It's still all I wanna do tbh. If our "wonderful, amazing, SOOOO advanced" medical industry could ever actually help. I'd be in a center in a heartbeat for sure, my passion is still behind the lanes as it always has been. I miss it dearly. Thanks for the comment! :)
I was there once in my teens for a tourney but never when it was Fair Lanes. AMF had bought them out by then. I'll never forget it tho, it was a no-tap tourney and my first game ever there I had the front 9 and all were real strikes LOL. I hadn't shot 300 yet since I was only 16, I didn't shoot 300 til about a year later. Anyway I got really nervous and left like a bucket on the 10th shot LOL. Sad, I remember when they closed, I had a co-worker from my first center that lived just behind it, saw those A2's just sitting in the parking lot, quite a sad site which I saw far too often, I lived off that 24 hour McDonalds just in front of it, went there a lot on late work nights (I worked til closing on all my shifts ever lol)
slyflight Like riding a bike isn't it? lol. I know when I left my old center with AMF's and got some side work on AMF's and was quite a bit nervous honestly. Just like you said, like I never left. It was all still right there
lol, I watch plenty of vids. I like seeing other machines run despite always having the ones at work to watch. You are right, no 2 machines are the same, what works on one won't work on another. They all have their own traits. I really love it, being privately owned we don't have OSHA guards all over. We still take great care when working with them but no useless guards getting in the way. We get 180 w/pins occasionally usually just kids and the reset button. When pressed at the right time, BOOM
Peter Vachon No, it doesn't matter which way the pins enter the pinwheel. Once they are fed to the turnaround pan at the top of the wheel (or turnpan as it's usually called) it orients all pins butt first to be fed to the machine. I can get a quick video for you if you'd like and show/explain a little better. Thanks for the comment! :)
I worked at Rose Bowl Lanes Roseville Mich. We had 48 lanes of very used equipment. At 19, I used to run that gauntlet of of breakdowns during league play, like it was a mechanical obstacle course! One evening, I left the back door open, and a thunder storm outside immediately changed the temp and humidity inside... At that moment, about 5 ball return belts at various locations, just jammed up. One by one, I had to reset them, and make adjustments. If all that wasn't enough, that long hallway behind the machines would entice the other guys who worked there, to launch a pin (like when you bowl) towards you, sliding on that tile floor. You had to time it just right to jump over that flying pin, or get hit! But wait, it gets better... One night, a co-worker offered me something to feel good, and I took it, not knowing that it was acid. Can you imagine, being on the job back there around all of that equipment, stoned out of your mind? I'm lucky to be alive. I remember running on top of the cat walk, saying, wow, look at me! I got so high, that I couldn't pick up a bowling ball, and the walls were "breathing" at me, I started getting sic, I couldn't work. I got a call, Ball return lane 23... I went to the machine, the pin wheel wasn't turning. I just leaned against the machine to hold myself up cause I could hardly stand. I called the front counter and told them lane 23 is down for the night, the clutch is burned out... As high as I was, I was correct, when the head mechanic came in and started screaming at me while tearing down the machine, proved I was right, and we didn't have a replacement on hand. After that whole experience, I would never touch another drug...
Nice demonstrations here too! I just want to say, the machine with the out of range pin, that was one CLEAN deck shield! heh. Makes me really miss the A machines that our center here at home had.
You are a godsend in your work habits. My place is so small I work the desk and run calls. But working in other centers and talking to other mechanics the communication between the desk and back is usually very bad. Improper calls are usually no big deal as the mechanic will see the issue, but say a respot? Wrong pin #'s, wrong lane #'s can cause issues. Another thing I always told the desk people is to never say "pin" over the PA system for a setup. It sounds like "10". It's really cool to see that you take pride in your work and wanna make calls to the back properly. The majority of your calls will probably be 180's and ball returns (as the most things can cause them) :)
***** Well at my other center we had older machines so we just called the lane number and he'd go back and fix it. Then I came to brunswick and found out I could actually break the machine calling the wrong call if they thought I had actually called the right one. So I've been trying to ask the mechanics now if I'm calling em right and if not to let me know what it really is. I learned a while back not to say "pin" over the PA. And I know a lot of times with my speaking some people can't understand me clearly to I try my best to say something that doesn't sound like something else. I think the only way to enjoy your work is to take pride in it so I try to learn as much as possible, as thoroughly as possible. So far the majority of calls are out of range, ball returns, and I think 180's
drgnldy89 That's excellent, more people need to work like you do. Getting quite rare. Your calls sound normal to me, I should've thrown OOR's in as well but didn't think of it since we have the auto kits installed
drgnldy89 Absolutely! I do take a lot of pride in my work. It's by NO means glamorous but I love what I do. I've been doing for over 16 years. My big thing with video is when I made the switch from AMF 82-70's to A2's I wanted to see some video! I had manuals and plenty to read but I wanted to see as well and hoped by making videos I'd be able to help others. Thankfully I've had people that work on the machines say it did help them a lot and even people who work up front now too as well thanks to you! :)
this goes along w/what Rep says... best thing you can do is just sit on top of the machine during league and literally watch it run. look at it as a chain reaction. when the ball hits the pit cushion, it lifts up which trips the shotgun (rake latch assembly), triggers the machine to cycle, etc. if you have some down time, read "The Bible" (service manual) and it describes in good detail on how the machine operates and so on.
Thanks for the comment. I love to show the machines off, there's so much going on back there that most people don't realize. I saw them once as a younger child and was fascinated. Still amazed by the machines now many years later. Glad you enjoyed! :)
I haven't done this in almost 35 years, but I sure do miss it. Thirty-two years working in a factory building car parts, but I still have dreams where I'm watching our pinsetters run.
The bowling alley I work at has these. I heard they didn't make them anymore and are very difficult to work on. I only run back to them on Friday nights during open bowling when there is no mechanic on duty to clear jams and stops. So many moving parts is intimidating. Only have one scar from them, could be worse lol.
