I've ruined so many friendships and relationships with people I care about. I don't want to hurt anyone or make a fool of myself. It makes so much sense now. I have vivid memories of violent fights between my parents where one of them would always leave and at such a young age I was and still are traumatized that I'd never see one of them again. Now I'm always traumatized to lose anyone in my life, I hate what and how I've acted to other's. I want to be accountable and better. These videos taught me a lot about myself, I'm grateful I've found your work. Thank you. Just FYI I'm a 25 year old male.
Admittedly being with a borderline is a lot of hard work, since you are pretty much responsible for her emotional regulation and sense of self. And in a way the intimate partner can help the borderline become themselves and their own person, but only if the borderline is aware enough to accept this task and responsibility. However, it can be very rewarding and an extremely enriching relationship if both parties put the hard work in. Borderlines didn’t choose to be like this. It seems even worse if they act infantile but you have to be patient…
@@ChornaRealEstate if people dont understand you its because they dont want to understand. Its the same thing with yourself as well. Everyone is just trying to get revenge on others for what someone else did to them. Remember that you can get better for yourself and for others.
But, trust is a big issue when they lie and went hot/cold cycles. When they grow distant, I can't be sure if they are cyber-romancing. Because it seems like what they do in my case.
It's hard to deal with a person you know is sick when they push/pull and cheat. I tried everything to help my wife. In the end I got discarded. I know she will try to get back with me, but the trauma she has done is too much.
Wonderful comment. Problem is most are not aware or refuse to acknowledge this or seek help. I have been in a relationship with one who has teh quiet form for nearly 20 years. For 18 years i put up with this. Was a caretaker and probably codependent. But then it got too much and I found myself and boy have things been volatile since. I had to in order to retain my sense of self and self esteem. I was about to lose this. Not sure we’ll survive TBH. So very sad.
Me and my current girlfriend boderline were on the road in the Atacama desert and then she asked me to stop the car, I did, so she turned up the car stereo and turned the headlights on full volume, she climbed on the hood of my car and took off clothes while dancing. borderlines do these crazy things they drive men crazy in every way : love hate fury they make men awaken in them a sense of protection they are angelic, eternal young they are a devil sometimes. they are free but if they feel they have been rejected or feel envy they destabilize their own emotions but it doesn't last long. they will addict you! I think they are the best women of course I also have a certain narcissism too
I am a borderline female. When i was young, very young, batween the ages of 2 and up until i stopped giving the strong desperate reaction my mother wanted, my mom would play dead. She'd be gone. My mom kept dying from the age of 2 until i stopped reacting. I stopped reacting at around 8/9 years old. She enjoyed the sound of my desperate aggrieved cries when i thought shed left me. Another tactic was the silent treatment. Now as a child, when given the silent treatment by your mother, it feels like you've been deleted. You dont exist. This being a malignant narcissistic mother means there were many insults, gaslighting, verbal abuse of all sorts. All those words and emotions rang loud and heard deep in my little ears during the silent treatment. Somehow i felt enslaved, oppressed, unwanted, a defected child. I felt rejected. With came the feelings of unworthiness and shame. Now the deepest and most overwhelming emotion i felt hard and strong from the age of 7 was excruciating emotional PAIN. At 18, shame created a void of a deep EMPTINESS.
I am so sorry for the pain you've experienced in your life. I've never heard of a parent playing dead to their child, that's mind-boggling and plain horrifying. People are often cruel in the way they speak of people suffering from BPD, because of the ways they've been hurt by them. I hope you don't feel ashamed by the diagnosis, knowing how you've been set up by your mother to have these problems. I pray that you learn self-love to the point that you no longer have the fear of being unwanted or unworthy. I pray that you find peace and the past mistreatment will no longer sting when you remember it. I hope that you find people who will treat you gently.
I'm so very sorry you experienced such unimaginable horror. You deserved NONE of this trauma. The earth knows your terror and honors your bravery. God bless you and be well.
Thank you so much for sharing. Went through the same thing. Can’t get the idea out of my head that she must have heard my crying myself to sleep and she didn’t come to suit me. Still working on myself and healing my inner child, grieving I didn’t have a mom at all. Wishing you lots of strength and love ❤️
The best I've ever heard it described. "She wants to hurt you not in order to hurt you but for you to have a shared experience of her pain..." hurt with me heal with me so we can bond together. It explains so many of my romantic relationships I realize now. Thankyou so much for sharing these insightful videos!
I got goosebumps at one point when you were describing "Mirroring" the borderline's extreme behaviour. Before I even had a hunch of my girlfriend being "BPD" (neither I nor she had ever heard about it), I used to employ some of the techniques you're describing to calm down her tantrums. At one time, she was threatening to cut herself, and in order to "wake her up", I very cold-bloodedly took a fork and started scraping my arm with it; she snapped out of it immediately. It was not a particularly fun experience. Other times I would mirror the calculated verbal abuse she'd throw at me until her psychotic alter ego burned out and she snapped back into her regular self and say "what am I doing". I've literally endured dozens if not hundreds of these situations... Sadly, no amount of efforts, strategies and dispositions were enough to stabilize our relationship enough to be viable long-term; I've literally developed some serious triggers and anxieties myself to the point where being together is becoming intolerable. Only now she's beginning to acknowledge my suggestions to look into the BPD diagnosis and seek some adequate help, since 18 years in psychoanalitic therapy, although useful in many ways, has not brought her even an inch towards actual proper adult behaviour and fulfillment in life.
