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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 พ.ค. 2024
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00:00 Intro
00:29 I judge the other side
03:33 Sex work can make the world a better place
07:48 God cares about our sex lives
10:57 I've had trouble in romantic relationships
15:00 I enjoy masturbation
18:43 The sex industry is sexist
21:44 All sex work should be legalized in America
24:18 Sex is the ultimate form of intimacy
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I wish there was a virgin on this episode that was a virgin due to choice not necessarily religion. That would've given another interesting perspective
Yes, I'm atheist virgin I'm over forty, ex lingerie model just to give some background. I chose a non piv sx lifestyle as a woman, but I've been with thousands of men. I'm also an ex sx worker.
I understand your point but following religious beliefs is a choice. Religion doesn’t force your to do anything. That’s what cults do.
That is a choice
Yes, but they chose religious virgins bc they have the opposite stance of sex workers. An atheist virgin for example wouldn't have any problem with sex work, making for a boring discussion. They try to have ppl from opposite ends of the spectrum to see if they can discuss and find any middle ground.
@@bodyofhope why not? An atheist can most certainly be against sx work. A stance regarding sx work has nothing to do with any religion!
I kinda wish the "virgin" side was not only for religious reasons but were for identities like asexuality and being able to see what different perspectives on intimacy could be.
I mean it's not that difficult to remain a virgin for an asexual
@@noemisadventures206 I think they just worded it badly. They probably mean being a virgin by choice because of asexuality. Generally speaking you can be asexual and have sex anyways, but then again why would you want to?
they could've picked me. LMAO
Sex just scares me for some unknown reasons
@@noemisadventures206 were you replying to me?
I mean it could be interesting to see perspectives. I'm not saying it based off of "choice" of being a virgin or difficulty level of anything but it could level a view of how folks view sex.
I felt very weird with the whole “saving a man’s life” or “making men not be violent” with sex thing. I feel like there’s an underlying issue with this that is NOT fixed with sex, but it requires therapy and these people not behaving like feral animals.
Self-control is a virtue
This is exactly what I thought too!!! Like how is this taking back power it feeds into the fact of objectification and digs deeper for men to be allowed to be that nasty. Like we just allow that behavior by never addressing it for what it is which is mental and psychological beliefs
@@Friendly_Neigborhood_Astolfo am telling you!!..
It's a shame you see it like this. The examples they gave were of prior experiences. She didn't make it up and decide what she thought she did for the person.
@@artistetcascadeur I know it’s her experience, but I’ve heard these examples prior to this. It’s not an a isolated experience.
This was the calmest, most respectful conversation iv seen on this channel. Who knew.
Both positions have been firm for centuries. Flat earth, tranz, hyper raciality are all brand new social constructs.
I think it's because they don't belong in "opposite groups" like other video where it's "that VS anti-that". Here, it's just people with different way of living their lives, they don't think necessarily that the other group is in the wrong, they just don't want to live like them
@@mauhine26 true, very true.
Because they don't contradict eachother... While vegans and meat eaters, it speaks for itself.
Also I think both groups might face a lot of criticism in their private lives, so I feel like they are more understanding to people facing similar experiences in that area
i genuinely felt like both sides were super respectful towards each other-this is one of the better middle ground episodes definitely !!
except angie
Very different than when lotus lain was on the sex workers vs religious leaders episode.
Well a virgin literally can’t argue someone who isn’t to be one
@@georgeniflis3149 yes but they could disrespect them and shame them for their decisions, but they didn’t
@@kara5281 I hope the rest of your year is great
It should not be pro sex workers vs. virgins, it should be pro-sex work vs. anti sex work.
I agree, it was weird to see the title at first.
Anti sex work people HATE speaking to sex workers
I actually think it's better this way, in this context, neither side is inherently against the other, but if it was pro sex work vs anti sex work, then there is a side obviously being attacked here,, it's like if you were to have gay people vs homophobes, one of the sides is very obviously attacked and antagonize by the other side,,, I believe having a more level ground of "here's two ways of viewing and interacting with sex that can coexist" instead of a pro xyz vs anti xyz concept which pits them against each other, often with one of the sides facing overt hate,, but that's just my take on it I guess
it wasn't pro sex workers though? it was just sex workers? like people who have a lot of sex, contrary to people who haven't had any?
Those Anti-Sex Worker People are locked up Prison serving life or on Death Row, Facts!
That guy saying he has to save his sex drive for work and he can't give that to his future wife is the most depressing thing I've ever heard
Same
That’s insane
Comparing being a nurse to a sex worker is crazzzzzzy😂
Came through at the end
I feel like they could have gotten people that are virgins for different reasons other than religion for the sake of more opinions
like iamLucid
Agreed. This Made their side of the argument Stale . I always Pause these Videos in between different prompts and Try to check and form an opinion & in This Episode The Virgin side didn't gave me any fruitful inputs.
Tbh, almost 90% of people that are virgins are that because of religion. Others are probably virgins because they can't get laid ( incels) it'll be really difficult to find a person that isn't a virgin because of religion.
@@nonsomokwuah That's Actually true
I agree. For a lot of people, they're virgins because it just hasn't happened yet. For me, I don't want to engage in sex until I find someone that I have a strong emotional bond with. That doesn't mean they're gonna be my forever person, but I have to be emotionally attracted to them. And that hasn't happened yet for me
i think it would be really interesting to have an episode of sex workers versus ex sex workers. i believe that would provide a lot more perspective on how sex work affects people who get involved in it.
That would be interesting.
Yes very interesting!
Also different kinds of sex workers. I'm happy they choose their work that way, it should be like the. But is not the case for all sex workers. But of course, is difficult to find forced sex workers for this kind of dynamic, the pimp wouldn't allow it
Yes.
I agree!
