Thank you for the feedback. No trouble! It's a handy resource and the HP Z8 G4 is only just entering its value proposition phase - so many will benefit from this information. This video took a long time to compile. It's not that the Z8 G4 can't render long videos efficiently - it's that my editing motivation is inversely proportional to video length.lol
Hey, Cheers from a fellow helmet wearer 🙂 from from the opposite part of the world (Sweden). At long last, a video in depth about the Z8G4. THANKS! Make more. Please!!! I promise to watch. I've seen some of your informative posts on forums, so I definitely have been looking forward to this one. Thanks. With Z8G4 I saw, for the first time in 10 years or more, a possibility for me to get a decently modern WS without being ruined... So, finally I went for it. Anyway, I got mine late 2023 from Italy with 192GB 2666 RAM and the first thing that really surprised me was the weight. More than the luggage that airlines allows as standard (20kg). I upgraded my CPUs from sluggish silver to gold with dual 6148, Radeon RX6950XT, HP turbo cards for the 2 PCI special slots with 2 nvme in each card, in the 3 bays I got 2,5 SATA drives, HP TB3 card, WiFi/BT-card, 2,5 GB Ethernet card and now I'm testing a 2nd video card (AMD WX7100) since I want to test Proxmox with multiple OS with passthrough. Oh, and I replaced the HP writer with a more modern BluRay rider and DVD writer. In short: I got no PCIE free anymore... And (as far as I know) I got 3 free SATA connector slots and a free 5,25 slot I also tested to have NVME on PCIE but got corruption and that was the signal for me to get the HP Turbo cards. I looked at a 4X solution like the 3 models you tested in one of your videos, but stopped since I knew my PCIE slots would be occupied. I got great help and insight about the jumpers for the turbo cards on the HP forum for WS. The AMD 6950 GPU isn't as wide as the 4090 but it covers 2 precious 16X slots gets anyway (3 16X gets lost in total for me) and I've watched your video from your previous WS where you tested different raiser cables. But keeping the silent cover with some sort of double tape solution or zippers would be difficult on the Z8, so I passed. I really wanted the keep the silent cover over the PCIE and finally I did the unthinkable: I got rid of some plastic (with dremel) on the inside of the cover in order for the 6950 graphic card to not hit the cover when it was mounted. It's mounted since yesterday! Finally, the cover is mounted again. It took me 6 months to get the guts, but who is counting?... I'm thinking about Platinum as the upgrade for the CPU but the prices are still stupid (and that for ES models) so I keep my eyes out and will look into your spreadsheet. Thanks for publishing it. And thanks for sharing info about the 205 limit, that one I haven't read or heard before. On your system I noticed that you got the premium I/O on the front while I have the "standard" one... Upgrading it was on my to do until I realized I had to get a cable that wasn't shipped with the front, so I passed. For now. And yes, I'm interested to know about those air filters too. None came with my system. And please tell how you managed to get that 4 bay in the front to work. I only found 3 free SATA slots and have postponed to install that one on mine for the time being. You don't have the amount of subscribers you should have IMHO and I think it has to do with the fact that your voice is muffled. I know since I've heard I also sound muffled when I'm wearing a motorcycle helmet with a BT solution added or built in. You do as you wish of course, but the things you did on older systems and now with the Z8 is very insightful and interesting. I just wish for you to get the credit and kudos you should have. It takes time to do the things you did on this one, record it, edit it and polish it. Yes, I do some video editing too. I just want you to know how appreciated it is for some of us. Anyway, keep those videos of yours coming. Now I'm more interested than ever. What will come next: Dust filter? How SATA connects to your 4 bay in the 5,25 bay with the 3 in bay already connected? Memory comparisson between 2666 and 2933? How to use raiser cable for those of us that don't have any free PCIE slots anymore? Settings in BIOS (I've got weird results trying different BIOS UEFI choices)? Usage of VROC? Setting up of Proxmox and what to think about? Yupp, I'm sure looking forward for the next one. Cheers and many thanks for now!
Thank you for your message and support! Sometimes I wonder if I should just ditch the channel theme and go without the helmet, but the channel was inspired by an idea that hit me while sim racing and I have stuck with it - I am stubborn like that. A muffled voice is definitely an issue - and I need to compensate for that in post. (DaVinci has incredible audio editing). Raising the visor has helped a little and using a shotgun mic. has also helped. With the visor up the sound is decent enough by my ear but it could still improve. This project has been a time and energy sink but it should be a solid resource for years to come. I believe the Z8 G4 is stepping up as the Z840’s replacement right about now and hardware prices are beginning to reflect that (E5-2697A V4’s are only marginally cheaper than Gold 6142’s - despite being ~3000 points weaker in Passmark benching). Nice setup! Your system is very well populated. You may want to consider the dual HP 10GbE network module since that will free up one of your PCIe slots (they are still really expensive unfortunately - likely quite rare). These systems are perfect for multiple OS setups, and if anything you could quite literally have 4 capable virtual systems (each VM - 12Cores, 64GB mem, 1x GPU etc.) running from one machine. Nice upgrade with the Blueray reader / DVD writer. I tend to not use them much (it’s one of the first things I remove for more storage if possible lol), but for a media station that would be great value. Output video to a home project and you have movie nights covered. It's strange that you had issues with NVMes. I have had issues with my old Win 10 NVMe not being detected in this system. I presumed it was a new feature of secureboot - preventing an OS from being switched from another machine. But generally my NVMes have been working fine. I am working on an upgrade - RAID 0 on the M.2 Personality module. It’s just a shame that NAND storage has jumped in price. I had to forfeit NVMe capacity to get that future video content lol. The riser mod would work - I did have the idea of running a long riser cable that could be rerouted to sit ontop of the GPU backplate - double sided tape etc. Then you could fit certain small PCIe adapters - and it sounds like you would appreciate a SATA/SAS HBA for some extra SATA ports.lol. Yes, the 205W limit is a major issue and it has caught out many because you don’t always expect a CPU socket to not support a CPU that fits that socket! I caught onto it because of wanting to purchase dual Platinum 8275CL due to going cheap- but they were 240W! The Z8 G4 and Z6 G4 have been limited by their motherboard power delivery components - they lack the amps to support 240W sustained power draw. I do wonder if the 210W CPUs would work (e.g. Platinum 8259CL) - maybe. At least you can remove that front panel if you need to upgrade - new front I/O or that dust filter! If I can track a dust filter I will consider it, but I would not want to pull that front panel off regularly. It really feels like something that was not meant to be removed - securely fits in place. Thank you, the subscriber grind is real. The helmet likely holds me back, but I see that as a good thing. I have to rely on improving video content rather than relying on my dashingly good looks haha. I did have in mind to include the BIOS but I neglected to add that. I only recently got HP Performance Advisor to install correctly on this system - otherwise I would have included more from the BIOS. It’s complicated in there! A VROC video will be beneficial but I fear the cost of a VROC module is somewhat prohibitive. But I did notice in the BIOS there option is there to setup VROC on most of the PCIe slots - so it will be a really powerful system if implemented right. I can foresee a couple of quad NVMe adapters combining via VROC into a mega RAID 0 pool - just in the name of science (a 16TB VROC NVMe RAID 0 sounds nice haha). Proxmox is less likely on my Z8 G4 since I use it mostly to edit. I will do some Proxmox content on my “FMS” Mini Server build - so stay tuned for that one! I also need to get a video out on the Lenovo M920Q - that thing has some potential! I just wish I had got the dual M.2 slot version. Thank you for the detailed message - keep us posted on your finds for the Z8 G4!
