The Truth about the Come Bet | Casino Craps
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 พ.ค. 2022
- There is a myth that the Come bet has to roll a number twice in order to win, but this is not the whole story. The come bet, like the pass line bet is a two part bet. It is a very different bet than a place bet. While many craps players try and compare the two bets, the truth is they are very different bets.
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Great presentation comparing the Place bet to the Come bet. Thank you!
Strength of the Come bet's 'Come-out" makes a simple Come bet progression a great hedge for a Place bet spread.
Bring the Place bet down with the Come bet going to that number, and you have paid for the Come bet with the Place bet win.
Or use the Place bet win to add Odds to the Come bet, and then establish predetermined number of Come bets & pull rest of the Place bets.
Much better version of the 3 point Molly, if you're so inclined.
Great video. Very informative in regards to the odds.
Ha, I now understand your comment in your previous video.
Perfectly said sir. I agree with you here. One of the best videos I've seen about this bet and overall strategy.
One minor nit: You are absolutely correct in that someone who comes through the Come and not wanting the 7.
Note, however, that such does, in fact, serve as a (minor) hedge against the 7. This was the concept I was alluding to in the other video. No one wants a 7, but it helps when you have a working Come bet!
In any case, the idea that a place bet is inherently superior to a Come bet is Neanderthal in its conception.
Your strategy at the table will determine what and when certain bets will be made.
Follow your strategy, hopefully it's sound, and let 'er rip.
Yep, there are strategies that utilize the come bet as a hedge, ie. making increasing size come bets etc. but it is always a nice little "rebate" if the 7 does show
@@ColorUp This is what I was alluding to in my comment above.
Thanks for making this video. You couldn't have explained the way come bets work any better. I was one of those people who certainly thought you to get the come bet number twice in order to win. The way you explain how this really works makes soooo much sense.
Thanks, it is a two stage bet, so very different than a place bet
I always play the come, and because most people don't play it you would be surprised how many dealers forget to take the flat bet and return free odds after a point is made.😂 at least in NY. Thanks again!
@@ColorUp So at end of day,is the "buy" the better way to go? Say you do $30 place on the 10,$30 buy the 10 and the $20 on the come and it lands on the 10,then $10 on odds. 3 different scenarios,all $30 on each,dosent the "buy" return the most profit?
Always buy vs place on 4/10, only buy 5/9 if vig is collected on win only.
@@ColorUp that's the way bubble craps and all the electronic games are set up. They only take the vig off the win.
Increasing the Come bet as there is more exposed money could be a good hedge against the Seven.
Also the Come bet is a "contract" bet and can never be removed. I suppose most players know this but it was not mentioned in the video.
On a side note: I had a great time with the Roll To Win electronic craps at the Grand Sierra Resort when I was in Reno.
Or I could bet the don’t pass to hedge for the 7
I understand that the house edge on the come between is 1.62%, but that is because it’s basically a pass line bet. I would rather place the 6 and 8 +buy the 4 and 12. You eliminate the chance of losing on a 2,3,12 when you can still lose on the 7. I like the option of pulling back my place bets if I want to, where as you are 100% committed to the come bet as the money travels to the number.
Great video. I subscribed!
Thanks for the sub!
Thank you Jeremy,
It opened my eyes to the COME bet,going to try it 🤙🏻🤙🏻🤙🏻 Mahalo
Best of luck!
Thank you for your excellent & informative videos. I've been playing so long I sometimes forget why I do what I'm doing! You help me think & refresh my play. Keep them "coming".😂😂😂
Going straight come bets can get pricy and I'm a low bankroll player. So I'll start place bets and once the roll pays for itself I move to come bets ASAP
My favorite strategy involved doing place bets but also a $10 come bet, when a number rolls, I ask my place bet be used for odds on the come bet and collect the win and make another $10 come bet and repeat the process until all numbers have come bets with odds. Because the $10 bet on the come remains, the come bets on the numbers and thier odds don't get taken down. Then I'd shift to a collect/press routine. With a good shooter you can start pulling a lot of money. If i remember correctly, a great part of this strategy is if a 7 rolls on the come out roll, I lose the come bets but I don't lose the odds and they return them to me and I get to start over.
