Excellent Tom! Glad there is someone out there that presents a concise simple to understand method for lathe leveling. I must have spent hours trying to level the 4 contact points on my South bend 9" lathe bench to get it generally level before final shimming between the top and the lathe bed feet. Never thought about utilizing a three point method. Bravo, you're my hero! It was also nice to learn how to calibrate a level as well.
Hey John, You guys remind me of stuff to think about all the time. I'm learning here as well. When you have to explain things on camera makes you think them through a little. All the best, Tom
Tom your information and expertise is most welcome because I have just purchased a new chinese lathe and I knew I had to level it some time to get the best from it.. Good video and good work and keep them coming..Greetings from a bloke from the southern part of Western Australia...
5 years later another sandgroper from southern part of Western Australia is reading this same comment! That’s the beauty of the internet, it’s like having an encyclopaedia / library in your house, you can learn just about anything and people’s knowledge from years ago can keep on helping out others - just as if you published a book, & someone checked it out of the library.
Put the mag base on the frame of the lathe and let the indicator stem contact the floor, this has helped me to see the movement when adjusting the leveling bolts. I can see movement in thousandths instead of parts of a turn.
Hey Tom, you never told me to send that Empire level to you to help with the lathe leveling. Looks like you gotter hooked up with those nice Starrett and Soutbend levels. Good job. Lots of good advice in this one. Thanks buddy! Adam
WOW! Thank you for a incredibly informative video. The 3 point method of leveling and the proper way to calibrate the level. Thank You for sharing your knowledge with all of us. Matt
Thanks for a great video. It was very timely in that I recently purchased a new 12" X 36" lathe and a precision level. I used your procedures for calibration and leveling and they worked great.
dustinc1820 Dustin Collins Hi Dustin, That is one of the best features of any tool. The ability to be self proving or self calibrating. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Love your videos! Working beside you would be an awesome experience, can't wait for part 2! Adam, MrPete, Kieth, and yourself sure take up a lot of my spare time, however I have run out of new videos! Keep up the great work!
Hey Cleft, Thanks for the comment. So your telling me you have watched all 186 of my video's and need more? Pretty impressive. How come you waited this long to leave a nice comment? All the best, Tom
I leveled my lathe originally with just a craftsman level and at high speeds it always shook. I finally took the plunge and bought a Starrett precision level and after leveling with it I couldn't believe the difference. No more wobble at high speeds and ran so much quieter. I also did my Milling machine and boring bar. Well worth every penny for my Starrett level. Thanks for sharing
Ray introduced me to your channel. Great stuff. TH-cam was the reason I went out and bought a 1957 bridgeport!! Haha. Ya ray stole that mill!! I paid more and I don't have DRO. I'll make sure keep the level bubble in the middle! Haha. Thanks for the vids, Tom.
Hey Phillip, You are perfectly positioned to strike. These old guys keel over all the time. Just don't piss him or his daughter off and that Webb is as good as in your garage. Might just take a few years. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco Tom, if you do it on Hangouts you can have your entire channel 'assisting' you, though when Adam is shouting clockwise and Chuck is shouting the opposite, that might create a high friction co-efficient :)
Hey Ray, Glad you got the mill home safe and sound. Now were all waiting for a new YT channel to pop up called Fresno Fab And machine with Big Ray as your host. All the best, Tom
oxtoolco Thank you Tom! This entire adventure would not have happened without your keen eye for a great deal, and most importantly sharing it with the gang! Now let the chips fly coming at you from Fresno Fab!!! Thanks again Tom, Big Ray :)
I can personally attest to having to test your machine for twisting via level. I have an un-named - un-known, very old 10 inch x 36 inch metal lathe. Prior to this I relied on by back ground as a body & fender guy (25 yr's plus). I only recently in life learned about how to check your level (self prove). But just using a pipe-fitter's level (you can dial in angles) I was able to finally over come the twist, and get everything to where it needed to be. Was quite the pain in the neck. Very useful information, and again great video, oh and I love the "Red-Neck-Creeper." L-O-L.
Hi Tom ! Now you inspired me again ... I have had to do this for month and NOW I'll do it - level up my lathe - I had got the same problem as you = at high rpms I had some vibrations - I only got 5 feet to adjust ;-)) Thx for sharing the method ! I long to see what running/turning test you will do !
I always wondered how you calibrate a level if you don't have a perfectly level surface to calibrate it on, now I know. It didn't matter that I couldn't see the bubble in the video, as soon as you started to explain it I face-palmed myself and said, "Of course. You flip it 180 degrees and split the difference, then keep doing that til there's no difference left to split...calibrated. Thanks for the informative videos.
Having been a land surveyor for many years I can tell you that the bubble always follows the direction your thumb is pointing (the thumb on the adjuster screw). At least that was the "rule of thumb" on the older theodolites and automatic levels I was using in the early-mid eighties.
Hey Victor, We have some cool old Brunson Jig transits at work that are really fun to use. They have a very sensitive level in them as well as micrometers to measure offsets at distance. Best, Tom
Hi, Tom. Thanks for a fun video, I've learn a lot from it, considering the fact I've always want to do things proper. I wish I could go learn lathe tips and trics on practice with pros such as yourself.
Hi Tom, you read in my mind! I was just looking for tips and tricks and stuff about lathe levelling. But I am lucky: mine is a 7X12 mini-lathe. :-) So I don't have to push hard on my knees. :-) Thank you for your video, well done!
Hi Tom, Great vid. Especially the explanation of the differences between the precision and construction levels and how the precision bubble is made. Leveling the lathe is something I had seen in other videos, using many questionable methods, but your explanation of concepts and direction for ease of operation seems definitive. Being significantly older then you, my joints were crying out watching you do the leveling calisthenics. Several others mentioned using phones to assist, seems like hunting for elephant with a .22. I suggest you acquire a video surveillance system with multiple cameras, 4 camera systems can be had for less the $200. This allows positioning of a camera directly above each level, giving the truest reading, and having all the images on a single monitor is split-screen. Mount the screen on a dolly and you can easily change from foot to foot without the up and down.
Hey Morris, I think I'll just open up a can of eager viewers next time I have to do it. I'll call it a lathe metrology seminar. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Thank you sincerely, that’s an excellent instructional guide to levelling a lathe for us new chums. Can I ask please, someone with a lathe said to me that he does level across the ways as you showed but he doesn’t level end to end on the long axis (headstock to tailstock). He says he deliberately runs his slightly downhill to the tailstock end to get his coolant to flow in the chip tray to the drain at the tail stock end. Does this sound acceptable to you please as long as there’s no twist (out of wind) in the ways and a test bar turns concentric along its length between centres and not tapered like a carrot? Hoping to set up my first lathe in a week or so & would like to get it right first go hopefully. Thanks in Advance.
Your timing of this video couldn't have been better for my purposes..I just bought two Starrett 98s (6" and 18") to level my Cincinnati lathe. The agenda for my next day off has been established.
Thanks for showing that, my lathe has some vibration at faster rpm's so i will have to find a good level and do some work on mine. Looking forward to part 2. Thank you Buddy.
Watching this video on leveling brings back memories of an "Oh S**t" moment at work. We were having a Hiedelberg Printing press installed. The installer came in with his tools, one of which was a custom Starrett level in a case with all it's accessories. I believe it was $100,000 plus in price. Well some poor rigger's assistant came flying through with one of their huge forklifts and just annihilated the entire ensemble. I learned a few new swear words, plus a few utterances, and then total silence once the forklift was turned off. The rigger boss and the installer stood there looking at the case like it was the family dog. OUCH!