Have a quick question. What would cause the pins to play forward in the turret as opposed to laying back against the turret wires? And what would be the solution please
My immediate thoughts would be that maybe the turret wires are a bit too tight (Close to each other) how I adjusted mine (no real adj, you just kinda bend them to get the gap you want), I never really messed with the upper part of the wires, but my procedure was to unlock the spider, and take the pin and at the fattest part (of the pin) against the bottom of the wires, get em as close as possible without any drag on the pin, this also helped with some deck jams and assures the pins dropped straight down into the deck chutes. Another quick though it maybe the spoons on the spider could be bent? Maybe compare the angle of them with a machine without the issue you're having. I suppose the top of the turret wires could be tight too (I never had this issue or a spoon issue but my machines were from late 56 or early 57 so they were TANKS, everything was so well made!). Anyway take a pin and just like I mentioned at the bottom of the turret wires, check the top and middle also, get em as close as possible without touching them or any drag at all. Just some quick thoughts, hope they help, been many years since I've been around machines sadly but I still remember some things! lol. Hope these ideas help you some!
@@Rep2369 thanks. Ran across your videos didn't know if you were still a mechanic so decided to reach out. Will check the width of bottom wires. Have a great new year
@@keithblackketter2395 Well at heart and in the brain I'm a mechanic for life, I fell ill in late 2014 and lost a lot of my mobility so it was kind of a forced retirement physically anyway. I still talk to many other mechanics and will always gladly help any question asked if I can! Hope the tips/ideas help your issue. Hope you have a blessed, safe, and happy 2023!!
One more thing I meant to add was when you check the spoons out make sure both bolts on each spoon are intact and tight. PM at my center was phenomenal so I never ran into it but I do know those spoon bolts break. So just check em out and make sure the bolts and nuts on the underside are there and tight! :)
@@Rep2369 I can understand the illness part. If ok I will shoot questions to you. I got pulled into a center that is?severely run down. I am a decent b mechanic but not much more.
Hey Rep! Hope your night is going well. Just wanted to give you a little life update, instead of moving I am staying in the area I am at, and just got a job over at a 32 lane center with GS-Xs. Any advice for me?
Hey bro! Great hearing from you! I haven't dealt with any GS machine myself hands on. I've seen some in person but mainly thru video and I think you will be fine. They need mechanics like any other machine will, tho ofc this (before this whole string pinsetter junk started) claimed to not really need mechanics which ofc is a crock. Keep up on your preventative maintenance and as always keep them running well, put fires out as always (if there are any repeated calls). I know they will tell you a lot thru self diagnostics so that should make things easier. They seem pretty user friendly, I never really heard anyone complain about learning to work on and with them so I think you're good. They seem to be the best of AMF's and Brunswicks mixed with some newer things too. Just be the sponge as always and learn from the best you work with! I hope you enjoy working with those "tinker toys" as I call em lol :D
@Rep2369 Wow thanks, I really appreciate all that you do :) Oh this next thing isn't a request, but more of a general question. What exactly does the Y-switch help achieve? Only because, like on the A machines that I recorded, which don't have a Y-switch, don't the A2 return tracks (granted, they are different) also have those "stoppers" to hold a ball in place so to stop them until the other track clears?
Awesome! Glad ya found the video helpful! Thanks for the sub also, got some machine stuff on the list of "to do vids" so there will be more to come! If there's anything I can help with or video you'd like to see feel free to let me know! :)
I have no idea why I am watching this. Been repairing these machines for 12 years. Over that time repaired machines for 6 different centers. No 2 machines are exactly the same. (Upgrades, different variations of the same parts, people rigging stuff to last until parts arrive.) Sounds like you love your job as much as I did. (OSHA sucked the fun out of everything. Can't really even do PMs anymore.) Never heard of 'hanging bananas' being caused by hitting RS I usually replace the GB trigger assy.
i work at a 40 lane house and we are having a lot of calls lately and im thinking it is do to the lack of pm's but my fm says otherwise. what do you think? the calls are very random. i actually had one today where the machine was cycling its self every time pins would drop into the deck. turned out to be the 180 link was to tight so it was causing the machine to cycle. it took a wile to root out the scoring, and electrical problems.
this happens a lot at our center do to slow moving pits, (someone put oversized pulleys on them) it causes slow pin setting and front of cushion ball returns.
Me again. Basically, I don't know where to start. Well, i got my "basic pinchaser training/safety today. And i know how to fix a few calls now, i know how to run our lane machine. I can fix 180s, hanging bananas( as we call it) and ball returns. I am somewhat familiar about clearing black outs( power the machine off off, clear the pins on the deck, turn it back on) Do you always have to make sure the clutch is engaged? Also, how do you get a machine out of a 90 and/or 270? PS SHOW MORE VIDEOS (:
This is semi-common at my center, but I'd like to see if you could demonstrate how to clear a jam when a pin is stuck halfway up the deck tube (so you can see the bottom half of the pin only as it's dangling from the deck)
@Rep2369 Oh nice, those automotive guys are great for those things! Oh and for those auto out of range kits, how complex are they, since they make the deck hook lower earlier and also prevent the rake from sweeping. Also maybe a request here, since it may be too complex to show or explain; the detector. I know about the difference in deck movement between standing pins and a strike, but how exactly is it "detected" or is that mechanism way too complex to show or explain? I've wondered about it.
what do you prefer to use on the balls wheels. cork or rubber. or do you use aomething else..we tend to get alot of balls call no matter how much we clean the ball wheels. same as we get ball calls at the Y switch with out any pins. the balls will hit the wheel.and bounce back at times. keep trying to.get the owner to update things on the machines but he's pretty cheap.lop
How are your machines so fast our a2 machines move so slow we have the newer ones with the electric box on the back like at the end. been a tech 5 years just kinda learned as a go
All it is really is the size of the pulley on the motor that goes to the gearbox. These are converted A2's that were never slowed down over the years, still running full A2 speed. Most centers have slowed their A2's down to save on wear and tear, these are also very old machines so they were very well made and we didn't have a lot of issues due to the speed
I used to work in the back for about 5 years as my parent owned and too much stuff as oil and clean the deck and more from 1967 to 1972. But I still bowl since.
