Just wanted to say thank you! Just got back from Vegas with about a 40% ROI through 3 craps sessions. Once I got down to about 2.5 shooters but never had a losing session. Thanks!
@@jmpopa I’m looking to win one shooter (7 units) at minimum. If it’s going well I’ll try for two. I like this a lot when I do a coffee run. First thing in the morning on a table where I’m basically alone. Great way to warm up
Thanks John! 124 rolls. No sevens between the 23rd and 43rd rolls. You had two hot combos - 3 showed eleven times and (6-3)9 twelve times. (Today is 3/9) I played this way (with the pass line also) in the early 80's for years and I agree with all your spoken and written comments on it. It is enjoyable and you can have a few drinks without blowing it. For the normal choppy table you can hang in there for hours when the dark side, place and full press bettors are all getting cleaned out, but you don't have the upside that they do on a hot roll. Still, you will be seen by the house as a tough player to beat. Just leave when you're up and maybe pay for dinner. I like the bigger payoffs of my aggressive strats, but not physical the stress. Unless I'm hanging out with friends, I go for the quick win and get gone.
I say all the time that you have to have some home run strategies, but also bachelor party weekend strategies ... this is one of the latter! But I have played this at the $25 level (once at the black level) and those itty bitty wins look like car payments.
Wow. I knew I rolled a lot of 3's and 9's last night. Holy Cow. This is absolutely a short/choppy table killer. On a long roll, you can miss a lot. On a medium roll, you could get roped. But it's been so stable for me over the years.
@@ProCraps With the 5-4s, you rolled a total of 15 nines. The 6-3 was superhot early, so the trend was very catchable. You rolled 9 avg every 10.33 rolls and my hops plays or just about any ladder or mini martingale on 9 would have crushed it. You rolled the exact same dice combo back-to-back 6 times - which is one of my sleeper hops progression plays. The first back to back combo repeat was the 6-3+6-3 on the 11th roll. The 5-1+5-1 back to back repeat hit twice, only 9 rolls apart. The 3 and the 4-3+4-3 Red combo both did a back to back and were #2 and #3 after the hot 9. BTW, any combo that repeats back to back is not a number you want a lay bet on - it will usually be at expectation or higher in the near term. So although people think bubble craps and the RNGs can get weird, they are really no different than random live tosses. When hot dice combos show up like this something else must be cold to compensate. In this test, when the nines took off, it was the 10 that went cold - ideal for a lay hedge vs Red and bonus winning from both sides.
That was a cool strategy. I thought on the grinds that your bank roll would go down but it didn't. I like the idea of playing with units to get your point across. Great to keep track all the time where your at!
It'll definitely grind a bit, but it's been so stable for me over the years. ... and yes. Think always in generic units, not dollars. It'll change the way you play.
I have revised this and tweaked it a bit. I wanted to get your thoughts say you get 2 come bets set and traveled put the the amount to cover in any seven. Covering it for less. If a box number hit your back into you strategy. And the seven is your friend the only numbers the hurt you is 2, 3 or midnight.
I really enjoy this strat John. It is a resilient sucker. It is really good at battling back and it's fun to play. The only problem is it's not easy to play on a bubble craps or Roll To Win. You almost need the chips to keep track of where you are. I'm definitely going to try this at a real table.
Big AZ did it on a bubble and ran it perpetually. Was nervous but made like $700. On a bubble it always tells you how much you have out there. So you just bet that plus $1
@@ProCraps That's true. You could just bet +1 on what you have out there. That would be easier with the individual Interlock bubble craps where you can take as much time as you want between rolls, but I find with the other type, you have 45 seconds to make a decision and it's easy to get flustered and make a mistake.
@@knuteboy3778 Please explain or demonstrate the "+1" idea here. And also do you cover the "Any Craps" also on each Pass and Come Rolls? I do like this "hedge" type strategy. Thanks!
Great illustration of this system!....I plan on hitting the casino in the next week or so and play this system with green, buy in for 1K....the extra reds to use to hedge with some Prop bets.
@@gscop1683 This one, the "Southern Border" strategy work well as counterparts. And either can be worked into the Horseman in place of the normal 3 come bets in there.