I’m having a hard time following this. Say you have place bet on 6 and a come bet. 6 rolls. You get paid on the place bet, use that for your odds on the 6 come bet then place another come bet. If a 7 rolls next you would win the new come bet but you should lose the 6 and the odds on it.
He calculated the come bet on 4 wrong. The 10 dollars gets paid 9-5 or 18 plus true odds of 2-1 on the free odds or 20 for a total of 38, not 30. The buy bet gets paid true odds of 40 less the commission of of 1 or 39. The place bet of 20 pays 9-5 or 36.
I've always thought of it as a "time travel" bet where the next roll is the come-out roll, on a separate timeline, and only a seven-out with both main game and Come bet-with-point brings everything back into the present. Wibbly-wobbly.
I imagine it was invented as a way to get people into the action sooner without having to wait for a new shooter.
this is a good although inadvertent explanation of why you should not make Come bets if you already have a Pass Line bet in effect. it's better to make Come bets when you have a Don't Pass bet in effect, because then the bets are not interfering with each other...both of these bets will win when a 7 is rolled (if the Come bet is still in the Come box).
Maybe but if you bet don’t pass and a come bet, they offset and you win nothing
Love the videos
What happens to the come bet with odds when the puck is off? Do you lose the money ? Or because the puck is off nothing happens? Would love to know
Nice explanation Jeremy 👍👍
Glad you liked it!
New players think they have a big advantage with the come or pass line bet because you win on the 7 & 11 and you get a lower house edge when taking odds. There are only eight out of 36 ways to win which is a very low 22.22% versus 28 ways you're not going to win which is 77.7%. and you lose four ways with the 2,3&12 out of the 28 combinations. (11.1%) Plus You can not take odds until you take an "even money" pass/come bet and that lowers your ROI and you do not get to pick your number. Place bets have a lot more options for the player. This is one of the TOP TEN MYTHS in Craps. This is called "Casino math ( House edge%) VS Real math (ROI $$$) Old saying in Vegas "All This House edge is Crap with a Capital C" Nice clip. Good Luck at the tables.
Explains why I prefer place bets well.
I always thought there was more of an advantage getting paid true odds at a lower house edge (with the come & odds), but will have to reevaluate. Thanks for the great vid.
Nothing to evaluate . Lowering the house edge has to be the best strategy .
@michaelblankenau6598 lowering house edge simply means you lose less money over the long term. You can only win in the short term at this game, which requires a bit of luck and minimizes the effect of house edge
@@ColorUp Correct . And losing less over the long run is better than losing more . So nothing really needs to be evaluated .
Great video but curious on one thing. Can you put odds on a place bet like you can with the come bet? You mentioned that there is a zero house edge when you put odds after a number is hit with the come bet.
No you cannot. However the odds are somewhat built into a place bet payout. You don’t get the benefit of a first roll 7 winning, but a place bet does pay better until you have 5x in odds on a come bet. For instance, a $30 place bet on 9 pays $42. A $10 come and $20 odds, pays $40
@colorup - Thank you for your response and breaking it down more. So regarding your example, a $30 place bet on 9 wins $42. But $10 come plus $20 odds which would equal a total bet of $30 only wins $40? So you would make more betting on the number not factoring in the come out bet possibly winning with a 7 or 11?