Sold 100s if not 1000s of used HP 9000 unix workstations back in the day. Now upgrading my Z800. HP quality has always been great on the high end systems, little else comes close.
Nice. I am late to the workstation field - I use to only know desktops. Sadly I recycled my first computer years ago - Intel 286. That would have made for a cool retro video now haha (I still have it's optical floppy readers and a few ISA expansion cards stashed away in storage). The HP build quality really does stand out from the other competitors. I can appreciate a system that is built to be reliable - because sometimes we just want something that will boot up when needed without issue.
@@racerrrz You should have seen the even older 9000 series from the 80s. The 680x0 based 200 and 300 series with HIL keyboards and HPIB interfaces. We used them on boats for underwater survey and they took a hell of a beating. They could do things even today's computers would struggle with.
Somehow I have no doubt of that. PCBs from that era looked really durable and they outlived their usefulness. I can't say the same for modern hardware as often (I am still sour over my Asus ROG Rampage Extreme 4 mobo frying a capacitor only a few years after ownership). HP workstations have been the exception thus far - they are built to last. I still have a PS/2 keyboard sitting around on a shelf somewhere lol, but I don't recall ever using a HPIB interface, nice. Amazing to think how far technology has come.
Hey, fellow Kiwi I have watched all your videos since 2022. I have 3 x z840 for our Broadcast OB truck. I am ready for the upgrade found myself a z8 g4 on trademe (Not from the usual seller). Im replacing the current cpu for Xeon Gold 6240 x 2. Look forward to more videos on this beast.
Thank you for the support. Nice, the Z840's are troopers - and I need to do an update video on them to get the Windows 11 upgrade process outlined (yes it seems the Z840 will live on beyond Windows 10!). That's funny, I actually saw that Trademe listing (some damage on the rear panel right?) and noticed this morning it vanished. It was well loaded for the price - well done. I am working on the Z8 G4's CPU guide and it's making good strides. I need to fast track it for you!
How is that system running? I forgot which CPUs it came supplied with but the Gold 6240's are solid. I presume you have obtained a torque wrench for the job? Did you manage to get the second CPU cooler and CPU carrier? Which thermal paste are going with? I found that the CPU carrier is not absolutely needed but it does help with fitment of these rather large CPUs.
I am running 6 modules of 16GB DDR4 2666MHz ECC Reg at the moment - but I will eventually upgrade to 4 modules of 64GB DDR4 2933Y ECC Reg (but I would like more - why are these still so expensive lol).
Using Rufus, you can install Windows 11 as a FRESH install on almost any old hardware, as Rufus removes the TPM and RAM limitation requirement by W11, just make certain you have all your data backed up, so it isn't an UPGRADE, it is a fresh install, which is different. :)
I need to test this out! I had in mind the Z8 G4 was quite fussy on OS security. I wasn't able to use my previous installation of Win 10 that I had on my Z840 (it refused to detect the drive with the OS - but it worked fine in other systems). This may also work as a quick way to get Win 11 onto a Z840. Thanks for sharing.
I recall something of the sort, plus the USB port that you use can change detection also. A USB 3.0 might be a challenge - I think I mostly only have USB 3.1 and USB 3.2 (that are of decent capacity). But I do need to get my self upgraded to Windows 11 - I'll end up leaving it to the last minute.lol
@@racerrrz Be persistent! I successfully installed Windows 11 on an HP T620 thin client. I have many of them spread around the house, and I use them as terminals with Remote Desktop to connect to a Lenovo E32 running Windows 11. You can also get dirt cheap legit Windows 11 license keys from Gamers-Outlet for around $5
Cost of living crisis and all that. The power bill isn't far from truthful (cries internally haha). I am just glad my CPUs are only 150W TDP. I imagine dual 205W Xeons with 24 memory modules will consume a power plant, annually.
I bought this workstation on FB Marketplace for $100 with one Bronze 6 core CPU and 16GB of ram.. no HD or graphics (but that was ok because I had that), I bought two 20-core CPU at $80 each, the 6148 Gold / and added another 16GB of ram ... so now rocking 40 physical codes with extra ram for about $300 so far in / I love this workstation, I also have the Z800 which I got for free and still works on Windows 10 // the end of life don't concern me at all, I can always load up Linux on it, cheers - great machines!!!
How you managed to get a Z8 G4 for $100 I have no idea and you may not see that price again for at least a decade! So a steal - well done! Great choice with the Gold 6148s. For the price point you get a massive 40 cores and 80 threads. Add in Linux and you have a beast. What are your future plans for the system?
@@racerrrz don't know some dude was selling it, he wanted a gaming machine... I am running Win 11 Pro on it, so it sees both processors.... Currently, I edit some video and play some games and do some stats on R, which runs super fast, puts my work machine to shame. I tell no body that I do my work on it, and finish super fast, haha I also have the Z800 and that has 2 CPUs of older Xeon and still a great workstation too, running 10 Pro.
No complains there then, you obtained an absolute beast that can be upgraded to handle some fairly intensive workloads. They game well enough - I get to enjoy 4K 60FPS in most games while using the Gold 6142's. I will keep an eye on prices for the Cascade Lake Xeons - if I can get more cores with higher clock speeds and faster RAM I will be satisfied for a while yet. The Z800 is getting along in the years but with their hardware prices being so low you can get a system up with the top spec CPUs for a half decent price. They still work well as home servers too.
@@racerrrz i got the Z800 for free, some guy was giving it away on FB Marketplace, so no complaints at all (came with one cpu and added the 2nd cheap, don't even remember what it is anymore as my attention has shifted in using my Z8), and i can later turn it into maybe like a NAS server running FreeBSD. my graphics card is only a 1080 on the Z8 so later want to get better graphics card...
Sorry I didn't get notified of your reply. Nice, a free Z800 gives you room to push it to the limit without worry, no initial investment haha. I think converting a Z800 to a home server is ideal - you could load it up with different OS depending on your needs. Add in some VMs and you have everything running from one system. The GTX 1080 remains a hero card - I would use it until it fails haha.
I haven't had the need just yet but it is nice to know that there are some aftermarket offerings. The Noctua NH-U14S DX-3647 should be a solid performer. I imagine clearance might be an issue but given the lack of a complicated CPU fan shroud on these systems it may well be quite feasible to upgrade. I have kept my system on the lowest fan speed setting and I suspect that will need to increase with more power hungry CPUs. What I will add is that HP normally designs a custom set of high performance coolers but on the Z8 G4 there was no such offering. That either means it was never required (assuming the stock cooler is highly efficient) or it was too much work to design two unique coolers due to the socket designs on the LGA 3647 lineup. As for which is the best way to go I am not sure but what I can say is that my Gold 6142's with stock thermal paste routinely reached 95'C which is too high. Faster fan speeds should negate that issue but at a higher BIOS setting the system's noise increases a lot.
They are hard to find. I was looking for two years before I landed on one, but I would hope they will become more available as more individuals switch to the HP Z8 G5. Keep an eye on your local market places - they will come up (a good price might be hard to find though).
You can complete a RAID for any storage devices in your system and you are in luck because I just released a video guide on how to do this: th-cam.com/video/NzncGJJV5qk/w-d-xo.html Your RAID configuration would need to be matched with your end-purpose. I use RAID 0 stripe for transfer speed with NVMes, RAID 1 Mirror for SSDs and HDDs for critical data and RAID 5 for long term storage of critical data.