This is one of the most mutually respected videos I've watched on middle ground. Neither side was harshly judging anyone and they were laughing and learning together.
it'd be interesting to have a video from chosen sexworkers and people who were trafficked bc it is two very different worlds
I’m triggered and traumatized by this statement and I’m not of either world. That would be a VERY interesting one!
I don't think anyone on this panel is for slavery, which is what sex trafficking is. Let's not conflate voluntary sex work with forced or coerced sex work.
@@e.pluribusunum7916 mmmmm... We can have different perspectives, and that's okay! You can get trafficked in many ways. I work with a lot of victims who were voluntary at first and then it all got out of control.
I don't believe there is a lot of instances where sexwork is voluntary (i was in the field for 10 years), and I think it's kind of gross to glamourize the industry as an empowering choice for women who have the money and safety to do it that way, all while women and children are still suffering, sacrificing their bodies for survival.
I mean, one side is consenting and one side isn't. It's like saying you want one side to be people who have had sex and one side to be people who were r@ped.
@@E.primordial94 That's like saying we should stop having sex, because there are people who r@pe. Have you ever considered the fact that trafficking wouldn't be such a thing, if prostitution were legalised? There would be so many regulations involved, that they wouldn't be able to hide away as easily. Sometimes, making things illegal doesn't make it dissappear; it just makes it worse.
I hate how society has made being a virgin something to be ashamed of. Not everyone is sexual.
I agree. It makes me feel like im unwanted, or disgusting, unlovable.
I hate how society made being a not a virgin a shameful thing.
I feel like it's the opposite, a big chunk of society glorifies being a virgin as some sort holy grail of religious purity
From this video it looks like the virgins are doing the shaming 😒
@@xellffs6258 That's not true. There is a stigma only if you had a LOT of partners (not saying it's right). The standards once you reach your 20s and up is definitely not to still be a virgin. If you are it's weird, something is wrong with you etc.
I’m sorry homegirl lost me when she said we save marriages 😂😂
Same 😄😄😄
I agreed with her on everything except that. If I found out my husband did that marriage over. In fact of it came down to that I would rather the marriage be over instead
@@darkangelprincess101 but you wouldn't know, so you'll be fine and so will your marriage, that's the success in her words playing through
Not all marriages have sex at the center of the relationship, and put more value on emotional intimacy, companionship. One spouse may be unable to have sex, so the other will go outside the marriage to meet that need. This even happens sometimes with the other spouse's consent.
@@thegreatwesternbengalproje2863 gross if my husband killed my mom and I didn’t know that does that mean it helps my marriage? Not knowing doesn’t mean it’s okay
"She's _only_ slept with _13_ people" is wild 😭
Fr
Oh.....
Is it?
@@TheBritishCigarette THATS ALOT
@@JosephineSimmons776 oh....
Huh.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I really wish they got virgins who were either virgins not by choice, or virgins who aren’t interested in sex, or just virgins who weren’t virgins purely for religious reasons
I feel like virgins who aren't virgins by choice would agree with the sex workers a lot more tbh, would still be interesting but I listen for the disagreements as that's what I believe drives the fruitful conversations on this channel
most people aren't virgins by choice. Some just cant get action
I found the idea of “not everyone should watch porn” interesting as it made me think of my friends who just shouldn’t watch horror movies as it really affects them negatively (like literally makes them anxious and paranoid etc..)
I love that they talked about that. How porn is just entertainment not reality and how it has a negative effect on people. I always felt like a prude or left out to admit that I dont like watching it
This goes to the heart of so many things. Porn is a tool. It can be used well. It can be abused. Simply because some people abuse it, doesn’t mean no one should have access to it or the tool is inherently bad. In the same way as there’s bad and unethical porn, some tolls are badly made some are not. But it doesn’t mean the tool is inherently bad and should be banned.
@@MikeCruzable this!!!
@@MikeCruzable This is false. Pornography is inherently destructive. It’s not just entertainment. Some things belong in the privacy of a bedroom away from the eyes of the world. This is one of them.
@@katethegreat4918 it might be false for YOU but it is not objectively false. Many couple - married and not married - have benefited from using porn as a tool. Many people with various medical conditions or people in a variety of situations have benefited from it. It’s also helpful for the occasional entertainment for some people. What’s unhealthy is obsessive use, addiction, or extreme or unethical porn exposure to people who are undereducated or too young, or porn paired with bad sex education/bad parenting. But again, like any tool, this is true. This is also true of most medical drugs, this is also true of marihuana, alcohol, and cigarettes. This is also true of exercise, or eating, or shopping. This is even true of religion as we all know what cults and fundamentalism can create. Excess and abuse is one thing, the tool is something else.
Can we see people who are into hookup culture and casual sex vs those who are not. Would be awesome to see.
Less extreme, but that would be interesting.
It would be
I would love love love an episode like this too.
I don't see the difference.
There is actually an episode that is about monogamy and polygamy and is similar to what you’re saying
I'm so happy to see Nathan here again. He seems like such a nice, respectful person, I remember him from the video with his fiancé. The love and appreciation he expressed towards her was so heartwarming. He is great at expressing himself and is very empathetic. Great guy!
Can you tell me the title of that video? :)
What is his last name?
We been seen him 😂😂😂
@@emreayvazoglu7071 Nathan Bronson is his name.
Selling your body is respectful?
