@@180mph9 TA-4 F and J instrument training squadron. He was an instructor when ALL the other LT, jg's were students ! That says something about the guy. He was the Only Officer that ever gave me the time of day.
I accompanied Lt. Snoot Snodgrass along with several other trainees as his Troubleshooter when we deployed to Yuma Arizona Air Combat Maneuver Rang on several occasion from Miramar Naval Air Station California. Great times after flying early in the mornings on the range when we would all go out to the lake for cooling off and waterskiing. And of course drinking beer!! Great pilot and a good man. I was 18 at the time but they kept an eye on us young’in’s as they called us. Lt. Snodgrass’s letter of recommendation got me accepted in for the US Navy P-3 Flight Engineering school at Moffett Field California and that started my flying carrier. Thank you Lt. Snodgrass for all that you unselfishly did for me and you will always be missed by your shipmates Sir! Damn good times!
I was honored to have served on the USS America with Capt. Snodgrass where I was on deck when he made the infamous knife-edge low pass. In the civilian world I sat many hours watching Dale as I was an ARFF firefighter/paramedic at NAS Norfolk back when we hosted an annual air show. He was truly a living legend and will be greatly missed. Rest eterrnally in the heavens shipmate.
I was on the deck then, also. I took a ton of F-14 pictures back then. This was near the end of my time onboard, and I was too “spent” to bother anymore. Wish I would have brought the camera up that day..
RIP Snort - he was kind enough to shake hands and talk with me decades ago - when he was just a 20 something at the air show in Quonset, RI after demonstrating the capabilities of the F-14 Tomcat. He was a great pilot and a nice guy.
Call sign "Snort" Dale Snodgrass a Brother in Arms and supreme Patriot. Gone West, we will more than miss him. Thank you brother for your service, leadership, inspiration, influence and above all for me the pleasure to have known you. The stall spin scenario that Juan mentioned is possible from the physics angle but I find it impossible to believe that it was pilot induced. We had an IAC incident where the pilot of a Pitts experienced "control lock" coming out of a hammerhead. Vertically nose down when he pulled the stick back to recover it failed to move enough to complete the level off. As an F-16 pilot and well experienced as was "Snort" he had the presence of mind "The Right Stuff" to use the trim to help get the nose up. He survived the crash and was lucky that the landing was cushioned by soft muddy ground. Investigation found a tool wedged in the elevator controls. Dale was capable of piloting under pressure, I agree with others that he would have been maneuvering the entire time trying to alleviate whatever conditions existed at the time. Hand Salute!
Want to let everyone know that if you're ever in Miami, you can see Captain Snodgrass' actual combat F-14 on display at the Wings Over Miami Museum. Highly recommend.
@@mattf49006 Matt, I have been to the Air Zoo many times including yesterday to see Doc, the B-29. The F-14A at the Air Zoo is lettered for Snodgrass as the pilot. I saw the Flight of the Grummans a few times at the air shows in Kalamazoo. Impressive to see the F-4, F-6, F-7, F-8, F-9 and F-14 all in one formation.
@@klsc8510 ...I live a mile east of the tower...unfortunately i was out of town when Doc laid over ..i've toured it before and its a magnificent bird Yes the F-14 at the Zoo has Dales name on it..he flew that aircraft over Iraq as a member of VF-33 ...he delivered it in spring of '95
We can hear the frustration and sadness in your voice Juan. Full throttle, prop spinning, no reasonable reason for a spin in. Snort was a pilots pilot. R I P
You will be missed and will always be remembered, Skipper. I'm proud to have served under your command. May you always rest in peace, Skipper. You'll always be a legend in my mind.
Dale did not stall and spin in. I was an eye witness. The plane did pitch up steeply but it looked like he could not control the pitch up so it looked like he executed a wing over type recovery but apparently still had no pitch control. He then impacted the ground in a steep nose down attitude. The aircraft did not stall. I am a long time friend of Dale and a retired air show performer and assure his fans that he did not stall and spin his aircraft. We should all remember him as the extraordinary aviator he was.
I'm so sorry you had to observe your friend's accident. I'm unfamiliar with the airplane, but could the seat have slid backwards on takeoff, preventing operation of the controls? I had that happen in a 172 and it almost killed me.
I despise these TH-cam “safety” channels that jump on every tragedy for clicks. Few have any formal safety investigation experience, and lurk about hoping to be first to post about a mishap, without credible information. The indict someone with speculation and continue with admonitions based on pure speculation, then cover with “we don’t know what happened” It’s disgusting.
@@maxbuffet4493 Then don't watch them, Max. For those of us who have "been there done that", we enjoy the frankness and immediate details of these accidents to keep reminded of how critical it is to follow check lists and pay attention to details. The NTSB speculates within 90 days and then takes 3 years to release the facts and more speculation. God bless these TH-camrs.
Saw him perform at the Dayton Airshow about 20 or so years ago. He was, of course, flying an F-14, but had it tucked up tight under the tail of a propeller-driven F7 Tigercat, doing a close-formation aerobatic. What an absolutely superb flight demo with two totally dissimilar aircraft! Also met him briefly at Oshkosh several years ago...a very nice man and a great aviator. A true pilot's pilot. He'll be sorely missed. RIP, Snort!
Saw Snort first as a kid going to east coast air shows when he was Tomcat demo pilot. Saw him in the fleet. Saw him more recently flying the F-86 at air shows. Always had the time to answer a question or share a quick story. RIP Snort
My first day at NAS Oceana was memorable... Someone drove a golf cart into the swimming pool at the O-club, wasn't the first time but it drew a crowd. I went inside and found Snort pouring over paperwork by himself at a table in the back. I introduced myself and told him I was a Nugget just assigned to VF-102 and had a problem to discuss with him. He invited me to sit down and asked a ton of questions about who I was and what I had done the first 23 years of my life, even though I wasn't in his squadron. We talked for an hour and flew the next day. He knew what my problem was, why I was having the problem and 2 hours later it was history... Never spoke directly with Snort again. Never forgot that day. RIP Dale... anytime, any place, any weather!
