Iirc, when the Clans stuff first came out, AMS engaged the first missile pack shot. So a Kit Fox could fire an LRM-5, trigger the enemy AMS, then fire two LRM-15s with little risk of the enemy carrying multiple AMS. Ironically, a C could engage all three salvos.
The Kit Fox seems to be built with the same design philosophy in mind: it can mount a massive amount of firepower for the Tonnage with the mindset of one shoting an opponent at the expense of long term survivablity and endurance. Many configurations can smash mediums and the odd heavy in the right situations. Like many designs of this era, it lacked the endurance and armor to be very successful in the kind of drawn-out fights that were common in the Inner Sphere. The thing to remember is that this machine is geared towards fighting mediums, not fast lights.
Just looked over my 3050 tech readout, Whiskey has 2 Large Pulse Lasers and 2 Medium Pulse Lasers, 1 in each arm. All the Wolves (Standard, Exile, and Dragoons) used the variant as a trainer.
@@jamesbeard5513 Thanks for the correction. I did the math in my head while I was listening to the premiere and noticed my script was missing something.
Good review. I never "hated" this mech on tabletop but I don't think I ever chose it once for a game. I did hate it in the Mechwarrior 2 video game. They wanted you to take this "glass cannon" ( good description) against multiple assault mechs, with virtually no torso twist.
A Kit Fox won me a game in an currently ongoing IS vs Clan campaign. It was a 2v2 game based on a DFA Wargaming module. The opfor had built their force around a Viking IIC, supported by 3D printed dino riders (declared as beast mounted calvary) and a Peregrine VTOL acting as spotters, a Griffin, Warhammer, Grasshopper, Hunchback, and several other mechs. My team mate had brought a Timber Wolf, a medium omnimech (a Nova I think.), and some Elementals. As for myself, I was running a Kit Fox Prime, a Cougar Prime, two Fire Falcon As, and some Elemental points for holding objectives. Essentially a rough Nova vs a combined arms company. It was near the end of the game, We had bloodied each other significantly, and my team mate and I were slightly ahead on capturing ground, the vtol/viking combo had taken out my Cougar, and most of the battle armor, I target the vtol with my Kit Fox, and declare I'm using flak. I need a 10 to hit, I roll a 12, I roll again to confirm the shot had done damage, it does 1 point of structure damage plus two crits. Since we were playing in a campaign, this was enough to put the vtol into forced withdrawal. This likely won us the game, as without a spotter, the Viking had to close to finish my team mate's Twolf, but it never got close enough to do so by the time the final round ended. The best part was, the Kit Fox took a through armor crit to it's motive system practically at the beginning in the game, it was limping along the edge of the map for pretty much the entirety of the game, and successfully withdrew under it's own power. Suffice it to say, the pilot deserved a raise in skill lvl after that shot.
The Kit Fox epitomizes the soul of clan military industrial ethos. It is expensive, frail, difficult feed, and difficult to fix. When you consider all the IS hunter-killer mechs you can buy that are heavier, simpler and still better armed, it really clarifies how little clan technology carries if you aren't smart about it.
@ProfessorHeyTeeEn I think the Wolfhound is in an entirely different class of light mech. Closer to the panther. It's pretty tough and a better zombie. If you lose an arm on the WH it's rough, but on the fox it's crippling.
@ProfessorHeyTeeEn maybe you're right though, I've been thinking about it. Maybe you just get a better mech for the money despite all the bugbears of the kit fox.
@@teehasheestower difficult to fix? Sry, but omnimechs are canonically faster to repair than standard battlemechs, provided you have spare omnipods you can swap out. Everything else you said is accurate however.
@Prich319 that 'provided' of yours is doing some heavy lifting. Maybe when IS and Clan Omni technology are fully compatible it won't matter. Otherwise you are always taking a logistical risk by leaning fully into clan tech. Rimward you need to be sure you can get parts, there is no point having a fancy mech if it is up on blocks waiting for a 12 ton gauss, or tubes that go empty because you have no clan rockets.