I love how respectful everyone is towards eachother :) it's nice to see people have a conversation rather than yelling at eachother, like a lot of these videos tend to be like
It would have been interesting to have this discussion with sex workers and people who are virgins for a non religious reason. I guess it's a different discussion but it would be really interesting
I totally agree
agreed, nearly every episode of Middle Ground has some religious involved, and I felt somehow tired about that. I am really hoping there can be more arguments that is not "because the Bible say"
Agreed! But Jubilee is low-key a Christian-focused channel and they love to bring videos back to the religion
I was thinking the same thing! I'm a person who is a virgin by choice because I'm very selective about who I want to have that level of intimacy with. I've dated people and after even one month (sometimes a couple weeks) of dating them, it's revealed they've been putting up a front and they're clingy or hostile or looking to me to "fix everything wrong in their lives", and it's an immediate turn off. I've also had people say "I love you" when I'd been dating them for a short time (a week) and that just ruined the relationship for me. I'm now finally in a new city and great job and everything, and the pandemic is happening, so that's put my dating on hold. I'd love to see nonreligious virgins who aren't like the psycho "he has to be tall, dark, handsome, with a 401K, and who texts perfectly,etc" sort of high maintenance ppl.
Wouldn't it be more interesting to have virgins have this discussion with virgins for religious reasons? In my opinion hearing why people are virgins for different reasons would be cool.
As somebody who is saving sex for marriage for religious reasons I think it would be far more interesting to have virgins saving themselves for other reasons as well. I'd like to hear their perspective.
Agreed. Btw, just out of curiosity, as someone who's choosing to wait for marriage for religious reason, what's your opinion about countries that make it a criminal offense to do it before marriage? Personally, I don't see anything wrong with waiting until marriage, though I think it's important for such choices to be voluntary
I was a virgin for a while. Initially saving myself for marriage but eventually I decided I wanted to save myself for a boyfriend that loved me and I loved them. I’m glad I made that choice and don’t regret it. I no longer will have sex with anyone outside of a relationship where we both professed that we love each other... but won’t necessarily wait for marriage.
Side note: I found that the shame I faced for having sexual thoughts really hurt me in the long run. I still have a fear of using tampons. I don’t really know the anatomy of my vagina..never put a finger or inserted anything myself up there. I always have this fear & I know that came from saving myself.
Agreed! I'm one of those people. I've dated casually and I've never felt compelled to be intimate with any of them for various reasons. I've had their true colors come out before even considering intimacy and then ended thing shortly after, I've had clingy, controlling, lying about smoking/drug use, lied about not being an alcoholic, no job, sketchy job "car part salesman" aka drug dealer, emotionally manipulative/abusive/gaslighting, and one saw me as their substitute for going to therapy/medication/getting their life together. So basically, my attempts at dating all ended in uncovered lies and varying degrees clinginess and disrespect. I'm a virgin because the guys all played their hands way too quickly. I won't let anyone get to the deeper intimacy with me until they're genuine with me. I had a shot before the pandemic to date someone but their true colors became evident the second we couldn't be in person due to lockdown. 🤷🏻♀️. I can wait. I have solid friends and family and coworkers, so it's not like I'm bored without dating right now
@@cosmeticaffairs7220 exactly! You put it perfectly how I feel as well! I want to wait until a committed relationship where I love my partner and WANT to be intimate with them in that way.
@@HouseMDaddict I relate to both your testimonies before I became a christian. I love sex so I thought I could just casually date. But the thought of a random/unworthy person touching me like that was just so eew everytime I came close to do it.
that woman was proud of sleeping with married men?? gurl....
my question is, do the wives know? most likely not
i’ll never understand how sharing dicks is not nasty to them 🤢
Everyone in this episode was so sweet and supportive of eachother. AND actually willing to hear out the others sides opinions and perspectives and further questioning them. I want to be friends with everyone in this video!
totally
“Keep that pussy on lock.” Lmao. This was a heartwarming and productive episode. As someone who had premarital sex and is now happily married, to me, it’s more intimate when we cuddle and laugh than when we have sex.
Wholesome
Definitely a womem
Only a woman would say this.
@@anthropomorphicOrangetbh no
Sex becomes less meaningful to you when you share it with someone you don't love. In other words, you value it less or not value it at all. Your perspective is proof. It's just like anything else. For example, food. We take food for granted because we are so used to having it until it's gone. When there is a lack of sex all of a sudden it becomes important.
It was so nice to hear everyone's oppinion in this group. Nathan was so respectful to everyone and uplifting.
I am highly supportive of open relationships, but I also support abstinence. I think both are nice.
I was searching for a Nathan comment! He’s just so effortlessly likable
Oh the moment he spoke I knew I was going to like him.
I would like to hear Nate talk about stunt work now. It's like ok I know his side hustle, so pls don't throw a hip out, I wanna see him jump on a car!
Exactly.
I love the way Nathan describes everything. He seems like he's had experience before with educating people about sex work, and I think that really helps open up people's eyes in this episode.
this episode made me so happy!! the way they all asked genuine questions and were so respectful to one another 💌 it must have been a memorable moment for all of them (the hug at the end was extremely cute!)
I feel like Nathan is an incredible person, he has so much respect, talks about things without making people feel ashamed about it I mean it can seem like it’s the strict minimum but I think that I would love having a discussion with him
Nathan's awesome! He'd be such a fun friend
would be a cool dad
do anybody know what his last name is i’m tryna see something
yeah he saves his load for pornstars and leaves his wife dry and she hates what he does, what a great guy
He doesn't have sex with his own wife for the sake of his job... And she tells him that him having sex with younger girls makes her sad yet he keeps doing it...
This is an incredibly privileged, sanitized representation of the reality of sex work.
This.
Yep
💯
Most representations are.
Same for the religious virgins though, they didn't represent the ones who insult, scoff and demonise sex work. There are extreme case scenarios in both sides. The religious virgins were the nicest bunch they could have found but we both know that a lot of them wouldn't have been this sweet to the sex workers.
The audacity to say sex work saves marriages or comparing sex work to being a nurse. Some people are just delusional.
i was blown away by that smh
Genuinely though
Truly disrespecful to nurses. Would they say the same to doctors, veretinarians...? I don't know but It seems sexist 🧑🏻🦯
This!
