I believe the NCR-Brotherhood war is another reason that the NCR is short on resources. During this conflict, the Brotherhood destroyed the NCR's gold reserves in Redding, which is why bottle caps have made a comeback in the Mojave. In the time of Fallout 2, caps were worthless and the NCR dollar was the standard currency. During the events of this game, it's devalued fiat currency.
@@joeyknight8272 Well, the Brotherhood decided that the NCR shouldn't have access to the technology they helped them plunder from Navarro, and blew up the gold reserves of Redding to cripple their economy. I have a hard time thinking that was a justifiable move.
@@joeyknight8272 The West Coast Brotherhood is a pretty questionable organization to say the least. The East Coast Brotherhood as seen in Fallout 3 and 4 are downright altruistic and paragons of tolerance by comparison.
@@Arbaaltheundefeated The Capital Brotherhood chapter under Lyons was more tolerant to "Natives" and even people they met along the way in Chicago and The Pitt
@@Arbaaltheundefeated Uh, not the brotherood under Maxson... They are not tolerant at all, they came to the Commonwealth to destroy the institute but also to clame it as their new territory. Let's not forget about that part
Rivet city was a loose Democratic place with a city council of scientists looking for solutions for purify water for DC area , I loved rivet city cool place to live I lived in the hotel in the under part of aircraft carrier which is cool to live at lol, the security is pretty good for a loose Democratic city ect with black armor which I took a few and can make some money by going rivet city kill 2 or 3 guards take armor and guns go to tenpenny tower real quick and sell the stuff for a few hundred caps and retire for the day in my tenpenny suite , eat some good meat and booze and sleep till morning and look around rivet city ect and live there most of the time and I grown to love the rusty old thing it adds character to the people lol
@Otto von Bismarck but they have some basic reading comprehension skills, a basic understanding of biology, and history. You do know what an amendment is, don't you? Or the song, "California Dreamin"
@@smashfam1 They also has Victor, who will find you no matter where you go. Not to mention that Goodsprings is in a strategic position. There's only 2 ways in or out and one is crawling with deathclaws and cazadors.
Actually, I figured when Ceaser pointed out Tandi's extensive presidency, he wasn't criticizing it - he seems to almost admire it. He says she was voted in "because she had the people's love", and that the 'Democracy' was more or less an illusion. Caeser says that the NCR got weaker when it lost Tandi, referring to her as basically a dictator -- considering that Ceaser's own position is more or less an authoritarian dictatorship, I imagine he's actually suggesting that during this period, the NCR was strong. Considering his own beliefs, it would make sense that Ceaser would see Tandi as the height of the strength of the NCR - the council was almost a formality, being unable to actually move against her, so Tandi's word was essentially law, not unlike Ceaser among his Legion. While the difference between the two might be obvious (Tandi was much more benevolant than Ceaser), his belief that such power would allow her to make the NCR strong would certainly help explain his own position and views on the Legion, and even how he might go to the extremes he did as a means to weed out weakness -- not that it does a lot of good if you side against the Legion.
That's the basic jist of what Caesar is saying. He approved of her rule as a high-point of the republic. What he fails to understand is the difference between a liberal constitutional monarchy, which tend to share Enlightenment values with Democracy, and an authoritarian one.
Not at all. It's likely he understood that but, having seen the NCR have and then lose it, considered it an imperfect system. By comparison, Caeser has the undying loyalty of his followers. They live to serve him, and would gladly die in service of him. Caeser made a system that guaranteed his strength of rule -- the problem is that it guarantees only his own strength of rule, as without him, the Legion crumbles and falls apart. Ironically, in this way it's not unlike the NCR, except instead of continuing to exist as a bureaucratic nightmare, the Legion simply ceases to exist entirely. Caeser wasn't looking for a perfect system that made everyone happy; he wanted a system that kept order, that was free of corruption. The best way to get that is a single-leader system, where the punishment for any act of disobedience is harsh at its kindest, and the death sentence is passed around freely. The fact oppressive regimes are often the most effective isn't an accident; people are much less likely to be corrupt when the smallest punishment you can expect is to be made to fight to the death in the arena.
Oppressive regimes appear efficient because they worship order but generally are ruled through corruption and gaft with a sheet of Ideology thrown over top. Those who appear strong are often weak because they cannot survive the appearance of weakness. Compare the Industry and leadership of the US during WWII with The Nazi's, sure the Nazi's talked a big game about order and Gleichshaltung but the US was led by Sanguine professionals choreographing a logistical miracle to put the most powerful economy in the world in the hands of Seasoned capable Military leaders. The Nazi's, conversely, had a high command mostly interested in misappropriating national resources looting art treasures and building gothy doom castles and building whatever insane pipe dream some quack convinced Hitler of, all while ignoring strategic and tactical realities on the ground: because sunlight is the best disinfectant.
@Michael Wright: "Oppressive regimes appear efficient because they worship order but generally are ruled through corruption and gaft with a sheet of Ideology thrown over top.". Correct. That is why Stalin's way was the only way for a dictatorship to be successful. 24/7 cult of personality, propaganda at full blast, mass murder, slavery and imaginary enemies all around, and a purge every few years at the top (shooting the top men so they don't become entrenched and become a danger to the state i.e. Stalin). It is a horrifying system. BTW, hitler was an idiot living in Stalin's era.
Stalin was envious of America's industrial might, a might he was incapable of recreating even with an Iron fist. Did you know that Chef Boyardee received the Order of Lenin for provisioning the Red Army during WWII? If tyranny is so efficient why does Liberal Democracy have to provide the logistics? Now sure the major agricultural centers of the USSR were occupied but would the Nazis have been able to make it to Kiev had Stalin not purged the cream of the Red Army a decade prior.
God, the Minutemen are needed fucking everywhere. Regardless of my feelings on doing there shit, next to the Followers of the Apocalypse, they might just be the only faction that can say it's desires are purely selfless, and (mostly) executed those desires well. One of the only truly good factions in the hell hole that is Fallout
I’m glad he’s stretching out on the negatives of every faction rather than sticking to a biased on his favorite. It’s great to hear bigger opinions on both positive and negative rather than defending one side and ignoring the other.
Yeah Right The brotherhood are a group of zealots with an act first talk later mentality. Pretty much everything they do, they do through force and nothing else. They consistently show the belief they are the only ones fit to wield advanced technology (Danses immediate response to to the minute men getting artillery is a negative one, as he just sees it as the minute men now having the fire power to blow up, aka, resist, the brotherhood). They have an irrational hatred of ghouls and synths, even ones that are clearly not hostile. They order the death of the railroad solely on the grounds that the railroad makes it harder for them to find and kill synths. Completely ignoring the fact that the synths the railroad helps are completely self aware, and thus indistinguishable from humans in every way but biologically. They want to destroy the institute long before the institute really gives them a reason to, happily nuking the place and everyone inside it. There's really no argument to be had here, the brotherhood are nutjobs who want to horde all technology to themselves, and shoot any one who tells them not to. They hate anything not human, a hate so engrained in them that Danse wanted to kill himself when he discovered he was a synth. They're just awful.
@@Collateral0 You're miscontextualizing the brotherhood pretty hard in FO4. While yes, they see the synths as technology run amok, they don't care so much about their potential risk to humanity so much as seeming them as an abomination that needs to be destroyed. Even ignoring the synth question though, which has many answers depending on your personal definition of what makes a human, human, the Brotherhood are not out to help anyone but themselves. They want the institute gone because they have access to quote unquote dangerous technologies, no more and no less. The Brotherhood cares only about hoarding technology and the nebulous goal of protecting humanity from themselves and nothing else. Elder Lyons in FO3, who actually did want to kill dangerous supermutants to help people was considered a disgrace because he stopped focusing on the Brotherhoods obsessive hoarding of technology to help people with the technology they had available. Elder Maxson makes it clear that he wants to purge everything that he considers 'non-human.' He doesn't care if a synth is helpful, or that many ghouls are just normal people who are suffering mutations as a result of radiation, and if it weren't for the bad PR and the sheer impracticality of doing so he would gladly wipe them all out. As for the automatron thing? The whole reason they went wrong is because the brains used as their processors were those of psychopathic killers who twisted their directives so they could act out their sadistic desires. It wasn't the machine part of them that led to the killings, it was the human. Besides that, the third generation synths are hardly terminators, many of them don't even know they are synths, and the ones that do overwhelmingly just want to have the right to make their own choices instead of being slaves. Even if you don't consider them human, Synths are certainly sentient beings... don't they have the right to choose their own paths? Is Nick Valentine a danger to humanity, or should be be put down just to be safe?
@@AqvaSerpentis Yeah of course, even House is oblivious about the shitstorm Omertas are trying to create with the help of the Legion, Legion has spies on The Strip as well and who knows would he even get ahold of the Platinum chip if there wasn't for Courier's intervention.
luka.cuturilo as well as it seems like to a degree the NCR follows the Geneva convention or rules similar where as the legion doesn’t care and will radiation bomb an entire town, the legion could infiltrate hundreds of their legionaries into the NCR and would slowly cripple them
Litm8 64 the legion would destroy the NCR from the inside, if they could sneak a spy into mccarran then they could sneak a lot of frumentarii into the NCR
To be fair, annexation and conquest are inevitable consequences in the early formation of any great nation. Even the most democratic and peace-loving countries on our planet have a history of war, violence, exodus and genocide that established their borders and delineated the ethnic groups, even though the people living in those countries today prefer to forget that history, or blame it on a more barbaric, uncultured past where "people just didn't know any better". The NCR would be little more than a collection of armed farms or a minor town at most if they hadn't engaged in aggressive imperialist and expansionist policies, and likely been swallowed up by any larger faction that might have come their way. Oxhorn, I would really recommend you read The Origins of Political Order by Francis Fukuyama. He's a great mind that explores how and where human civilization emerged, common misconceptions and compares the views of both Hobbes and Rousseau on the matter. Given the questions you asked in this video, I think the content of the book would be perfect for your interests.
In the 19th century the United States had to make a decision between being straight up Imperialists or just creating a sphere of influence. They had colonized the Philippines at the cost of millions of lives and thousands of soldiers and in the aftermath of thousands of people dying for nothing and the press publishing their warcrimes they rejected Imperialism. Its pivotal moments like these that define what a country is, the early history of a nation sets the foundation and the NCR government succeeding by being more authoritarian and using illegal (by their own ideals) methods like torture and assassination sets a horrifying precedence.
Well, if the Courier does not have high Charisma and Speech and have not completed most faction quests peacefully, then it's almost guaranteed than New Vegas will become second New Reno.
@@marcvandermeyden8000 that's equivalent of saying Jews under hitler were treated badly while others were treated well I mean yeah ncr isn't that great but you can find good people in their group with legion it isn't same thing
This is why I love this game. There's no true 'good ending', all 4 endings have their pros and cons. It is up to you to decide which one is the best option for the future of New Vegas.
I mean, conceptually, yes, but if you care to help everyone and make sure every other faction helps at Hoover Dam, the endings are more or less like this: House: send securitrons tô kill everyone and dominate Yes Man: let everyone down and anarchy happens Legion: RETRIBUTION NCR: everyone is better except that one city wich has TAXES now :( It more or less becomes the official happy ending, even if it takes a particularly pious and diplomatically savy courier to do it. I guess the message here is that you make your own happy ending, that a good society only comes at the intersection of individual and systemic justice.
@@anarcopablo Nah not really, Mr. House doesnt send securitron to kill. Only to secure land. He only kill those who oppose him, and in ending slide, he may / may not kill the kings. Depend on your ending with them. If the kings allied with NCR, they get killed, as the kings would have opposed House. If we ignite the conflict of the kings with NCR, Mr. House will let them be, as he see it the kings are devoted to vegas.
@@anarcopablo NCR ending doesnt actually make everyone better at all. No. A lot of mojave local's already said that the NCR tax are heavy. A lot of them are against it. It doesnt explicitly said in the slide, but implied. In game, it is stated by various NPC and side quests, that NCR arrival lay heavy tax, without proper protection
@@anarcopablo Independent New Vegas is the best ending. So what violence increases? They could join the minor factions for protection. It teaches people that everyone must learn to fend for themselves not rely on one courier like NCR, Legion, or House. In the Mojave, you must look out for your own interests or be exploited and killed. Just my 2 cents.
@A J, bad comparison, there, pal. That's because in those, there is no opposite party with different ideas, and the party itself selects the candidates for the elections, making it so people have no other options for voting. Comparing the NCR to North Korea is like comparing apples to pizza, with shitty ground to stand on...
NCR: a colossal being with a thousand hands all pulling in different directions all to a schizophrenic will, gorging on everything around it to feed itself yet simultaneously tearing itself apart and becoming too bloated to function properly and healthily. Yet it is egalitarian, humanitarian (to an extent), technologically savvy compared to most of its contemporaries and when *eventually* roused can do great things. It is a complex mechanism, missing a couple of parts, with a fair bit bodged together, but for the most part it works. But only if the job you need done fits within the parameters within which it can operate. The Legion: another monstrous entity which is similarly overstretched, which hungers in a similar fashion but which co-opts those it incorporates into itself for one singular purpose, for one singular vision. It lives and dies by that vision, that singular obsession. The problem is that the vision, the purpose, the "one fits all" identity is all wrapped up in and with Caesar, and the mythos of Caesar. And Caesar... is a mortal man. It is sorta like a vast pyramid... but inverted. With everything balanced upon one slender, increasingly fragile pillar. What is probably saddest about these two factions is that regardless of which one "wins" at Hoover dam, they and the Mojave lose.
i'm reminded of hbomberguy's famous takedown of Fallout 3. When talking about previous Fallouts, he points out that the answer to how you do some quests, who you side with, can depend on /what you personally think is best for humanity/, and people can honestly disagree about it. That's New Vegas. For me, even and despite all of the NCR's countless flaws, I honestly never even saw the other choices coming close. It's an actual nation. Somebody else can have a totally different, perfectly legit reason for picking one of the others. Except the Legion. I'm with Boone, and I take him basically everywhere. They may as well be an elaborate band of raiders. Which is kinda fitting, actually.
That's why House is the best option. You cut out the inefficiency of the NCR's bureaucracy, you can ensure the egalitarianism of the NCR based on equality of opportunity by virtue of every deal with House is a mutually consensual transaction.
Thats why house is the right choice. Even the legion is a better choice. Romanization and its ability to assimilate is what is needed in the factional world
@@dodsonbe360 The thing is, Caesar doesn't even do it right. Rome didnt erase cultural identity, in fact it did the opposite, having a policy of "keep your cultures and traditions, just work with us and prosper" that made conquered territories like Rome so much.
I mean, President Tandi was elected to office every time, and she was the most popular beloved President in NCR history. Tandi also did the most to improve the NCR in her time.
