Related Videos & Playlists: 🌞 Precolonial & Early Philippine History bit.ly/EarlyPhilippines 🌏 Demystifying Southeast Asia - bit.ly/KnowSoutheastAsia 🔥 ‘Discovery’ & Conquest of the Philippines: bit.ly/DiscoveringPH
I just realized I published this video exactly on the 453rd anniversary of the official establishment of the colonial province of “La Pampanga” (December 11, 1571) which is also considered to the official date when the Kingdom of Luzon 🇲🇱 fell to the Spaniards 🇪🇸
I'm kind of miffed that they based it on Thailand rather than Maritime SEA. Maybe they can take inspiration from the diplomatic and political actions of the Thai monarchy during the era of colonialism and imperialism, but basing the architecture (and other social systems maybe) with Thailand seems to display an ingenuine attempt of historical accuracy. They don't even have to look far to gain a more accurate inspiration. Many IP communities and especially the Moros retained many pre-colonial Filipino ways of living that were similar with how the other colonized Filipinos used to live. Many modern building here in Mindanao and especially in areas with major Moro presence integrate architecture that are inspired with Maritime SEA and Pre-colonial designs. (See Sultan Kudarat Capitol and some building within the BARMM Regional Office in Cotabato City) I just wished they went a little further with their historical research before filming the thing. Still going to watch it though if I can.
I think they had consultants based on the BTS. But the consultants did admit that production did "creative/artistic licenses" which explains some of the deviations. To be frank, this is more of a family drama first then a fictional kingdom second.
Same. I play Minecraft and I've recently built a bastion fort with a few buildings all based on Maritime Southeast Asian architecture. So I've looked at a lot of references and I wish they took more inspiration from Istana Negara, Istana Nurul, and Darul Jambangan. The sculpted green and white gate is very Maritime SEAsian so I don't see why they couldn't make it more like this. I mean, it does look good right? So why?
fr fr. Philippines shares more cultural and linguistic heritage with Indonesians and Malaysians than Thai. And precolonial Philippines is more diverse in religion with Theravada Buddhism, Hinduism, and Islam being more influential throughout the islands.
As Chinese myself, I am surprised that there seems so little Chinese influence in the trailer. Manila is only about 2 hours flight from the coast of Fujian (where most of the Chinese migrants in SEA came from). Without the Spaniards, it is only fair to assume that PH would end up more like Malaysia, with 20% Chinese and the Chinese people maintained their separate linguistic and cultural identities. And without the Roman Catholicism brought by the Spaniards, it is likely that PH would become Islamic, more similar to its big maritime neighbors: Malaysia or Indonesia.
The Northern Island of Luzon and mindoro used to be a Chinese colony, Luzon comes from the Chinese word liu song (I’m not sure of the spelling) and the territory of the Chinese colony in Luzon and mindoro was called Ma-i There are many possibilities if the spaniards never colonized the archipelago first is that most parts of the country would turn out like malaysia and indonesia like you said but some parts would remain hindu/buddhist animist like cambodia thailand or laos and The term Filipino will never exist and every territory will have their own sovereignty and everyone would need a passport if they want to visit the other islands
@@justice_crash2521 What is liu song supposed to mean? Can you cite references? The name "Luzon" is believed to derive from the Tagalog word ᜎᜓᜐᜓᜅ᜔ "lusong," which refers to a large wooden mortar used for dehusking rice. This term reflects the island's agricultural heritage and its historical significance in the Philippines. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luzon#Etymology
@@mishaelfernandez1 great catch, everything should be cited with references. But I think Wikipedia is not a great reference because people can edit things on that site easily. But in this case, I'm not turning down what you said, it's more convincing than the "Chinese origin" stated above without prior reference.
@@mishaelfernandez1 But I could be wrong because History specifically ours is always controversial due to some people pushing their own narratives and made it confusing or conflicting
Mabuhay from your Malayan brothers in Malaysia! We do shred A LOT of history and culture together since ancient times! Many of our Ancient dynasties actually intermarried with each others for example many Bruneian royals married many Tagalog and Kapampangan princesses and other royal families all over the Philippines. In the South the commonality is even much closer because of trade and proximity of the southern Island with the Malays archipelagoes' Kingdoms in Malaysia and Indonesia.
Hello I love Philipenes from Czech republic 🇨🇿❤️🇵🇭I love Philippine history culture, and bizarre Philippine mythology where there are monsters like Aswang
IMO the Philippines would remain a confederacy of kingdoms if the Spanish did not colonize the Philippines. However, the colonial bug of Europe was also an unstoppable phenomenon. If the Spanish didn't, the Dutch or the British would have. Another thought is that the Filipino nationalism is also the result of colonialism sparked by the American and French Revolution introducing enlightenment and rights of man.
Exactly! There wouldnt be a Philippine archipelago in the first place! Because spain was the one who enforced the idea of a unified archipelago. Before colonial era, the archipelago had different government and was connected to other existing empires at the time
9:59 One reason why I love your channel is that you respect history by not politicizing it (notwithstanding the fact that history can be argued to be inherently political). Many Filipinos love black and white thinking where it's always happy and prosperous during pre-colonial times and it's all death and despair during colonial times. But then again, Jean-Jacques Rousseau's Nationalism always want someone to blame and act as a unifying force to create a nation. But for me personally, the beauty of being Filipino is the amalgamation of eastern and western culture that made who and what we are today with all the joy and sorrows that came before it.
Pre colonial Philippines was like how thomas hobbes describe his views of the state of nature but the only difference is each different groups during pre colonial era have their own perspective sovereign in their area
💯 agree with you. So much happened in history. Bad or good, if the past hadn’t happened, there is a huge chance a lot of us wouldn’t be born today. A chance our culture, food would be different. A chance that some other european country would have colonized the PH archipelago and was worse. Influences can’t just be erased away just like that; it’s more complex. Our current history actually imo makes us way ahead of the other asians in terms or multiculturalism. People forget we all started as a mammal that evolved into a kore complex being. There was a time homosapiens and neanderthals were eating each other, and later on neanderthals mated with homosapiens to not only survive but create what we are now. There was the history of slavery in the ancient world, creating more mixed race people. Who knows; 1000 years from now when there is a possibility of people moving to other planets or space colonies, would the same countries and nationalities be called the same? Life moves and changes.
The main characters have Eurocentric features, while the minor characters are Austronesian-looking. Eurocentrism is alive even in an alternate timeline.
Honestly for me I realized, it's not so much about whether this movie was well researched or not. To me, this will get people to be curious about pre-colonial era. And that's a good start. I wish someday that pre-colonial history will be the primary lessons in schools and the spanish colonial history will be secondary. Not that we won't give importance to our national heroes of today anymore (which btw majority of them belonged to the colonial era anyways), I would rather give more importance to the history of the Lakans and Rajahs and align ourselves more to our SEA neighbors' cultural values than what the western values gave us forcibly.
This was supposed to be a tv series but got greenlighted as a movie when it was accepted by MMFF. Imagine how much more precolonial lessons that could have been shown if it was a teleserye.
True, as a student who was obsessed with precolonial history of the Philippines I got a lot of "what if" and "who's who" like who's the first "king" of every barangays?, what are the policies they enacted that still affect nowadays?, how is the living standards in middle ages?, what happens to each barangays? Is there a female ruler or regent who proves the people around her that she is capable of reigning and affecting policies?
this series has missed several variables of history that could've been integrated. - The Chinese (Southern Chinese such as Yue, Hakkas and Hokkiens) presence in Lusong (esp in Pampanga and Cagayan) - The Japanese and Okinawan presence same place as the Chinese - presence of Mahayana Buddhism in Butuan region, Bikol region, Pampanga, and Cagayan regions. - Posibility of Full Christian nation of Sri Vishaya - Muslim Tundung Kingdom, Sulu Kingdom/Empire, and other offshoot city-states and micro nations. - Heavy influences of Spanish, Western, Chinese and Indian, and Arab for Muslim areas. - Heavy influence of Theravada Buddhism in the Western Philippine islands & Malaysia - Women holds political power but not Leadership power - Unified Philippines would be impossible as it also influence other variables such as the Majapahit Empire (if they never fell), Brunei, Malay Federation (which there's a possibility that Butuan, Visayas, and Bikol region would belong to), and the possible annexations of Australian, Oceania, and other Pacific Islands that would be a part of that variable (ie the possibility of our current Australia didn't exists instead, several nations with other Malay-Austronesian cultures occupied the place with some settlements of westerners) and Taiwan being a part of a let's say confederation of nations of North Luzon. may bias ang writer nito, naka focus sa "purity" of history which is very wrong due to several factors and variables na mag-shape ng kapalaran ng mga bansa-bansa nito.
Based on my personal take on the trailer, their Philippines was Colonized by the Spanish but instead of 333 years it would be shortened to a Century since they use Spanish Loan Words and English. Possible that a Moro revolution unified with the Indigenous inhabitants drove the Spaniards away while managing to trading with the rest of South East Asia and the British. Also it seems that the Katipunan and the American occupation never existed.