The real myth is comparing "house edge" vs. the odds of throwing any given number. Like you said, house edge is long term, but the odds of an outcome stay the same. So the myth is a player hearing "house edge" believes it's a "better" bet in the short term. I'd guess there is not a hand full of players in the country that will play enough to ever bring house edge truely to bear.
truth
our fellow friends at Casino Quest do a 30 roll Craps challenge, I never understood why more players don't to a come bet towards the end of the roll (>28) when they are attempting to win big. Most players end up doing a field bet, which isn't necessarily a bad bet despite what the "experts" say. However if on roll 28 you do a come bet, 7 hits - you win, cool! Otherwise your next roll (#29) is focused another point number, again not a bad bet. If you do manage to make it all the way to the end of 30 rolls they take all your bets down and tally up for a score. If you follow my logic you are getting two bets for the price of one and the potential to get your money back....Of you could do a "Don't Come" if you are a dark side player.
I might attempt this strategy if I ever get back to Vegas and the Casino Quest crowd.😀
Hey ColorUp, when is dice con? When y’all headed to Vegas?
Sorry Private event- date hide for club members
One other reason that casinos have 345 odds: It helps the dealers. With full 345 odds on any number (come or pass line), the dealer will pay 7 times the base bet. Thanks for the video.
Yeah, I've heard that a lot, but they do math all the time, and that only helps if and when the player bets max odds so....🤷🏽♂️
Do you know WHY a pass & come bet with odds that has a low house edge of 0.8% pays LESS money than a place bet with a 4% house edge?? (Point 5/9 with odds) Anyone, Anyone, Bueller, Bueller! The books NEVER explain this to the players. Why not?? It is better to play for a higher ROI $$ than a lower House edge % aka "Casino Math vs Real math." From the show on TH-cam: "Casino math VS Real math." Good Luck at the tables!! Enjoyed this clip. 🤫 Win more at the tables.
This Information is " OFF THE RECORD, ON THE Q.T. AND VERY HUSH HUSH" TIP: ALL This house edge % is Crap with a capital "C" aka "Casino Math VS Real Math!
I play the come ladder strategy with a fair amount of winning sessions. I ignore the pass and play 3 units escalating per come bet. I win far more with the come strategy over my favorite place strategy the hungry 6-8.
The true advantage is place bets are not contract bets. You decide the numbers. You can pull your bet(s) at any time. Come line bets are contract bets.
Those are all advantages of place bet, yes
that's one of the reasons I don't like Come and DC bets, they are CONTRACT bets and you can't take them down when you are at a disadvantage.
sorry, i meant to say Come and Pass Line bets.
Arent you losing money tho when your bet travels to lets say the 4 or 10 and you are paid 1:1 when if you placed you would be collecting 9:5 on the bet ? Yes the odds that you take are higher but then come bets are only beneficial when you are taking high odds and lose you money if you dont play odds. By my math which could be absolutley wrong you have to bet at least 4 x odds to break even with a place bet on the 4 and 10 .... Please help me out here im not sure what im missing ? Thanks !
this is on a table minimum of 10 dollars
Correct, you have to play 4-5x in odds to pay more than an equivalent sized place bet. If not adding odds, the benefit is the the come out roll, which has the bet at a huge 2:1 favorite to win for the first roll. because of this, the bet also carries a small 1.4% house edge. The place bet, is always at disadvantage and more likely to lose than win, and thus carries a much larger house edge, and with 4/10 is over 6%
@@ColorUp Ahh yes I see - so the main advantage is really the comeout roll and then you need to play odds if you dont seven out ! Thanks for your timely reply !
@@benmartindale5121 Correct,.I have done many videos on the subject but here is one you may like. th-cam.com/video/-uDPdGwDMDA/w-d-xo.html
You want a 11 now or an 6 or 8
Would it be incorrect for me to say after stage 1 of a come bet, you are betting on the chance of that number rolling again before the seven rolls. Because that's how I originally thought about it
Exactly correct
@@ColorUp first things first, love your videos. You made me fall in love with the game of craps and, it may sound weird, but you indirectly helped my relationship with my mother, so thank you for that.