Ahh, very nice. I was going to do something similar but honestly it's just not enough of a problem for us as we don't get 180 with pins stops often at all. Many have done as you did though and just block the signal to cycle out (usually tied into the rake down switch). I've heard nightmare stories about the guards, I still know a LOT of AMF guys from my years with those machines. Same deal, LOTO a whole pair to get a call and ya can't see or do much at all
I'd have to say a 180 call as there's just NUMEROUS things that can cause it. A ball spinning at the bottom of the ball wheel blocking pin feed can even do it and that's a ball call problem
@@Rep2369 I personally think that Brunswick stops or problems on A2’s and GS were less frustrated and less hassle to clear than AMF’s, especially at my local mall AMF bowling center with poor maintained 82-90’s that had number of different problems, same thing goes with my childhood mall Bowling Center with GS-92’s before that were poor maintained as well but not too bad, I mean GS Blackouts aren’t a huge deal than Pinjams, Table jams and interlocks on AMF. Only most common problem in our League is missing pins on 2nd Ball, not a problem on GS, we can hit the Set Button on Brunswick 2000 Ball Returns and let the GS Cycle and recover your shot. On AMF that it could take a while for mechanics manually doing it which I personally hate AMF for that, I know same thing goes with A2’s but we our League never bowls on them yet but I know they’re much easier to set than AMF.
@@PinoyBowlerGS92 AMF's just are going to get pinjams. It's the weak area of the machine (aside from new AMF's where the elevator was changed). A little neglect goes a LONG way and you'll have tons of jams if not worked on. And it is NOT (in most cases) the distributor itself, the distributor is all mechanical, very simple tbh and as long as your clutch is cleaned and lubricated properly the dist itself will run great for a long time. The bin and shuttle and feed TO the dist are what cause the jams. I did my best to keep those issues under control when I worked on my old 82-70's and pinjams happened, sure but not very often and if I did get one I would sit on the machine looking for anything suspicious and many times caught issues and corrected them. It's the same on all machines really, neglect is gonna cause you issues. And the manufacturers pushing this low maint owners take wrong and understaff on mechanics IMO
@@Rep2369. I don’t know what our League should do to deal with this crap, I mean I could work for them during Weekends of no school or tournaments, I know all the parts on both Brunswick and AMF but I need to wait for one of their Mechanics to resign and I’m not comfortable on working on their junk dirty 82-90’s, if they don’t have any Pinsetter Cleaners, then I had nothing to do just sit around being lazy, I mean I can’t do that cause I want me and my League Mates to feel better of no more issues. If only there’s a way to make Homemade Pinsetter Cleaners in a simple way. Also I think making adjustments won’t be a problem except the Shuttle and Bins which were a headache.
@@PinoyBowlerGS92 Are there any nearby centers your league could go to? I know a few leagues in my years did indeed move centers in this area due to constant machine problems, damage to their bowling balls, etc. An easy available cleaner for pinsetters I used was diluted lane stripper, worked great on any area that didn't need oil/lubrication, I used it for years, full strength I felt was a bit much so I'd add some extra water and keep it in a spray bottle, I ALWAYS had some on hand, worked great. That and some very diluted bleach and water (like 10% bleach) I used that on the pindecks to help with sliding pins, worked very well and WAY cheaper than the pindeck treatments they sell. Talk to your league officials tho if you can move centers. If machines are neglected it means the owners are either clueless or just money hungry, if the league leaves it gets the point across in both cases
haha. You'll hear it for sure as those pins drop back down to a wheel with no cord.It's weird to see for sure, pins flipping and falling on the left side
We have switches on the 4:1. Any cycle input that happens between 1 & 359 doesn't do anything. So, if I get that I go back and usually find something wrong with the trigger assy. It's not just the guards. We cant even look at a machine w/o locking out the pair. Even for respots and DW. No one follows the rules completely, but if you get caught being on a machine with no padlock on the rear switch you, and any manager who didn't report it, get fired immediately. Tough to do PMs now.
ever since i was a kid that started bowling when i was 3 i have always been interested in the working of pinsetters. thanks for the great videos! 1 question. what prevents the 10th pin from exiting the elevator into the center 5 spot carousel position prematurely?
A pin can actually enter the spot on the turret, but there is a lever that detects whether the deck is properly in place waiting for a full set of pins, and whether it -needs- said pin. (I don't know about other centers, but my corporate Brunswick center operated with 21 pins per machine.)
When the rake dropped down and stopped in front, we always called that a 270. 1972 I worked at 56 lane "Town and Country Lanes" in Flint, Mi. Some league nights I ran on those cat walks like a marathon runner covering stops, ball returns, and pin spots.