I also used to massage her forehead when she started getting emotional. It didn't solve anything in the long run but it did calm her down a lot on the moment.
This is absolutely the best video about borderlines Ive ever found. My wife of 10 years is borderline and if id watched this once a week for the last 10 years my relationship wouldnt be failing.
I have learned more from you in three days of watching your videos than I have listening to so called gurus for the past 2 yrs. Thank you sir!! You are Brillaint.!! I also think you are a legend for surviving around borderline women for 35 yrs!!
Incredible work, Mr Vaknin. The descriptions of borderline character, are subtle and comprehensive. I can feel your emotion at the end of the video. And it shows your love, for borderline women, that I share with you.
@@samvakninThanks. Correction made. I had a marvelous relation with a borderline woman, exactly as you describe. In the end, she was unstable, and when she noticed I was going to discover it, she decided to cheat, and walk away. Everything you said is real, even for women on the other side of the globe.
I think they should re-do all the Disney movies but switch out the romantic characters with borderlines, narcissists, anti-social disorder types, and maybe throw in a few schizoids and autistic persons. Then these kids might be more ready for the dysfunctional reality of adult romance. Surrender Dorothy.
well, that's all well and good but kids these days see enough of that crap especially if they have single moms which is almost half of kids these days. they need realistic healthy models compared and contrasted against realistic unhealthy ones. The last thing we need is for this plan to backfire and little Sophie is imitating her favorite histrionic attractive princess in the Kroger's ok?
I would say that the segment about supporting BPD during their psychopathic acting out sadly can ever work in a home environment. They weaponize everything, they assume worst lies and intentions when someone is doing what is humanly possible to remind them of love. Truly, this is beyond anything animalistic. It is a warped, volatile essence of dysregulation and chaos in the most vile sense.
Thank you Sam and all commenters. I will have to watch this several times, make notes, and do all this for myself as I have removed myself from every one except one person in my life. I am 69 years along and have suffered myself and everyone in my lifetime, diagnosed from teenager. The isolation is sometimes stifling but also gives me insight and direction to what to work on next. I am seeking professional help and running up against the obstacles of misdiagnosis like OCD, ADHD, and refuse to take their meds. DBT and CBT seems hard to get through to diagnosticians that don't understand. So I am deduced to self help books on these at the moment. Also Richard Grannon exercises for CPTSD, and bouts of daily journaling. I'm not consistent in any or all of these, thus the search for a therapist to represent some consistency. Your lectures and seminars are priceless and provide not only amazing understanding, but a bar set for what I am to expect in therapist attributes. I bring your introject with me to these sessions.
I am of similar age. There was next to no mental health support in rural America when we grew up plus the stigma and shame was off the charts! We could never foreseen the phenomena of TH-cam as a resource for healing those early wounds. I like the homeostasis I've built living on my own. I applaud you still seeking therapy to find healing. It's never too late to live your best life!❤️
bless you, this is a wealth of great knowledge. I'm 1 year in and have been learning all I can but have paid the piper as well. It's certainly one of the hardest relationships I've had but her love makes it all worth it and I always tell her that. I have never been loved by anyone the way you do.
I find the similarities between BPD and heightened RSD in ADHD mixed with long term exposure to trauma like C-PTSD quite astonishing, to say the least. Similarities of symptoms listed below. _Please debate with me & don't hate on me_ I'm curious about this. *BPD:* Borderline Personality Disorder _Emotional dysregulation + Impulsiveness + All or nothing + Expecting rejection + Rejection sensitivity + People pleasing + Anxiety + Distressed dissociations + Distorted lens + Panic/anger attacks + Reassurance relying + Trust issues + Addictions + Obsessions_ *ADHD:* Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder _Emotional Dysregulation + Impulsiveness + All or nothing_ *RSD:* Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria _Expecting rejection + Rejection sensitivity + People pleasing + Anxiety + Distressed dissociations + Distorted lens + Panic/anger attacks + Reassurance relying + Trust issues + Addictions + Obsessions_ Fear of rejection, criticism, inadequacy, deception and isn’t being abandoned by someone actually the worst kind of rejection there is? *Unstable self-image:* This becomes an *RSD* issue if you're more invested in constantly trying to please others than to discover who you are as an individual. _tastes, likes, dislikes, values, beliefs etc._
I have ADHD and RSD, I married and had a child with a woman who has BPD and OCD. We got locked down together over COVID, 1/2 truths, 100 white lies a day, gaslighting, manipulation, intermittent reinforcement, cycles of ideation and vilification, I saw the psychopathy many times, it felt sadistic. Then I left. It was a perfect storm of pain and disaster, pushed me to the absolute breaking point. She took custody of my child and created false accusations, spread rumor's throughout my work networks and friends, destroyed me financially. The loss of time with my daughter has been the most painful experience of my life. I would rather be beaten by a gang of men with baseball bats, than go through the pain this woman can cause. I do understand SV's points here, we are now divorced and we have started talking again. I feel tempted to see if reconciliation is possible, Sometimes I feel strong enough to deal with it, sometimes, it feels too much. I wish that our family could have worked.
I appreciate you ... Your wrapping together your detailed analysis with what the experience feels like! 2 borderlines together - what a once in a lifetime experience for me. Never before, never since.
Yet another superb video! I think that everything you outlined can be helpful to anyone who loves and cares for a Borderline person, whether as an intimate partner, friend, or family member These skills, tools, and the framework you provided can help engender compassion and understanding.