These people really compared themselves to nurses and claimed selling sex saves lives with a straight face . I cant
@romanaa7070 Ikr🤣
As a Christian I am exhausted from having these conversations and only caring about how it affects men. I had a porn addiction from the time I was 12, and I KNEW that I as a girl could not get help from my church bc of the judgement and stigma that would come after. We shouldn’t only worry about how the things in this world are affecting our boys and men, we ALL deserve that.
How did you get over it?? 😪😪
Yes! I feel exactly the same!
@@theofficial-j-2859 I honestly looked at sex workers documentaries and begin to realize that porn stars are just people again..
@Cece_24 yes, porn addiction exists, but only so far as you can get addicted to say food or gaming, but imo it's far more likely (generally speaking) that you've been peer pressure shamed by our sex negative culture into believing you're doing something wrong... exactly how gay people were shamed into believing homosexuality is a mental disorder or child molestation for example... if you're not physically hurting yourself or watching illegal material, then you're doing great watching porn... imo :)
@Kevin Cobb kind of, it just woke me up to realizing these are real people with jobs. The fantasies went away. There is a vice doc about Japanese porn stars.
In it , one of the male Japanese porn stars was asked if he would ever like his daughter doing porn. He said something along the lines of :
" yes, only if she wants too. She has to realize that porn is a job though. That we have to go back a take certain shots again and again and again...."
Idk if Nathan goes to church at all but he gave us a WORD at the end! He said “intimacy is moments! Sex is not the thing you die for!” Wow, PREACH!!!
damn really, his response was amazing
I want him to do a lecture like that in sex ed classes. People need to hear that!
His father is a pastor. That will always be a part of him, even if it's suppressed.
But it's untrue though... Intimacy is not made up of moments. It's a long term, build up of familiarity and closeness with another individual.
I mean, he did say his dad was a pastor, so I guess he picked up some speaking skills from him
This has to be my favorite Middle Ground episode for sure. I love how everyone's just laughing together regardless of which side they're on.
"Almost every sex worker I know who has gotten involved with the cops has gotten r*ped by the cops". Wow. That is a horrible experience
I know, that moment shook me. They do it because they’re opportunists that know they can get away with it. Imagine the sex worker claiming that the police officer who caught her and took her in raped her. People will likely think she’s just trying to stir trouble and she won’t be believed.
That's not even taking into consideration how often cops will just turn away sex workers who have been raped. Saying stuff like "you asked for it." "that's part of the job" or other victim blaming crap.
Bruh with her being a sex worker, I would imagine she knows a LOT of other sex workers. Like, not trying to invalidate what she said, but maybe a bit because I highly doubt it's true
@@ItachiUchiha-sh6of It shouldn't be "part of the job", of course. Still, I think that the risk is part of the job. Kinda like if you were an insane stunt person, and then broke a leg. When you're then complaining to the hospital worker, I imagine they would still feel bad, but also be like "damn bruh kinda a risk of the job eh?". Not quite the same thing but I mean it is simply an insanely higher risk in that job and unfortunately that's just how it is. Also not saying the cop shouldn't help the sex worker, but like prob wouldn't feel the same way as if a different person had a similar experience.
@Nixulluve Assuming "almost every" is about 90%, you're saying about 90% of sex workers have gotten raped by cops? Not saying that's impossible, but I am because that's like, pretty impossible
Nathan’s support and energy for everyone is just amazing
I know! I think I almost died at 12:20 💀
@@ajaysodumb lol and when he waved at aella walking over and said he was excited to be there☺️pure
he was so excited at the end lol, just like a child tbh! that bye at the end had me laughing haha :)
i agree!
@@kaylanicole5126 Pure? Lmao
1) sex workers do not save marriages. 2) I want to know how many sex workers come from stable, healthy, financially secure families, and have never been financially challenged at any point in their lives. Those are the people I want to hear from.
Exactly, they’re polishing it up like it’s the perfect lifestyle
@@orgith54
Well, what counts as a "perfect lifestyle" to you?
Name 10 people, any profession, that grew up with with all of the criteria that you listed. Having or not having all of those things do not guarantee an outcome . Ijs
They are trying to promote evil
Correlation is not causation. That's the literal bedrock of intelligent conversation.
now this is truly a middle ground episode! The group hug at the end ❤i love this group!
That’s what really caught my attention because I haven’t seen an episode ending like this and it was great to see
The world needs whores, unfortunately. As long as it ain't my daughter tho😁
I see that happen at the end of most of these
nothing wrong with being a sex worker, nothing wrong with being a virgin.
your life, you live it how you want
@MorningStar9443 dad?
Well you can’t just leave everything up to the individual without any values and norms in society.
@MorningStar9443 You are misusing that term.
No, it spreads diseases and decays society.
Agree
I can understand both sides except the part about sex with a sex worker saving marriage. If you’re married, you’re basically cheating and that’s so unfair to the partner. Not trying to generalize sex workers. Just saying, we shouldn’t normalize adultery.
I agree but unfortunately it's part of human nature
@@NineToFiveGamerUC0079 evil is in human nature. Rejecting it for discipline is the hard thing to do, but it is also the right thing.
I don't agree with you. There are health conditions where human touch is painful and in those situations the other partner still has sexual desires then sex workers can save the marriage if it is talked about between the couple in these situations. It allows the other partner to still get that sexual desire they may have
@@EHowdy97 but not if they aren’t aware. she never said in the video that him going to an escort was talked about and consented from the wife/partner.
Exactly
I feel bad for that guys fiancé
Yeah! He literally said, “I don’t have time to have sex with my fiancé” she should be you’re number 1!
@@debgal26 yeah that’s awful can’t imagine how depressed she must feel
Why? She's with him because she wants to be. Theÿ aren't married. She could leave.
i find some of the arguments kinda weird tbh. like that one girl saying about how when violent men have sex, it can help calm them down. i’m sorry but if you are an angry & violent person, you need therapy, not sex. sex is temporary so that will only temporarily fix your anger. and then when that other girl said how sex work saves marriages. honestly i’d rather my partner divorce me & go through that whole shitty experience rather than finding out they are cheating on me bc for whatever reason they feel like they cannot communicate their needs to me.