I met Snort at KSGJ (Saint Augustine ) in the mid 2000s during a St Augustine Aircraft Pilots Association (SAAPA) meeting. I told him I had worked for Grumman Aerospace from 67-70 when we won the F-14 contract. I was starting my 3rd year at NY Institute of Technology and Grumman paid my tuition for the next 3 years. He told me he was highest time Tomcat driver. He was a cool guy. A couple of years later he invited a Ukrainian fighter pilot to a SAAPA meeting for a “Duel”. The Ukrainian flew the the top of the line Russian fighter and he and Snort talked about whose aircraft was better. What I remember most significantly was Snort asking him how many hours a year he flew the fighter. He responded about 25. Snort said he had a nephew F-18 pilot who flew that many hours a month. His point was how can you compete with 25 hours a year vs 300+ hours per year. RIP Snort.
If you can enter and exit your airplane with the seat in its usual flying location, it's probably a good idea to just use bolts in the tracks to prevent this.
I had exactly the same thought. Far too many times an accident that went down as Juan described has traced back to a seat that rolled back just after liftoff.
Another senseless, inexplicable accident of the type that has claimed so many. ASN reports that the aircraft was a "B" model of which only four were built. They had a 400 hp Allison turboprop instead of the 350 hp of the "A" model. Stalling speed: 61 mph flaps up; 43 mph flaps down.... Hopefully there will be an explanation for an accident that should not have happened...
Snort was a legend in the aviation community... Another painful reminder that aviation can be a very unforgiving business no matter how experienced you are or how many hours are in your logbook. Condolences to the Snodgrass family.
If you are a text book pilot you should fly by the book and as long as your flying experiences are by the book then many happy landings to you. If I am a RIO and SHT-Fan I would want Dale in the front seat.
Snort took me for the pre buy flight in Little Horse, Ken Dahlberg’s P-51 Mustang. We rolled and looped that day in the Florida sky. Somewhere I have the video from that flight. RIP Dale.
I was there. I was giving tours on the 747 and he came thru. He was super kind and willing to talk to a young Private Pilot. I had worked on the TF-30 engines in the F-14 and he was genuinely interested in what I did.
@@mgas1237 If that was the show at Rentschler in which "Snort" flew the F-14 under a (wink, wink) 1000 ft ceiling, I was there too. MAN, was that loud. I have seen "Snort" demo the F-14 many times. Nobody could thrill a crowd like "Snort's" Tomcat demo. He was the best. Gone too soon.
I read all the comments and something happened to me years ago that no one has mentioned or speculated. I had a 172 get a rock jammed in the elevator on takeoff preventing the yoke from going forward. Light enough to maintain pitch by Reducing power and full forward trim and was able to return and land. Could have easily been not so lucky. Just another possibility to consider in this case. RIP
@@maxon1672 Yes, likewise. It would be very sad to lose such an experienced and capable aviator to such a silly and avoidable event, but we're all only human and we can all easily get killed by out mistakes...
@@DavidPT40 - I can’t answer that, but as a mechanic of land based vehicles of all kinds, I will say that if it’s mechanical, it will fail at some point. That’s a given.
Years ago we had an accident in Germany in which a glider pilot had a heart attack while taking off with the winch and the plane spun to the ground immediately after loosening the winch rope.
So very sad and a tragic loss to one of the best sticks around! This is a learning experience that the simple things can reach out and get you. Again RIP.
I watched Ward's report. Ward is clearly taking hard. I thought of you. Maybe when the NTSB report comes out my two favorite aircraft guys could team up? Ward brings a lot of background on how the military guys approach flying. Thanks for the quick update and keep the Oshkosh content coming.
Snort was my C.O. during the Gulf War, Operation Dessert Sheild/Dessert Storm. USS America CV-66, VF-33 Starfighters. Aircraft Division, power plants workcenter night shift supervisor.
Another concise and on-point presentation from an aviator who know what he’s talking about. A terrible loss to the community, this death of Mr Snodgrass. All of personal aviation is a high intensity activity; STOL flying is especially so. Be alert, fly safe.
I hope it wasn't a seat lock issue, in 2007 i was taking off in a Cessna 182 and right as i rotated my seat slid back making me pull back on the controls, my stall horn went off and luckily i just let go of the yoke and the nose lowered by it's self because I had the right trim for take off. If i held the yoke back for 1 or 2 more seconds i would have stalled and spun in to the ground. Lot's of accidents happened do to seat sliding back on take off, i was one of the lucky ones.
Sad news for sure Juan. I've already seen Wards (Mooch) video. It's always disheartening to lose some one in general, but Snodgrass was a legend in his world. Rest in peace Snort.
I watched Ward Carroll's channel yesterday. Juan recommends it (and gave his link above). I also recommend watching it. Very, very good. These are great Americans (I guess I should have just said 'people'). As Ward said 'at least Snort went the way he would probably have wanted to, doing what he loved best'. Thanks.
That reminds me of an AD on Cessna's pilot seat latch pins. In the UK they had a secondary safety pin so if the catch failed on Take Off you didn't slide right back pulling the yoke with you.
Snort was one of a kind. Had the privilege to serve with him and was loved by enlisted and officers alike. Dale was just the kind of guy everyone loved to watch and to listen too.
I was told once that one mistake and it's curtains. That's why I'm not a pilot. These pilots got balls of steel. God's speed to our USA vets. Mahalo for your service
@@RobtheAviator And the aircraft you are making it in.We have all made mistakes ,the idea that they all add up to curtains is not even close to the truth..
Sorry to hear about D"S"S, JB. RIP and condolences to those he knew and loved. Thanks for the usual tips, always looking out for the rest of us. Take care, have fun and stay safe. 🤟🏽🖖🏽
I had a seat track lock fail early on , I was still under student status. I had placed an extra cushion between my back and the seat back. It allowed me to maintain control with only a small pitch up.
H as opened to me on flight training in a 152- 2nd or 3rd lesson with the CFI slid back a short distance. He explained it was common to Cessnas how important it was to check the seat latch was fully engaged and about the safety pin. Always thought about how a full seat track failure would really ruin your takeoff as first instinct would be to grab at the yoke......what a tragedy hope the figure out what went wrong.
