Least Glamorous Spec? Still VERY Important! Deere 3046R vs. 2038R vs. Kubota LX3310!!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ก.พ. 2022
- Measure turning radius on Deere 3046R, 2038R, 1025R and Kubota LX3310. Surprising Results.
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So that’s how those circles show up in farm fields! It’s TTWT doing turn radius tests!
I would guess in the vast majority of situations, most any tractor regardless of brand, will turn tight enough. There’s always the exception of course.
Where was our invite to this competition??? We could have left our duals on for fun. :) Great video Tim!
You woulda made em all look bad!
I hated to shame them!
My 3E turns VERY tight. Will post up on TU soon, great Video Tim !
Great video Tim, Very interesting to see how they all compared. I appreciate all the "Leg Work" You had to go through to make this video.. I can tell it took a lot of effort to make this and your subscribers will appreciate it!
I would say that my tractor gets used in the woods 90% of the time. While most may use their tractors in open fields, i am constantly trying to get between and around trees and downed timber. Tight turning was the first thing i noticed when i test drove my 3039. It seemed very comparable to my 2305 that i had at the time. Thanks for the video
Good video Tim. Glad to see Christy getting some seat time.
The Kubota has a steering valve without a "stop" so it can rotate. My old JD 2720 could rotate even when the tires were at their stop.
Our 3720 tractor also has the same characteristic. I don’t see it as an issue but more so a part of the fully hydraulic steering system.
As usual, you have put a ton of very common sense thought into your testing. I say that because it's EXACTLY how I would have done the testing. Your testing is consistent, replicable and useful to us users of the products you are testing. Kudos to your wife who seems to be extremely adept at flying drones and photovideoing your testing... all while driving the tractors!
Great info Tim and Christy. Thanks for taking the time to do this. I agree, specs are confusing unless you see how they are measured and even then they don't always agree with themselves. Just for fun do you get the same results going right? I would think so.
Cheers
Great comparison. Very relevant and I like the way you chose to measure it
Thank you for taking the time to make this video!
Thanks Tim and Christy, another well done comparison with concisely defined parameters which are easily understood, and clearly demonstrated. Good info for current and prospective compact tractor users. Blessings.
Tim and gang I always appreciate how your videos just cut right to the chase, no messing around! Keep up the great videos.
Thanks! We try to avoid wasting your time.
I like videos like this. Some auto literature used to have a diagram showing turning radius.
I used my 2025R to get my neighbor's boat lift out of the ice and rising water this morning. Uses never end.
LOL, I have that exact same paint marking tool. Bought it more than ten years ago and have used it dozens of times. The plastic sleeve is still on mine to this day. I think you chose a good methodology for a consistent comparison. As always, great video, thanks guys!
Tim & Christy, Great video, very informative. Thanks for showing turning radius of various tractors in a clearly understood manner. Look forward to seeing more comparison videos.
I like the two criteria you picked, they make sense for space needed to turn in a yard or in a building. I think an equally important one is where the inside rear tire swings for an idea of space between rows or around flower beds or trees. That would then bring in the complexity of mower deck sizes and how close to that same radius they end up being.
Anyway, love your stuff as always and those drone shots really helped solidify just what the differences are between the four. Remarkably close but also surprisingly different.
Always an interesting comparison, I like the added bonus of making crop circles. Great video and have a wonderful weekend.
it was so cool to see all these tractors in one shot.:D
Were you in 2wd or 4wd when making the measurements? The last video you made doing this showed both. That would be interesting to see the difference 2wd and 4wd turning radius.
2wd for all tests.
It would be interesting to see how much engaging the front effects the turning radius. And is it a set percentage across the board or is it different for each.
Hello Tim !!!! When you were at Messick's - for an sit and answer questions !!!! You said, to mike Morgan - about using his rented mulcher on a skid steer - to borrow !!! Courtney at Good Works Tractor - has an skid steer and an mulcher !!!! Maybe he would let you borrow his skid steer with mulcher to clean up the property at the radio tower !!!! Courtney has a few videos with this skid steer and mulcher - using on his new property !!!! Letting you know about this request for you - Tim !!!!
Now I want a green glazed doughnut. I'm not sure why... Good info. Thanks.