@@MutantMasterRace The NCR is repeating the mistakes of the old US, but the Legion is repeating the mistakes of the old Roman Empire. That's why House wants them both out so he can do his Elon Musk nonsense.
@@connorperrett9559 the downfall of the Roman empire didn't lead to the great War but old world government flaws did. The legion may be making mistakes that the Roman's also made but it's existence and inevitable downfall is crucial to the future of post war America, Unlike NCR. But I do agree that house has a good outlook on the future of the wasteland and is a better option than NCR and yes man.
I wish you could form a Minutemen-like Militia in the Mojave (you make a Militia is GoodSprings, can make an independent sheriff in Primm, provide Westside with water, bring peace to Freeside, decanibalize UltraLux, etc...). Yes, Yesman is kinda that, but they’re not connected. Yes GoodSprings idolizes the Courier, yes the Boomers are loyal to him, yes Primm & Freeside owe their independence to him, yes Westside and Jacobstown owe their existence to him, but they’re not interconnected.
That'd be so cool. I see the minutemen (while joining with the railroad) eventually forming something akin to old America, and if anyone could use that, Mojave could.
I see a lot of the NCR's problems mostly a communication's and inability to work in smaller units like almost all decisions have to come from higher up. With the exception of individuals hiring a mercenary crap would get done especially in their military. So like I feel organizations like elder Maxson's brother hood of steel would be more effective than either the NCR or the Legion. I mean other than the racism that he has towards non-humans how he has it set up is he has junior officers giving out missions to their subordinates which playing fallout 4 you'll see small squads taking on super mutants on their own and able to quickly take land in the commonwealth even though they're the newest faction in the commonwealth. Though I may have my lore wrong but when they come into the Prydwyn that's just a portion of their might it's not their entire force. So they aren't exactly over extending themselves they go there and accomplish their goals and generally leave non threats to their own devices
I have a hard time understanding why everybody thinks they are racist. Super Mutants have always been dumb and aggressive murderers who go out of their way to kill every other lifeform in their path. The few minor exceptions do not change the race. Hell even strong is still the monster and would kill you if you'd tell him the milk is not real. Frral ghouls are a fate worse then death. The group the BoS could be """racist""" against are the normal ghouls. But the BoS shot them even during Lyons time. So Maxson hasn't done anything that was done before.
The Brotherhood are an organization with roots in the military immediately after the Great War. So naturally they still use passed down military tactics, and they adhere to the rules laid out in The Codex I’m pretty sure just like the West Coast Brotherhood of Steel.
@@TurKlack Because there are Super Mutants that are murdered on sight regardless of if they are hostile or not and most super mutants in the west arent very hostile other than maybe night-kin but THEY ARE STILL HUMANS JUST BIG GREEN UGLY HUMANS THAT CAN BE CURED.
Thank you for bringing up the usual, "It's the post-apocalypse, there's no values left." The Minutemen disprove this ridiculous notion, as does almost every single settler across the wasteland.
their numbers are few though. in reality, most people would kill you if it meant that they could eat today, and see tomorrow. morals would get you killed in the wasteland.
@Napoléon Bonaparte that's fair but no other political government is better. Wanna know the real reason the NCR is the strongest faction in the waste even above the brotherhood? Because of their democracy. If Caesar dies the legion dies, if house dies, the strip dies, if yes man and yourself dies then your empire dies but if Kimball dies, the NCR survive.
@@JC19171 well.. that brotherhood. :) let's see how the NCR handles true democracy. A type of democracy that is non negotiable. Liberty prime all the way !!!
@@s2korpionic Yes but his successor wouldn't have the loyalty of the the legion people, only the word of the man who created the legion. Cesar was a unique man and I'm sure that any successor would pale in comparison, causing infighting, coups and potentially civil wars. On the other hand, if the people of the NCR have a problem with their leader, then they will simply vote them out. So while I believe that the NCR does have it's problems, it is not in nearly as much danger of tearing itself apart as the legion.
She was adorable the way she talked and how she was so happy to help you out and how she just hunts coyotes and geckos for skins and just gets what she needs no more no less lol😚
It's a failing many great leaders have, not being able to see a world without themselves in it. How many nations across history have had a great leader followed by someone who pissed it all away? How many achievements undone in a generation?
Fun Fact: That's basically the greatest failing of Catherine the Great. She was so afraid of her eldest son usurping her (like Catherine had done to her husband Peter) that she more or less neglected him and forbade him from training in running the Russian monarchy. It's no surprise that Catherine's reign was the height of Russia's glory days back then because she did nothing to prepare after her either
Reminder that he also said at the start of House's evaluation video that it's not to say that House isn't the best option The only one he straight up didn't say was a possible best option was the Legion because honestly that's just the truth
@@rangergxi The NCR is in the US. Nukes wouldn't even stop the corruption here, that we can almost certainly guarantee. Taiwan is a small nation with very nationalist priorities. Very much unlike Brazil or the US.
That's because none of the factions in Fallout 4 are nationstates.... they're cliques, comparable to the warlords of China after the fall of the Qing. The Brotherhood of Steel is a military organization, not a nation. The minutemen are a decentralized militia force who only exist to protect farms and villages, their dream of creating a provisional government was ended by the Institute which is a scientific organization, not a nation. And The Railroad are just a organization that helps to free synths. None of these factions are nationstates nor (aside from the Minutemen) have any desire to be one. That said, even if the Minutemen were to create some sort of government it would be like the founding of the NCR. Loosely centralized villages. Rome wasn't built in a day, and comparing the factions of Fallout 4 to previous games (Fallout 3 didn't have any "nations" either, and no, the Republic of Dave doesn't count) so it is kind of a weak, silly argument.
The US wasn’t a democracy when the great war happened, it was a totalitarian oligarchy pretending to be a democracy, the pre 1969 US would have been able to survive for way longer especially if it had conserved reasources. The NCR is a true democracy that is dividing itself based on states instead of commonwealths which is better for stability and they have probably learned from their ancestor to not nuke the hell out of their neighbors
Throughout my gameplays of New Vegas I've always found the NCR very difficult to work with. It's not a dislike of them it's more...difficult to know where they stand and just how long they can even last for the following reasons. 1) They have incredibly weak military strength. By the numbers their military is strong, but when it comes to actual fighting? It's clear by their state in the game you play that they've been backed to the cliff's edge. Ranger stations are in the dark, Camp Forlorn Hope is a simple blitz away from being overrun, and Bitter Springs is in just as much dire straits. The only reason they wind up defeating the Brotherhood is by numbers and they only defeat the Legion the first time because they blew up Boulder City. (Which may help explain why Caeser refuses to change tactics since with what he had, he had the NCR that desperate). 2) They apparently lack the necessities to farm One of the things that irked me the most was Sharecropper Farm. The ONLY source of food for the NCR in the Mojave. Why? How is that the only source? How many abandoned farms and ranches do you find while traveling around? Locations that are still quite clearly growing crops. There's fertile land around, the only thing they have to do is find the means of transporting water. Which they can't seem to do/think of. 3) Mass levels of unpopularity I've gone through the settlements in my mind a number of times and with the possibility of Jacobstown (maybe) I can't think of a single one that would truly accept the NCR above them. Goodsprings would rather remain independent, people in Primm are hesitant to accept an NCR sheriff, Nipton only wanted their money, Novac has no problem accepting veterans but would rather remain independent, and if anyone thinks Freeside or North Vegas want them? As Alf would put it; Ha! It wouldn't take much for hatred to become a rebellion. 4) Their bayonet first approach It's war, I understand, but the way they send you on your missions is kill first unless you convince us there's another way. Kill the Brotherhood, kill Mr. House (whom we have a negotiated deal with that we'd really like to re negotiate if only there was SOMEONE who could talk to him BUT since we can't think of anyone you'll have to go right up to him and kill him), kill the Kings, kill the Great Khans. Unless you can convince us there are other means. It almost makes me think that places like Bitter Springs is a cover. "We really care, look what we're doing here" and if that's the case... This doesn't even touch on the corruption or really them being spread too think (though the military portion does a bit). This isn't me hating on the NCR or anything. In fact, it's the opposite. All these negatives makes me appreciate them more. One of the things I absolutely love about the franchise is there's no, absolutely none wholly good faction within the series. (Don't bring up Minutemen because giving settlers access to high explosive weaponry without at the very least a prejudice check and saying it's all run by one person. Yeah, that's NEVER failed in the past. lol)
Here's my take on the NCR: I love the soldiers and the people. I hate the NCR Government and it's bureaucracy, corruption, ineffectiveness, and self-limiting and hindering nonsense. Whenever I play NV, I just couldn't get myself to open fire on NCR troops (except in self-defense only), although assassinating Kimball and killing General Oliver is always fun to do. I personally think that pulling the betrayal on NCR at the Dam is the best outcome (Independent or House ending), plus the NCR has so many quests and missions that it's stupid to throw that away unless one just wants to rack up insane amount of kills or is going for Legion. I personally wish that there could have been an ending where House and NCR just make peace and neither side tries to take each other over (rather, NCR stops trying to take over Vegas, House is simply defending his territory from outside aggression) and they can be allied in trade and as friendly nations. Since that ending does not exist, the closest to this is Independent. Just my two cents, great analysis.
The reason I prefer legion over NCR often is because of you're nr.4 they are the same in there unmoving way of violence first but the legion just has trained there soldiers better band with allot more discipline plus there civilian city are better taking care of.
@@marcvandermeyden8000 The Legion doesn't take better care of their civilians because the legion has no civilians nor cities. The Legion is a gigantic nomadic warring tribe even by Caesar's own admission. The Legion possesses Legionaries or slaves and no others. The faults of the NCR are nowhere near as aggregious.
I mean, a auto destructive, possible drug/alcoholic addict, crazy, and gun collector. His could be a goody 2 shoes or a devil's Master. The player chooses, but definitive, he got SHOT in the head, it could be crazy like No-bark (No-Bark best Character 2010)
Are you crazy? My courier is _amazing_ for the Mojave! Now you take that back or you'll get a visit from two of my men in a black covered wagon in the night!
Depends on the player. My courier is very good, a model of selflessness she is called. She declines reward for helping the less fortunate and never strays from the path of righteousness. Idolized by all except Caesar's legion and the powder gangers. Always helping the followers of the apocalypse. Found the cure for the nightkin schizophrenia and fixed Rhonda for Tabitha on top of Black mountain. Helped Jason Bright and his followers journey to the far beyond and turned on Helios one and diverted the power across the whole Mojave evenly. Every thing she does is for the betterment of the Mojave wasteland and New Vegas! My Courier is the best choice for the Mojave wasteland!
You trust people to be independent and rule themselves? People are idiots. They devolve so rapidly. No, freedom is definitely not the best thing for people.
@@apolloptx It's not that blunt, if the Courier is smart and resourceful, Vegas can thrive, he may make connections with New Canaanites and the tribes, use the technology from big MT as an advancement, use the riches of the Sierra Madre as an advantage.
So the ncr became so flawed because the ncr population was pissed of the death of few prospectors who went outside the border of the ncr, in the wasteland, at their own risks and died? Did they know that most of the US is still a harsh place? Thank god is wasn't the capital wasteland.
@Exotic Bat The events about the death of the prospectors happened decades before fallout 3. The brotherhood didn't clean the capital wasteland back then. Even after fallout 3, the fight against the super mutants continued for a few years.
Exactly it just proves that the NCR are the best 34 people died going to a dangerous place and the ncr citizenry still freaked out. Shows how well they are protected and cared for in the heart of the ncr.
Johnathan Era except now they actually don’t care about their people. Maybe they did then, but that was decades ago. Now, they don’t care at all about their own people and will allow raider gangs to terrorize their own citizens and harass traveling merchants. I think the big problem with the NCR is that it’s a democracy that has little-to-no checks and balances in how it operates as a government. This could likely be because President Tandy was such an effective ruler back in her day to be elected for 50 years that now they expect all their rulers to be just like that; when the truth is that having a highly competent ruler that is also benevolent is actually quite rare and not usually the norm. Quite often, careers in political power attract some of the worse types of people that are only in it for themselves. The political corruption within the NCR has only been getting worse since Fallout 2 and will continue to do so unless they see drastic reason to change (such as losing). The more powerful they grow however, the more they will continue to disregard their own people as they have been doing because they will not see any reason to change.
Its an event we see repeated over and over again throughout history. The machurian incident in a way. It reminds me most fiercely of british settlers being murdered after crossing into zululand territory. The British declared war on the Zulu the following in the following weeks and a conflict which culminated in increased tyranny in the region resulted from it ultimately.
What I would want to see is The NCR, Minutemen's commonwealth and galvanized BoS all running into each other at peak strength, thus starting Cold War 2...
Thing is, the NCR is very similar to the actual U.S. government around the late 18/early 19 hundreds, with cattle barons, railroad companies and even newspaper magnates able to wield huge influence without any accountability, a string of broken/unfair treaties with various naitive peoples and the demands of a rapidly expanding population. However, they simply cannot allow an independent New Vegas since it is the door to eastward expansion, probably after they turn Oregon and Idaho into their breadbasket and Washington state into their lumber-yard. Personally, the only thing I can see realistically putting a stop to the NCR is the Yellowstone volcano going off again, which is due soon™ and will make the Divide look like a day at the seaside.
The time comparison you're thinking of is the gilded age, implying that under the glittery, or gilded, surface of prosperity lay huge problems, from corruption to monopolies to racial inequality just to name a few. The NCR looks to be going through a post apocalyptic gilded age. People are saying the NCR will collapse because of this, but people thought the same thing about the U.S during the gilded age, and it's still here. I don't see Oregon becoming a breadbasket for the NCR due to the very high chance of blizzards there, same for Idaho except not much snow depending on location, and there's no lore about Yellowstone at all, not even a reference, but I imagine it'd be utter hell for anyone due to the supervolcano beneath the park.
The House always wins. But to NCR's credit, they expanded their borders to New Vegas to secure a power source. Surely this territory grab isn't the first annexation delivering value to the NCR and its people? I think there's too much context missing on the reasons behind prior annexation to presume NCR's rapid expansion was just done for the sake of taxes and power alone.
From the way that expansion for them can happen in fallout 2 when setting up and various things said by people in NV. We can make some pretty good guesses to their motives and modus operandi when it comes to annexation. It's not pretty.
@@Quandry1 Speaking with the newly-acquainted taxpayers of the Mojave alone isn't really the best source in finding advocates for the faction. What was not pretty during the expansion between FO1&2?
You are aware that they ask you to attack patrols for towns so that they would accept being annexed into the NCR for protection aren't you? And very few of the people in the Mohave pay taxes to the NCR or are a part of the NCR during the events of NV. Even in some of the places where the NCR has actual residence.