Sorry about the delay. The video description had a link right down the bottom to our Reddit page which has the CPU Mega List pinned but it can be found under my TH-cam posts also. I have adjusted the video description link to go directly to the CPU list instead. The direct links: www.reddit.com/r/HSpecWorkstations/comments/19b4jdy/intel_xeon_cpu_mega_list/ th-cam.com/users/postUgkxinbLescQdmrqtvl7VzO2DW8Eaysrn3QH It has a half decent hit rate on Google search under "Intel Xeon CPU Mega List". The list includes my selection of the most ideal CPUs (for the HP workstations in particular) and includes: Intel Xeon Legacy, Sandy Bridge, Ivy Bridge, Haswell, Broadwell, Skylake and Cascade Lake. I'll still refine the presentation of it once I get my website all finished up. Enjoy.
I had two Xeon silver 4116 processors in mine and it was running a bit shoddy and was even giving me some audio issues. Took one of the cpus out and it has been running a heck of a lot smoother without audio issues. I am wondering if I were to upgrade cpu, would sticking with a single cpu be better in my use case (homelab, gaming, etc)?
Your issue with dual CPUs was quite strange. I have not had any issues with dual CPUs in any of my HP workstations. Maybe the socket had a bent pin or the CPU had some damage? If you aren't able to confirm that both sockets are fully functional you will likely be better off spending on a powerful single CPU. I haven't been able to confirm this but I do suspect the Intel Xeon W's with LGA 3647 socket will support single socket operation in the HP Z8 G4. My pick would be the Intel Xeon W-3245M on price point. This CPU is supported by the HP Z6 G4 and since these systems share the same BIOS I would expect the same CPUs to be listed in the BIOS CPU registry. The only snag is that I have found no HP Z8 G4 systems online with a Intel Xeon W CPU fitted - so maybe it doesn't work. The safe choice is still a solid Xeon Gold or Platinum CPU. High clock speeds should be fine for your applications - so aim for the highest clock speed CPU your budget allows.
Nice system!💪 I'll be looking to upgrade mine based on the guidance here. Currently have 2 x xeon gold 6132 with 128 GB 2666 MHz RAM and (previously) a NVIDIA 2080
@@DanLaRussa Solid setups that you guys have. Nice call on the CPUs - Gen 1 CPUs are the way to go for now. I really wish the Cascade Lake CPUs were a little less pricey already but they remain a steep item. Just to restress a key detail, CPU listings often make amazing claims for really low prices. If you see a Cascade Lake CPU for less than $350 USD it is likely a fake (most likely a Skylake CPU). Make sure the listing has a real photo of the CPU (check for the model name) and check for "Cascade Lake" in the HWiNFO screen shots etc. GPU wise, there may be a substantial bottleneck with the more modern GPUs (e.g. RTX 5090, RTX 4090 etc.). I still think it would be worth it, a severely limited RTX 4090 is still better than a RTX 20xx or RTX 30xx. I would place the Dual M.2 NVMe modules high on the upgrade list since they are relatively cheap. 5.25" bay storage adapters are also useful and there are a heap lined up for the Z8 G4.
The Z4 G8 (Z4 G4?) is quite capable and they can be sourced for a much better price point. Enjoy the Z4 first then save up a heap before making the shift. Dual CPU is cooler and worth the money, hopefully lol. I have had really good service from mine thus far, satisfied with the performance.
That's good to know - I was expecting a non-boot condition due to BIOS not catering for them, but there may be some exceptions! I should really have book-marked all the forums I read on the topic to add in as reference but the conclusion I drew was that the Z6 G4 and Z8 G4 lack the appropriate motherboard hardware to power CPUs over 205W (technical reason: CPUs with TDP=240W require TDC=255A and need a VRM controller with ICC_MAX = 255A, the Z6 G4 and Z8 G4 are limited to TDP=205W, TDC=228A, ICC_MAX = 228A to the best of what I recall). A quick couple of links for support: forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/vrm-modify-icc_max-to-run-high-tdc-tdp-oem-processors.38686/page-4 forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/es-xeon-discussion.5031/page-130#post-379664
@@racerrrz according to the OP these machines have a 5 phase vrm well 4+1 and he says its not recommended however a good set of copper heatsinks and faster fans should help . me or you could send a picture of the baord so we can find the chip we must flash
I really hate HP, they actually force you to use HP ram if you want max performance. I had a couple of HP servers and if you had Samsung ram it would run it a 1866Mhz instead of 2400mhz, even if the ram model had a slight different model number, ie, last couple of letters. I moved to Dell T430 and R730 I'm able to run at 2400mhz different ram models and different capacity.
Ah yes, the RAM brand lockout. I haven't spent $$ to investigate the extent of this issue, and I tend to only buy Samsung modules to avoid this risk. It really hits you in the pocket when your new modules fail to detect. I find the HP workstations have a higher build quality than the Dell or Lenovo workstations, but for the price difference and increased upgrade flexibility it sure does make sense to use a Precision or Thinkstation. What I liked about the Z8 G4 was the PSU output - 1700W opens up a wealth of potential upgrades.
I am configuring x2 with Gold 6146 really hot temperature. I often hang, freeze. The screen still displays but the whole system does not respond I have to press the Power button to turn it off. Is this because the temperature is too high? The CPU cooling system of HP Z8 G4 is really bad. I now only dare to set Power Plan to Balanced to avoid freeze
That doesn't sound good but I would tend to agree - in my opinion the fan ram speeds are too delayed, but I would like to think the cooling system can be effective. What is the condition of your CPU thermal paste? When the paste dries out due to the run-out effect it exposes patches of the IHS that are not making good contact with the cooler - leading to a high temp condition under load. I replaced my HP supplied thermal paste with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and saw a reduction of 5'C in peak temperatures (so 95'C to 90'C - which is still too high). The other option is to increase your base system fan speeds in the BIOS (with the caveat of increased noise).
@@racerrrz I also don't know what kind of thermal paste they use at the store. (I think they used Snowman) Also, I use the Perc H710P Raid Card and it's too hot. I used an external fan to blow into the Case My problem is that when the temperature is high, the system doesn't shut down or reduce the clock speed, but it freezes. I'm not sure if it's because the CPU is overloaded or because some of my components are not working properly. In your experience, what causes the freeze?
@@danthanhtrung In my experience, nine times out of 10 a freeze is caused by software issues instead of hardware issues. That should be fairly easy to test - take a new SSD or NVMe drive - install the same OS and see if you can recreate the freeze. If not - then your current OS may have picked up a driver conflict etc. (talking software issues - insert Crowdstrike Windows blue screen of death reference here - ouch - but that proves the point - usually software that's to blame). I had a similar issue with heat on my 10GbE NIC PCIe adapter. I installed a 90mm fan that was inside the case (secured with zip ties) to blow air across the PCIe lanes. That resolved the overheating PCIe card issue. You could do the same - but it's not really needed in the Z8 G4 since it has two 90mm fans in the lower bay already - so it should in theory keep the card cool. What would be really handy is some datalogging of your system's performance. The best software for that is HWiNFO. You could use that to log your system temperatures and workload to check under what conditions the system freezes (although I am not certain that the datalog will work if the system crashes - it may not store the log file). You could at least check all your hardware sensors to check for abnormal temperatures. On my Z8 G4 my CPUs are ~ 60'C at rest (90'C full load), RAM ~ 42'C at rest (50'C full load), GPU ~ 55'C at rest (65'C full load), NVMes ~ 40'C at rest (55'C full load).