Thank you for this video. I watched it as a borderline wife. And the last few minutes of you explaining the prize being worth the price helped me see those aspects of myself that I always tend to forget. I'm not all bad all the time and I definitely don't mean to be that much effort to be involved with. I have a wonderful husband who tries so hard and it makes me feel so bad for him. I wish he'd just give up on me and move on with our girls, so they can live happily, no more egg shell walking..... but he stays🤷♀️..... thank you for those last few minutes especially 🖤
What a dangerous and toxic thing to say. I think it's more accurate to say that about toxic people who don't want to heal, in general. And NPD are BPD are different. Idk if you can be both so easily. Narcissists are horrible, but even they are capable if they want to change. I'd never be with a narcissist. It's be able to with most anyone who agreed to work on themselves. Sorry, I'm just defensive because my sister is BPD and she's really misunderstood and very sweet. As her favorite person, I know it's hard to handle her. But you just have to realize it's mostly cptsd and learn how to support someone in that way, if you have the motivation to love them and stay. They're just a lot of work because their parents never taught them better.
I'm a borderline that's becoming a reiki practicioner and when the treatment broke the illusion I was living in, I've became disabled with PMDD and have cried for a year now on and off. Lost my ability to feel music. He is right in saying if we face who we are we wouldn't survive because i feel like im dying literally. Body is breaking down. It's not because of facing who I am though even though that's hard e.g.. realising I'm a people pleaser. But it's what people have done to me for 30 years. Psychological & emotional abuse that's made me into someone that enables people to disrespect me & boundarys where I do nothing until i split which I see as me having a moment of facing what i brush under the carpet so i blow. Knowing I've not honered myself & the people who say they love me abuse me. What I'm not surviving is seing relationships for what they are. (Being only ok if I shrink myself, no boundary, no love, codependancy, a illusion ) bpd for me is reaction to emotional abuse. Splitting is me facing what i suppress all at once where I assume that the person must be a narcassist given information. So I rage as im dealing with a psychopath in my mind) pmdd makes me face the truth. The more my emotionally abusive bf heals the less the pmdd makes me think hes bad. We attract narcassistic people so we will act accordingly. 30 years of fighting peoples gaslighting & tactics that is unconscious in them. And making sure I don't become a hypocrite fighting against what I'm guilty of myself.
@@bloom_meister9541 I shouldn't entertain you, & yet: I was moved by her comment & then enter, you 🙄 & NOW, I am feeling fiercely loyal to the original commenter, though i dont know either of you, i can see clearly that you are needing to adjust that stick up your arse, & learn some manners or common decency. It's quite gross, to scavenge the internet, looking to kick someone in a moment of vulnerability. It's not cute. Did it make you feel better? (This is intended as rhetorical question). Take care
Yes very addictive! After 4 relationships with BPD women it’s hard to go back to the less intense love of a more stable person. It’s such a balance..is the amazing pure love worth the energy it takes to maintain the relationship & yourself? Still don’t know the answer to that but damn I’ve been to the stars & the gutter many times
*I practically did everything told in this video.* Guys, only different thing happens at the end she leaves you but makes a "closing speech". Hell, I had no idea she had BPD. My problem was I never had a gf, she was first and I don't have any attachment problems. Her unacceptable behaviours almost made me leave her, however she insisted to be together causing drama.
My borderline ex is somewhat on the severe spectrum even with the proof of her emotional cheating she called them "friends" and the things she was saying to them were "jokes". Everytime she verbally assualted me and i stood up for myself she said she just cant talk to me because im so "sensitve" and cant take a "joke". Its all just a big game to her. She got very cruel towards the end. She would text me as if i just didnt understand how emotions work and I just dont understand while sending multiple hysterical laughter emojis as if i were just beneath her...because i just "wouldnt get it" even if she sat me down and explained to me how she met (literally most of these ppl shes never even met in real life and were just "cyber friends") these ppl and how their relationship worked..completely nuts
That's exactly how my ex was, and when I confront him he'd get very abusive and ruthless i thought he was a psychopath, i stayed because i knew he was just deeply hurt and had to make me see it, he went to therapy turned out it was BPD, things got better he gave me the best times of my life like sam said it was worth the price untill he stopped therapy it all went haywire again i had to leave, eight years later and i still regret it though...
You never know by the second how things change. One minute you are turning in for bed exhausted after walking on eggshells, then if you are not 100% mentally present for a sincere "good night" or you are not attentative for 1 second, there is screaming and raging and you are begging for her to forgive you.
Your borderline description is very interesting for a stranger in this field like me. It seems to fit with "a few" women I met in life, regarding the general aspects of borderline. Especially a girl I once knew. She was beautiful and awesome, a great person actually. I wanted to date her, she told me no, we became sort of friends for a while. Then I frustrated her on something, but not intentionally, as I remember. She got angry with me among friends, and there was no fix. I was a toxic narcissistic guy at the time. As you mention I have to agree her anger towards me was to hurt me and share the emotional burden of our situation going wrong. But I felt it was also part an act, cause I guess I never truly knew her. We parted ways for a good while. Then when we saw each other again, we could only look at each other from distance. Thank you for your very insightful rich talks.
Once they get under your skin, watch out. There's just something about them. They can be very childlike and they bring out one's protective instinct. They are challenging and exciting...