Beauty! I feel confident enough to give this a go. I got a smoking deal for 4", 6" and 8" Starrett levels. Finally found a few pawn shops that cater to my addiction. Now I got the tools to level the lathe and mill. PS... those gloves are great! I can hardly keep 'em around. My wife has a pair now, and my kids, and sis-n-law.... Hard to keep a stash of those.
They go thru workers pretty fast around here. The Eagle Ford is needing workers like crazy. Hard to keep anyone around for long. I like it, because working with the young ones, they look at the time the piece has been out of pawn, not the price of the tool I got a Starrett disk mic for 9.00 the other day, just because it had been out for several months. Thank you for sharing your expertise. Means alot to me to learn from solid performers.
Hi Tom, great piece on leveling. What a good idea to put the level on the carriage. Just scroll from the head stock end to the tail stock end without touching the level this should reveal any twist in the ways. Looking forward to the test cuts, accuracy requires good set-up. Just say no to the plumb bob technique. Maybe look at head stock alignment ! Taking the time to set up tools properly pays off down the line.
Thanks for the great video as always. Was just thinking maybe a laptop and webcam, or some variation of the concept would make this easier, so cam pointed at the levels, and laptop to view it while making the adjustments.
My father in law is a quite the OCD type of person. If there is one thing he ever taught me it was how to make sure the tools you where using where capable of the job to begin with. Squares are another self proofing tool. It is quite amazing how many people use tools without knowing how to properly check them first. I included at one time.
Hey Tom, when you show the close up of the level at 8:02, the bubble level itself is "blown out" - it's overexposed in a way that makes it hard to read. This is happening because the camera is setting the exposure for the dark granite block.As an avid watcher of your videos, I've seen this a number of times. The way to fix it is to set your camera to underexpose slightly, maybe -.5EV to -1.0EV. Most cameras call this "exposure compensation", and most have it. Take a look and see if it improves the readability of your levels and dial indicators.
Hi Tom, On some lathes we might have to address some level of bowing due to length or poor rigidity, how could we measure and address that problem? Looking forward for more instructive videos, well appreciated. Thanks Pierre
Hi Pierre, If you suspect bowing you have to check in multiple places and map the bow or distortion with the level. You can sometimes use the carriage to drive along the ways to find local spots that need help. Ultimately the only adjustments you have to mess around with are the leveling feet so do you checking under those. The precision level is sensitive enough to pick up on many of the twist errors you see in lathes. Does it cut straight is the final question that has to be answered. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco Looking forward for your next video where you fine tune your lathe. Very pertinent information to get the most from fine equipment. Always a pleasure to watch. Pierre
Hey Tom Great job on leveling. watch most all your vids. In this one I noticed you changed shirts, and removed the swing arm you made from the red pipe behind your lathe. Great Job !! George
Hey George, Sharp eyes on that one. I had a fire sprinkler inspection the other day and they don't like to see foreign doohickies on their piping. The shirt is a time lapse thing. I shoot sometimes over a period of days so I try to not wear the same shirt for more than a week if I can help it. Cheers, Tom
Hey Chuck, But what they don't know is as soon as I connect air to it it floats on a cushion or ultra level air. It has a special leveling system underneath to level and isolate for vibration. How bout them apples. Going on a grinder retrieval mission this weekend? Cheers, Tom
I borrowed one of those Starrett levels when I set up my lathe. I didn't know anything about adjusting it to make sure it was correct. I may have to buy one on Ebay to keep around.
Hey Steve, It just like a scope for slopes. Need to be sighted in regularly. After this video I think level prices just clicked up a notch. Cheers, Tom
I noticed the mag carrier. What type of pistol do you prefer to carry? I have got comfortable with my Ruger LC9 and am looking forward to the new striker fire version.
That sure looked like a labor intensive procedure.....During the fast forward portion, I was expecting to see you do some jumping jacks to make it a full workout.....Nice captions at around the :25 minute mark...I am about purchase a new lathe to replace my small bench top one...I can use this newly learned information....thank you.
Hey Tom, this video couldn't come at a better time, I moved my lathe and was wondering how I should level it. Wheres your buddy ? That looks like a two man job.
You made that look easy. I have the same Starrett level, how do you use a shorter level like an 8" or 10" or so to cross a longer distance or wider ways?
Hi Tyler, You need a really good two by four.... Just kidding. You can use a long parallel (not cheap) or put the level on the top of the cross slide. Run the carriage up and down the machine to check for local errors. Cheers, Tom
Just got me a sharp 1340vs and the aggervation of leveling, one question i have is i didnt ever see you put the level down by the tailstock? Do you just check at the headstock and so far off the headstock? Or halfway down the ways? Thanks john
Lsu31 Hi John, Yes I had it at both ends of the machine. I also put the level on the carriage and run it up and down the length of the machine. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
How would you level a early 1990s Taiwanese "ENCO" 9"x20" bench lathe? one that has two mountings (bolts - 1ea) under the headstock/tailstock or a 13"x40" / 14x40". Any differences in setup? 2nd part.. what would you do if your facing cut ends up shaped more like a dome than a flat surface? turning between centers?
Hi Greg, Not sure. I'd have to see the mounting bolts. Sounds like your headstock might not be aligned to the ways. Is it a bolt on headstock setup? Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco I haven't really looked to be sure. It's not as accurate as it once was. The mounting setup is really designed to be mounted to their flimsy sheetmetal stand up on some metal blocks with threaded holes which are welded in the center of both ends of the sheetmetal chip pan just using some bolts and washers of the appropriate size. I don't notice much taper end to end when turning OD. It has a Phase II (Aloris Copy) AXA size (250) wedge toolpost.
What is that red piping/gauges/valve thing behind your lathe? Do you normally use metric units at work? Your one of the very few American machinists I've seen to always reference both systems of units. And from your 'on the fly' conversions it seems to be something you do regularly.
Hi Walter, I work with scientists during the day. I have to switch units pretty frequently. Its turned out to be very popular with the viewers in metric land. The red pipes are the cooling system for the lathe.... Just kidding. The pipes behind the lathe are the fire sprinkler riser. Cheers, Tom
Hey Tom, for the metric wrench get a cheap one imperial one (one you already have) and mill one of the jaws a little larger for the metric bolt. Love that PPG button sign near the picture of your friends sailboat.
Hi Andre, That sign is a thermometer and humidity gauge. The 26 mm was only $24 from Mcmaster. I didn't feel too bad at less than a buck per mm. Cheers, Tom
It's new? It's really cool! Didn't know McMaster carried that sort of stuff. Also, I might be interested in making a squareness comparator, Did you ever show the one you made on your blog in a video? Thanks
Andre Gross Hey Andre, The thermometer came from the flea market. Also the squareness comparator plans are on my blog. You will have to go back a ways to find them. Cheers, Tom
Thanks very much for this. I've been struggling to leveling my 14x40 Lathe using shims. I'm curious about the source of the leveling feet your using. Are they something that came with the lathe, purchased or shop made???
