My 20 Year Battle Against My White Whale Game
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 พ.ค. 2024
- There is one SNES game that I've been trying to beat since I was a kid. This is the story of how I finally beat it!
Jake's Stream - / kensei_xero
Side Projects and Socials - allmylinks.com/sethhaskell
Footage Credits
Pixel Art Boxing by Alexandre Muttoni - www.behance.net/gallery/10082...
A guide for Secret of Mana, used to get examples of directions when riding Flammie - gamefaqs.gamespot.com/iphone/...
Secret of Mana PS4 Footage by 8 Bitty LP Committee - • Secret of Mana Longpla...
0:00 - The Game
1:28 - The Boss
2:15 - The White Whale
4:44 - The Plan
5:40 - The Playthrough
8:57 - The Reward - เกม
So nostalgic. I used to play this all the time with my little sister in the 90s and we’d voice all of the characters. Such cool memories.
Man, this made me want replay this game. I think I have it on Switch. One of the best games I've ever played
I rented it from my local Blockbuster back in the day and just had to own it. From the moment the opening theme music started playing; I knew I'd found a great game.
I remember getting this just before Thanksgiving 1993. I played it a little through to December, because school and life kept me busy. But the night of Christmas Eve, my dad and I sat down to play it together, and next thing I know it's December 26th, and we've almost beaten the game.
30 years later, I just beat the game again on the HD Remake, with my wife. Unfortunately, my dad passed in 2017, so I wasn't able to relive the experience with him one more time.
SOM has one of the greatest holds on me. Since its release I've always considered its soundtrack one of the most nostalgic things I've heard. You did a great job in telling this journey and I'm glad to see this ended with such a positive experience. As gaming fans we all have white whale games and not all of them will be defeated and put behind us but you can definitely say Secret of Mana has achieved that. Congrats on doing so and great job here. Thanks Seth!
there is just SOMEthing about that OST.. i mean ive been obsessed with so many other video game soundtracks but yeah SoM is something else. all the tones/instrumentation in Evermore do that to me too
that initial field music is like my #1 nostalgic video games music of ANYTHING.
The alternate solution to the problem before learning about the map button was "landmarks." You look at the Mode 7 map and try to figure out what goes where based on how it looks and where it is on the map, possibly trying to cross-reference it with your own memories of using Cannon Travel and how the map looked when traveling that way if you've ever used it (which hopefully a player would have done it at least once since early game Jema offers one free Cannon Travel to the Water Palace); vast empty yellow space is the desert/Kakkara Town/Fire Palace, giant white island is Ice Country/Ice Palace, etc. Then you trial-and-error the thing and take notes either mentally or written.
Gold Town was always my favorite place to stumble upon because we rented the game from Blockbuster when we were kids and one time the save file that was there was already about to go into the Gold Palace to do those fights to get Lumina and I had absolutely no idea what was going on, along with the town music being so peaceful as a counterpoint. XD
Having played Final Fantasy (1, "2", and "3") prior to Secret of Mana back in the day (also: Link to the Past) I was already familiar with the idea of a large map loosely representing the relative locations of towns and landmarks, so navigating the world on Flammie wasn't a problem for me.
this game broke so many barriers. co-op live action, Randi bobbing and weaving backflipping away from damage, the field music. OMFG. Don't get me started...
I remember as a kid I got up to the mana beast last boss and I couldn’t beat him. I tried the remake on ps4 a few years ago and couldn’t get into it. I’ll have to pick up the collection on switch and play it again. I loved this game growing up. Magic was op
Back in the day I couldn't figure out how to cast Mana Magic properly, but noticed that charged attacks (plus critical hits) could pierce Flammie's defense and deal damage anyway, so I just brute-forced it from there.
It's fitting that the mana beast is basically a giant Flammie.
Perhaps through rose-tinted glasses, but I've always called SoM my favorite game. I'm happy to hear someone has finally reached journey's end.
I remember having a distinct impression that the Mana Beast wasn't just "a" giant Flammie but specifically YOUR Flammie. Which really cast a different tone over the final battle overall....