This was probably one of the most intriguing lessons you've shared. I say that based on how tight the 3046 turns. I feel this just may convince landscapers to give another look to the compact tractor market. Hopefully this leads to some good discussions with equipment reps at NFMS. Have fun while you're there also and enjoy the pull nights if you get a chance.
Another great informative video. Thanks Tim & Christy
This was a GREAT video! Been lurking for a long, long time. Good solid useful video. Thank you so much for this. Hoping to get a 2038R this next year, and your videos have been very helpful.
Thanks for the kind words!
Well Tim, let it never be said….that you cut any corners!!🤣🤣
Through test as accurate as it can be!! Well done! This can absolutely have concerns for guys like me who will spend much of my time negotiating through wooded areas that turning radius’s matter. Even though I’m not a Deere or kabota guy. Thanks for the extra effort!
Very interesting old boy thanks, the drone video really shows it nicely 👍
When we got our 3033r I was pretty impressed with how tightly it turned wish I could same the same about my super duty lol
I was just glad to see Tim use color coordinated paint to differentiate between the Deere and Kubota.
Great info, the steering tire Toe being In or Out can also affect the results, not a huge amount, but some, especially with more hours if the owner hasn't done the recommended measurement checks per the manual.
Used a JD X729 at work for mowing in summer & snow removal w/ blower in winter. It also had the wandering steering wheel as the spinner was never in the same place when you got done. Dealer said it was normal.
Nice video. I'll try and get out with my BX2660 sometime, but for now we just got another 8" snow here. Just to rib you a bit, you should see how tight my Kubota G1800-s turns. It's uncut circle was 16" when I did my mowing comparison video. (BTW, I fully understand this isn't even a comparison but thought I'd jest a bit about it). I'll put the BX results out there asap and fully expect it to match your earlier results. Take Care, J
Interesting , Thank You.
Tim let Christy have the easy job this time!
I checked the turning circle of my 1955 Ferguson today before hooking up the plow to turn over the field.
Inside tire 13ft diameter, outside front tire 21ft diamter.
Cool.
Great way to compare all the different tractors. Doing apples to apples. Looks like all your snow is gone. We got a couple of inches last night but should all be gone by Monday with the weather warming up. Thanks for taking the time to do this comparison.
This was before the snow :-)
Great video Tim! One question, how does rear wheel spacers effect turning radius? I’m thinking like for a 3R cab or some people put them on large 2R?
Good job on the circles. I am tempted to go out and measure my 2305 now just out of curiosity
Thanks Tim and Christy for the data. Another data point I would be interested in would be the inside radius. This would tell me how much mulch to put around objects or how small a roundabout I can make. Second would be the same data points (inside, outside, loader) but with a distinction between 2wd and 4wd.
This was all 2wd.
Great content, I liked seeing this. You do a good job trying to duplicate real life situations using a non-biased approach. I noticed your 3046R always sounds like an unloader valve is unloading. I assume this is normal, do to fact my 3039R does the same. Thank you as always!
Not sure what that is…but I don’t like it!
Thanks!
The 3046R is not only a sharp turning tractor but also a sharp looking tractor.
The kubota has hydrostat steering, all hoses, no linkages. Are the deere tractors hydrostat, or hydraulic assist, do they have steering linkages? This might explain the steering on the kubota.
Great comparison, have a 2025r like the start points
Now I want to measure my 1950s Fergusons (TO35 & MF35). Maybe this weekend when/if the weather warms up again after the snow storm.
If you have access to Fergusons or N-series Fords those would be a good reference, just the front wheels, there are many different buckets.
Good to know info keep it coming Tim 😎
Hey Tim: One thing you left out that i would think make a big difference in turning radius is wheel base. Be interesting to see if a longer wheelbase can turn sharper? ( i doubt it though)
Hopefully JD and Kubota use your video when people look at Steering specs 😉
I haven't bought my tractor yet, but the numbers on my wheelborrow are pretty amazing.
Another great one
Oooo, I really want to see the 3E results...I might do this in the back corner of my lot if no one else does. I'm fairly certain it's close to the 1 series
I think nearly identical to the large frame 2r.
Just a quick comment about the steering wheel that keeps turning I use a deer x580 at our church that dose the same thing, along with my bx. I was under the impression that all hydro steering worked that way.
