Buck/Boost WM-045 - Looks like an LTC3780 (but it's not)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ต.ค. 2024
- Buck/boost converter with 4x TO220 devices surrounding an inductor. But it's not a LT3780.
5V-30V To 1.25-30V Automatic Step-Up/Down Boost Buck CVCC Power Supply Module 8A #Module ebay.us/XeEM6z
SOOOO MANY people get confused by CC CV supplies, and I'm not sure why BUT, here's the answer - What you are ACTUALLY setting is the MAXIMUM current allowed and the MAXIMUM voltage allowed. If the load is varying but the current drawn is BELOW the limit then whatever current is required will flow. When the current tries to increase above the maximum set then the Voltage will drop to maintain operation within the Safe Operating Area of the supply and the current will be limited to what has been set.
1. Setting a "constant" voltage MUST be done OPEN circuit NOT when the circuit to be powered is actually switched ON and drawing current - erroneous setup or "finger trouble" results otherwise
2. Setting the "constant" current is done when the output is a SHORT circuit, OR (If you don't trust your supply) by ensuring a load guaranteed to pull AT LEAST that current. Same thing, BAD setup or "finger trouble" results
If you have set your current "limit" (CC) then NO HARM WILL COME TO YOUR SUPPLY AT ALL. It can ONLY supply the current you have set IRRESPECTIVE of WHATEVER Voltage has been set. The output volts will DROP automatically to supply the current you selected into the load. It is unbelievable the number of people who get this SO muddled, partly, I suspect, it may come from experience with LINEAR supplies of certain designs that ARE sensitive to excess POWER dissipation under extended short circuit, ESPECIALLY when on the high voltage setting! This is because of the way they work intrinsically and NOTHING to do with the correct setup
Under these conditions (as for a battery being charged) the CC CV should be treated as a MAX Volts and MAX current setting respectively. Ohms law will STILL apply - 0 volts will be on the output for a short circuit even with the rated amps flowing (Super Cap at charge start). The problem is that the "load" resistance is effectively changing during use as a CHARGE circuit and under such conditions, there can be NO concept of a "constant" anything! Everything will be in a state of flux. The voltage will be zero (even if set at say 12v) and the current will be the MAXIMUM set until the tipping point is reached (MAX volts setting) when the current will be AT the current limit and gradually drop as the load decreases (the Cap or battery fills up)
If you have a 5v output supply charging a capacitor of ANY value, at zero initial charge, the current will be high (the max allowed by CC) and as the capacitor charges the voltage across it rises to its max (CV) and the current will fall. When charging batteries, the initial voltage won't be zero, but again, depending on the state of charge, the current may be at the maximum level set CC and then it will drop while the voltage will be below the final expected level (CV set point) until the charge level has increased to the point where it has reached the MAX volts (CV set level)
IMPORTANT: You should ALWAYS do 1 & 2 above IN ORDER and ensure your MAXIMUM charge voltage and MAXIMUM charge current are set at the output BEFORE you connect your charge load. NEVER change their values during charging otherwise your charging procedure will NOT be correct and you may well blow caps or batteries as a consequence!
A little trick I learned fixing TV's where it was hard to see the writing on the chips. Spread a tiny bit of heat sink paste on the chip then rub it off with your finger. Sometimes the paste gets stuck on the slight texture of the printing and you can read it easily.
Awesome tip :)
I spent a good chunk of time doing research on this chip on my own, and found that it's a knockoff of the LTC1775, a no r-sense current mode buck converter for high current applications. One of the application circuits is a buck boost converter using three FETs and one diode, same as the circuit!
Additionally there is actually one op amp, hidden under the inductor if I remember correctly. A63A is the number on it.
Additionally you can use it as a buck converter if you just take out the one FET and do some basic rewiring.
Great info, thanks! Very interesting.
Thank you sir. This information really helped
I have one of these and mine isn't scrubbed and it is a STPS20H100CG (which is a 100v 20a schottky rectifier) with three IRL3803L mosfets . I love mine and it works great....very smooth switchover. Thanks for the interesting video! P.S. Those last numbers on the chip are CHN 748, but as stated it is an ST chip. Sorry yours doesn't do CC correctly, but mine does. You just have a faulty module.
Thank You for the magnets on the light bulb trick! That's awesome, Julian!
The very quick kick-in of the CC control was down to the resistance tempco of the bulb. As it dimmed, the resistance dropped and it avalanched down as its effective current demand increased, resulting in the PSU voltage dropping even further. As for the second part current problems, you have two closed loop controlled devices connected together at points within their loops. When you do that, the net loop response could be almost anything.
It’s been quite a while since I watched a video all the way from start to finish.... this type of video is what got me subscribed...looking forward to you making battery packs up..just made a 5s7p today to run my makita fan.... just waiting for the bms
Cheers Syd - Power modules will be a feature for a while - as I kit out the new workshop.