No American Occupation but the place still drives on the right side of the road instead of the left as is common in the rest of the region. Left-Hand Motoring on the Right Side of the road is a distinctly American practice (stemming from Conestoga horse wagons) that was exported to allies and associates after WW2, with the exception of France. France was an early adopter of driving on the right, owing to Napoleon. Philippines used to be RHD during the Commonwealth and switched sides for pragmatic reasons after the war. Everyone else retained RHD they already had, even if they weren't under the British Crown.
Such an amazing video, Yang Amat Mulia/Your Highness Pengiran Datu Kirby! it’s incredible to think that if the Philippines had never been colonized, you could very well be the Raja Muda or Crown Prince of a thriving kingdom, given your noble lineage from the last Lakans or King of Luzon and the Sultans of Sulu and Brunei!
Despite all the lackings of "The Kingdom" it is honestly interesting to study the whole concept and mindset created in this. Especially as the Philippines is basically a federation all but in name in terms of the various power dynamics we have. I like how there is a strong parallel connection type of situation built on here that implies that regardless of what happens there will be some form of foreign influence that applies in the Philippines. Yet at the same time, our republican/representative leadership/democracy tendencies have deep roots in the fact that we are a more meritocratic-based tradition, unlike mostly Eurasian systems that centralize power intensely. The film is honestly just one of many ways we could dwell on the topic of "what if we weren't colonized" because, for all we know, we could've still had a republican form of governance down the like that is more relatable to our current reality but still apply this indigenous identity to it. The divergance of us having a more central monarchy makes sense in a writing stand point to have us diverge extremely from the current reality we have, but it would be nice to have an alternate history more closer to reality so I definitely agree we need more of this. More power to the various Filipino artists and writers; lets have another renaissance this time not lead so top heavy.
Maybe in the south, the northerners were animists and didn’t trust the southerners, whom they also considered foreigners who’s main goal is to enslave (likely due to their connections to Brunei and Indonesia). The Philippines, as we know it today, likely wouldn’t exist. Luzon might have developed as its own independent country.
I’ll give this movie a chance. Though I’m a bit wary because they had Spanish loan words pa rin in the trailer and how they’ll showcase the themes, it’s promising. I’ll wait for it to available on Netflix and give this a watch! Also, I AM SO HAPPY THEY PRONOUNCED RAJAH CORRECTLY. RA-DYA! NOT RA-HA (This is a Spanish pronunciation.)
Sobrang ingrain na kc ng Spanish words s Pinas s totoo lng. Pero at least something new nmn sa mga movies natin. Kakasura n ng mga kabitan stories sa totoo lang. 😂
From language, instead using loanwords from Spanish, they may use any loan words of any regional language of the Philippines. Instead saying Pula we say Mabaya (its an Ivatan word for Red) or any words shared from our Austronesian Ancestors then put some caption for context during the movie.
Siguro patawarin na natin sila dun, dahil masyado nang engraved yung mga spanish loan words sa vocabulary natin na kapag di natin sinali, baka wala na tayong maintindihan sa dialogues nila, masyado nang mahirap ito sa mga writers just to make it very authentic. Kasi di rin authentic if it happens na magawa ng mga researchers alamin ang vanilla language natin(free from spanish influence), for authenticity, di tayo mag-expect na ganun parin sila magsalita hanggang ngayon, malamang mag-evolve rin ito into something that is influenced by neighboring countries(China, Japanese, Thailand, etc). And there are so much possibility na we'll never know the right outcome. So, para concentrated na lang tayo sa context ng kwento, mas practical using our current common toungue. Tulad ng ng mga sci-fi movies (Star Wars, Star Trek etc) bagamat may mga fictional languages tulad sa star-trek, we do not expect na after a thousand years in the future or so, ay american english pa rin ang ginagamit ng humans and aliens alike sa communications nila.
Thank you so much po sa pag share ng matagal ko nang "what if" question sa history ng Pilipinas. Napakaganda po ng pagka explain niyo at minsan naiisip ko baka nga muslim country rin tayo kundi po tayo sinakop nun. ❤😊
If PH was not colonized by Spain, then there will be no Philippines at all in the first place. Entirety will be composed of different kingdoms, making partnerships, merging or conquering each other. Unless there will be a reason for them to unite and form a unitary government.
Salute to you Kirby. Very informative ang research mo, malaking tulong ito sa tulad naming mga kabataan na ngayon pa lang na mumulat sa ano pa ba ang hindi natin alam sa mga kwento ng Filipino Heritage.
we were so behind and warring with each other if would have not worked.... even today some tribes in mindanao thinks it can survive with out the rest of the country.
This is quite an interesting thought but the result may vary depending upon up to which point in relation to global actual modern historical events. For example, if we manage to keep the status quo and until WW2 then the Japanese would have been able to successfully achieve their target conquest because we would have been to fragmented and more likely fight each other than resist Japanese occupation.
yup... arguably, the Japanese could have invaded earlier (about the same time as they invaded china) if the Americans were not here.... Islands' culture and politics were too fragmented ( and this consequence being felt up to today) to put up a common identity and united front to repel invaders.
@@bret0974yup it kinda how actually Spain manage to colonize us just in different times. Spain just pitted different groups that have existing grudge against each other. Visayans vs Manila, Manila vs Moros.
Great video though the chances of a unified pre-colonial Philippines under a centralized rule would be impossible considering how culturally distinct each of the political entities within pre-colonial Philippines. A sort of federalized rule would make more sense and plus logistically sound as well. Plus you sort of glossed over the visayas region quite a lot considering the visayans also have different political alliances that are either connected or disconnected (not in good terms) with some political entities in both Luzon and Mindanao region.
Kirby does tend to gloss over certain aspects of our history in some of his explanations regarding things that also involves Visayas and Mindanao. Kirby is Kapampangan so the tendency to be more detailed regarding Tagalog and Kapampangan culture/history (which would be much more relevant for his identity) and have more generalized description for the rest of the country is visible. It's also probably because he specializes in those groups (just like how Philippine history in the academe in general is very Manila-centric or Luzon-centric).
We could have been ruled by an Islamic monarchy similar to Brunei if the whole archipelago was unified under one centralized authority (assuming that Spanish sphere of influence was averted early on). However, just like Indonesia and other Muslim-majority states, we would come to see secessionist groups from indigenous and religious minority groups sprouting across the nation. I fear that this will mark a groundbreaking, nationwide civil war that the movie highlights as the focus of conflict.
Geography dictates history, we dont have rivers connecting luzon to mindanao nor flat continous plains to make communication from villages easy. Which requires more resources uniting Philippines. That's why we dont have a unified country before colonization. And most importantly, we have strong regionalism back then until now. Ph would unite precolonial period if we have a roman empire moment. Italian region is geographically challenged kaya after fall of roman empire fragmented sya for so long, and same with the german region may history of unification albeit loose.
Looking forward to see The Kingdom, I do hope it would get some screening here in NZ. I've always thought that if PH archipelago wasn't colonized, the Iranun people would have thrived because of their maritime supremacy.
Debatable, you can argue that it would be even more divided than what it is today. A lot of things could've happened in the 300+ years SEA has been colonized.
You also mentioned the tradition of social mobility in precolonial Philippines. Some might interpret that as a semi-democratic but still a rare occurrence. But I see your point where precolonial SE Asia has a hybrid mix of feudal, caste, and democratic society.
idk if you've seen the video of their 'making of'/bts but they did say that aside from taking artistic liberties they also imagined how the society assimilated outside influences in to their own especially considering the amount of time that could've happened if the country was never colonized. We have assimilated different ideas from outside the country after all. Though it's beautiful, I wish the wedding - if it is a one - attire wasn't white. Same with the flag, I wish the top wasn't blue but either purple or black.
What made the producers and scriptwriters of "The Kingdom" film think that the archipelago would have a single unified government in the 20th Century if the Spanish had not forcefully conquered and subjugated the individual island-based polities and separate tribal communities? They also ignore that the Spanish successfully fended off the Chinese, Japanese, Malay, Muslim, Portuguese, Dutch, French, and English would-be invaders and raiders who also tried to carve out chunks of territory from what would become the solidified Spanish Philippine archipelago for over three hundred years. That unified Kingdom in the movie is a fantasy that would not have coalesced into just one unitary government all the way to the 18th and 20th Centuries. It is highly unlikely and the archipelago would probably be fragmented into multiple independent or colonized territories that have no common identity as one nation.