Hi Tom, thanks for the video, it will be of great help some time in the near future for me (I hope). Sorry if I ask something you already answered but I don´t have the time to read all the comments. Could you please tell me what kind of stone did you use to grind the lathe down in the video and where online may I get them shipped abroad? Thanks. Regards. Marcelo (from Argentina)
+cdsplus1 Hi Marcelo, Its a two grit combination bench stone made by Norton Abrasives. The fine side is around 320 grit and the coarse side is 120. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Great stuff brother, had a brain storm. Could you go to the next extreme and use a tension wrench with a crows foot on it to load the jacks evenly after leveling. But then with less jacks on one end the tensions will be more and same for the heaviest end will require more tension. Probably unnecessary but just a thought. Thanks for the video Tom :-)
Tom I just came into a 12 atlas I don't have a precision level or the cash for one. I've seen setups with a plumb bob to do this job what is your 2 cents on that?
You just schooled me on levels Tom. Thank you for that lesson. Wonder if thats one reason my little 9x20 cuts like a beaver chewing through a log. Cause I never leveled it just tossed it on a old wooden bench.
Even though the levels are calibrated,would using a long level on a long span( the lathe bed), be easier or more accurate than using the short one? Thanks for posting this video. Very informative!
Hi Steve, The accuracy of a level is in the vial. Precision levels have a ground vial that has an internal radius. They are quite sensitive and considerable more sensitive that commercial grade levels regardless of length. The length of a commercial or construction level is for spanning and averaging long surfaces. The precision level has to be short enough to not loose accuracy from sagging under its own weight. So a eight foot level of precision accuracy would probably need a hoist to move it around. Hope this helps. Cheers, Tom
Oh boy, there are some great set-ups for jokes on this video...I'll stick to the one that made me giggle the most. "You can get me 'Gently stoned' anytime Tom" LOL!!! I know, I know...I'm easy to make laugh so even my bad jokes are hilarious to me...especially when I'm gently stoned ;) All jokes aside, thanks for the great video, I will be needing this shortly. When I build my base I was thinking about putting 6 adjustable feet on it, should I weld a 7th one on the tailstock end to take the place of your jack? Would the 4 corners be enough for my little 54 inch bed, with a 5th one for the "tripod trick"? I know that I will also be able to shim it under the 4 mounting brackets on the lathe's feet, but any pointers you have on building my base would be so gracious of you. I'll send you an email with some photos of my tiny Atlas so you can get a good laugh. Thanks in advance...Aloha, Chuck.
Thanks really informative Tom I really love your videos. I use the brown and Sharpe 0-1 " micrometer I revived in Keith Fenners toolbox giveaway which I believe you donated
Howdy Tom, i have a question regarding a WEBB mill my girlfriends father Ray bought recently. I trammed the head, knuckle, and vise yesterday, and now the machine needs to be leveled. Hes wondering if the process of leveling the mill, will throw off the tram?? i am wondering if it will also. i don't think it will make a difference, but its always good to consult an expert!! haha. thanks.
Hey Phillip, Small world around here. Ray scored big time on the Webb. Now you can spend lots of time in the garage with your inheritance. Leveling the machine should not affect the tram. However you should tell Ray that when leveling the old guy gets down on the floor and adjusts the shims while the younger guy reads the level. Newer eyes you know. All the best. Tom
Thanks for all the good dope on machinist levels and how to check them. The tripod concept for machine leveling is useful too. Of course, this video raises questions about how you'd level a mill...the basic idea is obviously the same, but where do you check? On the base? The knee? The table? The head seems like a poor choice, though once the rest is level, tramming the head to the table is good. The table is my guess for the reference point, but since it may vary over its travels, that may be wrong... -- Mike
Hey Mike, You have it right. The table is the reference surface on a mill. One neat thing is when your mill is leveled well you can use your level as a good setup tool. If your concerned or seeing differences it the table depending on where it is in its travel try to optimize or average in the area's where you use it most. cheers, Tom
You really need a wireless mic! The echo is bad. Up close, things are great, but during the intro, I have to turn up the volume to hear your comments, but in the close-up, I get blasted and need to turn the volume back down. The Pyle PDWM96 is available from Amazon.com for $12.73. It seems to be a pretty good deal. Wireless Lavalier Mic Pyle PDWM96 Unboxing Tom - Vista, CA
Tom great video as usual. Any recommendos for levels? Obviously the starrett, brown sharpe, mitutoyo are all good. I see quite a few Stanley #36 and some older scroll cast iron starretts that are around the $50 range on eBay. Obviously I like the adjustability after watching your video but don't know if all "machinist" levels on eBay would have that. And I'm starting to go to flea markets thanks for the bad influence.
Hi Peter, The giveaway for me is the length of the bubble. If you see one and it is heavily build and has a very long bubble with graduations its probably a decent one. You now know how to calibrate and test one so some of the uncertainty is removed. Once you have embraced the power of the heavy side you will never go back. Cheers, Tom
If I were a video guy levelling a lathe, I would have a monitor hooked to the realtime video output of a camera aimed at the levels, and set where I could see the monitor while adjusting the legs. It would really cut the number of times I had to get up and down.
Hey Tom, great video, I'm looking forward to the follow up... Nice Mitutoyo! That baby could sure give you a workout if you were shooting for dead-nuts (Is there any other way? lol)... I've managed with a Starrett 98-6, but am envious of you 98-12 a second level is sure a time saver... Showing the adjustment process is a great addition! Thanks for sharing! :o] O,
Hi O, Two levels really makes it nice. At work we have even more so you can lay them all over the machinery and do the entire job dynamically. That mit will drive you bonkers when coupled with the big Starrett Master level. Cheers, Tom
Probably because of my father's aversion to bubble levels i have one too. But i can certainly see how much more simple this method would be. I'd probably go through 2 different methods to do this because of excluding bubble levels.
oxtoolco Because he's an architect and to him those are imprecise tools. I haven't asked him, why exactly he hates (and by hate i don't mean see one and hammer it to the ground hate, just aversion to use one) them so much but like all sons and daughters who are painted by "the parent perspective" i kinda caught the bug myself. I just can't look at one and not think "imprecise little bugger". Some are very imprecise and in some cases surfaces that were supposed to have very precise "docking" positions wound up being screwed by the workers who used these tools. Admittedly these are clearly far more precise tools than what we generally see in use in the trade but still he'd rather use nine different ways of figuring the twist and level of something than use a level. Wanna know what the odd thing is? Among the tools of the trade, with which i grew up with, there is this long slab of hard wood that has two bubbles. One for vertical and one for horizontal measuring. He never used it in any of the jobs i've followed him around, but i know it has been used since there's a bit of grime on it and well signs of use. Mah, oddities of odd people. A day after having seen the ones you've presented which are clearly far more precise tools i might see to acquire a couple or more because i'd rather use that than have to go through number crunching, lead line measuring and lasers setups. So thanks for bringing the existence of these for me.
Hi, I am offered a surface plate mitutoyo 550x840x approximate 100mm. they are asking 1000$ it look like its been used for some kind of fixture as its holes in it. i think the price are steep and I think I can get a chinese one for about700$ what do you think this offer? I could send you a picture of the plate
I'm assuming this is to improve accuracy, but I'm unclear on the benefits of getting perfectly level. What kind of behavior do you see when it's out of plumb?