The mech that couldn't? Speaking on behalf of everyone who played Mechcommander, the Uller's introduction went like this: Okay, well, there's one mech over there, but I have three, so I can probably rush in and shoot it to death, there's no vehicles or anything. Followed immediately by: HOLY FUCK HE JUST SHOT MY MEDIUM MECHS HEAD OFF IN ONE SHOT WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK IS THIS THING
I always thought the Kit Fox was a neat lil guy, mostly because it has a lot of guns for its weight. Realistically, there is no such thing as a "bad" OmniMech, barring any lore or quirks to the contrary, only bad configurations, seeing as they are so quickly reconfigurable.
I always thought the KitFox was meant to be an escort light mech, to support heavies or assaults with ECM and AMS, and chase off or cripple enemy lights who try to backstab the big stompy mechs.
Victor is my favorite. I use him as a backline mech behind heavies and assaults. It either forces the enemy to take arrow 4 while tangling with assaults, or going after the harassing Kit Fox while ignoring assaults. It's so mean.
The LRM Variant is nothing to sneeze at either, actually most Kit Fox's work well as support for larger units. If the enemy takes a turn or two to kill the Kit Fox then they take that much longer to kill the bigger mechs. If they don't then they take significant chip damage all match, an ER LL / ER PPC / Gauss / LRMs / Arrow IV is not something you can shrug off forever.
Love the Kit Fox, particularly the Gauss Rifle wielder. It punches so far above its weight, it is a delight. No, it isn't a coward mech with flitting about like a Pheonix Hawk but it can punch up. Use it like a Commando and hit hard from the back or flank with bigger mechs. Edit: yeah, holy shit who thinks a Clan ER PPC isnt a good weapon?
Yeah, who!? The CERPPC is one of the best main guns in the game. Unless you're facing reflective armor or a blueshield, it's an outstanding piece of kit able to sustain devastating output at long ranges. And if you need a bit more kick, just get yourself a PPC capacitor and spend more time aiming.
In all honesty, mounting AMS on the anti-infantry config isn’t a terrible idea. Before the advent of battle armor, one of the most threatening infantry weapons to a battlemech would be massed infantry SRM fire, which one might reasonably encounter when fighting massed Solahma formations. But mounting three AMS is likely being way too cautious about it.
@@cobalt968 AMS are much better in Pirahna's game then they are in tabletop. It is a good option to have when chasing down infantry or supporting a squad, but 3 of them is getting silly.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn ...until the Kit Fox gets targeted by multiple mech-sized missile racks. This is the scout config, not anti-infantry per se. Given the low weight of the Clan missile racks and the KFs crappy armor, those three AMS could well mean the difference between the KF getting away or splattered all over the battlefield when encountering an enemy tank or mech.
As an Omnimech, if I were forced to incorporate one of these lemons into a formation, I'd probably try to slot in a mixture of jump jets and cLRM launchers with enough ammo to keep it in the fight. The idea would be to maximize use of the offensive pod space by avoiding use of the thin armor. Maybe treat it kind of like a Valkyrie.
It's not as bad as this video makes out, you just need to be smart about how and when you use this mech. You take them in Medium/Heavy/Assault stars more than you would in Light stars. They work best as supporting units for heavier mechs and for filling out a star with something cheap, so your other mechs can be better.
4:50 The Kitfox serves a good purpose: Those configurations available to the Kitfox are also available to the NOVA (which also shares 16 tons of pod space)
It seems as if most of your videos have light mechs as lackluster. they called it Uller after the Norse God of Archery. I realize you are doing this as a sort of roleplay kind of thing, but you seem to have lots of biases against the light mech weight class.
@@Cytl-bu3nq There are fantastic light mechs out there. Things like the Wolfhound, Jenner (some variants at least), Panther, Commando. For Clan machines, you have the Adder, the Pouncer... The Kit Fox just is not good enough to warrant what it is meant to be.
I was going to suggest pulling the LRM5 on the D to upgrade the NARRCC to an INARC, but that would require another ton, so that's not happening. Oh well. When in doubt, a small pulse laser or pair of flamers work wonder on infantry and decent on BA so long as that BA isn't equipped with reflective or thermally resistant armor. In those cases, AP Gauss.