That’s what I keep on saying, I’m guessing if the writers really thought this through by considering the most possible outcome if the westerners (spaniards) never came would be that The extent of the(Kingdom’s) Dominion in the movie would only cover central Luzon only and probably half of palawan and Mindoro but I could be wrong I haven’t seen the movie yet
Nah the Spanish did not fended against Malay or Muslims. Malay and Muslims was already part of the broader region of the South of Philippines and its was the Malay and the Muslims in the south that make sure many of the traditional aspect of the local culture still preserved. If all the people in Maguindanao and Sulu were captured by the Spanish and they successfully converted them to Catholicism all of the native culture, outfit, weapons, traditions and even language will be gone and banns by the church. This is what happened after the Spanish took over Kapampangan or Luzon. Kingdome of Lusung and Tondo already have a strong ties and marriage alliance with the Malay Kingdome of Brunei at that time. Many times Brunei sent their army to help the Tagalog to fought the Spanish although it failed. The Spanish even tried to invade Brunei but later kicked out by the Malays and they failed many times to captured Maguindanao and Sulu. All because the Malay from Malaya, Borneo and Sumatra help them by sending weapons and fighters. In Sumatra and Malaysia today there are still many villages that have names coming from Sulu or Tausug names. After the fall of Lusung and Tondo and other island in the north many of the nobles and royals of Kapampangan actually migrated to Brunei, Sulu and even Malaka and Sumatra. Many of them became traders and mercenaries for many Malay Kingdome and Sultanate. This phenomenon is the same like when the Kingdome of Gowa in Sulawesi was captured by the Dutch many Gowan Royalties the Bugis and the Makassaries people immigrated to Sumatra and Malaya and became part of the local people.
@@wewenang5167 If the Spaniards want to conquer Mindanao they could've done it, but there is little incentive at that time to do that. They can send more forces from Mexico if there is an incentive to do so, like an important mineral like gold or a cash crop that can only be grown there. Luzon is of importance because the trade is centered around that area and historically they already have connection with chinese traders which is important since the west want those chinese goods, and the Visayas islands are small enough to be conquered easily. And the fact that the Spaniards already establish coastal towns in Mindanao as well.
@@johncortez3428 the thing with producers here is that they would consult but in the end, they still make the final decision. 😞 The Panay Bukidnon criticised them for making Amaya wear a sinina (crop top) when binukot were supposed to be covered head-to-toe. They likely also decided to exaggerate the flowy sleeves of Hara Lingayan when all our records explicitly mention that our sleeves were fitted. And they likely also did the same creative liberties in Lihim ni Urduja
What if the Philippines was never colonized? Every time I think about this what if, I imagine the Philippines being Thailand but instead of Buddist influence, Islam is the dominant religion. I mean if Christianity doesn't take over the Philippines, Islam will. The fact that ARMM is Islamic, just show it's progress of expansion.
The premise of the movie is impossible unless one of the Kingdoms in the archipelago became imperialistic/expansionist and brings about a forced union where the ruling imperial Kingdom would treat all the subjects from subjugated polities as second class citizens but I guess this is not far from reality either as Imperial Manila and the Tagalogs rule over the other ethnicities, where others are treated as second class citizens that are forced to learn the rulers language of Tagalog or as it would be subtly rebranded "Filipino", where others are forced to be under the Tagalog yoke, as a Tagalog(Chinese-Filipino) myself, it sure feels good not to learn the language of others but instead they would bare the indignity of speaking my language, of course this is sarcasm but it is grounded in reality, whether I'm just being polite or not is up to your imagination! Either way, I believe that the only way our people can move forward is thru the balkanization of this fake nation! only after that can we even contemplate to form a political/economic union similar to the EU.
As an alternate historian lover and maker, i agree on many points you address especially the architecture, their inspiration and many more but i will also add the influences of chinese merchants who were reduced during the spanish colonization. Chinese would have a remarkable influences in this alternate history and that time they would seek alliance with ming or qing to preserve their identity and playing their cards well between the french, dutch and british to preserve their autonomy by 18th century. Then adopt to western technologies by 19th century with the help of US and ally with japan and thai. Also, they should have more japanese influences as during the lakan rebellion, they were help by the Japanese. Then we should have more influences from islam especially in manila. Though manila was islamic only on the surface but time would come that they would become like the brunie. I had concern about the bisaya especially sugbu and butuan joining an alliance with manila lakan which was now muslim community with heavy Chinese and japanese influences.
Can you name me at least 5 Alternate History Ideas that you have in relation to the “Philippine” Archipelago and it’s native peoples? (Ex: What IF Islam had arrived in the “Philippine” archipelago much earlier than in OTL?) PS: I’m also interested in Alternate History like you
@alsuvarnadvipadanargentum1743 first was what if the coup deta't of former President Corazon Aquino succeeded and Philippines ends under the military government. Second, what if People's power revolution ends in Civil war between the marcos loyalist, aquino supporters, muslim separatist movement and communist insurgency which Philippines becomes an unstable chaotic nation. Third, What if all of the president of the Philippines achieved their goals for the Philippines, continuing the success of their predecessors which contributes to the success of their successors goal. Fourth, What if Philippines Revolution was taken inspiration from American Revolution which leads to the first Republic of the Philippines continues and becomes the first asian colony to gain independence. Fifth, What if the Spanish government follow the reforms of Dr. Jose Rizal leading to the Philippines becoming one of the spanish Commonwealth where their head of state is the spanish monarch but remains independent from spain.
I think the pre-colonial Philippines wouldn't be united because of different regional/cultural differences... If anything, I think two or even three distinct kingdoms would rise instead : Kingdom of Luzon, Sultanate of Mindanao and probably something of a surviving Confederation of Madyaas?
an exercise in futility - know the past , the accurate facts, and learn from it! -- if not you will just repeat the same mistakes of the past!!! DON'T learn and you die, and disappear from history...
as a Filipino Muslim I think we would be rich in gold😊 oto oto kasi yung iba ipinagpalit ang ginto sa papel😂😂😂 tapos yung ibang na mondok dala dala ang ginto. at pilit na hina-hunt.na niniwala ako hindi po dahil sa religion kaya meron War kung hindi dahil po sa Ginto at Oil idinadahilan lang po ang religion. kaya kung hind po tayo na colonize naniniwala akong ginto ang pera natin ngun😅
Movies and series like these should be more well-produced. Otherwise di rin papanuorin ng mga tao. Watching the trailer, rather than feeling pride, the poorly made costumes and CGI made me think "ah, modern day Pinas nga talaga to" 😂 I'm sure it was a budget thing. I agree that it's thought-evoking though, and the story might actually be nice.
Pakiramdam ko lang (base na din sa experience ko sa pinanood ko na notoriously inaccurate ung Iskul Bukol movie ni Vic) may sablay sa The Kingdom movie trailer pa lang nakita ko na ung Phillipine flag dun sa tulay na project ng China-Philippines (nakalimutan ko lang pangalan ng tulay) di man lang inedit. Pati ung inspection ng pulis kay Piolo ung salitang "marka" diba barrowed word un sa English/Spanish? Tsaka duda ako dun sa mga Baybayin words baka ginaya lang yung ginawa dun sa mga street signs na nagtrend dahil mali paggamit nila sa Baybayin.
Nice commentary video for this movie, Kirby and The Kingdom is a very promising movie that every Filipinos should watch it not only because of being a pure Filipino movie that showcasing our country's culture, themes and history (even though it's purely fictional) but it also shows how politics really works from bureaucracy, political dynasty, feudalism and corruption within the government and it really reflects to the political situation in our country today whether our country had been colonized by two Western powers or not, we could still see the problems in our country on politics and this is also the same situations in our Southeast Asian neighbors as well like Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam, Cambodia, etc. and there's no such thing as "perfect government" that could rule a country as what Vic Sotto portrayed to this movie as a alternative timeline of a Filipino sultanate. It's just like the Pinoy versions of House of Cards and Game of Thrones. And if you think that this movie might be a catapult for his political ambition to run for a higher position in our country in the near future, maybe or maybe not even though he had no intention to run on politics for now unlike his older brother, his son, his nephew and niece in spite that the Sottos are well known political clan in our country besides well known showbiz family for decades but if he could do that and run for higher position like the President of our country just like what Donald Trump did then the question is could he handle the pressures, his leadership and the problems in our country? Well, that's my honest opinion.
I think if the Philippines were not colonized, one of the two scenarios would happen... Scenario 1 (Most Likely) - The sultanates would eventually conquer the Philippines. They are more centralized and organized, which makes them more likely to be more militarized. They would then eventually fight amongst each other. From there, the Philippines will be ruled by one sultanate. Due to their inherent hostility towards Christianity, they would not trade with the Europeans, which would prevent them from learning science from them. The official religion of the Philippines would be Islam. However, after the decline of the Islamic Golden Age, Islam would strictly forbid scientific pursuits, which would prevent the Philippines from having scientific pursuits. Islam would also limit creative expression in the Philippines, particularly in the arts, since it considers the drawing of people to be a form of idolatry. The sultanate would be more and more centralized. It would be more and more concerned about preserving its power. The Philippines would not be a free nation. It will also not be a prosperous nation. It would be stuck in the Middle Ages. Scenario 2 (Least Likely) - This scenario would happen if the rest of the Philippines form a federation that would maintain peace with the sultanates, absorb the sultanates, or even wipe out the sultanates. This scenario would also happen if Scenario 1 happened but the sultanates end up destroying each other. Filipinos would be more interested in climbing up the social hierarchy. They would also be interested in preventing other Filipinos from climbing the social hierarchy. Some of them would also even be interested in making other Filipinos go down the social hierarchy. They would trade with the Europeans, particularly the Dutch, which would allow them to learn science and other ideas from them. They would have scientific pursuits but most likely as a means to climb the social hierarchy or preserve their place in it. Two of the ideas that they will learn from the Europeans are the concepts of individual liberty and the abolition of slavery, which would challenge the social hierarchy. The Philippines would dismiss and reject the concepts as foreign ideas that are not compatible with the social hierarchy and that disrupt the established social order in it. The concepts may cause the social hierarchy to undergo reforms. The concepts will not abolish the social hierarchy, which will be too disruptive in the Philippines.