But, back to my question, if that's the case, shouldn't you consider the odds as the likelyhood to roll that number again before a seven? Or do you (not you personally per say) take each roll as a completely independent event?
(I hope I'm making sense, writing is not a strong suit of mine)
Each roll is independent. So sure, before starting you would say for example I need the 5 to roll twice. But first roll a 7/11 is a winner which is big player advantage. After point is the 5, at that stage, really you only need to roll the number once to win.
Glad things with your mother are improving.
@@ColorUp ah ok. I'm not sure why I thought they should be grouped together than. Thank you!!
Cheers
Thank you thank THANK YOU! For making this video. Come betters are so misunderstood.
Its a great, super low house edge bet. Great way to play the game.
@@ColorUp And another great point is when the roll ends, and they all do, at various times, that the last come gets paid on the seven out makes up the lower payment. Thanks again for putting out this video. Excellent content.
Jim we all know where you COME out on this discussion.
@@demondog6988 You crack me up!
I prefer the lower house edge
Over time that is the better decision
You say that when a come bet wins, it comes down and you have to make another come bet "if you want to get back on it"; but, there is no guarantee that your bet will get back on the same number again. It could travel to any point number.
That is correct, the dice choose which number the come bet moves to
That's why just "buy" the number,you're locked in.
I know I'm a bit late to this discussion but my Casino offers put bet options which allow you to essentially make a combat without going through the come so if you want to be on the 5 or nine, you just say put me on the 9 what's 200 in odds now you can't take it down with the same way you can with the place bit. However it just has to hit once
Once my money is back in my rack I'm playing on house money. My investment is returned to me and I have zero risk on the table. Every hit after that is a plus. I want to get on house money as quickly as possible. What strategy gets my money out the quickest and I am playing on house money? We all know that 7 is coming so the sooner I have my investment the better.
The other down side to the come bet is after a point is hit your bets are still "ON" and subject to that 7 rolling on a come out roll, being they are a contract bet.
The dice don't know that it's a come out roll. The 7 after the come point is established is a loser regardless of if it's on a pass line come out roll. It's not more likely to occur just because it is a come out roll.
@@randy5248 I agree that the dice don't know its a come out roll and that the odds of hitting a point 7 are the same as a 7 on the come out. My point however is that during a hot roll or hot shooter where points are being hit and money is being made 7 are generally thrown on come out rolls. So instead of you being happy and cheating with the rest of the table you loose money with a come bet.
@@iamme170 Are you actually saying that with a straight face?🤨
The dice also don't know that it's a hot roll, which technically only involves past results and has no impact on the next roll. But if you are that confident that it is a "hot roll" just double up on your pass line bet to compensate for losing your contracted come bet. Or throw a buck or two on big red, which I would never actually recommend but hey, it's a hot roll! 🔥 🙄😉
As a come bettor, I think you failed to mention the huge disadvantage of place betting: the point seven out. I’d rather lose just the odds on my pass line bet (since the pass line losing and first come bet winning are a wash) than whatever across that the place bettor loses. But overall, this is a great explanation of why the come bettor doesn’t really have to roll the number twice.
if the PSO occurs after a Come bet has moved to a box number, then that Come bet will also lose along with the Place bets. i will still take a Place bet over a Come bet any day of the week. Come bets are contract bets, you cannot turn them off or take them down. with Come bets you have no control over which box number they are moving to. Come bets only have a 1:1 payout, while Place bets have a greater than 1:1 payout.
@@douglasscovil3447 how often are you taking place bets down entirely? The VAST majority of place bettors do not regress to zero - they only collect and press. The only valid argument for place betting over come betting imo is better rating (which is often summarily dismissed by come bettors, but is absolutely a valid point).
@@douglasscovil3447 Correct!! That is why they leave too much on the table when the seven is rolled. They NEVER take profits and that is what the house wants. PRESS ALL your bets, risk and give us all of your money---DUMB!!!