@@racerrrz I tried everything you suggested before (I have experience with HP from Z800, Z820, Z840 and now Z8 G4 so I can say I am an advanced user) 1. Windows 10 Pro for Workstation newly installed 2. SSD I bought new Samsung 970 Plus 2TB to replace the previous WD SN740 nvme 256GB 3. Temperature monitoring with CSV log of HWiNFor64 for DTS temperature for CPU and GPU (All are below 85 degrees) 4. I removed all Raid Card and 2nd SSD leaving only Video Card Nvidia A4000 and Samsung 970 Evo 5. Ram swapped, I only have 4 total 16GB sticks, instead of running 4, I run 2x16 to 32GB (and swapped in combination) Result still freezing... Looking at the temperature of HWiNFor64, it is around 80 slightly (Maybe in that case HWiNFor64 does not update correctly Realtime) 6. BIOS latest update v02.94 7. Windows to power plan is Utimate Perfomance And the result is still freezing as usual when the temperature is above 90 degrees with the power plan is Utimate Perfomance (What I know is that high temperature CPU will reduce clock, or suddenly power off, but mine is freezing, all fans are still spinning and can not receive any response from the computer by external devices. I only except pressing the Power key to turn off the power and restart after 15-30 seconds) Currently I only leave it at Hight Perfomance and do not dare to leave Utimate Perfomnance, everything works well and nothing happens, I have tried for more than 2 days the time up is still at the load as I tried with Utimate Perfomance All the above factors I eliminate software, and only related to hardware. The main problem is that I cannot identify which part is faulty to exchange for the supplier, because I buy components from many different suppliers. The only thing I run is Android virtual machine LDPlayer about 4-5 virtual machines, the configuration I set 2CPU - 4GB ram If I chose windows in Balanced or Hight Performance power state, there is almost no problem. All my components are warranted for 12 months and I cannot know where the fault is to receive this warranty.
Sorry about the delay. Thank you for the detailed response. Eliminating the possibility of the OS being the cause really hammers down on one hardware component that’s causing the issue. Given that the issue can be simulated only when using Ultimate Performance mode that would it suggest that under high the Ultimate performance mode there is a hardware component that is unable to keep up with power demands. Looking at HP published information regarding what changes occur between each mode, the following settings are adjusted: CPU power limits • GPU power limits (where applicable) • System power limits • Thermal limits • Fan control settings and acoustics (doc link: h20195.www2.hp.com/v2/GetDocument.aspx?docname=4AA8-2411ENW ). Which CPUs do you have in your system? It could be that they are not compatible with the ultimate performance mode (e.g. processor voltages exceeding the ideal range - but I wouldn’t expect that to be an issue with HP). Why do you require Ultimate performance mode? Could you attain higher efficiency by retaining performance mode but upgrading your current hardware? The only way to establish which component is at fault is to test the system in Ultimate performance mode with each hardware component switched out during test runs. I would start with the CPUs, but that would not be easy to just switch out!
z8 g4 2x6140 88gb ram, mem slot 5 is not coming up, 43tb 7 drives p400. I just 7ziped 4tb. I was processor bottle necked. 7zip only uses one processor took about a day.
Unfortunately there are many software packages that are just not optimized to use all of the cores on offer in these systems. I run into similar bottlenecks in DaVinci Resolve where certain functions are only coded to use one core, really frustrating. If you are doing frequent compression and decompression it could be worth getting a modern CPU to handle that task. A 4 core - 8 core modern CPU would do well for that. For a quick benchmark comparison of some of the popular CPUs: openbenchmarking.org/test/pts/compress-7zip-1.11.0
@@racerrrz LOL, you get what you pay for. I paid 35 dollars for that 6140. The media for the backup is old sas 4tb with a write speed of about 75Mbs. It would cost me a grand to bottle neck on the drive with a pair of 8260Ls. This machine is a wonderful upgrade from my z820 for under a grand. Thanks for the review, I'm looking forward to tubo z drive content.
Ah that makes sense. I wonder to what degree your bottleneck could be lifted if you replaced the SAS drive with a NVMe RAID 0 pool. Z8 G4 would be a massive upgrade over the Z820 - but yes, the Z820 still is a fantastic machine for the price point. I presume you have seen my related videos on the HP Z Turbo Drive Quad Pro (th-cam.com/video/umLcRS05nAk/w-d-xo.html) and the 4 Quad NVMe adapter shootout (th-cam.com/video/xqg0uQ93KTg/w-d-xo.html). I am working on a quick RAID 0 upgrade for the Personality Module in the Z8 G4 - so we will see how that performs. The only snag at the moment is flash storage pricing - ouch! My Asus Hyper M.2 V2 actually netted some solid speeds in the Z8 G4 - 12k MB/s read and 9.5k MB/s write (RAID 0 pool of 4x 2TB Adata Legend 800's).
@@westcovinadodge For the price point it gives great performance. The Z Turbo Drive will make for a solid addition to the Z8 G4. I have managed solid RAID 0 speeds of ~12k MB/s read and 9.5k MB/s write with the Asus Hyper M.2 V2 in the Z8 G4. I have a quick video planned for RAID 0 on the personality module also. In case you haven't seen these, I have done overviews on the HP Z Turbo Drive Quad Pro and an overview of 3 other Quad NVMe adapters (testing was done on the Z840). th-cam.com/video/umLcRS05nAk/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/xqg0uQ93KTg/w-d-xo.html
It seems to be a recurring issue with these gaming GPUs. My case is open over the PCIe chamber to avoid placing stress on the 12VHPWR plug. It's really a design issue to have the cable exit towards the lid, but maybe they assume most systems have GPU risers. I did purchase 12VHPWR to 3x 8-pin angled converters which should clear this issue but after reading about the cable mod 12VHPWR adapter issues (good overview: th-cam.com/video/B8nJobY1SGM/w-d-xo.html), I wasn't sure if the Aliexpress converters would be wise.lol
@@racerrrz I do admit you really are making me want one of those. Or buy a new high dollar new xeon scalable Mb and an engineering cpu sample. Then build around that with my own case and everything else. I think it will cost more yet will be DDR5 and just newer hardware. Since the CPU you can get for so cheap.
@@feelsbad1193 It makes no sense to me because the majority of the consumer base run their GPU in PCIe slots. But then the 12VHPWR connector it self has been a bit of a let down - so I guess two negatives make a .... very negative situation lol.
@@feelsbad1193 It's a fine balance between modern systems and these aged Z8 G4's. I would say it really just depends on what you are doing on these. If you need cores and aren't fully reliant on high clock speeds then the Z8 G4 is king on the value front. But if you need fast single core CPU processing then modern systems will be far superior. I wish software was better optimised to use multicore - I often stand amazed when I experience lag because 1 core is at 100% and the other 31 cores are at idle... lol. It's like letting a V12 breath through a straw.
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Awesome review! Thanks for pulling the video details together!
Thank you for the feedback. No trouble! It's a handy resource and the HP Z8 G4 is only just entering its value proposition phase - so many will benefit from this information.
This video took a long time to compile. It's not that the Z8 G4 can't render long videos efficiently - it's that my editing motivation is inversely proportional to video length.lol
Hey,
Cheers from a fellow helmet wearer 🙂 from from the opposite part of the world (Sweden).
At long last, a video in depth about the Z8G4. THANKS!
Make more. Please!!! I promise to watch.
I've seen some of your informative posts on forums, so I definitely have been looking forward to this one. Thanks.
With Z8G4 I saw, for the first time in 10 years or more, a possibility for me to get a decently modern WS without being ruined... So, finally I went for it.
Anyway, I got mine late 2023 from Italy with 192GB 2666 RAM and the first thing that really surprised me was the weight. More than the luggage that airlines allows as standard (20kg).