Hi Robert, The leveling is an accessible method for the average person to do an accurate job setting up a lathe. The goal is to eliminate any twist in the bedways and a level is a convenient method to do this. The problems you see are machines that cut tapers instead of cylindrical surfaces. Cheers, Tom
Awesome. Thanks. My '41 Sheldon 11" just sits on cast iron legs but I might add leveling feet as my work becomes more refined. Also the longest piece I've made was 1.5" long and was an aesthetic design piece so accuracy over length hasn't been a concern. Great info.
Hi Manu, Some lathes when not leveled will not cut straight. They can have twist in the ways which shows up as taper in your work. Leveling machines is best practice. Cheers, Tom
Hey Greg, That Cadillac is actually a nice machine. They were sold under a couple names. Yuasa, Caddilac and Takisawa. Heavy duty for their size if its the one I think it is. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco It's a CL1440 / CM1440.. Pretty nice lathe. You may have seen them around. I always thought they were part of the YAM family lathes. (Birmingham, etc).It's nice to have After fixing my other two lathes up, this one went pretty quick. All it needed was new bearings and new screws.
The lathe does not care if it is level. It could be upside down even. What is important is to ensure no twist in the bed ie both "rails" (ways) of the bed run parallel. The easiest way to accomplish this is with a level.
Hi Tom, very good video on iron leveling. As always thanks for sharing your wisdom on these subjects, everyone can potentially benefits from the tips and tricks you present on how to do things the easiest way. But there are always the folks who insist on doing everything the hard way s they can bitch about it. I am sure you have run into that brand of yahoo, there is always one nearby.
Hey John, In my experience there are two basic types. People that want to get things done and the other type. Thanks for the comment. All the best, Tom
I mention to Abomb79 in an email, but he doesn't answer emails. If you ever come across a Snap-On adjustable wrench be sure to pick it up. They have no backlash. Best adjustable wrench you'll ever own.
‘Tom’ thanks for the tip, I just got my first metal lathe an old, South bend lathe model (A) catalog CL 670Z, bed 31/2. It will be my first-lathe; it seems in very good condition. But I know nothing about it. Can you tell me something about it? As always, thanks’ for taking the time to make this video! And I support this site. ~M~
+rene levesque Hi Rene, You should be able to do all that yourself. Do you have a surface plate to spot the bottom of the level? If so you can scrape the bottom and then recalibrate the level. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
+oxtoolco to give you a follow-up of that starrett level : I don t know how it twisted and bent as a banana however I had to remove 3 thou. to get it straight . it s second life has begun
This is clearly a job where you need your buddy Chuck. He could be drinking his hot chocolate and just tell you what the level says. Would save hundreds of the on knees, adjust, stand up, look, back to knees cycles.
Hey Pat, I used up all my saved up knee bonus points. We need a phone app that shows the level on remote display that way all you have to do is wallow around on the floor scooting from one foot to another. Cheers, Tom
It occurs to me that a smartphone camera control app such as Adam uses, in conjunction with a camera positioned directly above the level, would save an awful lot of up-and-down exercise during the leveling process, something that would be really important for people who have mobility issues.
Hi Graham, On the best levels the inside of the vial is ground barrel shaped to a large radius sometimes as large as 100 meter radius. On some cheap levels they just bend the vial to simulate a curve. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Excellent Tom! Glad there is someone out there that presents a concise simple to understand method for lathe leveling. I must have spent hours trying to level the 4 contact points on my South bend 9" lathe bench to get it generally level before final shimming between the top and the lathe bed feet. Never thought about utilizing a three point method. Bravo, you're my hero! It was also nice to learn how to calibrate a level as well.
Hey Eric,
Just going to three point is a major step in simplifying the job. Thanks for the comment. Feels great to be a hero today.
Best,
Tom
Hi Tom- With every new video you post I realize just how little I know... ;) Thanks for helping fix that!
Hey John,
You guys remind me of stuff to think about all the time. I'm learning here as well. When you have to explain things on camera makes you think them through a little.
All the best,
Tom
Tom your information and expertise is most welcome because I have just purchased a new chinese lathe and I knew I had to level it some time to get the best from it..
Good video and good work and keep them coming..Greetings from a bloke from the southern part of Western Australia...
Hi Ian,
Thanks for the comment. How is the southern part of western Australia these days?
All the best,
Tom
5 years later another sandgroper from southern part of Western Australia is reading this same comment!
That’s the beauty of the internet, it’s like having an encyclopaedia / library in your house, you can learn just about anything and people’s knowledge from years ago can keep on helping out others - just as if you published a book, & someone checked it out of the library.
As a hobbyist, I find your videos to be invaluable. Thanks!
Put the mag base on the frame of the lathe and let the indicator stem contact the floor, this has helped me to see the movement when adjusting the leveling bolts. I can see movement in thousandths instead of parts of a turn.
Richard Smith p
Hahaha, loved the creaky old back and popcorn knees.....sounds like me on a good day.
Very interesting stuff too
Hey Tom, you never told me to send that Empire level to you to help with the lathe leveling. Looks like you gotter hooked up with those nice Starrett and Soutbend levels. Good job. Lots of good advice in this one. Thanks buddy!
Adam
oxtoolco
(In Adam booth character) "Hey, wanna sell that level??" :-)
Great job on the leveling demonstration, and the level leveling tips. glad to hear it fixed the vibration you had!
Hey Brad,
Thanks for the comment. Its much better now.
Cheers,
Tom
WOW! Thank you for a incredibly informative video. The 3 point method of leveling and the proper way to calibrate the level. Thank You for sharing your knowledge with all of us.
Matt
Hi MAtt,
Thanks for the comment and compliment.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks for a great video. It was very timely in that I recently purchased a new 12" X 36" lathe and a precision level. I used your procedures for calibration and leveling and they worked great.
Hi Vaughn,
Glad it all worked out for you. Next video is the test cutting.
Cheers,
Tom
I never knew how to calibrate a level. Thanks for the knowledge!
dustinc1820 Dustin Collins Hi Dustin,
That is one of the best features of any tool. The ability to be self proving or self calibrating. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Love your videos! Working beside you would be an awesome experience, can't wait for part 2!
Adam, MrPete, Kieth, and yourself sure take up a lot of my spare time, however I have run out of new videos! Keep up the great work!
Hey Cleft,
Thanks for the comment. So your telling me you have watched all 186 of my video's and need more? Pretty impressive. How come you waited this long to leave a nice comment?
All the best,
Tom
I leveled my lathe originally with just a craftsman level and at high speeds it always shook. I finally took the plunge and bought a Starrett precision level and after leveling with it I couldn't believe the difference. No more wobble at high speeds and ran so much quieter. I also did my Milling machine and boring bar. Well worth every penny for my Starrett level. Thanks for sharing
Hey Maul,
Thanks for sharing your experience. Level machines are happy machines. They let you know in a number of ways.
Cheers,
Tom
Ray introduced me to your channel. Great stuff. TH-cam was the reason I went out and bought a 1957 bridgeport!! Haha. Ya ray stole that mill!! I paid more and I don't have DRO. I'll make sure keep the level bubble in the middle! Haha. Thanks for the vids, Tom.
Hey Phillip,
You are perfectly positioned to strike. These old guys keel over all the time. Just don't piss him or his daughter off and that Webb is as good as in your garage. Might just take a few years.
Cheers,
Tom
Videos like this make me miss the option to press the Like button several times.
Thank, N
Hi Nezir,
Feel free to click on some of the pesky advertising. Every little click counts. Thanks for the nice comment.