Wasn't surprised by your results, specs show that the 3R's turn sharper. What I did like though was the real world test that you performed, especially the the corner of the bucket radius, that's the real world number that matters. Don't overthink my opening sentence, I really enjoyed this video and all the effort that you and Christy put into them.
Thanks Pat!
Kubota steering seems to be like that on the hydraulic steering system. That’s why if you place a spinner in say the 8 o clock position, in just a few minutes of use when you straighten the wheels forward the spinner will be clocked in another position. As for a Kubota G2160 with electric power steering the spinner stays clocked in the position you installed it. The Kubota G 2160 mower tractor does turn really sharp. My Kubota BX 1870 doesn’t turn quite as sharp as the G 2160. Seems all tractors aren’t created equal for some reason. Have a Blessed Day !
Wow Vinnie must be crying in the shed. He does not get to plow or be in the turn radius video. 😆 LOL
A little late watching this video, I’m a new subscriber and just bought a 2038R a couple of months ago. Don’t know if it makes that much of a difference but I do believe the 2038R has a longer wheel base than the 3046R.
Since I mow with my 1025R, I am interested in the inside turning radius rather than then outside as I need to know how much mulch I need to place around my trees. What I noticed in these areal shots was that the inside radius is at a minimum at the rear tire. I have noticed this as I place my deck at the edge of the mulch but as I do a turn around the tree I will find my rear tire has scrubbed the edge of the mulch. But I was happy as my 1025R turns as good as the old Cub GT2550 that was downgraded to trail mowing.
We show the ‘uncut circle diameter’ of 1025r and BX2680 in the bx vs. 1025r comparison.
You can see actual measurements there.
I had the steering problem on my last tractor,a massy. It was the hydraulic cylinder leaking internally. Replaced cylinder and solved the problem. The steering knob was never in the same place, very annoying. The seals in the cylinder were damaged from the factory.
Tim, that's a very good demonstration of true "turning radiuses". I'm wondering if either one of your tractors in this demonstration have wheel spacers that would affect this measurement🤔 It may be something you want your viewers to know. Keep up the good work my brother 👍👍
Rear wheel spacers have no impact on these measurements.
Nice job setting up a consistant method to measure. Would be interesting to know if wheel spacers have any effect. Likely would not, but worth a demonstration anyway I think.
They would not.
Our 5320, our old 5300, and the 1050 all did/do the thing with where you can slowly move the hydro steering even after the wheels are at lock. I've seen offroad vehicles with hydro steering do it too, so I just thought all hydro steering did that. The two that don't may do it once they've got more hours on them.
My 1025R does it since it was new. I figured it was due to the hydro steering as well.
Okay Tim, bringing up a past video. Now that I've had some time on my 3039R I'm amazed every time I turn. Numbers aside since they don't generally mean much to me, I'm more for actual user data and input, it is a very noticeable difference in the turning radius with the 3R compared to my 2038R.
...THAT is why numbers matter, Pat! Your experience shows the value of this test. I see the same thing. In the real world, the 3R is simply AMAZING. Much better than the 2R. ...and I had no idea until I got one. Why didn't the specs make this clear???
@@TractorTimewithTim I've wondered that myself, and yes, the numbers do matter. But, the numbers provided by JD are so far off that I don't find it relevant, but in the real world it simply amazing how much tighter the 3R turns. I wish JD would do a better job on their specs, a few of there different sites are all over the place, don't even get me started on FEL specs.
Furthermore, several folks say turning radius doesn’t matter. I find that absurd!
It is very important to me.
@@TractorTimewithTim Couldn't agree more!! It's very tight when I'm working in the barnyard, the turning radius of this 3R gets me around better than did the 2038R.
For curious, did you check to see if turning left and right are the same? Some vehicles and mowers and at least older tractors weren't always the same spec both directions. I did also see the question for 2wd compared to 4wd. Loaded bucket seems to me could "require" 4wd depending on conditions. I am fairly certain that would impact how tightly a tractor can turn.
2wd
I have a JD 758 with hydraulic front wheel drive. When mowing it will leave a 26" circle of uncut grass. My 1025 will leave a 50" circle of uncut grass.
Wow! Johnny #3, what's the distances from center of front hub to center of back hub of the 4 tractors, this would make up the difference, like Johnny #3... thanks for information.. 😉
That would be called the ‘wheelbase’. You can find that spec on the respective site.