I like a hedge system so I played a $15 dp on every comeout. Ended with a +7 dp units or a +$105 at the $5 level. On a bubble machine, start with 7 units and cash out when done, then insert another 7 units for the next shooter. Just keep track of the "profit units" and don't use them, like on a big table.
Great Video! I love this strat... is it hard to keep track of the units on a $15 dollar table? playing with all 5 dollar chips would seem excessive on the $60 3rd come bet... lol any tips or thoughts? Thanks!
Yeah, it's a pain for sure. When you buy-in, though, they give you a good mix of chips. So what I do is pre-arrange my rack after the buy-in with each "shooter" section having 5 Reds and 3 greens, so that I can easily throw out the $15/$30/$60
It is a grind fursure. There’s high level of discipline involved. I do it sometimes and I must say I lay one smaller unit on the crap check! Protects ur COME bet. Crap numbers do come up.
Craps are the Kryptonite for sure. I’ve done this with a Field bet along with it. Covers the craps, sometimes pays you as the come bet gets set. Not sure if that’s good long term but it’s an interesting mix-up
When I was young and playing in AC almost every weekend I made friends with a few of the regulars. Learned a lot about the game from them. I’m making my one or two little bets and grinding out money for smokes watching others do more advanced things.
I have played them. At some point, I'll do a video on them, but you really need access to one with a camera (tough to get permission) to make that interesting enough, though.
I made the call there, because I had alotted 7 units for that shooter, and I'm not going to dig back into profits or backing bankroll to make that bet properly sized. That's the discipline that I try and play this at. Sometimes, I'll break with that on a long running roll. I may even start jacking odds on those, during a long roll.
I played this at the $1,000 chip level and made $16,000 in about 45 mins. It can be very dangerous but it's pretty solid. I almost always play don't which is why I have such a big bankroll, btw.
Wow. Be careful. On a crazy run it'll get absolutely nuts. I did this on a live show one day with bubble craps and starting at $1, I had a 40 roller and my last bet was like $2700.
Absolutely. I've got another strategy called the "Southern Border" where we do 2 DC bets and 1 Come bet, also with some sizing options to keep the 7 strong all the way through.
I don't understand why you are only paying 1 to 1 when you win a number that had moved from the Come bet. Is it because you don't have a pass line bet or is this just for an example?
@@ProCraps Thanks for the reply, yeah I realized later that was a stupid question. I'm headed to vegas this weekend and plan on trying this Come Ladder strategy. I've been testing it at home and don't understand why you don't utilize the pass line as one of the bets? Is it just personal preference or is there some advantage I'm missing? Love your channel.
@@ronawood it’s absolutely personal preference for me. In a good roll where a shooter is making lots of numbers but not the point, I like it when I have 3 come bets rotating around instead of just 2 and the pass line.
I really like this strategy but every time I roll it out I get absolutely trounced. I also really like the idea of using this as a way of kearning to manage bankroll and rack throughout a session.
From the hedgeless horseman, I absolutely do. On this one, I'm always so focused on winning on the 7 in the come, that I like to cycle these things. BUT, there absolutely no reason why you can't move the come bet wins right into place bets
I would wait until you have all 3 bets set -- keep the 7 strong -- and then take odds based on your bankroll. If you have a short stack of chips, I'd bypass them so you can keep playing. But if you're in profit, then definitely go and take odds on the come bets once set. I'd use any odds wins to go on back in with the next come bet, basically paid for.