The more I watch these videos, the more I have the feeling that New Vegas' NCR & Legion route is nothing more than a reminder on the weaknesses of going all out on 2 sides of what lead to the downfall of Greece & Rome, respectively. Of course, minus a societal condoning of slaves, but it's the 2 major aspects that are strongly associated each country. One for their birth of Democracy, which becomes bizarrely quite similar when you notice the amount of land and people they annex to be part of their machine in so much as they become slaves. And the other for their ambition to go all in and never take the time to properly look back, just like how Alexander the Great essentially went on his own campaign to conquer all the lands to the East as he could get without having the foundation to uphold his spoils during and after death, though the latter might just be more political corruption.
Part of what undid Alexander's kingdom was his sons. Each one felt they were the best to rule and had their own flaws which to some extent broke things up between them in the process.
Interesting point on hope as it implies the ability to change which is my favorite factor here. 4. the Legion, basically for the Legion to actually MAKE their rome first and THEN overcome Caesar's brainwashing that has put woman as sub-humans and economy based on slavery. Unlike Ashur for example, there are not plans for the ones in power to overcome their flaws and with the legion those flaws are in fact going to be enforced by a religious dogma. 3. House would be the least likely to ever change, he will not die for the foreseeable future and has a unquestioning robotic army, while not letting in anything get in the way of his plans. BUT Vegas itself has some freedom as long as House doesn't see what they are doing as a threat. 2. Yes-man is just anarchy as written, hell it doesn't even look like the courier is doing basic law enforcement outside the strip in that ending. it would take all the settlements coming together and finding a successful government to come that, then (unless the Courier/yes-man are backing it) they are going to have to find the resources to actually support it and a army. Not impossible but after NCR/House/Legion people seem every independent and unlikely to push for it. 1. then there NCR with it's voting. all they need to start overcoming their flaws is for the people to vote in favor of it. Hell if the followers start preaching about how in the Progressive Era the US overcame many of NCR's issues then they very well could start that process.
Caesars brainwashing makes the legion loyal to him, not any other ideological tenants. If he says women are equal, they will accept it implicitly; They believe he is a God. Uylsses says as much if you're a woman aligned with the legion, he says he wouldn't be surprised if the Legion had female legionaries now, because it changes itself entirely on Caesars whims. Therefore, there's no need to overcome that... All Caesar needs to do is say it, for his word is divine truth to them. It's much easier for Caesar to change his Legion than for the NCR to change. Also, when it comes to voting, we're discounting how much money affects the system, especially in something so shot through with corruption as the NCR; Hell, the NCR increases its own risk of total military defeat simply for General Oliver's own personal political point scoring. A lot of democratically elected politicians are, generally, pretty corruptible and you need a lot of incorruptible ones to manage any real change. It's not likely to change within a lifetime. Likewise the NCRs immediate problems can't be solved by voting; the famine, water shortage etc aren't going to be changed by a vote, they're the result of decades of short sighted and greedy exploitation... And will take decades, at best, to solve. So you really need another President Tandi with a powerful party to save the Republic... and that's not likely to happen. What's more likely is the wheels of the NCR will just keep on turning, and keep on crushing the poor people who have to hold the burden.
@@nonamegiven202 Alright; Theres a lot of ways in which the US is still really shit for minorities, and the US itself has problems to do with corruption without being anywhere near as cartoonishly corrupt as the NCR. What were the latest polls that something like over 2/3s now supported an expanded socialised healthcare system, including a majority in both major parties? Yet it doesn't happen, because the powers that be don't want it to happen, because it would cost them a lot of money. There's a lot of Americans who think that reducing the funding to the massive military budget to care for the people would be better, to the point where the military itself hands off surplus equipment to the police of all things because it just doesn't need it... But it doesn't and won't happen in the near future, because the military industrial complex is so influential. Eisenhower said "Beware the military industrial complex", America didn't listen and now look at how run away crazy it's gotten. And that's a real world example in a system that isn't that terribly corrupt compared to the NCR, isn't threatened by a massive army on its doorstep and isn't facing the horrors of the wastes. The NCR is facing a massive uphill struggle to get any of its ills changed... And even then, it can't change the resource problems without a rapid expansion and hoping for the best. Its own greed has come back to reckon with it, and it is going to be a massive struggle to cope. House has very few of such long term problems, the Legion has fewer. The NCR is the least likely to be able to get where it needs to be, because its democracy is highly corrupted already.
@@syphonfillter My point is simply that History provides examples of how NCR can fix it's current problems, an example that in universe they have access to. Who knows what would come after that. I mean take the "military industrial complex" as you pointed out, a lot of that was breed from the World Wars and the Cold War, and now the US's place in the current power balance NCR, on the other hand, isn't likely to face those problems, worst case they just contract the Gun Runners start producing pulse ammunition in case of conflict with house in that ending (there's a reason House wanted the president to be the Scapegoat, NCR could take vegas from him)
@@nonamegiven202 I'm not sure they have that example though, because in Universe the point of divergence starts after ww2 and things immediately start getting off track in all kinds of direction (and ends up culturally trapped in the 50s), and by the time the bombs dropped the US was a highly authoritarian state conducting massively unethical experiments without consent and was highly racist and suspicious towards those of Chinese descent. In universe the example of the US is a bad one for the NCR because the US went very horribly wrong, that's why its brought up against the NCR when repeating the mistakes of the past. The NCR is engaged in something of an arms race with the Legion due to their need to outfit so many soldiers (and consequently the gun runners are pretty powerful, but even then the supply can't keep up with NCRs demands) , but I was more using it as an example of how something can hold so much power over a democracy; in the NCR, it is more the Brahmin barons and the rich caravan companies like the crimson caravan that hold that influence, and they don't want things to change because the status quo is good for them, benefiting them massively over the poorer people and farmers who work for them, and helping them to quash and take over the smaller independent entities (Like how the crimson caravan works to acquire said caravans like Cass' and are willing to do dirty work to acquire them if someone's holding out) As an aside that's not really related, part of the reason I don't like the mistakes of the past criticism the NCR often gets given is because it's circumstances are very different to prewar America's, and it really isn't like prewar America and the world its in is really too different to just brand it in that way. Not to mention for all its flaws, I'm pretty sure the NCR is actually well meaning for the most part and isn't conducting crazy human experiments and stuff. I kinda find it an unfair criticism because House is far closer to the Fallout America than the NCR is.
NCR looks very much like Russia (where i live at): 1. Large territory which is hard to maintain 2. "Democratic" dictator who gets re-elected until death 3. Thriving bueracracy all around Sad story C:
I like how you don't mention that if you go with the NCR, and follow their questline as they ask(just following orders), you basically go on a killing spree. Khans, free side, one of the families, House, BoS. Unless a courier goes out of his way to achieve at least some peace, you basically commit small genocides in the name of NCR. They directly ask you. Only the first quest asks you to become friends with the bombers to get their help. That's it. NCR is not interested in peaceful and co-existing solutions. I also laughed at "NCR keeping Fiends at bay". Fiends base is across the street from NCR's main base in the whole mohave. Across the street, Carl! Keeping Legion at bay, eehh, somewhat. I mean NCR does win the 1st battle of the hover dam, however as well at the start of the game(no prior courier involvement), NCR loses Nipton, Ranger Station Charlie, Nelson, Searchlight. All after their win at the Hover. Forlorn Hope is under siege and without the help of the courier they can't regain their positions at Nelson. NCR bites more than it can chew. They have too many enemies at the start of NV story, and their only ally is not interested in a long partnership, exactly because NCR eventually would try to chew him too. And they do...well, they send the courier to do the dirty job. I just don't like that when it comes to the NCR "if we consider the intervention of the courier". No. We shouldn't. Courier is a standalone godalike entity in NV. It's a power that can do anything and everything. It's like saying "well, we kinda fucked up, but if only this godlike creature could come to solve all our problems that we created and make NCR great again"... I don't remember which character in the game said it, but he summed it up quite good. "NCR is better than Ceaser, but practically anything is better than Ceaser"
this exactly. the courier doesn't fix the NCR's problems. the courier just treats a few symptoms. the problems that caused those symptoms still exist and the major source of those is oliver and kimball. who gets the credit for the courier's deeds in mohave? oliver and kimball. you make the NCR worse off by helping them and doom the mohave by ensuring kimball and oliver remain in power for years to come. they are still just as corrupt and imperialistic as they've ever been.
New Vegas: who would be best for the Mojave? Me: who has the most bad ass shit? Caesar: we have Spears, men, roads, and honor. NCR: we have cool ranger helmets. Me: okay, NCR it is!
American industry is/was the greatest on earth because of the gilded age, but during that time ot was also extremely corrupt and under the influence of big industrials. So the NCR has to overcome these things, but I believe will ultimately make it stronger
Here's what I think will happen in order for the series First: the full story of Fallout 76 Second: The full story of Fallout 2 Third: the full story of Fallout 3 Forth: Independent Vegas Fifth: The full story of Fallout 4
Another point about the corruption of the NCR is that some people at McArran say that if General Oliver didn't have ties to Kimball, Colonel Hsu would've been promoted to general. I also think that the NCR definitely has the resources and manpower they need to properly occupy the Mojave, but their presence there is so fragile because Oliver sends most or all of the new recruits that come in every month straight to the dam, he could definitely pull them out of there to secure the land if he'd move some of the rangers from camp golf that don't see much action there anymore to the dam, but like you said it's a pride thing with Oliver.
When Hsu says "we tried to annex New vegas, lots of supplies that would be good for us. But if anything they've annexed us," I was like GOOD. GET YOUR GRUBBY MITS OFF VEGAS
OK I can already imagine what the title is going to be when he does the last of th videos of the "independent New Vegas"-route: "Why Oxhorn is doomed to be the bad choice for the Mojave Wasteland" And if he thinks it isn't, because he would rule fair and square of something like that, I'd like to remind the fair reader of one little quote Oxhorn himself used either in the same form or at least derived from this, by Lord Acton btw: "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power tends to corrupt absolutely" I would add though that I would change the quote to "power tends to corrupt, the more you have and the longer you hold it." That's why I somewhat are astonished by House, how he managed to not become some techno-caesar. Though I might have an idea why he is like he is; due to being immortal (or the closed any non-ghould has come to it), he's removed one basic part of the human condition: our mortality. So he can really have projects that take forever, like, I don't know going to space maybe, without having to teach a line of successors. Also, the fact that he trusts the courier with helping him, because he realized he needed somebody else, an agent, while everybody else talks to you as mostly some sort of convenience they appreciate, since they almost always could reach their goals without you, though not as easy. House, he can't, his securitrons are good for security and fighting, but when it comes to something that needs anything close to subterfuge, there is simply no comparing his robots to to Rangers or Frumentarii.
if she was a bad president then how come Caesar has to fight the NCR? If she "failed" then wouldn't the NCR be a distant memory? And its not like Caesar can win easily against them either, the protagonist is the winning factor.
The protagonist is he deciding factor for all factions in the game, but there have been multiple post Son the fallout lore subreddit which examined the state of the game before the player does anything. The general points were - Without the Chip, House is screwed. Benny gets captured by the Legion, Caesar has the chip. So House and Benny are out the game, bringing it down to just the Legion and the NCR. - Due to the Legion having multiple strategic victories before the courier even shows up (The elimination of key locations such as Nelson and Search Light the generally bad state of NCR morale etc), they have a considerable edge over the NCR in the region and, during the final battle, their plan outsmarts the NCR as can be seen in the NCR ending where the player finds that the NCR has been taken off guard by the Legion having infiltrated into the lower levels of the dam. Without the couriers intervention the NCR is unlikely to stop them.
From the old ranger at a ncr camp he said that all there lakes were dried up by the ncr over use and then from the scientists they say they are going to run out of food. This shows that they don’t use resources effectively and will collapse if they don’t expand
Great video Oxhorn. Oddly it would seem winning the war, but losing the Mojave the dam might be best for the NCR. It needs to pull back some and straighten up the territory it already has. Under the right management, the Mojave could be a great neighbor for the NCR to have. With the proper people running things in the things, that is. There's something I noticed interesting about these endings. For the endings so far, what these factions are and represent is pretty much set in stone. Even the side quests don't really change their nature, only the endings. But Yes Man ending seems to be different. I've heard quite a few argue that what right or ability does the Courier. All those side quest they do, All those SPECIAL stats they have, all those Skill points and Perk points they use. They all potentially define the character you play as. In a lot of ways, it seems like the Yes Man Ending shares a lot in common with your thoughts about the Minutemen, Oxhorn. I wonder if what I'm thinking will hold up to when you start looking into the Yes Man ending?
I agree. One of the best arguments for House or Yes Man is that the NCR is better off having the Mojave as an ally than as part of its own territory. I think the best outcome for the NCR is arguably a Yes Man ending where the Courier works closely with the NCR as a permanent ally, maybe even forming some sort of federation with the NCR. The latter isn't really anything that you can do in-game, but since the Courier is the player character, you can always say that that's what your character plans to do.
@@0816M3RC No, they aren't. They're sort of like the Enclave from Fallout 3 but better. All the BOS wants to do is bring civilization back to what it was. No synths, no ghouls, no supermutants, just human beings. They also want to take as much technology as they can so history can't repeat itself with nukes. That sounds good in the long run to me.
Makenzie Brennan the problem is that non humans like super mutants and synths and ghouls exist and they all have the capacity to be cognitively aware. Why should they be exterminated to return to a time long gone by 2200s ?
These are my favorite works by Ox. This is my 5th time through each series. Love the philosophy/morality convos. Side note I literally laughed out loud at "everyone's favorite blue-eyed, burned and bandaged, pistol-whipping, ex-Legion Mormon"! Lolol
this is why I went with independent Vegas with yes man! House is powerful, yes, but greedy and amoral, but you can take all that makes him powerful (and able to protect Vegas) for your own, promising a better future for the mojave. The NCR has potential for a real future civilization, but they need time. making vegas independent gives them an opportunity to consolidate their resources, build up their armies, and build relations with the surrounding territories.
Ruth Miller but isn’t taking the rights and abilities away from a person so you can have them for yourself amoral and greedy? How do you differ from House if you take all the same steps he did to get to the top? How do you know that he isn’t doing what he thinks is right? What makes your version of what’s right better? The questions these choices impose. FYI: I chose independent Vegas too
Sometimes I sit here and I watch videos like this and I read the comments and it makes me wonder: Why can't we discuss real politics as civil-ly as this
i know this isn’t your final decision on what’s the best choice for the mojave but the ncr is a far sight better than all other options when you factor in the courier’s help. No other option is as benificial to the most amount of ppl in the long run in comparison to the other choices given to us. Simply put they are the best of a bad situation which isn’t great but i believe it’s better than the rest...