We were coming back from Council, Idaho, climbing out of Lewiston, almost to the WA border that day. I saw the smoke, thought it was a small grass fire out by the airport. Didn't find out until a week later that it was the smoke from a legend's final flight. RIP, Capt Snodgrass. Never met you, sure would have liked to.
I used to fly L-19s in a banner tow operation. The plane was already a hot rodded version of a C-170B, with a lighter tandem seat fuselage and 90 hp more than a 170B (235 hp from 145 hp). The SIAI-Marchetti as a lighter turbine engine that puts out 400 hp (almost 3 times what the original 170B had). The larger engine required a larger tail to handle the torque. Even with the rudder area increase, I would suspect that this plane might not handle full power on stalls very well.
Thanks for posting this. Stall/spin on take off like that sounds like it could only be a few things: Pilot error - that is hanging it on the prop as you describe, and some tiny thing didn't work this time. Equipment - seat, control cable failure, grossly out of trim, or something very wrong with the elevator. Pilot medical. Hope the NTSB does an actual investigation of this one. Everyone's family and friends deserve that, and it sounds like this fellow made a lot of friends along the way.
That’s because the local news paper here hates everything about the airport. They barely reported on the accident itself. Yes I live in Lewiston. Sad to see or hear about anyone losing their life. Tragic loss.
Nothing but respect for him. That said, I can't help but wonder if age (he was 73) has anything to do with this kind of accident. I was a GA pilot most of my younger life (now 80) and I can tell you, by 70 I was aware that my cognitive ability and my memory just wasn't what it once was.
He just turned 72 in May. An hour and a half before the crash, he flew his Aerostar from Driggs to Lewiston, and his radio transmission - with the same ATM controller - lasted 8 minutes. He seemed perfectly fine. In fact, his wife accompanied him on that flight and said one thing she knows is that it wasn't pilot error.
Do you remember that airshow in East Hartford back around '87 or '88? It was sponsored by Pratt and Whitney I think, and featured the Grumman vintage "Cat" fighters (Hellcat, Wildcat Bearcat. etc.) Dale Snodgrass was the show stealer in the F-14 Tomcat. Later, he parked his jet, got out and talked and shook hands with the crowd. Everybody loved it. He will be missed.
RIP Sir. Could this be similar to the Cessna crashes on take off several years ago attributed to the seat stops and seat tracks breaking and allowing the pilot to slide backward and not be able to control the plane? Such a shame and a loss.
Hi Juan. Shocking bad news about Snort Snodgrass. Condolences to his family and his many friends. When I first watched your post on this incident, I straightaway was reminded of my instructors briefing when first taking a C150 out for an hour in the pattern. It included a stern warning about the need to be aware of the possibility of a stall on take off if the attitude is not levelled off after a " short field take off" . The briefing also included a warning to double check the security of the pilot seat position and the locking mechanism. The seat had a tendency to slide back in the rails with the possibility of causing an irretrievable loss of control . I wont go into detail here, but anyone familiar with the Cessna cockpit layout can easily see that a seat sliding back on take off would render the pilot incapable of reaching the controls. No doubt the details will be found during the investigation. As you so rightly say Juan, Fly Safe !
I agree with you on those prop hangers Juan! You're just looking for trouble. Get a tip stall and not enough of air to recoup. I see too many of those videos on TH-cam.
A friend of mine, fellow CFI where I worked, was fatally injured when her stol ‘big tire’ airplane stalled just after takeoff. I wasn’t there at the time… but we heard that it climbed a few hundred feet, stalled and fell to the terrain and she and her boyfriend she was flying with were killed. Surprised all of us and was very sad.
Thank you sir. Tragic loss,...just last week, saw the knife edge pass photo from the USS America,...and then went to Wikipedia to look a little deeper into his career. Gone in the blink of an eye.
Please stay on top of this story, Snort was a national hero and a hell of a pilot. If it could happen to him it could happen to anybody! Good advice for max takeoff departures which all of us have done.
It looks like he just bought the aircraft, it has a recent registration date of 7/1/2021. The last time it was registered was late 2016, which means it would have expired in 2019 and therefore sat for a couple of years unless the last owner was flying it without a registration.
Check Kathryn's List for N28U. Records show it had undergone annual maintenance in 2020, and photos of the plane when it was offered for sale reveal a torn canvas boot at the base of the stick. There's a lot to wade through there, but no consensus on probable cause.
Piloti così bravi e coraggiosi non dovrebbero lasciarci così....dopo aver pilotato bestie di aerei cento volte più potenti e in scenari di guerra!!! R-I-P NobilHomo ....ora puoi volare liberamente tra le nuvole nel cielo azzurro
I learned to fly in a T-41(Cessna 172 mod) eX-USAF Academy trainer, And we could NOT get that aircraft to bite us no matter what we did! High speed/low speed stalls even with full rudder would produce nothing but a mild oscillation as it stalled and immediately regained lift. And all of this was at high altitude 10,000'+- flying out of Flagstaff, Az (7500' field elevation). The spin resistance seemed to be absolute. Why aren't they all built like that? (C-172, front wing extension, drop wing tips, 225hp, variable pitch prop).
Any aircraft will bite you in the arse if you do not respect the laws of aerodynamics or forget something as simple as the control locks. As you say fly safely & conservatively at all times Juan.
@@seanmcerlean I agree. Lot of pilots stalling and crashing lately. Used to be Pilot Error. Now we can add Stressed Prop to the list of other explanations.
I’m not familiar with the aircraft, but this sounds like a sear latch problem. With that much experience in flying, that level of expertise I could only imagine this being the cause. RIP to this military hero.
JUSN, Hello, man this one is a surprise, after all the planes he flew, his name was REALLY easy for me to remember ,as there was a. guy on the radio, with the SAME NAME, as others thought about the seat/rail, hate to speculate, but barring a medical, this would be the suspect, sadly thanks for the update , RIP SNORT & condolences to family ,etc, stay well, 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
I've noticed quite a few in the STOL competition hanging on their prop after lifting off. Didn't strike me as a great idea. I wonder if it's an instinct thing, not wanting to drop the nose because they're still so close to the ground?