@@gkgsports absolutely. Every strategy does. This one can do very well on a nice streak and definitely is a good long runner Remember to limit yourself to the 7 units per shooter. That’s critical to managing your profit and loss with this one. If you just keep running Come bets out there forever you will get hammered
Depends on why I'm there. For example, if I'm there "to go to work" and build up my 401(g), I'm going alone, probably early, and with that 20% goal in mind. I won't just walk out in the middle of a shooter but if I'm up by enough, I'm out. Now, if that was a great shooter and I'm up more than 20%, what I do is lock up the 20% with my buy-in and I take whatever excess I have and play on that and see if I can extend the win a bit more. A lot of times I'll buy-in for $500 and have a $200 win on the first one or two shooters. I'll lock up the $100, and I'll play on the other $100 and lock up 50% of every win from that. The fact that I live 20 minutes from a $5 table makes this possible for me to do, where for most people, it's just not that convenient. But there are other times when I'm there, say, with family or friends and I know we're going out to play, go to dinner and maybe play some more. On these nights, my buy-in is very much totally at risk and I'm not on any sort of a goal plan. I'm just playing for fun and if we win we win, but it's all about the hanging out. I have some grinder strategies that I play on these nights (the come ladder being one of them) that I know I can tread water with for hours and not have to think too much. And then there are the craps meetups where I'm playing with players. On these, I'm usually more aggressive and employing more home run strategies. Will I walk if I'm up big? Depends on how it's all going. But these aren't business trips, if you will. In fact, just last week, I met up with 5 TH-camrs to play in Atlantic City. We were all up over 20% after the first shooter. But none of us had shot yet, so we kept on playing. What i did was short stack play for a while, but then started playing more aggressively as the session wore on. That was a purely "let's go for it" kind of a day, and I brought bankroll specifically that I felt like it was ok to burn. Ended up doubling up, but that's not really the point. I find myself in scenario 1 (going to work) 90% of the time. The rare occasions where my wife and I are there for HOURS or when I have an all-in meetup are so rare that I'm totally ok with not obeying my 20% rule.
Great strategy John and great rack management. I want to try this at the casino tomorrow with $15 table which I will treat unit as $15. That would be $105 per shooter. I only have two quick questions, if you were to play this would you put odds if you start winning, question number one. Number two question would you play this with a don't come in the beginning if it was you. Kind of like what you and Greg came up with. I'm only going to go for a shot while and probably only do up to 500 to $600 bankroll. .. or should I just run it like it is? I think this would be a good slow bank roll builder.
You can do it like that for sure, but you can also go out there with $15 / $20 / $40 and make your "extra unit" a nickel instead of a full $15. Basically, cap each subsequent bet with the amount you're looking to win. You can do this with the horseman, for sure. Start with a DP and then ladder up the come bets. I've never done that, but there's no reason why that wouldn't work. It just makes the 7 more powerful as you go.
Hi John, First and foremost, I wanted to thank you again and thought I would follow up with some results. On my practice table, I did 12 shooters and was amazed with a win 34% or $436. At the casino I played for 3 hours. It was a very tough table and mostly everyone lost and left during the 3 hours. Well Long story short, I only lost $18 and was up and down ,At one point in the beginning I was actually up 2 hundred dollars. I’m definitely fond of this strategy. Being on the table for 3 hours and having that much fun was still a winner for me. Thanks Again Dan
I head this type of come play gets VERY little tier, pit boss wont even rate you worthwhile. Thoughts? In addition to pass line full odds with come bet full odds.
I'm an outlier here, but I don't give two you-know-what's about points or comps. They're just a reminder that I'm losing too much. I prefer to just focus on leaving with money and not worry about the other stuff at all. I'm sure I'm missing out on some perks, but I feel like it's a distraction. For this particular strategy, if you want to take the odds after you have the bets up there, that's fantastic if your bankroll and risk tolerance supports it. But I would hold off on dropping those odds out there while your tiered bets are coming through. Let the 7 win for you while you have the chance (thats the backbone of this play) and then go for it once you're all setup.
@@ProCraps I recommend you consider this, love the video. Concept is good to. A minor change would also gets you Tier Status and ability to get comps. I am living it, with similar strategy and travel. I think with your learned discipline you will succeed at most strategies. Thanks.
@@ProCraps yeah, glad we letting viewers know. several disputes with hosts and pit managers over the decades confirm this. 10's of thousands, and the reply is your an odds player. lol. loss and win numbers are still there so think they should still take care of my friends. lol
Money at risk should be money at risk in their eyes either way right? In the old days whether I played line or box they just watched you and fed you. Now it all feels a little bit to corporate to me.
On a $10 or $15 table would you ever just go for a win. So $10,$15,$30. A bit more of a grind as you only win $5 per win. Wondering if that is enough to work out of a hole?
You can set the "cap" to be whatever you want. "The Cap" being however much you want to win on the 7. So, instead of going out with $5, $10, $20 ... you could up the game and go out with $5, $30, $60 and look to win $25 on the 2nd or 3rd bets on the early 7. This takes bankroll, though. The further you go into it, you'll need a huge pile of chips to cover what's out there, but it's aggressive and profitable
@@diceemotion5412 I definitely do it with partial units at the higher levels. So, starting with $25, then $35, then $70 (targeting a $10 win each time). So you can alter the cap as you please, based on your goal. I suppose you could characterize increasing the cap as a laddering approach to some degree. This helps you control the acceleration so to speak.