I've always loved the Kit Fox. Particularly the variant that carries a Gauss Rifle. In its Prime configuration, I think it sacrifices too much weight to that LB5-X. Swapping to a LPL or another ER Large and making that Clan Warrior use their heat management skills would've been better and you could fit the last 1.5 tons of armor that it's missing.
You can't modify the armor of an Omnimech except by using some sort of quirk set in MWO maybe. You might be able to fit 1.5 tons for crit padding, but that is it.
@@Cytl-bu3nq That comes when Clan Wolf-in-Exile develops the tech. And it comes with a drawback that does not help the Kit Fox enough to justify about 24 pips of growth in the event of the 1.5 tons that Wolfhreda was thinking if acquiring.
Can't make me hate this little beast. There's some questionable, confusing, and even baffling configs, but at least there's no streak LRM pods. And for those who see the prime as a multitool that's a master of none, and see THAT as better than a master of one, more power to them.
@@ero9841 It isn't "unusable", but anecdotal evidence are dime a dozen in Battletech. Anything can be good and outperform the enemy, depending on the dices.
At what point does information you get from the field anecdotal or just information you don't want to here. Not to mention variables such as different theaters of wars and the enemies we face. Always tuff call in my honest opinion
The Kit Fox is totally underrated as a light mech, you just need to use it right. First thing to do is gut it weapons load and fill every slot you can with SRM's, ammo and an ECM. The light mech that hits like a heavy. Run it with a couple Storm Crows or a Linebacker to keep attention off it (both have the same movement) and it can do work.
The swipe at the Fox Patrol is a bit off. Nobody, including them, considers them more than scruffy newbies. Nobody thinks they are the best mercenaries ever. The Kitfox they have wasn't really missing components, so most of the work was just replacing wiring and retuning stuff. They didn't really need a ton of supplies. So sure, difficult for a newbie, but not requiring a lot of the specialised stuff. The Kitfox isn't the best mech out there, but a lot of the configurations are pretty decent. A 98 kph mobile artillery piece is fantastic in a lot of cases because they have a harder time pinning you down. The gauss rifle one shouldn't be getting xlose to anything ideally and is meant for sniping, so being a bit slower and lower armored is generally okay. It should either be sniping the faster units before they know its there or having their starmates screen for them as they snipe at bigger mechs.
Iirc, when the Clans stuff first came out, AMS engaged the first missile pack shot. So a Kit Fox could fire an LRM-5, trigger the enemy AMS, then fire two LRM-15s with little risk of the enemy carrying multiple AMS. Ironically, a C could engage all three salvos.
The Kit Fox seems to be built with the same design philosophy in mind: it can mount a massive amount of firepower for the Tonnage with the mindset of one shoting an opponent at the expense of long term survivablity and endurance. Many configurations can smash mediums and the odd heavy in the right situations. Like many designs of this era, it lacked the endurance and armor to be very successful in the kind of drawn-out fights that were common in the Inner Sphere. The thing to remember is that this machine is geared towards fighting mediums, not fast lights.
I wish they had built an updated version of this design that would sacrifice some Pod Space for additional speed and armor.
Emotional support small laser, someone watches the chieftain.
Clan Mechanical Frog
I enjoy all of Professor HeyTeeEn videos 🎉🎉😊
Just looked over my 3050 tech readout, Whiskey has 2 Large Pulse Lasers and 2 Medium Pulse Lasers, 1 in each arm. All the Wolves (Standard, Exile, and Dragoons) used the variant as a trainer.
That is one of the better variants to be honest, any light that runs up for an easy kill will die long before the Kit Fox does.
@@jamesbeard5513 Thanks for the correction. I did the math in my head while I was listening to the premiere and noticed my script was missing something.
Good review. I never "hated" this mech on tabletop but I don't think I ever chose it once for a game. I did hate it in the Mechwarrior 2 video game. They wanted you to take this "glass cannon" ( good description) against multiple assault mechs, with virtually no torso twist.
