good luck with this new stage of yours!
Part of the problem is finding a therapist. There isn't enough help in my area and nocd is too expensive for me. Hopefully one day I'll be better
@@donnaaranda7175 Oof, I'm sorry to hear that. I've struggled to find a good therapist in the past, but not for lack of options. Have you looked into telehealth therapists? There can even be therapists from other parts of the country who are licensed to practice telehealth in your state. I found psychologytoday to be a very helpful resource when I was searching. Please don't give up, you deserve proper treatment
This interview is exemplary. It's incredibly powerful to hear about OCD from John's perspective and to have that supported by a thoughtful, gracious interviewer who is so knowledgeable about OCD themselves. The end result differs from what we usually see about mental illness in interviews, which is often illness as spectacle--or, at the extreme, an exploitative giggle-fest of just how "gosh darn wacky" the visible manifestations of the illness can be to the layperson. It's just really, really nice to see any mental illness being treated so respectfully. Thank you to both of you!
OCD is a nightmare. I've overcome a lot with it, but that romanticization is a problem. Its not a cute little disorder. It feels like an everlasting hell when you're going through it.
There he goes, opening the door to our own emotions and holding our hand. JG is such a generous human being xxx
"Despair lies."
I didn't know that I needed to hear that.
I remember lying in my garden, sunshine on my face, listening to the Anthropocene Reviewed podcast without any SUDS and ruminations in my mind during remission. Now I'm back at it again in the loop of OCD. I'm already doing the work to get out again though. And who knows maybe I will be able to revisit this beautiful experience again this summer. Thank you John Green for what you are doing. Also can you maybe make another episode? I really do love them because they bring peace to my mind 😆 greetings from Germany
Good luck man, I really hope you manage to get trough it again. Greetings from Sweden
This is all new to me. What is SUDS and what is the podcast you had mentioned?
@@Gizmosnitto13 SUDS is short for subjective units of distress scale. During OCD usually you experience distress during the whole day and SUDS is a self assessment of how high it is at any given moment. The podcast is made and spoken by John Green, the person that is being interviewed here. I do really recommend listening to it.
@@Gizmosnitto13SUDS is subjective units of distress scale it helps with building hierarchy and tracking progress. The idea is that SUDS is trending downwards as you work up your hierarchy.
The podcast is from the interviewee.
Just wanted to give you guys an update, after six months of doing my ERP homework and 40 therapy sessions with an OCD specialist I reached subclinical in OCD symptomatic.
I don’t have OCD but I still felt so seen when I watched the movie. I do have anxiety, and the scene with Aza in the hospital writhing, crying and so worried about getting infected with C Dif felt like it could have been a scene from my life. I always feel like such a freak when I have episodes like that
It wouldn’t hurt to get diagnosed if you haven’t.
lol I can't wait for the Vlogbrothers video 10 years from now featuring John jumping out of an airplane! I remember when you were afraid to stand on a table, you really have come so extraordinarily far John.
Great work you guys! 👏
Just want to say thank you for your videos! Some of them have been super helpful - I'm very grateful!
Ahh I'm so happy to see John Green, NOCD, and Nate all together in the same place on the internet! You have all made a huge impact on my life! I've been doing ERP since January and I really do feel like I'm living a different life.
Around 16:10 John talks about the intrusive, spiraling thoughts around human bacteria biomes. A thing I read that helped me manage my spiraling thoughts about contagion and bacteria takeover was reading The Body: A Gyise for Occupants by Bill Byson. He talks about how your immune system is basically derived from your biome. The only reason it works is it can often tell "me" from "not me" and seeks to eliminate "not me." So the biome that males up part of the matter of my body really is me. It's not less me just because other bacteria similar to mine are out in the world. Even kissing can't permanently impact the biome. Within a short time after kissing there's no trace left of the other person's bacteria. I found it comforting that the natural world has an ebb and flow like that.
When I was younger, in middle school, I was really worried that I wouldn’t be able to live a fulfilling life and have a career because of my OCD. I loved watching John Green on Crash course and when I found out that he had OCD, I felt so hopeful about my life, because even though he has OCD like me, he is able to have have a family and a good career and be a force for good in this world. It made me realize that despite the struggles I have with my mental health I could also do amazing things. It really helped me through a tough time in my life, and while continuing to follow John on social media, I continue to feel less isolated with my OCD. Thank you John Green for being you! DFTBA!
DFTBA!!
What is this acronym?
@@Gizmosnitto13 don’t forget to be awesome!