The trim pot pen, do you have a link for that? Super sensible option compared to fiddling around with a screwdriver:-)
They're available on Amazon. www.amazon.com/Potentiometer-Tools-Hardware-ADJUST-TOOL/dp/B06Y6FTGNT/
I get mine from RS.
@@PablumMcDump Cheers for that:-)
@@dogwalker666 Not got an account with RS, Maplin used to be my go to place for anything electrical.
david bone maplin was handy you can get them from farnell if your trade or CPC for non trade they carry most stuff RS has for next day delivery.
The safety rings on probes get in my way frequently, also. I was hoping to see you clip them off, thus giving me the impetus to do the same. They maybe should put them at different heights.
Different heights - that is genius :)
Yep! As I have a collection of DVMs I take a probe from meter A and one from meter B which have the irritating rings at different positions.
You're channel should have been called bespoke cables
Would love a video on your favorite power supplies.
The LTC3780 is up there. There's also an LT8705 but I've never managed to track one down.
@@JulianIlett oh thanks! You are a nice person.
i may be wrong, but i have a chinese psu module, with this one you have to short circuit the output and than limit the current.
I take all my old broken cheap probes and solder Dupont pins to them. Add some heat shrink to stiffen them up a bit and they're perfect. Also, a set with alligator clips just in case. ;)
you say the chip number is 46 something. maybe its a 45.. as in WM-045 as printed on the pcb with a great big arrow pointing at the IC?
I immediately thought the same
I thought the same.
good catch
I feel your pain re: the multimeter probes. I've started using smaller slimmer ones as a matter of course. There's an excellent set of slender little Fluke probes available but they're something ridiculous like 70 quid a pair. For the likes of us, you can buy the ones which are supplied with the Aneng 8009 meters, which are similarly compact, from Banggood for under a fiver, I currently have 3 sets of those plugged into 2 DVMs and my bench meter. I had replace the bananas on one set as they were only just making contact in the sockets of my bench meter, but that did allow me to inspect the conductors, which are just about acceptable. Are they really Cat III/1000V, Cat IV/600V? Probably not, but who cares? I don't make that kind of measurement anyway. The probes are certainly much handier and more convenient to use than full size ones.
I feel your pain as well, because... I mean, it's not a competition but in my experience multimeter leads are the only thing that gets more tangled up than headphone cables.
Can't hear the high pitch as the audio quality is like that of a 64KBps WMA file.
Good on the ears....
Also, would've been great if the manufacturer hadn't filed off the part number....
What happens if you wanted to go from prototype to final product using their module as the basis?
I'd get a ISDT q6, then you would have balancing, what are the lithium batteries going to be used for? Also the ISDT charger is a good price, and will do about 20 amps, discharge at 1-2 amps or so, up to 6s, and operates as a DC and USB power supply. I have the Q8 for 8s ( I have 7s packs in my bank) I gave $60 American for it, it has nice features I haven't even gotten into. The only issue I have is the balance and discharge current us a bit low, but I'm working with 120ah to 300 ah packs, it's not really made for that! It should work with 10-20 ah or less, much better! I usually charge 1 cell at a go, let it rest, then balance charge , so it's basically balanced, because each cell is charged the same, some I parallel, and add a bit of charge to, after charging to 4.1v parallel after all are very close then charge to 4.15- 4.18v per, then assemble, and balance charge, to 4.2v for the first charge, I usually keep them to 4.1v. The ISDT can be powered by any 10 - 30 volt supply, and can set limits and restrictions, to protect the supply, it's a buck boost charger! I run mine at 25v with a 38 amp supply, it will work to do what you want, and it can be calibrated, it's not the cheapest option, but it is a deal for the features, I'd like to get the Q8 1kw version, it's about $80-90
But the 500 watt version I have works well! Good day & cheers!
Can you do a more in-depth review of this module, and the LTC3780, and maybe find out why this modules CC isn't working properly?
It does warrant some further investigation.
The big meter probes are for guys with big hands those fiddly little ones are a pain when testing panels.
I was just going to complain about the horrible high-pitch tone, but then Julian called me "young" :)
I clicked on the video and was immediately greeted by the very loud and painful tone at the beginning of the video as well. My ears are literally ringing. I wish he'd COMPLETELY remove it from the video, no matter what he says the high-pitched noise is still very irritating to people who CAN hear it. His last video with the tone I literally *could not watch* because it was so bad. In fairness, this video doesn't have the noise (it seems the device he's got switches at a high enough frequency) but the intro having it almost made me close the video.
I can't hear any 15kHz tones when listen through my Sony MDR-V150 headphones. In real life I can hear TVs and such. Maybe you need worse listening equipment.
Multimeter probes have always been designed for electricians so they're a bit big for the kind of things we use them for.
You can get needle probes that don't have the annoying finger guards and are extremely sharp for probing tiny parts and poking through flux residue and conformal coating.
'These for example
www.sparkfun.com/products/12078
@Mai Mariarti I have some super sharp regular sized Micsoa probes and I've impaled my leg with them before :)
Shipping to Canada has gotten really expensive lately. Only the super slow shipping options from China are free anymore. At lest that's what I've found from Amazon.