Ideally, yes. That makes $10 you win size on those gross short rolls. You could also go at $10, $15, $$30 and make you 7 wins $5 And if you have bank … drop odds on them!
I have a strategy called the Southern Border, where I do a 3 Unit Don't Come, a 2 Unit Don't Come, and then a 3 unit Come. In that order, at those amounts. If you win any 2 of those 3 you'll be in profit. It's a grinder but works really well.
@ChristopherTaravella check out the strategy playlist on the channel. I think there’s one or two videos there where I explain this one from zero. This particular video is just a roll out and practice. I don’t have that link handy right now though.
I always call out the dice individually so you know the combinations, so if one die is a 2 and other is a 4, that's a "2-4" ... "6" so you know the dice and the total. That matters to a lot of people that make hop bets or play the hardways
I'm a don't player, most of the time, and I've learned that FOMO is real, but you have to stick to your deal and not let that creep into your psyche when you play a strategy like this.
Good morning john, please tell everybody out there, do not play this system... Casinos love this system , WHY...Because every time you make this bet/come bet THE CASINO pays you even money instead of [ 7 to 5 ] and that bet/bets are contract bets. John, when are you moving to vegas? your friend from puerto rico...jaime.
Even without odds, the lowly come bet has a lower house edge than every other bet out there on the table. If you want to follow the 3 come bets and add odds to them once they're set, that's fine, but for the first 3 rolls, while they're getting set ... let them stay flat because the 7 wins for you
John, from my perspective I fear that you are too * invested * in this tactic, this and your “Horseman,” even to entertain alternative methods of Betting On The Come. In my opinion these tactics consist of multiple repeated Violations of more nearly optimal Right Side strategy. To be continued.😏
Not sure what you’re referring to? I’ve presented a few times on betting the come with odds … full and progressed. As well as mixing it into other strategies. Full odds are great if you can afford them. Most people cannot. I’m more than ok losing less at the expense of bigger paydays. Would love to hear from you other ideas or methods you like to see me employ. I do have plenty of time in these shows to run and talk about things! Thanks as always for your support
Just wanted to say thank you! Just got back from Vegas with about a 40% ROI through 3 craps sessions. Once I got down to about 2.5 shooters but never had a losing session. Thanks!
Nice work! Love that strategy as a grinder
@@ProCrapscan I ask one follow up question, how many shooters up do you typically walk away in this strategy?
@@jmpopa I’m looking to win one shooter (7 units) at minimum. If it’s going well I’ll try for two. I like this a lot when I do a coffee run. First thing in the morning on a table where I’m basically alone. Great way to warm up
A complete FRAUD
Quit your FRAUD Channel. Show us your real Money! Show this live! You fake MF!
Thanks John! 124 rolls. No sevens between the 23rd and 43rd rolls. You had two hot combos - 3 showed eleven times and (6-3)9 twelve times. (Today is 3/9) I played this way (with the pass line also) in the early 80's for years and I agree with all your spoken and written comments on it. It is enjoyable and you can have a few drinks without blowing it. For the normal choppy table you can hang in there for hours when the dark side, place and full press bettors are all getting cleaned out, but you don't have the upside that they do on a hot roll. Still, you will be seen by the house as a tough player to beat. Just leave when you're up and maybe pay for dinner. I like the bigger payoffs of my aggressive strats, but not physical the stress. Unless I'm hanging out with friends, I go for the quick win and get gone.
I say all the time that you have to have some home run strategies, but also bachelor party weekend strategies ... this is one of the latter!
But I have played this at the $25 level (once at the black level) and those itty bitty wins look like car payments.
Wow. I knew I rolled a lot of 3's and 9's last night. Holy Cow. This is absolutely a short/choppy table killer. On a long roll, you can miss a lot. On a medium roll, you could get roped. But it's been so stable for me over the years.
@@ProCraps Oh yeah, it scales! With 3k playing bankroll, patience and discipline you can make those car payments.