Ahcbuhas eh if you work reallyyyy hard you can Yesman (while helping NCR a lot) your way to a great ending. Spare Caesar, but neuter the Legion otherwise (Vulpes, Nelson, Cottonwood Cove, etc...) but without nuking them. Obviously, don’t nuke the NCR, help them as much as possible *except* when it hurts locals (so, keep water in Westside, even though it hurts the NCR). Slaughter the Omertas, kill Benny with the help of Swank, expose the White Gloves’ cannibals & kill them (make sure not to let the Brahmin Barron boycott NV though). Help the Kings as much as possible (BUT use your one favor with them to bring about a peaceful resolution). Take the legal route with Cassidy, have an independent Primm, make the GoodSprings militia, kill all the Fiends and Powder Gangers. Convince the Khans to give up hope (sounds bad, but they’re drug dealing raiders, they should dissolve). Use Helios One to evenly distribute power. Fully help the Followers. Finally, convince the Brotherhood Elder to open up. If you do all that with good karma you get arguably the best ending.
It would be cool for example to have an alliance between the NCR and the Commonwealth Provisional Government, wich was a state that the Minutemen wanted to create but it was destroyed by the Institute, maybe after the end of Fallout 4 who knows if the Commonwealth was unified under the rule of the Minutemen. Someone should make a mod about that to Fallout 4
Imo, if the Minutmen actually succeeded on establishing the Commonwealth Provisional Government, the Minutemen let alone is enough to unify the wasteland under it's banner (especially with the the Sole Survivor being it's General) and as for the NCR, as far as I know, I don't think they'd be any 'good' fit the wasteland as they are controlled by corrupt politicians.
I doubt the NCR would accept, the NCR would try to take over / consume the minuteman. Considering their idea align, the minutemen would probably getting absorbed to NCR (as NCR being a big nation that always consume everything)
That guy was almost as bad as Hitler. He deliberately killed 3 million people in India with an induced famine which eventually led to their independence just as Queen Victoria had done to Ireland. He set up concentration camps in Kenya where he sent 80,000 innocent people most of whom were veterans in the British army and tortured them for years mostly involving genital mutilation. 20,000 people died in these camps and Barrack Obama's grandfather was sent to one, that's why he removed Churchill's bust from the whitehouse. Not only this but Churchill was aggressively against workers rights. When a worker's union for miners formed in the North of England for better working conditions or better pay he sent in the army to quell the English working class and most were injured and 2 were killed. On top of all these terrible things he oversaw the Black and Tans which were the equivalent of the Nazi SS. They were mostly world war 1 veterans with severe PTSD and were under orders to roam Ireland and kill civilians, kill livestock & burn villages. He was an evil bastard. Take his quotes with a pinch of salt.
@@totmgsrockxd9900 except democracy only works when the foundation of civilization has been laid. only when everyone has their most basic needs covered and their borders secured can democracy work. even our own society today couldn't have been possible if the groundwork hadn't been laid by the autocrats of the past.
What if you did "ALL" the NCR quests that resulted in the best outcome and convincing the NCR to be better/and vastly improving the NCR? And all the quests to make people like the NCR more?
I would like to think of an ending for New Vegas would be to combine the Yes Man and NCR ending to make New Vegas a part of the Republic, but is run by the Courier.
I actually kinda see that as the canon ending, new vegas would basically be a protectorate of the NCR, they're technically separate, but their leadership is influenced by the NCR heavily. This would be good because then the NCR get robots I not their army and new vegas gets increased law and order without heavy weapons.
@@blasterthehedgehog8824, I don't really see that happening without the courier's new vegas being allied to the NCR heavily, kinda like Australia during World War 2 maybe.
And that is where the problems start. The only reason why Hsu lost to Oliver is because he didn't have the right connections. The NCR will never rid itself of the corruption if they favor people based on money or other things instead of popularity and support.
Twin Builders lol a faction of rehabilitated tribals that rape children, murder indiscriminately, crucify people and leave them to die in the sun, pillage and loot towns, enslaved women and men alike...is the lesser evil? The NCR is very flawed and slow in progress, but it’s not a dumb glorified tribe ruled by one man who’s death would mean the end for it.
@@blackicestudiosv8065 the legion doesn't actively make regions outside of its own more chaotic and ruin trading routes, leading to Indeoendant settlements being choked to death. You know, like the NCR does. The NCR also keeps slaves, allows massive amounts of corruption, is massively guilty in taxation without representation, etc.
Or just pick nobody. Don’t let the bear, bull, or Vegas rule the mojave, let the people rule themselves, and use the securitrons to prevent invasion by imperialist factions. No gods, no masters.
I actually disagree with Caesar on Tandi on calling her and the NCR a Hereditary Dictatorship "Because the council didn't dare oppose her! She was too popular. She had the people's love." ISN'T THAT THE BASIS OF A DEMOCRACY?
If the NCR is nothing but a "good guy" democracy, then it's not as interesting to have them in the game. There would be no quests and no grunt work for the Courier to do. They are purposefully made incompetent so we can fix their problems and have a proper quest line. So the NCR is still the best choice, they just need a glorified delivery boy to do some glorified janitor work.
Andri474 NCR benefits more from a mr house ending actually. It they succeed in annexing there resource scarcities will continue as they continue to be overstretches and overspend on the military. With a mr house ending the over spending is cut out but the resources are collected all the same. And new Vegas under mr house is not much different to NCR the elite still rule but people have the same freedoms to come and go. Lastly it provides a buffer zone between them and the legion.
@@federicoveronese7998 Lets not forget that House answers to no feeble bureaucracy or directorate. He is free to move humanity forward and i think he has no reason to be horrid to his citizens as they are customers. Like a business he coincidentally serves them and humanity by extension. The house always wins. If you want to see the fate of democracy look out the window
This makes me wonder how long the longest democratically-elected president (or prime minister or equivalent office) has served IRL. I know no American president has served anywhere near that long, and I'm a bit skeptical of anyone ever being able to serve 52 years before she starts to be blamed for everything that's wrong in the country. Yes, there are legislators who've served that long, but they don't get as much publicity, and they can blame the other legislators for any problems in the legislature, and that's not counting things like gerrymandering.
I mean, both the Legion and the NCR are worst off for the people of the Mojave than going Independent. But there are risks with being independent, even with Yes Man's upgraded securitrons. So I think in the long run, it's probably better for both New Vegas and the surrounding area to be linked with the NCR. The Republic is like any nation-state, it'll have its up and down, but as an established and relatively stable faction, it'll allow the Mojave to prosper...given time.
Yep. Best choice 100% legit no scam. Are u serious NCR main goal is to live like before the war. This is not progress this is regress. Not even saying that the world before war is destroyed and they want do do the same thing! Doing the same thing over and over expecting diferent results is trait of madman. Sorry for my english
The governments before the world was destroyed were really dictatorships at that point. They did whatever they wanted with the people and killed anyone who protested against them in any way. So it was really the *absence* of democracy that ended up with the Great War.
Dear Oxhorn I love the way you explain things which helps explain the title of your videos and also helped me make my faction decision as the minuteman.Despite "Another settlement needs your help".
![ปฏิเสธไม่ไหว (Crush on you) - LIPTA feat. No One Else [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/NBw1jF342vw/mqdefault.jpg)
*plays proud sounding music*
*shows drunk NCR troopers dancing in a fountain almost naked*
That shows NCR is 'Murica's son
I think its a musical version of California Dreamin’
I died when i saw the stripper fountain
@@simonkimberly6956 it is
All the Leaves are Brown.
*leaves are brown*
And the Sky is Grey.....
*and the sky is greyyyyy*
I believe the NCR-Brotherhood war is another reason that the NCR is short on resources. During this conflict, the Brotherhood destroyed the NCR's gold reserves in Redding, which is why bottle caps have made a comeback in the Mojave. In the time of Fallout 2, caps were worthless and the NCR dollar was the standard currency. During the events of this game, it's devalued fiat currency.
So brother hood bad?
@@joeyknight8272 Well, the Brotherhood decided that the NCR shouldn't have access to the technology they helped them plunder from Navarro, and blew up the gold reserves of Redding to cripple their economy. I have a hard time thinking that was a justifiable move.
@@joeyknight8272 The West Coast Brotherhood is a pretty questionable organization to say the least. The East Coast Brotherhood as seen in Fallout 3 and 4 are downright altruistic and paragons of tolerance by comparison.
@@Arbaaltheundefeated The Capital Brotherhood chapter under Lyons was more tolerant to "Natives" and even people they met along the way in Chicago and The Pitt
@@Arbaaltheundefeated Uh, not the brotherood under Maxson...
They are not tolerant at all, they came to the Commonwealth to destroy the institute but also to clame it as their new territory. Let's not forget about that part
23:40 Mars himself comes down to aid the legion. Like his son, he fails to account for long range firearms.
Ha!
😂😂😂
Mars will soon cry to daddy that the humans shot him
Sounds like Khain from the 40k universe
Why Rivet City Security is bad for the Mojave.
Why colin marrearty (I dont even attempt to spell that right) is the worst choice for the wasteland
@@Brando216 Moriarty
@@HellYeahCorp thank you :)
Why civilization is bad for the mojave
Rivet city was a loose Democratic place with a city council of scientists looking for solutions for purify water for DC area , I loved rivet city cool place to live I lived in the hotel in the under part of aircraft carrier which is cool to live at lol, the security is pretty good for a loose Democratic city ect with black armor which I took a few and can make some money by going rivet city kill 2 or 3 guards take armor and guns go to tenpenny tower real quick and sell the stuff for a few hundred caps and retire for the day in my tenpenny suite , eat some good meat and booze and sleep till morning and look around rivet city ect and live there most of the time and I grown to love the rusty old thing it adds character to the people lol
Yo, I REALLY appreciate a military styled “California Dreamin’” to open.
Do we know where it came from?
@Otto von Bismarck but they have some basic reading comprehension skills, a basic understanding of biology, and history. You do know what an amendment is, don't you? Or the song, "California Dreamin"
@Otto von Bismarck Yikes buddy did you just blow in from stupid town
@@sunkintree No I think he made it clear in his comment he's not from California.
@Otto von Bismarck 2nd amendment to what? It's 2281 and a trans NCR ranger is probably knocking off legion heads with a sniper
please make "why goodprings is bad for the mojave"
Easy Pete is too OP
@@smashfam1 They also has Victor, who will find you no matter where you go. Not to mention that Goodsprings is in a strategic position. There's only 2 ways in or out and one is crawling with deathclaws and cazadors.
Because chet
@@iRradiantRayne They have doc mitchell, the best doctor of all time clearly. And they have MANTISES!
Trudy though
After “why yes man is bad for the Mojave” it’ll be “why the Mojave is bad for the Mojave”
"Why the nuclear winter is bad for the Mojave"
"Why the great war was bad for the Mojave"
"why the courier is bad for the Mojave"
“Why the ghoul is bad for the Mojave”
@@Quakkauq all ghouls are bad lol
Actually, I figured when Ceaser pointed out Tandi's extensive presidency, he wasn't criticizing it - he seems to almost admire it. He says she was voted in "because she had the people's love", and that the 'Democracy' was more or less an illusion. Caeser says that the NCR got weaker when it lost Tandi, referring to her as basically a dictator -- considering that Ceaser's own position is more or less an authoritarian dictatorship, I imagine he's actually suggesting that during this period, the NCR was strong. Considering his own beliefs, it would make sense that Ceaser would see Tandi as the height of the strength of the NCR - the council was almost a formality, being unable to actually move against her, so Tandi's word was essentially law, not unlike Ceaser among his Legion. While the difference between the two might be obvious (Tandi was much more benevolant than Ceaser), his belief that such power would allow her to make the NCR strong would certainly help explain his own position and views on the Legion, and even how he might go to the extremes he did as a means to weed out weakness -- not that it does a lot of good if you side against the Legion.
That's the basic jist of what Caesar is saying. He approved of her rule as a high-point of the republic. What he fails to understand is the difference between a liberal constitutional monarchy, which tend to share Enlightenment values with Democracy, and an authoritarian one.
Not at all. It's likely he understood that but, having seen the NCR have and then lose it, considered it an imperfect system.
By comparison, Caeser has the undying loyalty of his followers. They live to serve him, and would gladly die in service of him. Caeser made a system that guaranteed his strength of rule -- the problem is that it guarantees only his own strength of rule, as without him, the Legion crumbles and falls apart. Ironically, in this way it's not unlike the NCR, except instead of continuing to exist as a bureaucratic nightmare, the Legion simply ceases to exist entirely.
Caeser wasn't looking for a perfect system that made everyone happy; he wanted a system that kept order, that was free of corruption. The best way to get that is a single-leader system, where the punishment for any act of disobedience is harsh at its kindest, and the death sentence is passed around freely. The fact oppressive regimes are often the most effective isn't an accident; people are much less likely to be corrupt when the smallest punishment you can expect is to be made to fight to the death in the arena.
Oppressive regimes appear efficient because they worship order but generally are ruled through corruption and gaft with a sheet of Ideology thrown over top. Those who appear strong are often weak because they cannot survive the appearance of weakness. Compare the Industry and leadership of the US during WWII with The Nazi's, sure the Nazi's talked a big game about order and Gleichshaltung but the US was led by Sanguine professionals choreographing a logistical miracle to put the most powerful economy in the world in the hands of Seasoned capable Military leaders. The Nazi's, conversely, had a high command mostly interested in misappropriating national resources looting art treasures and building gothy doom castles and building whatever insane pipe dream some quack convinced Hitler of, all while ignoring strategic and tactical realities on the ground: because sunlight is the best disinfectant.
@Michael Wright: "Oppressive regimes appear efficient because they worship order but generally are ruled through corruption and gaft with a sheet of Ideology thrown over top.".
Correct.
That is why Stalin's way was the only way for a dictatorship to be successful. 24/7 cult of personality, propaganda at full blast, mass murder, slavery and imaginary enemies all around, and a purge every few years at the top (shooting the top men so they don't become entrenched and become a danger to the state i.e. Stalin).
It is a horrifying system.
BTW, hitler was an idiot living in Stalin's era.
Stalin was envious of America's industrial might, a might he was incapable of recreating even with an Iron fist. Did you know that Chef Boyardee received the Order of Lenin for provisioning the Red Army during WWII? If tyranny is so efficient why does Liberal Democracy have to provide the logistics? Now sure the major agricultural centers of the USSR were occupied but would the Nazis have been able to make it to Kiev had Stalin not purged the cream of the Red Army a decade prior.
So what I'm hearing is the Minuteman have a whole desert that needs our help
best comment
A new settlement is under attack!