@@Gizmosnitto13 Don't Forget To Be Awesome
I don’t have OCD, but I do have bipolar and have experienced crippling, unrelenting anxiety along with ADHD. Turtles All the Way Down has been the most comforting work for me in my times of illness, because I’m hearing from someone who has lived with serious mental illness well into his adulthood. It helps to hear from someone with experience that it doesn’t necessarily go away, and it can get worse, but even still, clouds do part at times and you can lead a fulfilling life.
As I was going through another ocd episode my boyfriend shared this. I’m starting to watch now while the ocd thoughts are still knocking on my door, threatening to kill me.
This thing ruined my life, and is still continuing to ruin my life every day. It has brought me confusion, delusion, absolutely crippling depression, suicidal ideation, health problems, loss of my prior faith, isolation from family and colleagues, inability to work, inability to concentrate, inability to learn boring things, PTSD like symptoms, unhealthy coping mechanisms, etc. I can’t remember what it is like living without the darkness and anxiety and constant feeling that the world is going to end and thoughts that I hate and guilt. I miss not having to fight off my own thoughts from waking up to laying down and sometimes even during the night.
Phew. I needed to write that.
❤❤ stay strong
When my inability to lock doors, without checking every outlet in the house and the lock itself repeatedly, began to interfere with my schedule and expanded to mail, bills, and other basic necessities of life, I visited a therapist. She told me of another patient (as they do I guess) who checks every single space in her house, including every drawer in her 64-drawer medicinal cabinet, to see if somebody might be hiding in them, meaning a full human being in 4 square inches of space. I felt a rush of relief, followed by a deep, sad empathy for that stranger. I wanted to tell her that she is not mad, and she is not alone.
Well you might not have been able to tell her she's not alone.....but you've told me because I have the same as you .
How are you now ?
Thanks 😊
@@mariang3946 I am sorry to hear that.
I am better actually, but it took time. OCD doesn't go away, but you can get it to be really quiet. Therapy helps to recognize the fear and confront the situations that trigger it. Personally, I find it was important to learn to be less hard on myself, trust my decisions more, and recognize that they mostly do not have detrimental consequences, neither physically, nor socially. Positive, well-grounded people and responsibilities in your life can help loads, as well.
Hope that helps a little. I wish you well. 🌺
Hi John, I just want to express sincere gratitude for you being so vulnerable and sharing your experiences with OCD over the years- it was the reason I was diagnosed and got treatment back in 2020. I remember being at one of my lowest points and watching one of your videos, and realizing that my lifetime of mental health difficulties could be summed up in a single diagnosis. I ended up getting treatment and proper care, am doing so much better now. Your perspective and wisdom on being able to still live a good life has really brought me comfort as a young adult figuring things out. Thanks for all you do!
What kinda treatment
I have often told people that I would prefer to be tortured than have severe OCD again.
The things you believe about yourself, others and the world are so beyond terrifying it is indescribable.
I've felt the exact same thing. I would gladly endure a lot of pain if it meant I wasn't living half, or more, of my life in the bathroom. Even just that one aspect of my OCD being removed would be worth it.
I really appreciate the attention that John Green is bringing to OCD; I also have OCD and can relate to what he is saying quite a bit. Medication and ERP are so important. I'm currently enrolled in school in hopes to help others in a clinical setting, there are some real options available to manage it. I really dislike when people say, "oh, that's just my OCD."
My sympathy goes out to those with OCD. But the montage at the end was beautiful and I can imagine it could be a glimmer of hope for anyone suffering🩷
"Because thats the nature of OCD" it truly is.
People who never had and have mental health issues have no idea how lucky they are. Sigh.
Thank you very much!
27:57 "When we're talking about feelings if it feels real it is real" THIS!
It's so invalidating to be told (over and over) that something isn't real when you are experiencing it, suffering from it.
This whole conversation was so helpful. Thank you thank you both ❤
Brilliant! Absolute gems throughout from both Dr. McGrath and John. While I'm older than John (I'm 66), I relate so very much to what he's saying. Thank you, gentlemen!
So glad to know that "Turtles..." has been made into a movie!
I not only became a recent member of NOCD but I watched the movie twice and it will be one I will continue to watch and show my loved ones just a gain a little understanding and it has educated them. I got diagnosed with other themes but I have found it is all similar if not the same. I felt so seen and understood by aza and as someone who was scared to mention it - I am learning the tools and resources. I almost wasn’t able to function.. but I had a mental breakdown that led me to seek help. I was the one who sought help to find out if I had OCD and yeah .. I’ve had it all of my conscious life just like he said but if you avoid it long enough like I did .. you can fake it till you make it till your body just gives up.