@@ProCraps With the 5-4s, you rolled a total of 15 nines. The 6-3 was superhot early, so the trend was very catchable. You rolled 9 avg every 10.33 rolls and my hops plays or just about any ladder or mini martingale on 9 would have crushed it. You rolled the exact same dice combo back-to-back 6 times - which is one of my sleeper hops progression plays. The first back to back combo repeat was the 6-3+6-3 on the 11th roll. The 5-1+5-1 back to back repeat hit twice, only 9 rolls apart. The 3 and the 4-3+4-3 Red combo both did a back to back and were #2 and #3 after the hot 9. BTW, any combo that repeats back to back is not a number you want a lay bet on - it will usually be at expectation or higher in the near term. So although people think bubble craps and the RNGs can get weird, they are really no different than random live tosses. When hot dice combos show up like this something else must be cold to compensate. In this test, when the nines took off, it was the 10 that went cold - ideal for a lay hedge vs Red and bonus winning from both sides.
@@blacklight4460 That happened again today. The 9 was HOT this morning.
That was a cool strategy. I thought on the grinds that your bank roll would go down but it didn't. I like the idea of playing with units to get your point across. Great to keep track all the time where your at!
It'll definitely grind a bit, but it's been so stable for me over the years.
... and yes. Think always in generic units, not dollars. It'll change the way you play.
I have revised this and tweaked it a bit. I wanted to get your thoughts say you get 2 come bets set and traveled put the the amount to cover in any seven. Covering it for less. If a box number hit your back into you strategy. And the seven is your friend the only numbers the hurt you is 2, 3 or midnight.
I could see doing that. The trouble is the bleed, though. I'll have to run these options side by side in WinCraps to see how bad the bleed is.
I really enjoy this strat John. It is a resilient sucker. It is really good at battling back and it's fun to play. The only problem is it's not easy to play on a bubble craps or Roll To Win. You almost need the chips to keep track of where you are. I'm definitely going to try this at a real table.
Big AZ did it on a bubble and ran it perpetually. Was nervous but made like $700. On a bubble it always tells you how much you have out there. So you just bet that plus $1
@@ProCraps That's true. You could just bet +1 on what you have out there. That would be easier with the individual Interlock bubble craps where you can take as much time as you want between rolls, but I find with the other type, you have 45 seconds to make a decision and it's easy to get flustered and make a mistake.
@@knuteboy3778 Please explain or demonstrate the "+1" idea here. And also do you cover the "Any Craps" also on each Pass and Come Rolls? I do like this "hedge" type strategy. Thanks!
Great illustration of this system!....I plan on hitting the casino in the next week or so and play this system with green, buy in for 1K....the extra reds to use to hedge with some Prop bets.
Let me know how it goes. This one really is pretty resilient
I certainly will! Im trying to study more on your No Bets and Choppy table bets before I go in case I need to shift strategies. Many Thanks !
@@gscop1683 This one, the "Southern Border" strategy work well as counterparts. And either can be worked into the Horseman in place of the normal 3 come bets in there.
Thanks !
Thank You, I have just pulled the Southern Border up!
I like a hedge system so I played a $15 dp on every comeout. Ended with a +7 dp units or a +$105 at the $5 level. On a bubble machine, start with 7 units and cash out when done, then insert another 7 units for the next shooter. Just keep track of the "profit units" and don't use them, like on a big table.
That's a good tweak.
I agree, I would never play the pass line with this strategy. However, I would consider playing the don't pass with this strategy.
That becomes the Hedgeless Horseman. I like that variant
Great Video! I love this strat... is it hard to keep track of the units on a $15 dollar table? playing with all 5 dollar chips would seem excessive on the $60 3rd come bet... lol any tips or thoughts? Thanks!
Yeah, it's a pain for sure. When you buy-in, though, they give you a good mix of chips. So what I do is pre-arrange my rack after the buy-in with each "shooter" section having 5 Reds and 3 greens, so that I can easily throw out the $15/$30/$60
It is a grind fursure. There’s high level of discipline involved. I do it sometimes and I must say I lay one smaller unit on the crap check! Protects ur COME bet. Crap numbers do come up.
Craps are the Kryptonite for sure. I’ve done this with a Field bet along with it. Covers the craps, sometimes pays you as the come bet gets set. Not sure if that’s good long term but it’s an interesting mix-up
@@ProCraps -too much goes to the house if constant edging. Kryptonite fursure.