Time for the Minutemen to become the US IntervetionMen
God, the Minutemen are needed fucking everywhere. Regardless of my feelings on doing there shit, next to the Followers of the Apocalypse, they might just be the only faction that can say it's desires are purely selfless, and (mostly) executed those desires well. One of the only truly good factions in the hell hole that is Fallout
Finally, my time to shine
I think the republic of Dave should colonize the Mojave
Macshot245 ALL HAIL PRESIDENT DAVE
President dave is number one!!
They would most likely defend their borders and citizens better than the NCR does tbh
Hail me!
Do you think his soldiers would hope for a nuclear winter as well?
I’m glad he’s stretching out on the negatives of every faction rather than sticking to a biased on his favorite. It’s great to hear bigger opinions on both positive and negative rather than defending one side and ignoring the other.
Crow Ikr
Yeah Right they are nazis in fallout 4tho lol
@@Collateral0 In FO4 at least they are super ethnic cleansing-y
Yeah Right The brotherhood are a group of zealots with an act first talk later mentality. Pretty much everything they do, they do through force and nothing else. They consistently show the belief they are the only ones fit to wield advanced technology (Danses immediate response to to the minute men getting artillery is a negative one, as he just sees it as the minute men now having the fire power to blow up, aka, resist, the brotherhood). They have an irrational hatred of ghouls and synths, even ones that are clearly not hostile. They order the death of the railroad solely on the grounds that the railroad makes it harder for them to find and kill synths. Completely ignoring the fact that the synths the railroad helps are completely self aware, and thus indistinguishable from humans in every way but biologically. They want to destroy the institute long before the institute really gives them a reason to, happily nuking the place and everyone inside it. There's really no argument to be had here, the brotherhood are nutjobs who want to horde all technology to themselves, and shoot any one who tells them not to. They hate anything not human, a hate so engrained in them that Danse wanted to kill himself when he discovered he was a synth. They're just awful.
@@Collateral0 You're miscontextualizing the brotherhood pretty hard in FO4. While yes, they see the synths as technology run amok, they don't care so much about their potential risk to humanity so much as seeming them as an abomination that needs to be destroyed. Even ignoring the synth question though, which has many answers depending on your personal definition of what makes a human, human, the Brotherhood are not out to help anyone but themselves. They want the institute gone because they have access to quote unquote dangerous technologies, no more and no less. The Brotherhood cares only about hoarding technology and the nebulous goal of protecting humanity from themselves and nothing else. Elder Lyons in FO3, who actually did want to kill dangerous supermutants to help people was considered a disgrace because he stopped focusing on the Brotherhoods obsessive hoarding of technology to help people with the technology they had available. Elder Maxson makes it clear that he wants to purge everything that he considers 'non-human.' He doesn't care if a synth is helpful, or that many ghouls are just normal people who are suffering mutations as a result of radiation, and if it weren't for the bad PR and the sheer impracticality of doing so he would gladly wipe them all out.
As for the automatron thing? The whole reason they went wrong is because the brains used as their processors were those of psychopathic killers who twisted their directives so they could act out their sadistic desires. It wasn't the machine part of them that led to the killings, it was the human. Besides that, the third generation synths are hardly terminators, many of them don't even know they are synths, and the ones that do overwhelmingly just want to have the right to make their own choices instead of being slaves. Even if you don't consider them human, Synths are certainly sentient beings... don't they have the right to choose their own paths? Is Nick Valentine a danger to humanity, or should be be put down just to be safe?
I wonder what would've happened without the Courier.
Which faction would've emerged victorious, left to their collective devices.
MagnuMagnus legion without a doubt
@@AqvaSerpentis Yeah of course, even House is oblivious about the shitstorm Omertas are trying to create with the help of the Legion, Legion has spies on The Strip as well and who knows would he even get ahold of the Platinum chip if there wasn't for Courier's intervention.
luka.cuturilo as well as it seems like to a degree the NCR follows the Geneva convention or rules similar where as the legion doesn’t care and will radiation bomb an entire town, the legion could infiltrate hundreds of their legionaries into the NCR and would slowly cripple them
@@AqvaSerpentis its Fallout LORE that The Ncr wins
They have more manpower and better equapment
Litm8 64 the legion would destroy the NCR from the inside, if they could sneak a spy into mccarran then they could sneak a lot of frumentarii into the NCR
To be fair, annexation and conquest are inevitable consequences in the early formation of any great nation.
Even the most democratic and peace-loving countries on our planet have a history of war, violence, exodus and genocide that established their borders and delineated the ethnic groups, even though the people living in those countries today prefer to forget that history, or blame it on a more barbaric, uncultured past where "people just didn't know any better".
The NCR would be little more than a collection of armed farms or a minor town at most if they hadn't engaged in aggressive imperialist and expansionist policies, and likely been swallowed up by any larger faction that might have come their way.
Oxhorn, I would really recommend you read The Origins of Political Order by Francis Fukuyama. He's a great mind that explores how and where human civilization emerged, common misconceptions and compares the views of both Hobbes and Rousseau on the matter. Given the questions you asked in this video, I think the content of the book would be perfect for your interests.
In the 19th century the United States had to make a decision between being straight up Imperialists or just creating a sphere of influence. They had colonized the Philippines at the cost of millions of lives and thousands of soldiers and in the aftermath of thousands of people dying for nothing and the press publishing their warcrimes they rejected Imperialism. Its pivotal moments like these that define what a country is, the early history of a nation sets the foundation and the NCR government succeeding by being more authoritarian and using illegal (by their own ideals) methods like torture and assassination sets a horrifying precedence.
@@rangergxi yupppp ur right
@@tannert7450 no
Oooooh, fabulous book. Dry, but incredibly interesting. Definite must-add to any political theory class.
@@rangergxi yeah you are really right.
And then a few months from now... "why Yes Man is bad for the Mojave"
Or, "Why the Courier is bad for the Mojave".
Well, it does cause complete anarchy in the Vegas area
Well, if the Courier does not have high Charisma and Speech and have not completed most faction quests peacefully, then it's almost guaranteed than New Vegas will become second New Reno.
The Mojave is bad for the Mojave
Remember when we won against the British
"The NCR has it's share of Warts, but I'd rather have them around than the Legion."
"NCR might take some money, but they leave us our women and children."
The thing with the legion is there military camps are bad for woman,but the civilian city's they have are actually better of then those of the NCR.
@@marcvandermeyden8000 that's equivalent of saying Jews under hitler were treated badly while others were treated well
I mean yeah ncr isn't that great but you can find good people in their group with legion it isn't same thing
@@Mcsnickers_7 yeah I can't believe people even considering that what the legions did is justifiable
They are the only option.
This is why I love this game. There's no true 'good ending', all 4 endings have their pros and cons. It is up to you to decide which one is the best option for the future of New Vegas.
I mean, conceptually, yes, but if you care to help everyone and make sure every other faction helps at Hoover Dam, the endings are more or less like this:
House: send securitrons tô kill everyone and dominate
Yes Man: let everyone down and anarchy happens
Legion: RETRIBUTION
NCR: everyone is better except that one city wich has TAXES now :(
It more or less becomes the official happy ending, even if it takes a particularly pious and diplomatically savy courier to do it. I guess the message here is that you make your own happy ending, that a good society only comes at the intersection of individual and systemic justice.
@@anarcopablo Nah not really, Mr. House doesnt send securitron to kill. Only to secure land. He only kill those who oppose him, and in ending slide, he may / may not kill the kings. Depend on your ending with them. If the kings allied with NCR, they get killed, as the kings would have opposed House. If we ignite the conflict of the kings with NCR, Mr. House will let them be, as he see it the kings are devoted to vegas.
@@anarcopablo NCR ending doesnt actually make everyone better at all. No. A lot of mojave local's already said that the NCR tax are heavy. A lot of them are against it. It doesnt explicitly said in the slide, but implied. In game, it is stated by various NPC and side quests, that NCR arrival lay heavy tax, without proper protection
@@anarcopablo Independent New Vegas is the best ending. So what violence increases? They could join the minor factions for protection. It teaches people that everyone must learn to fend for themselves not rely on one courier like NCR, Legion, or House. In the Mojave, you must look out for your own interests or be exploited and killed. Just my 2 cents.
@@晏榮努 Well, if you see death and sufferiing and think "so what", I guess there ain´t much I can say to convince you to my view of things
Caesar: "Tandi was a dictator! She only won so many elections because she had the people's love!"
Uh, yeah, kinda how democracy works buddy.
Not to mention he seems to fail basic government science and politics.
@A J, bad comparison, there, pal. That's because in those, there is no opposite party with different ideas, and the party itself selects the candidates for the elections, making it so people have no other options for voting. Comparing the NCR to North Korea is like comparing apples to pizza, with shitty ground to stand on...
@@dragonbornexpress5650 yep
@@slymarbo2559, did that guy's comment get deleted at some point? Because he's no longer there and yet my reply is still there.
@@dragonbornexpress5650 I think,
5:41
Hey, look, his tumor is gone.
Well you aren’t wrong
@@randomncrsoldier9120 shouldn't you be patrolling the Mojave? Wishing for a nuclear winter?
Found it! Stuck under my gatorclaw skin boots right here...
that was badass
You take a sip from your trusty vault 13 canteen....
patrolling the mojave almost make wish for nuclear winter
@@idunnoaskmydog3412 I was hoping there would be more gambling
omfg i get that shit every two minutes 💀💀💀
I'll mark it on your map
Another Settlement needs your help here I'll mark it on your map
NCR: a colossal being with a thousand hands all pulling in different directions all to a schizophrenic will, gorging on everything around it to feed itself yet simultaneously tearing itself apart and becoming too bloated to function properly and healthily.
Yet it is egalitarian, humanitarian (to an extent), technologically savvy compared to most of its contemporaries and when *eventually* roused can do great things.
It is a complex mechanism, missing a couple of parts, with a fair bit bodged together, but for the most part it works. But only if the job you need done fits within the parameters within which it can operate.
The Legion: another monstrous entity which is similarly overstretched, which hungers in a similar fashion but which co-opts those it incorporates into itself for one singular purpose, for one singular vision. It lives and dies by that vision, that singular obsession. The problem is that the vision, the purpose, the "one fits all" identity is all wrapped up in and with Caesar, and the mythos of Caesar.
And Caesar... is a mortal man.
It is sorta like a vast pyramid... but inverted.
With everything balanced upon one slender, increasingly fragile pillar.
What is probably saddest about these two factions is that regardless of which one "wins" at Hoover dam, they and the Mojave lose.
i'm reminded of hbomberguy's famous takedown of Fallout 3. When talking about previous Fallouts, he points out that the answer to how you do some quests, who you side with, can depend on /what you personally think is best for humanity/, and people can honestly disagree about it. That's New Vegas. For me, even and despite all of the NCR's countless flaws, I honestly never even saw the other choices coming close. It's an actual nation.
Somebody else can have a totally different, perfectly legit reason for picking one of the others.
Except the Legion. I'm with Boone, and I take him basically everywhere. They may as well be an elaborate band of raiders. Which is kinda fitting, actually.
That's why House is the best option. You cut out the inefficiency of the NCR's bureaucracy, you can ensure the egalitarianism of the NCR based on equality of opportunity by virtue of every deal with House is a mutually consensual transaction.
Thats why house is the right choice. Even the legion is a better choice. Romanization and its ability to assimilate is what is needed in the factional world
@@dodsonbe360 The thing is, Caesar doesn't even do it right. Rome didnt erase cultural identity, in fact it did the opposite, having a policy of "keep your cultures and traditions, just work with us and prosper" that made conquered territories like Rome so much.
@@BetaGunslinger slavery and "working for us" are very different things, bucky.
"The events of the divide were an act of god" Late-game me: "God...I like that title..."
God from dead money: "Taken"
At least it’s not raining.
Is there another settlement needs our help preston?
@@alpharius7630 Not HIS help, General.
No it is raining 23:49
Patrolling the Mojave almost makes you wish for a nuclear winter
@@mr.pacman5466 lol
Why The Dovahkiin and Alduin are much Better for the Mojave
No Alduin, he was most likely gonna eat the world literally, which wouldn't surprise me. Also, two different universes and times, so not happening.
@@dragonbornexpress5650 Alduin is a lazy guy who didn't want to do his duty and decided to rule Nern
@@dragonbornexpress5650 woooosh
@@deeplysuperficial1637, I don't have Reddit.
@@deeplysuperficial1637 r/ihavegay
I remember my history teacher talking about how the reason we learn history is not repeat it’s mistakes, and learn from people like Tandi.
I mean, President Tandi was elected to office every time, and she was the most popular beloved President in NCR history. Tandi also did the most to improve the NCR in her time.
That's why the NCR are the worst faction imo
@@MutantMasterRace
The NCR is repeating the mistakes of the old US, but the Legion is repeating the mistakes of the old Roman Empire. That's why House wants them both out so he can do his Elon Musk nonsense.
@@connorperrett9559 the downfall of the Roman empire didn't lead to the great War but old world government flaws did. The legion may be making mistakes that the Roman's also made but it's existence and inevitable downfall is crucial to the future of post war America, Unlike NCR. But I do agree that house has a good outlook on the future of the wasteland and is a better option than NCR and yes man.
@@MutantMasterRace The Legion’s mistakes aren’t mistakes, which is what makes the Legion a mistake.
"blue eyed, burned and bandaged pistol whipping former legion Mormon." Hell of a mouth full there ox.
I wish you could form a Minutemen-like Militia in the Mojave (you make a Militia is GoodSprings, can make an independent sheriff in Primm, provide Westside with water, bring peace to Freeside, decanibalize UltraLux, etc...). Yes, Yesman is kinda that, but they’re not connected. Yes GoodSprings idolizes the Courier, yes the Boomers are loyal to him, yes Primm & Freeside owe their independence to him, yes Westside and Jacobstown owe their existence to him, but they’re not interconnected.
That'd be so cool. I see the minutemen (while joining with the railroad) eventually forming something akin to old America, and if anyone could use that, Mojave could.
the thing is,it is what most likely happened after 2nd battle,
and ofc if you have a headcannon
I see a lot of the NCR's problems mostly a communication's and inability to work in smaller units like almost all decisions have to come from higher up. With the exception of individuals hiring a mercenary crap would get done especially in their military. So like I feel organizations like elder Maxson's brother hood of steel would be more effective than either the NCR or the Legion. I mean other than the racism that he has towards non-humans how he has it set up is he has junior officers giving out missions to their subordinates which playing fallout 4 you'll see small squads taking on super mutants on their own and able to quickly take land in the commonwealth even though they're the newest faction in the commonwealth. Though I may have my lore wrong but when they come into the Prydwyn that's just a portion of their might it's not their entire force. So they aren't exactly over extending themselves they go there and accomplish their goals and generally leave non threats to their own devices
I have a hard time understanding why everybody thinks they are racist.