Honestly, I think the movie is low-key Marcos propaganda. Right now, the Philippines is having a nationalistic reawakening. However, the narratives of this nationalistic reawakening are more or less under the control of the Marcos Clan.
the likely scenario is that the British will colonize the Philippines. If not it might be the Dutch or Portuguese. The Renaissance happened in the West and the rest of the world had to catch up by that time. They have superior firepower, ships, strategies, knowledge that made it easier for them to conquer territories. Even Thailand had to adapt to western ideals to survive not being colonize but it took the british and french agreeing to make Thailand neutral so that it will remain free.
Assuming that pursuit of knowledge and art in an Islamic nation is oozing European bias to me. Islamic scholars pursued mathematics, medicine, architecture, astrology, etc.
I would hope po, you will also try alternate history with your deep knowledge on Philippines history and southeast asia, i would say that you are capable of creating an alternate history scenario mr. kirby.
I don't think that a fragmented state like the "Kalayaan" can be centralized. I would see it as like the Federal-style government but with the kings like Malaysia. But since the film was based on Siam rather than Nusantara, I do not think that would happen.
Probably. But since its almost impossible to be an isolated "kingdom". There would be some pockets of other religions. I imagine priests, pastors, and missionaries present.
Chinese Exchange rate to Philippines, Ceramics to Gold 🪙. At Ming Dynasty Era. China are Abundant of Ceramics & Philippines Are abundant of gold 🪙. Trading Traditional. Or Bartering.
Seems they rely solely on AI rather than historians to reimagine an uncolonized Philippines. Also, isn’t the sun on the flag influenced by the Spanish? Another point to consider is having a stronger navy
Thank you for the video. Never imagined to see the day you create content for a vic sotto movie. JK! Srsly, looking forward on your thoughts after watching the movie.
Haven't seen the trailer yet myself but I don't like how the tattoos look base on what I can see in this video. Although I do think that the tattoos should have a more contemporary style and design, the ones they went with just look too westernized to me. If I had a say in how the tattoos would've looked like, I would have made them take heavy inspiration from okil and batik textile. This way you can have a contemporary design that can be more easily interpreted by a modern audience but it would still look very much like batok.
Bat di ko feel yung plot nila? Di sana nung pinakita palang yung trailer, nakuha na yung interest ko... Buti napakita mo sir yung info na to regarding this movie.... Hmmm interesting indeed...
As a person who loves to learn more about pre-colonial history and actually wonder that ‘what if the philippines never colonize’, it makes me wonder if they would include sultans in mindanao. And how they would portray people in visayas. Would it be play as a connection or a vital role in-terms of the trade and agriculture? Because pretty much the story’s economic growth heavily relies on the agriculture. Please I want to know your thoughts
A very comprehensive and informative content. I wish you could also do a tagalized version so many young Filipinos would understand the origin of our country.
@@KirbyAraullo Before Europe The asia colonialism was Mongol - Yuan and then Ming. Yuan failed Ming half success. There was already a mandala in the 14th century calling the country NUSANTARA = archipelagic country, leading by Majapahit in Java island. However, this was successfully suppressed by the Ming Dynasty, especially General Zheng He, who sailed 7 times in Southeast Asia. The leader of Pasai Malaka Brunei Sulu came to the Ming palace. Meanwhile, Palembang leader was destroyed and the island of Java was divided into two kingdoms
no colonization no philippines no filipinos ..the archipelago and its inhabitants would have been absorbed by the indonesian empire, then later by the dutch, german or british ...northern luzon will have been the exception which is because of its proximity to china and japan and would have been annexed by either powers. Ancient philippine archipelago will have never united into one country...different cultures, traditions, religions and languages will have prevented a unification.
I dont think Filipinos clans would be in that dress. I assumed that it dresses or atire remained indigenous not western atire... . Your know just like in school cultural dance which dancers are dressed using indigenous atire(not costume)
Like you said, the ancient pre colonial Philippines is more active in cooperation and trade. There were disagreements between them for sure. But I cannot see a united Philippines under one political centralized system coming out of that. Filipinos by nature are laid back. They would raid sometimes but I don't see them trying to conquer other tribes. Without that drive to conquer, we would remain separate micro kingdoms spread out among 7000 islands. It did indeed need for colonization for us to become one nation.
Related Videos & Playlists:
🌞 Precolonial & Early Philippine History bit.ly/EarlyPhilippines
🌏 Demystifying Southeast Asia - bit.ly/KnowSoutheastAsia
🔥 ‘Discovery’ & Conquest of the Philippines: bit.ly/DiscoveringPH
Hi Kirby will there Christianity there as minority?
I just realized I published this video exactly on the 453rd anniversary of the official establishment of the colonial province of “La Pampanga” (December 11, 1571) which is also considered to the official date when the Kingdom of Luzon 🇲🇱 fell to the Spaniards 🇪🇸
I'm kind of miffed that they based it on Thailand rather than Maritime SEA. Maybe they can take inspiration from the diplomatic and political actions of the Thai monarchy during the era of colonialism and imperialism, but basing the architecture (and other social systems maybe) with Thailand seems to display an ingenuine attempt of historical accuracy.
They don't even have to look far to gain a more accurate inspiration. Many IP communities and especially the Moros retained many pre-colonial Filipino ways of living that were similar with how the other colonized Filipinos used to live. Many modern building here in Mindanao and especially in areas with major Moro presence integrate architecture that are inspired with Maritime SEA and Pre-colonial designs. (See Sultan Kudarat Capitol and some building within the BARMM Regional Office in Cotabato City)
I just wished they went a little further with their historical research before filming the thing. Still going to watch it though if I can.
I agree!
I think they had consultants based on the BTS. But the consultants did admit that production did "creative/artistic licenses" which explains some of the deviations. To be frank, this is more of a family drama first then a fictional kingdom second.
@@geopadilla1455True. In the end no matter how much consultation was done, the producers still have a final say 😢😢😢😢
Same. I play Minecraft and I've recently built a bastion fort with a few buildings all based on Maritime Southeast Asian architecture. So I've looked at a lot of references and I wish they took more inspiration from Istana Negara, Istana Nurul, and Darul Jambangan. The sculpted green and white gate is very Maritime SEAsian so I don't see why they couldn't make it more like this. I mean, it does look good right? So why?
fr fr. Philippines shares more cultural and linguistic heritage with Indonesians and Malaysians than Thai. And precolonial Philippines is more diverse in religion with Theravada Buddhism, Hinduism, and Islam being more influential throughout the islands.
As Chinese myself, I am surprised that there seems so little Chinese influence in the trailer. Manila is only about 2 hours flight from the coast of Fujian (where most of the Chinese migrants in SEA came from). Without the Spaniards, it is only fair to assume that PH would end up more like Malaysia, with 20% Chinese and the Chinese people maintained their separate linguistic and cultural identities. And without the Roman Catholicism brought by the Spaniards, it is likely that PH would become Islamic, more similar to its big maritime neighbors: Malaysia or Indonesia.
Because it's obvious, we hate them more than ever, he he he (joke)
WPS is ours !!!
The Northern Island of Luzon and mindoro used to be a Chinese colony, Luzon comes from the Chinese word liu song (I’m not sure of the spelling) and the territory of the Chinese colony in Luzon and mindoro was called Ma-i
There are many possibilities if the spaniards never colonized the archipelago first is that most parts of the country would turn out like malaysia and indonesia like you said but some parts would remain hindu/buddhist animist like cambodia thailand or laos and The term Filipino will never exist and every territory will have their own sovereignty and everyone would need a passport if they want to visit the other islands
@@justice_crash2521 What is liu song supposed to mean? Can you cite references?
The name "Luzon" is believed to derive from the Tagalog word ᜎᜓᜐᜓᜅ᜔ "lusong," which refers to a large wooden mortar used for dehusking rice. This term reflects the island's agricultural heritage and its historical significance in the Philippines.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luzon#Etymology
@@mishaelfernandez1 great catch, everything should be cited with references. But I think Wikipedia is not a great reference because people can edit things on that site easily. But in this case, I'm not turning down what you said, it's more convincing than the "Chinese origin" stated above without prior reference.
