Well done, thanks. It's crucial for violinists to understand the effects of playing with instruments that use equal temperment - which includes 99% of guitars and basses as well as keyboards. The more we violinists practice scales and double stops, by ourselves, the more we end up trained to play in just temperment - so, the more at odds with our fretted friends. We might think, hey, I know, I'll just ask the bandmates to run a few scales at each rehearsal. I tried that with my first band, in the early 70's: Gibson EB0 bass, Telecaster, Rhodes, an early Mullen Pedal Steel, and me. We recorded it. Funny thing - the out of tuneness of the band was kinda obvious - even when the steel and I didn't play!! I still have the cassette. My intonation stuck out more because you can hear the little microadjustments I'm making to try to match the guitars. But there's an even nastier problem than equal vs. just temperment: its VOLUME. A bunch of psychoacoustics studies have shown that as the loudness of notes goes up, the human perception of pitch changes. With "pure" tones (tone generator), Ernst Terhardt found that musicians perceived a 6khz tone about 30 cents sharper than actual, and a 200hz tone was perceived 20 cents flatter than actual, when the volume was raised from 60db to 90db. So for any of us who are stuck playing in loud bands that can't seem to get hip to using ear monitors, frets may serve as the only port in a storm of built-in intonation discrepancies.
Outstanding video set! Extremely well done! Straightforward information, without all the unnecessary elitism and looking down your nose at us “mere mortals” who use frets!
As a guitar player, I think one of the main advantages with frets is in chord playing. The more I play extended chords or suspensions that stretch my fingers, the harder it would be to intonate four fingers stretched to their useful limits!
Frets facilitate playing in tune & also show you where all the notes are. The Fret Dots on the Wood Viper Violin & Cobra Cello indicate all your positions.
I’ve just bought a fiddle, and I’ve put frets on it. I tied nylon string around it like lute frets. I’m yet to see any downsides to it, but I’ll let you know
I'm just trying to find a few places where I can purchase a 4/4 fretted ebony fingerboard anyone have any advice the only place I found is over $200 for 12 frets only no inlays
When you are playing with equally-ish tempered instruments like keyboards, guitars and fretted basses, do you lean toward the just note or the equally tempered note on the violin? Which sits better over a guitar chord, or keyboard chord? (Not intended as a snarky question, I’m on the fence regarding buying a fretted violin).
I don't have any trouble playing with equal or just tempered instruments. The frets on the Viper don't tune it out. They're low enough that I can play it out of tune (and often do). They're really just landmarks on the neck that you can feel under your fingers.
Hi, an unrelated question: Do you have any thoughts/experience with using Vox Amplug2 as a headphone practice amp for violin? And which model would you think most suitable? Clean, I would guess? Thanks!
My question on your other video wasn’t really answered here, I’ll reword it a little bit… In your opinion, when is the fret spacing too narrow to still be useful?”
It's a little hard to say. I don't spend a ton of time above about the 17th fret. Nobody wants to hear all that screechy stuff in a rock band. But they're certainly useful at least up to there.
Exactly. On guitar intonation is an instrument setup problem. Electrics have an independant saddle for each string that adjusts forward and back to set the intonation. If all 6 saddles are in a line I guarantee the guitar sounds horrible high on the neck (if not everywhere).
Practicing with distortion will help identify intonation issues? Say less, all I needed was a single excuse to justify cranking some distortion during ptlractice 😎
Well! That helped me a lot after getting an acoustic violin custom made with frets! And struggling to get the notes still. 😅
Dude, this video taught me more about intonation than anything in college did. Thank you.
Very well and educationally explained, Matt. 🙂.