I knew really little about what OCD was like before I watched TATWD. I hadn't read the book and hadn't even really heard what it was about! But I've been watching vlogbrothers videos for the last year and decided to watch the movie after all of John's promo (good work John, I've recommended it to a bunch of people). It blew me away. I felt it in my core. The acting and the writing was just so phenomenal. I cried and gasped and laughed. Now I'm determined to learn more about OCD! This video was really helpful! Also, I have anxiety, and this is just convincing me more and more that I need a therapist (and that I need to always be good about taking my meds lol)
i am only 5 minutes in on the video and already feel so seen, the poem quote is such a perfect explanation of how it starts, hopefully with the book and movie people can became aware of what having ocd really means..
When I was first coming to terms with the fact that I have OCD I was reluctant to watch this channel just because of the name "NOCD". Now seeing John Green here, that makes me trust that you guys truly are a good resource. I'm glad, theres not much out there, its nice to have another!
Thank you for continuing to share your story, John. 💗
Dear John. You are one of my heroes and for a long time you have been one of my sources of hope living with OCD. I appreciate you immensely. YNWA.
"Anything mentionable is manageable." Chef's kiss. ❤
I struggled with my self identity for a few years. It was a bit more extreme though: I lost all concept of “myself”. I didnt think of myself like a person, more just a collection of intermittent thoughts. I was so used to changing my personality (which is either my coping mechanism or my compulsion, depends if I get diagnosed with OCD or not) that I wasn’t the same person as I was even a month before. Nothing was static, everything just kept falling apart and deteriorating and changing
Ironically, the thing that saved me was realizing the only thing I had that was constant no matter what I did was a chaotic life. That’s what I made define me: the pure chaos that is my life with the constant regressions and highs and lows, and with that I managed to over a few months rebuild my sense of self. Now it’s strong: I know who I am
While I was listening I heard a lot of descriptions that also fit alcoholism. (I'm in recovery and have been for a while). And then you nod to it, illustrating enabling behaviour with providing alcohol to one such as I.
Staying in reality is frequently difficult and relies on interaction with other people to show me when I've taken off into my own universe again.
Thank you.
I hope you know how much value you bring to this world, John. You have enriched the lives of so many different people in so many different ways and I truly admire you for it. Never stop being you ❤
This is a great platform to expose the schemes that OCD and create awareness and not be ashame of these intrusive thoughts. Shame and guilt are the cunning ways OCD use to cause delibitation! Most important keys in helping OCD sufferers are awareness and proper professional support. Every treatment journey for each person is different. However, I would compassion and understanding from family members and peers goes a long way! I would just want to share my initial recovery journey of OCD doesn't mean LESS intrusive thought, anxiety, heart palpitations etc...hahaha. In fact, it's the opposite. For me, the way to guage is the QUALITY of life meaning able to basically meet your daily physical needs, driving, going out and just enjoying the things I used to do before OCD became worse. Baby steps matters and never condemn yourself whenever you do a compulsion. I just want to encourage people with OCD out there that whatever OCD sends to us, we still have a winning card in our hands!!❤ Thank you NOCD for your platform
My kid and I have been reading this book on our drives too and from their mother's house. It's probably the most realistic telling of OCD that I've ever read. There have been moments that I've almost felt like I needed a break because it was too real.
Both Green brothers are amazing writers, which is nice because I'm going to need a recovery book when I finish this one.
John I hope you can see this. Thank YOU so much for not only this book but ALL Your books they have been a bridge for me and my son. I suffer from severe depression and this movie talked to me so much. I was like talking to Aza take your meds. It's so very hard to get through the days sometimes. Your books are such a light. Thank YOU! Blessings to you.
My ocd is mainly around health like him although it has morphed..it generally morphs from one concern to the other and then once that’s resolved it jumps to another fear..of course this affects relationships and is frustrating for all. Good interview- thank you
Thank you, John, for speaking about your experience and for bringing it into your novel. As someone with OCD, I empathize with your struggle. Its crazy to think how many years I spent believing that “my brain was broken”, not knowing that there was a name for the experience. You’re so right that it is a very isolating and confusing experience, so hearing others talk about it is so reassuring and really goes a long way, thank you❤
Love this so much!! Have been a fan of John for years and hearing about his experience with OCD just fills me with hope that a good life is really possible ❤
Not to be the guy that comments about the first 5 seconds of the interview, but my depression sounds exactly like the song titled, 'with tired eyes tired minds tired souls we slept' by explosions in the sky
I read the book when it first was released. I hate read it as a teen because I was sad it was his "last" novel for YA fiction. But me now watching the movie as a now 22 year old.... I cried the majority through it because I finally saw accurate representation of OCD in film in my eyes. I was diagnosed at 9 along with other mental disorders and this movie made me remember how amazing the story was and I was upset at little me for donating the book to the shelter I was moving out of.