@@mishaelfernandez1 But I could be wrong because History specifically ours is always controversial due to some people pushing their own narratives and made it confusing or conflicting
Mabuhay from your Malayan brothers in Malaysia! We do shred A LOT of history and culture together since ancient times! Many of our Ancient dynasties actually intermarried with each others for example many Bruneian royals married many Tagalog and Kapampangan princesses and other royal families all over the Philippines. In the South the commonality is even much closer because of trade and proximity of the southern Island with the Malays archipelagoes' Kingdoms in Malaysia and Indonesia.
Hello I love Philipenes from Czech republic 🇨🇿❤️🇵🇭I love Philippine history culture, and bizarre Philippine mythology where there are monsters like Aswang
IMO the Philippines would remain a confederacy of kingdoms if the Spanish did not colonize the Philippines. However, the colonial bug of Europe was also an unstoppable phenomenon. If the Spanish didn't, the Dutch or the British would have. Another thought is that the Filipino nationalism is also the result of colonialism sparked by the American and French Revolution introducing enlightenment and rights of man.
Exactly! There wouldnt be a Philippine archipelago in the first place! Because spain was the one who enforced the idea of a unified archipelago. Before colonial era, the archipelago had different government and was connected to other existing empires at the time
9:59 One reason why I love your channel is that you respect history by not politicizing it (notwithstanding the fact that history can be argued to be inherently political). Many Filipinos love black and white thinking where it's always happy and prosperous during pre-colonial times and it's all death and despair during colonial times. But then again, Jean-Jacques Rousseau's Nationalism always want someone to blame and act as a unifying force to create a nation.
But for me personally, the beauty of being Filipino is the amalgamation of eastern and western culture that made who and what we are today with all the joy and sorrows that came before it.
Pre colonial Philippines was like how thomas hobbes describe his views of the state of nature but the only difference is each different groups during pre colonial era have their own perspective sovereign in their area
💯 agree with you. So much happened in history. Bad or good, if the past hadn’t happened, there is a huge chance a lot of us wouldn’t be born today. A chance our culture, food would be different. A chance that some other european country would have colonized the PH archipelago and was worse. Influences can’t just be erased away just like that; it’s more complex. Our current history actually imo makes us way ahead of the other asians in terms or multiculturalism. People forget we all started as a mammal that evolved into a kore complex being. There was a time homosapiens and neanderthals were eating each other, and later on neanderthals mated with homosapiens to not only survive but create what we are now. There was the history of slavery in the ancient world, creating more mixed race people. Who knows; 1000 years from now when there is a possibility of people moving to other planets or space colonies, would the same countries and nationalities be called the same? Life moves and changes.
Thanks!
The main characters have Eurocentric features, while the minor characters are Austronesian-looking. Eurocentrism is alive even in an alternate timeline.
What I imagine Philippines will be if not colonized:Each island is its own nation...Sulu Sultanate still exists
Ang galing ng pagkaka break down ng trailer! Salamat po Datu Kirby, iba talaga kapag henyo ang nag react.
Maraming salamat! 🙏🏽
@@KirbyAraullohave u ever looked into Taipan Lucero filipino caligraphy works?
Maybe he should do another vic sotto fictional kingdom movie. Enteng Kabisote? Just kidding!
Honestly for me I realized, it's not so much about whether this movie was well researched or not. To me, this will get people to be curious about pre-colonial era. And that's a good start. I wish someday that pre-colonial history will be the primary lessons in schools and the spanish colonial history will be secondary. Not that we won't give importance to our national heroes of today anymore (which btw majority of them belonged to the colonial era anyways), I would rather give more importance to the history of the Lakans and Rajahs and align ourselves more to our SEA neighbors' cultural values than what the western values gave us forcibly.
of course, he hearts your comment. that great for you man! lmao. 👍👍👍
@@GaranLansangan ahm, wdym?
This was supposed to be a tv series but got greenlighted as a movie when it was accepted by MMFF. Imagine how much more precolonial lessons that could have been shown if it was a teleserye.
I never watch teleseryes but I would this one. Sadly, I think they'll make it focus on love stories rather than actual pre colonial culture.
True, as a student who was obsessed with precolonial history of the Philippines I got a lot of "what if" and "who's who" like who's the first "king" of every barangays?, what are the policies they enacted that still affect nowadays?, how is the living standards in middle ages?, what happens to each barangays? Is there a female ruler or regent who proves the people around her that she is capable of reigning and affecting policies?
this series has missed several variables of history that could've been integrated.
- The Chinese (Southern Chinese such as Yue, Hakkas and Hokkiens) presence in Lusong (esp in Pampanga and Cagayan)
- The Japanese and Okinawan presence same place as the Chinese
- presence of Mahayana Buddhism in Butuan region, Bikol region, Pampanga, and Cagayan regions.
- Posibility of Full Christian nation of Sri Vishaya
- Muslim Tundung Kingdom, Sulu Kingdom/Empire, and other offshoot city-states and micro nations.
- Heavy influences of Spanish, Western, Chinese and Indian, and Arab for Muslim areas.
- Heavy influence of Theravada Buddhism in the Western Philippine islands & Malaysia
- Women holds political power but not Leadership power
- Unified Philippines would be impossible as it also influence other variables such as the Majapahit Empire (if they never fell), Brunei, Malay Federation (which there's a possibility that Butuan, Visayas, and Bikol region would belong to), and the possible annexations of Australian, Oceania, and other Pacific Islands that would be a part of that variable (ie the possibility of our current Australia didn't exists instead, several nations with other Malay-Austronesian cultures occupied the place with some settlements of westerners) and Taiwan being a part of a let's say confederation of nations of North Luzon.
may bias ang writer nito, naka focus sa "purity" of history which is very wrong due to several factors and variables na mag-shape ng kapalaran ng mga bansa-bansa nito.
Based on my personal take on the trailer, their Philippines was Colonized by the Spanish but instead of 333 years it would be shortened to a Century since they use Spanish Loan Words and English.
Possible that a Moro revolution unified with the Indigenous inhabitants drove the Spaniards away while managing to trading with the rest of South East Asia and the British. Also it seems that the Katipunan and the American occupation never existed.
Initially colonized by malays..but some stayed as they were and we call them natives, the REAL owners of this land..
No American Occupation but the place still drives on the right side of the road instead of the left as is common in the rest of the region. Left-Hand Motoring on the Right Side of the road is a distinctly American practice (stemming from Conestoga horse wagons) that was exported to allies and associates after WW2, with the exception of France. France was an early adopter of driving on the right, owing to Napoleon. Philippines used to be RHD during the Commonwealth and switched sides for pragmatic reasons after the war. Everyone else retained RHD they already had, even if they weren't under the British Crown.
both of you, you are wrong@@Cr0zzAlpha
@@benzonjhermogeno 🤦you never heard of austronesians🤦
@Ryan_Christopher True, forgot about that one, but it's possible that they could have adopted that from the Spaniards.
I knew you'd do a reaction and analysis video to this when the trailer first dropped. Definitely didn't disappoint.
Glad you liked it! 😊 Salámat!
Such an amazing video, Yang Amat Mulia/Your Highness Pengiran Datu Kirby! it’s incredible to think that if the Philippines had never been colonized, you could very well be the Raja Muda or Crown Prince of a thriving kingdom, given your noble lineage from the last Lakans or King of Luzon and the Sultans of Sulu and Brunei!
That is true, his lineage adds a compelling layer to this perspective. Honestly, I wouldn’t mind him being the Raja Muda either.
Despite all the lackings of "The Kingdom" it is honestly interesting to study the whole concept and mindset created in this. Especially as the Philippines is basically a federation all but in name in terms of the various power dynamics we have. I like how there is a strong parallel connection type of situation built on here that implies that regardless of what happens there will be some form of foreign influence that applies in the Philippines. Yet at the same time, our republican/representative leadership/democracy tendencies have deep roots in the fact that we are a more meritocratic-based tradition, unlike mostly Eurasian systems that centralize power intensely.
The film is honestly just one of many ways we could dwell on the topic of "what if we weren't colonized" because, for all we know, we could've still had a republican form of governance down the like that is more relatable to our current reality but still apply this indigenous identity to it. The divergance of us having a more central monarchy makes sense in a writing stand point to have us diverge extremely from the current reality we have, but it would be nice to have an alternate history more closer to reality so I definitely agree we need more of this.
More power to the various Filipino artists and writers; lets have another renaissance this time not lead so top heavy.
Precolonial Philippines was never devoid of "foreign" inlfuences because we are not New Zealand nor Greenland. We are in the middle of trade routes
I reckon if our country was never colonized, the islands would still be a thalassocracy with Islam as a primary religion.
Maybe in the south, the northerners were animists and didn’t trust the southerners, whom they also considered foreigners who’s main goal is to enslave (likely due to their connections to Brunei and Indonesia). The Philippines, as we know it today, likely wouldn’t exist. Luzon might have developed as its own independent country.