It could just be the crowd-pleaser thing going on. - Aiming to please brings too many people undone across a wide range of circumstances. - In due course we shall learn what happened. - In meantime hopefully folk will let this discussion rest quickly for the sake of those near and dear to the man.
It's a horrible idea. RC guys do that all the time, and every once in a while it doesn't work. Just a fraction of a second or a tiny problem and it's gone. There's no time or energy to catch it. If you're going to hang on the prop, do it RC or at altitude.
Don’t think it’s an instinct thing. It is not comfortable having extreme nose high attitude close to the ground. For most the “instinct” is to get more level and gain airspeed.
I have worried about Mike Patey and some of his extreme nose high climb outs. I have considerable Twin Otter time. The 300 Otters with the dash 27’s could climb out at extreme angles. If you lost an engine below VMC you were toast. The standard procedure once clear of the obstruction in a real STOL environment was to accelerate immediately to at least best single engine climb speed. The drill if you lost an engine right after getting airborne, was to shove the yoke forward and immediately chop both throttles. We tried to limit operating in that regime if at all possible. 95 percent of the operations allowed 10 degree flap takeoffs with V1, Vr and V2. I worry about a lot of pilots I see on TH-cam. Flying down in canyons with no possible landing spot except a raging river in case of an engine failure. I am a 20,000 hour plus pilot who has trained pilots for a Missionary Aviation Ministry. I have lost just too many friends. Retired American Captain but do not hold that against me.
Learning of this reminds me of being at the Reno Air Races and having the plane crash straight down just 10m from where I had been sitting the day before. You realize the beauty and thrill of flight - fast and low … all the way to STOL - all beautiful, exciting, and technically challenging. But in the back of the mind one needs to always remember that if you “step outside” you fall to your death at only 20+ feet of altitude. We have the privilege to do and see amazing things but gravity is a quick equalizer. I am so sorry for everyone’s loss here. All of these are tragic and feel sickeningly close to home.
Unfortunately another pilot met something they couldn't handle, and I don't mean that in an unkind or condescending way. Their fault or not, lots of training or not, thousands of hours or not, respected or not, well liked or not are characteristics that confuse those left behind. I remember another fatal crash in which the pilot was revered by all for his safety. FAA final ruling was correct that he had always been so safe he failed to handle a few clouds on a very VFR day.
As a NZer I do nog know ‘Snort’, but lovely to hear that this gentleman aviator is being acknowledged.You realise what a small world it is when you read how many of you know him. 🇳🇿🇳🇿🐑🐑🙏🏼🙏🏼
Thanks for the shout out, Juan. Wish it was a different topic. #RIPSnort
I was a Plane Capt. for Lt.J.G. Snodgrass at VF-126 at NAS Miramar in 1973-75 !! He was one of the Good Guys ! He will be missed.
I was a controller at NKX then, A-4 squadron correct?
@@180mph9 TA-4 F and J instrument training squadron.
He was an instructor when ALL the other LT, jg's were students ! That says something about the guy. He was the Only Officer that ever gave me the time of day.
I accompanied Lt. Snoot Snodgrass along with several other trainees as his Troubleshooter when we deployed to Yuma Arizona Air Combat Maneuver Rang on several occasion from Miramar Naval Air Station California. Great times after flying early in the mornings on the range when we would all go out to the lake for cooling off and waterskiing. And of course drinking beer!! Great pilot and a good man. I was 18 at the time but they kept an eye on us young’in’s as they called us. Lt. Snodgrass’s letter of recommendation got me accepted in for the US Navy P-3 Flight Engineering school at Moffett Field California and that started my flying carrier. Thank you Lt. Snodgrass for all that you unselfishly did for me and you will always be missed by your shipmates Sir! Damn good times!
I was honored to have served on the USS America with Capt. Snodgrass where I was on deck when he made the infamous knife-edge low pass. In the civilian world I sat many hours watching Dale as I was an ARFF firefighter/paramedic at NAS Norfolk back when we hosted an annual air show. He was truly a living legend and will be greatly missed. Rest eterrnally in the heavens shipmate.
I was on the deck then, also. I took a ton of F-14 pictures back then. This was near the end of my time onboard, and I was too “spent” to bother anymore. Wish I would have brought the camera up that day..
What year was that picture taken shipmate? I’ve seen 1986 and I’ve also seen 1988.
@@eisenhowercvn69v47 1988
RIP Snort - he was kind enough to shake hands and talk with me decades ago - when he was just a 20 something at the air show in Quonset, RI after demonstrating the capabilities of the F-14 Tomcat. He was a great pilot and a nice guy.
I met him there as well. He was an amazing pilot.
@@paulg.5997 He blew my mind - and, after researching him, it appears that it was the first year he started doing air shows (1985).
@@paulg.5997 Best comment ever, typo or not!
@@rodciferri9626 lol...typo...fixed it. Sorry.
@@paulg.5997 met him at Oceana, ask him if there was anything he couldn't fly, he said a helicopter.
Call sign "Snort" Dale Snodgrass a Brother in Arms and supreme Patriot. Gone West, we will more than miss him. Thank you brother for your service, leadership, inspiration, influence and above all for me the pleasure to have known you.
The stall spin scenario that Juan mentioned is possible from the physics angle but I find it impossible to believe that it was pilot induced. We had an IAC incident where the pilot of a Pitts experienced "control lock" coming out of a hammerhead. Vertically nose down when he pulled the stick back to recover it failed to move enough to complete the level off. As an F-16 pilot and well experienced as was "Snort" he had the presence of mind "The Right Stuff" to use the trim to help get the nose up. He survived the crash and was lucky that the landing was cushioned by soft muddy ground. Investigation found a tool wedged in the elevator controls. Dale was capable of piloting under pressure, I agree with others that he would have been maneuvering the entire time trying to alleviate whatever conditions existed at the time.
Hand Salute!
Want to let everyone know that if you're ever in Miami, you can see Captain Snodgrass' actual combat F-14 on display at the Wings Over Miami Museum. Highly recommend.