would it be rare if the maintenance people would lift up the masking unit to get in to the pinsetter to repeair it, they do that at my local bowling alley
I wouldn't say it's rare. With more modern masks it's more uncommon I'd say. A lot depends on the masks themselves, some sat quite close to the machines and they had to be up to access the fronts. I generally don't leave them up but we have plenty of space out front
as far as i know, it has a-2s, and was made in 1960 and has not been modernized since also sometimes the ball will not return what would cause that. also here is a picture with the masking unit www.easternct.edu/universityrelations/images/images/bowler_000.jpg
***** here is a picture of the back, looks like a small space to me images.indiegogo.com/file_attachments/986719/files/20141104170527-IMG_7809_copy1_.jpg?1415149527
random Not too bad at all, about the space we have. It looks kinda tight but I've seen FAR worse. I've seen pics of back wall installs (as they're called) where the machines are literally against the back wall. Interesting machine setup, definite A's some with come conversions on some. I saw some hockey sticks in the pic, those were only used on A cushions
Easy way to avoid bowler induced 180’s ( former head mechanic on Otis built model A pinsetters) is simply add a microswitch to the detector and hook up one wire of the bowlers reset button to the only position the reset button works is zero degrees. As soon as the clutch engages the microswitch opens one side of the bowlers reset button. Little bit of wiring adding a microswitch and no more bowler induced 180’s. Food for thought
@@matlightfxproductions Well there are some minor differences. From the back you can definitely tell. From up front it's tricky, converted ones do have lowering links so if you see the deck motion and it's a scotch yoke where it slows at 270 degrees to set new pins, def a factory A2. Lowering link movement is either a converted A2 or a later one (Brunswick went back to lowering links in the 80's IIRC before they stopped making them in 1985)
lol, you just love noisy pinwheels haha. Ever see a lane with a turnpan jam from the front? If it doesn't totally jam up and stop the pinwheel you'll see pins going downward from the left side instead of being taken up the right
random You can. It wouldn't work very well. There'd be so many extra pins laying around it would block the bowling balls and they'd get stuck constantly. If you bowl and get 9 that's 29 pins in the back and top of the machine, the deck holds 10, the turret 10, and they'd just be all over the pit with what the pinwheel and CC couldn't hold. I'd run 24 pins MAXIMUM on an A/A2
Thanks for the comment! Yea, it is kind of dark down in the back. This video is from a few years ago, I tend to record more towards the middle now as the lighting is MUCH better for video there
Rep I aS reading comments and I know where a good bowling center is with a scrap ton of lanes, if you go to east hartford there is an ex and center owned by a pan bowler, it's called hall of fame silver lanes, got my first bowling ball there :)
Also its two sided with lAnes on both sides, and ironically it has brunswick 2000 ball returns even when it was and, also I made a typo, i meant was not aS
random The name of that center sounds familiar for some reason, never been there but that name does ring a bell. I love the B2000 returns pry some of my favs ever made
Also has a good pro shop with a good person running it, the person running it used to work at 2 different bowling alleys, both were popular in the area
Great stuff here but tsk tsk. There is nothing about L.O.T.O. procedures. I have also noticed here that your center (lucky you) has not installed the OSHA mandated shields. Prepare for the headache ... ugh. Btw, nice PM-ing on the machine(s) wtg!
LOTO to me in general is a great thing. OSHA however gets totally carried away IMHO. They just go overboard, I always try to mention killing the power to the machine, I personally always unplug the electrical panel and shut the breaker both just to be safe. Been working on AMF's since 98 and 5 years in now on A2's and I still have all my fingers and toes. Respecting the machinery and working safely is the way to go. Most of our guards are still in place but yes we are an independant center so no OSHA guards all over thankfully. The machines do run well, they're not spotless but clean and PM is regularly done on them. Thanks for the comment! :)
I would like to post photos of the rediculousness OSHA has put us through, but I don't know how. But be assured, with the new guards, you can not clear a black out with out removing at least one. Not to mention the latest arrival of the Ball and Pin elevator guards we just installed..... picture this: Place your hat centerd on the step between lanes 15/16 now place a 3/4 wrench on each side.... that's all you have to squeeze through. never mind the sheilds you need to remove to access a basic ball return or TPJ!
I've seen pics and video of the guards. I'm currently uploading a video and I do mention LOTO intentionally thanks to your comment but I just feel they are WAY overboard. I'm all for safety yes but stupidity and laziness cause accidents IMHO. Respect the machines and you'll be fine :)
The A2 at full speed is one of the fastest pinsetters ever made. About an 8 second cycle time. Don't blame the machines, blame the owners of your center. The machines were either slowed down with different pulleys, are short pins (they should have 21 or 22 in each lane) or are neglected and have bad pin transfer in the pit areas. A full speed A2 with a good pit carpet and the proper amount of pins has basically no waiting, it's ready to go
TF2Player Absolutely. Less than 20 pins and pit issues will cause that. You'll see it anytime after a gutter and you throw your 2nd ball or after a strike. At those points you need 20 pins minimum in the machine for no waiting (10 on the deck and 10 up top ready to go)
***** The only time we ever run less than 20 pins is if the machine has problems with double dumping. It is supposed to be a quick fix to get through to the next time we are able to perform a proper repair, but due to use only having 3 mechanics (only 2 of use really know anything, the other guy can barely chase pins) it ends up staying like that for a while. I know its an easy fix, its just a matter of finding a time when we can have more than one mechanic on shift at a time so the one working on the machine isn't a jack in the box having to pop in and out of the machine all damn day, that gets old fast, especially for ball calls that aren't there or someone calling a 180 stop for a rake down when the machine was just started up. I'm done ranting for now, best of luck!
MadeOfSolder Absolutely. I've done it before. Even years back on the AMF's if dist problems (hesitation) I'd pull pins to get it by. Then fix as soon as league was over. The key is getting by to let the bowlers bowl without problems and repair properly when time allows. I feel your pain tho, my old center was 64 lanes on 2 sides and we were WAY short handed mechanic wise, ya just do all ya can. From how you wrote and the stories of dumb calls I can easily tell ya know your way around a bowling center, hope things ease up for ya a little at the lanes. It's summer almost and slow times for centers so hopefully ya can get some work in on those machines! :)
I still look at these videos just for the hell of it. HM at my center. Just memories of when I first started/before I started.
It's still all I wanna do tbh. If our "wonderful, amazing, SOOOO advanced" medical industry could ever actually help. I'd be in a center in a heartbeat for sure, my passion is still behind the lanes as it always has been. I miss it dearly. Thanks for the comment! :)
Very informative. Its been 35 years since I worked at Fair Lanes in Edgewater Park. It's gone. It's a warehouse now.
I was there once in my teens for a tourney but never when it was Fair Lanes. AMF had bought them out by then. I'll never forget it tho, it was a no-tap tourney and my first game ever there I had the front 9 and all were real strikes LOL. I hadn't shot 300 yet since I was only 16, I didn't shoot 300 til about a year later. Anyway I got really nervous and left like a bucket on the 10th shot LOL. Sad, I remember when they closed, I had a co-worker from my first center that lived just behind it, saw those A2's just sitting in the parking lot, quite a sad site which I saw far too often, I lived off that 24 hour McDonalds just in front of it, went there a lot on late work nights (I worked til closing on all my shifts ever lol)
I was just trained tonight, felt like I could use a refresher. Thanks a lot for uploading.