Is there any difference in two-wheel or four-wheel drive in the turning size?
We did all this testing in 2wd. Yes, 4wd would be worse. We shoulda tried it I guess. Got tired!!
The inner rear wheel for the radius
I will try to convince my finance committee in assisting. I would like to see if my 2014 model 1025r is different
How did your test due against the specs ?
Tim the turning radius is from the rear wheel
Can you do a few more measurements?
Leg room seat back to dashboard
Foot room on floor on center
Rear axle to front axle
Rear axle to 3 point
Rear tire to 3 point
Front axle to front edge
Front axle to loader arm
Front axle width outside tires
Rear axle width outside tires
Front loader high
Rear 3 point high / low
Steering tilt
Top rops high
I am aware of what Christy observed with the Kubota, since I'm an "orange tractor guy" I assumed they were all like that. I guess it's just a design difference, some have a hard stop, but the Kubotas don't so when you turn the wheel beyond the limit of the system, the excess pressure is relieved...
I currently have a CCY SC2400 that operates in the same manor.
Need to get the Zetor M25 in the mix. I have one and its a good machine. But until then, the interwebs will have ZERO info on the Zetor….odd.
How does the ventrac compare to the 1025?
Ventrac has a VERY COMPREHENSIVE comparison to the 2025r. This would be worth your time. Almost all of this applies to 1025r as well.
I love it haha great info for us but someone flying over is thinking crop circles
That's what I was thinking. 😊
I was trying to make Olympic Rings!
Very informative if you are looking to purchase a new tractor.
What was the thumping noise when the first test was being conducted?
3046r? Not sure what it was.
@@TractorTimewithTim Yes, the 3046R. Start listening at 5:25 after you ask Christy to “Make another round.” It’s very consistent and sounds like a metallic low-pitched thud to me.
Are you in two or four wheel drive, while mowing I notice a difference.
2wd for all tests
I wish they gave us independent rear brakes for even more tighter steering.
3 of the 4 tractors in this test do indeed have independent rear brakes.
I have to correct my last comment. I would have measured the diameter of the outside front bumper - OR which ever part of the tractor stuck out the farthest to the outside-front. This measurement is called the wall-wall distance that the tractor could turn around in. For instance... if you were pulling a rotary cutter (no FEL) and you needed to turn within 2 fences or whatever. I think that and the front tire diameters are what I'd need. Just sayin'.
Front wheel or front loader stick out furthest….as I measured.
I had a long post over on your old youtube video round #3 of 8 on the 1025r vs bx2680, but I actually have some interesting results on the new to us BX2380. Remember that uncut mowed circle? I didn't have a way to video by myself, but I measured the "uncut" circle to be roughly somewhere between 62 to 64"?!! Isn't that so odd? We have several theories on why the bx2680 you tested was different---of course it is a different engine but you would think the same machine, right? Of course I also noticed some other Kubota folks saying they got a tighter radius on your round #3, but again on the BX2380, I don't think anyone chimed in on a different measurement for the 2680. But, If we can get some time this week we will post a video to try to show all three measurements for you and others, but the grass was wet this entire weekend. We are still catching up on videos, but we definitely appreciate the great info. Your research continues to be entertaining!
What did I get? Can’t remember. Was it in the 70’s?
@@TractorTimewithTim Your uncut circle for the bx2680 was 78". I thought maybe Kubota changed something since my tractor is a 2019, but doubtful. The civil engineer in me loves the numbers...still raining in our mountains.
I think there is a ‘stop’ on the steering. Maybe ours was adjusted improperly? It only had 50 hours when we got it..and we didn’t mess with it.
@@TractorTimewithTim That would definitely explain the difference. In the above video for the 1025r outside tire diameter/turning radius you got roughly 7.75 feet so that sounds close to John Deere's 7.4 foot turning radius in their listed 1025r specs where tractor manufacturers probably test on asphalt or concrete to help tires grip. That 3046 turning ability is amazing.