So you'd rather give up 4% to the house than less than 1% ( by taking odds ) ? That's why casinos love players like you .
@@michaelblankenau6598 You are better off playing for a higher ROI $$$ than a low house edge %. You do not take house edge to the cashiers cash you take chips $$$$. Come bets lose and the first roll of the game PLUS after you win they give you back that bet and you have to start all over. In Vegas they call them YO-YO bettors. Up & Down, Up & Down, they have NO options with their come bets (small bet, press, regress etc) Old saying among the pros: "All This house edge is Crap with a Capital C. ( From the show on you tube: ) The TOP TEN MYTHS IN CRAPS That is MYTH #1. NUMBER ONE. But many, many, players play that way. That is why the casinos love players like them- They have a lower ROI than the place/buy bettors. I think I have over ten books that tell players to play like that.😰 Good Luck at the tables!! Enjoy the show. 🧐☯ P.S. I have only read two books that do NOT tell you to play like that. 📚📓 Those are our favorite books.
Come bet is a pass line bet for the next roll👍
u ppl forget that on average of 8 rolls a 7 will come, meaning those press strat don’t really work in long run, my best strat is after a 7 come, I bet on 4,5,6,8,9,10 for 4 rolls, after that I take down all my bets, then wait until a 7 come & repeat my strat
Dice also seem to trend when I am at the table and numbers can repeat with the same shooter, is a possible advantage to the come bet. The "Dominator" uses the come bet strategy, who is supposed to be one of the best craps players ever. The math should speak for itself though. Nice job as always, thanks.
If you play like the Dominator you'll go broke before you can say "Color coming in." We go over his method and his new book on the show: The TOP TEN MYTHS IN CRAPS on Y.T. with gambling expert John Patrick. Guess what-- Dom is MYTH number one. #1 Enjoy the show. P.S. Info on his "Five count" as well Myth #2.
There's nothing special about " having " to roll the same number twice as a Come bettor since the rolls are always independent . The dice don't remember what was just rolled , so the human should forget it as well .
Have you messed around with WinCraps?
Nope, not available for Mac as I understand, and not a windows guy
@@ColorUp I played a system to bet big on the line if a 7 were rolled twice in a row. The statistical chance of three 7s is very very low.
Chance of three 7’s in a row is 1 in 216.
@@ColorUp better than 1 in 6 😆
@@thesneakyapguy7172 It is better than 1 in 6, but those odds are 3 in a row if no 7's have yet to roll. After 2 sevens have rolled and you make your big bet. The odds of a 7 rolling are 1 in 6. The odds reset after every roll.
Thanks!
Wow, Thank you so much. Really appreciate the support!
Your a 2 to 1 favorite. But you have to roll the same number twice to actually get paid. So if your factor that in your 2 to 1 advantage means nothing.
You are a 2:1 favorite, and after point is set you have same odds as a place bet hitting. So it is something, especially considering the game is resolved 33% of time in the first roll.
POP QUIZ: Do you know WHY the place bettor wins more $$$ than the come/odds bettor betting the SAME amount of money$$ ( to 5X odds)???? What is the answer?? EXAMPLE: The pass/come bettor has a $10 bet with $10 odds on the 5 or 9. He wins $25 ( $10 +$15) at a VERY VERY LOW 0.8% house vig. His ROI is 125% The place bettor has the same $20 on the number and wins $28 ( 7x4) for for a ROI of 140% and a HIGH house edge OF 4%. Bottom line: $28 and 140% ROI is higher than $25 and 125%. ROI. It is more important to play for a higher ROI and not a lower house edge. P.S. The pass/come bettor has to roll the number "twice" to win and the place bettor just won his bet twice VS Once and there is NO house edge % on a losing bet-none! Did you come up with the answer?? Nice clip.
Yes Jeremy, too many players think that the playing for a low edge% is better than playing for a higher ROI. Remember there is no house edge on a losing bet-none and you can't take the house edge to the cashiers cage you take chips $$$. Speak to you soon-- G-Craps.