I haven't pin chased in 28 years. It's amazing how everything just came rushing back!
slyflight Like riding a bike isn't it? lol. I know when I left my old center with AMF's and got some side work on AMF's and was quite a bit nervous honestly. Just like you said, like I never left. It was all still right there
lol, I watch plenty of vids. I like seeing other machines run despite always having the ones at work to watch. You are right, no 2 machines are the same, what works on one won't work on another. They all have their own traits. I really love it, being privately owned we don't have OSHA guards all over. We still take great care when working with them but no useless guards getting in the way. We get 180 w/pins occasionally usually just kids and the reset button. When pressed at the right time, BOOM
Peter Vachon No, it doesn't matter which way the pins enter the pinwheel. Once they are fed to the turnaround pan at the top of the wheel (or turnpan as it's usually called) it orients all pins butt first to be fed to the machine. I can get a quick video for you if you'd like and show/explain a little better. Thanks for the comment! :)
I worked at Rose Bowl Lanes Roseville Mich. We had 48 lanes of very used equipment. At 19, I used to run that gauntlet of of breakdowns during league play, like it was a mechanical obstacle course! One evening, I left the back door open, and a thunder storm outside immediately changed the temp and humidity inside... At that moment, about 5 ball return belts at various locations, just jammed up. One by one, I had to reset them, and make adjustments. If all that wasn't enough, that long hallway behind the machines would entice the other guys who worked there, to launch a pin (like when you bowl) towards you, sliding on that tile floor. You had to time it just right to jump over that flying pin, or get hit! But wait, it gets better... One night, a co-worker offered me something to feel good, and I took it, not knowing that it was acid. Can you imagine, being on the job back there around all of that equipment, stoned out of your mind? I'm lucky to be alive. I remember running on top of the cat walk, saying, wow, look at me! I got so high, that I couldn't pick up a bowling ball, and the walls were "breathing" at me, I started getting sic, I couldn't work. I got a call, Ball return lane 23... I went to the machine, the pin wheel wasn't turning. I just leaned against the machine to hold myself up cause I could hardly stand. I called the front counter and told them lane 23 is down for the night, the clutch is burned out... As high as I was, I was correct, when the head mechanic came in and started screaming at me while tearing down the machine, proved I was right, and we didn't have a replacement on hand. After that whole experience, I would never touch another drug...
Nice demonstrations here too! I just want to say, the machine with the out of range pin, that was one CLEAN deck shield! heh.
Makes me really miss the A machines that our center here at home had.
Cool video. I started working at the front desk and still trying to make sure I call the calls right. Nice to see what all goes on back there
You are a godsend in your work habits. My place is so small I work the desk and run calls. But working in other centers and talking to other mechanics the communication between the desk and back is usually very bad. Improper calls are usually no big deal as the mechanic will see the issue, but say a respot? Wrong pin #'s, wrong lane #'s can cause issues. Another thing I always told the desk people is to never say "pin" over the PA system for a setup. It sounds like "10". It's really cool to see that you take pride in your work and wanna make calls to the back properly. The majority of your calls will probably be 180's and ball returns (as the most things can cause them) :)
***** Well at my other center we had older machines so we just called the lane number and he'd go back and fix it. Then I came to brunswick and found out I could actually break the machine calling the wrong call if they thought I had actually called the right one. So I've been trying to ask the mechanics now if I'm calling em right and if not to let me know what it really is. I learned a while back not to say "pin" over the PA. And I know a lot of times with my speaking some people can't understand me clearly to I try my best to say something that doesn't sound like something else. I think the only way to enjoy your work is to take pride in it so I try to learn as much as possible, as thoroughly as possible. So far the majority of calls are out of range, ball returns, and I think 180's
drgnldy89 by the way, I think it's really cool that you take pride enough to post on TH-cam where I can find it
drgnldy89 That's excellent, more people need to work like you do. Getting quite rare. Your calls sound normal to me, I should've thrown OOR's in as well but didn't think of it since we have the auto kits installed
drgnldy89 Absolutely! I do take a lot of pride in my work. It's by NO means glamorous but I love what I do. I've been doing for over 16 years. My big thing with video is when I made the switch from AMF 82-70's to A2's I wanted to see some video! I had manuals and plenty to read but I wanted to see as well and hoped by making videos I'd be able to help others. Thankfully I've had people that work on the machines say it did help them a lot and even people who work up front now too as well thanks to you! :)
this goes along w/what Rep says... best thing you can do is just sit on top of the machine during league and literally watch it run. look at it as a chain reaction. when the ball hits the pit cushion, it lifts up which trips the shotgun (rake latch assembly), triggers the machine to cycle, etc. if you have some down time, read "The Bible" (service manual) and it describes in good detail on how the machine operates and so on.
Nice. I appreciate the behind--the-scenes viewpoint!
Thanks for the comment. I love to show the machines off, there's so much going on back there that most people don't realize. I saw them once as a younger child and was fascinated. Still amazed by the machines now many years later. Glad you enjoyed! :)
I haven't done this in almost 35 years, but I sure do miss it.
Thirty-two years working in a factory building car parts, but I still have dreams where I'm watching our pinsetters run.
The bowling alley I work at has these. I heard they didn't make them anymore and are very difficult to work on. I only run back to them on Friday nights during open bowling when there is no mechanic on duty to clear jams and stops. So many moving parts is intimidating. Only have one scar from them, could be worse lol.
Have a quick question. What would cause the pins to play forward in the turret as opposed to laying back against the turret wires? And what would be the solution please
My immediate thoughts would be that maybe the turret wires are a bit too tight (Close to each other) how I adjusted mine (no real adj, you just kinda bend them to get the gap you want), I never really messed with the upper part of the wires, but my procedure was to unlock the spider, and take the pin and at the fattest part (of the pin) against the bottom of the wires, get em as close as possible without any drag on the pin, this also helped with some deck jams and assures the pins dropped straight down into the deck chutes. Another quick though it maybe the spoons on the spider could be bent? Maybe compare the angle of them with a machine without the issue you're having. I suppose the top of the turret wires could be tight too (I never had this issue or a spoon issue but my machines were from late 56 or early 57 so they were TANKS, everything was so well made!). Anyway take a pin and just like I mentioned at the bottom of the turret wires, check the top and middle also, get em as close as possible without touching them or any drag at all. Just some quick thoughts, hope they help, been many years since I've been around machines sadly but I still remember some things! lol. Hope these ideas help you some!