9 years with him. I'm exhausted. He disguarded me 2 months ago. I can't get over it. Most intense relationship of my life. This is the best description I have found on borderline to date, and it's his birthday...I'm so upset.I wish I'd seen this years ago, then maybe I'd never have lost him. I would take him back in a heart beat, but he will never talk to me again. He ran back to his friend (whom he'd discarded for me - not that I'd wanted him to) He improved in some ways towards the end, it was almost as if we were swapping places... Thank you Doctor. This has helped me to make sense of the best roller coaster of my life.
@@escalera601 because borderlines are the opposite of each (love and hate) on the spectrum. When it's bad, it's BAD, but when it's good it's GOOD. It's like an addiction. They train you to want the high (or the deep intense feeling of happiness and love) which they make you believe you cannot find with another person. You spend ALL your time walking the eggshells and working to keep getting the GOOD. By human nature, we want what we've worked for. It's sick, it's twisted and they KNOW what they're doing. I miss the highs it's true, but overall I'm steady now and MUCH better off without him. Think of it this way, someone who was addicted to say, alcohol, drugs, sex, food, whatever, will miss it at times, but they know it's destructive, so hopefully stay clear - same thing. Best advice is, stay the f away from borderlines, NEVER get involved in the first place. Unfortunately, most people don't know it's a rollercoaster till they're half way through. It's never too late to get off tho. Good luck with your journey, stay true to yourself and who you were before you met the thing that WILL destroy your life/relationships.
11:15 For 20 years I managed to do this, but the thing that wrecked it all is that for those same 20 years, my BPD father-in-law was directly competing against me for the "pivotal role". In the end, he won. In his late 70s, he was able to break her with his victimization/woe-is-me guilt tripping. I believe that since he is the original sinner that caused her trauma to begin with, it was futile for me to even believe I had a chance against his evil hand. I could not convince her to remember the horrible ways her toxic family treated her in the past, so I could not give her continuity with me.
I like this sentiment. Very difficult to hold, when one is in devaluation. In addition possibly harmful. However very good point and an important yet dissonant point for those who love borderlines. Thank you. 😊
@@sneakerhead567 It's all bullshit regardless of it's source. The human experience isn't a picnic for anyone. Character is built thru the learning of tolerance via understanding. I don't seek to persuade others to have the same opinion as me nor the same feelings that I do. God Bless
I would feel bad to tell somebody to do all these things for me.... Sounds like a full time unfair job. I get them with how deep I love but my emotions always cause problems.... I guess I should stay single until I can control my thoughts and emotions huh 😅. GREAT VIDEO.
You're absolutely right.. I have borderline personality disorder..my last bf was a somatic narcissist.. it was a nightmare. .. the fighting.. the pain .. the hurt .. therapy for the past 11 months is helping me .
It seems like all treatment is the responsibility of others, not the borderline. It seems like 24 hour babysitting of the borderline. It seems that healing is the responsibility of others which makes me wonder if that’s healing at all? Does the borderline take responsibility for their actions or is this constant monitoring on the behalf of others?
Interesting, I took 41 notes and listened through the entire video as if I am her partner (I am her parent). Very challenging relationship and the end of the lecture is very romantic . Thanks
Have not watched but I definitely have described my past BPD partners as Sirens. Most definitely. They are probably what they greek were talking about.
This is my favourite video. I felt the care Dr. Vaknin has in this regard. So true as well if I look at what has helped me in therapy and in life, as a person who was in the least a budding borderline.
I wish I’d have watched this video some years ago, to help him in the right time. Now he is deeply grounded in the black hole and won’t listen 😢💔 don’t know what I can do more to help him and in the same moment try to help myself.
goddammit, comrade Sam, thank you so much for this. im a third of the way through and already i know this is exactly what i needed after that last video i watched, that left me feeling a bit hopeless. ❤❤❤
never again am I allowing such a toxic individual in my life never again...I thought narcissists were bad...bpd sufferers can be equally as bad and toxic
I never do the pull away for any other reason than, I’m seeing things that make me believe they are going to leave me, so I want to avoid that pain and need to try and leave them before they can leave me
People already got enough on their plate these days. Life is hard enough. Work on yourself please. Don't expect anyone to 'handle you' but handle the world together, with him.
Keep working on yourself to become more self aware and then actively start changing your lifestyle and find a spiritual path. You will learn to handle yourself God Willing and then you will find true love. Best of luck! Don't stop trying.
When I would go out I used to say "I didn't do it, it was elissa." M(elissa) she is within me. Also, I used to wonder why amy winehouse albums just spoke to me, I get it now. Thank you Sam.
Thank you Dr Vaknin. You are always so insightful. How is it that the borderlime worries about being abandoned by their lover when they have object inconstancy? It seems they should not be thinking of their romantic lover at all to even worry about being abandoned if they lack object constancy Also, putting in all this work and effort to make the relationship work seems like the perdect recipe to develop codependancy. Not sure following this recipe will lead to a healthy relationship. Always appreciate your videos on the topic of borderlines. Thank you for all your efforts.
The borderline suffers from intolerable abandonment anxiety. So, she leverages her object inconstancy to preempt abandonment: she abandons first (often by cheating).
I spent 30 years surfing this wave, from incredible high to another, with gusto! Eventually, it was time to stop and my own sanity improved 10,000 times. While they were worth it, in the end, slowing down to 25 mph saved my life.
This video is extremely insightful. However, by attempting to employ all the techniques mentioned, anyone involved with a borderline is essentially abandoning themself to figure out the borderline’s 24/7 mind fuggery.
That man would be me... ...Just kidding, it’s been 6 months since our breakup, I would totally take he back. Being with her is equal to the pain of not.