I upgraded my CPUs from sluggish silver to gold with dual 6148, Radeon RX6950XT, HP turbo cards for the 2 PCI special slots with 2 nvme in each card, in the 3 bays I got 2,5 SATA drives, HP TB3 card, WiFi/BT-card, 2,5 GB Ethernet card and now I'm testing a 2nd video card (AMD WX7100) since I want to test Proxmox with multiple OS with passthrough. Oh, and I replaced the HP writer with a more modern BluRay rider and DVD writer.
In short: I got no PCIE free anymore... And (as far as I know) I got 3 free SATA connector slots and a free 5,25 slot
I also tested to have NVME on PCIE but got corruption and that was the signal for me to get the HP Turbo cards. I looked at a 4X solution like the 3 models you tested in one of your videos, but stopped since I knew my PCIE slots would be occupied. I got great help and insight about the jumpers for the turbo cards on the HP forum for WS.
The AMD 6950 GPU isn't as wide as the 4090 but it covers 2 precious 16X slots gets anyway (3 16X gets lost in total for me) and I've watched your video from your previous WS where you tested different raiser cables. But keeping the silent cover with some sort of double tape solution or zippers would be difficult on the Z8, so I passed.
I really wanted the keep the silent cover over the PCIE and finally I did the unthinkable: I got rid of some plastic (with dremel) on the inside of the cover in order for the 6950 graphic card to not hit the cover when it was mounted. It's mounted since yesterday! Finally, the cover is mounted again. It took me 6 months to get the guts, but who is counting?...
I'm thinking about Platinum as the upgrade for the CPU but the prices are still stupid (and that for ES models) so I keep my eyes out and will look into your spreadsheet. Thanks for publishing it. And thanks for sharing info about the 205 limit, that one I haven't read or heard before.
On your system I noticed that you got the premium I/O on the front while I have the "standard" one... Upgrading it was on my to do until I realized I had to get a cable that wasn't shipped with the front, so I passed. For now.
And yes, I'm interested to know about those air filters too. None came with my system.
And please tell how you managed to get that 4 bay in the front to work. I only found 3 free SATA slots and have postponed to install that one on mine for the time being.
You don't have the amount of subscribers you should have IMHO and I think it has to do with the fact that your voice is muffled. I know since I've heard I also sound muffled when I'm wearing a motorcycle helmet with a BT solution added or built in. You do as you wish of course, but the things you did on older systems and now with the Z8 is very insightful and interesting. I just wish for you to get the credit and kudos you should have. It takes time to do the things you did on this one, record it, edit it and polish it.
Yes, I do some video editing too. I just want you to know how appreciated it is for some of us.
Anyway, keep those videos of yours coming. Now I'm more interested than ever.
What will come next:
Dust filter?
How SATA connects to your 4 bay in the 5,25 bay with the 3 in bay already connected?
Memory comparisson between 2666 and 2933?
How to use raiser cable for those of us that don't have any free PCIE slots anymore?
Settings in BIOS (I've got weird results trying different BIOS UEFI choices)?
Usage of VROC?
Setting up of Proxmox and what to think about?
Yupp, I'm sure looking forward for the next one.
Cheers and many thanks for now!
Thank you for your message and support!
Sometimes I wonder if I should just ditch the channel theme and go without the helmet, but the channel was inspired by an idea that hit me while sim racing and I have stuck with it - I am stubborn like that. A muffled voice is definitely an issue - and I need to compensate for that in post. (DaVinci has incredible audio editing). Raising the visor has helped a little and using a shotgun mic. has also helped. With the visor up the sound is decent enough by my ear but it could still improve.
This project has been a time and energy sink but it should be a solid resource for years to come. I believe the Z8 G4 is stepping up as the Z840’s replacement right about now and hardware prices are beginning to reflect that (E5-2697A V4’s are only marginally cheaper than Gold 6142’s - despite being ~3000 points weaker in Passmark benching).
Nice setup! Your system is very well populated. You may want to consider the dual HP 10GbE network module since that will free up one of your PCIe slots (they are still really expensive unfortunately - likely quite rare). These systems are perfect for multiple OS setups, and if anything you could quite literally have 4 capable virtual systems (each VM - 12Cores, 64GB mem, 1x GPU etc.) running from one machine. Nice upgrade with the Blueray reader / DVD writer. I tend to not use them much (it’s one of the first things I remove for more storage if possible lol), but for a media station that would be great value. Output video to a home project and you have movie nights covered.
It's strange that you had issues with NVMes. I have had issues with my old Win 10 NVMe not being detected in this system. I presumed it was a new feature of secureboot - preventing an OS from being switched from another machine. But generally my NVMes have been working fine. I am working on an upgrade - RAID 0 on the M.2 Personality module. It’s just a shame that NAND storage has jumped in price. I had to forfeit NVMe capacity to get that future video content lol.
The riser mod would work - I did have the idea of running a long riser cable that could be rerouted to sit ontop of the GPU backplate - double sided tape etc. Then you could fit certain small PCIe adapters - and it sounds like you would appreciate a SATA/SAS HBA for some extra SATA ports.lol.
Yes, the 205W limit is a major issue and it has caught out many because you don’t always expect a CPU socket to not support a CPU that fits that socket! I caught onto it because of wanting to purchase dual Platinum 8275CL due to going cheap- but they were 240W! The Z8 G4 and Z6 G4 have been limited by their motherboard power delivery components - they lack the amps to support 240W sustained power draw. I do wonder if the 210W CPUs would work (e.g. Platinum 8259CL) - maybe.
At least you can remove that front panel if you need to upgrade - new front I/O or that dust filter! If I can track a dust filter I will consider it, but I would not want to pull that front panel off regularly. It really feels like something that was not meant to be removed - securely fits in place.
Thank you, the subscriber grind is real. The helmet likely holds me back, but I see that as a good thing. I have to rely on improving video content rather than relying on my dashingly good looks haha.
I did have in mind to include the BIOS but I neglected to add that. I only recently got HP Performance Advisor to install correctly on this system - otherwise I would have included more from the BIOS. It’s complicated in there!
A VROC video will be beneficial but I fear the cost of a VROC module is somewhat prohibitive. But I did notice in the BIOS there option is there to setup VROC on most of the PCIe slots - so it will be a really powerful system if implemented right. I can foresee a couple of quad NVMe adapters combining via VROC into a mega RAID 0 pool - just in the name of science (a 16TB VROC NVMe RAID 0 sounds nice haha).
Proxmox is less likely on my Z8 G4 since I use it mostly to edit. I will do some Proxmox content on my “FMS” Mini Server build - so stay tuned for that one! I also need to get a video out on the Lenovo M920Q - that thing has some potential! I just wish I had got the dual M.2 slot version.
Thank you for the detailed message - keep us posted on your finds for the Z8 G4!
Sold 100s if not 1000s of used HP 9000 unix workstations back in the day. Now upgrading my Z800. HP quality has always been great on the high end systems, little else comes close.
Nice. I am late to the workstation field - I use to only know desktops. Sadly I recycled my first computer years ago - Intel 286. That would have made for a cool retro video now haha (I still have it's optical floppy readers and a few ISA expansion cards stashed away in storage).
The HP build quality really does stand out from the other competitors. I can appreciate a system that is built to be reliable - because sometimes we just want something that will boot up when needed without issue.
@@racerrrz You should have seen the even older 9000 series from the 80s. The 680x0 based 200 and 300 series with HIL keyboards and HPIB interfaces. We used them on boats for underwater survey and they took a hell of a beating. They could do things even today's computers would struggle with.