This looks like a great strategy. I'm surprised more people aren't talking about it.
It works surprisingly well. Try in bubble craps with $1 chips up to 6 levels.
I wish someone would have shown this to me 3 yrs ago...lol
Great system,,thanks for the content John.
When I was young and playing in AC almost every weekend I made friends with a few of the regulars. Learned a lot about the game from them. I’m making my one or two little bets and grinding out money for smokes watching others do more advanced things.
Hello John. Have you tried the new, "Roll to Win Crap" Tables? Would you do a new Video, on how to play them? Thanks Jerry.
I have played them. At some point, I'll do a video on them, but you really need access to one with a camera (tough to get permission) to make that interesting enough, though.
@11:44 what happen to your discipline , putting up 3 unit when it should have been 4, were do you draw the line.
I made the call there, because I had alotted 7 units for that shooter, and I'm not going to dig back into profits or backing bankroll to make that bet properly sized. That's the discipline that I try and play this at. Sometimes, I'll break with that on a long running roll. I may even start jacking odds on those, during a long roll.
I like using this out of the tool kit occasionally but seems like usually it's bad timing and lose more often than not....Thanks John!
Maybe if I laddered up to about 20 units it would recover but damn that's risky.
You'll hit a bad run, but this thing always finds a way to battle itself back to health.
how do you like this vs the horseman?
They're interchangeable to me. This one takes 7 units, the core horseman takes 4 units, so sometimes it's a bankroll decision.
I played this at the $1,000 chip level and made $16,000 in about 45 mins. It can be very dangerous but it's pretty solid. I almost always play don't which is why I have such a big bankroll, btw.
Wow. Be careful. On a crazy run it'll get absolutely nuts. I did this on a live show one day with bubble craps and starting at $1, I had a 40 roller and my last bet was like $2700.
Liked watching this, thoughts on it from the darkside?
The beauty of this one is that it’s technically a dark side play. Looking for that nice early 7
Can you do this strategy with the don't?
Absolutely. I've got another strategy called the "Southern Border" where we do 2 DC bets and 1 Come bet, also with some sizing options to keep the 7 strong all the way through.
Oh great betting strategy for $25 table. I'm trying this.
Let me know how it goes!
I don't understand why you are only paying 1 to 1 when you win a number that had moved from the Come bet. Is it because you don't have a pass line bet or is this just for an example?
A travelled come bet pays 1:1. It issues extra when you take odds on it as well. But in this strategy we don’t do the odds.
@@ProCraps Thanks for the reply, yeah I realized later that was a stupid question. I'm headed to vegas this weekend and plan on trying this Come Ladder strategy. I've been testing it at home and don't understand why you don't utilize the pass line as one of the bets? Is it just personal preference or is there some advantage I'm missing? Love your channel.
@@ronawood it’s absolutely personal preference for me. In a good roll where a shooter is making lots of numbers but not the point, I like it when I have 3 come bets rotating around instead of just 2 and the pass line.
I really like this strategy but every time I roll it out I get absolutely trounced. I also really like the idea of using this as a way of kearning to manage bankroll and rack throughout a session.
If you give it some runway, it's very stable. I lived on this one for years.
Do you ever transition to a more place that strategy
From the hedgeless horseman, I absolutely do. On this one, I'm always so focused on winning on the 7 in the come, that I like to cycle these things.
BUT, there absolutely no reason why you can't move the come bet wins right into place bets
How can I do this with Odds? Thanks
I would wait until you have all 3 bets set -- keep the 7 strong -- and then take odds based on your bankroll. If you have a short stack of chips, I'd bypass them so you can keep playing. But if you're in profit, then definitely go and take odds on the come bets once set.
I'd use any odds wins to go on back in with the next come bet, basically paid for.
Does this strategy go to ruin John? Let's say I have a BR for 10 shooters? How often does this go to ruin if my Stoploss is $0. Thank you.
@@gkgsports absolutely. Every strategy does. This one can do very well on a nice streak and definitely is a good long runner
Remember to limit yourself to the 7 units per shooter. That’s critical to managing your profit and loss with this one.
If you just keep running Come bets out there forever you will get hammered
John if you are up 20% right away. Do you walk away from the table?
Depends on why I'm there.
For example, if I'm there "to go to work" and build up my 401(g), I'm going alone, probably early, and with that 20% goal in mind.