I vividly remember the first time I said something mean to someone I was in my early twenties. I just could not control myself it would not stop coming out of my mouth. I feel sorry for any person who falls in love with one of us. My reactions have become more explosive as I have grown old and it has scared me. I am using some of the techniques you spoke of doctor thank you so much.
Thank you very much for the validation. I’ve found that when properly reparenting my borderline with love, he has matured immensely. He’s now much more vulnerable. As you said, they need constant reminders, reassurance, etc. Once I depersonalized his behaviors, I was able to be more in tune to areas where he has been failed by his parents and can then assist and retrain him with unconditional love and boundaries and provide new perspectives.
Life is too short to be in a relationship like this, I promise you. Avoid dysfunctional people. Seek out healthy people for relationships and friendships.
I couldn't have done it. I don't have the skills, the presence of mind. I would react in the moment because all that the borderline is, is what I am not. I am rational in thought, fair play is important. I would not have succeeded.
Borderline women gotta be top 3 worst to get involved with in any relationship. They’re the most giving, loving, freaky, cooperative and friendly at 1st but without any warning they’ll flip and tear your world apart and will crush your spirit. Save your sanity fellas, stay clear of these types of women. You’ll be a lot happier.
Nobody taught me about such things (or anything useful really) as a boy, but I'm absolutely never dealing with one ever again. They are the worst--an absolute nightmare to deal with.
No other video I've seen has illustrated just how hard this all is. What he's describing is a full time job. How do you have your own life? You are basically her parent and you can't screw up or she'll cheat on you. There should be no shame if you can't take it on. The problem is they are so full of life, so free, so capable of giving you the thing that you've always wanted out of a woman, that it's almost equally hard to walk away. I suggest hard drugs. Just kidding.
Once you recognise that your partner has BPD, assess yourself if you really want to stay in the relationship. Without therapy, the relationship probably will not work out and you will loose precious time trapped in repetition compulsion. If you want kids or have more professional ambition, I don't recommend it. A relationship with a borderline will consume all of your energy and exposing children to an unstable parent is just irresponsible. So get out or make the relationship a life project, but without kids.
I am listening to these recommendations and it is soo overwhelming to be in this situation. The real question is whether it is really worth going through this. Okay, you do all this stuff and then you miss out on something and you are screwed, the worst person that exists, the source of her eternal pain. It's really no surprise that she feels this fear of being abandoned. The instinct of someone healthy would dictate to run as far as your eyes can see. This kind of relationship can make you sick and mentally inept. Ok, I am narcissistic too and sometimes avoidant, but honestly I think I'm so much more easy going than my partner. Borderline relationships are 10/10 on the scale of difficulty.
No offense but i dont think theres any hope once u split. i am borderline and there is nothing anyone can say or do to stop me. once im gonna act out its out
Who would be an ideal partner for BPD? I can't imagine Narcissist would be willing to take on such an undertaking on himself just to be with a borderline. It's a full time job seems like it. Can BPD have a long lasting relationship with a Narcissist, provided she is looking to get better mentally/emotionally? Or would it be like poring gasoline into a fire if she continues to choose Narcissists as she so often does?
The narcissist loves this job. He is needed as much as someone can possibly be. He is consumed. He is one of the few with a shell strong enough to survive the downfalls. Since he is never actually wrong.
When you say a borderline has the out of sight out of mind thinking cheating will always be a problem that's not fair for the one who is involved with and not suited for marriage.
Sam... what is the artwork in the thumbnail. Im intrigued as to whether the borderline type, and their partners, has been depicted mythologically/artistically. I remember reading something to do with borderline woman, metaphorically speaking, being half bird or half fish. Im interested in finding out why these associations are made.
Do these tips adequately apply to covert borderlines who have higher degrees of narcissistic defences and like you mentioned in another video transition to primary psychopaths in stressful moments of rejection/abandonment?
Is it not a contradiction of sorts when you are saying not to invalidate their feelings yet, we are also supposed to not take responsibility or blame for things that are coming from them or that we did not do, and/or trying to help them reality check and help them integrate their splitting and show them that the world is not black and white etc. In my case with my untreated BPD ex, these are precisely the things that cause her to split even more and fly into a rage and flee from me and cut off contact and give silent treatment etc. In other words a lot of her feelings are that I am doing all of these awful things and I'm an awful monster but if I try to remind her that no I'm not all bad and that she was with me for 3 years and we had lots of good times and I was a good partner to her etc.... Or if I try to gently remind her that she is responsible for her behavior for example the silent treatments and various forms of abusive behavior towards me... This is precisely what causes her to get extremely angry and refuse to engage. In other words she holds every interaction hostage unless I will validate her distorted delusional accusations and blaming me for everything. How can I question her distorted perceptions and black and white thinking without her feeling invalidated? She's hypervigilant around invalidation and what she perceives as gaslighting, because any time I try to bring nuance and gray area to anything she claims I must be gaslighting her.