Cool. Thanks for the info
His F-14 is currently on display at Wings of Eagles at the Elmira Corning Regional Airport.
@@mattf49006 Matt, I have been to the Air Zoo many times including yesterday to see Doc, the B-29. The F-14A at the Air Zoo is lettered for Snodgrass as the pilot.
I saw the Flight of the Grummans a few times at the air shows in Kalamazoo. Impressive to see the F-4, F-6, F-7, F-8, F-9 and F-14 all in one formation.
Rest in peace Captain Snodgrass.
@@klsc8510 ...I live a mile east of the tower...unfortunately i was out of town when Doc laid over ..i've toured it before and its a magnificent bird
Yes the F-14 at the Zoo has Dales name on it..he flew that aircraft over Iraq as a member of VF-33 ...he delivered it in spring of '95
We can hear the frustration and sadness in your voice Juan. Full throttle, prop spinning, no reasonable reason for a spin in. Snort was a pilots pilot. R I P
You will be missed and will always be remembered, Skipper. I'm proud to have served under your command. May you always rest in peace, Skipper. You'll always be a legend in my mind.
Dale did not stall and spin in. I was an eye witness. The plane did pitch up steeply but it looked like he could not control the pitch up so it looked like he executed a wing over type recovery but apparently still had no pitch control. He then impacted the ground in a steep nose down attitude. The aircraft did not stall. I am a long time friend of Dale and a retired air show performer and assure his fans that he did not stall and spin his aircraft. We should all remember him as the extraordinary aviator he was.
Thank you for the update.
I'm so sorry you had to observe your friend's accident. I'm unfamiliar with the airplane, but could the seat have slid backwards on takeoff, preventing operation of the controls? I had that happen in a 172 and it almost killed me.
I despise these TH-cam “safety” channels that jump on every tragedy for clicks. Few have any formal safety investigation experience, and lurk about hoping to be first to post about a mishap, without credible information. The indict someone with speculation and continue with admonitions based on pure speculation, then cover with “we don’t know what happened” It’s disgusting.
@@maxbuffet4493 Then don't watch them, Max. For those of us who have "been there done that", we enjoy the frankness and immediate details of these accidents to keep reminded of how critical it is to follow check lists and pay attention to details. The NTSB speculates within 90 days and then takes 3 years to release the facts and more speculation. God bless these TH-camrs.
Thank you for this update. RIP Mr Snodgrass.
You are freak’n amazing. How you get information of aviation incidents so quickly will never cease to amaze me.
Saw him perform at the Dayton Airshow about 20 or so years ago. He was, of course, flying an F-14, but had it tucked up tight under the tail of a propeller-driven F7 Tigercat, doing a close-formation aerobatic. What an absolutely superb flight demo with two totally dissimilar aircraft! Also met him briefly at Oshkosh several years ago...a very nice man and a great aviator. A true pilot's pilot. He'll be sorely missed. RIP, Snort!
Ward did a Great Tribute He's spreading his big wings RIP Snort, thanks for your coverage Brownie
Following Ward's tribute I knew it would not take Juan long to do his own analysis and I was not disappointed.
I caught part of Ward's live tribute. I had not heard of Snorts death until tuning in the tribute.. I was shocked..
Dale was my XO in VF-33 back in the late eighties! RIP “Snort”
About the time he said "No More Desk Jobs !!" right?
Dime in the slime
Saw Snort first as a kid going to east coast air shows when he was Tomcat demo pilot. Saw him in the fleet. Saw him more recently flying the F-86 at air shows. Always had the time to answer a question or share a quick story. RIP Snort
My first day at NAS Oceana was memorable... Someone drove a golf cart into the swimming pool at the O-club, wasn't the first time but it drew a crowd. I went inside and found Snort pouring over paperwork by himself at a table in the back. I introduced myself and told him I was a Nugget just assigned to VF-102 and had a problem to discuss with him. He invited me to sit down and asked a ton of questions about who I was and what I had done the first 23 years of my life, even though I wasn't in his squadron. We talked for an hour and flew the next day. He knew what my problem was, why I was having the problem and 2 hours later it was history... Never spoke directly with Snort again. Never forgot that day.
RIP Dale... anytime, any place, any weather!
I met Snort at KSGJ (Saint Augustine ) in the mid 2000s during a St Augustine Aircraft Pilots Association (SAAPA) meeting. I told him I had worked for Grumman Aerospace from 67-70 when we won the F-14 contract. I was starting my 3rd year at NY Institute of Technology and Grumman paid my tuition for the next 3 years. He told me he was highest time Tomcat driver. He was a cool guy. A couple of years later he invited a Ukrainian fighter pilot to a SAAPA meeting for a “Duel”. The Ukrainian flew the the top of the line Russian fighter and he and Snort talked about whose aircraft was better. What I remember most significantly was Snort asking him how many hours a year he flew the fighter. He responded about 25. Snort said he had a nephew F-18 pilot who flew that many hours a month. His point was how can you compete with 25 hours a year vs 300+ hours per year. RIP Snort.
I had the pleasure of working with Mr. Snodgrass as he flew our P51D in the heritage flights. RIP sir.
R.I.P., Snort. Thank you for your service.
Given his experience, this sounds like a seat failure.
Was thinking the same thing
My thoughts exactly
If you can enter and exit your airplane with the seat in its usual flying location, it's probably a good idea to just use bolts in the tracks to prevent this.
I had exactly the same thought. Far too many times an accident that went down as Juan described has traced back to a seat that rolled back just after liftoff.
My thoughts too. RIP Mr Snodgrass.
Another senseless, inexplicable accident of the type that has claimed so many.
ASN reports that the aircraft was a "B" model of which only four were built. They had a 400 hp Allison turboprop instead of the 350 hp of the "A" model.
Stalling speed: 61 mph flaps up; 43 mph flaps down....
Hopefully there will be an explanation for an accident that should not have happened...
Wow that hits close to home. I am from Lewiston
Went to school with Snodgrass’s.
Knew him and his family from Ronkonkoma
good advice, sir... I thank you for your love for your friends and for your service.