Best,
Tom
Yup, this is definitely where I borrow the kids iPad and have a Facetime conversation with my level while I am down at the leveling feet :)
Now that is an awesome idea!
Hey Steve,
You could do it with two phones and Google hangouts as well. I think you can get multiple images on that platform. Great idea.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Tom, if you do it on Hangouts you can have your entire channel 'assisting' you, though when Adam is shouting clockwise and Chuck is shouting the opposite, that might create a high friction co-efficient :)
Yikes, Now there is a scary thought. Those two guys barking at me in real time.
Cheers,
Tom
That's ingenius
Tom,
Excellent video on level calibration, and machine leveling. Just in time for me to level out the WEBB!
Thanks,
Ray
Hey Ray,
Glad you got the mill home safe and sound. Now were all waiting for a new YT channel to pop up called Fresno Fab And machine with Big Ray as your host.
All the best,
Tom
oxtoolco Thank you Tom!
This entire adventure would not have happened without your keen eye for a great deal, and most importantly sharing it with the gang!
Now let the chips fly coming at you from Fresno Fab!!!
Thanks again Tom,
Big Ray :)
I can personally attest to having to test your machine for twisting via level. I have an un-named - un-known, very old 10 inch x 36 inch metal lathe. Prior to this I relied on by back ground as a body & fender guy (25 yr's plus). I only recently in life learned about how to check your level (self prove). But just using a pipe-fitter's level (you can dial in angles) I was able to finally over come the twist, and get everything to where it needed to be. Was quite the pain in the neck. Very useful information, and again great video, oh and I love the "Red-Neck-Creeper." L-O-L.
Thanks for posting video Tom, very enjoyable and informative.
Hi Tom !
Now you inspired me again ... I have had to do this for month and NOW I'll do it - level up my lathe - I had got the same problem as you = at high rpms I had some vibrations - I only got 5 feet to adjust ;-))
Thx for sharing the method !
I long to see what running/turning test you will do !
Hi Keld,
Five feet. You sure you haven't missed one under there? You have to lay on the ground to see them all sometimes.
Best,
Tom
I always wondered how you calibrate a level if you don't have a perfectly level surface to calibrate it on, now I know.
It didn't matter that I couldn't see the bubble in the video, as soon as you started to explain it I face-palmed myself and said,
"Of course. You flip it 180 degrees and split the difference, then keep doing that til there's no difference left to split...calibrated.
Thanks for the informative videos.
Having been a land surveyor for many years I can tell you that the bubble always follows the direction your thumb is pointing (the thumb on the adjuster screw). At least that was the "rule of thumb" on the older theodolites and automatic levels I was using in the early-mid eighties.
Hey Victor,
We have some cool old Brunson Jig transits at work that are really fun to use. They have a very sensitive level in them as well as micrometers to measure offsets at distance.
Best,
Tom
Hi, Tom. Thanks for a fun video, I've learn a lot from it, considering the fact I've always want to do things proper. I wish I could go learn lathe tips and trics on practice with pros such as yourself.
Glad you liked the video. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom, you read in my mind! I was just looking for tips and tricks and stuff about lathe levelling. But I am lucky: mine is a 7X12 mini-lathe. :-) So I don't have to push hard on my knees. :-) Thank you for your video, well done!
Hi Cosimo,
You are lucky. This is a real hard job on a four meter lathe with ten or twenty support feet.
Cheers,
Tom
This is very interesting Mr. Tom. I like the idea of making one. Thanks for this class.
RP
Just checked a few of my levels, Ouch.... I guess I'm going shopping!
Very informative! Thanks for sharing!
Hi Tom,
Thanks for the excellent video.
Congratulations I noticed that your subscribers passed 10000.
Hi Mehmet,
Thanks for the comment. Its kind of a special milestone for me. Never thought it would go this far.
Cheers,
Tom
Checking for bed twisting of a lathe on a ship next week, that's going to be interesting.
Hey Tom...
Enjoyed watching (learning from) this video....
Great lesson on the precision levels....
Chuck
Hey Chuck,
Always good to see your comments.
Talk to you soon.
Tom
Hi Tom,
Great vid. Especially the explanation of the differences between the precision and construction levels and how the precision bubble is made. Leveling the lathe is something I had seen in other videos, using many questionable methods, but your explanation of concepts and direction for ease of operation seems definitive. Being significantly older then you, my joints were crying out watching you do the leveling calisthenics. Several others mentioned using phones to assist, seems like hunting for elephant with a .22. I suggest you acquire a video surveillance system with multiple cameras, 4 camera systems can be had for less the $200. This allows positioning of a camera directly above each level, giving the truest reading, and having all the images on a single monitor is split-screen. Mount the screen on a dolly and you can easily change from foot to foot without the up and down.
Hey Morris,
I think I'll just open up a can of eager viewers next time I have to do it. I'll call it a lathe metrology seminar. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
I enjoy all the minutia involved with machining
Thank you sincerely, that’s an excellent instructional guide to levelling a lathe for us new chums.
Can I ask please, someone with a lathe said to me that he does level across the ways as you showed but he doesn’t level end to end on the long axis (headstock to tailstock).
He says he deliberately runs his slightly downhill to the tailstock end to get his coolant to flow in the chip tray to the drain at the tail stock end.
Does this sound acceptable to you please as long as there’s no twist (out of wind) in the ways and a test bar turns concentric along its length between centres and not tapered like a carrot?
Hoping to set up my first lathe in a week or so & would like to get it right first go hopefully.
Thanks in Advance.
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! I have finally learned how to properly level my lathe!
Hi Jake,
Thanks for the thanks. Let me know how it goes. Part 2 just went up as well.
Cheers,
Tom
Your timing of this video couldn't have been better for my purposes..I just bought two Starrett 98s (6" and 18") to level my Cincinnati lathe. The agenda for my next day off has been established.
Hi Greg,
Smart man buying two levels. It really cuts the work down having two good instruments. Let us know how it works out for you.
Cheers,
Tom
My new and approved level arrived Saturday.
Thanks for the rundown on this procedure. I'll be moving my lathe soon and have to go through the ordeal as well.
Colin
Hey Colin,
Rearranging the shop again. Does the new milling machine not match the drapes again?
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco
What drapes??....NO windows! Actually I have something up my sleeve for the next few weeks but I'll just hang on to it just yet. :-)
Colin
Thanks for showing that, my lathe has some vibration at faster rpm's so i will have to find a good level and do some work on mine. Looking forward to part 2. Thank you Buddy.
Hey Buddy,
Thanks for the comment. Leveling should help with your vibration problem.
Cheers,
Tom
Watching this video on leveling brings back memories of an "Oh S**t" moment at work. We were having a Hiedelberg Printing press installed. The installer came in with his tools, one of which was a custom Starrett level in a case with all it's accessories. I believe it was $100,000 plus in price. Well some poor rigger's assistant came flying through with one of their huge forklifts and just annihilated the entire ensemble. I learned a few new swear words, plus a few utterances, and then total silence once the forklift was turned off. The rigger boss and the installer stood there looking at the case like it was the family dog. OUCH!
Hey Jim,
There was a disturbance in the force felt by all tool Jedi. Thanks for sharing.
Cheers,
Tom
Beauty! I feel confident enough to give this a go. I got a smoking deal for 4", 6" and 8" Starrett levels. Finally found a few pawn shops that cater to my addiction. Now I got the tools to level the lathe and mill. PS... those gloves are great! I can hardly keep 'em around. My wife has a pair now, and my kids, and sis-n-law.... Hard to keep a stash of those.