@@samvaknin thanks for your reply. I guess what I'm getting at is she in particular seems to be abnormally hypervigilant about invalidation, even for a borderline (?). I am extremely careful to reality test in a respectful manner but she views literally ANYTHING that could even remotely be seen as an attempt to get her to "question her reality" (as she puts it), as automatically a sign of malicious intent, gaslighting, an attempt at manipulation and invalidation of her feelings. She insists that me even having a different perception than her about anything and everything, automatically is an attempt to invalidate or gaslight her. She seems to see subjective perception as mutually exclusive where only one narrative can be true (hers) and any other narrative is therefore completely false with no validity. And all such things are framed as power struggles where only one version of reality can "win" and it's a zero sum game where to believe one means to disbelieve the other. She is forever demanding that I agree with her distorted picture of reality as a condition to even communicate with her at all. For example she has said that I "used to follow her around and scream at her all the time.". This is completely false and untrue. (If anything, it's a projection as she would do this at times). Yet if I push back and tell her that isn't how I remember it, she says "See you won't take accountability and that's why I don't want to talk to you". But how can I have accountability for things that are literally fictional? I can't bring myself to just lie and accept responsibility for things I know are fabrications. It seems like one of her main areas of distorted thinking/delusional perception has to do specifically with communication and attempts to get her to reality check. She seems to have a specific defense mechanism around precisely this area, communication, which seems to insulate her from acknowledging her BPD traits. She claimed me telling her I think she had BPD was ITSELF abusive and that she "only has C-PTSD" when clearly it's more than that (mom is diagnosed BPD, and both her mom and herself have all nine diagnostic criteria to some degree, and certain criteria to the extreme). She will even see things that are completely innocuous and not EVEN attempts at reality testing as somehow being invalidating attempts at controlling her or gaslighting her. For a typical example with her, normal casual or positive/polite suggestions that come up in regular conversation such as say, "Your paintings are really good! You should think about selling them on Etsy!", she will react to this as if it's a pressuring/controlling comment and she will reply angrily and hyper defensively even to things like that- "I don't need to be pressured to sell my paintings! I'm allowed to do what I want with my own paintings! Stop telling me what I need to do!". It's truly bizarre and exhausting and off-putting because nobody was saying it wasn't up to her, and obviously that was not the intent or spirit of what was being suggested-and it was in fact a compliment and there was no intent to compromise her agency whatsoever, but she still perceives it as such. Additionally she believes things can be objectively "pressuring" or "controlling" even IF the other person has zero controlling intent and doesn't want to compromise anyone's agency. She thinks it's somehow possible to have no intent to control another, yet still somehow ACT in controlling ways towards them (to me, this would seem a boundary issue ultimately, on HER part. If she feels certain things are attempts to control her, and the person doing them reports no controlling intent, then isn't that her responsibility and she can just refuse to allow those things to control her then?) I suppose this all means her BPD traits are just too extreme to work with? Until she gets some kind of treatment independently on her own? I wouldn't even know how to establish communication protocols since she's so hyper defensive and flees any such conversation.
@@danvorosmarty9854 I have had this EXACT experience. Reading your comments made me think we were with the same partner. I have recently, after trying every possible approach, to no avail. Came to the same heartbreaking conclusion. Until she obtains help, she has been in therapy for years but I fear only used to validate herself. I have to withdraw for my own safety and sanity. I pray 🙏 that she becomes self aware at some point and can heal. I see her pain and it deeply pains me. But I can no longer sacrifice myself. It was literally killing me.
@@DiogenesNephew thank you, yes I am long gone from that relationship! And thank the sweet Lord lol. Actually though just by chance I'm in the midst of her attempting a ridiculous new triangulation thing with a mutual co-worker of ours who she is now dating and they had been actively hiding it from me for months while she tried to dogwhistle to me that they were together (sending covert signals behind his back) blah blah blah. It's incredibly dysfunctional, she is truly one of the most toxic people I've ever encountered. It's very unfortunate that I still sometimes have to see her at work bc otherwise I'd never want to see her again. Hopefully one or the other will get a new job soon but I'm actually fine at this point bc Now that I understand her disorder it's much easier to not let her shenanigans affect me.
Why is it that people can not see their own personality disorder. Is it true that if you do not recognize or care enough to get personality disorder help you can't heal. Or even be happy.
I've ruined so many friendships and relationships with people I care about. I don't want to hurt anyone or make a fool of myself. It makes so much sense now. I have vivid memories of violent fights between my parents where one of them would always leave and at such a young age I was and still are traumatized that I'd never see one of them again. Now I'm always traumatized to lose anyone in my life, I hate what and how I've acted to other's. I want to be accountable and better. These videos taught me a lot about myself, I'm grateful I've found your work. Thank you. Just FYI I'm a 25 year old male.
Admittedly being with a borderline is a lot of hard work, since you are pretty much responsible for her emotional regulation and sense of self. And in a way the intimate partner can help the borderline become themselves and their own person, but only if the borderline is aware enough to accept this task and responsibility. However, it can be very rewarding and an extremely enriching relationship if both parties put the hard work in. Borderlines didn’t choose to be like this. It seems even worse if they act infantile but you have to be patient…
thank you for ONE KIND RESPONSE in the sea of meanness and judgement!
@@ChornaRealEstate if people dont understand you its because they dont want to understand. Its the same thing with yourself as well. Everyone is just trying to get revenge on others for what someone else did to them. Remember that you can get better for yourself and for others.
But, trust is a big issue when they lie and went hot/cold cycles. When they grow distant, I can't be sure if they are cyber-romancing. Because it seems like what they do in my case.
It's hard to deal with a person you know is sick when they push/pull and cheat. I tried everything to help my wife. In the end I got discarded. I know she will try to get back with me, but the trauma she has done is too much.
Wonderful comment. Problem is most are not aware or refuse to acknowledge this or seek help. I have been in a relationship with one who has teh quiet form for nearly 20 years. For 18 years i put up with this. Was a caretaker and probably codependent. But then it got too much and I found myself and boy have things been volatile since. I had to in order to retain my sense of self and self esteem. I was about to lose this. Not sure we’ll survive TBH. So very sad.