I watched Ward’s livestream and was waiting for your update and eventual analysis of the crash.
RIP Snort.
Sad.
RIP
Condolences to family & friends.
RIP! Best F14 demo shows I have ever seen! Awesome memories of him at the Wings of Eagles airshows in the 90s at Batavia, NY
Snort was a legend in the aviation community... Another painful reminder that aviation can be a very unforgiving business no matter how experienced you are or how many hours are in your logbook. Condolences to the Snodgrass family.
Tragic loss. :( thx Juan for your update
What you say regarding "don't hang it on the prop", that sooo true!! 😃
If you are a text book pilot you should fly by the book and as long as your flying experiences are by the book then many happy landings to you. If I am a RIO and SHT-Fan I would want Dale in the front seat.
I've heard you say many times "Even A Bad Landing is better than A Bad Takeoff" Txs for sharing
Very sad to hear this, men like Snort don't come around every day. Thanks Juan and have a good day.👍🇺🇸❤🙏😪
Snort took me for the pre buy flight in Little Horse, Ken Dahlberg’s P-51 Mustang. We rolled and looped that day in the Florida sky. Somewhere I have the video from that flight. RIP Dale.
I saw him at Pratt & Whitney “air show 90”
It was an awesome t14 demo
I was there. I was giving tours on the 747 and he came thru. He was super kind and willing to talk to a young Private Pilot. I had worked on the TF-30 engines in the F-14 and he was genuinely interested in what I did.
@@mgas1237 If that was the show at Rentschler in which "Snort" flew the F-14 under a (wink, wink) 1000 ft ceiling, I was there too. MAN, was that loud. I have seen "Snort" demo the F-14 many times. Nobody could thrill a crowd like "Snort's" Tomcat demo. He was the best. Gone too soon.
@@kevinmadore1794 Saturday was the low ceiling day if I remember correctly
R I P Snort you will be missed by many, God bless his family and friends.
I read all the comments and something happened to me years ago that no one has mentioned or speculated. I had a 172 get a rock jammed in the elevator on takeoff preventing the yoke from going forward. Light enough to maintain pitch by Reducing power and full forward trim and was able to return and land. Could have easily been not so lucky. Just another possibility to consider in this case. RIP
Wonder if this was another seat issue? I can't believe that such a experienced pilot would stall it on take off without a mechanical failure. RIP
Seat sliding back is the first thing that came to my mind too.
@@maxon1672 - Same here. Has all the signature actions of one.
@@maxon1672 Yes, likewise. It would be very sad to lose such an experienced and capable aviator to such a silly and avoidable event, but we're all only human and we can all easily get killed by out mistakes...
@@DavidPT40 - I can’t answer that, but as a mechanic of land based vehicles of all kinds, I will say that if it’s mechanical, it will fail at some point. That’s a given.
Years ago we had an accident in Germany in which a glider pilot had a heart attack while taking off with the winch and the plane spun to the ground immediately after loosening the winch rope.
So very sad and a tragic loss to one of the best sticks around! This is a learning experience that the simple things can reach out and get you. Again RIP.
Hope it wasn’t a seat latch issue. A guy like that with so much time and experience and combat time, it’s just not right. RIPSnort
That sounds like the only logical explanation. Such a powerful plane and legendary pilot. Such a tragedy
I watched Ward's report. Ward is clearly taking hard. I thought of you. Maybe when the NTSB report comes out my two favorite aircraft guys could team up? Ward brings a lot of background on how the military guys approach flying. Thanks for the quick update and keep the Oshkosh content coming.
Snort was my C.O. during the Gulf War, Operation Dessert Sheild/Dessert Storm. USS America CV-66, VF-33 Starfighters. Aircraft Division, power plants workcenter night shift supervisor.
I was there in 2011 before leaving for Afghanistan, we all had a great time walking the sights there.
Oh that's crushing. He made probably the most iconic F-14 pass down the side of a carrier deck, so famous I am sure everyone knows it.
Another concise and on-point presentation from an aviator who know what he’s talking about.
A terrible loss to the community, this death of Mr Snodgrass.
All of personal aviation is a high intensity activity; STOL flying is especially so. Be alert, fly safe.
I hope it wasn't a seat lock issue, in 2007 i was taking off in a Cessna 182 and right as i rotated my seat slid back making me pull back on the controls, my stall horn went off and luckily i just let go of the yoke and the nose lowered by it's self because I had the right trim for take off. If i held the yoke back for 1 or 2 more seconds i would have stalled and spun in to the ground. Lot's of accidents happened do to seat sliding back on take off, i was one of the lucky ones.
Sad news for sure Juan. I've already seen Wards (Mooch) video. It's always disheartening to lose some one in general, but Snodgrass was a legend in his world. Rest in peace Snort.
I watched Ward Carroll's channel yesterday. Juan recommends it (and gave his link above). I also recommend watching it. Very, very good. These are great Americans (I guess I should have just said 'people'). As Ward said 'at least Snort went the way he would probably have wanted to, doing what he loved best'. Thanks.
That reminds me of an AD on Cessna's pilot seat latch pins. In the UK they had a secondary safety pin so if the catch failed on Take Off you didn't slide right back pulling the yoke with you.
if you look at the rear stabs it is apparent he was not pulling back on the stick , in fact it shows the direct opposite
Nice mention of Ward's channel, he's got great content.
Snort was one of a kind. Had the privilege to serve with him and was loved by enlisted and officers alike. Dale was just the kind of guy everyone loved to watch and to listen too.
I was told once that one mistake and it's curtains. That's why I'm not a pilot. These pilots got balls of steel. God's speed to our USA vets. Mahalo for your service
That's not necessarily true at all.
@@sydbarrett4518 depends on the mistake
@@RobtheAviator And the aircraft you are making it in.We have all made mistakes ,the idea that they all add up to curtains is not even close to the truth..
@@sydbarrett4518 agreed. Some mistakes you can make often, some mistakes you can make once!
Prayers for Dale and his loved ones. Memory Eternal.
Sorry to hear about D"S"S, JB. RIP and condolences to those he knew and loved.