So you're somehow trying to prove that giving up 4% to the house is better than .8 % ? That makes zero sense . You seem to forget that the Come bettor wins if a 7 is rolled when that bet is made . The place bettor loses his whole bet . Bottom line ... You keep trying to fade - 4% e.v. and I'll fade 0.8 % . Guarantee you'll lose more in the long run .
@@michaelblankenau6598 Ok and the Sun revolves around the Earth. 😨Watch the show: "Casino math ( house edge) VS Real math (ROI) have pen and paper available.
You can skip the Come bet with a Put bet if you really wanted to. Maybe a little too advanced for this video though.
True, but then turns good bet into bad bet with higher house edge than place bets. But if want to pick number and get 20x odds, it makes sense to do put bet
If a player goes "off and on" there is no waiting to reset the bet...think that's important to say.
Good point
DUDE GOT NY 4WIFE TO UNDERSAND,
I always wondered about the Come bet odds & payouts for their numbers.. Thought they were the same as pass line. But why didn't they keep them each the same? It have been easier.
They are the same as pass line. Not sure if your question.
Hey Color Up...where are some videos that cover Don't or "Wrong" strategies?
In general, I'm a wrong bettor and would love some strat videos. And I have a few strategies that I'd love to submit as well!
You'll just have to browse through all my video catalog, there are dark side strategies just not as many for sure. Would love to present some more. You can submit with "dice advice" form on my website www.colorup.club
Good on rules and procedures and math facts. Not good on reasoning.
Thanks for watching and responding
Nope!
Love you brother but that was a lot of word salad
Okay, thanks for checking out
Place bets are superior on choppy tables. You place $58 on the 4, 5, & 6
Other person places $10 come bet.
5 is rolled come travels to the 5.
Cone better places $10 odds
Place better wins $28
Come player places another $10 come bet
7 rolls.
Come pays $10 you've lost nothing.
Place bettor loses $58 - the $28 so down $30.
Just a scenario for those thinking of the pros and cons. Each have their places. I generally do place bets unless I'm trying out a strategy from someone else. 😂
Come bet would be down $10.
Lost $20 on the 5 btwn bet & odds.
Won $10 on the 7. Net -10.
@@TKDIsaac True! I went to school in Pennsylvania so... 🤷🏿♂️😅
The bigger problem is how long until the 7 shows up and how many wins did you get? And did the dice cooperate?
For example the Come/Pass-Line player may Travel to 4 different box numbers … say the 4, 10 ,9, & 6 … if the 7 comes out after that. The come better really loses when the place better can win.
In this example $10 flat with $10 odds is a loss of -$80 … maybe winning $10 in the come … net loss -$70
The Place better would win 4 = $36, 10 = $36, 9 = $28, 6 = $23.34 (improper bet) Total ⨊ $123.34. The investment would be $120.00.
Therefor about a brake even with only a +$3.34 profit.
Say the roll out would be the 4, 9, 6, then the Big Red 7. The Come better would lose -$50 (instead of the -$70), and the Place better would lose -$32.66 (instead of a win +$3.34)
PSO or +1 roll - The Come better would do better for sure.
P.S. _This is just data - not a strategy_
…… --->>> But yeah choppy tables suck for sure.
The hidden test is @ PSO, whereby the place better-even if he only picks one place bet, say of $15-loses all. Come bet flat wins $5 (+$5); Place bet loses $15 (-$15-$96).
Not all correct info!!!
Please do share
1st!!!!!!
Thank you!!
The fact that you win on a 7 or 11, on a come bet, makes it sensible now. Because I didn't understand why I didn't just place a bet on the numbers up top
Thank you for /r/e/v/i/s/i/n/g/ revisiting this topic, for a more comprehensive analysis on a per bet ba$is, and per bet features. Nice going.