They also help close the gaps in a gauntlet. The metacarpal is protected in most steel gauntlets, but points can go into the palm, which is hard to do much about, or the top or bottom of the hand, which a rondel dagger prevents.
You prolly dont give a shit but if you're bored like me atm you can stream pretty much all of the latest series on instaflixxer. I've been binge watching with my gf these days :)
I suspect that "guarding the hand" was the primary driver of development into the form we know, but other things like retention/draw with a gauntleted hand, application of pressure from behind, etc were ancillary uses and optimizations that helped refine that form after the initial push.
Great video Dave. Tod, in one of his more recent videos, mused that the rear rondel could assist drawing the dagger with a gauntleted hand. Stay safe, love the cats.
I don't necessarily agree with your theories on the morphology of the rondel dagger. But that is an absolutely stunning specimen you have(the first one shown) there, and the cats are gorgeous!😁
I completely agree, but I wouldn't dismiss the idea of applying more force to the back rondel. For example, if my opponent is in armor, and I manage to get him on the ground, I'd make sure that my dagger penetrates his mail or gambeson. Pushing on the back rondel and applying body weight would surely make that easier. But again, that is when it's used as a specialised weapon.
Actually the roundel is to deliver force from the hand to the blade effectively. The disks also cover the hole in gauntlets but I don’t think that matters when you don’t draw a roundel until your sitting on your opponents chest. Hand protection does not even enter into it. The man just won’t be corrected too much reputation at stake I guess.
It’s also round so when your struggling on the opponents chest it does not mater how you grab the handle. It takes one second Draw it , stick it, done. No guard needed.
From sparring I've found that the "pommel" rondel is great for smashing into their face if you don't have time or space to turn the blade around to face them
Considering the amount of times i have stabbed somebody through a swept hilt guard (even with a rubber tip on) with my cup hilt in rapier class is is totally sensible assumption.
Kinda my thoughts as well. 🤔 But also think that what Matt Easton just posted is kinda correct to. 🤔 But, yes 💯 a guard n protection for the hand. 🧐🤓💯 ❤️ 🦄 🌈 🌈 👌🏽 👍🏽
Sound historical and martial information (to the best of my knowledge), as always. I agree with you, and think most people underestimate the amount of protection simple disc guards (like on katanas) offer. Cool points about all the different ways to hold the dagger for different purposes, I'll remember that. Just something I think you'll appreciate: th-cam.com/video/ZhpX_SZutRU/w-d-xo.html
Im a novice. Ive Been watching easton. I want to know wheres the data or facts to prove any argument. It sounds like opinions. Good opinions but not fact. So nobody can poo poo anyone else. But as i said, im a novice and new so maybe im missing something
They also help close the gaps in a gauntlet. The metacarpal is protected in most steel gauntlets, but points can go into the palm, which is hard to do much about, or the top or bottom of the hand, which a rondel dagger prevents.
agreed
You prolly dont give a shit but if you're bored like me atm you can stream pretty much all of the latest series on instaflixxer. I've been binge watching with my gf these days :)
@Kameron Leighton yea, I've been using InstaFlixxer for years myself :D
Came over from Matt Easton suggestion; saying because of your good content!
Same
Enjoyably informative!!! And I also enjoyed how calm your two cats are while you swinging those metal daggers around during your mini lecture
I suspect that "guarding the hand" was the primary driver of development into the form we know, but other things like retention/draw with a gauntleted hand, application of pressure from behind, etc were ancillary uses and optimizations that helped refine that form after the initial push.
Now that you mention it when you hold it forward like that, the front rondel does kind of resemble the disc of a modern fencing foil.
Great video Dave.
Tod, in one of his more recent videos, mused that the rear rondel could assist drawing the dagger with a gauntleted hand.
Stay safe, love the cats.
Good video. I would also like to ad that anvil techniques are also facilitated by the rear rondel as well as fucktioning as a strike enhancer
Interesting. I never thought the rondels serve as protection. Thanks for sharing.
I don't necessarily agree with your theories on the morphology of the rondel dagger. But that is an absolutely stunning specimen you have(the first one shown) there, and the cats are gorgeous!😁
What is the specific name of the dagger from Tod's workshop?
I completely agree, but I wouldn't dismiss the idea of applying more force to the back rondel. For example, if my opponent is in armor, and I manage to get him on the ground, I'd make sure that my dagger penetrates his mail or gambeson. Pushing on the back rondel and applying body weight would surely make that easier. But again, that is when it's used as a specialised weapon.
ockham's dagger. the simpler (and stabbier) explanation of an entity is to be preferred.
what size do you prefer?
I like to learn so I like to experiment with various.:)
Actually the roundel is to deliver force from the hand to the blade effectively. The disks also cover the hole in gauntlets but I don’t think that matters when you don’t draw a roundel until your sitting on your opponents chest.
Hand protection does not even enter into it.
The man just won’t be corrected too much reputation at stake I guess.
It’s also round so when your struggling on the opponents chest it does not mater how you grab the handle. It takes one second
Draw it , stick it, done.
No guard needed.
when was the rondel invented?
why are rondels found on daggers and occasionally pole arms but not swords?
I love the choice of word, of "bollocks", considering the existence of the bollock dagger.
The Cats are an extra plus
From sparring I've found that the "pommel" rondel is great for smashing into their face if you don't have time or space to turn the blade around to face them
That’s a big rondel dagger! Who makes it?
Like a tsuba
Exactly.
Considering the amount of times i have stabbed somebody through a swept hilt guard (even with a rubber tip on) with my cup hilt in rapier class is is totally sensible assumption.
Majestic moustache, majestic cats, majestic weapons rack.
Need you even much hand Protection in full armour ?
@Colin Cleveland if you have a good Armored glove
Kinda my thoughts as well. 🤔 But also think that what Matt Easton just posted is kinda correct to. 🤔 But, yes 💯 a guard n protection for the hand. 🧐🤓💯 ❤️ 🦄 🌈 🌈 👌🏽 👍🏽
Sound historical and martial information (to the best of my knowledge), as always. I agree with you, and think most people underestimate the amount of protection simple disc guards (like on katanas) offer. Cool points about all the different ways to hold the dagger for different purposes, I'll remember that. Just something I think you'll appreciate: th-cam.com/video/ZhpX_SZutRU/w-d-xo.html
Im a novice. Ive Been watching easton. I want to know wheres the data or facts to prove any argument. It sounds like opinions. Good opinions but not fact. So nobody can poo poo anyone else. But as i said, im a novice and new so maybe im missing something
Slashing,? Really? Are you planning to slash with THAT?
Seriously?
Read more crime reports of what happens when people use kitchen knives and weapons without guards of any kind. Your being misleading.
So your all wrong, big deal 🔬