Thanks for the usual tips, always looking out for the rest of us.
Take care, have fun and stay safe. 🤟🏽🖖🏽
I had a seat track lock fail early on , I was still under student status. I had placed an extra cushion between my back and the seat back. It allowed me to maintain control with only a small pitch up.
H as opened to me on flight training in a 152- 2nd or 3rd lesson with the CFI slid back a short distance. He explained it was common to Cessnas how important it was to check the seat latch was fully engaged and about the safety pin. Always thought about how a full seat track failure would really ruin your takeoff as first instinct would be to grab at the yoke......what a tragedy hope the figure out what went wrong.
This just this moment popped up in my notifications!
So sorry for the loss of this Aviator. Fly High, Snort......✈️
Thank you as always, Juan!
Just very very sad. So much we don't know yet. R.I.P. Dale.
Prayers up for the ones left behind. Captain Snodgrass someday I hope to see your new set of wings.
Sorry for this loss.
After your video today, it's refreshing to look back and see you didn't jump to conclusions early on, yet one of your guesses was correct.
We were coming back from Council, Idaho, climbing out of Lewiston, almost to the WA border that day. I saw the smoke, thought it was a small grass fire out by the airport.
Didn't find out until a week later that it was the smoke from a legend's final flight.
RIP, Capt Snodgrass. Never met you, sure would have liked to.
RIP Snort.
How sad. RIP "Snort" :(
I used to fly L-19s in a banner tow operation. The plane was already a hot rodded version of a C-170B, with a lighter tandem seat fuselage and 90 hp more than a 170B (235 hp from 145 hp). The SIAI-Marchetti as a lighter turbine engine that puts out 400 hp (almost 3 times what the original 170B had). The larger engine required a larger tail to handle the torque. Even with the rudder area increase, I would suspect that this plane might not handle full power on stalls very well.
Thanks for posting this. Stall/spin on take off like that sounds like it could only be a few things: Pilot error - that is hanging it on the prop as you describe, and some tiny thing didn't work this time. Equipment - seat, control cable failure, grossly out of trim, or something very wrong with the elevator. Pilot medical. Hope the NTSB does an actual investigation of this one. Everyone's family and friends deserve that, and it sounds like this fellow made a lot of friends along the way.
I live in Lewiston! Didn't hear a thing about this.... RIP.
That’s because the local news paper here hates everything about the airport. They barely reported on the accident itself. Yes I live in Lewiston. Sad to see or hear about anyone losing their life. Tragic loss.
Nothing but respect for him. That said, I can't help but wonder if age (he was 73) has anything to do with this kind of accident. I was a GA pilot most of my younger life (now 80) and I can tell you, by 70 I was aware that my cognitive ability and my memory just wasn't what it once was.
Dime in the slime for snot
He just turned 72 in May. An hour and a half before the crash, he flew his Aerostar from Driggs to Lewiston, and his radio transmission - with the same ATM controller - lasted 8 minutes. He seemed perfectly fine. In fact, his wife accompanied him on that flight and said one thing she knows is that it wasn't pilot error.
@@citybright8925 NTSB said it's pilot error
@@bmw_m4255 They did not.
@@citybright8925 really? There is no deflection of the flight controls at all. He took off with a homemade gust lock engaged. That's his error
Do you remember that airshow in East Hartford back around '87 or '88? It was sponsored by Pratt and Whitney I think, and featured the Grumman vintage "Cat" fighters (Hellcat, Wildcat Bearcat. etc.) Dale Snodgrass was the show stealer in the F-14 Tomcat. Later, he parked his jet, got out and talked and shook hands with the crowd. Everybody loved it. He will be missed.
Thanks for the caution to the pilots Juan. That always makes me nervous when they do that in the no-recovery zone.
So very sad. Condolences to family and loved ones. Juan, from what you described, almost sounds like a medical situation. Time will tell.
RIP Sir. Could this be similar to the Cessna crashes on take off several years ago attributed to the seat stops and seat tracks breaking and allowing the pilot to slide backward and not be able to control the plane? Such a shame and a loss.
My first thought too.
Jw: There is no reason to think the seat has anything to do with the crash. 1. This isn't a cessna.
Hi Juan. Shocking bad news about Snort Snodgrass. Condolences to his family and his many friends. When I first watched your post on this incident, I straightaway was reminded of my instructors briefing when first taking a C150 out for an hour in the pattern. It included a stern warning about the need to be aware of the possibility of a stall on take off if the attitude is not levelled off after a " short field take off" . The briefing also included a warning to double check the security of the pilot seat position and the locking mechanism. The seat had a tendency to slide back in the rails with the possibility of causing an irretrievable loss of control . I wont go into detail here, but anyone familiar with the Cessna cockpit layout can easily see that a seat sliding back on take off would render the pilot incapable of reaching the controls. No doubt the details will be found during the investigation. As you so rightly say Juan, Fly Safe !
I agree with you on those prop hangers Juan! You're just looking for trouble. Get a tip stall and not enough of air to recoup. I see too many of those videos on TH-cam.
A friend of mine, fellow CFI where I worked, was fatally injured when her stol ‘big tire’ airplane stalled just after takeoff. I wasn’t there at the time… but we heard that it climbed a few hundred feet, stalled and fell to the terrain and she and her boyfriend she was flying with were killed. Surprised all of us and was very sad.
Thank you sir. Tragic loss,...just last week, saw the knife edge pass photo from the USS America,...and then went to Wikipedia to look a little deeper into his career. Gone in the blink of an eye.
I saw his demo routine many times as a kid then later his F86 demo. What a huge loss.
Please stay on top of this story, Snort was a national hero and a hell of a pilot. If it could happen to him it could happen to anybody! Good advice for max takeoff departures which all of us have done.
Had the honor to meet him in 98. Gods Speed “Snort.” Nickel on the Grass.
Met him in Sun Valley. Rest With the Angels.
Juan, sincerity at its best..
R.I.P to an American Legend. You are loved and respected by so many..