Somehow I have no doubt of that. PCBs from that era looked really durable and they outlived their usefulness. I can't say the same for modern hardware as often (I am still sour over my Asus ROG Rampage Extreme 4 mobo frying a capacitor only a few years after ownership). HP workstations have been the exception thus far - they are built to last. I still have a PS/2 keyboard sitting around on a shelf somewhere lol, but I don't recall ever using a HPIB interface, nice. Amazing to think how far technology has come.
Hey, fellow Kiwi I have watched all your videos since 2022. I have 3 x z840 for our Broadcast OB truck. I am ready for the upgrade found myself a z8 g4 on trademe (Not from the usual seller). Im replacing the current cpu for Xeon Gold 6240 x 2. Look forward to more videos on this beast.
Thank you for the support. Nice, the Z840's are troopers - and I need to do an update video on them to get the Windows 11 upgrade process outlined (yes it seems the Z840 will live on beyond Windows 10!).
That's funny, I actually saw that Trademe listing (some damage on the rear panel right?) and noticed this morning it vanished. It was well loaded for the price - well done. I am working on the Z8 G4's CPU guide and it's making good strides. I need to fast track it for you!
@@racerrrzyes correct i get it tomorrow.🎉
How is that system running? I forgot which CPUs it came supplied with but the Gold 6240's are solid. I presume you have obtained a torque wrench for the job? Did you manage to get the second CPU cooler and CPU carrier? Which thermal paste are going with? I found that the CPU carrier is not absolutely needed but it does help with fitment of these rather large CPUs.
run the memory in 6 channel . it really makes the xeons happy
I am running 6 modules of 16GB DDR4 2666MHz ECC Reg at the moment - but I will eventually upgrade to 4 modules of 64GB DDR4 2933Y ECC Reg (but I would like more - why are these still so expensive lol).
@@racerrrz stay with 6 channels it runs sooo much better
@@amdintelxsniperx what does 6 channels mean? I have 8X 32 ram.. So put them all in one slot vs 3 ea in both slots? Thanks!
Using Rufus, you can install Windows 11 as a FRESH install on almost any old hardware, as Rufus removes the TPM and RAM limitation requirement by W11, just make certain you have all your data backed up, so it isn't an UPGRADE, it is a fresh install, which is different. :)
I need to test this out! I had in mind the Z8 G4 was quite fussy on OS security. I wasn't able to use my previous installation of Win 10 that I had on my Z840 (it refused to detect the drive with the OS - but it worked fine in other systems). This may also work as a quick way to get Win 11 onto a Z840. Thanks for sharing.
@@racerrrzSome HPs are very fussy and don't like USB 3.1 or higher.
Try a USB 3.0 and it should work.
I recall something of the sort, plus the USB port that you use can change detection also. A USB 3.0 might be a challenge - I think I mostly only have USB 3.1 and USB 3.2 (that are of decent capacity). But I do need to get my self upgraded to Windows 11 - I'll end up leaving it to the last minute.lol
@@racerrrz Be persistent! I successfully installed Windows 11 on an HP T620 thin client. I have many of them spread around the house, and I use them as terminals with Remote Desktop to connect to a Lenovo E32 running Windows 11.
You can also get dirt cheap legit Windows 11 license keys from Gamers-Outlet for around $5
That power bill, jeeeezuSS haha.
Cost of living crisis and all that. The power bill isn't far from truthful (cries internally haha). I am just glad my CPUs are only 150W TDP. I imagine dual 205W Xeons with 24 memory modules will consume a power plant, annually.
@@racerrrz nah not much more maybe a couple bucks a lot less then a single 13900k or 14900k
I bought this workstation on FB Marketplace for $100 with one Bronze 6 core CPU and 16GB of ram.. no HD or graphics (but that was ok because I had that), I bought two 20-core CPU at $80 each, the 6148 Gold / and added another 16GB of ram ... so now rocking 40 physical codes with extra ram for about $300 so far in / I love this workstation, I also have the Z800 which I got for free and still works on Windows 10 // the end of life don't concern me at all, I can always load up Linux on it, cheers - great machines!!!
How you managed to get a Z8 G4 for $100 I have no idea and you may not see that price again for at least a decade! So a steal - well done! Great choice with the Gold 6148s. For the price point you get a massive 40 cores and 80 threads. Add in Linux and you have a beast. What are your future plans for the system?
@@racerrrz don't know some dude was selling it, he wanted a gaming machine... I am running Win 11 Pro on it, so it sees both processors.... Currently, I edit some video and play some games and do some stats on R, which runs super fast, puts my work machine to shame. I tell no body that I do my work on it, and finish super fast, haha
I also have the Z800 and that has 2 CPUs of older Xeon and still a great workstation too, running 10 Pro.
No complains there then, you obtained an absolute beast that can be upgraded to handle some fairly intensive workloads. They game well enough - I get to enjoy 4K 60FPS in most games while using the Gold 6142's. I will keep an eye on prices for the Cascade Lake Xeons - if I can get more cores with higher clock speeds and faster RAM I will be satisfied for a while yet. The Z800 is getting along in the years but with their hardware prices being so low you can get a system up with the top spec CPUs for a half decent price. They still work well as home servers too.
@@racerrrz i got the Z800 for free, some guy was giving it away on FB Marketplace, so no complaints at all (came with one cpu and added the 2nd cheap, don't even remember what it is anymore as my attention has shifted in using my Z8), and i can later turn it into maybe like a NAS server running FreeBSD. my graphics card is only a 1080 on the Z8 so later want to get better graphics card...
Sorry I didn't get notified of your reply. Nice, a free Z800 gives you room to push it to the limit without worry, no initial investment haha. I think converting a Z800 to a home server is ideal - you could load it up with different OS depending on your needs. Add in some VMs and you have everything running from one system. The GTX 1080 remains a hero card - I would use it until it fails haha.
Have you considered aftermarket CPU cooler? I’ve seen Noctua and Dynatron but unsure on performance vs stock
I haven't had the need just yet but it is nice to know that there are some aftermarket offerings. The Noctua NH-U14S DX-3647 should be a solid performer. I imagine clearance might be an issue but given the lack of a complicated CPU fan shroud on these systems it may well be quite feasible to upgrade. I have kept my system on the lowest fan speed setting and I suspect that will need to increase with more power hungry CPUs.
What I will add is that HP normally designs a custom set of high performance coolers but on the Z8 G4 there was no such offering. That either means it was never required (assuming the stock cooler is highly efficient) or it was too much work to design two unique coolers due to the socket designs on the LGA 3647 lineup.
As for which is the best way to go I am not sure but what I can say is that my Gold 6142's with stock thermal paste routinely reached 95'C which is too high. Faster fan speeds should negate that issue but at a higher BIOS setting the system's noise increases a lot.
def keeping a eye out on a cheap one cant find in aus for a good price
They are hard to find. I was looking for two years before I landed on one, but I would hope they will become more available as more individuals switch to the HP Z8 G5. Keep an eye on your local market places - they will come up (a good price might be hard to find though).
So raid is only for non-ssd or is raid possible with SSD personality modules? Or can you make video on how to set this up? Thanks!
You can complete a RAID for any storage devices in your system and you are in luck because I just released a video guide on how to do this: th-cam.com/video/NzncGJJV5qk/w-d-xo.html
Your RAID configuration would need to be matched with your end-purpose. I use RAID 0 stripe for transfer speed with NVMes, RAID 1 Mirror for SSDs and HDDs for critical data and RAID 5 for long term storage of critical data.
Just upgraded my Z8 from dual Xeon Gold 6128 to 6144.
Nice, the Gold 6144's are great with their high boost clock speeds. How do they handle gaming? Solid performance for the price point also.