@Mai Mariarti Agree. No surprise when we outsourced everything to the Chinese...
Indeed they are for electricians not electronics testing that's why I have 2 sets.
This seems to imply that the current detection is on the high side rather than the usual ground side. That would make this a useful module for common ground applications such as automotive which isn't possible with the devices which have ground side detection.
Any chance you could check this? It will probably involve removing the heatsink to see if both negative connections are attached to the ground plane.
Did your other boost converter hold the current at a constant level? This looks a bit scary as you could just have it shut down charging on you with little notification. Love your videos.
Error alert, Most of these units drop their voltage when under load if they reach the current limit, which means the current out will also drop as it reached the limit, subsequently, when the load changes (released), the current will also rise. These things merely cut off if the preset limit is reached, therefore, it the current limit control is twiddled, the reading will also rise. Basic physics.. Boom, Boom.!!
This "constant current" setting is definitively not working. I don't understand, because it is so easy to implement this function to each kind of buck / boost converter.
I've worked with busses that have 24V systems. In the schematics they say the 24V rail is +30V. So just go wild on the boost..
Julian, You often seem to be wondering what's going on. Maybe you need to use TOOLS to help you? Try something like www.aliexpress.com/item/4000111246909.html to monitor the incoming power. Then something like this (with a wider voltage range) www.aliexpress.com/item/32992421935.html to monitor the output / load side. And always have your oscilloscope there to monitor. You have the tools, just use them instead of frustrating yourself (and irritating those of us watching who'd like to actually find out what's going on).
would this type of buck boost work with a 2 way radio ? Or are they just to noisy ? I have various 24v military kit and this would mean i can run it from a car battery.
If your psu is not able to deliver it, why not use the charged supercap bank? I use one like that to start my car engine. I would call it Super Power !
Does touching with a cap or something discharge buck boost from creating the spark?
The blinking LEDs are really distracting.
Those flashing leds are "god-almighty annoying"!
And copied from Big Clive...
Hi newbie
I have 3 good 3.5v 40ah cells
Could I use a buck booster to get 12.6v to run a camp fridge etc max would be 10a
Or would it run down battery quickly
Thanks
Seems widely sold on Ali. Cannot find schematic or driving chip spec. 150khz.
(shrug)
maybe this one www.ebay.ca/itm/XH-M401-DC-DC-Buck-Module-XL4016E1-High-Power-DC-Regulator-Max-8A-with-Regulator/162947064840?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20200520130048%26meid%3D3eff9b55b63245018884e4611607cf04%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D7%26mehot%3Dlo%26sd%3D173918158270%26itm%3D162947064840%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv5PairwiseWebWithBBEV2bDemotion%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851
please could you tell me where you e
ordered your red flashing on your wall thank you
Who would package electronics under an inductor? You shouldn't even run traces under them
cue the Two sheds Monty python skit.. now is three sheds!
i do similer kind of thing but with cheap charge controllers i have a lead acid system that solar goes then from lead acid load on controller that feeds a 3s lithuim charge controller i did start with solar on both inputs but found they was not away to combine the outputs so the solar charging the lead acid that then feeds the lithuim works prob not ideal
If you put a metal rod on the ferrite and mic on that - old car trick to hear bad bearings - maybe we could hear the 15kHz whine - lol -.
i found i only need the diode is when the charging battery has a higher voltage than the buck converter i found as long as the converter is powered befor connecting i have had no need for the diode
3 amps at 24 volts requires about 6.5 amps at 12 volts in.......
Watts in = watts out / efficiency of converter
Lets be honest you don't need CATIII cables on 12V stuff
Touch the multimeter probes to the screws.
Yes do wiring while it's live/powered! Good job, dad! lol
The micro may be pic16f676
Does that BUCK BOOST converter claim more then 10A Continuous ? Dhoooooo Never mind.
I analyzed the audio from the beginning of this video and not only is there no 15khz whine, the audio mostly cuts off at 15khz.
I measured 15726 hz at the start
Good
Yeah yeah yeah yeah - where’s the modular shed videos!!
I need ma fix man!!
🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
Sneak peek: lbry.tv/@LBROI:8/Insulate:a
Julian Ilett ooooh yeah, that’s the stuff. 😬
Lol! Thanks Julian. Looks good. Gonna get cold 🥶 soon.
Julian Ilett I know we’ve talked about this before, but Rockwool...
I used some today actually for studwork and flooring. It’s SO much nicer to work with. And the edges of it are designed so that it stays put when wedged between studs/joist.
I know it’s more expensive but it’s well worth it. It blocks sound much much better too
Note: everyone, no I don’t have shares in Rockwool... 😐
I'm planning to have fluffy internal walls - no internal panels. These really have to be rockwool, not fibreglass. So I'll buy a roll of rockwool soon (it's still warm, so there's little incentive yet). My cunning plan to hold the rockwool in place is net curtain wires :)
First..