I’ll give this movie a chance. Though I’m a bit wary because they had Spanish loan words pa rin in the trailer and how they’ll showcase the themes, it’s promising. I’ll wait for it to available on Netflix and give this a watch!
Also, I AM SO HAPPY THEY PRONOUNCED RAJAH CORRECTLY. RA-DYA! NOT RA-HA (This is a Spanish pronunciation.)
Sobrang ingrain na kc ng Spanish words s Pinas s totoo lng. Pero at least something new nmn sa mga movies natin.
Kakasura n ng mga kabitan stories sa totoo lang. 😂
From language, instead using loanwords from Spanish, they may use any loan words of any regional language of the Philippines. Instead saying Pula we say Mabaya (its an Ivatan word for Red) or any words shared from our Austronesian Ancestors then put some caption for context during the movie.
Siguro patawarin na natin sila dun, dahil masyado nang engraved yung mga spanish loan words sa vocabulary natin na kapag di natin sinali, baka wala na tayong maintindihan sa dialogues nila, masyado nang mahirap ito sa mga writers just to make it very authentic. Kasi di rin authentic if it happens na magawa ng mga researchers alamin ang vanilla language natin(free from spanish influence), for authenticity, di tayo mag-expect na ganun parin sila magsalita hanggang ngayon, malamang mag-evolve rin ito into something that is influenced by neighboring countries(China, Japanese, Thailand, etc). And there are so much possibility na we'll never know the right outcome. So, para concentrated na lang tayo sa context ng kwento, mas practical using our current common toungue.
Tulad ng ng mga sci-fi movies (Star Wars, Star Trek etc) bagamat may mga fictional languages tulad sa star-trek, we do not expect na after a thousand years in the future or so, ay american english pa rin ang ginagamit ng humans and aliens alike sa communications nila.
So ang pagpronounce ko ng Rajah is Spanish pronunciation
@@nahiadiwata8599 yeah. It's a huge mishap on their part. I find it lazy to be honest.
Thank you so much po sa pag share ng matagal ko nang "what if" question sa history ng Pilipinas. Napakaganda po ng pagka explain niyo at minsan naiisip ko baka nga muslim country rin tayo kundi po tayo sinakop nun. ❤😊
If PH was not colonized by Spain, then there will be no Philippines at all in the first place. Entirety will be composed of different kingdoms, making partnerships, merging or conquering each other. Unless there will be a reason for them to unite and form a unitary government.
Well it would be majority of Muslims
a lot of our mainstream historians or thinkers in general lack proper historiography
Salute to you Kirby. Very informative ang research mo, malaking tulong ito sa tulad naming mga kabataan na ngayon pa lang na mumulat sa ano pa ba ang hindi
natin alam sa mga kwento ng Filipino Heritage.
we were so behind and warring with each other if would have not worked.... even today some tribes in mindanao thinks it can survive with out the rest of the country.
This is quite an interesting thought but the result may vary depending upon up to which point in relation to global actual modern historical events. For example, if we manage to keep the status quo and until WW2 then the Japanese would have been able to successfully achieve their target conquest because we would have been to fragmented and more likely fight each other than resist Japanese occupation.
yup... arguably, the Japanese could have invaded earlier (about the same time as they invaded china) if the Americans were not here.... Islands' culture and politics were too fragmented ( and this consequence being felt up to today) to put up a common identity and united front to repel invaders.
@@bret0974yup it kinda how actually Spain manage to colonize us just in different times. Spain just pitted different groups that have existing grudge against each other. Visayans vs Manila, Manila vs Moros.
Great video though the chances of a unified pre-colonial Philippines under a centralized rule would be impossible considering how culturally distinct each of the political entities within pre-colonial Philippines. A sort of federalized rule would make more sense and plus logistically sound as well.
Plus you sort of glossed over the visayas region quite a lot considering the visayans also have different political alliances that are either connected or disconnected (not in good terms) with some political entities in both Luzon and Mindanao region.
Kirby does tend to gloss over certain aspects of our history in some of his explanations regarding things that also involves Visayas and Mindanao. Kirby is Kapampangan so the tendency to be more detailed regarding Tagalog and Kapampangan culture/history (which would be much more relevant for his identity) and have more generalized description for the rest of the country is visible. It's also probably because he specializes in those groups (just like how Philippine history in the academe in general is very Manila-centric or Luzon-centric).
We could have been ruled by an Islamic monarchy similar to Brunei if the whole archipelago was unified under one centralized authority (assuming that Spanish sphere of influence was averted early on). However, just like Indonesia and other Muslim-majority states, we would come to see secessionist groups from indigenous and religious minority groups sprouting across the nation. I fear that this will mark a groundbreaking, nationwide civil war that the movie highlights as the focus of conflict.
I just hope the movie isn't a subtle propaganda in favor of the Marcoses...
Sana nga hindi!
I made that movie trailer. Malayong-malayo =)
Pero once na mapanood ng mga apologist to matic yan
SEA would have retained gold reserves.
Geography dictates history, we dont have rivers connecting luzon to mindanao nor flat continous plains to make communication from villages easy. Which requires more resources uniting Philippines. That's why we dont have a unified country before colonization. And most importantly, we have strong regionalism back then until now.
Ph would unite precolonial period if we have a roman empire moment. Italian region is geographically challenged kaya after fall of roman empire fragmented sya for so long, and same with the german region may history of unification albeit loose.
Watch 'The Kingdom" Official Trailer here 👉🏼 th-cam.com/video/rl-KjeepAaM/w-d-xo.html
As a monarchist I will watch it. Even Sultan Muedzul Lail Tan Kiram said that he will try to see this in cinema ❤
I always enjoy your videos and learn from them and the many comments as well.
Looking forward to see The Kingdom, I do hope it would get some screening here in NZ. I've always thought that if PH archipelago wasn't colonized, the Iranun people would have thrived because of their maritime supremacy.
*sees thumbnail*
Yep, Kirby (or his editors) really knows what he's doing 👀
Thank you for this. This would be interesting to see
if colonization never happened, philippines, indonesia, malaysia (sabah), and even brunei are probably a one big archipelago country today 😅
EXANCTLY! MAPHLINDO OR MALAYARAYA WAS SUGGESTED BUT THEN FAILED.
Debatable, you can argue that it would be even more divided than what it is today.
A lot of things could've happened in the 300+ years SEA has been colonized.
existence of a supranational state is a post colonial phenomenon. Most likely a group of sultanates, tribal confederacies and Chinese republics
You also mentioned the tradition of social mobility in precolonial Philippines. Some might interpret that as a semi-democratic but still a rare occurrence. But I see your point where precolonial SE Asia has a hybrid mix of feudal, caste, and democratic society.
Looking forward to your full review, Prof. Kirby. Thank you for this episode!
Thanks Mr. Kirby. I'm going to watch this movie, thanks to you.
idk if you've seen the video of their 'making of'/bts but they did say that aside from taking artistic liberties they also imagined how the society assimilated outside influences in to their own especially considering the amount of time that could've happened if the country was never colonized. We have assimilated different ideas from outside the country after all.
Though it's beautiful, I wish the wedding - if it is a one - attire wasn't white. Same with the flag, I wish the top wasn't blue but either purple or black.
Brilliant analysis, @Kirby! Fwd’ing to everyone!
What made the producers and scriptwriters of "The Kingdom" film think that the archipelago would have a single unified government in the 20th Century if the Spanish had not forcefully conquered and subjugated the individual island-based polities and separate tribal communities? They also ignore that the Spanish successfully fended off the Chinese, Japanese, Malay, Muslim, Portuguese, Dutch, French, and English would-be invaders and raiders who also tried to carve out chunks of territory from what would become the solidified Spanish Philippine archipelago for over three hundred years. That unified Kingdom in the movie is a fantasy that would not have coalesced into just one unitary government all the way to the 18th and 20th Centuries. It is highly unlikely and the archipelago would probably be fragmented into multiple independent or colonized territories that have no common identity as one nation.
That’s what I keep on saying, I’m guessing if the writers really thought this through by considering the most possible outcome if the westerners (spaniards) never came would be that The extent of the(Kingdom’s) Dominion in the movie would only cover central Luzon only and probably half of palawan and Mindoro but I could be wrong I haven’t seen the movie yet
Nah the Spanish did not fended against Malay or Muslims. Malay and Muslims was already part of the broader region of the South of Philippines and its was the Malay and the Muslims in the south that make sure many of the traditional aspect of the local culture still preserved. If all the people in Maguindanao and Sulu were captured by the Spanish and they successfully converted them to Catholicism all of the native culture, outfit, weapons, traditions and even language will be gone and banns by the church. This is what happened after the Spanish took over Kapampangan or Luzon. Kingdome of Lusung and Tondo already have a strong ties and marriage alliance with the Malay Kingdome of Brunei at that time. Many times Brunei sent their army to help the Tagalog to fought the Spanish although it failed. The Spanish even tried to invade Brunei but later kicked out by the Malays and they failed many times to captured Maguindanao and Sulu. All because the Malay from Malaya, Borneo and Sumatra help them by sending weapons and fighters. In Sumatra and Malaysia today there are still many villages that have names coming from Sulu or Tausug names. After the fall of Lusung and Tondo and other island in the north many of the nobles and royals of Kapampangan actually migrated to Brunei, Sulu and even Malaka and Sumatra. Many of them became traders and mercenaries for many Malay Kingdome and Sultanate. This phenomenon is the same like when the Kingdome of Gowa in Sulawesi was captured by the Dutch many Gowan Royalties the Bugis and the Makassaries people immigrated to Sumatra and Malaya and became part of the local people.