Maybe i'm missing it in the description, but where's that lovely spreadsheet link?
Your right where is the link ?
Sorry about the delay. The video description had a link right down the bottom to our Reddit page which has the CPU Mega List pinned but it can be found under my TH-cam posts also. I have adjusted the video description link to go directly to the CPU list instead.
The direct links:
www.reddit.com/r/HSpecWorkstations/comments/19b4jdy/intel_xeon_cpu_mega_list/
th-cam.com/users/postUgkxinbLescQdmrqtvl7VzO2DW8Eaysrn3QH
It has a half decent hit rate on Google search under "Intel Xeon CPU Mega List".
The list includes my selection of the most ideal CPUs (for the HP workstations in particular) and includes:
Intel Xeon Legacy, Sandy Bridge, Ivy Bridge, Haswell, Broadwell, Skylake and Cascade Lake.
I'll still refine the presentation of it once I get my website all finished up.
Enjoy.
I had two Xeon silver 4116 processors in mine and it was running a bit shoddy and was even giving me some audio issues. Took one of the cpus out and it has been running a heck of a lot smoother without audio issues. I am wondering if I were to upgrade cpu, would sticking with a single cpu be better in my use case (homelab, gaming, etc)?
Your issue with dual CPUs was quite strange. I have not had any issues with dual CPUs in any of my HP workstations. Maybe the socket had a bent pin or the CPU had some damage? If you aren't able to confirm that both sockets are fully functional you will likely be better off spending on a powerful single CPU.
I haven't been able to confirm this but I do suspect the Intel Xeon W's with LGA 3647 socket will support single socket operation in the HP Z8 G4. My pick would be the Intel Xeon W-3245M on price point. This CPU is supported by the HP Z6 G4 and since these systems share the same BIOS I would expect the same CPUs to be listed in the BIOS CPU registry. The only snag is that I have found no HP Z8 G4 systems online with a Intel Xeon W CPU fitted - so maybe it doesn't work.
The safe choice is still a solid Xeon Gold or Platinum CPU. High clock speeds should be fine for your applications - so aim for the highest clock speed CPU your budget allows.
mines loaded with 384 gb ram dual xeon gold 6138p rtx 4070ti and a radeon pro ssg
Nice system!💪 I'll be looking to upgrade mine based on the guidance here. Currently have 2 x xeon gold 6132 with 128 GB 2666 MHz RAM and (previously) a NVIDIA 2080
@@DanLaRussa Solid setups that you guys have. Nice call on the CPUs - Gen 1 CPUs are the way to go for now. I really wish the Cascade Lake CPUs were a little less pricey already but they remain a steep item. Just to restress a key detail, CPU listings often make amazing claims for really low prices. If you see a Cascade Lake CPU for less than $350 USD it is likely a fake (most likely a Skylake CPU). Make sure the listing has a real photo of the CPU (check for the model name) and check for "Cascade Lake" in the HWiNFO screen shots etc.
GPU wise, there may be a substantial bottleneck with the more modern GPUs (e.g. RTX 5090, RTX 4090 etc.). I still think it would be worth it, a severely limited RTX 4090 is still better than a RTX 20xx or RTX 30xx. I would place the Dual M.2 NVMe modules high on the upgrade list since they are relatively cheap. 5.25" bay storage adapters are also useful and there are a heap lined up for the Z8 G4.
Son of a... I thought this was about the Z4G8 that I'm running for a minute and now I have to spend more money... Ugh. Thanks.
The Z4 G8 (Z4 G4?) is quite capable and they can be sourced for a much better price point. Enjoy the Z4 first then save up a heap before making the shift. Dual CPU is cooler and worth the money, hopefully lol. I have had really good service from mine thus far, satisfied with the performance.
these can boot with 240 watt cpus howerver ..... they power throttle and wont turbo so yes you are right 205 is the way to go
That's good to know - I was expecting a non-boot condition due to BIOS not catering for them, but there may be some exceptions!
I should really have book-marked all the forums I read on the topic to add in as reference but the conclusion I drew was that the Z6 G4 and Z8 G4 lack the appropriate motherboard hardware to power CPUs over 205W (technical reason: CPUs with TDP=240W require TDC=255A and need a VRM controller with ICC_MAX = 255A, the Z6 G4 and Z8 G4 are limited to TDP=205W, TDC=228A, ICC_MAX = 228A to the best of what I recall).
A quick couple of links for support:
forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/vrm-modify-icc_max-to-run-high-tdc-tdp-oem-processors.38686/page-4
forums.servethehome.com/index.php?threads/es-xeon-discussion.5031/page-130#post-379664
@@racerrrz according to the OP these machines have a 5 phase vrm well 4+1 and he says its not recommended however a good set of copper heatsinks and faster fans should help . me or you could send a picture of the baord so we can find the chip we must flash
I really hate HP, they actually force you to use HP ram if you want max performance. I had a couple of HP servers and if you had Samsung ram it would run it a 1866Mhz instead of 2400mhz, even if the ram model had a slight different model number, ie, last couple of letters.
I moved to Dell T430 and R730 I'm able to run at 2400mhz different ram models and different capacity.
Ah yes, the RAM brand lockout. I haven't spent $$ to investigate the extent of this issue, and I tend to only buy Samsung modules to avoid this risk. It really hits you in the pocket when your new modules fail to detect. I find the HP workstations have a higher build quality than the Dell or Lenovo workstations, but for the price difference and increased upgrade flexibility it sure does make sense to use a Precision or Thinkstation. What I liked about the Z8 G4 was the PSU output - 1700W opens up a wealth of potential upgrades.
I am configuring x2 with Gold 6146 really hot temperature.
I often hang, freeze. The screen still displays but the whole system does not respond I have to press the Power button to turn it off.
Is this because the temperature is too high? The CPU cooling system of HP Z8 G4 is really bad.
I now only dare to set Power Plan to Balanced to avoid freeze
That doesn't sound good but I would tend to agree - in my opinion the fan ram speeds are too delayed, but I would like to think the cooling system can be effective.
What is the condition of your CPU thermal paste? When the paste dries out due to the run-out effect it exposes patches of the IHS that are not making good contact with the cooler - leading to a high temp condition under load. I replaced my HP supplied thermal paste with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and saw a reduction of 5'C in peak temperatures (so 95'C to 90'C - which is still too high). The other option is to increase your base system fan speeds in the BIOS (with the caveat of increased noise).
@@racerrrz I also don't know what kind of thermal paste they use at the store. (I think they used Snowman)
Also, I use the Perc H710P Raid Card and it's too hot.
I used an external fan to blow into the Case
My problem is that when the temperature is high, the system doesn't shut down or reduce the clock speed, but it freezes. I'm not sure if it's because the CPU is overloaded or because some of my components are not working properly.
In your experience, what causes the freeze?
@@danthanhtrung In my experience, nine times out of 10 a freeze is caused by software issues instead of hardware issues. That should be fairly easy to test - take a new SSD or NVMe drive - install the same OS and see if you can recreate the freeze. If not - then your current OS may have picked up a driver conflict etc. (talking software issues - insert Crowdstrike Windows blue screen of death reference here - ouch - but that proves the point - usually software that's to blame).
I had a similar issue with heat on my 10GbE NIC PCIe adapter. I installed a 90mm fan that was inside the case (secured with zip ties) to blow air across the PCIe lanes. That resolved the overheating PCIe card issue. You could do the same - but it's not really needed in the Z8 G4 since it has two 90mm fans in the lower bay already - so it should in theory keep the card cool.