The pawn shop guys are luring you in. Pretty soon they will be calling you at all hours to check out the latest stash.
Cheers,
Tom
They go thru workers pretty fast around here. The Eagle Ford is needing workers like crazy. Hard to keep anyone around for long. I like it, because working with the young ones, they look at the time the piece has been out of pawn, not the price of the tool I got a Starrett disk mic for 9.00 the other day, just because it had been out for several months. Thank you for sharing your expertise. Means alot to me to learn from solid performers.
Hi Tom, great piece on leveling. What a good idea to put the level on the carriage. Just scroll from the head stock end to the tail stock end without touching the level this should reveal any twist in the ways. Looking forward to the test cuts, accuracy requires good set-up. Just say no to the plumb bob technique. Maybe look at head stock alignment ! Taking the time to set up tools properly pays off down the line.
Hi David,
Thanks for the comment. You guys are going to get your wish. Test cuts, headstock alignment the whole tamale.
Cheers,
Tom
That is some really good info. I haven't heard it anywhere else
Hi Eitri,
Thanks for the comment. There will be a second video in this series so stay tuned.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks for the great video as always. Was just thinking maybe a laptop and webcam, or some variation of the concept would make this easier, so cam pointed at the levels, and laptop to view it while making the adjustments.
Hi Jason,
Google glasses. Preferably the Dean Edell edition in 1.5X.
Cheers,
Tom
My father in law is a quite the OCD type of person. If there is one thing he ever taught me it was how to make sure the tools you where using where capable of the job to begin with. Squares are another self proofing tool. It is quite amazing how many people use tools without knowing how to properly check them first. I included at one time.
Hi Jasin,
Thanks for the comment. See all that geometry in school is actually useful. Those old Greek guys knew some stuff.
All the best,
Tom
Hey Tom, when you show the close up of the level at 8:02, the bubble level itself is "blown out" - it's overexposed in a way that makes it hard to read. This is happening because the camera is setting the exposure for the dark granite block.As an avid watcher of your videos, I've seen this a number of times.
The way to fix it is to set your camera to underexpose slightly, maybe -.5EV to -1.0EV. Most cameras call this "exposure compensation", and most have it. Take a look and see if it improves the readability of your levels and dial indicators.
Daniel Reetz In sure he knows that, it's hard to tell if it's over exposed when he's looking at a 2.3" screen.
I learn something new every day :-)
Hi Tom,
On some lathes we might have to address some level of bowing due to length or poor rigidity, how could we measure and address that problem?
Looking forward for more instructive videos, well appreciated.
Thanks
Pierre
Hi Pierre,
If you suspect bowing you have to check in multiple places and map the bow or distortion with the level. You can sometimes use the carriage to drive along the ways to find local spots that need help. Ultimately the only adjustments you have to mess around with are the leveling feet so do you checking under those. The precision level is sensitive enough to pick up on many of the twist errors you see in lathes. Does it cut straight is the final question that has to be answered.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco
Looking forward for your next video where you fine tune your lathe.
Very pertinent information to get the most from fine equipment.
Always a pleasure to watch.
Pierre
Hey Tom
Great job on leveling. watch most all your vids. In this one I noticed you changed shirts, and removed the swing arm you made from the red pipe behind your lathe.
Great Job !!
George
Hey George,
Sharp eyes on that one. I had a fire sprinkler inspection the other day and they don't like to see foreign doohickies on their piping. The shirt is a time lapse thing. I shoot sometimes over a period of days so I try to not wear the same shirt for more than a week if I can help it.
Cheers,
Tom
Tom,
Good show, as always. You do realize that the whole TH-cam world now knows your surface plate is not level!
Thanks. Chuck.
Hey Chuck,
But what they don't know is as soon as I connect air to it it floats on a cushion or ultra level air. It has a special leveling system underneath to level and isolate for vibration. How bout them apples. Going on a grinder retrieval mission this weekend?
Cheers,
Tom
I borrowed one of those Starrett levels when I set up my lathe. I didn't know anything about adjusting it to make sure it was correct. I may have to buy one on Ebay to keep around.
Hey Steve,
It just like a scope for slopes. Need to be sighted in regularly. After this video I think level prices just clicked up a notch.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Yea I just missed one! LOL Thanks.
Thanks again for a good demo.
I noticed the mag carrier. What type of pistol do you prefer to carry? I have got comfortable with my Ruger LC9 and am looking forward to the new striker fire version.
Hey Duck,
Its for a leatherman multitool. But if I did carry I would be Mitch Rosen leather around it and just shy of half inch diameter.
Cheers,
Tom
i need to level my machines. thanks for showing how to level.
Hi Zeeshan,
Thanks for the comment.
Best,
Tom
That sure looked like a labor intensive procedure.....During the fast forward portion, I was expecting to see you do some jumping jacks to make it a full workout.....Nice captions at around the :25 minute mark...I am about purchase a new lathe to replace my small bench top one...I can use this newly learned information....thank you.
Hey Clete,
Yeah its a workout all right. One hundred squat thrusts per lathe leveling.
Best,
Tom
Hey Tom, this video couldn't come at a better time, I moved my lathe and was wondering how I should level it.
Wheres your buddy ? That looks like a two man job.
Hey Dennis,
Chuck would have been a great help. Its always easier to switch off laying on the floor.
Cheers,
Tom
Levelling that small machine is a one man job.
Try level a 30 ton machine and 28 bolts, that is a two-man job (I have done it alone).
You made that look easy.
I have the same Starrett level, how do you use a shorter level like an 8" or 10" or so to cross a longer distance or wider ways?
Hi Tyler,
You need a really good two by four.... Just kidding. You can use a long parallel (not cheap) or put the level on the top of the cross slide. Run the carriage up and down the machine to check for local errors.
Cheers,
Tom
Just got me a sharp 1340vs and the aggervation of leveling, one question i have is i didnt ever see you put the level down by the tailstock? Do you just check at the headstock and so far off the headstock? Or halfway down the ways? Thanks john
Lsu31 Hi John,
Yes I had it at both ends of the machine. I also put the level on the carriage and run it up and down the length of the machine. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi mate.
Thanks for that. I never thought of that.
Marcel.
How would you level a early 1990s Taiwanese "ENCO" 9"x20" bench lathe? one that has two mountings (bolts - 1ea) under the headstock/tailstock or a 13"x40" / 14x40". Any differences in setup?
2nd part.. what would you do if your facing cut ends up shaped more like a dome than a flat surface?
turning between centers?
Hi Greg,
Not sure. I'd have to see the mounting bolts. Sounds like your headstock might not be aligned to the ways. Is it a bolt on headstock setup?
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco I haven't really looked to be sure. It's not as accurate as it once was. The mounting setup is really designed to be mounted to their flimsy sheetmetal stand up on some metal blocks with threaded holes which are welded in the center of both ends of the sheetmetal chip pan just using some bolts and washers of the appropriate size. I don't notice much taper end to end when turning OD. It has a Phase II (Aloris Copy) AXA size (250) wedge toolpost.
What is that red piping/gauges/valve thing behind your lathe?
Do you normally use metric units at work? Your one of the very few American machinists I've seen to always reference both systems of units. And from your 'on the fly' conversions it seems to be something you do regularly.