Me and my current girlfriend boderline were on the road in the Atacama desert and then she asked me to stop the car, I did, so she turned up the car stereo and turned the headlights on full volume, she climbed on the hood of my car and took off clothes while dancing. borderlines do these crazy things they drive men crazy in every way : love hate fury they make men awaken in them a sense of protection they are angelic, eternal young they are a devil sometimes. they are free but if they feel they have been rejected or feel envy they destabilize their own emotions but it doesn't last long. they will addict you! I think they are the best women of course I also have a certain narcissism too
Same here. She turned up the music and got on the roof dancing extremely provocatively. She is an absolute joy.
I am a borderline female. When i was young, very young, batween the ages of 2 and up until i stopped giving the strong desperate reaction my mother wanted, my mom would play dead. She'd be gone. My mom kept dying from the age of 2 until i stopped reacting. I stopped reacting at around 8/9 years old. She enjoyed the sound of my desperate aggrieved cries when i thought shed left me. Another tactic was the silent treatment. Now as a child, when given the silent treatment by your mother, it feels like you've been deleted. You dont exist. This being a malignant narcissistic mother means there were many insults, gaslighting, verbal abuse of all sorts. All those words and emotions rang loud and heard deep in my little ears during the silent treatment. Somehow i felt enslaved, oppressed, unwanted, a defected child. I felt rejected. With came the feelings of unworthiness and shame. Now the deepest and most overwhelming emotion i felt hard and strong from the age of 7 was excruciating emotional PAIN. At 18, shame created a void of a deep EMPTINESS.
I am so sorry for the pain you've experienced in your life. I've never heard of a parent playing dead to their child, that's mind-boggling and plain horrifying. People are often cruel in the way they speak of people suffering from BPD, because of the ways they've been hurt by them. I hope you don't feel ashamed by the diagnosis, knowing how you've been set up by your mother to have these problems. I pray that you learn self-love to the point that you no longer have the fear of being unwanted or unworthy. I pray that you find peace and the past mistreatment will no longer sting when you remember it. I hope that you find people who will treat you gently.
I'm so very sorry you experienced such unimaginable horror. You deserved NONE of this trauma. The earth knows your terror and honors your bravery. God bless you and be well.
Same. NPD mother. Never heard of someone else experiencing this.
Thank you so much for sharing. Went through the same thing. Can’t get the idea out of my head that she must have heard my crying myself to sleep and she didn’t come to suit me. Still working on myself and healing my inner child, grieving I didn’t have a mom at all. Wishing you lots of strength and love ❤️
Hugs, this must’ve been indescribable 😢❤
The best I've ever heard it described. "She wants to hurt you not in order to hurt you but for you to have a shared experience of her pain..." hurt with me heal with me so we can bond together. It explains so many of my romantic relationships I realize now. Thankyou so much for sharing these insightful videos!
Wouldn't that type of healing be a trauma bond though?
😊😊😊😊😊
😊😊 i 😊😊
@@wendi2819b😊 😊😊
I😊😊😊
I got goosebumps at one point when you were describing "Mirroring" the borderline's extreme behaviour. Before I even had a hunch of my girlfriend being "BPD" (neither I nor she had ever heard about it), I used to employ some of the techniques you're describing to calm down her tantrums. At one time, she was threatening to cut herself, and in order to "wake her up", I very cold-bloodedly took a fork and started scraping my arm with it; she snapped out of it immediately. It was not a particularly fun experience. Other times I would mirror the calculated verbal abuse she'd throw at me until her psychotic alter ego burned out and she snapped back into her regular self and say "what am I doing". I've literally endured dozens if not hundreds of these situations... Sadly, no amount of efforts, strategies and dispositions were enough to stabilize our relationship enough to be viable long-term; I've literally developed some serious triggers and anxieties myself to the point where being together is becoming intolerable. Only now she's beginning to acknowledge my suggestions to look into the BPD diagnosis and seek some adequate help, since 18 years in psychoanalitic therapy, although useful in many ways, has not brought her even an inch towards actual proper adult behaviour and fulfillment in life.
I also used to massage her forehead when she started getting emotional. It didn't solve anything in the long run but it did calm her down a lot on the moment.
That’s so sweet. 🙂
This is absolutely the best video about borderlines Ive ever found.
My wife of 10 years is borderline and if id watched this once a week for the last 10 years my relationship wouldnt be failing.
I have learned more from you in three days of watching your videos than I have listening to so called gurus for the past 2 yrs. Thank you sir!!
You are Brillaint.!! I also think you are a legend for surviving around borderline women for 35 yrs!!
Incredible work, Mr Vaknin. The descriptions of borderline character, are subtle and comprehensive. I can feel your emotion at the end of the video. And it shows your love, for borderline women, that I share with you.
Vaknin.
@@samvakninThanks. Correction made. I had a marvelous relation with a borderline woman, exactly as you describe. In the end, she was unstable, and when she noticed I was going to discover it, she decided to cheat, and walk away. Everything you said is real, even for women on the other side of the globe.
I think they should re-do all the Disney movies but switch out the romantic characters with borderlines, narcissists, anti-social disorder types, and maybe throw in a few schizoids and autistic persons. Then these kids might be more ready for the dysfunctional reality of adult romance. Surrender Dorothy.