That is the song that Jake Peralta started screaming with a guitar in hand at that one dude he had detained and was trying to break hey like run-on sentences me neither.
as a big fan of the green brothers and a NOCD patient, this is the collaboration i knew i needed, but didn’t expect to get
Most of us have some kind of dysfunction. It is a great person that strives to improve. It’s the striving that matters.
First off, this interview is ASTOUNDING! All claps for them both. Thank you for the education and the creative inspiration!
I know that this interview has gone through editing, the questions were somehow prepared for. But idk why I feel like there are some questions that felt triggering. I can't exactly pinpoint if I, as in the one typing right now, am being ticked off, or if I am reacting to something subtle that I am clocking from their demeanors?
Naah, maybe just reading too much into it
I do not have OCD or any other mental health issues, but I have recently had an experience that really helped me understand it all a lot better.
I recently for the first time had a pot edible, I have never smoked or anything and have never had a desire to do so, but I had this and about 40 minutes later I was stuck on the couch and could barely move, and with in minutes was not able to communicate at all. Just occasionally giggle or cry a little bit so the people with me did not know what I was going through. At first it was much more a sensation thing of feeling immense weight on my body and feeling disconnected from my body, but then before long it changed to much more mental issues.
First with huge depression and anxiety, or at least huge for me. And then before long became the exact thought spirals being described here. It was such an unpleasant experience, and I kept thinking for what seemed like hours that is this really all there is to life? This pain and suffering. That all that stuff I remember happening before, was there just pretend? Will this ever end can I ever go back to that life on not feeling like this again? Even if the pain stops will I be so traumatized by this experience that I will be a completely different person?
But fortunately for me I was always able to talk/think/work my way back to a better place, saying no, I know this is just temporary, I know that I can get through this, I know who I am, and yes this is crappy, but I can get through it. But then I would fall right back off and say no I am just lying to myself, that none of that is true and I am just pretending that things will be better. And the spiral analogy is so apt, every time I would be able to get back on the good path and fall right back off, again and again. And it just seemed to go faster and faster back and forth. It seemed like I could not even finish thoughts before the next one was there ready to take over. Thinking I have been through this whole path before and maybe I can just jump forward to the good part again, but then that made falling again all the faster.
And I would now and then get on little side tangents about how I was finally going to have some trauma in my life that I could talk about and use to relate to people and work through. And even going through plans of who I was going to tell about this and how I would describe it, but then faster and faster just get pulled right back into the main part of the loop.
And again fortunately for me I did have something that at least helped for me I feel, I am a gamer and a lot of the problem solving skills I have learned in those place over the years, and the sense of being the hero who can over come bad situations, and the idea that darkness and shadow and difficulties may suck, but they can help you grow stronger and there is always hope really helped me get through it.
Sorry for that being long, but it was something I really wanted to share as someone who normally does not have mental health issues, but that at least a little bit I think I understand what people with OCD are going through.
0:08 Many bands have…it’s always been some of my favorite music. I’d recommend the album Schlagenheim by Black Midi
Thank you Dr. McGrath for your enormous dedication to treating OCD and educating people with and without it. Your understanding of the disease is almost unparalleled to anyone else who doesn't struggle with OCD. I remember first meeting you at Foglia in Chicago. Ever since you have always impressed me with your passion for treatment and compassion for those you you're treating. Thank you John Greene for being so open and answering these questions so articulatly. I look forward to seeing Turtles All the Way Down. It's worth it to me to get HBO Max for a month just to see it.
I was recently diagnosed with OCD after finally understanding and connecting symptoms that I have experienced for my entire life. This interview has helped me feel so seen and less alone about my own OCD. This disorder can be so isolating, and it is helpful to see it discussed in such a safe space. Thank you for this video, it truly means so much to know that others understand and can relate to OCD.❤️
Thank you SO much for having this conversation. I don't have the words for how much this means to me
0:10 I believe Finneas and Billie are on it.