Hi Walter,
I work with scientists during the day. I have to switch units pretty frequently. Its turned out to be very popular with the viewers in metric land. The red pipes are the cooling system for the lathe.... Just kidding. The pipes behind the lathe are the fire sprinkler riser.
Cheers,
Tom
Hey Tom, for the metric wrench get a cheap one imperial one (one you already have) and mill one of the jaws a little larger for the metric bolt.
Love that PPG button sign near the picture of your friends sailboat.
Hi Andre,
That sign is a thermometer and humidity gauge. The 26 mm was only $24 from Mcmaster. I didn't feel too bad at less than a buck per mm.
Cheers,
Tom
It's new? It's really cool! Didn't know McMaster carried that sort of stuff.
Also, I might be interested in making a squareness comparator, Did you ever show the one you made on your blog in a video?
Thanks
Andre Gross Hey Andre,
The thermometer came from the flea market. Also the squareness comparator plans are on my blog. You will have to go back a ways to find them.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks very much for this. I've been struggling to leveling my 14x40 Lathe using shims. I'm curious about the source of the leveling feet your using. Are they something that came with the lathe, purchased or shop made???
That's a shiny head there Mr. Wizard!
Hi Tom, thanks for the video, it will be of great help some time in the near future for me (I hope). Sorry if I ask something you already answered but I don´t have the time to read all the comments. Could you please tell me what kind of stone did you use to grind the lathe down in the video and where online may I get them shipped abroad? Thanks. Regards. Marcelo (from Argentina)
+cdsplus1 Hi Marcelo,
Its a two grit combination bench stone made by Norton Abrasives. The fine side is around 320 grit and the coarse side is 120. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Great stuff brother, had a brain storm. Could you go to the next extreme and use a tension wrench with a crows foot on it to load the jacks evenly after leveling. But then with less jacks on one end the tensions will be more and same for the heaviest end will require more tension. Probably unnecessary but just a thought. Thanks for the video Tom :-)
Tom I just came into a 12 atlas I don't have a precision level or the cash for one. I've seen setups with a plumb bob to do this job what is your 2 cents on that?
Hey Chris,
Never tried that method. The proof is in the cutting. Use the best level you have and then do test cuts.
Cheers,
Tom
Ok hay ever finish my compound swivel ?
Chris Anderson Hey Chris,
Not yet. Are you getting close to needing it?
---Tom
Lol so so fixing up the atlas now so its not a rush by any means
You just schooled me on levels Tom. Thank you for that lesson. Wonder if thats one reason my little 9x20 cuts like a beaver chewing through a log. Cause I never leveled it just tossed it on a old wooden bench.
And it hasn't chewed through the bench yet? wow your lucky. Its going to build a dam in your backyard soon.
Cheers,
Tom
I hope so cause I hate mowing grass!
Even though the levels are calibrated,would using a long level on a long span( the lathe bed), be easier or more accurate than using the short one? Thanks for posting this video. Very informative!
Hi Steve,
The accuracy of a level is in the vial. Precision levels have a ground vial that has an internal radius. They are quite sensitive and considerable more sensitive that commercial grade levels regardless of length. The length of a commercial or construction level is for spanning and averaging long surfaces. The precision level has to be short enough to not loose accuracy from sagging under its own weight. So a eight foot level of precision accuracy would probably need a hoist to move it around. Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Tom
Oh boy, there are some great set-ups for jokes on this video...I'll stick to the one that made me giggle the most.
"You can get me 'Gently stoned' anytime Tom" LOL!!!
I know, I know...I'm easy to make laugh so even my bad jokes are hilarious to me...especially when I'm gently stoned ;)
All jokes aside, thanks for the great video, I will be needing this shortly. When I build my base I was thinking about putting 6 adjustable feet on it, should I weld a 7th one on the tailstock end to take the place of your jack? Would the 4 corners be enough for my little 54 inch bed, with a 5th one for the "tripod trick"?
I know that I will also be able to shim it under the 4 mounting brackets on the lathe's feet, but any pointers you have on building my base would be so gracious of you. I'll send you an email with some photos of my tiny Atlas so you can get a good laugh.
Thanks in advance...Aloha, Chuck.
Thanks really informative Tom I really love your videos. I use the brown and Sharpe 0-1 " micrometer I revived in Keith Fenners toolbox giveaway which I believe you donated
Hi Andre,
I'm glad it found a good home. The micrometer had not seem any use and is beautiful.
Cheers,
Tom
Good night do you have material of leveling sistem i want know how using so how make the calculation
Howdy Tom, i have a question regarding a WEBB mill my girlfriends father Ray bought recently. I trammed the head, knuckle, and vise yesterday, and now the machine needs to be leveled. Hes wondering if the process of leveling the mill, will throw off the tram?? i am wondering if it will also. i don't think it will make a difference, but its always good to consult an expert!! haha.
thanks.
Hey Phillip,
Small world around here. Ray scored big time on the Webb. Now you can spend lots of time in the garage with your inheritance. Leveling the machine should not affect the tram. However you should tell Ray that when leveling the old guy gets down on the floor and adjusts the shims while the younger guy reads the level. Newer eyes you know.
All the best.
Tom
Thanks for all the good dope on machinist levels and how to check them. The tripod concept for machine leveling is useful too.
Of course, this video raises questions about how you'd level a mill...the basic idea is obviously the same, but where do you check? On the base? The knee? The table? The head seems like a poor choice, though once the rest is level, tramming the head to the table is good. The table is my guess for the reference point, but since it may vary over its travels, that may be wrong...
-- Mike
Hey Mike,
You have it right. The table is the reference surface on a mill. One neat thing is when your mill is leveled well you can use your level as a good setup tool. If your concerned or seeing differences it the table depending on where it is in its travel try to optimize or average in the area's where you use it most.
cheers,
Tom
Well, I always level the mill with the table at the center of it's travel. It just seems to be leveled better there.
very good information ty :)
You really need a wireless mic! The echo is bad. Up close, things are great, but during the intro, I have to turn up the volume to hear your comments, but in the close-up, I get blasted and need to turn the volume back down. The Pyle PDWM96 is available from Amazon.com for $12.73. It seems to be a pretty good deal. Wireless Lavalier Mic Pyle PDWM96 Unboxing
Tom - Vista, CA
Tom great video as usual. Any recommendos for levels? Obviously the starrett, brown sharpe, mitutoyo are all good. I see quite a few Stanley #36 and some older scroll cast iron starretts that are around the $50 range on eBay. Obviously I like the adjustability after watching your video but don't know if all "machinist" levels on eBay would have that.
And I'm starting to go to flea markets thanks for the bad influence.
Hi Peter,
The giveaway for me is the length of the bubble. If you see one and it is heavily build and has a very long bubble with graduations its probably a decent one. You now know how to calibrate and test one so some of the uncertainty is removed. Once you have embraced the power of the heavy side you will never go back.
Cheers,
Tom
I wish it were possible to give a video two thumbs up.
+Mike Behrens Hi Mike,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
If I were a video guy levelling a lathe, I would have a monitor hooked to the realtime video output of a camera aimed at the levels, and set where I could see the monitor while adjusting the legs. It would really cut the number of times I had to get up and down.
Peter W. Meek Hey Pete,
Sound like your ready to fire up your channel. Let me know. I'l throw you a sub.