@@StratelierI really wish they clarified that. I never got that impression, and I'd be heartbroken to learn if that was true.
@@AkaiAzul I think it was specifically the main character's hesitation to defeat the Mana Beast that gave me that impression ... and it never left.
....You can look at the world below you ought to recognize landmarks you've walked through.
Finally just beat this one after 30 years just this week lol. Only got about halfway through when i first played it in 1993. Ah, pre internet lol.
The game shipped in a big box with a 100 page guide, including a walkthrough, maps for all locations, and enemies&items lists. I used it when I got lost. With just a few difficulty spikes at some bosses this game was the very first RPG I beat. For some time I replayed it almost every year and at one point I even hunted down all the rare item drops.
I vividly remember the first time I saw the game box at my local toy store. The incredible art work on the cover alone was enough to convince me that I had to get the game, but unfortunately the game sold out quickly where I lived and it took like two years before I finally got my hands on it.
The music, graphics and gameplay were all so good, but man could it be confusing to figure out where to go. The most jarring example for me was when you were supposed to go to one of the cannon brothers to be blown away to "Upper Land" or something like that. I can't remember if there was a single hint anywhere that pointed you in that direction.
Also, how were you supposed to know how to enter the Mana Fortress? I looked around for hours before stumbling across the answer: you just fly towards it. A real facepalm moment.
Secret of Mana are the source of many of my favourite gaming memories from back in the day, and I still listen to the OST regularly.
8:15 ' [...] like playing dlc that came out years later after the initial game's release."
Oh man, I know that feel! That happened to me with Bomberman 64. I was a single gold card off on the last boss from (what I thought was) 100%'ing the game. Couldn't do it. Years later, found the game again, pulled out my old save and as I beat the last boss, and saw a cutscene I never saw before. Turns out, I somehow got that last gold card during the battle, and then a whole new area opened up afterwards! It was too hard, so I gave up lmao
I'm glad you managed to finish Secret of Mana, Seth!
That's an amazing game that should be under the belt of anyone who loves rpgs!
Congrats on beating your white whale! I loved Secret of Mana, but loved the sequel even more. Back when it released, I was so adamant about it, that I even imported a Japanese copy. Got quite far, but couldn't beat it. Not until years later in the early 2000s, when I played it with the translation patch. Seiken Densetsu 3 ( Trials of Mana) is my favorite in the series.
Nice editing, great video. One of my favorite snes games of all time. Can’t wait to see the next snes rpg play through vid.
Very surprising that it was so difficult for you. I found this game so dang easy. Glad for ya tho! I love this game a lot. The vibe is just perfect
I found it difficult because my party members cannot stay alive. Haven't gotten too far, though; about where you start upgrading weapons.
Secret of Mana was my first big RPG on SNES. I basically begged for the game on any given occasion until my Sister finally bought it for my birthday. Since Nintendo in the 90s believed that Europeans were not ready (i.e. to dumb) for JRPGs they sold these Games in large 13“-boxes and added a complete walkthrough book as a bonus. Maybe this would have saved you from your initial experience as well? Going home with this big box in my arms was everything for me. Played through the entire game with my best friend. Oh the memories!
Secret of Mana is one of the greatest 16-Bit games ever.
Congratulations on beating it.
Time to try Secret of Evermore or Trials of Mana. Maybe Chono Trigger? All great games.
Man SoM was such a great game. Thank you for sharing this story. My white whale game was Final Fantasy 1. I played from beginning to last boss without winning twice but the third playthrough was the charm.
Here in Germany these RPG games came with a complete walktrough book with pictures, maps and everything. Even as a kid as long as you could read it was impossible to get lost thanks to this.
The game was 30 bucks more expensive then regular but you got a giant box with a beautifull artwork and a realy helpful book.
Congratulationa to overcoming the challenge! I too played it alongside my brother as a kid, but for me it was one of the first longer RPG games I actually finished, though I recall having a map come with the game. Reading that made navigation pretty easy, but now I'm wondering if it'd have been harder if I didn't know how to navigate the Mode 7 map.