Agreed
I agree
I personally didn't see it that way. I thought she was more so saying that sex is just another way to release pent up stress that could potentially express itself in physical aggression, etc. Not that they specifically wanted to hurt someone and that sex is an alternative to doing that. Because of you really wanted to hurt people, sex isn't going to deter you from that.
@@etherealnerd but physical aggression is a massive issue in and of itself. if you are physically aggressive, you could hurt somebody & imo that potentially requires therapy, or maybe something else that isn’t sex.
why tf should you be physically aggressive when you are stressed? my mum is a very stressy person but you don’t see her punching anybody. that behaviour is not ok, is unacceptable & sex will not fix your issue of physical aggression.
@@etherealnerd why anyone would want to release their stress at the expense of having someone sexually? Maybe it is not "intimacy" which soothes the anger but a feeling of dominance over someone vulnerable before you?
I’m only three minutes in and I love Nathan. He seems like such a chill, smart dude to have a coffee with.
And fuck with
@@angelgonzalez5766 LMFAOOOOOOO knew this reply was coming
@Ángel González exactly.
Seems like an ok dude. Feel bad for his fiance.
You can get some cream in your coffee if you want mate
I knew a "lady of the evening" who specialized in virgin men who were nervous. She was my coworker (don't ask). I introduced my best friend to her, and now they're married with four children... I wonder how they're going to tell this story to their grandchildren. Hahahaha.
That is awesome!!!
they can always lie. lol
@@ggggg-fo2xq I imagine alot of parents have to.
Poor guy
@@iliseiandrei9158 yeah but they're not ghetto
I can’t believe that woman said adultery with a prostitute can save a marriage 😂 delusional….
i think angie's responses were actually really beautiful when she spoke about her knowing she was a sexual being but only wanting to share that with her husband...
Agreed!
Yea
@@aishaz.a.k7656 u missed the whole point of the video but ight. As if they dont have self respect.....
As someone who is a virgin for non religious reasons, I would have loved more representation (:
Yeah this was more like 'sex workers vs religious people'
What's your reason? Other than it not having happened yet or asexuality, that is.
@@RandomStreak-eo my reason is that I’m waiting to be in a relationship with someone I truly care about and that hasn’t happened yet
@@Oumaima500 me too! Just the thought of having sex with any random person just doesn’t seem very desiring to me
@@arianam.1571 same, it takes me forever to trust someone in a regular relationship...let alone bringing this other part into it.
One of the best Middle Ground videos I've ever watched. It really illustrates what every Middle Ground video should look like.
One episode where I was expecting drama but instead it served goodness and stellar communication
Angie was so sweet and understanding to the other side, despite not personally agreeing with their opinions. What a great conversation this was!
yah it was expected horror when the virgins said they were christians
She even knew what asexual is, 2 points for her 🥰
@@prod.bexerk8997 I’m a Christian we aren’t crazy lol we just have different beliefs the ones who are rude and horrible are the ones going against what our religion says I love and respect everyone no matter there sexuality, religion, or anything like that even if I don’t agree with it
@@lapris7380 😅😅😭I just red my comments again it's sounds way different then I thought in my head, what meant to say is that I expected the sex workers to be super aggressive towards the virgins when they said the were Christians
@@prod.bexerk8997 oh lol my bad
I know this lady didn’t just say cheating on your spouse with an escort perseveres the marriage. Oh what a world we’ve come to 😭
Facts
Right, I had to rewind to make sure my ears were working 😂😂
The world has been worse
Nah because I wouldn’t hesitate to accidentally lock my spouse out of the house and mail divorce papers 🤣
Yes that was ridiculous… their should’ve been a wife there to tell how that does not save marriages
they are so different yet so wholesome on these topics i feel like those hugs are totally genuine
you don't need to be a virgin to be against sex working. these are two EXTREMES.
Exactly
@Electroencefalografista uhm no, they just take opposing views on the same topic. not unrelated extremes
Anyone who's against sex work can't ever give a reason. I get you aren't ok with it for yourself, but that's different.
how is being a virgin extreme lol what. If everyone had no sex before marriage it would equate to lower divorce rates, less single mother households, larger family units and lower crime rates
@@elizabethchwakanowski5067 it's not even an opposing view. not all virgins are against sex work. but maybe they looked for virgins who are specifically against sex work, idk. would explain why they only chose religious virgins.
As a virgin ace, I feel like there's a whole other side to this conversation that's getting missed since the only virgins in the conversation are religious. Nothing against the religious stand point, it's valid, duh, but not everyone is a virgin for religious reasons.
To me, sex work is so alien of a concept for someone who experiences life like me that it's kind of fascinating. Like how someone might be fascinated by a great magician. I have no idea what's going on but I'm here for you doing you boo and I have a million and a half questions.
Yeah that's where I'm at in this conversation as well! Like sex work is such a wild but interesting field of work to me. It's so crazy to me that people really get naked and touch privates but also it's super valid and I wouldn't discourage it.
i think this conversation was about whether or not sex workers and religious people who were anti sex could see eye to eye. As for someone who is asexual this kind of conversation would be one of endearment, not disagreement. the point of the yt channel is for people who have polarizing beliefs to come together and talk about their own experiences. typically people who are of religious or spiritual faith have very conservative ideas when it comes to sex. I to was hoping to see an atheist talk about the sort of topic.