Super Mutants have always been dumb and aggressive murderers who go out of their way to kill every other lifeform in their path. The few minor exceptions do not change the race. Hell even strong is still the monster and would kill you if you'd tell him the milk is not real.
Frral ghouls are a fate worse then death.
The group the BoS could be """racist""" against are the normal ghouls. But the BoS shot them even during Lyons time. So Maxson hasn't done anything that was done before.
The Brotherhood are an organization with roots in the military immediately after the Great War. So naturally they still use passed down military tactics, and they adhere to the rules laid out in The Codex I’m pretty sure just like the West Coast Brotherhood of Steel.
@@TurKlack Because there are Super Mutants that are murdered on sight regardless of if they are hostile or not and most super mutants in the west arent very hostile other than maybe night-kin but THEY ARE STILL HUMANS JUST BIG GREEN UGLY HUMANS THAT CAN BE CURED.
Thank you for bringing up the usual, "It's the post-apocalypse, there's no values left."
The Minutemen disprove this ridiculous notion, as does almost every single settler across the wasteland.
Yep.
I appreciate their efforts to help people, but at the end of the day it just isn't enough.
And the ncr
their numbers are few though. in reality, most people would kill you if it meant that they could eat today, and see tomorrow. morals would get you killed in the wasteland.
@@DirtyDan1 No, not 'in actuality'. If that was true, settlements wouldn't exist.
"the council didn't dare oppose her, she was popular. had the people's love"
yah ceasar thats how a democracy works actually
I don't think he was critiquing it
@Napoléon Bonaparte that's fair but no other political government is better. Wanna know the real reason the NCR is the strongest faction in the waste even above the brotherhood? Because of their democracy. If Caesar dies the legion dies, if house dies, the strip dies, if yes man and yourself dies then your empire dies but if Kimball dies, the NCR survive.
@@JC19171 well.. that brotherhood. :) let's see how the NCR handles true democracy. A type of democracy that is non negotiable. Liberty prime all the way !!!
@@JC19171 I'm pretty sure Caesar has already set up a contingency plan on the Legion's political hierarchy once he's gone.
@@s2korpionic Yes but his successor wouldn't have the loyalty of the the legion people, only the word of the man who created the legion. Cesar was a unique man and I'm sure that any successor would pale in comparison, causing infighting, coups and potentially civil wars.
On the other hand, if the people of the NCR have a problem with their leader, then they will simply vote them out. So while I believe that the NCR does have it's problems, it is not in nearly as much danger of tearing itself apart as the legion.
"Why Sunny Smiles is the best choice for the Mojave"
Agree
She was adorable the way she talked and how she was so happy to help you out and how she just hunts coyotes and geckos for skins and just gets what she needs no more no less lol😚
She should’ve been our first companion tbh
@@AstarionWifey I agree she wouldve been s good companion
Tandi's biggest failing was that she utterly failed to prepare the NCR for life after her.
It's a failing many great leaders have, not being able to see a world without themselves in it. How many nations across history have had a great leader followed by someone who pissed it all away? How many achievements undone in a generation?
Fun Fact: That's basically the greatest failing of Catherine the Great. She was so afraid of her eldest son usurping her (like Catherine had done to her husband Peter) that she more or less neglected him and forbade him from training in running the Russian monarchy. It's no surprise that Catherine's reign was the height of Russia's glory days back then because she did nothing to prepare after her either
Isnt NCR democratic? how did she know who is her successor?
@@randomanon8781 She wouldn't need to.
Sen Howler That’s a two way street...
*Sees title*
Me: Excuse Me!?
Ox: That's not to say they aren't the best option.
Me: Ok, I'm listening. Please continue.
Reminder that he also said at the start of House's evaluation video that it's not to say that House isn't the best option
The only one he straight up didn't say was a possible best option was the Legion because honestly that's just the truth
Seriously though ncr isn't the best option
@@Mr.Classic91 You say that as if it's fact and not opinion.
@@Mr.Classic91 yes it is lol, well actually house in control of new vegas and the dam With strong ties and alliances to the ncr is the best option
They're easily worse then house
5:45
Ah. I see you managed to cure Caesar's tumor quite nicely 👌
Living in Brazil has taught me that corrupt goverments never change.
Taiwan is one of the most democratic and corrupt-free countries in the world. It used to be much different, anything can change.
@@rangergxi The NCR is in the US. Nukes wouldn't even stop the corruption here, that we can almost certainly guarantee.
Taiwan is a small nation with very nationalist priorities. Very much unlike Brazil or the US.
4324324294482 ~ True. For now. Like you said, anything can change. And things don't always change for the better.
Jair Bolsonaro FTW!!!
Croatia challenges you.
I like how trivial the factions of Fallout 4 are when compared to the actual nations with actual problems.
[ЯemoteRomance] well, that’s not to say the institute isn’t a powerful faction, if they wanted to be a big deal, they could be
The east coast is more in a state of fallout 1. You could say the same thing about fallout 3. Good games, different concepts.
I don't think the factions in Fallout 4 seem trivial compared to the ones in FNV, though I love both games
Well The Minutemen tried to create a nation but the plans were destroyed by the Institute.
That's because none of the factions in Fallout 4 are nationstates.... they're cliques, comparable to the warlords of China after the fall of the Qing. The Brotherhood of Steel is a military organization, not a nation. The minutemen are a decentralized militia force who only exist to protect farms and villages, their dream of creating a provisional government was ended by the Institute which is a scientific organization, not a nation. And The Railroad are just a organization that helps to free synths. None of these factions are nationstates nor (aside from the Minutemen) have any desire to be one.
That said, even if the Minutemen were to create some sort of government it would be like the founding of the NCR. Loosely centralized villages. Rome wasn't built in a day, and comparing the factions of Fallout 4 to previous games (Fallout 3 didn't have any "nations" either, and no, the Republic of Dave doesn't count) so it is kind of a weak, silly argument.
"If you want to see the fate of democracies, look out the windows."
Ha! You're the smartest here.
You can also do it now
Anthony Johnson Yes
House Forever!!!
The US wasn’t a democracy when the great war happened, it was a totalitarian oligarchy pretending to be a democracy, the pre 1969 US would have been able to survive for way longer especially if it had conserved reasources. The NCR is a true democracy that is dividing itself based on states instead of commonwealths which is better for stability and they have probably learned from their ancestor to not nuke the hell out of their neighbors
Throughout my gameplays of New Vegas I've always found the NCR very difficult to work with. It's not a dislike of them it's more...difficult to know where they stand and just how long they can even last for the following reasons.
1) They have incredibly weak military strength.
By the numbers their military is strong, but when it comes to actual fighting? It's clear by their state in the game you play that they've been backed to the cliff's edge. Ranger stations are in the dark, Camp Forlorn Hope is a simple blitz away from being overrun, and Bitter Springs is in just as much dire straits. The only reason they wind up defeating the Brotherhood is by numbers and they only defeat the Legion the first time because they blew up Boulder City. (Which may help explain why Caeser refuses to change tactics since with what he had, he had the NCR that desperate).
2) They apparently lack the necessities to farm
One of the things that irked me the most was Sharecropper Farm. The ONLY source of food for the NCR in the Mojave. Why? How is that the only source? How many abandoned farms and ranches do you find while traveling around? Locations that are still quite clearly growing crops. There's fertile land around, the only thing they have to do is find the means of transporting water. Which they can't seem to do/think of.
3) Mass levels of unpopularity
I've gone through the settlements in my mind a number of times and with the possibility of Jacobstown (maybe) I can't think of a single one that would truly accept the NCR above them. Goodsprings would rather remain independent, people in Primm are hesitant to accept an NCR sheriff, Nipton only wanted their money, Novac has no problem accepting veterans but would rather remain independent, and if anyone thinks Freeside or North Vegas want them? As Alf would put it; Ha! It wouldn't take much for hatred to become a rebellion.
4) Their bayonet first approach
It's war, I understand, but the way they send you on your missions is kill first unless you convince us there's another way. Kill the Brotherhood, kill Mr. House (whom we have a negotiated deal with that we'd really like to re negotiate if only there was SOMEONE who could talk to him BUT since we can't think of anyone you'll have to go right up to him and kill him), kill the Kings, kill the Great Khans. Unless you can convince us there are other means. It almost makes me think that places like Bitter Springs is a cover. "We really care, look what we're doing here" and if that's the case...
This doesn't even touch on the corruption or really them being spread too think (though the military portion does a bit). This isn't me hating on the NCR or anything. In fact, it's the opposite. All these negatives makes me appreciate them more. One of the things I absolutely love about the franchise is there's no, absolutely none wholly good faction within the series. (Don't bring up Minutemen because giving settlers access to high explosive weaponry without at the very least a prejudice check and saying it's all run by one person. Yeah, that's NEVER failed in the past. lol)
Here's my take on the NCR:
I love the soldiers and the people.
I hate the NCR Government and it's bureaucracy, corruption, ineffectiveness, and self-limiting and hindering nonsense.
Whenever I play NV, I just couldn't get myself to open fire on NCR troops (except in self-defense only), although assassinating Kimball and killing General Oliver is always fun to do. I personally think that pulling the betrayal on NCR at the Dam is the best outcome (Independent or House ending), plus the NCR has so many quests and missions that it's stupid to throw that away unless one just wants to rack up insane amount of kills or is going for Legion. I personally wish that there could have been an ending where House and NCR just make peace and neither side tries to take each other over (rather, NCR stops trying to take over Vegas, House is simply defending his territory from outside aggression) and they can be allied in trade and as friendly nations. Since that ending does not exist, the closest to this is Independent. Just my two cents, great analysis.
The reason I prefer legion over NCR often is because of you're nr.4 they are the same in there unmoving way of violence first but the legion just has trained there soldiers better band with allot more discipline plus there civilian city are better taking care of.
@@marcvandermeyden8000 The Legion doesn't take better care of their civilians because the legion has no civilians nor cities. The Legion is a gigantic nomadic warring tribe even by Caesar's own admission. The Legion possesses Legionaries or slaves and no others. The faults of the NCR are nowhere near as aggregious.
@@Priceluked what are you talking about the legion does have civilian cities
@@reddeadspartan yeah its literally stated that settlements under legion control are safer to live in if im correct
Why a violent, sociopathic Courier at the head of a dictatorship is bad for the Mojave.
You forgot the fact that they got shot in the face.
He can be however the courier wants him to be
I mean, a auto destructive, possible drug/alcoholic addict, crazy, and gun collector. His could be a goody 2 shoes or a devil's Master. The player chooses, but definitive, he got SHOT in the head, it could be crazy like No-bark (No-Bark best Character 2010)
Are you crazy? My courier is _amazing_ for the Mojave! Now you take that back or you'll get a visit from two of my men in a black covered wagon in the night!
Depends on the player. My courier is very good, a model of selflessness she is called. She declines reward for helping the less fortunate and never strays from the path of righteousness. Idolized by all except Caesar's legion and the powder gangers. Always helping the followers of the apocalypse. Found the cure for the nightkin schizophrenia and fixed Rhonda for Tabitha on top of Black mountain. Helped Jason Bright and his followers journey to the far beyond and turned on Helios one and diverted the power across the whole Mojave evenly. Every thing she does is for the betterment of the Mojave wasteland and New Vegas! My Courier is the best choice for the Mojave wasteland!
-The virgin NCR trooper Vs. Chad, The Legion Decanus-
Only true faction is Yes Man. ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
You trust people to be independent and rule themselves? People are idiots. They devolve so rapidly. No, freedom is definitely not the best thing for people.
@@apolloptx It's not that blunt, if the Courier is smart and resourceful, Vegas can thrive, he may make connections with New Canaanites and the tribes, use the technology from big MT as an advancement, use the riches of the Sierra Madre as an advantage.
No, Robert Edwin House is best for the Mojave wasteland. VIVA NEW VEGAS
@@timothymensik4494 Let's not forget that House was the one who built the securitron army and maintain vegas from not getting hit by any bombs
@@apolloptxok Caesar boomer
Is the opening “California Dreaming” By the Mamas and Papas...? 😂
yes Lmao
A cover.
mrnapolean1 really? A cover? You don't say...
Can somebody please post a link of the version Oxhorn uses?
Yep and a pretty nice cover i think.
Why the NCR is good for the Mojave, They have the best looking armour
And coolest in look and skill snipers with marksmans
They used gray and yellow-desert colors in NV
(Cough) “Brotherhood of Steel”
Cassie Hoffman NCR with power armor can be too
Remnants power armor > All
In the into, is that an orchestral version of “California Dreaming” I hear?
ON A WINTER DAAAAAAY
No
@@hostile1809 are you sure? Listen again, you’d be surprised.
@@hermannshulz770 I was being an asshole haha
@@hostile1809 I didn’t see your “no” comment coming of as “hostile” so I don’t know what you mean.
NCR: "This is our country now!"
Settler: "No it's not, we were here first!"
NCR: "...Do you have a Flag?"
Is that an Eddie Izzard reference I see?
Settler: Yes and it's a smiling face on a screen Man.
NCR: I should've stayed in California.
The best faction for the Mojave are
*TUNNEL SNAKES!*
Just A Random Penguin even though the farthest they got to to commonwealth, where they all proceeded to die from radiation
@@HondaCivic0053 Lmao this is the best thing i read this week
@Locust Drone bro dont mix factions from Fallout 4 :(
Just A Random Penguin Captain Ironsides
@Poly Tunnel Snakes and Pillars of the community aren't meant to be serious factions at all.
"The events of the Divide we affectively an act of god."
Um, about that...
So courier is a god then
Why The Institute and Preston Garvey are Good for the Mojave.
STOP
I couldn’t resist lol. Preston would try that stunt though, and we would finally tell him No lol
Another fallout game needs your help
@Richard Wilson I'll mark it on your map
The Institute are bad for the whole fucking planet ffs
So the ncr became so flawed because the ncr population was pissed of the death of few prospectors who went outside the border of the ncr, in the wasteland, at their own risks and died? Did they know that most of the US is still a harsh place? Thank god is wasn't the capital wasteland.
@Exotic Bat The events about the death of the prospectors happened decades before fallout 3. The brotherhood didn't clean the capital wasteland back then. Even after fallout 3, the fight against the super mutants continued for a few years.
Exactly it just proves that the NCR are the best 34 people died going to a dangerous place and the ncr citizenry still freaked out. Shows how well they are protected and cared for in the heart of the ncr.
Johnathan Era except now they actually don’t care about their people. Maybe they did then, but that was decades ago. Now, they don’t care at all about their own people and will allow raider gangs to terrorize their own citizens and harass traveling merchants.