What would be really handy is some datalogging of your system's performance. The best software for that is HWiNFO. You could use that to log your system temperatures and workload to check under what conditions the system freezes (although I am not certain that the datalog will work if the system crashes - it may not store the log file). You could at least check all your hardware sensors to check for abnormal temperatures. On my Z8 G4 my CPUs are ~ 60'C at rest (90'C full load), RAM ~ 42'C at rest (50'C full load), GPU ~ 55'C at rest (65'C full load), NVMes ~ 40'C at rest (55'C full load).
@@racerrrz I tried everything you suggested before (I have experience with HP from Z800, Z820, Z840 and now Z8 G4 so I can say I am an advanced user)
1. Windows 10 Pro for Workstation newly installed
2. SSD I bought new Samsung 970 Plus 2TB to replace the previous WD SN740 nvme 256GB
3. Temperature monitoring with CSV log of HWiNFor64 for DTS temperature for CPU and GPU (All are below 85 degrees)
4. I removed all Raid Card and 2nd SSD leaving only Video Card Nvidia A4000 and Samsung 970 Evo
5. Ram swapped, I only have 4 total 16GB sticks, instead of running 4, I run 2x16 to 32GB (and swapped in combination)
Result still freezing... Looking at the temperature of HWiNFor64, it is around 80 slightly (Maybe in that case HWiNFor64 does not update correctly Realtime)
6. BIOS latest update v02.94
7. Windows to power plan is Utimate Perfomance
And the result is still freezing as usual when the temperature is above 90 degrees with the power plan is Utimate Perfomance (What I know is that high temperature CPU will reduce clock, or suddenly power off, but mine is freezing, all fans are still spinning and can not receive any response from the computer by external devices. I only except pressing the Power key to turn off the power and restart after 15-30 seconds)
Currently I only leave it at Hight Perfomance and do not dare to leave Utimate Perfomnance, everything works well and nothing happens, I have tried for more than 2 days the time up is still at the load as I tried with Utimate Perfomance
All the above factors I eliminate software, and only related to hardware.
The main problem is that I cannot identify which part is faulty to exchange for the supplier, because I buy components from many different suppliers.
The only thing I run is Android virtual machine LDPlayer about 4-5 virtual machines, the configuration I set 2CPU - 4GB ram
If I chose windows in Balanced or Hight Performance power state, there is almost no problem.
All my components are warranted for 12 months and I cannot know where the fault is to receive this warranty.
Sorry about the delay. Thank you for the detailed response. Eliminating the possibility of the OS being the cause really hammers down on one hardware component that’s causing the issue. Given that the issue can be simulated only when using Ultimate Performance mode that would it suggest that under high the Ultimate performance mode there is a hardware component that is unable to keep up with power demands. Looking at HP published information regarding what changes occur between each mode, the following settings are adjusted: CPU power limits • GPU power limits (where applicable) • System power limits • Thermal limits • Fan control settings and acoustics (doc link: h20195.www2.hp.com/v2/GetDocument.aspx?docname=4AA8-2411ENW ).
Which CPUs do you have in your system? It could be that they are not compatible with the ultimate performance mode (e.g. processor voltages exceeding the ideal range - but I wouldn’t expect that to be an issue with HP). Why do you require Ultimate performance mode? Could you attain higher efficiency by retaining performance mode but upgrading your current hardware? The only way to establish which component is at fault is to test the system in Ultimate performance mode with each hardware component switched out during test runs. I would start with the CPUs, but that would not be easy to just switch out!
z8 g4 2x6140 88gb ram, mem slot 5 is not coming up, 43tb 7 drives p400. I just 7ziped 4tb. I was processor bottle necked. 7zip only uses one processor took about a day.
Unfortunately there are many software packages that are just not optimized to use all of the cores on offer in these systems.
I run into similar bottlenecks in DaVinci Resolve where certain functions are only coded to use one core, really frustrating. If you are doing frequent compression and decompression it could be worth getting a modern CPU to handle that task. A 4 core - 8 core modern CPU would do well for that.
For a quick benchmark comparison of some of the popular CPUs: openbenchmarking.org/test/pts/compress-7zip-1.11.0
@@racerrrz LOL, you get what you pay for. I paid 35 dollars for that 6140. The media for the backup is old sas 4tb with a write speed of about 75Mbs. It would cost me a grand to bottle neck on the drive with a pair of 8260Ls. This machine is a wonderful upgrade from my z820 for under a grand. Thanks for the review, I'm looking forward to tubo z drive content.
Ah that makes sense. I wonder to what degree your bottleneck could be lifted if you replaced the SAS drive with a NVMe RAID 0 pool.
Z8 G4 would be a massive upgrade over the Z820 - but yes, the Z820 still is a fantastic machine for the price point. I presume you have seen my related videos on the HP Z Turbo Drive Quad Pro (th-cam.com/video/umLcRS05nAk/w-d-xo.html) and the 4 Quad NVMe adapter shootout (th-cam.com/video/xqg0uQ93KTg/w-d-xo.html). I am working on a quick RAID 0 upgrade for the Personality Module in the Z8 G4 - so we will see how that performs. The only snag at the moment is flash storage pricing - ouch! My Asus Hyper M.2 V2 actually netted some solid speeds in the Z8 G4 - 12k MB/s read and 9.5k MB/s write (RAID 0 pool of 4x 2TB Adata Legend 800's).
@@westcovinadodge For the price point it gives great performance. The Z Turbo Drive will make for a solid addition to the Z8 G4. I have managed solid RAID 0 speeds of ~12k MB/s read and 9.5k MB/s write with the Asus Hyper M.2 V2 in the Z8 G4. I have a quick video planned for RAID 0 on the personality module also.
In case you haven't seen these, I have done overviews on the HP Z Turbo Drive Quad Pro and an overview of 3 other Quad NVMe adapters (testing was done on the Z840).
th-cam.com/video/umLcRS05nAk/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/xqg0uQ93KTg/w-d-xo.html
Can you close the case with that GPU?
It seems to be a recurring issue with these gaming GPUs. My case is open over the PCIe chamber to avoid placing stress on the 12VHPWR plug. It's really a design issue to have the cable exit towards the lid, but maybe they assume most systems have GPU risers. I did purchase 12VHPWR to 3x 8-pin angled converters which should clear this issue but after reading about the cable mod 12VHPWR adapter issues (good overview: th-cam.com/video/B8nJobY1SGM/w-d-xo.html), I wasn't sure if the Aliexpress converters would be wise.lol
@@racerrrz That might be one of the dumbest design in computing have the power cable stick out like that.
@@racerrrz I do admit you really are making me want one of those. Or buy a new high dollar new xeon scalable Mb and an engineering cpu sample. Then build around that with my own case and everything else. I think it will cost more yet will be DDR5 and just newer hardware. Since the CPU you can get for so cheap.
@@feelsbad1193 It makes no sense to me because the majority of the consumer base run their GPU in PCIe slots. But then the 12VHPWR connector it self has been a bit of a let down - so I guess two negatives make a .... very negative situation lol.
@@feelsbad1193 It's a fine balance between modern systems and these aged Z8 G4's. I would say it really just depends on what you are doing on these. If you need cores and aren't fully reliant on high clock speeds then the Z8 G4 is king on the value front. But if you need fast single core CPU processing then modern systems will be far superior. I wish software was better optimised to use multicore - I often stand amazed when I experience lag because 1 core is at 100% and the other 31 cores are at idle... lol. It's like letting a V12 breath through a straw.
HUH?! WHAT?!!
Hi there. I'll need more explanation to be able to clarify. I presume my thumbnail pulled you in by surprise.