Either way- as a Mana fan I hope we might see even more Mana content from you in the future :) And did you play the Trials version that was on the collection, or the modern remake?
The only SNES RPG I still have never finished is secret of mana. It's way too hard
The trick is to grind out weapon and magic levels. They can make a world of difference.
FLAMMIE!
I also love Legend of Mana (though it did get me also hopelessly lost here and there). But Legend of Mana and ff9 pretty much inspired much of my childhood imaginings.
About feeling so weird and happy about seeing new parts of a game you're so familiar with since a child, reminded me of when I finally went to finish Sonic 2 as an adult and just sped through (though as a kid I tried to get as many rings as I could). And I finally was able to see parts I never saw, and beat it.
Couch co-op is the absolute best way to play Secret of Mana. The concept of playing DLC of an old game you're familiar with is much like how I experienced some of the more hidden things in Final Fantasy 6 going back years later, also with couch co-op with my brother.
The game races to the end because it's tragically rushed and borderline incomplete. That what's there is so good is a real achievement of the developers.
Congratulations! And as a fellow father, high-five for going through things with your kids!
Reminds me of how I remember playing a super old point and click when I was 6, and then finally found and beat it 23 years later. It's quite gratifying to finally put it to rest after all those years, no?
Also if anyone is wondering what that game is, it's called Ween
I fucking love this game - how you hadn't player it all the way through to the end is beyond me. I've even gotten all spells to 8:99 and weapons all to NINE for all characters
I love this game and have played it many times over the years. I don't really recall having trouble navigating it, but I have definitely had games that I felt just didn't give me good enough directions to continue. I get the frustration.
I remember, back in the day, not figuring out how to cast Dryad's Mana Magic during the final battle but still winning anyway because charged attacks + critical hits = massive damage.
I also remember the first time seeing the secret spell animations that occur above Lv.8 and immediately wanting to level up EVERY elemental (& almost succeeding at it) just to see the results .
Hell yeah! Way to go!
good stuff!
My white whale was Dragon Warrior 7 for PS1. Tried it as a kid, but it was too hard and I never finished.
I finally went back to it decades later, only to find that I really, _REALLY_ didn't like it. I literally said to myself "my younger self dodged a bullet by not playing a minute more of this awful game. Why am I torturing myself?"
So, I quit. I left the game unfinished. This time by choice.
Good job! I remember me and my sisters getting stuck for hours trying to locate the Magic Rope and also encountered a glitch where the girl or the sprite got turned to stone and disappeared permanently from the game.
Just so you know, the SNES version got dialogue cut from the English release since English takes up more space in memory than Japanese. The Steam version restored the missing dialogue.
I need to actually fully finish it. Not spend an hour or two saying hey that's fun....and never pick it up for years.
Secret of Mana, 聖剣伝説2、is my favorite video game in the whole world. It still haunts me to its day -- it's 雰囲気 (atmosphere) is so incredibly powerful. I use the Japanese version as training for learning Japanese. (聖剣伝説3 was a bit beyond me, last I tried it.) Also 天地創造。 I hope that in the afterlife, I get to see the 滝, get to visit the ice forest, and the forest between Potos village and the Water Palace. I've seen all of it, so many times in my heart. It's like a fundamental part of my character.
Haha. As someone who only recently played Final Fantasy 4 and pretty much lost all motivation once I got the Airship and had no idea where to go I think I can relate.
This, FF3/6, Mario RPG and of course the GOAT Chrono Trigger. Good times! Grats on beating Som!
Cool video. This really shows the difference between players of that generation and now. I remember this JRPG as being very easy compared to say Final Fantasy VI or Chrono Trigger. But then I thought about it, there was an instruction manual that came with the game back then. It basically tells you all the stuff about the maps, compass, and navigation that you were missing. Most games nowadays come with a tutorial and spell things out for you. Back then, you were expected to read the instruction booklet. Funny stuff. Anyway, glad you made it through.
I absolutely loved this game back when it first came out. This was before the age of the internet mind you. All we had were some guides that could be found in magazines and the first of its kind, the dinosaur micro transaction of the 1-900 numbers you had to call if you wanted to know how to progress in a game. Which was used a couple times on this game to figure it out at the time to beat the game with my friend who would come during the winter months that we played this game and beat it. We had the fold out maps and the trusty -1900 number that was like 4$ a call. I would have to ask my dad at the time, as some of my friends over used that number on our video games. Mind you we were in middle school. About 6th grade is when SoM came out for me. Thinking back on that, it opens up a whole other can of worms about them preying on kids like us to call a number that was a small fee to know how to do things in the game. Nintendo was known for putting things in their games a person would never just figure out on their own. Then you realize it is a system build on other systems that are still in play today. Just given new coat of paint. Ya feel me?
Weird, as a kid, I enjoyed flying above the continents and going "oh hey look, that's where I started the game! And that's Gaia's Navel!" and then I'd fly over that HUGE forest and go "Oh, that must be the four seasons forest!" and then I'd see that tiny little building on a hill and go "That's matango!"
There can be that moment in a JRPG for a person where they struggle against a part that was not meant to be difficult. It reminds me how I got stuck on Final Fantasy eight for way too long because I didn’t understand that you could only get into the plant in the Selphie part by driving the vehicle inside and not walking. 😂 It's great that you were able to overcome your white whale finally, though!
I didn't get lost playing SOM when it was new, because I was lucky enough to have had a complete in box copy with the map included. Regardless, congratulations on finishing it finally!
I played the hell out of the game as a middle schooler, and when I caught bronchitis while playing it, I had a recurring fever dream wherein I'd managed to save my game right as my party died, so whenever I reloaded all I could do was watch my characters die over and over again. It was very upsetting!
It's interesting the overworld map was your barrier. When most people report the AI supporters or general combat difficulty is the thing that makes them quit. In any event, I had a similar experience with this game. Saw it at my cousins house, then didn't get to play it for over a decade. When I did, I really loved it. But then got stuck in the maze part and quit in frustration. Came back and finished it with the Collection of Mana on Switch. I absolutely love the final area and the mix of fantasy/scifi, just like Final Fantasy V and Chrono Trigger.
For me, the worst part of the game is simply having to level up elementals. That burned me out replaying it somewhat recently.
this happened with me and FF VII across 5 years lol
Mine was the very first ZELDA. I finally beat it a few months ago... Now i'm in ZELDA II hell.. give me another 40 years..
Oh yes, the original Legend of Zelda (both first and second quests). "Zelda 2 hell" is very accurate -- back in the day, our copy was used (i.e. no manual) so we had to figure everything out manually. I remember getting stuck because we couldn't locate the hidden village (and in turn, the 6th palace). Still tried to reach the final palace, even reached it (without the ability to see blue ghosts) but the forcefield wouldn't let you in.
Final Fantasy Adventure = Seiken Densetsu, of which Sword of Mana was a remake of.
Secret of Mana = Seiken Densetsu 2
Trials of Mana (also known as secret of mana 2) = Seiken Densetsu 3
Legend of Mana = Seiken Densetsu 4
That said sword of mana was such a departure from what FFA was that they are basically not the same game.
2:06, 2:49 & 3:47- LOL
I first knew about the Franchise since the late 90's. Secret Of Mana is also the first game I knew was made by Square Soft before I knew about the Final Fantasy Franchise.
I actually like Seiken Densetsu 3/Trials Of Mana. It was a big step-up after Seiken Densetsu 2/Secret Of Mana.
i have yet to beat this game myself but i have a similar story
i remember playing castlevania sotn as a kid and never paying attention to putting on the glasses that maria gives you
so i would just beat shaft and think nothing of it
about a year later i discover i was awe struck when i finally used them and revealed the upside down castle lmao
like you said: almost like dlc
20 years.
I found the gem missle stunlock 3 days after I got the game about 6mo after it came out new.
People praise the SNES for it's graphical capabilities in this game but it was only able to show one sprite on the screen.
Sometime you should try the Remake that is sold on Steam, while some people have issues with it, they did some really nice things with it. 8-directional attacking, allies who actually know how to fight (they are actually quite vicious), being able to hotkey two spells/weapons/items so you don't have to bring up the menus constantly, etc.
I really like your thumbnails
A good ARPG is all about the grind!
HUGE BOSS BATTLES. ELDEN RING WAAAYYYYY BEFORE ELDEN RING even down to the co-op lol
Just imagine not being able to finish a game for 20 years because you failed to realize there is an ingame worldmap. Holy cow, dude. Anyway, congrats on finally finishing 😂
It's a shame you didn't buy the game retail complete, because the original release on SNES came with a Poster that had the world map and major locations marked on the backside.
Yeah, kinda rude of the game to not tell you about how to access the world map until after your first flight. Grats on beating the game!
Didja know that, when you get magic leveled to level 8, there is a chance that it will display a different animation and be more powerful than normal? The chance is equal to how far above level 8 your spell level is, with 8.00 having a 0% chance of triggering, and 8.99 having a 99% chance of triggering.
Also, the final weapon seeds for seven of the weapons are dropped by regular enemies in the Mana Fortress, with each different specific enemy dropping precisely one seed at low odds. One of your weapons is below the others at this point, so there are two weapon seeds for it. The only weapon for which this is not true is the sword, as the only way to reawaken the Sword of Mana is with Mana Magic.
Righteous
I'm usually really good with navigation but there's one game that wreaked me the same way Secret of Mana did for you, Terranigma.
I managed to finish it but not without a guide!
Look, I got stuck on that island with those disembodied chicken legs constantly smashing against my face so I won’t judge. SoM remains unbeaten for me. Which is a shame too because I really wanted to fight Thanatos and take down the mana beast.
Congrats on your success!
Hmm... lol. I beat it back in the day... no guide. How old where you? I remember games I could not beat when I was a kid or teenager, which I later beat easily lol.
How did I beat SoM as a kid without a walkthrough and no internet??? Time on my hands? Congrats bro 😎
THE COVER!!!!
Good lord you have really good editing, nice topic, a room with a lot of cool collectibles in the background, and a pretty good voice. How is this such a small channel?? I don't know if this used to be a big channel and it just got small for whatever reason or if I actually just stumbled on this, but I hope you get more views that it seems you're deserving of, nice video man!
Secret of Mana, Final Fantasy 6, & Chrono Trigger. The best period of gaming I've ever experienced. The only games recently that gave me those some vibes are the Legend of Zelda: BOTW and TOTK. I always wondered why Square could not give us a modern game that had the same quality as these two games, embracing the iconic look of their 90s games. FF12 was the last time I played and enjoy anything Square Enix put out, but I really felt like they had lost some core part of their magic after FF7. I loved FF8, but I can understand why it isn't in any top lists generally and was a bit decisive. I also have a penchant for quiet and brooding protagonists that are thrust into responsibility they don't want, as opposed to the overwhelming number of bombastic-determined-burning spirit protagonists that litter the JRPG space, so that game had that going for it as well.
Man, ive bested this masterpiece so many times, im considering attempting a solo sprite, no magic run (inspired by SOM master DonYagamoth)
Yeah, SoM did not age so well in regards noob friendliness, as didn't many golden age square games except for Chrono Trigger (played through recently for the first time). And barely anything is so much to blame as is the given direction ingame.
The overworld looks VERY samy, if not played for extended periods with about 4 hours per session a day or a very good memory and the names just blur heavily.
It is not the dreaded ring menu (which I love to this day and miss dearly), the exploitative magic system or the suggested grinding. It is the lack of good direction in combination with barely distinguishable landmarks visible from the sky.
Chrono Trigger, Secret of Evermore, FF6, Terranigma (Quintet) all did not have these problems. I recently replayed SoM for the first time again since about 20 years ago and I had to look up a guide despite having beaten it several times. It simply is the game and that would have been a point in dire need of improvement i the remake and even in a remaster if there ever will be one.
But it is pretty much the first non-FF adventure game that opened up and it spoke to an entire new audience of action RPG enthusiasts which translated into rose tinted nostalgie goggles with a bit too much praise... or more not enough negative criticism which got rectified later in Square's future releases.
I love it still and I am dead certain that the gaming industry would look slightly different if SoM had a better development history. Either Squaresoft would have choked and died on it or it would have been the grandest game on the SNES with absorbing much of later tremendous renowned titles. SoM is one of the biggest RPG-what-ifs I know of that could have changed a whole platform and still did. It might be one of the most important titles together with Final Fantasy for Squaresoft, which makes it even more bizarre to me why it is handled with so much neglegence by them. Then I remember Squeenix and the wonder disappates into smoke and darkness.
I beat it when it came out, I was 13 at the time.. As a 17 yo stomped it and my snes in rage.
i literally drove a super mario world 2 cart like a nail through the bottom of my snes.
i regret that very much.
but i have snes controllers hooked to my PC
so not all was lost.
i will never play baby mario games again however.
Its my favorite game if all time. I lovecthis fucking game
Bruh, how does it take you 20 years to beat Secret of Mana? Just level up your dudes and your magic and steamroll through the game.
I still haven’t beaten it. Beat Final Fantasy Adventure. Beat Trials. But not this. 2024 goals!
The gameplay is pretty rough and there are some early difficulty spikes and glitches that will turn many away. The game feels like a chore at times. Still worth playing if you are a RPGamer
Fun as they may be but oldschool jrpg often have the mechanic that forces grinding which will turn away many.
@@saaken1 I chalk it up to the development methodology of the time. 🙂
@darksuns Ah, yes. Someone wasn't listening when he said it was a matter of him getting lost that would impede his progress, not the difficulty.
Your problem was navigation? That's quite odd.
grind, level up, explore, spam magic. not a difficult game..
I remember beating this game as a kid with no issues multiple times without a guide or any help. Recently I went through the game and ran into the same issues you were having.
this reminds me I need to get trials of mana and the 3d remake. I played the fan patch for the ROM and I loved it.
Oh and Legend. That one was really weird but I absolutely love the art style. I still jokingly call apricots apricats. Nobody gets the reference.
same here
noice
i literally came here to learn how in the world does one get stuck on such an easy game.
...... wut? More money than gamer I will never get my head around. Like that blue hair dude that used to stream d2 that had no idea about basic mechanics or equipment statistics but somehow had impossible gear loaded with 14 years of play rune set ups. What even is gaming now? You have this, and then speed runners, and an empty light year void inbetween. Could you imagine him getting through smt2, any might and magic, ultima, or wizardry game?
Same. It's just super long.
maannnnnnn listen...
I read "white male." We live in a time
Im playing this with my son thomas he is know a fan if i can pry him off cod that is .
I beat this before there's was any walk-throughs. It took 3 yrs no learn to navigate stupid flamie
How is it possible to fail to figure out a basic flight map?
Curse this generation who need Bethesda easy mode arrows and checkpoints.
Secret of evermore was way harder.
FYI if you have the Multi Tap. You can play all 3 Characters.
Game isn’t hard, just level up
Mine was secret of evermore. But in my defense it sucked
the thing is you bought the CART, not the GAME. the manual and the paper map are part an integral part of the game... some 8 bit are unplayable without the manual...
I am sad to admit I played all of these games on an emulator back in the late 90s. I was born late for the snes era, so I missed on all of the manuals 😢
I do remember reading some NES and SNES games included world maps that made the game much easier 😂 I think the original Final Fantasy game was one. I had fun discovering towns and stuff on my own, but I had a ton of free time back then.
"Legend of Mana best in the series"...LMAO! OH BOY!!! I think you meant WORST! That game is garbage.
Wow took you long enough for that easy rpg
...overrated, broken game.
I wouldn't say broken, but kind of overrated, yeah. I liked it, but it's menus, and the delay between action and damage calculations are kinda bad even for its year of release
Som is great game