I won't just walk out in the middle of a shooter but if I'm up by enough, I'm out. Now, if that was a great shooter and I'm up more than 20%, what I do is lock up the 20% with my buy-in and I take whatever excess I have and play on that and see if I can extend the win a bit more. A lot of times I'll buy-in for $500 and have a $200 win on the first one or two shooters. I'll lock up the $100, and I'll play on the other $100 and lock up 50% of every win from that. The fact that I live 20 minutes from a $5 table makes this possible for me to do, where for most people, it's just not that convenient.
But there are other times when I'm there, say, with family or friends and I know we're going out to play, go to dinner and maybe play some more. On these nights, my buy-in is very much totally at risk and I'm not on any sort of a goal plan. I'm just playing for fun and if we win we win, but it's all about the hanging out. I have some grinder strategies that I play on these nights (the come ladder being one of them) that I know I can tread water with for hours and not have to think too much.
And then there are the craps meetups where I'm playing with players. On these, I'm usually more aggressive and employing more home run strategies. Will I walk if I'm up big? Depends on how it's all going. But these aren't business trips, if you will.
In fact, just last week, I met up with 5 TH-camrs to play in Atlantic City. We were all up over 20% after the first shooter. But none of us had shot yet, so we kept on playing. What i did was short stack play for a while, but then started playing more aggressively as the session wore on. That was a purely "let's go for it" kind of a day, and I brought bankroll specifically that I felt like it was ok to burn. Ended up doubling up, but that's not really the point.
I find myself in scenario 1 (going to work) 90% of the time. The rare occasions where my wife and I are there for HOURS or when I have an all-in meetup are so rare that I'm totally ok with not obeying my 20% rule.
@@ProCraps Thanks.
Great strategy John and great rack management. I want to try this at the casino tomorrow with $15 table which I will treat unit as $15. That would be $105 per shooter. I only have two quick questions, if you were to play this would you put odds if you start winning, question number one. Number two question would you play this with a don't come in the beginning if it was you. Kind of like what you and Greg came up with. I'm only going to go for a shot while and probably only do up to 500 to $600 bankroll. .. or should I just run it like it is?
I think this would be a good slow bank roll builder.
You can do it like that for sure, but you can also go out there with $15 / $20 / $40 and make your "extra unit" a nickel instead of a full $15. Basically, cap each subsequent bet with the amount you're looking to win.
You can do this with the horseman, for sure. Start with a DP and then ladder up the come bets. I've never done that, but there's no reason why that wouldn't work. It just makes the 7 more powerful as you go.
Hi John, First and foremost, I wanted to thank you again and thought I would follow up with some results. On my practice table, I did 12 shooters and was amazed with a win 34% or $436. At the casino I played for 3 hours. It was a very tough table and mostly everyone lost and left during the 3 hours. Well Long story short, I only lost $18 and was up and down ,At one point in the beginning I was actually up 2 hundred dollars. I’m definitely fond of this strategy. Being on the table for 3 hours and having that much fun was still a winner for me. Thanks Again Dan
I head this type of come play gets VERY little tier, pit boss wont even rate you worthwhile. Thoughts? In addition to pass line full odds with come bet full odds.
I'm an outlier here, but I don't give two you-know-what's about points or comps. They're just a reminder that I'm losing too much. I prefer to just focus on leaving with money and not worry about the other stuff at all. I'm sure I'm missing out on some perks, but I feel like it's a distraction.
For this particular strategy, if you want to take the odds after you have the bets up there, that's fantastic if your bankroll and risk tolerance supports it. But I would hold off on dropping those odds out there while your tiered bets are coming through. Let the 7 win for you while you have the chance (thats the backbone of this play) and then go for it once you're all setup.
@@ProCraps I recommend you consider this, love the video. Concept is good to. A minor change would also gets you Tier Status and ability to get comps. I am living it, with similar strategy and travel. I think with your learned discipline you will succeed at most strategies. Thanks.
@@majesticnetcom They definitely don't give ratings at all on odds play. It's all about time and consistent risk from what I understand.
@@ProCraps yeah, glad we letting viewers know. several disputes with hosts and pit managers over the decades confirm this. 10's of thousands, and the reply is your an odds player. lol. loss and win numbers are still there so think they should still take care of my friends. lol
Money at risk should be money at risk in their eyes either way right? In the old days whether I played line or box they just watched you and fed you. Now it all feels a little bit to corporate to me.