I was thinking the other day how cool the knife edge pass picture would look in my garage. RIP Dale
It looks like he just bought the aircraft, it has a recent registration date of 7/1/2021. The last time it was registered was late 2016, which means it would have expired in 2019 and therefore sat for a couple of years unless the last owner was flying it without a registration.
Check Kathryn's List for N28U. Records show it had undergone annual maintenance in 2020, and photos of the plane when it was offered for sale reveal a torn canvas boot at the base of the stick. There's a lot to wade through there, but no consensus on probable cause.
Piloti così bravi e coraggiosi non dovrebbero lasciarci così....dopo aver pilotato bestie di aerei cento volte più potenti e in scenari di guerra!!!
R-I-P NobilHomo ....ora puoi volare liberamente tra le nuvole nel cielo azzurro
I learned to fly in a T-41(Cessna 172 mod) eX-USAF Academy trainer, And we could NOT get that aircraft to bite us no matter what we did! High speed/low speed stalls even with full rudder would produce nothing but a mild oscillation as it stalled and immediately regained lift. And all of this was at high altitude 10,000'+- flying out of Flagstaff, Az (7500' field elevation). The spin resistance seemed to be absolute. Why aren't they all built like that? (C-172, front wing extension, drop wing tips, 225hp, variable pitch prop).
Any aircraft will bite you in the arse if you do not respect the laws of aerodynamics or forget something as simple as the control locks.
As you say fly safely & conservatively at all times Juan.
yeah what was this wise pilot thinking? juan had it right dont stress the prop.
@@2wheelman Absolutely.
Yeah, laws of aerodynamics are the same everyday. But if you wake up and think your plane is an F14....
@@ebenwaterman5858 That is the mindset that will catch you out.
@@seanmcerlean I agree. Lot of pilots stalling and crashing lately. Used to be Pilot Error. Now we can add Stressed Prop to the list of other explanations.
I’m not familiar with the aircraft, but this sounds like a sear latch problem. With that much experience in flying, that level of expertise I could only imagine this being the cause. RIP to this military hero.
I'm sorry for your loss Captain Juan.
Such a tragedy to loose a great hero.
Stay safe there. C u there.
"loose"???
JUSN, Hello, man this one is a surprise, after all the planes he flew, his name was REALLY easy for me to remember ,as there was a. guy on the radio, with the SAME NAME, as others thought about the seat/rail, hate to speculate, but barring a medical, this would be the suspect, sadly thanks for the update , RIP SNORT & condolences to family ,etc, stay well, 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Wow, that guy was a legend. I guess it doesn't matter sometimes how experienced you have, when your time is up, it's up. RIP Capt. Snodgrass.
same thing happened to "Dick Bong"
5000 hours in the tomcat, what a legend. RIP
Worked with Dale at air shows flying warbirds I crewed, great guy a skilled aviator and a great loss.
I've noticed quite a few in the STOL competition hanging on their prop after lifting off. Didn't strike me as a great idea. I wonder if it's an instinct thing, not wanting to drop the nose because they're still so close to the ground?
It could just be the crowd-pleaser thing going on. - Aiming to please brings too many people undone across a wide range of circumstances. - In due course we shall learn what happened. - In meantime hopefully folk will let this discussion rest quickly for the sake of those near and dear to the man.
It's a horrible idea. RC guys do that all the time, and every once in a while it doesn't work. Just a fraction of a second or a tiny problem and it's gone. There's no time or energy to catch it. If you're going to hang on the prop, do it RC or at altitude.
Don’t think it’s an instinct thing. It is not comfortable having extreme nose high attitude close to the ground. For most the “instinct” is to get more level and gain airspeed.
I have worried about Mike Patey and some of his extreme nose high climb outs. I have considerable Twin Otter time. The 300 Otters with the dash 27’s could climb out at extreme angles. If you lost an engine below VMC you were toast. The standard procedure once clear of the obstruction in a real STOL environment was to accelerate immediately to at least best single engine climb speed. The drill if you lost an engine right after getting airborne, was to shove the yoke forward and immediately chop both throttles. We tried to limit operating in that regime if at all possible. 95 percent of the operations allowed 10 degree flap takeoffs with V1, Vr and V2. I worry about a lot of pilots I see on TH-cam. Flying down in canyons with no possible landing spot except a raging river in case of an engine failure. I am a 20,000 hour plus pilot who has trained pilots for a Missionary Aviation Ministry. I have lost just too many friends. Retired American Captain but do not hold that against me.
Another seat rail locking mechanism failure maybe? There have been several already this year.
Love your explanations Juan. Just damn nice to listen to your advice!
Learning of this reminds me of being at the Reno Air Races and having the plane crash straight down just 10m from where I had been sitting the day before.
You realize the beauty and thrill of flight - fast and low … all the way to STOL - all beautiful, exciting, and technically challenging.
But in the back of the mind one needs to always remember that if you “step outside” you fall to your death at only 20+ feet of altitude.
We have the privilege to do and see amazing things but gravity is a quick equalizer. I am so sorry for everyone’s loss here. All of these are tragic and feel sickeningly close to home.
Unfortunately another pilot met something they couldn't handle, and I don't mean that in an unkind or condescending way.
Their fault or not, lots of training or not, thousands of hours or not, respected or not, well liked or not are characteristics that confuse those left behind.
I remember another fatal crash in which the pilot was revered by all for his safety. FAA final ruling was correct that he had always been so safe he failed to handle a few clouds on a very VFR day.
Good advice Juan. I also say never do low level 360's over naked girls or moose or sheep! Do fly-bys, then do a 180 with eyes in the cockpit!
Very sad. RIP Dale.
As a NZer I do nog know ‘Snort’, but lovely to hear that this gentleman aviator is being acknowledged.You realise what a small world it is when you read how many of you know him. 🇳🇿🇳🇿🐑🐑🙏🏼🙏🏼
It’s insane to me that he used to fly F14s and he died in a smallish plane
Scott Crossfield, too. RIP.
Defying gravity is risky!
We try and mitigate the risk with training/maintenance and medicals but sometimes crap happens.
RIP Snort, Sad sad loss.
Hey Juan we got heavy smoke in New England today from the fires that are in your area. Very Hazy and smells strong!