@@TractorTimewithTim Well, I created a really boring Turning circle diameter bx2380 video for you LOL! My son will help me do a full video for the other 2 measurements for this video, but I laid out a 60" diameter with white landscape rocks measured to the inside of the rocks and then tried to drive exactly where the circle was created. Paint would have made much more sense, but I did not have anyway to paint by myself and I had already measured about 62" of an uncut grass circle diameter which you just couldn't see so I think the video will show you what some of the BX owners had seen. My wife is at the Ewomens conference in Lynchburg, so I had a bit of free time to make what my kids would say is a really boring video. @th-cam.com/video/duNyWn_auCo/w-d-xo.html
So here's my dilemma. I have an extensive garden but no tiller. I have rented several and to tell the truth they are all terrible. I do have a JD 1025R like yours. So I am thinking on buying a iMatch quick connect rig and buying a tiller and trailer to trailer the tractor. Then renting out my services. Is there enough business out there tilling to pay off this investment? I don't even know where to begin. Any advice would be much appreciated.
I liked the test, I think it gives a pretty good idea of real world expectations. The results across all the bigger tractors are pretty close, to the point there is no real usability difference between any off them. I would say if turning radius is the selling point you are focused on when purchasing a compact tractor because of your work requirements, you are probably getting the wrong machine for the job and your going to tear up the ground and put way more ware and tear on your tractors drive components than need be.
I disagree. The 3R is much more capable than the 2R and yet it turns shorter. Noticeably shorter.
Also, if turning radius is NOT a priority in your purchase decision, you are missing a major usability consideration. Every single time you turn the front wheels to their stops is a time you need tighter turning radius.
@@TractorTimewithTim what I'm taking away from your comment is that you want people to know capacity and maneuverability do not necessarily have a linked inverse relationship.
What I'm getting at is an operator who is familiar with that machine will adjust their path to acount for a ten inch diffrance in turning radius, in the majority of their maneuvers. If your constantly making sharp turns or 3 point turns because you can't get around an obstacles, you might want to consider a diffrent tool.
I think both points are valid in the right circumstances.
Just my to cents but these are a couple video ideas I would find intresting. Find a company using a tractor for a task that it's not ideally suited for and have them try out a more ideal machine. Get some reaction and opinion from the operator. Two, a videos showing a small tractors competing against specialized tools, such as a mini track loader doing landscape work on a small lot. It could be a bit of when to rent concept.
Overall I think you do a good job of showing usability and keeping the videos practical. This was another good real world demo.
Yea, but how many tractors etc must we buy? Most folks want to find the best compromise for their needs.
@@TractorTimewithTim One for every mood? :) In all serous you might be under estimating the purchasing power of your viewers or at least a big chunk of them. In my experience most sub compact, and compact tractors are purchased for hobby work. We like to tell ourselves that we have a need, or we manufacture a need, but really we just want to play in the dirt. If you take look at it from a hobby perspective and then look at what people spend on their hobbies. You will find small tractors are pretty inexpensive comparatively. How many Harley-Davidson people have 3 or more bikes, or pickup truck people have a $70k truck that can't be used for utility because it's been setup for going off road. The list really never stops, ski boats, bass boats, watches, sports cars, airplanes. I'm financially conservatives as I imagine you are, and focus on price for most things, but hobbies are an area where you spend for satisfaction not utility per dollar. Using a sub optimal tool kills the enjoyment of doing the task. I'm not saying you shouldn't show people how to get more done for less, but I bet if you did a survey of your viewers you would find a good chunk are into this because it's an escape from their office job, or other stresses in their lives. If you use the lens of showing people the most satisfying way to accomplish their tasks, you might find you are doing them a favor. You might saying don't get the backhoe attachment, get a mini excavator to complement your tractor. I think all the cabs showing up on tractors points to the idea, it's not just about getting something done, it's about playing in the dirt and enjoying it.
Again I enjoy the work you and your wife do, and I have learned a lot from your channel. I just encourage you to consider changing your frame of reference "occasionally" from being fiscally conservative and maximizing your dollar to "you only get so much time to play in the dirt. this is how you make the most of it".
I swear I'm going to stop the rant. There are also some economics in buying say a mini X over a backhoe. A subcompact backhoe only fits the model it was built for, so it only has value to a small group and as time goes on that group gets smaller, so it's value drops dramatically over time. A mini X with a consumer hours on it still has a high market value because companies buy them for utility value vs intrinsic value. Depending on purchasing factors, a person could have an over all lower TCO from the mini X and enjoy their time with it more.