I mean it can happen. It just the percentage is very very low.
@@wewenang5167 If the Spaniards want to conquer Mindanao they could've done it, but there is little incentive at that time to do that. They can send more forces from Mexico if there is an incentive to do so, like an important mineral like gold or a cash crop that can only be grown there. Luzon is of importance because the trade is centered around that area and historically they already have connection with chinese traders which is important since the west want those chinese goods, and the Visayas islands are small enough to be conquered easily. And the fact that the Spaniards already establish coastal towns in Mindanao as well.
The producers should have consulted with historians, architects and linguists and avoided the use of Spanish derived words in the script.
@@johncortez3428 the thing with producers here is that they would consult but in the end, they still make the final decision. 😞
The Panay Bukidnon criticised them for making Amaya wear a sinina (crop top) when binukot were supposed to be covered head-to-toe.
They likely also decided to exaggerate the flowy sleeves of Hara Lingayan when all our records explicitly mention that our sleeves were fitted.
And they likely also did the same creative liberties in Lihim ni Urduja
What if the Philippines was never colonized?
Every time I think about this what if, I imagine the Philippines being Thailand but instead of Buddist influence, Islam is the dominant religion. I mean if Christianity doesn't take over the Philippines, Islam will. The fact that ARMM is Islamic, just show it's progress of expansion.
The premise of the movie is impossible unless one of the Kingdoms in the archipelago became imperialistic/expansionist and brings about a forced union where the ruling imperial Kingdom would treat all the subjects from subjugated polities as second class citizens but I guess this is not far from reality either as Imperial Manila and the Tagalogs rule over the other ethnicities, where others are treated as second class citizens that are forced to learn the rulers language of Tagalog or as it would be subtly rebranded "Filipino", where others are forced to be under the Tagalog yoke, as a Tagalog(Chinese-Filipino) myself, it sure feels good not to learn the language of others but instead they would bare the indignity of speaking my language, of course this is sarcasm but it is grounded in reality, whether I'm just being polite or not is up to your imagination! Either way, I believe that the only way our people can move forward is thru the balkanization of this fake nation! only after that can we even contemplate to form a political/economic union similar to the EU.
As an alternate historian lover and maker, i agree on many points you address especially the architecture, their inspiration and many more but i will also add the influences of chinese merchants who were reduced during the spanish colonization. Chinese would have a remarkable influences in this alternate history and that time they would seek alliance with ming or qing to preserve their identity and playing their cards well between the french, dutch and british to preserve their autonomy by 18th century. Then adopt to western technologies by 19th century with the help of US and ally with japan and thai. Also, they should have more japanese influences as during the lakan rebellion, they were help by the Japanese. Then we should have more influences from islam especially in manila. Though manila was islamic only on the surface but time would come that they would become like the brunie. I had concern about the bisaya especially sugbu and butuan joining an alliance with manila lakan which was now muslim community with heavy Chinese and japanese influences.
Can you name me at least 5 Alternate History Ideas that you have in relation to the “Philippine” Archipelago and it’s native peoples? (Ex: What IF Islam had arrived in the “Philippine” archipelago much earlier than in OTL?)
PS: I’m also interested in Alternate History like you
@alsuvarnadvipadanargentum1743 first was what if the coup deta't of former President Corazon Aquino succeeded and Philippines ends under the military government. Second, what if People's power revolution ends in Civil war between the marcos loyalist, aquino supporters, muslim separatist movement and communist insurgency which Philippines becomes an unstable chaotic nation. Third, What if all of the president of the Philippines achieved their goals for the Philippines, continuing the success of their predecessors which contributes to the success of their successors goal. Fourth, What if Philippines Revolution was taken inspiration from American Revolution which leads to the first Republic of the Philippines continues and becomes the first asian colony to gain independence. Fifth, What if the Spanish government follow the reforms of Dr. Jose Rizal leading to the Philippines becoming one of the spanish Commonwealth where their head of state is the spanish monarch but remains independent from spain.
I think the pre-colonial Philippines wouldn't be united because of different regional/cultural differences... If anything, I think two or even three distinct kingdoms would rise instead : Kingdom of Luzon, Sultanate of Mindanao and probably something of a surviving Confederation of Madyaas?
Luzon probably would become like taiwan, Visaya and mindanao would probably become a muslim country like indonesia and malaysia
an exercise in futility - know the past , the accurate facts, and learn from it! -- if not you will just repeat the same mistakes of the past!!! DON'T learn and you die, and disappear from history...
Maayo gyud, Kirby. Higaonon baylan asawa ko. Importante na ang mga babaye sa Lumad nga mga tribu pa.
as a Filipino Muslim I think we would be rich in gold😊 oto oto kasi yung iba ipinagpalit ang ginto sa papel😂😂😂 tapos yung ibang na mondok dala dala ang ginto. at pilit na hina-hunt.na niniwala ako hindi po dahil sa religion kaya meron War kung hindi dahil po sa Ginto at Oil idinadahilan lang po ang religion. kaya kung hind po tayo na colonize naniniwala akong ginto ang pera natin ngun😅
Hindi rin naman magiging iisa Ang buong kapuluan naging Isang bansa lang pilipinas dahil sa mga dayuhan
If only they hired linguists to make a con lang so we can get a glimpse of how tagalog would sound like without the colonial influence
Movies and series like these should be more well-produced. Otherwise di rin papanuorin ng mga tao. Watching the trailer, rather than feeling pride, the poorly made costumes and CGI made me think "ah, modern day Pinas nga talaga to" 😂 I'm sure it was a budget thing. I agree that it's thought-evoking though, and the story might actually be nice.
sadly we'd have 20 different countries hating each other hahaha
Pakiramdam ko lang (base na din sa experience ko sa pinanood ko na notoriously inaccurate ung Iskul Bukol movie ni Vic) may sablay sa The Kingdom movie trailer pa lang nakita ko na ung Phillipine flag dun sa tulay na project ng China-Philippines (nakalimutan ko lang pangalan ng tulay) di man lang inedit. Pati ung inspection ng pulis kay Piolo ung salitang "marka" diba barrowed word un sa English/Spanish? Tsaka duda ako dun sa mga Baybayin words baka ginaya lang yung ginawa dun sa mga street signs na nagtrend dahil mali paggamit nila sa Baybayin.
IMO had the Philippines was never colonized by Spain - Luzon, Visayas and Mindanao would be 3 separate states. 😁
Kanang ngano kaha magsuka jud kog balangaw pag maghisgot nag ingon ani ✨✨✨✨✨
Kuyawa gud 😂
thank kirby for clearing my questions in my mind
What was your questiom?
@KirbyAraullo about the architectures and what could be looking like if it happened in our time line
Nice commentary video for this movie, Kirby and The Kingdom is a very promising movie that every Filipinos should watch it not only because of being a pure Filipino movie that showcasing our country's culture, themes and history (even though it's purely fictional) but it also shows how politics really works from bureaucracy, political dynasty, feudalism and corruption within the government and it really reflects to the political situation in our country today whether our country had been colonized by two Western powers or not, we could still see the problems in our country on politics and this is also the same situations in our Southeast Asian neighbors as well like Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam, Cambodia, etc. and there's no such thing as "perfect government" that could rule a country as what Vic Sotto portrayed to this movie as a alternative timeline of a Filipino sultanate. It's just like the Pinoy versions of House of Cards and Game of Thrones. And if you think that this movie might be a catapult for his political ambition to run for a higher position in our country in the near future, maybe or maybe not even though he had no intention to run on politics for now unlike his older brother, his son, his nephew and niece in spite that the Sottos are well known political clan in our country besides well known showbiz family for decades but if he could do that and run for higher position like the President of our country just like what Donald Trump did then the question is could he handle the pressures, his leadership and the problems in our country? Well, that's my honest opinion.
I think if the Philippines were not colonized, one of the two scenarios would happen...