@@Rep2369 thanks. Ran across your videos didn't know if you were still a mechanic so decided to reach out. Will check the width of bottom wires. Have a great new year
@@keithblackketter2395 Well at heart and in the brain I'm a mechanic for life, I fell ill in late 2014 and lost a lot of my mobility so it was kind of a forced retirement physically anyway. I still talk to many other mechanics and will always gladly help any question asked if I can! Hope the tips/ideas help your issue. Hope you have a blessed, safe, and happy 2023!!
One more thing I meant to add was when you check the spoons out make sure both bolts on each spoon are intact and tight. PM at my center was phenomenal so I never ran into it but I do know those spoon bolts break. So just check em out and make sure the bolts and nuts on the underside are there and tight! :)
@@Rep2369 I can understand the illness part. If ok I will shoot questions to you. I got pulled into a center that is?severely run down. I am a decent b mechanic but not much more.
Hey Rep! Hope your night is going well. Just wanted to give you a little life update, instead of moving I am staying in the area I am at, and just got a job over at a 32 lane center with GS-Xs. Any advice for me?
Hey bro! Great hearing from you! I haven't dealt with any GS machine myself hands on. I've seen some in person but mainly thru video and I think you will be fine. They need mechanics like any other machine will, tho ofc this (before this whole string pinsetter junk started) claimed to not really need mechanics which ofc is a crock. Keep up on your preventative maintenance and as always keep them running well, put fires out as always (if there are any repeated calls). I know they will tell you a lot thru self diagnostics so that should make things easier. They seem pretty user friendly, I never really heard anyone complain about learning to work on and with them so I think you're good. They seem to be the best of AMF's and Brunswicks mixed with some newer things too. Just be the sponge as always and learn from the best you work with! I hope you enjoy working with those "tinker toys" as I call em lol :D
@Rep2369 Wow thanks, I really appreciate all that you do :)
Oh this next thing isn't a request, but more of a general question. What exactly does the Y-switch help achieve? Only because, like on the A machines that I recorded, which don't have a Y-switch, don't the A2 return tracks (granted, they are different) also have those "stoppers" to hold a ball in place so to stop them until the other track clears?
Awesome! Glad ya found the video helpful! Thanks for the sub also, got some machine stuff on the list of "to do vids" so there will be more to come! If there's anything I can help with or video you'd like to see feel free to let me know! :)
I have no idea why I am watching this. Been repairing these machines for 12 years. Over that time repaired machines for 6 different centers. No 2 machines are exactly the same. (Upgrades, different variations of the same parts, people rigging stuff to last until parts arrive.) Sounds like you love your job as much as I did. (OSHA sucked the fun out of everything. Can't really even do PMs anymore.) Never heard of 'hanging bananas' being caused by hitting RS I usually replace the GB trigger assy.
i work at a 40 lane house and we are having a lot of calls lately and im thinking it is do to the lack of pm's but my fm says otherwise. what do you think? the calls are very random. i actually had one today where the machine was cycling its self every time pins would drop into the deck. turned out to be the 180 link was to tight so it was causing the machine to cycle. it took a wile to root out the scoring, and electrical problems.
this happens a lot at our center do to slow moving pits, (someone put oversized pulleys on them) it causes slow pin setting and front of cushion ball returns.
Me again. Basically, I don't know where to start. Well, i got my "basic pinchaser training/safety today. And i know how to fix a few calls now, i know how to run our lane machine. I can fix 180s, hanging bananas( as we call it) and ball returns. I am somewhat familiar about clearing black outs( power the machine off off, clear the pins on the deck, turn it back on) Do you always have to make sure the clutch is engaged? Also, how do you get a machine out of a 90 and/or 270? PS SHOW MORE VIDEOS (:
This is semi-common at my center, but I'd like to see if you could demonstrate how to clear a jam when a pin is stuck halfway up the deck tube (so you can see the bottom half of the pin only as it's dangling from the deck)
Basically lower the deck down about 1/3 the way. Then if it doesn't release itself take another pin and knock it from the bottom.
@Rep2369 Oh nice, those automotive guys are great for those things! Oh and for those auto out of range kits, how complex are they, since they make the deck hook lower earlier and also prevent the rake from sweeping.
Also maybe a request here, since it may be too complex to show or explain; the detector. I know about the difference in deck movement between standing pins and a strike, but how exactly is it "detected" or is that mechanism way too complex to show or explain? I've wondered about it.
what do you prefer to use on the balls wheels. cork or rubber. or do you use aomething else..we tend to get alot of balls call no matter how much we clean the ball wheels. same as we get ball calls at the Y switch with out any pins. the balls will hit the wheel.and bounce back at times. keep trying to.get the owner to update things on the machines but he's pretty cheap.lop
Can you show a video when the pinsetter won't pickup the pins?
How are your machines so fast our a2 machines move so slow we have the newer ones with the electric box on the back like at the end. been a tech 5 years just kinda learned as a go
All it is really is the size of the pulley on the motor that goes to the gearbox. These are converted A2's that were never slowed down over the years, still running full A2 speed. Most centers have slowed their A2's down to save on wear and tear, these are also very old machines so they were very well made and we didn't have a lot of issues due to the speed
I used to work in the back for about 5 years as my parent owned and too much stuff as oil and clean the deck and more from 1967 to 1972. But I still bowl since.
Ahh, very nice. I was going to do something similar but honestly it's just not enough of a problem for us as we don't get 180 with pins stops often at all. Many have done as you did though and just block the signal to cycle out (usually tied into the rake down switch). I've heard nightmare stories about the guards, I still know a LOT of AMF guys from my years with those machines. Same deal, LOTO a whole pair to get a call and ya can't see or do much at all
What is the most common stop on a brunswick machine
I'd have to say a 180 call as there's just NUMEROUS things that can cause it. A ball spinning at the bottom of the ball wheel blocking pin feed can even do it and that's a ball call problem
@@Rep2369 I personally think that Brunswick stops or problems on A2’s and GS were less frustrated and less hassle to clear than AMF’s, especially at my local mall AMF bowling center with poor maintained 82-90’s that had number of different problems, same thing goes with my childhood mall Bowling Center with GS-92’s before that were poor maintained as well but not too bad, I mean GS Blackouts aren’t a huge deal than Pinjams, Table jams and interlocks on AMF. Only most common problem in our League is missing pins on 2nd Ball, not a problem on GS, we can hit the Set Button on Brunswick 2000 Ball Returns and let the GS Cycle and recover your shot. On AMF that it could take a while for mechanics manually doing it which I personally hate AMF for that, I know same thing goes with A2’s but we our League never bowls on them yet but I know they’re much easier to set than AMF.