A Kit Fox won me a game in an currently ongoing IS vs Clan campaign. It was a 2v2 game based on a DFA Wargaming module. The opfor had built their force around a Viking IIC, supported by 3D printed dino riders (declared as beast mounted calvary) and a Peregrine VTOL acting as spotters, a Griffin, Warhammer, Grasshopper, Hunchback, and several other mechs. My team mate had brought a Timber Wolf, a medium omnimech (a Nova I think.), and some Elementals. As for myself, I was running a Kit Fox Prime, a Cougar Prime, two Fire Falcon As, and some Elemental points for holding objectives. Essentially a rough Nova vs a combined arms company.
It was near the end of the game, We had bloodied each other significantly, and my team mate and I were slightly ahead on capturing ground, the vtol/viking combo had taken out my Cougar, and most of the battle armor, I target the vtol with my Kit Fox, and declare I'm using flak. I need a 10 to hit, I roll a 12, I roll again to confirm the shot had done damage, it does 1 point of structure damage plus two crits. Since we were playing in a campaign, this was enough to put the vtol into forced withdrawal. This likely won us the game, as without a spotter, the Viking had to close to finish my team mate's Twolf, but it never got close enough to do so by the time the final round ended. The best part was, the Kit Fox took a through armor crit to it's motive system practically at the beginning in the game, it was limping along the edge of the map for pretty much the entirety of the game, and successfully withdrew under it's own power. Suffice it to say, the pilot deserved a raise in skill lvl after that shot.
The Kit Fox epitomizes the soul of clan military industrial ethos. It is expensive, frail, difficult feed, and difficult to fix. When you consider all the IS hunter-killer mechs you can buy that are heavier, simpler and still better armed, it really clarifies how little clan technology carries if you aren't smart about it.
"Expensive and frail, but still a bit better than the Wolfhound."
TH-cam AI doesn't understand BattleTech, it seems.
@ProfessorHeyTeeEn I think the Wolfhound is in an entirely different class of light mech. Closer to the panther. It's pretty tough and a better zombie. If you lose an arm on the WH it's rough, but on the fox it's crippling.
@ProfessorHeyTeeEn maybe you're right though, I've been thinking about it. Maybe you just get a better mech for the money despite all the bugbears of the kit fox.
@@teehasheestower difficult to fix? Sry, but omnimechs are canonically faster to repair than standard battlemechs, provided you have spare omnipods you can swap out. Everything else you said is accurate however.
@Prich319 that 'provided' of yours is doing some heavy lifting. Maybe when IS and Clan Omni technology are fully compatible it won't matter. Otherwise you are always taking a logistical risk by leaning fully into clan tech. Rimward you need to be sure you can get parts, there is no point having a fancy mech if it is up on blocks waiting for a 12 ton gauss, or tubes that go empty because you have no clan rockets.
The mech that couldn't?
Speaking on behalf of everyone who played Mechcommander, the Uller's introduction went like this:
Okay, well, there's one mech over there, but I have three, so I can probably rush in and shoot it to death, there's no vehicles or anything.
Followed immediately by:
HOLY FUCK HE JUST SHOT MY MEDIUM MECHS HEAD OFF IN ONE SHOT WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK IS THIS THING
I always thought the Kit Fox was a neat lil guy, mostly because it has a lot of guns for its weight. Realistically, there is no such thing as a "bad" OmniMech, barring any lore or quirks to the contrary, only bad configurations, seeing as they are so quickly reconfigurable.
I always thought the KitFox was meant to be an escort light mech, to support heavies or assaults with ECM and AMS, and chase off or cripple enemy lights who try to backstab the big stompy mechs.
Victor is my favorite. I use him as a backline mech behind heavies and assaults. It either forces the enemy to take arrow 4 while tangling with assaults, or going after the harassing Kit Fox while ignoring assaults. It's so mean.
@@StefanAmarisDidNothingWrong An arrow IV on a 6/9 platform is actually quite terrifying, especially with specialty ammo.