Well done, thanks. It's crucial for violinists to understand the effects of playing with instruments that use equal temperment - which includes 99% of guitars and basses as well as keyboards. The more we violinists practice scales and double stops, by ourselves, the more we end up trained to play in just temperment - so, the more at odds with our fretted friends. We might think, hey, I know, I'll just ask the bandmates to run a few scales at each rehearsal. I tried that with my first band, in the early 70's: Gibson EB0 bass, Telecaster, Rhodes, an early Mullen Pedal Steel, and me. We recorded it. Funny thing - the out of tuneness of the band was kinda obvious - even when the steel and I didn't play!! I still have the cassette. My intonation stuck out more because you can hear the little microadjustments I'm making to try to match the guitars. But there's an even nastier problem than equal vs. just temperment: its VOLUME. A bunch of psychoacoustics studies have shown that as the loudness of notes goes up, the human perception of pitch changes. With "pure" tones (tone generator), Ernst Terhardt found that musicians perceived a 6khz tone about 30 cents sharper than actual, and a 200hz tone was perceived 20 cents flatter than actual, when the volume was raised from 60db to 90db. So for any of us who are stuck playing in loud bands that can't seem to get hip to using ear monitors, frets may serve as the only port in a storm of built-in intonation discrepancies.
Thanks Matt, great content!! Really appreciate all of the valuable insights and information. Cheers!
Excellent video. Helped me understand a lot of what I am hearing when I play.
*This was clarity, educational and truthfulness. Thank you very Much. I needed this lesson.*
Outstanding video set! Extremely well done! Straightforward information, without all the unnecessary elitism and looking down your nose at us “mere mortals” who use frets!
Much appreciated!
Love it when the bottles are clinking.
Superb video thank you Matt cant wait to get hold of one
Awesome
As a guitar player, I think one of the main advantages with frets is in chord playing. The more I play extended chords or suspensions that stretch my fingers, the harder it would be to intonate four fingers stretched to their useful limits!
Frets facilitate playing in tune & also show you where all the notes are. The Fret Dots on the Wood Viper Violin & Cobra Cello indicate all your positions.
I’ve just bought a fiddle, and I’ve put frets on it. I tied nylon string around it like lute frets. I’m yet to see any downsides to it, but I’ll let you know
Let us know now haha.
I'm just trying to find a few places where I can purchase a 4/4 fretted ebony fingerboard anyone have any advice the only place I found is over $200 for 12 frets only no inlays
Educational
When you are playing with equally-ish tempered instruments like keyboards, guitars and fretted basses, do you lean toward the just note or the equally tempered note on the violin? Which sits better over a guitar chord, or keyboard chord? (Not intended as a snarky question, I’m on the fence regarding buying a fretted violin).
I don't have any trouble playing with equal or just tempered instruments. The frets on the Viper don't tune it out. They're low enough that I can play it out of tune (and often do). They're really just landmarks on the neck that you can feel under your fingers.
@@ElectricViolinShop “often do” is the part I was looking for, thanks!
Hi, an unrelated question: Do you have any thoughts/experience with using Vox Amplug2 as a headphone practice amp for violin? And which model would you think most suitable? Clean, I would guess? Thanks!
My question on your other video wasn’t really answered here, I’ll reword it a little bit…
In your opinion, when is the fret spacing too narrow to still be useful?”
It's a little hard to say. I don't spend a ton of time above about the 17th fret. Nobody wants to hear all that screechy stuff in a rock band. But they're certainly useful at least up to there.
Guitars, and Basses tend to have that problem too where not alll frets are in tune.
Exactly. On guitar intonation is an instrument setup problem. Electrics have an independant saddle for each string that adjusts forward and back to set the intonation. If all 6 saddles are in a line I guarantee the guitar sounds horrible high on the neck (if not everywhere).
@@jeanenviedapprendre Yeah Adjustable Saddles would really make a big difference.
My opinion is frets are useful for instruments playing chords.
Practicing with distortion will help identify intonation issues? Say less, all I needed was a single excuse to justify cranking some distortion during ptlractice 😎
Your 1.05946 is the 12th root of 2, for non concert pitch instruments... the math is much easier than a fiddle 😢