I think the big problem with the NCR is that it’s a democracy that has little-to-no checks and balances in how it operates as a government. This could likely be because President Tandy was such an effective ruler back in her day to be elected for 50 years that now they expect all their rulers to be just like that; when the truth is that having a highly competent ruler that is also benevolent is actually quite rare and not usually the norm. Quite often, careers in political power attract some of the worse types of people that are only in it for themselves.
The political corruption within the NCR has only been getting worse since Fallout 2 and will continue to do so unless they see drastic reason to change (such as losing). The more powerful they grow however, the more they will continue to disregard their own people as they have been doing because they will not see any reason to change.
Its an event we see repeated over and over again throughout history. The machurian incident in a way. It reminds me most fiercely of british settlers being murdered after crossing into zululand territory. The British declared war on the Zulu the following in the following weeks and a conflict which culminated in increased tyranny in the region resulted from it ultimately.
I want Bethesda to make a fallout in NJ where the minutemen grow up to be an empire and get more lore than they got in fo4
New Jersey, not New York.
If Bethesda can get their damn heads straight.
What I would want to see is The NCR, Minutemen's commonwealth and galvanized BoS all running into each other at peak strength, thus starting Cold War 2...
Thing is, the NCR is very similar to the actual U.S. government around the late 18/early 19 hundreds, with cattle barons, railroad companies and even newspaper magnates able to wield huge influence without any accountability, a string of broken/unfair treaties with various naitive peoples and the demands of a rapidly expanding population. However, they simply cannot allow an independent New Vegas since it is the door to eastward expansion, probably after they turn Oregon and Idaho into their breadbasket and Washington state into their lumber-yard. Personally, the only thing I can see realistically putting a stop to the NCR is the Yellowstone volcano going off again, which is due soon™ and will make the Divide look like a day at the seaside.
The time comparison you're thinking of is the gilded age, implying that under the glittery, or gilded, surface of prosperity lay huge problems, from corruption to monopolies to racial inequality just to name a few. The NCR looks to be going through a post apocalyptic gilded age. People are saying the NCR will collapse because of this, but people thought the same thing about the U.S during the gilded age, and it's still here. I don't see Oregon becoming a breadbasket for the NCR due to the very high chance of blizzards there, same for Idaho except not much snow depending on location, and there's no lore about Yellowstone at all, not even a reference, but I imagine it'd be utter hell for anyone due to the supervolcano beneath the park.
@@dragonbornexpress5650 Idaho gets snow everywhere
@@connerkinney97, depending on location, time, and other things, yeah.
@@dragonbornexpress5650 Not really even our desert areas get snow
@@connerkinney97, wait, what? How? That makes very little sense!
The House always wins.
But to NCR's credit, they expanded their borders to New Vegas to secure a power source. Surely this territory grab isn't the first annexation delivering value to the NCR and its people?
I think there's too much context missing on the reasons behind prior annexation to presume NCR's rapid expansion was just done for the sake of taxes and power alone.
DelaneWazHere come back to the lucky 38 mr house and I got some champagne for you
From the way that expansion for them can happen in fallout 2 when setting up and various things said by people in NV. We can make some pretty good guesses to their motives and modus operandi when it comes to annexation. It's not pretty.
@@Quandry1 Speaking with the newly-acquainted taxpayers of the Mojave alone isn't really the best source in finding advocates for the faction.
What was not pretty during the expansion between FO1&2?
You are aware that they ask you to attack patrols for towns so that they would accept being annexed into the NCR for protection aren't you?
And very few of the people in the Mohave pay taxes to the NCR or are a part of the NCR during the events of NV. Even in some of the places where the NCR has actual residence.
@@Quandry1 I will admit, it's been a long time since I last played NV, let alone siding with the NCR.
Who sends the courier out to attack the patrols?
That intro, with the CA dreamin’ track is badasss!
So underrated. Great work!
The NCR drove the dodo to extinction!
jbiehlable ahhh the voice of reason.... where have you been all my life..
The more I watch these videos, the more I have the feeling that New Vegas' NCR & Legion route is nothing more than a reminder on the weaknesses of going all out on 2 sides of what lead to the downfall of Greece & Rome, respectively. Of course, minus a societal condoning of slaves, but it's the 2 major aspects that are strongly associated each country.
One for their birth of Democracy, which becomes bizarrely quite similar when you notice the amount of land and people they annex to be part of their machine in so much as they become slaves.
And the other for their ambition to go all in and never take the time to properly look back, just like how Alexander the Great essentially went on his own campaign to conquer all the lands to the East as he could get without having the foundation to uphold his spoils during and after death, though the latter might just be more political corruption.
Part of what undid Alexander's kingdom was his sons. Each one felt they were the best to rule and had their own flaws which to some extent broke things up between them in the process.
The march version of “California Dreaming” is simply the best!
I’m feeling the California Dreamin’ intro 💯
Interesting point on hope as it implies the ability to change which is my favorite factor here.
4. the Legion, basically for the Legion to actually MAKE their rome first and THEN overcome Caesar's brainwashing that has put woman as sub-humans and economy based on slavery. Unlike Ashur for example, there are not plans for the ones in power to overcome their flaws and with the legion those flaws are in fact going to be enforced by a religious dogma.
3. House would be the least likely to ever change, he will not die for the foreseeable future and has a unquestioning robotic army, while not letting in anything get in the way of his plans. BUT Vegas itself has some freedom as long as House doesn't see what they are doing as a threat.
2. Yes-man is just anarchy as written, hell it doesn't even look like the courier is doing basic law enforcement outside the strip in that ending. it would take all the settlements coming together and finding a successful government to come that, then (unless the Courier/yes-man are backing it) they are going to have to find the resources to actually support it and a army. Not impossible but after NCR/House/Legion people seem every independent and unlikely to push for it.
1. then there NCR with it's voting. all they need to start overcoming their flaws is for the people to vote in favor of it. Hell if the followers start preaching about how in the Progressive Era the US overcame many of NCR's issues then they very well could start that process.
Caesars brainwashing makes the legion loyal to him, not any other ideological tenants. If he says women are equal, they will accept it implicitly; They believe he is a God. Uylsses says as much if you're a woman aligned with the legion, he says he wouldn't be surprised if the Legion had female legionaries now, because it changes itself entirely on Caesars whims. Therefore, there's no need to overcome that... All Caesar needs to do is say it, for his word is divine truth to them. It's much easier for Caesar to change his Legion than for the NCR to change.
Also, when it comes to voting, we're discounting how much money affects the system, especially in something so shot through with corruption as the NCR; Hell, the NCR increases its own risk of total military defeat simply for General Oliver's own personal political point scoring. A lot of democratically elected politicians are, generally, pretty corruptible and you need a lot of incorruptible ones to manage any real change. It's not likely to change within a lifetime. Likewise the NCRs immediate problems can't be solved by voting; the famine, water shortage etc aren't going to be changed by a vote, they're the result of decades of short sighted and greedy exploitation... And will take decades, at best, to solve. So you really need another President Tandi with a powerful party to save the Republic... and that's not likely to happen.
What's more likely is the wheels of the NCR will just keep on turning, and keep on crushing the poor people who have to hold the burden.
@@syphonfillter Again, just look at the US's the gilded age compared to where NCR is, and it's Progressive age.
@@nonamegiven202 Alright; Theres a lot of ways in which the US is still really shit for minorities, and the US itself has problems to do with corruption without being anywhere near as cartoonishly corrupt as the NCR. What were the latest polls that something like over 2/3s now supported an expanded socialised healthcare system, including a majority in both major parties? Yet it doesn't happen, because the powers that be don't want it to happen, because it would cost them a lot of money. There's a lot of Americans who think that reducing the funding to the massive military budget to care for the people would be better, to the point where the military itself hands off surplus equipment to the police of all things because it just doesn't need it... But it doesn't and won't happen in the near future, because the military industrial complex is so influential. Eisenhower said "Beware the military industrial complex", America didn't listen and now look at how run away crazy it's gotten. And that's a real world example in a system that isn't that terribly corrupt compared to the NCR, isn't threatened by a massive army on its doorstep and isn't facing the horrors of the wastes.
The NCR is facing a massive uphill struggle to get any of its ills changed... And even then, it can't change the resource problems without a rapid expansion and hoping for the best. Its own greed has come back to reckon with it, and it is going to be a massive struggle to cope. House has very few of such long term problems, the Legion has fewer. The NCR is the least likely to be able to get where it needs to be, because its democracy is highly corrupted already.
@@syphonfillter My point is simply that History provides examples of how NCR can fix it's current problems, an example that in universe they have access to. Who knows what would come after that.
I mean take the "military industrial complex" as you pointed out, a lot of that was breed from the World Wars and the Cold War, and now the US's place in the current power balance NCR, on the other hand, isn't likely to face those problems, worst case they just contract the Gun Runners start producing pulse ammunition in case of conflict with house in that ending (there's a reason House wanted the president to be the Scapegoat, NCR could take vegas from him)
@@nonamegiven202 I'm not sure they have that example though, because in Universe the point of divergence starts after ww2 and things immediately start getting off track in all kinds of direction (and ends up culturally trapped in the 50s), and by the time the bombs dropped the US was a highly authoritarian state conducting massively unethical experiments without consent and was highly racist and suspicious towards those of Chinese descent. In universe the example of the US is a bad one for the NCR because the US went very horribly wrong, that's why its brought up against the NCR when repeating the mistakes of the past.
The NCR is engaged in something of an arms race with the Legion due to their need to outfit so many soldiers (and consequently the gun runners are pretty powerful, but even then the supply can't keep up with NCRs demands) , but I was more using it as an example of how something can hold so much power over a democracy; in the NCR, it is more the Brahmin barons and the rich caravan companies like the crimson caravan that hold that influence, and they don't want things to change because the status quo is good for them, benefiting them massively over the poorer people and farmers who work for them, and helping them to quash and take over the smaller independent entities (Like how the crimson caravan works to acquire said caravans like Cass' and are willing to do dirty work to acquire them if someone's holding out)
As an aside that's not really related, part of the reason I don't like the mistakes of the past criticism the NCR often gets given is because it's circumstances are very different to prewar America's, and it really isn't like prewar America and the world its in is really too different to just brand it in that way. Not to mention for all its flaws, I'm pretty sure the NCR is actually well meaning for the most part and isn't conducting crazy human experiments and stuff. I kinda find it an unfair criticism because House is far closer to the Fallout America than the NCR is.
NCR looks very much like Russia (where i live at):
1. Large territory which is hard to maintain
2. "Democratic" dictator who gets re-elected until death
3. Thriving bueracracy all around
Sad story C:
You forgot the bear
you forgot to add "re-elected"
20:15- 20:21. You’ve read Machiavelli’s the Prince haven’t you. Lol
"Leave now, while you still have hope..."
-The Master
I like how you don't mention that if you go with the NCR, and follow their questline as they ask(just following orders), you basically go on a killing spree. Khans, free side, one of the families, House, BoS. Unless a courier goes out of his way to achieve at least some peace, you basically commit small genocides in the name of NCR. They directly ask you. Only the first quest asks you to become friends with the bombers to get their help. That's it. NCR is not interested in peaceful and co-existing solutions.
I also laughed at "NCR keeping Fiends at bay". Fiends base is across the street from NCR's main base in the whole mohave. Across the street, Carl!
Keeping Legion at bay, eehh, somewhat. I mean NCR does win the 1st battle of the hover dam, however as well at the start of the game(no prior courier involvement), NCR loses Nipton, Ranger Station Charlie, Nelson, Searchlight. All after their win at the Hover.
Forlorn Hope is under siege and without the help of the courier they can't regain their positions at Nelson.
NCR bites more than it can chew. They have too many enemies at the start of NV story, and their only ally is not interested in a long partnership, exactly because NCR eventually would try to chew him too. And they do...well, they send the courier to do the dirty job.
I just don't like that when it comes to the NCR "if we consider the intervention of the courier". No. We shouldn't. Courier is a standalone godalike entity in NV. It's a power that can do anything and everything. It's like saying "well, we kinda fucked up, but if only this godlike creature could come to solve all our problems that we created and make NCR great again"...
I don't remember which character in the game said it, but he summed it up quite good. "NCR is better than Ceaser, but practically anything is better than Ceaser"
this exactly. the courier doesn't fix the NCR's problems. the courier just treats a few symptoms. the problems that caused those symptoms still exist and the major source of those is oliver and kimball. who gets the credit for the courier's deeds in mohave? oliver and kimball. you make the NCR worse off by helping them and doom the mohave by ensuring kimball and oliver remain in power for years to come. they are still just as corrupt and imperialistic as they've ever been.
This:Why the NCR is Bad for the Mojave
The other vid:Why i chose the NCR
Because there are nothing but bad choices.
New Vegas: who would be best for the Mojave?
Me: who has the most bad ass shit?
Caesar: we have Spears, men, roads, and honor.
NCR: we have cool ranger helmets.
Me: okay, NCR it is!
Well I guess honor is sometimes subjective, but I wouldn't say crucifying men and enslaving women would be considered honorable in many people's eyes.
@@dooperdooper6679 A very antiquated sense of honor
American industry is/was the greatest on earth because of the gilded age, but during that time ot was also extremely corrupt and under the influence of big industrials. So the NCR has to overcome these things, but I believe will ultimately make it stronger
Here's what I think will happen in order for the series
First: the full story of Fallout 76
Second: The full story of Fallout 2
Third: the full story of Fallout 3
Forth: Independent Vegas
Fifth: The full story of Fallout 4
I love these "Why (faction) would be good/bad for (location)." videos, it's so interesting hearing your reasoning!
Another point about the corruption of the NCR is that some people at McArran say that if General Oliver didn't have ties to Kimball, Colonel Hsu would've been promoted to general. I also think that the NCR definitely has the resources and manpower they need to properly occupy the Mojave, but their presence there is so fragile because Oliver sends most or all of the new recruits that come in every month straight to the dam, he could definitely pull them out of there to secure the land if he'd move some of the rangers from camp golf that don't see much action there anymore to the dam, but like you said it's a pride thing with Oliver.
When Hsu says "we tried to annex New vegas, lots of supplies that would be good for us. But if anything they've annexed us," I was like GOOD. GET YOUR GRUBBY MITS OFF VEGAS
23:43
Its a flying centurion!
Oh no, mah immersion D:
OK I can already imagine what the title is going to be when he does the last of th videos of the "independent New Vegas"-route:
"Why Oxhorn is doomed to be the bad choice for the Mojave Wasteland"
And if he thinks it isn't, because he would rule fair and square of something like that, I'd like to remind the fair reader of one little quote Oxhorn himself used either in the same form or at least derived from this, by Lord Acton btw:
"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power tends to corrupt absolutely"
I would add though that I would change the quote to "power tends to corrupt, the more you have and the longer you hold it."