@@PinoyBowlerGS92 AMF's just are going to get pinjams. It's the weak area of the machine (aside from new AMF's where the elevator was changed). A little neglect goes a LONG way and you'll have tons of jams if not worked on. And it is NOT (in most cases) the distributor itself, the distributor is all mechanical, very simple tbh and as long as your clutch is cleaned and lubricated properly the dist itself will run great for a long time. The bin and shuttle and feed TO the dist are what cause the jams. I did my best to keep those issues under control when I worked on my old 82-70's and pinjams happened, sure but not very often and if I did get one I would sit on the machine looking for anything suspicious and many times caught issues and corrected them. It's the same on all machines really, neglect is gonna cause you issues. And the manufacturers pushing this low maint owners take wrong and understaff on mechanics IMO
@@Rep2369. I don’t know what our League should do to deal with this crap, I mean I could work for them during Weekends of no school or tournaments, I know all the parts on both Brunswick and AMF but I need to wait for one of their Mechanics to resign and I’m not comfortable on working on their junk dirty 82-90’s, if they don’t have any Pinsetter Cleaners, then I had nothing to do just sit around being lazy, I mean I can’t do that cause I want me and my League Mates to feel better of no more issues. If only there’s a way to make Homemade Pinsetter Cleaners in a simple way. Also I think making adjustments won’t be a problem except the Shuttle and Bins which were a headache.
@@PinoyBowlerGS92 Are there any nearby centers your league could go to? I know a few leagues in my years did indeed move centers in this area due to constant machine problems, damage to their bowling balls, etc. An easy available cleaner for pinsetters I used was diluted lane stripper, worked great on any area that didn't need oil/lubrication, I used it for years, full strength I felt was a bit much so I'd add some extra water and keep it in a spray bottle, I ALWAYS had some on hand, worked great. That and some very diluted bleach and water (like 10% bleach) I used that on the pindecks to help with sliding pins, worked very well and WAY cheaper than the pindeck treatments they sell. Talk to your league officials tho if you can move centers. If machines are neglected it means the owners are either clueless or just money hungry, if the league leaves it gets the point across in both cases
Have you ever had a problem with the rake/pinsetter coming down randomly while bowling. no consistency, multiple lanes?
Braedan Brennaman it happens all of the time with a friend of mine, (weekly) and no-one can figure out why it's only doing it for him
Yes my local bowling centers A2 rakes do it sometimes.
haha. You'll hear it for sure as those pins drop back down to a wheel with no cord.It's weird to see for sure, pins flipping and falling on the left side
We have switches on the 4:1. Any cycle input that happens between 1 & 359 doesn't do anything. So, if I get that I go back and usually find something wrong with the trigger assy.
It's not just the guards. We cant even look at a machine w/o locking out the pair. Even for respots and DW. No one follows the rules completely, but if you get caught being on a machine with no padlock on the rear switch you, and any manager who didn't report it, get fired immediately. Tough to do PMs now.
ever since i was a kid that started bowling when i was 3 i have always been interested in the working of pinsetters. thanks for the great videos! 1 question. what prevents the 10th pin from exiting the elevator into the center 5 spot carousel position prematurely?
A pin can actually enter the spot on the turret, but there is a lever that detects whether the deck is properly in place waiting for a full set of pins, and whether it -needs- said pin. (I don't know about other centers, but my corporate Brunswick center operated with 21 pins per machine.)
Me, just for you, if I have some free time tonight I will make you a video on our machines. Any requests?
When the rake dropped down and stopped in front, we always called that a 270. 1972 I worked at 56 lane "Town and Country Lanes" in Flint, Mi. Some league nights I ran on those cat walks like a marathon runner covering stops, ball returns, and pin spots.
would it be rare if the maintenance people would lift up the masking unit to get in to the pinsetter to repeair it, they do that at my local bowling alley
I wouldn't say it's rare. With more modern masks it's more uncommon I'd say. A lot depends on the masks themselves, some sat quite close to the machines and they had to be up to access the fronts. I generally don't leave them up but we have plenty of space out front
as far as i know, it has a-2s, and was made in 1960 and has not been modernized since also sometimes the ball will not return what would cause that.
also here is a picture with the masking unit
www.easternct.edu/universityrelations/images/images/bowler_000.jpg
random Might be space issues, never dealt with those masks so I dunno how close they are to the machines.
***** here is a picture of the back, looks like a small space to me
images.indiegogo.com/file_attachments/986719/files/20141104170527-IMG_7809_copy1_.jpg?1415149527
random Not too bad at all, about the space we have. It looks kinda tight but I've seen FAR worse. I've seen pics of back wall installs (as they're called) where the machines are literally against the back wall. Interesting machine setup, definite A's some with come conversions on some. I saw some hockey sticks in the pic, those were only used on A cushions
Easy way to avoid bowler induced 180’s ( former head mechanic on Otis built model A pinsetters) is simply add a microswitch to the detector and hook up one wire of the bowlers reset button to the only position the reset button works is zero degrees. As soon as the clutch engages the microswitch opens one side of the bowlers reset button. Little bit of wiring adding a microswitch and no more bowler induced 180’s.