The LRM Variant is nothing to sneeze at either, actually most Kit Fox's work well as support for larger units. If the enemy takes a turn or two to kill the Kit Fox then they take that much longer to kill the bigger mechs. If they don't then they take significant chip damage all match, an ER LL / ER PPC / Gauss / LRMs / Arrow IV is not something you can shrug off forever.
Love the Kit Fox, particularly the Gauss Rifle wielder.
It punches so far above its weight, it is a delight.
No, it isn't a coward mech with flitting about like a Pheonix Hawk but it can punch up.
Use it like a Commando and hit hard from the back or flank with bigger mechs.
Edit: yeah, holy shit who thinks a Clan ER PPC isnt a good weapon?
Yeah, who!? The CERPPC is one of the best main guns in the game. Unless you're facing reflective armor or a blueshield, it's an outstanding piece of kit able to sustain devastating output at long ranges. And if you need a bit more kick, just get yourself a PPC capacitor and spend more time aiming.
In all honesty, mounting AMS on the anti-infantry config isn’t a terrible idea. Before the advent of battle armor, one of the most threatening infantry weapons to a battlemech would be massed infantry SRM fire, which one might reasonably encounter when fighting massed Solahma formations. But mounting three AMS is likely being way too cautious about it.
Not really as in game, each AMS can only counter a single SRM system per round, or squad/platoon in this case.
@@cobalt968 AMS are much better in Pirahna's game then they are in tabletop. It is a good option to have when chasing down infantry or supporting a squad, but 3 of them is getting silly.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn ...until the Kit Fox gets targeted by multiple mech-sized missile racks. This is the scout config, not anti-infantry per se. Given the low weight of the Clan missile racks and the KFs crappy armor, those three AMS could well mean the difference between the KF getting away or splattered all over the battlefield when encountering an enemy tank or mech.
I saw C as being good for infantry/BA support.
I loved this mech in MWO. It was so short i could get "under" some opposing assaults and use them as a meat shield while i killed them.
As an Omnimech, if I were forced to incorporate one of these lemons into a formation, I'd probably try to slot in a mixture of jump jets and cLRM launchers with enough ammo to keep it in the fight. The idea would be to maximize use of the offensive pod space by avoiding use of the thin armor. Maybe treat it kind of like a Valkyrie.
What is sad is that the Valkyrie does manage to be WAY worse than the Kit Fox.
I love modestly agile light guntrucks, this and especially the Adder and Cougar are favorites of mine after MWO
Adder and Cougar are scary beast because they also are tough as nails. That's where the Kit Fox has some issues.
It's really pretty amazing how many Young Plucky MechTech-Girl-Turned-Mercenary stories are on the chatterweb, isn't it?
Love the Kit Fox. I know it's not particulary great, but the heart loves what the heart loves.
It's not as bad as this video makes out, you just need to be smart about how and when you use this mech.
You take them in Medium/Heavy/Assault stars more than you would in Light stars.
They work best as supporting units for heavier mechs and for filling out a star with something cheap, so your other mechs can be better.
One cool mech! It’s fast and can shoots LRMs
4:50 The Kitfox serves a good purpose: Those configurations available to the Kitfox are also available to the NOVA (which also shares 16 tons of pod space)
It seems as if most of your videos have light mechs as lackluster. they called it Uller after the Norse God of Archery. I realize you are doing this as a sort of roleplay kind of thing, but you seem to have lots of biases against the light mech weight class.
Probably because he's a tech and the lower armored lights tend to need structural and component repair and replacement over the most frivolous hits
@@Omniseed not all light mechs are trash, something that he pushes a lot, regardless of whether he's doing the stream as a roleplay tech.
@@Cytl-bu3nq There are fantastic light mechs out there. Things like the Wolfhound, Jenner (some variants at least), Panther, Commando. For Clan machines, you have the Adder, the Pouncer...
The Kit Fox just is not good enough to warrant what it is meant to be.