That's why I somewhat are astonished by House, how he managed to not become some techno-caesar. Though I might have an idea why he is like he is; due to being immortal (or the closed any non-ghould has come to it), he's removed one basic part of the human condition: our mortality. So he can really have projects that take forever, like, I don't know going to space maybe, without having to teach a line of successors. Also, the fact that he trusts the courier with helping him, because he realized he needed somebody else, an agent, while everybody else talks to you as mostly some sort of convenience they appreciate, since they almost always could reach their goals without you, though not as easy. House, he can't, his securitrons are good for security and fighting, but when it comes to something that needs anything close to subterfuge, there is simply no comparing his robots to to Rangers or Frumentarii.
if she was a bad president then how come Caesar has to fight the NCR? If she "failed" then wouldn't the NCR be a distant memory? And its not like Caesar can win easily against them either, the protagonist is the winning factor.
He never said Tandi is bad, he criticize the system, If im not mistaken he started to leave NCR after Tandi's dead
The protagonist is he deciding factor for all factions in the game, but there have been multiple post Son the fallout lore subreddit which examined the state of the game before the player does anything. The general points were
- Without the Chip, House is screwed. Benny gets captured by the Legion, Caesar has the chip. So House and Benny are out the game, bringing it down to just the Legion and the NCR.
- Due to the Legion having multiple strategic victories before the courier even shows up (The elimination of key locations such as Nelson and Search Light the generally bad state of NCR morale etc), they have a considerable edge over the NCR in the region and, during the final battle, their plan outsmarts the NCR as can be seen in the NCR ending where the player finds that the NCR has been taken off guard by the Legion having infiltrated into the lower levels of the dam. Without the couriers intervention the NCR is unlikely to stop them.
5:46 i love the way he died there the last person he sees is the courier and he dies on the throne
"Et tu, brute?"
From the old ranger at a ncr camp he said that all there lakes were dried up by the ncr over use and then from the scientists they say they are going to run out of food. This shows that they don’t use resources effectively and will collapse if they don’t expand
"It's everyone's favorite blue-eyed, burned and bandaged pistol-whipping ex-Legion Mormon!"
You're amazing, Ox 🤣
"The only thing that saves us from the bureaucracy is its inefficiency."
-Eugene McCarthy
Just want to say that the militaristic version of California Dreaming for this series was an excellent touch.
"Formed a vertibird fleet" *RIDE OF THE VALKYRIES INTENSIFIES*
It is one thing I admire of George Washington:
The presence set when he handed over power after only eight years was quite nice.
Great video Oxhorn.
Oddly it would seem winning the war, but losing the Mojave the dam might be best for the NCR. It needs to pull back some and straighten up the territory it already has.
Under the right management, the Mojave could be a great neighbor for the NCR to have. With the proper people running things in the things, that is.
There's something I noticed interesting about these endings. For the endings so far, what these factions are and represent is pretty much set in stone. Even the side quests don't really change their nature, only the endings.
But Yes Man ending seems to be different. I've heard quite a few argue that what right or ability does the Courier. All those side quest they do, All those SPECIAL stats they have, all those Skill points and Perk points they use. They all potentially define the character you play as. In a lot of ways, it seems like the Yes Man Ending shares a lot in common with your thoughts about the Minutemen, Oxhorn. I wonder if what I'm thinking will hold up to when you start looking into the Yes Man ending?
I agree. One of the best arguments for House or Yes Man is that the NCR is better off having the Mojave as an ally than as part of its own territory. I think the best outcome for the NCR is arguably a Yes Man ending where the Courier works closely with the NCR as a permanent ally, maybe even forming some sort of federation with the NCR. The latter isn't really anything that you can do in-game, but since the Courier is the player character, you can always say that that's what your character plans to do.
First the BoS in Fallout 4 and now this!!! Ox your breaking my awful nationalist imperialist heart 😋
*Democracy is non negotiable!*
Justin Newcomb The BoS in Fallout 4 are awful.
@@0816M3RC just like New Vegas
@@0816M3RC No, they aren't. They're sort of like the Enclave from Fallout 3 but better. All the BOS wants to do is bring civilization back to what it was. No synths, no ghouls, no supermutants, just human beings. They also want to take as much technology as they can so history can't repeat itself with nukes. That sounds good in the long run to me.
Makenzie Brennan the problem is that non humans like super mutants and synths and ghouls exist and they all have the capacity to be cognitively aware. Why should they be exterminated to return to a time long gone by 2200s ?
These are my favorite works by Ox. This is my 5th time through each series. Love the philosophy/morality convos.
Side note I literally laughed out loud at "everyone's favorite blue-eyed, burned and bandaged, pistol-whipping, ex-Legion Mormon"! Lolol
Did anyone notice that in the intro oxhorn used “California dreaming”
Democracy had its day. And Rome may not have been built in a day, but it sure fell in one.
The House always wins.
this is why I went with independent Vegas with yes man! House is powerful, yes, but greedy and amoral, but you can take all that makes him powerful (and able to protect Vegas) for your own, promising a better future for the mojave. The NCR has potential for a real future civilization, but they need time. making vegas independent gives them an opportunity to consolidate their resources, build up their armies, and build relations with the surrounding territories.
Ruth Miller but isn’t taking the rights and abilities away from a person so you can have them for yourself amoral and greedy? How do you differ from House if you take all the same steps he did to get to the top? How do you know that he isn’t doing what he thinks is right? What makes your version of what’s right better?
The questions these choices impose.
FYI: I chose independent Vegas too
What qualifications do we have that the courier can lead Vegas. Scoring 10 out 10 on a special test is not valid qualifications BTW
Sometimes I sit here and I watch videos like this and I read the comments and it makes me wonder:
Why can't we discuss real politics as civil-ly as this
Basically. Because the game politics doesn't affect real lives. Why the people in the game can't. Because they are acting like it affects their lives.
i know this isn’t your final decision on what’s the best choice for the mojave but the ncr is a far sight better than all other options when you factor in the courier’s help. No other option is as benificial to the most amount of ppl in the long run in comparison to the other choices given to us. Simply put they are the best of a bad situation which isn’t great but i believe it’s better than the rest...
Ahcbuhas eh if you work reallyyyy hard you can Yesman (while helping NCR a lot) your way to a great ending. Spare Caesar, but neuter the Legion otherwise (Vulpes, Nelson, Cottonwood Cove, etc...) but without nuking them. Obviously, don’t nuke the NCR, help them as much as possible *except* when it hurts locals (so, keep water in Westside, even though it hurts the NCR). Slaughter the Omertas, kill Benny with the help of Swank, expose the White Gloves’ cannibals & kill them (make sure not to let the Brahmin Barron boycott NV though). Help the Kings as much as possible (BUT use your one favor with them to bring about a peaceful resolution). Take the legal route with Cassidy, have an independent Primm, make the GoodSprings militia, kill all the Fiends and Powder Gangers.
Convince the Khans to give up hope (sounds bad, but they’re drug dealing raiders, they should dissolve). Use Helios One to evenly distribute power. Fully help the Followers.
Finally, convince the Brotherhood Elder to open up.
If you do all that with good karma you get arguably the best ending.
What if the Minutemen and NCR somehow ally I know it's not lore friendly, but that would kick ass.
It would be cool for example to have an alliance between the NCR and the Commonwealth Provisional Government, wich was a state that the Minutemen wanted to create but it was destroyed by the Institute, maybe after the end of Fallout 4 who knows if the Commonwealth was unified under the rule of the Minutemen. Someone should make a mod about that to Fallout 4
Minutemen are just some bunch of good-willing volunteers. Comparing to NCR, they are no difference from Republic of Dave by size.
Imo, if the Minutmen actually succeeded on establishing the Commonwealth Provisional Government, the Minutemen let alone is enough to unify the wasteland under it's banner (especially with the the Sole Survivor being it's General) and as for the NCR, as far as I know, I don't think they'd be any 'good' fit the wasteland as they are controlled by corrupt politicians.
I doubt the NCR would accept, the NCR would try to take over / consume the minuteman. Considering their idea align, the minutemen would probably getting absorbed to NCR (as NCR being a big nation that always consume everything)
"Democracy is the worst form of government...except for all the others." -- Winston Churchill
Don't feel bad, I had to google who said it too.
That guy was almost as bad as Hitler. He deliberately killed 3 million people in India with an induced famine which eventually led to their independence just as Queen Victoria had done to Ireland. He set up concentration camps in Kenya where he sent 80,000 innocent people most of whom were veterans in the British army and tortured them for years mostly involving genital mutilation. 20,000 people died in these camps and Barrack Obama's grandfather was sent to one, that's why he removed Churchill's bust from the whitehouse. Not only this but Churchill was aggressively against workers rights. When a worker's union for miners formed in the North of England for better working conditions or better pay he sent in the army to quell the English working class and most were injured and 2 were killed. On top of all these terrible things he oversaw the Black and Tans which were the equivalent of the Nazi SS. They were mostly world war 1 veterans with severe PTSD and were under orders to roam Ireland and kill civilians, kill livestock & burn villages. He was an evil bastard. Take his quotes with a pinch of salt.
Garry Love Good to know. But when he said that quote, he was right.
@@totmgsrockxd9900 except democracy only works when the foundation of civilization has been laid. only when everyone has their most basic needs covered and their borders secured can democracy work. even our own society today couldn't have been possible if the groundwork hadn't been laid by the autocrats of the past.
What if you did "ALL" the NCR quests that resulted in the best outcome and convincing the NCR to be better/and vastly improving the NCR? And all the quests to make people like the NCR more?
I would like to think of an ending for New Vegas would be to combine the Yes Man and NCR ending to make New Vegas a part of the Republic, but is run by the Courier.
I actually kinda see that as the canon ending, new vegas would basically be a protectorate of the NCR, they're technically separate, but their leadership is influenced by the NCR heavily. This would be good because then the NCR get robots I not their army and new vegas gets increased law and order without heavy weapons.
*into.
So Courier as mayor of an NCR city?
More like Governor of the state of New Vegas.
@@blasterthehedgehog8824, I don't really see that happening without the courier's new vegas being allied to the NCR heavily, kinda like Australia during World War 2 maybe.
I think that the fact the courier has to babysit the entire NCR in the Mojave says a lot
FF Kimball and Oliver, replace them with General Hsu and Chief Hanlon as the president also Major Dhatri
Damn right!!!
And that is where the problems start. The only reason why Hsu lost to Oliver is because he didn't have the right connections. The NCR will never rid itself of the corruption if they favor people based on money or other things instead of popularity and support.
I think the point of the NCR and Legion is a lesser of two evils thing. The NCR in the Mojave are the lesser evil.
I see legion as lesser evil, but to each is it's own.
Twin Builders lol a faction of rehabilitated tribals that rape children, murder indiscriminately, crucify people and leave them to die in the sun, pillage and loot towns, enslaved women and men alike...is the lesser evil? The NCR is very flawed and slow in progress, but it’s not a dumb glorified tribe ruled by one man who’s death would mean the end for it.
@@blackicestudiosv8065 the legion doesn't actively make regions outside of its own more chaotic and ruin trading routes, leading to Indeoendant settlements being choked to death. You know, like the NCR does. The NCR also keeps slaves, allows massive amounts of corruption, is massively guilty in taxation without representation, etc.
nah, the best option is to side with Ulysses and nuke both the NCR and legion, hit the reset button again.
Or just pick nobody. Don’t let the bear, bull, or Vegas rule the mojave, let the people rule themselves, and use the securitrons to prevent invasion by imperialist factions. No gods, no masters.
I actually disagree with Caesar on Tandi on calling her and the NCR a Hereditary Dictatorship "Because the council didn't dare oppose her! She was too popular. She had the people's love." ISN'T THAT THE BASIS OF A DEMOCRACY?
Yes if the people love their leader they should keep them until their love shifts so you don't get one guy taking away all the good the last guy did.
If the NCR is nothing but a "good guy" democracy, then it's not as interesting to have them in the game. There would be no quests and no grunt work for the Courier to do. They are purposefully made incompetent so we can fix their problems and have a proper quest line. So the NCR is still the best choice, they just need a glorified delivery boy to do some glorified janitor work.
Andri474 NCR benefits more from a mr house ending actually. It they succeed in annexing there resource scarcities will continue as they continue to be overstretches and overspend on the military. With a mr house ending the over spending is cut out but the resources are collected all the same. And new Vegas under mr house is not much different to NCR the elite still rule but people have the same freedoms to come and go. Lastly it provides a buffer zone between them and the legion.
@@irrelevant1242 yes I totally agree
Well I mean it’s either the NCR or legion imperialists or barbarians
Or free vegas
@@Fasttony64 which turns the mojave far worse than it originally is
Imperialism and Manifest Destiny FTW!
@@federicoveronese7998 Lets not forget that House answers to no feeble bureaucracy or directorate. He is free to move humanity forward and i think he has no reason to be horrid to his citizens as they are customers. Like a business he coincidentally serves them and humanity by extension. The house always wins. If you want to see the fate of democracy look out the window
Gotta love how you give Tandi the benefit of the doubt. "They just liked her"
But have you ever heard what legionaries have to say about Cesar?
This makes me wonder how long the longest democratically-elected president (or prime minister or equivalent office) has served IRL. I know no American president has served anywhere near that long, and I'm a bit skeptical of anyone ever being able to serve 52 years before she starts to be blamed for everything that's wrong in the country. Yes, there are legislators who've served that long, but they don't get as much publicity, and they can blame the other legislators for any problems in the legislature, and that's not counting things like gerrymandering.
I mean, both the Legion and the NCR are worst off for the people of the Mojave than going Independent. But there are risks with being independent, even with Yes Man's upgraded securitrons. So I think in the long run, it's probably better for both New Vegas and the surrounding area to be linked with the NCR. The Republic is like any nation-state, it'll have its up and down, but as an established and relatively stable faction, it'll allow the Mojave to prosper...given time.
Yep. Best choice 100% legit no scam. Are u serious NCR main goal is to live like before the war. This is not progress this is regress. Not even saying that the world before war is destroyed and they want do do the same thing! Doing the same thing over and over expecting diferent results is trait of madman.
Sorry for my english
The governments before the world was destroyed were really dictatorships at that point. They did whatever they wanted with the people and killed anyone who protested against them in any way. So it was really the *absence* of democracy that ended up with the Great War.
Dear Oxhorn
I love the way you explain things which helps explain the title of your videos and also helped me make my faction decision as the minuteman.Despite "Another settlement needs your help".
I Say the ncr and the minute men should team up.
Maybe even get the brother hood or the followers of the apocalypse or both
>furry ranger
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA