Smash Bros Ultimate Down-B Tier List
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- Down-B is an interesting move, let's see how I ranked them
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Also fun fact: if you break pits down b, HE gets frame advantage over YOU. That makes it even more broken.
Yep. Love baiting people to into that trap. It's always a guaranteed combo and sometimes even a front smash lol
The Pits also get invencibility when orbitars get broken, so it beats stuff like Wonder Wing.
I see what you did there.
Yes! I’m a Pit/Dark Pit main, and it’s always hilarious seeing people react to getting punished for breaking the orbitars when they think they have a read. So awesome to see somebody else who knows this weird trick
As a Pitoo main,I love using Side-B right after they break our shield,it's so funny seeing them dying for trying to get a read on us lmao
Hero's Down B is also strong for another reason: *Distracting the opponent by forcing them to read*
Jokes on u, I can't read
@@nico2electric374 actually brilliant
Fr, though, I feel like Pit's down b doesn't get talked about enough, especially relative to the rest of his character. Very unique and difficult to deal with.
Ik I'm being that guy buut I believe ryu's focus is better bc it has more range and you can combo off of the first level/phase(idk what it's called). I don't think the combo aspect is that big a deal since I feel like it'd be rare to land but does reach farther. There is a way for ken to use it as a combo though with doing the reverse aerial hit.
i don’t think ryu can combo off of level 1 focus, i think level 2 is the first level that can be comboed off of
@@ajlecs7932 you can combo with focus attack lvl 1 if you do descending dragon.
Landing on the ground cancels all your fadc endlag and it gives you even more combos than if you did a grounded focus attack because of the reduced endlag.
You can do descending dragon lvl1 -> every aerial and special.
Ryu’s fa has a better combo angle and it doesn’t launch them as far as ken’s fa.
Idk about y'all but I don't see good players using focus attack offensively. At least not by releasing it for the strike. They'll use the armor to get a frame advantage or whiff punish but I don't see much more than that usually
Bowser main here - You didn’t mention Bowser’s down b snaps to ledge, which makes it useful as both a get out of disadvantage tool when being edgeguarded (although technically you can hit him out of it with perfect timing), as well as a ledge trapping mix-up on a character that already has way too many good ledge options. (edit: the spike at startup and huge hitbox is what gives this move its ledge utility over yoshi’s, though yoshi’s is still better overall) Its his best jab lock punish at low percents unless there’s a platform in your way. I also use it quite a bit as a platform tech chase, though that’s a bit niche. It’s definitely one of his worst moves, probably third worst after down tilt and dash attack, but it’s not quite as bad as you placed it imo.
Agreed, Yoshi Main here, Also he didn’t say that Yoshi’s snaps to ledge either. Btw, Kirby’s for sure worse, it’s slow as heck and does horrible shield damage, so you can just shield it for free, unlike these. Also is it just me, or does Down B have a lot of bombs:
Link, Samus, Dark Samus, Yoshi, Peach, Daisy, Bowser, Young Link, Toon Link, etc.
All these tier lists make wonder what it would be like to have an Ultimate randomizer that shuffles every move among each character.
In Dota there's a mode called "ability draft" which is basically the Moba version of that. It's way fun, people can build super broken characters with moves that were never meant to be together.
And that's with 4 abilities, smash characters have what, 20 ish moves each? Wild.
I feel like certain moves like Min Min punch and transforming moves would break the game lol
@@cartoonkenj2209 True, I can't imagine this functioning a whole match. I'm not a doctor, but that doesn't seem possible.
I would love for that to be the next Smash game’s mechanic.
-Select a character
-Choose which special move to swap with another characters Special moves
This sounds like so much fun imagine not having to mod your switch to give Ganon monado arts.
Mario: 4:52
Donkey Kong: 29:32
Link: 19:29
Samus/Dark Samus: 36:31
Yoshi: 22:22
Kirby: 21:37
Fox: 16:11
Pikachu: 40:07
Luigi: 35:51
Ness: 41:20
Captain Falcon: 6:00
Jigglypuff: 10:19
Peach/Daisy: 25:29
Bowser: 14:00
Ice Climbers: 9:52
Sheik: 39:15
Zelda: 28:14
Dr Mario: 33:26
Pichu: 40:29
Falco: 2:00
Marth/Lucina: 11:11
Young Link: 18:58
Ganondorf: 6:19
Mewtwo: 28:56
Roy/Chrom: 11:17
Mr Game & Watch: 32:22
Meta Knight: 1:25
Pit/Dark Pit: 27:32
Zero Suit Samus: 44:53
Wario: 39:36
Snake: 20:39
Ike: 1:12
Pokémon Trainer: 0:42
Diddy Kong: 26:02
Lucas: 7:53
Sonic: 23:11
King Dedede: 6:49
Olimar: 1:01
Lucario: 3:34
R.O.B: 26:02
Toon Link: 18:58
Wolf: 31:23
Villager: 17:53
Mega Man: 16:41
Wii Fit Trainer: 23:39
Rosalina & Luma:
Little Mac:
Greninja:
Palutena:
PAC-MAN:
Robin:
Shulk:
Bowser Jr:
Duck Hunt:
Ryu/Ken:
Cloud:
Bayonetta:
Inkling:
Ridley:
Simon/Richter:
King K. Rool:
Isabelle:
Incineroar:
Piranha Plant:
Joker:
Hero:
Banjo & Kazooie:
Terry:
Byleth:
Min-Min:
Steve:
Sephiroth:
Pyra/Mythra:
Kazuya:
Sora:
I was waiting for Marss to come in like "WRONG, ZSS SUCKS!" when he put her top spot.
Incineroars whole kit is just like if this was on any other character lmaoo
The problem is his moves are still super fun even though he sucks.
My favorite thing about Sephiroth's counter is that Ness and Lucas's F-Smash can't be countered by it because they reflect it back immediately and dead ass kills sephiroth at like 30. Most satisfying thing I've ever done in my life.
The problem with that matchup is that they straight up can’t recover against him. It’s either the easiest counter ever or they air dodge to ledge and get dunked with the easiest 2 frame spike in the game
@@coltermasson8124 they also just get walled out by him and he has more speed than both pk-kids.
42:32 Hello, annoying mii gunner main here! Mii gunner's vortex actually has a bigger hitbox than ness's! It's big enough in fact that it's a consistent 2 frame option. Its momentum also carries gunner vertically, as opposed to how ness's carries him horizontally. Other than that, it's functionally worse than ness's in every other way. Thank you
i honestly think wii fit has the best down b in the game. the stat bonus is absolutely insane. i don’t like when people compare it to limit because it’s so much better in every conceivable way, it’s more like a diet version of every monado art at the same time. you HAVE to respect it and try to smother wii fit because otherwise she turns into a monster, she becomes significantly faster in every single metric, all her moves do significantly more damage and knockback, her moves get safer because of the damage multiplier, she gets new combos from increased fall speed, she has better survivability from the dmg taken reduction+gravity increase+healing, all if you let her breathe (pun intended) for just a split-second. and of course if she ever puts you in disadvantage she gets it for free.
she goes from average speed to one of the fastest. she goes from average strength to having a (frame 5) back air that kills at the same percent as CHARIZARD’S (sweetspot) and simple bread and butter combos that deal 80% or even more. it’s such a game changer that you absolutely need to respect it, and it makes her work as a character. just imagine this move on a top tier. it makes me sick thinking about it.
Yeah but it deteriorates. Every time you use it is (success or failure) the effects are weaker the next time
@@willycheez7218 not true. it does have a cooldown and it’s weaker if you don’t wait long enough. you can’t have it up 100% of the time. apart from that, the first deep breathing of every stock is *slightly* stronger than subsequent ones but it doesn’t go down any more than this, resets every stock, and the difference isn’t really significant
Imagine GnW juggling you with deep breathing up air.
@@yobber2991 the fox vortex...
If you were to try giving Pyra's down-B to another character, you'd basically be giving them _all of Mythra._ And then assuming Mythra wasn't changed, you'd then just end up playing Pyra because of Mythra's down-B. It would be really chaotic if you could actually shuffle the characters' moves like this, but giving them their own tier is probably a good move.
I think you can separate the swap itself from the character they swap into. Like if you added Pyra and Mythra's swap to DK, it could be for a different form of DK and not Pyra. Still, the swap itself has it's own properties that make them better or worse. Like Pyra and Mythra's swap gets invincibility a bit slower than PT's, but you can spam it endlessly and you always will get the other swap target. PT's has a long cooldown before it can be used again and you have to cycle between 2 other forms, resulting in you often having to swap to a form you don't need right now and waiting to cycle again to get the right one or worse having to cycle twice to get back to the original if you were using it as a defensive option.
@@TheEmperorGulcasa Or just work as an alternate air dodge. That could work. (shift but, to the same character you already were, with the invuln frames tho.)
@@TheEmperorGulcasa DK and Funky Kong
Falco shine is amazing, it makes him one of the best anti zoners in the game. Frame one projectile single handily makes him win so many matchups. Its literally the best reflector in the game
but like
g&w
I put it on par with Zelda's, Bounce, and G&W's for the best reflectors. That shit is stupid.
Frame 1-33 + travel distance. It nullifies projectiles as soon as the button is pressed. It has a total animation of 44 frames as well. A busted reflector.
I agree game and watch is good but falcon is so good he can reflect and the opponent has no choice but to eat the projectile because he can reflect so close to the enemy
I think ESAM needs to watch a bit of Tilde. He's sleeping on Falco's Shine.
He put mewtwo in mid tier what you expect. Disable is DLC
he's getting a bit lazy with these
The time of hero has awakened
All Dragon Quest Fans rise up.
Love the Dragonair plush. For those who don't know, Dragonair is Esam's favorite pokemon
i'll never forget the time I died cross-stage at 45% on ganondorf because the joker i was facing countered my f-smash...that I inputted from beneath the platform he was on.
the thing about isabelles down b that makes it so much better than u give it credit is that u can very easily place it after hitting someone and then approach and if they win neutral they just can’t safely combo u on that area of the stage anymore
I love this kind of tierlist. Great work Esam!
What? The mii gunner magnet is very different. Not only does it have a bigger hitbox, but it has less lag and is safer on sheild. It doesn't combo, but it air stalls and actually increases upward momentum instead of stopping it like ness's. Plus, it's just a big fast hitbox that has good 50/50s and makes gunner have great movement.
Tier list Tuesday is the best day of the week. Especially when it drops on a Monday.
I haven't seen this many counters since I worked at Home Depot
In 1953, Swanson had 260 tons of frozen turkey leftover after Thanksgiving, so they packaged them into trays with peas and potatoes, and the TV Dinner was born.
I don’t think Bowser Jr.’s mechakoopa should be so low. It is slow but if you hit someone with it there are a lot of strong punishes you can get combos off it because of the initial hit. For example at low percent you can get an up air chain and deal a lot of damage. While they are at a high percent the hit opens you up to land a fair or bair and then the explosion launches them further.
All I have to say is that the mecha-koopa ranking is a bit cringe here. When will you ever use this when the opponent is right in front of you? It's a walking projectile, not a melee attack! Do you use Zelda's Phantom in the opponent's face? No. Do you place one of Duck Hunt's hunters in the opponent's face? No. Do you place any projectile that requires setup in the opponent's face? No, no, and no.
I just feel like this deserved 4 or 5 tiers. There are so many and all the ones in the top tier are not made the same
I think there are some notable other things between Pyra/Mythra and Pokemon Trainer transforms. Pyra & Mythra's does start invincibility slower, but finishes faster, has applications in recovery, doesn't have a cooldown and always let you get the right form. Pokemon trainer's transform has a long cooldown and forces you potentially into a swap you didn't want, forcing you to fight it out as the wrong pokemon or slowly cycle again to get the right one. So I do think that even though Pyra and Mythra's swap is slower to become invincible, it's got a lot of other positives that make it a better swap move overall.
Imagine giving Mythra Deep Breathing instead of Pyra and then trade in lightning buster for Monado then stack them!!
I believe Sephiroth’s counter does to Mario’s cape because the attack animation is treated as projectile
I feel very sad about the gyro talk being edited out, as well as part of the banana explanation also being cut out. As a R.O.B. main, I know very well how busted gyro is, but I really wanted to hear your explanation for why YOU think it's that busted
Fun fact about Arsene counter: if Joker tries to use it against Mega Man uptilt at point blank, the counter whiffs for some reason.
I suggest a character tier list based on the only stage being FD, and other 3D FD forms. How well they perform and can play with the stage as they see fit goes into account.
4:00 you can actually chose whether lucario comes in from the left or right when using his counter so it’s actually pretty decent offstage. The quickplay lucarios definitely need to be taking notes lol
Piranha Plant’s down b is actually a good get off me tool & pseudo counter when uncharged. It does decent shield damage and has a pretty good hitbox too! The big charged version is definitely a meme though
Samus Down B is stupid good. Mixing up recovery? Bomb. Safely retreating? Bomb. Ledge Trapping/Edge Guarding? Bomb. Projectile Denying? Bomb.
Yeah bombs are kinda busted.
Olimar’s down b gives him super armor on frames 2-7. So although it would still be one of the worst down b in the game just for 6 frames or super armor. But, It is useful for some niche situations outside from ordering Pikmin
It's not that bad, I've seen some players spam it 3 times in an interaction when they're about to die and steal games.
I don’t really know how to deal with piranha plant down b honestly. It still isn’t amazing but I get hit kind of a lot by it
i learned the spacing and started forward-smashing the ones who try being cheeky.
It's pretty damn good for edgeguarding
I don’t know if I misheard him, but Snake does have bthrow sicky as a true combo…
Bthrow sticky is so good
@@imESAM oh OK lol, I thought you said at some point that snake can’t confirm into C4 off of a grab
bayo witch time seems good but when you look at the frame data you realize she’s basically stuck in super glue…
i get her pros but her cons are so huge it feels so bad to use (plus her smash attacks can clank with jabs 💀💀💀)
13:00 it's not good for edgeguarding but its excellent for catching people off guard anywhere above ground. Corrin juggles people so often that you can easily catch someone off guard with it and make them explode off the top at a very low percent
I think Down-B was a way for the Smash developers to better equalize characters, more than other moves. So many are considered top or broken especially on lower tiered characters.
my favourite part of Hero's bounce is that someone like Villager literally cannot do anything (except grab and down/up air) because all his moves will reflect it. i wish it lasted longer than 12 seconds 😢
If you guys like these tier list videos by Esam you should check out mock Rock or mock rock talk where he basically does the same thing. Pretty sure ESAM got the in a vacuum for the moves thing from mock rock
Greninja’s counter stuns the opponent even if you counter their projectile.
Btw oil panic, game and watch down b after bucket is full, is frame 2 which is as fast as rest, so you have a frame 5 out of shield option of jump down b and it kills with little end lag like as a game and watch secondary even I don't know why they made oil panic so good
41:31 that clip is so JUST 😩
I feel like these vids could definitely use more tiers. 3 is just way too unspecific.
ESAM: Ness magnet would only be good on Ness and Yoshi
Lucas: Am I a joke to you?
Shulks counter doesnt go through shields anymore. That was in Smash 4
Someone probably already said it but lucarios couter can be directed if you input the direction you want to go before the kick comes out.
Interestingly, as a Seph main, I was expecting Scintilla to be bottom tier. There are a LOT of times where I have it out and still get hit in the time between the counter and the hurtbox.
The only counter that can just not counter if strong enough
New challenge idea for esam: go 5 minutes without saying "but I play pika"
Pits down b also has insane b-reverse use. The drift is insane its like a better movement tool than Samus down b
Mega Mans Leaf Shield is busted until a lvl 9 Parries EVERY HIT! 😑 Happened to me just this morning.
YOSHI DOWN B FOREVER UNDERRATED
Imagine Incineroar with rest. I'm pretty sure down throw rest and down tilt rest would be true
Having essentially the worst physics in the game certainly would limit these possibilities, but with a slight speed boost, potential would be high, and down tilt would be much more usable
Imagine Incineroar with a down b that replaces his entire identity
@@matthewbartlett3442 Imagine completely missing the point of my reply
@@MrWin-pj4sg imagine receiving a reply from someone who completely missed the point of your comment
@Chunk MD I'm still not sure why no one has brought up the fact that Incineroar with rest would probably have a winning matchup vs every character that doesn't have a projectile.
But he'd lost every matchup with characters that have a decent projectile.
Could you imagine Min Min with revenge
Olimar down-B has super armor frames 2-7 so it does have SOME utility past the Pikmin.
I feel like banana should be top 3-4. Some characters would be damn near unbeatable with banana.
Im pretty sure kirby with deep breathing is like a top 10 character
You're evaluating Bowser Jr's Down B incorrectly. You're not supposed to release it towards your opponent but towards a ledge. It's the worst item for sure, and definitely should have had endlag removed, but it's certainly not YUCK tier. It's one of the only options that help him approach in his whole kit.
He’s talking about these moves in a vacuum
Even in a vacuum, several characters would appreciate the ability to start, extend, and finish combos with this item that can cover lots of ground.
There is this mod that changes the stats and frame data for every character and it fixes junior and makes him actually good, like it makes down b have little enough lag that you could pick it up immediately
Yeah Ike’s counter is super slow, only really viable when edgeguarding/ is a rare mixup.
How can you possibly think youngblinks bomb is worse than greninjas counter?
Why is Lucas Down-B so low its +0 on Shield and it only has 8 Frames Endig lag it also stalls u in the air and its great for B reversing?!?!?
Bowser's down b is better than that. Especially if you are good at using down b to catch the ledge to get rid of end lag. Also using it when people get up from ledge and shield is an easy and consistent shield break.
i know i’m late to this vid, but Jrs down b is so much more than “just an item” i get that this list in a vacuum but Jrs kit works very very well with this move
Once you finish all of the moves, can you do a tier list for intangibles like hitbox,air speed, weight, as a collective tier list. Basically I'm just wondering how Mewtwo can have S to A tier moves on every tier list but be so mid tier
He big
@@imESAM :( I know
I think Bowsers could use a little more credit. If you know your opponent is going to jump from the ledge towards the stage it is a guaranteed, heavy hitting spike and shield breaks are damn near guaranteed if you knock someone on a platform and they roll to get up, plus you can us it to snap to ledges. Just my opinion though. It's definitely not one of the best options but I wouldn't say it's bad.
I could not play Samus without the evasive properties of her down B as well as the offstage and ledge harassment. I miss Smash 4 letting her bombs and charge shot bust shields in 2 moves.
I think he might underrate the part where banana just combos into basically any move in the game
Based lucario ranking. I don't play him anymore but the homing and aura scaling make it busted
"Secretly broken Down-B: Ness"
"""Secretly"""
Esam why?
Why was Mario moved down?
Average pikachu: oh my god! I have combos and I should be 0 to deathing incineroar every stock!!
Incineroar enthusiasts: 2 hits is all I need.
of all the crazy ass moves, a large ass ripping is the one above all
Isn't waft just a more powerful rest that you don't have all the time?
Yes besides the notable upside of not being asleep after you hit it
editor adding omori music is unbelievably based
I love these tier list videos because I make my own tier lists before watching and follow along and get to see what ESAM and I agree on. Perfect evening entertainment.
Also this game has been out for over three years and I still have no idea what Sonic's down B does compared to all his other spinny spin moves that look the same but apparently actually do different things. Could I look this up? Yes. Would it spoil my curmudgeonly fun fact? Also yes.
Sora's counter heck most counters that got S-tier feeling weird.
Like Sora's counter is frame 8 2nd slowest in the game he called it fast?
It's the same speed as witch time lmao.
Plant down b is not THAT bad
Robins Nosferatu is not negative on hit against any cast member. They can not punish you for hitting it.
When you just throw around “broken” for half the moves in the game it entirely loses its meaning. It makes it hard to believe any points made due to the extreme hyperbole
Maybe it won't change its ranking but you forgot to say that lucas' down b is -0 on shield and that it pulls the opponent (% dependent), making it useful to catch off guard people trying to edgeguard you
I play ganon and I just don’t understand how his down b is in okay tier
Falco shine is actually kinda broken. It’s disjointed as fuck and works perfectly to set up his edgeguarding
I don't think Jet hammer is that bad. For starters its more functional than F- smash and D-air.
Yeah Byleth’s down B shoulda just been a run of the mill counter. You already have tipper F smash that kills at 40 at corner stage or a fully charge neutral B (another horrible move) to punish shield breaks.
I was just watching the other tierlists for the 10th time so I'm so happy there's another one.
Brooo clouds limit would actually be op on some characters cuz if u think about it its just a buff for the other moves as well as giving them limit so like imagine any one with a killing up b or side b it becomes even stronger
Oh yeah plus the movement buffs would help a lot for some characters like as a link co main id be able to combo my stuff a lot easier and up b would be a menace with that buff of course i lose bomb with it so maybe not
Could be neat on Bowser. The speed is terrifying, and he gets Giga Bowser's version of his Specials.
Man, i want arcfire -> arcfire -> finishing touch lol
My weekly dose of tier list 😫💉
Haven’t watched it yet I want to guess the best down b. I’m guessing hero
spin charge is an advantage state tool spin dash is a neutral tool simple
I use young links bomb to a cancel it and leave it on a platform above me or on the ground when I jump up to platform for my opponent to run into then I just follow thru with Nair Fair or Bair and the combo is started
It limits what you’re opponent can do and the options they have which is really good when fighting someone with a lot of options like pyra mythra
He has about the juniors down be all wrong. thought slow, it cuts off areas and if thrown back at you. Catch it and throw back
Ryu's and Ken's are not the same - Ryu's has a significantly bigger hitbox, which makes it the better of the two.
The bowser jr. Down B isn't that bad it gives really high number of differents situations like ledge Trap, frame Trap and throw combos and even more juste by positioning differently the bounce of Meca troopa on Platforms and legde
Shout out to FireThePyro for using the best Brawler set: 1332
You underestimate jet hammer.
I do agree with bayo down B as like top of okay tier. It's good for early combos and later percents is a free smash attack but the only issue is hitting it. But if you are hit later bats within activates so that's a plus.