Thank you for this. It helped me today. ❤
as someone who struggles with (what im assuming is) undiagnosed OCD (no, not needing to have your pencils in a row or whatever), although I haven't seen or read turtles all the way down yet, im really glad im able to see, and probably come back to, this video
it feels so great to hear someone else, especially someone so high standing, speak about these experiences and form such beautiful and accurate analogies around them, thank you for so many things John :) (and Patrick for giving you a concise opportunity for you to share this with all of us
"We all have a little [OCD/ADHD/PTSD/MDD/GAD/BPD/NPD]..."
Yes, we sure do. Those with a _lot_ are usually the ones with the disorders.
Right. The disorder part is when it stop being a part of normal brain function and it's fundamentally crowing out other functions of life.
We all like to be a little more organized tommanage stress, we all get tired and can't focus, etc. but when it's an all the time thing... That's the difference.
I'm so excited for a movie about OCD. It's so hard to explain to people what OCD is like.
Thank you,!
This is making me ask questions about and for myself, interrogate things and aspects of my own life.
Not jump to conclusions, ask questions.
Thank you guys for this talk.
so many times in this video i just have to pause and take in how much i relate insanely to just about everything he says. i understand EXACTLY what he means when he talks about the periods where he's "really sick". there's no real way to describe it in a way so that people who havent gone through it can really get it. but for those of us who have, yeah. it's a lot.
I'm so thankful for this interview as a partner or someone with OCD
Dear Hank and John(or as I like to think of it "Dear John and Patrick")
Honestly though, a wonderful conversation!
The sad part is OCD usually takes a long time to be diagnosed took 10 years for me they always say oh you are just depressed living with ocd is a different type of hell
while i (probably) dont have ocd, johns book and much of this interview have been impactful in the lack of control i feel as someone with adhd (and who knows what else)
I probably don't have OCD but this is still very helpful and interesting to me. I've had pretty bad problems with health anxiety and had periods of compulsive behaviour when I was younger.
It might not be a bad idea to talk to a psychiatrist about it if you haven't before and have the means. Even if it isn't OCD you may be able to find treatment if your anxiety is severe enough that it regularly causes you grief.
@@crosana01 oh yeah maybe I should've said that I did that for like a year and it helped me out a lot. Very good advice
Great interview.! And thank you, john, for always sharing yourself with the world.
That was wonderful. Thanks you both.
Thank you for this open and excellent interview. We need more conversations like this.
Looking forward to the movie!
Interesting take on the turtles metaphor. My take is closer to “what if but yeah what if”. The way the mind rationalizes the anxiety in the same way the elderly woman rationalizes her world view.
I had a job once counting thousands upon thousands of components by hand. You never could trust yourself to count exactly 7,342 pieces of something when you had an auditor over your shoulder. The “what ifs” keep piling up and prevent you from ever reaching your destination and you end up recounting something for hours, never being satisfied you didn’t skip one or add one. This is only the tip of the iceberg for sufferers.
When commenting above, I forgot to make my actual point.
A significant and tragic dimension of life for people suffering with OCD is related to a unique sort of loneliness. This relates to the frequent failure of (often very well-meaning) friends, family and community to appraise with accuracy the internal nature of their friend’s emotional response to the content of their obsessive thinking or imagery.
Are the thoughts making her friend terrified? Is the suffering friend seething with rage? Or is he feeling hopeless and quite forlorn?
For example, if it is a contamination obsession, the concerned friend may have been made aware of the likely content from previous discussions; however, at the same time this particular concerned friend may have no idea which specific emotions their friend with OCD may be experiencing during this, the current moment of having the inescapable thoughts/imagery.
The friend also has no way to hazard an accurate guess regarding the severity of this episode, which they themselves are witnessing ; does it seem like their friend’s episode is mild?
or, is it moderate?
or, is it some sort of severe?
Should they be calling for help from a professional ?
These are of course, completely innocent difficulties, and in career as a clinical psychologist, the strongest (and often the first) emotional response that my patients would tell me about (at the very start of the very next appointment after such an event) a was guilt; guilt for “making” their
friend feel uncomfortable, or concerned, or scared, or whatever they perceived their friend to have felt in response to having witnessed the patient’s obsessive, thinking or compulsive behavior symptoms.
So very often, the next emotional symptom set of my patients (continuing to resolve around the friend/witness) was comprised of the myriad, very real worries which my patients felt and maintained about emotional damage done to their friend, or to the friendship; they felt worry or embarrassment or an ongoing distress about their friend and about perhaps the friend still worrying about the incident when there there was certainly no need.