Rant over and best of luck with your continued work!
My Deere 2305 steering wheel continues to rotate with constant pressure like the kabota.
Where is the bobcat CT? Lol
The Kubota steering cylinder is bypassing. Needs fixing. Or, maybe that's Kubota's way of relieving the pressure at the end of the stroke. When our 4020 did that, the cylinder had to be replaced.
😊
shorter wheel base with most wheel angle wins, with greater wheel angle comes instability with a loader, this is why john deere all wheel steers are designed prohibiting front end loaders and shorter 3 point pick up height vs regular 2 wheel steer
If you find a product to tighten the circle let us see it. Blessings
sounds like the kubota steering is 100% hydraulic.
Use a spray paint can ground marker wheel and have christy sit in bucket
Or you could fabricated to drawbar with a pin mount then reach behind and pull trigger
Those 3r fronts look like they cut so hard at full lock, tipping could be an issue with a heavily loaded bucket. They definitely from the drone had the most degrees off straight when at full lock.
The fronts don’t do anything concerning tipping. The front axle oscillates, its the rear of the tractor that effects tipping, that’s why rear ballast is so important, to keep the rear planted on the ground.
How tight of a circle can Johnny X Drift?? 🤣
Ha!
The steering wheel thing on the Kubota does bother me because I put a knob on my steering wheel on my Kubota tractor and it is never in the same spot It goes all the way around even if I drive in a straight line for a long distance the steering wheel doesn't stay in the same position and my knob ends up moving on me
All brands do that.
Interesting… but makes no difference to me because of my land. I’m never driving the tractor without something on the three point, or a backhoe. My turning radius (where I care) is determined by the brush hog out back. I have lots of room everywhere but the property corners, so… although interesting, this measurement is irrelevant to me. I can see it being very important if you work in tight spaces. The measurement was really well done!
You need to put weight in the bucket. I expect tractor will turn tighter when the bucket is weighted as this puts more weight on the front wheels. Another twist to turning.
Being a math teacher, there is an easier way to do that experiment. First, I love seeing the 2 concentric circles. Great display. But if you are just concerned about the numbers, then just do the wheel circle, then measure distance from wheel to bucket and add that back to original circle. May have saved you some time. Loved the video. Keep it up.
I hate the "with brake" measurement. It is totally dependent on speed.
With hydrostatic transmissions turning radius just isn't important unless it's a huge difference and a very specific application. Still cool to see though!
Totally disagree. It takes LOTS of time for the 18 point turn.
It just doesn't, if so put it to practice and demonstrate. It simply isn't a big time difference in almost all circumstances.
Your wheel base will be different, so you can't compare to each other.
lol 'mid mount mower' 'turning radius' ... not a concern for 'real tractors.' Any decent size tractor has a huge turning radius...it's just a nature of tractors and physics...skid steers and excavators with tracks are tighter, but tears up the ground. Does it matter? Not really...maybe if some dummy is trying to mow a .33 acre suburban lawn with it, but otherwise you use it like a tractor. This means you back up and forward a lot when in tight spots. You drive it patterns to avoid turning around, meaning backing up etc. Certainly don't want to turn tight on a slope when hauling a full bucket etc. If you're doing any real work, you probably got it in 4WD, so turning tighter will tear up even more and it's even less effective unless you're going straight. Oh and why don't you have a real kubota? LX is for hobbyists and not much of a step up above 1025r...meanwhile you got 2 higher end green tractors. Either way, silly topic unless your primary concern is mowing grass......for which you should be using a lawn mower for NOT a tractor. Get a kubota L or MX+ to show off the channel...it will dominate as a 'tractor' over that manicured green garbage. 1025r that you started out on is a great big lawn mower (in a good way), but it's a totally different perceptive when you stop looking at tractors as mowers and more as tools (...tractors...).
I could not disagree more. Your pompous statements about our tiny tractors are laughable. I developed my appreciation for tight turning radius on a 320hp articulated Massey Ferguson tractor in 1980. My brother drove a Steiger which we all loved, but it’s turning radius was 3 Ft larger than my Massey.
The improved Massey turning radius proved incredibly valuable.
The same has proven true with the myriad of tractors I’ve had here.
Ignore it if you want, but a tighter turning tractor is much easier to use. Period!