We should have a conversation here, if only there would be a sex worker to talk to
I'm a sex worker. You can ask me
Thank you! Literally came to the coments searching for this. And I totally agree. I would have loved it if they had included a virgin ace and where that would have led the discussion
Hey it’s Jake. The reason why I am strict with my sexual views is for my personal growth. I don’t look down on anyone that does it differently. Much Love ❤️
I appreciate that you are open about it because there are many guys out there who are ashamed and feel as if they are disadvantaged because of the stereotypes surrounding virginity.
I was a virgin until 22. I heard a lot of the same comments. No need to explain why you are as people should respect it regardless.
More grace to stay strong and be joyful, in Jesus Christ name.
I do SW and I respect your views!
From Frenship?
Such a beautiful middle ground episode.
Absolutely loved it. Those people were so respectful of each other.
All of these people were way cool and understanding of each other. This is what the world needs!! LOVE AND RESPECT❤
Anytime y'all do things with virgins, they're always hella religious. The conversation always boils down to what Christians think about sex.
Where are the asexuals or the virgins that wish they weren't a virgin or the virgins that's are struggling to find someone to have sex with?
Not every virgin is a virgin by choice.
Not all virgins are Christians.
This ^^
This thank you. There are so many people who just haven’t found someone they love enough to give their virginity too. That’s most virgins.The religious people are the extreme side.
@@adrianna5378 lol who do you know that loves someone enough to give up sex? 😆
@@imanigordon6803 I meant they haven’t found someone they love enough or trust to lose their virginity with.
@@adrianna5378 oh my bad I misunderstood
Yet Again I’d love to see NON-RELIGIOUS Virgins or Virgins whose virginity is not due to their religion or waiting til marriage
Not gonna find them lol
@@SacredTruthing haha I was one of them :)
@@SacredTruthing I guess I don't exist then xD and I'm not a teenager anymore
@@stupidlysmart13 then what is your reason?
@@lenamichalik1211 then what is your reason?
I love how civil the conversation in this video is, I feel like people on both sides are very well spoken and I appreciate that because I don’t always feel like both sides are fairly represented in these videos
Genuinely loved Angies openes to talk about this subject and share her struggles and have a laugh. This was a cool converstaion.
nathan's demeanor and respect, curiosity and open attitude was so attractive in a person. I feel like his corn is probably so much better than the average main strean video because of this background info on who he is!
Corn? You mean porn?
@@nemamodgeddi5338 no she means corn 🌽 he’s a farmer outside of the sex industry life
Yeah he probably cooks really well made corn
So glad the issue with trafficking was brought up. I wish they had spent more time talking about that because it really is a huge problem that needs more attention. Unfortunately the sex industry plays a part in that and will continue to unless people do something about it. Sex work should only EVER be by choice
This is so true!! Specially in lower income environments and third world countries trafficking is a serious issue being fueled by the porn industry.
Sex work is by definition by choice. If it isn't by choice than it's sexual trafficking
This is a difficult topic and is not one that i feel sex workers have to tackle alone. Let's say I'm a farmer raising cruelty free chickens. Am i also responsible for the millions of farmers who are raising chickens in the most inhumane way? I don't think I have the power, nor the sway, nor the obligation to shut down or change those other farms. I can only be responsible for my chickens and my farm, not the world's.
@@MistaZULE yeah, I never said they did have to tackle it alone. But the industry is blended like that, so they do carry a bit of responsibility being a part of that industry because the industry itself makes things like trafficking easier. As a chicken farmer it says a lot about your ethics if you don't just care about your own backyard, but you work towards ethics in the community altogether.
But also, unethical chicken farming is not even comparable to sex trafficking.
@@Charlie-tq9yb that's not how it works. Trafficking is forcing people to *work*
Many people choose it, and many don't
Sex work is not, by definition, by choice.
I love how straightforward and considerate they where saying their side of the story and the way they tried to actually understand the other point pf view
So impressed with Aella. Rudy and Avery too. It's often the groups you "least expect" who are the most well-spoken, collected and calm on this channel. You learn so much about life in the trenches, more than most do in sheltered places.
That said, Angie and the others were also thoughtful and fair!
Totally agreed with Nathan. Better sex education better parenting. I’d rather my 3 kids have a super uncomfortable conversation with them instead of them learning from porn or their friends
Agreed, I tell my nieces all the time no matter the question. I'd rather they ask me an uncomfortable question over putting themselves in danger.
The only reason why I’m still a virgin is not religious or marital at all. I just haven’t found someone who I feel is worthy enough for me to give it up. I crave giving it to someone I love and who loves me, that would be an experience worth waiting for xx
exactly me too!!!!
Keep it up! Take care of your worth
@@rosegangsta4531 it’ll be worth it trust me 🥰
@@popcornmovietrailer960 thank you so much 🥰❤️
The only reason I’m still a virgin is because I’m 14 and don’t think I can bear the responsibility of a child 😭
I love how the blonde guy asked for a group hug and they all hugged at the end it was too sweet
They should have asked the first question again at the end.
This was probably my favourite episode so far. Such wildly opposing viewpoints, but such respect and compassion on every and all sides.
I'm a sex worker, but I almost feel like I resonated most with one of the virgins - not because of her choice in life about sex (which is everyone's own choice to make, fully), but because of her absolute compassion and non-judgmental attitude. Just wow. What wonderful people.
Saying that sleeping with prostitutes saves marriages is the most fucked up thing I’ve ever heard!!! Ever heard of couples counseling???
this was arguably the best jubilee content I've ever come across. And trust me, I'm an avid middle ground fan so i mean it when i say this, from the depths of my heart. I've seen everything. everyone on both sides was so well spoken, educated, and well-intentioned. i love the way everyone was laughing at each other, lightheartedly. laughter is the best medicine and the best common ground; this video was filled with respect and love for people that have extremely opposing sides. we need more of this.
jubilee if you're reading this right now and you ever want to produce any more content on mental health. please include me. I'm just an ordinary person, but it would be my greatest blessing and i would carry so much pride to be a part of something so amazing and revolutionary. your work is amazing and I have the utmost respect for what you guys stand for and promote. opposing sides having a positive and productive conversation, and people coming together on middle ground is what we desperately need in this country. thank you for all that you do.
everyone inthis video was so wise. you guys did an incredible job with choosing all of these amazing people.i simply cannot get over this video.