I was going to suggest pulling the LRM5 on the D to upgrade the NARRCC to an INARC, but that would require another ton, so that's not happening. Oh well. When in doubt, a small pulse laser or pair of flamers work wonder on infantry and decent on BA so long as that BA isn't equipped with reflective or thermally resistant armor. In those cases, AP Gauss.
I've always loved the Kit Fox. Particularly the variant that carries a Gauss Rifle. In its Prime configuration, I think it sacrifices too much weight to that LB5-X. Swapping to a LPL or another ER Large and making that Clan Warrior use their heat management skills would've been better and you could fit the last 1.5 tons of armor that it's missing.
You can't modify the armor of an Omnimech except by using some sort of quirk set in MWO maybe. You might be able to fit 1.5 tons for crit padding, but that is it.
@@Ichaerus by adding modular armor plates you can, it's part of the OmniArmor system
@@Cytl-bu3nq thats a thing from MW5C but not table top... waittttt..........
@@Cytl-bu3nq That comes when Clan Wolf-in-Exile develops the tech. And it comes with a drawback that does not help the Kit Fox enough to justify about 24 pips of growth in the event of the 1.5 tons that Wolfhreda was thinking if acquiring.
Sounds like you should just use it as a sniper mech like that one Sphere Mech (forgot the name. Just a gauss rifle on a light chassis).
I've always had a soft spot for the Kit Fox A, working in tandem with an Adder H.
The A and its derivatives are probably some of the better Kit Fox configurations because it can actually effectively support brawlers.
Juliet should have been the Prime. That's a solidly decently okay mech
I like the kit fox because its cheap for the points
Can't make me hate this little beast.
There's some questionable, confusing, and even baffling configs, but at least there's no streak LRM pods.
And for those who see the prime as a multitool that's a master of none, and see THAT as better than a master of one, more power to them.
I think configuration Alpha should have been the Primary, and people would like it a bit more.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn Try a lot more. But that Arrow IV with 3 tons of ammo moving over 90KPH is also hilarious.
15:04 Because some Star Colonel saw the UM-AIV Urbanmech and said, "Why not?"
Heh. Somebody's got a bone to pick with Fox Patrol.
I am too much of a fan of the Hollander to not like this mech
I do like the Kit Fox better than Hollander, at least at that level.
Professor what in the ancient kuritan is that? 0:00
The single best version of Dixie.
@ProfessorHeyTeeEn found it. Still not defecting to the kuritans. Rasalhague forever because family.
I've had some decent success. Cheap fire support
@@ero9841 It isn't "unusable", but anecdotal evidence are dime a dozen in Battletech. Anything can be good and outperform the enemy, depending on the dices.
At what point does information you get from the field anecdotal or just information you don't want to here. Not to mention variables such as different theaters of wars and the enemies we face. Always tuff call in my honest opinion
Hey i know that title song!
The best possible song for the weebiest of Clans.
The Kit Fox is totally underrated as a light mech, you just need to use it right. First thing to do is gut it weapons load and fill every slot you can with SRM's, ammo and an ECM. The light mech that hits like a heavy. Run it with a couple Storm Crows or a Linebacker to keep attention off it (both have the same movement) and it can do work.
How to beat a kit fox. Send its value in wolfhounds or phoneix hawks after it. Or some wraiths if you happen to have more money.
The Invading Clans didn't bid based on Battle Value.
The swipe at the Fox Patrol is a bit off. Nobody, including them, considers them more than scruffy newbies. Nobody thinks they are the best mercenaries ever.
The Kitfox they have wasn't really missing components, so most of the work was just replacing wiring and retuning stuff. They didn't really need a ton of supplies. So sure, difficult for a newbie, but not requiring a lot of the specialised stuff.
The Kitfox isn't the best mech out there, but a lot of the configurations are pretty decent. A 98 kph mobile artillery piece is fantastic in a lot of cases because they have a harder time pinning you down. The gauss rifle one shouldn't be getting xlose to anything ideally and is meant for sniping, so being a bit slower and lower armored is generally okay. It should either be sniping the faster units before they know its there or having their starmates screen for them as they snipe at bigger mechs.
BattleROM record not guncam footage. Roleplay properly.