Food for thought
This is an A-2 right
Field converted A2. These at heart are old otis A's that got all the A2 upgrades
@@Rep2369 yeah you can really never tell the difference between them lol
@@matlightfxproductions Well there are some minor differences. From the back you can definitely tell. From up front it's tricky, converted ones do have lowering links so if you see the deck motion and it's a scotch yoke where it slows at 270 degrees to set new pins, def a factory A2. Lowering link movement is either a converted A2 or a later one (Brunswick went back to lowering links in the 80's IIRC before they stopped making them in 1985)
lowering links and 60:1. don't expect any shiny machines, lol. only the turrets i've rebuilt and some pit cushion linkages
Why do you not use Brunswick bowling pins
Why not. Plus Brunswick Pins breaks a bit more than AMF and AMF Pins sounds so perfectly on A/A2/Jetback Pinsetters.
fairly new. i know they are in the 100k range (well... almost 100% sure).
lol, you just love noisy pinwheels haha. Ever see a lane with a turnpan jam from the front? If it doesn't totally jam up and stop the pinwheel you'll see pins going downward from the left side instead of being taken up the right
Wait, can you have 30 pins in a machine?
random You can. It wouldn't work very well. There'd be so many extra pins laying around it would block the bowling balls and they'd get stuck constantly. If you bowl and get 9 that's 29 pins in the back and top of the machine, the deck holds 10, the turret 10, and they'd just be all over the pit with what the pinwheel and CC couldn't hold. I'd run 24 pins MAXIMUM on an A/A2
21 or 22 tops
That takes me back :-)
As for ideas, if you could film anything that could help a newer tech (me) to get a good understanding of these machines.
Wish the video was more clear, stable, and better lit in some places.
Absolutely, that's what I usually do just felt like being different ;)
Good video just a little dark in some parts
Thanks for the comment! Yea, it is kind of dark down in the back. This video is from a few years ago, I tend to record more towards the middle now as the lighting is MUCH better for video there
Rep I aS reading comments and I know where a good bowling center is with a scrap ton of lanes, if you go to east hartford there is an ex and center owned by a pan bowler, it's called hall of fame silver lanes, got my first bowling ball there :)
Also its two sided with lAnes on both sides, and ironically it has brunswick 2000 ball returns even when it was and, also I made a typo, i meant was not aS
random The name of that center sounds familiar for some reason, never been there but that name does ring a bell. I love the B2000 returns pry some of my favs ever made
It has a website
silverlanes.com/about-us/
Also I'm commenting on mobile so copy and paste the url
random Ahh, nice! No copy and paste needed, it makes a link automatically. Looks like a nice center. Pretty big too 52 lanes!
Also has a good pro shop with a good person running it, the person running it used to work at 2 different bowling alleys, both were popular in the area
you're running the belt the wrong way. at least it looked like it.
Great stuff here but tsk tsk. There is nothing about L.O.T.O. procedures. I have also noticed here that your center (lucky you) has not installed the OSHA mandated shields. Prepare for the headache ... ugh. Btw, nice PM-ing on the machine(s) wtg!
LOTO to me in general is a great thing. OSHA however gets totally carried away IMHO. They just go overboard, I always try to mention killing the power to the machine, I personally always unplug the electrical panel and shut the breaker both just to be safe. Been working on AMF's since 98 and 5 years in now on A2's and I still have all my fingers and toes. Respecting the machinery and working safely is the way to go. Most of our guards are still in place but yes we are an independant center so no OSHA guards all over thankfully. The machines do run well, they're not spotless but clean and PM is regularly done on them. Thanks for the comment! :)
I would like to post photos of the rediculousness OSHA has put us through, but I don't know how. But be assured, with the new guards, you can not clear a black out with out removing at least one. Not to mention the latest arrival of the Ball and Pin elevator guards we just installed..... picture this: Place your hat centerd on the step between lanes 15/16 now place a 3/4 wrench on each side.... that's all you have to squeeze through. never mind the sheilds you need to remove to access a basic ball return or TPJ!
I've seen pics and video of the guards. I'm currently uploading a video and I do mention LOTO intentionally thanks to your comment but I just feel they are WAY overboard. I'm all for safety yes but stupidity and laziness cause accidents IMHO. Respect the machines and you'll be fine :)
OMG Reps Face!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I've shown my face here and there, not often but every once in a blue moon ;)
Hanging Banana's ?
Its a lousy trade. Doesn't pay that well and you're working your butt off. And management doesn't give you any respect.
bruh the brunswick a2 sucks! I have to wait forever for it to reset!
The A2 at full speed is one of the fastest pinsetters ever made. About an 8 second cycle time. Don't blame the machines, blame the owners of your center. The machines were either slowed down with different pulleys, are short pins (they should have 21 or 22 in each lane) or are neglected and have bad pin transfer in the pit areas. A full speed A2 with a good pit carpet and the proper amount of pins has basically no waiting, it's ready to go
***** maybe it it short of pins cause after the second throw it has to wait for the rest of the pins to fill up
TF2Player Absolutely. Less than 20 pins and pit issues will cause that. You'll see it anytime after a gutter and you throw your 2nd ball or after a strike. At those points you need 20 pins minimum in the machine for no waiting (10 on the deck and 10 up top ready to go)
***** The only time we ever run less than 20 pins is if the machine has problems with double dumping. It is supposed to be a quick fix to get through to the next time we are able to perform a proper repair, but due to use only having 3 mechanics (only 2 of use really know anything, the other guy can barely chase pins) it ends up staying like that for a while. I know its an easy fix, its just a matter of finding a time when we can have more than one mechanic on shift at a time so the one working on the machine isn't a jack in the box having to pop in and out of the machine all damn day, that gets old fast, especially for ball calls that aren't there or someone calling a 180 stop for a rake down when the machine was just started up. I'm done ranting for now, best of luck!
MadeOfSolder Absolutely. I've done it before. Even years back on the AMF's if dist problems (hesitation) I'd pull pins to get it by. Then fix as soon as league was over. The key is getting by to let the bowlers bowl without problems and repair properly when time allows. I feel your pain tho, my old center was 64 lanes on 2 sides and we were WAY short handed mechanic wise, ya just do all ya can. From how you wrote and the stories of dumb calls I can easily tell ya know your way around a bowling center, hope things ease up for ya a little at the lanes. It's summer almost and slow times for centers so hopefully ya can get some work in on those machines! :)
Hopefully you’re not on the oil. I don’t want your foot sliding carry down on my shot lol
Do you want your machine fixed or not