I agree to a point, I think Jubilee could of delved deeper in more about the sex trafficking and connections to the industry, instead it was mostly statements about religious views (which will always have a bias).
I agree. I actually love it when they all share laughs cuz it makes them feel like they on the same page. It demonstrates a great deal of respect, maturity, understanding, and communication skills
agreed ! well said.
About the "we (escorts) save marriages" part.
I think it only saves a marriage if both can agree, that they aren't happy with their sex lives anymore but don't want to break up because of it. If they talk about going to an escort service and are okay with their partner having sex with someone else then why not. But if it's happening without telling your partner and they find out about it through another way, it can be really hurtful and trust breaking and then this is the reason why they even got divorced.
The marriages they "save" are already dead, they help keep the corpse intact, for the kids and financial stuff.
They're right though
I agree completely, open and transparent communication is always best in any relationship. However, I imagine in some of those cases, if one partner came to the other with ‘it’s okay that you don’t want to have sex with me, I still love you and want to be with you, but I also want to get my needs met’ would still end that relationship because monogamy is seen as the default and the risk that through that intimacy, that partner might fall in love with someone else and leave them.
Yes, it’s absolutely devastating. My ex cheated on me with escorts. Completely destroyed me
@@aaronweiss3294 not necessarily. there are polygamous people who are in marriages too. I think it's great that people are becoming open about their polygamy, instead of cheating on their partners. and I do agree with the comment you replied to, that escorts only save a marriage if both partners know what's happening and are okay with it.
I love all of their sessions they have people come and do. They choose the people very well. They all stand firm in what they believe and who they all are as people but then they are open minded enough to understand that all people have their opinions and are given the chance to truly express and explain them. Also I love how they genuinely ask each other questions.
Came across this channel recently and I just love this concept. The open end conversations about literally any topic, sharing ideas, thoughts, beliefs, without judgement, and even being open to look the other side of things which you wouldn't have otherwise is just amazing.
We need more openness and inclusively like this in our generation.
i think we need more openess like this in humanity in general
I'm a 21yr old virgin and I don't see virginity till marriage as something amazing nor do I put it on a pedestal. But I do know science have proven that sex with people who u r attached to emotionally is much better than random sex. Th marriage part is mostly a religious thing rather than a morality thing. Being a virgin isn't a measure of how pure a person is but neither is it a bad thing. Having sex before marriage isn't a bad thing either. I hate virgin shaming and sl*t shaming people.
Hi Sunny! I can definitely say sex is not something to be put on a pedestal because even though it is one of the most beautiful forms of intimacy, it is not the only one. I waited until I found my life partner and it was not intentional and that emotional connection makes it amazing because you don’t seek others at all. Stay virgin if that’s what you want because it is a beautiful thing to experience with someone who you truly love and loves you.
Are you virgin because religious reason?
@@Ellieprez I agree with u. I'm just going with the flow tbh I'm not depressed cuz I'm not having sex nor am I gonna abstain from it intentionally. Emotions do matter alot. Some marriages last while some don't. Idk how my life is gonna be but if I want to have sex it's gonna be with someone who I love and who loves me alot.
@@kristianprigl7895 no. Not for any religious reasons. Its just the way my life has been. Idk how to explain it. Btw I'm not asexual by any means.
I think it's much safer to have sex with someone you're emotionally connected to (not necessarily married, but at least in a more serious relationship where the two of you already know each other well enough), because it can be very dangerous to have that type of intimacy with someone you just met at a nightclub or something. You must first know if the person is violent, unreliable, jealous, controlling or has any other character flaws before going to bed with them.
I want to see a Middle Ground thing between present sex workers and former sex workers who left the profession
THIS.
Mia Kalifa
Why do you assume sex workers who left the profession will be against it?
I’m sure it’s a demanding but lucrative job which some might not want to do forever - doesn’t mean they hate it.
If someone quit a travelling circus for a more normal life you wouldn’t assume they hated working in the circus - so why do you assume former sex workers hated their proffesion?
I know several ex strippers who don’t hate it at all but they’ve moved on with life.
@@poocrayon4588 “Tell me you have a low IQ without telling me you have a low IQ”
@@poocrayon4588 where did she assume that they hate it?
This is literally the most respectful conversation ever
NATHAN IS A LEGEND. That talk about intimacy is eye opening
Kind of wish they got more diverse virgins religion/non-religion wise..
Right? How do they get 3 religious people 🤔
Everyone in the video grew up Christian, like…?
@@iheartjbgccb because most adults who are virgins are likely religious???
@@h3llboyyy407 not true
@@h3llboyyy407 not really ,some are demi sexuals , asexuals or simply stucked in a super religious society and cant experience the sexual experience freely without being shamed or even puting their lives in danger
I am blown away by how respectful everyone here was. I think this is the first Jubilee episode where I didn’t hear one sideways comment or any form of disrespect. It was so genuinely uplifting and they were all so well spoken. Thank you to everyone in the video!
The mental games are insane
I can't even imagine how much better a place this world would be if everyone was as loving and respectful to those they disagree with as the people in this video.
1 - Nathan is a very a open-minded person and he knows what he says and what he stands for
2 - there's nothing Wrong with being a sex worker as long as you're protecting your body, and at the end of the day everybody is free to do what they want,
their body their choice
True. But let's be honest would you like to be seen associating with these sex workers in public?
@@dave1T I wouldn't mind. would you ? wow, its 2022 I thought we were beyond this by now, especially the western countries.
why would you mind ?
besides, nobody is forcing you to go "associate with them in public" if you don't want to.