Cheers,
Tom
Hey Tom, great video, I'm looking forward to the follow up... Nice Mitutoyo! That baby could sure give you a workout if you were shooting for dead-nuts (Is there any other way? lol)... I've managed with a Starrett 98-6, but am envious of you 98-12 a second level is sure a time saver... Showing the adjustment process is a great addition! Thanks for sharing! :o]
O,
Hi O,
Two levels really makes it nice. At work we have even more so you can lay them all over the machinery and do the entire job dynamically. That mit will drive you bonkers when coupled with the big Starrett Master level.
Cheers,
Tom
Probably because of my father's aversion to bubble levels i have one too. But i can certainly see how much more simple this method would be.
I'd probably go through 2 different methods to do this because of excluding bubble levels.
Hi Aserta,
Why did your father not like bubble levels? Now you have my curiosity perked.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Because he's an architect and to him those are imprecise tools.
I haven't asked him, why exactly he hates
(and by hate i don't mean see one and hammer it to the ground hate, just aversion to use one) them so much but like all sons and daughters who are painted by "the parent perspective" i kinda caught the bug myself.
I just can't look at one and not think "imprecise little bugger".
Some are very imprecise and in some cases surfaces that were supposed to have very precise "docking" positions wound up being screwed by the workers who used these tools.
Admittedly these are clearly far more precise tools than what we generally see in use in the trade but still he'd rather use nine different ways of figuring the twist and level of something than use a level.
Wanna know what the odd thing is? Among the tools of the trade, with which i grew up with, there is this long slab of hard wood that has two bubbles. One for vertical and one for horizontal measuring. He never used it in any of the jobs i've followed him around, but i know it has been used since there's a bit of grime on it and well signs of use.
Mah, oddities of odd people. A day after having seen the ones you've presented which are clearly far more precise tools i might see to acquire a couple or more because i'd rather use that than have to go through number crunching, lead line measuring and lasers setups.
So thanks for bringing the existence of these for me.
Hi, I am offered a surface plate mitutoyo 550x840x approximate 100mm. they are asking 1000$ it look like its been used for some kind of fixture as its holes in it. i think the price are steep and I think I can get a chinese one for about700$ what do you think this offer? I could send you a picture of the plate
I'm assuming this is to improve accuracy, but I'm unclear on the benefits of getting perfectly level. What kind of behavior do you see when it's out of plumb?
Hi Robert,
The leveling is an accessible method for the average person to do an accurate job setting up a lathe. The goal is to eliminate any twist in the bedways and a level is a convenient method to do this. The problems you see are machines that cut tapers instead of cylindrical surfaces.
Cheers,
Tom
Awesome. Thanks. My '41 Sheldon 11" just sits on cast iron legs but I might add leveling feet as my work becomes more refined. Also the longest piece I've made was 1.5" long and was an aesthetic design piece so accuracy over length hasn't been a concern. Great info.
but why ? why do you need the lathe to be level ?
Hi Manu,
Some lathes when not leveled will not cut straight. They can have twist in the ways which shows up as taper in your work. Leveling machines is best practice.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Bed twist is bad... but I have seen some very poorly cast beds. Oh, and I managed to find a unloved Caddilac 14x40.
Hey Greg,
That Cadillac is actually a nice machine. They were sold under a couple names. Yuasa, Caddilac and Takisawa. Heavy duty for their size if its the one I think it is.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco It's a CL1440 / CM1440.. Pretty nice lathe. You may have seen them around. I always thought they were part of the YAM family lathes. (Birmingham, etc).It's nice to have After fixing my other two lathes up, this one went pretty quick. All it needed was new bearings and new screws.
The lathe does not care if it is level. It could be upside down even. What is important is to ensure no twist in the bed ie both "rails" (ways) of the bed run parallel. The easiest way to accomplish this is with a level.
Hi Tom, very good video on iron leveling. As always thanks for sharing your wisdom on these subjects, everyone can potentially benefits from the tips and tricks you present on how to do things the easiest way. But there are always the folks who insist on doing everything the hard way s they can bitch about it. I am sure you have run into that brand of yahoo, there is always one nearby.
Hey John,
In my experience there are two basic types. People that want to get things done and the other type. Thanks for the comment.
All the best,
Tom
I mention to Abomb79 in an email, but he doesn't answer emails. If you ever come across a Snap-On adjustable wrench be sure to pick it up. They have no backlash. Best adjustable wrench you'll ever own.
‘Tom’ thanks for the tip, I just got my first metal lathe an old, South bend lathe model (A) catalog CL 670Z, bed 31/2. It will be my first-lathe; it seems in very good condition. But I know nothing about it. Can you tell me something about it? As always, thanks’ for taking the time to make this video! And I support this site. ~M~
Mike A Drover Hey Mike,
Shoot me a couple pictures of your lathe. In the mean time check out lathes.co.uk Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
i have an old starrett #98 level in mint condition , must be around 50 or 60 years of age and it warped !!! needs a reground and a calibration
+rene levesque Hi Rene,
You should be able to do all that yourself. Do you have a surface plate to spot the bottom of the level? If so you can scrape the bottom and then recalibrate the level. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco my friend has a grinding machine so that will be faster ... cheers
+oxtoolco to give you a follow-up of that starrett level : I don t know how it twisted and bent as a banana however I had to remove 3 thou. to get it straight . it s second life has begun
My left knee started hurting watching this ..
Well done. Has anybody had the thought to deliberately put a twist in a lathe to take out taper in a worn machine.
Oh man id like to have his clausing lathe. I wouldn't have room for that mill. Mine barely fits as it is. Haha.
This is clearly a job where you need your buddy Chuck. He could be drinking his hot chocolate and just tell you what the level says. Would save hundreds of the on knees, adjust, stand up, look, back to knees cycles.
I believe Chuck drinks chocolate Ensure. ;-)
Hey Pat,
I used up all my saved up knee bonus points. We need a phone app that shows the level on remote display that way all you have to do is wallow around on the floor scooting from one foot to another.
Cheers,
Tom
It occurs to me that a smartphone camera control app such as Adam uses, in conjunction with a camera positioned directly above the level, would save an awful lot of up-and-down exercise during the leveling process, something that would be really important for people who have mobility issues.
Hi Carknocker,
I think all older metal workers have mobility issues. That's why we should bring back apprentices.
Cheers,
Tom
@@oxtoolco 😂😂😂😂
Now I have an excuse to buy a really nice level. +1 for the tool junky.
Better hurry. Prices on levels are headed up after this video.
Cheers,
Tom
@@oxtoolco plus a hammer😉
Good information.
+Jerry Halcomb Hey Jerry,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Good video, how in the world did get to the back feet in the middle. It looks you get there from here. LOL
Hey Eric,
Its in the deleted scenes and bloopers folder, Not pleasant video unless you like plumbers crack.......
Cheers,
Tom
Point a baby monitor camera at the level. Look at the screen on the floor.
Like the reference to doubleboost.lol
I definitely do NOT have a "tripod situation", however, we can't all be so lucky...
Ok ll try that ever finish my compound swivel. Also I've got somthing fun to send ya
26 mm is a quite unusual size, I never worked with it. Usually you have 24 or 27 mm.
Don't vials need to be curved to build a precision level
Hi Graham,
On the best levels the inside of the vial is ground barrel shaped to a large radius sometimes as large as 100 meter radius. On some cheap levels they just bend the vial to simulate a curve. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
+oxtoolco so they grind the interior of the glass vial for a 50m radius ?