Scenario 1 (Most Likely) - The sultanates would eventually conquer the Philippines. They are more centralized and organized, which makes them more likely to be more militarized. They would then eventually fight amongst each other. From there, the Philippines will be ruled by one sultanate. Due to their inherent hostility towards Christianity, they would not trade with the Europeans, which would prevent them from learning science from them. The official religion of the Philippines would be Islam. However, after the decline of the Islamic Golden Age, Islam would strictly forbid scientific pursuits, which would prevent the Philippines from having scientific pursuits. Islam would also limit creative expression in the Philippines, particularly in the arts, since it considers the drawing of people to be a form of idolatry. The sultanate would be more and more centralized. It would be more and more concerned about preserving its power. The Philippines would not be a free nation. It will also not be a prosperous nation. It would be stuck in the Middle Ages.
Scenario 2 (Least Likely) - This scenario would happen if the rest of the Philippines form a federation that would maintain peace with the sultanates, absorb the sultanates, or even wipe out the sultanates. This scenario would also happen if Scenario 1 happened but the sultanates end up destroying each other. Filipinos would be more interested in climbing up the social hierarchy. They would also be interested in preventing other Filipinos from climbing the social hierarchy. Some of them would also even be interested in making other Filipinos go down the social hierarchy. They would trade with the Europeans, particularly the Dutch, which would allow them to learn science and other ideas from them. They would have scientific pursuits but most likely as a means to climb the social hierarchy or preserve their place in it. Two of the ideas that they will learn from the Europeans are the concepts of individual liberty and the abolition of slavery, which would challenge the social hierarchy. The Philippines would dismiss and reject the concepts as foreign ideas that are not compatible with the social hierarchy and that disrupt the established social order in it. The concepts may cause the social hierarchy to undergo reforms. The concepts will not abolish the social hierarchy, which will be too disruptive in the Philippines.
Honestly, I think the movie is low-key Marcos propaganda. Right now, the Philippines is having a nationalistic reawakening. However, the narratives of this nationalistic reawakening are more or less under the control of the Marcos Clan.
scenario 1 would not be happening because of the Brunei sultanate being stronger.
the likely scenario is that the British will colonize the Philippines. If not it might be the Dutch or Portuguese. The Renaissance happened in the West and the rest of the world had to catch up by that time. They have superior firepower, ships, strategies, knowledge that made it easier for them to conquer territories. Even Thailand had to adapt to western ideals to survive not being colonize but it took the british and french agreeing to make Thailand neutral so that it will remain free.
Assuming that pursuit of knowledge and art in an Islamic nation is oozing European bias to me. Islamic scholars pursued mathematics, medicine, architecture, astrology, etc.
I would hope po, you will also try alternate history with your deep knowledge on Philippines history and southeast asia, i would say that you are capable of creating an alternate history scenario mr. kirby.
I don't think that a fragmented state like the "Kalayaan" can be centralized. I would see it as like the Federal-style government but with the kings like Malaysia. But since the film was based on Siam rather than Nusantara, I do not think that would happen.
I totally agree with you. When I first saw the palace shot, it really looked like a Thai palace. Overall, it seems like this movie is wonderful.
The will of our ancestor will didnt destroy kahit na sinira ng mga dayuhan yung pagkakalinlanlan naten..
It's easy we will not be named phillippines but still we will be dress the same like we dress like now
Gusto niyo ba ng Tagalog version ng video na ito? 🤔
Wow..Japan has connection with pre colonial PHi..probably the Boat Ronins..
Watch mo yung ibang video ni sir Kirby matagal nang may connection mga taga Luzon sa mga Japanese.
Japanese samurais were hired by Southeast Asian royalties as special mercenary forces.
Better question to answer... What if the Philippine stopping corrupted and helps it's people?
Kudos, mukhang madadali nanaman ni Bossing itong 50th MMFF, ganda ng concept
Sa tingin ko magiging muslim nation tayo
Probably. But since its almost impossible to be an isolated "kingdom". There would be some pockets of other religions. I imagine priests, pastors, and missionaries present.
Majority yes but some areas would be hindu or buddhist
Now Visayans would choose roasted pig and Tuba over Islam
As a Person from Northern Luzon, mahirap yan sagutin...
Chinese Exchange rate to Philippines, Ceramics to Gold 🪙.
At Ming Dynasty Era.
China are Abundant of Ceramics & Philippines Are abundant of gold 🪙.
Trading Traditional.
Or Bartering.
Huh. Guess I HAVE to see this movie now that Sir Kirby featured it XD Salamat po!
that's why there is a document rcognizing andres bonifacio as "pangulo ng katagalugan" but it ahows the whole philippine archipelago
Seems they rely solely on AI rather than historians to reimagine an uncolonized Philippines. Also, isn’t the sun on the flag influenced by the Spanish? Another point to consider is having a stronger navy
Sir Kirby, is it true that in Kapampangan Communities Dayang Kalangitan was also known as Emperadora Kalangitan?
What if south east asia was never colonized and became one large nation
wishful thinking
To put into perspective, the movie is set to the current timeline which is why the setup is a mixture of traditional and modern things.
Hi kirby. Kindly greet naman please my nephew. Juan Miguel Quasco, i often narrate your story about our history with him
Yung baybayin!😢😭
Ang daming mali! Mali lahat!
@@matalino3614 not totally wrong, but many inaccuracies
Thank you for the video. Never imagined to see the day you create content for a vic sotto movie. JK!
Srsly, looking forward on your thoughts after watching the movie.
Salamat! 🙏🏽 You'll probably get to see the movie before they screen it here in the US 😅
Philippines would be an Muslim country easy.
In the Movie we are a Absolute Monarchy nation.
Alt history Filipino films 🗣🗣🗣💯💯💯🙏🙏
Haven't seen the trailer yet myself but I don't like how the tattoos look base on what I can see in this video. Although I do think that the tattoos should have a more contemporary style and design, the ones they went with just look too westernized to me. If I had a say in how the tattoos would've looked like, I would have made them take heavy inspiration from okil and batik textile. This way you can have a contemporary design that can be more easily interpreted by a modern audience but it would still look very much like batok.
Bat di ko feel yung plot nila? Di sana nung pinakita palang yung trailer, nakuha na yung interest ko... Buti napakita mo sir yung info na to regarding this movie.... Hmmm interesting indeed...
they forgot the Majapahit empire in which southern philippines were part of. becaue Hinduism came first before Islam arrived
Jose Rizal about tagalog word real name is "Pepe" to be called him with Baybayin traditional tagalog.
As a person who loves to learn more about pre-colonial history and actually wonder that ‘what if the philippines never colonize’, it makes me wonder if they would include sultans in mindanao. And how they would portray people in visayas. Would it be play as a connection or a vital role in-terms of the trade and agriculture? Because pretty much the story’s economic growth heavily relies on the agriculture. Please I want to know your thoughts
why do they still write in alphabet? and their official language for documents still in English?
A very comprehensive and informative content. I wish you could also do a tagalized version so many young Filipinos would understand the origin of our country.
I think if PH is not colonized it will be a Mandala system instead of a monarchy
Or a rotating monarchy like Malaysia
Absolute Monarchy tayo
Visayas and Mindanao will be separated from Luzon. No way Bisya is going to bend down to Tagalogs.
@@KirbyAraullo
Before Europe
The asia colonialism was Mongol - Yuan and then Ming.
Yuan failed
Ming half success.
There was already a mandala in the 14th century calling the country NUSANTARA = archipelagic country, leading by Majapahit in Java island.
However, this was successfully suppressed by the Ming Dynasty, especially General Zheng He, who sailed 7 times in Southeast Asia.
The leader of Pasai Malaka Brunei Sulu came to the Ming palace.
Meanwhile, Palembang leader was destroyed and the island of Java was divided into two kingdoms
no colonization no philippines no filipinos ..the archipelago and its inhabitants would have been absorbed by the indonesian empire, then later by the dutch, german or british ...northern luzon will have been the exception which is because of its proximity to china and japan and would have been annexed by either powers. Ancient philippine archipelago will have never united into one country...different cultures, traditions, religions and languages will have prevented a unification.
This topic was big mas maganda sana series na lang kesa sa movie hhahaha.
"Pilipina" walang po ito "S" words, because of that, Baybayin traditional tagalog ay walang cross kudlits at may personal preference.
Powerful countries can strongly influence smaller or less powerful countries culturally, even if they are not formally colonized.
I dont think Filipinos clans would be in that dress. I assumed that it dresses or atire remained indigenous not western atire... . Your know just like in school cultural dance which dancers are dressed using indigenous atire(not costume)
step up from ALL and I mean ALL (i.e. without exception) tagalog movies (aka Filipino movies).... way far elevated from all Filipino movies
Like you said, the ancient pre colonial Philippines is more active in cooperation and trade. There were disagreements between them for sure. But I cannot see a united Philippines under one political centralized system coming out of that. Filipinos by nature are laid back. They would raid sometimes but I don't see them trying to conquer other tribes. Without that drive to conquer, we would remain separate micro kingdoms spread out among 7000 islands. It did indeed need for colonization for us to become one nation.
Not unless we get an oda nobunaga, to cause alot of infighting and conquering. might aswell.