There’s everything wrong with being a sex worker. It is the least respectful profession throughout all of human history
@@dave1T your question makes no moral sense, I don't judge people based on their jobs I only care about how they think, and these sex workers are seem very open-minded I'd definitely love to hang out with them
5:09 I disagree here. You aren't "saving a marriage" by being the sex worker the husband hires to get his rocks off. That doesn't fix their lack of connection, trust, and lust with their partner. I argue that men in those situations need to learn to leave those situations instead of just satisfying their pleasures elsewhere. Also I doubt any of those wives would love that their husband was seeking sex elsewhere instead of communicating their needs or actually leaving the relationship first before cheating.
And she agreed that she wouldnt like to be married to a dude who hires someone else for sex... Then why do to others something you know its not right in terms of morals?
@@MrCheesecake1928 because its a morally grey issue rather than a black and white one. Who knows maybe the husband loves everything about his wife and doesnt want to leave her but also really enjoys sex that his wife cant provide to him. Or maybe the marriage is failing and he should leave the wife for someone else. Noone knows what kind of value sex holds to those men, especially not her. She doesnt have the knowledge to judge whether its the right choice or not.Thats something the husbands should realise themselves since theyre the ones who know their own situations the best.
@@tibi9733 exactly..studies show that not all men that cheats/have sex with another woman while married means that they don't unconditionally love thier spouse.. on the other hand if a woman cheats there's a way higher chance that she doesn't love her spouse and is just using him.. ....
It is still wrong for men to cheat. Tho
“Tell me you have a low IQ without telling me you have a low IQ”
@@thelastkushbendr7091 to who?
This is genuinely the best middleground that I have ever watched
I love this episode a lot and just felt respectful and calm also I absolutely love Nathan. I feel like he is a sweet and incredible guy to know.
As someone who’s been sexually assaulted and has a very mixed relationship with my body and sexuality...this has been such a heartwarming conversation to watch tbh. Thank you guys for hosting this because sex in general can be a very touchy subject. The sex workers and the people who are virgins were so open and understanding...overall I’m happy and a little emotional in the best way possible
I experienced date rape. Traumatizing for me. This open, gentle conversation feels healing to me.
😢💔
@@LL-cs2tr me too. this was great to hear.
Let’s be real. Every sex worker is miserable and sex work destroys relationships for those involved and not involved in sex work
As an asexual, I'm so happy that they mentioned our existence. We are usually completely invalidated in these kinds of conversations.
I noticed the christian lady mentioned it. Is asexuality accepted in religions? Because I know homosexuality isn't in most.
@@somebrid2147 depends, some might say being asexual is perversion of the natural order by not feeling attraction/desiring sex with others whilst others would praise it as a pinnacle of godly purity
@@somebrid2147 Its pretty much abstinence. In one of the books written by Paul I believe he mentions some are called to lead a life of abstinence but its usually not because they lack desire.
@@levinorton8676 are you saying that asexuality is the same as abstinence or that christians see it as abstinence? because if you meant the former, that isn't the case at all. a lot of asexuals have sex, they just don't have sexual desire or they don't have as much sexual desire as an average allosexual.
@@somebrid2147 Asexuality is 100% accepted in Christianity keep in mind that a lot of monks were celibate
17:34 THIS LITERALLY FEELS LIKE A SCENE FROM THE OFFICE
Loves this! So much positivity and acceptance, but still interesting and thought-provoking conversation.
I understand that peoples wives or partners owe you no loyalty but to sit there and say that you're in support of people cheating on their partners in order to "save" their marriage Is wrong on so many levels.
Yeah, I definitely didn’t agree with that take. Marriage counseling exists for a reason!
Fax
So true.
@@NatTheCatt communication exists for a reason! That's all that was needed. To pay for sex is an easy cop out than talking to your partner 🤔
I was about to say… chile… ain’t that cheating? 😭 a better approach to marital issues is directly talking to your wife about the issues at hand
i'm sorry-and without any disrespect to the woman who said this-in what world is having an affair with a sex worker going to save someone's marriage? adultery is a leading cause of divorce! if during a lull or difficult time my husband decided to be intimate with another person behind my back, THAT would end the marriage. i can't even begin to understand her logic or line of thinking
trust me, most people agree with your viewpoint, virgin or not
Not to mention that cheating causes way more damage to the other person than just ending a failed relationship, and I think most people who have been cheated on would agree, including myself. Her point made absolutely no sense.
they’re literally delusional and so self righteous
@@autumn7247 “Tell me you have a low IQ without telling me you have a low IQ”
One this is almost correct cheating is not the leading cause of divorce getting caught is. Two you seem to lack the ability to see circumstances other than your own where this would be a viable option especially if the spouse was informed beforehand. I’m not saying cheating is ok but in some cases it’s not the worst option.
One of the most lovely episodes so far. Such a harsh topic was handled respectfully
This discussion was surprisingly interesting and thought provoking great job finding these people
As someone who was a virgin and waited to have sex with someone and then quite literally fucked up and ended up having sex - I justified it by saying well we are getting married anyway. That sexual guilt pushed me to a really unhealthy relationship and 100% would’ve ended up in divorce. I really caution people to not make an idol of sex because we are animals who have desire and this can cloud or judgement and sometimes fall in love with the wrong people.
I’m not really sure what this comment is trying to say. This seems mostly to be an issue of dealing with regret and not letting regret consume you
@@mariellegomez5089 no
You were being convicted.
Cheating does not save a marriage. It may make the person realize they want to be with their partner but it damages the relationship
The relationship is dead anyway, they're not having sex
One of the best videos I’ve seen from Middle groundEveryone was so respectful and we’re actually listening to each other
This is probably the most interesting and productive episodes I've seen yet. There are still a lot of questions, but it was nice to see people willing to talk to each other rationally.