Dont you have to have a pass line bet in order to roll?
Yes, you do.
But when I'm rolling out strategies, I typically just roll as though we were going around the table, purely random.
Sorry I missed this. Too late for this old man.
On a $10 or $15 table would you ever just go for a win. So $10,$15,$30. A bit more of a grind as you only win $5 per win. Wondering if that is enough to work out of a hole?
You can set the "cap" to be whatever you want. "The Cap" being however much you want to win on the 7.
So, instead of going out with $5, $10, $20 ... you could up the game and go out with $5, $30, $60 and look to win $25 on the 2nd or 3rd bets on the early 7.
This takes bankroll, though. The further you go into it, you'll need a huge pile of chips to cover what's out there, but it's aggressive and profitable
@@ProCraps thanks. As you indicated this was a go to strategy for years I thought maybe you would’ve tried it not just up a unit but up a partial unit
@@diceemotion5412 I definitely do it with partial units at the higher levels. So, starting with $25, then $35, then $70 (targeting a $10 win each time). So you can alter the cap as you please, based on your goal. I suppose you could characterize increasing the cap as a laddering approach to some degree. This helps you control the acceleration so to speak.
So if you you are gonna play this at the 10 dollar level, it would be 10, 20, 40?
Ideally, yes. That makes $10 you win size on those gross short rolls.
You could also go at $10, $15, $$30 and make you 7 wins $5
And if you have bank … drop odds on them!
@@ProCraps thank you sir
How would you play this on the Don't strategy? No come out bet, 1 unit DC, followed by 2 units DC, followed by 4 units DC?
I have a strategy called the Southern Border, where I do a 3 Unit Don't Come, a 2 Unit Don't Come, and then a 3 unit Come. In that order, at those amounts. If you win any 2 of those 3 you'll be in profit. It's a grinder but works really well.
This is confusing to me! Come bets are Contractual. They can't be taken off!! Explain more!!😢😢😢
We never pull them down. They are contract bets that stay up until they resolve. Did I say otherwise somewhere in the video?
@ProCraps Look I respect you more than anyone in TH-cam! I want you to explain this more!
You don't need to be a a hole! I'm new to this game!
Wasn’t trying to be. Legitimately I make mistakes when I talk sometimes and people catch them. Thats why I asked.
@ChristopherTaravella check out the strategy playlist on the channel. I think there’s one or two videos there where I explain this one from zero. This particular video is just a roll out and practice. I don’t have that link handy right now though.
WTF iz a 2 4 6 ?
I always call out the dice individually so you know the combinations, so if one die is a 2 and other is a 4, that's a "2-4" ... "6" so you know the dice and the total.
That matters to a lot of people that make hop bets or play the hardways
So many juicy rolls wasted. I guess its viable when your low stack but i dont have the discipline to just play 2-3 numbers and not spread out
I'm a don't player, most of the time, and I've learned that FOMO is real, but you have to stick to your deal and not let that creep into your psyche when you play a strategy like this.
Good morning john,
please tell everybody out there, do not play this system... Casinos love this system , WHY...Because every time you make this bet/come bet THE CASINO pays you even money instead of [ 7 to 5 ] and that bet/bets are contract bets.
John, when are you moving to vegas?
your friend from puerto rico...jaime.
Even without odds, the lowly come bet has a lower house edge than every other bet out there on the table. If you want to follow the 3 come bets and add odds to them once they're set, that's fine, but for the first 3 rolls, while they're getting set ... let them stay flat because the 7 wins for you
John, from my perspective I fear that you are too * invested * in this tactic, this and your “Horseman,” even to entertain alternative methods of Betting On The Come.
In my opinion these tactics consist of multiple repeated Violations of more nearly optimal Right Side strategy. To be continued.😏
Not sure what you’re referring to? I’ve presented a few times on betting the come with odds … full and progressed. As well as mixing it into other strategies. Full odds are great if you can afford them. Most people cannot. I’m more than ok losing less at the expense of bigger paydays.
Would love to hear from you other ideas or methods you like to see me employ. I do have plenty of time in these shows to run and talk about things!
Thanks as always for your support