A quick second place was self loathing and hatred about having OCD with all other imaginable, emotional responses fitting in there somewhere of course with any number of 10 of people that I knew over time felt emotions such as embarrassed, and more often guilty or sorry for their friend or somehow responsible for making their friend have uncomfortable feelings in a way that was not fair because ‘how could the friend be expected to understand and cope with my symptoms when they’ve never heard of OCD in real life before?’
I watched "Pure" (Rose Cartwright's memoir) by UK Channel 4 / USA HBO MAX during lockdown, and suddenly realised this is what is wrong with me! .... since then I have recognised so many OCD thoughts and behaviours in myself. Looking forward to seeing John's film.
I related to this a lot as someone with intrusive thoughts. I never knew i was having compulsive thought patterns but that completely describes it. I dont have ocd, i have schizoaffective, but ive always thought there were a lot of similarities
The song to describe my OCD would be The Oke Cokey.
I put my right hand in, touch it four times.
I put my right hand out, because I did it wrong.
In out, in out, until I get it right.
I do the hokey cokey
And I turn about
I put my left hand in, touch it four times.
I put my left hand out, because I did it wrong.
In out, in out, until I get it right.
I do the hokey cokey
And I start it all again
Because it was uneven.
I can describe psychic pain. Anxiety is like walking around with a pair of hands slowly choking you all day. It's like the inside of your skin has recent cat scratches everywhere. It's like someone just keeps throwing balls just past your head all day.
In regards to the cold open I think Woodpecker No. 1 by Merzbow is the song that fits the description
As a retired clinical psychologist who worked with hundreds of patients living w OCD, I find this comment to be quite reminiscent of a common or representative statement made by patients struggling with OCD.
Excellent question about knowledge/research.
8:58-10:17 made me cry
28:10 I follow a guy with schizoaffective disorder who once said something similar to here, something along the lines of, “if I can see it, hear it, feel it, smell it…then what’s the difference?”
49 minutes of John talking about mental health is a dream come true, awesome video 👏
Song? "Turtle Dreams" by Meredith Monk
Seriously. Look it up.
Despair lies; also, despair is another word for hope (willa cather)
I wish naming it gave me relief. The chemical engineering department reinforces my compulsions for the sake of chemical engineering education. Nobody has ever talked their way out of OCD. And the scientist thinking to himself very clever. I am kind of a collection of infinite turtles.
feeling like an anthropologist in groups of other humans is a classic symptom of autism. I'm guessing other neurodivergent types as well. anybody with ADHD, OCD, Tourette syndrome, and other neurodivergencies know about this?
he main (very very important and often missed by other neurodivergent folks) is that it's not because you feel safe being unatteched to others' reality: it's terrifying and frustrating and ego dystonic.
a lot of non ocd folks on socials mention this phenomenon like they don't belong would prefer to have their surrounding fot their brains better. with ocd, the environment you're creating for yourself is incredibly destructive and harms your own belifes ajd self esteem.
this is not hate at all, but current autism content creators and communities forget that not all neurodivergent folks feel the same way they do. to us, it is an effing mental illness, it is bad and it surely doesn't mean the environment should adapt
@@lorenabpv that's a really interesting point. i'm curious about ocd because i can relate to thought spirals, feeling different, and intrusive thoughts but not the main ocd trait of needing to do something. ocd does sound incredibly difficult. i believe that autism is quite different, and i am just now learning a bit about ocd. the distinction you made between externalizing and internalizing one's world is really insightful. thanks for the new info! 💜
I wish NOCD was as affordable as it was accessible. So easy to got signed up but just like every healthcare it's too much for me to afford
Did you have insurance I have insurance and I was checking it out, I was assuming it would be covered automatically because my insurance covers therapy but I’m not sure. If you don’t have insurance, have you tried the marketplace? I’m broke af and that’s what I use for insurance
john is so well worded it’s so insanely hot omg
i love you John
i love you John
I'm here because I'm here... & newsletter
Does Violet in that movie by Justine Bateman have ocd?
Does anyone here have any advice on how to break the cycle? I find myself caught in anxiety and obsessive thought patterns quite often, and I don't know how to get out. Sometimes it just happens, and sometimes it just doesn't. I could use some guidance.
Look into the critial psyhology movement. One of the best things that made me rethink of all these mental health movement is the power threat meaning framework. We have alternative ways and I am starting to veer away with the diagnostic thinking thats very glaring on this interview
I feel like a fraud everyday and I hope that feeling will leave me.
XTC's Complicated Game could be a good song to describe his OCD.