This is genius
well, that's all well and good but kids these days see enough of that crap especially if they have single moms which is almost half of kids these days. they need realistic healthy models compared and contrasted against realistic unhealthy ones. The last thing we need is for this plan to backfire and little Sophie is imitating her favorite histrionic attractive princess in the Kroger's ok?
@@helenhoward5346 I think they are doing a lot better job lately. The older ones were not very realistic at all. I especially liked "Inside Out".
🤣
actually we should attribute their traits to the evil characters
“If not your cup of tea, then walk away….” I simple cannot with him!💯💕
20 yrs married to a bpd, with 6 kids; now I’m a single dad, and she’s facing life in prison after a drug binge.
I would say that the segment about supporting BPD during their psychopathic acting out sadly can ever work in a home environment. They weaponize everything, they assume worst lies and intentions when someone is doing what is humanly possible to remind them of love. Truly, this is beyond anything animalistic. It is a warped, volatile essence of dysregulation and chaos in the most vile sense.
Thank you Sam and all commenters. I will have to watch this several times, make notes, and do all this for myself as I have removed myself from every one except one person in my life. I am 69 years along and have suffered myself and everyone in my lifetime, diagnosed from teenager. The isolation is sometimes stifling but also gives me insight and direction to what to work on next. I am seeking professional help and running up against the obstacles of misdiagnosis like OCD, ADHD, and refuse to take their meds. DBT and CBT seems hard to get through to diagnosticians that don't understand. So I am deduced to self help books on these at the moment. Also Richard Grannon exercises for CPTSD, and bouts of daily journaling. I'm not consistent in any or all of these, thus the search for a therapist to represent some consistency. Your lectures and seminars are priceless and provide not only amazing understanding, but a bar set for what I am to expect in therapist attributes. I bring your introject with me to these sessions.
I am of similar age. There was next to no mental health support in rural America when we grew up plus the stigma and shame was off the charts! We could never foreseen the phenomena of TH-cam as a resource for healing those early wounds. I like the homeostasis I've built living on my own. I applaud you still seeking therapy to find healing. It's never too late to live your best life!❤️
I find me🍭self 🤝bestest👭here😻💪💜🎀👑👠🍷🔮🌹🎁💋
No one should have to live this way in a relationship!
bless you, this is a wealth of great knowledge. I'm 1 year in and have been learning all I can but have paid the piper as well. It's certainly one of the hardest relationships I've had but her love makes it all worth it and I always tell her that. I have never been loved by anyone the way you do.
Or we can just ram pins into our eye balls - It's a fool's errand intimately loving such an individual.
Yes, there is no consistency in behaviour, no follow through , identity crisis, instability
I find the similarities between BPD and heightened RSD in ADHD mixed with long term exposure to trauma like C-PTSD quite astonishing, to say the least.
Similarities of symptoms listed below.
_Please debate with me & don't hate on me_
I'm curious about this.
*BPD:* Borderline Personality Disorder
_Emotional dysregulation + Impulsiveness + All or nothing + Expecting rejection + Rejection sensitivity + People pleasing + Anxiety + Distressed dissociations + Distorted lens + Panic/anger attacks + Reassurance relying + Trust issues + Addictions + Obsessions_
*ADHD:* Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder
_Emotional Dysregulation + Impulsiveness + All or nothing_
*RSD:* Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria
_Expecting rejection + Rejection sensitivity + People pleasing + Anxiety + Distressed dissociations + Distorted lens + Panic/anger attacks + Reassurance relying + Trust issues + Addictions + Obsessions_
Fear of rejection, criticism, inadequacy, deception and isn’t being abandoned by someone actually the worst kind of rejection there is?
*Unstable self-image:*
This becomes an *RSD* issue if you're more invested in constantly trying to please others than to discover who you are as an individual.
_tastes, likes, dislikes, values, beliefs etc._
I have ADHD and RSD, I married and had a child with a woman who has BPD and OCD. We got locked down together over COVID, 1/2 truths, 100 white lies a day, gaslighting, manipulation, intermittent reinforcement, cycles of ideation and vilification, I saw the psychopathy many times, it felt sadistic. Then I left. It was a perfect storm of pain and disaster, pushed me to the absolute breaking point. She took custody of my child and created false accusations, spread rumor's throughout my work networks and friends, destroyed me financially. The loss of time with my daughter has been the most painful experience of my life. I would rather be beaten by a gang of men with baseball bats, than go through the pain this woman can cause.
I do understand SV's points here, we are now divorced and we have started talking again. I feel tempted to see if reconciliation is possible, Sometimes I feel strong enough to deal with it, sometimes, it feels too much. I wish that our family could have worked.
I appreciate you ... Your wrapping together your detailed analysis with what the experience feels like! 2 borderlines together - what a once in a lifetime experience for me. Never before, never since.
The bottling up of emotions it's so true. Thank you for this video it's very informative ways to use a borderline
Yet another superb video! I think that everything you outlined can be helpful to anyone who loves and cares for a Borderline person, whether as an intimate partner, friend, or family member These skills, tools, and the framework you provided can help engender compassion and understanding.
"Do not let her..." lol.
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Thank you for this video. I watched it as a borderline wife. And the last few minutes of you explaining the prize being worth the price helped me see those aspects of myself that I always tend to forget. I'm not all bad all the time and I definitely don't mean to be that much effort to be involved with. I have a wonderful husband who tries so hard and it makes me feel so bad for him. I wish he'd just give up on me and move on with our girls, so they can live happily, no more egg shell walking..... but he stays🤷♀️..... thank you for those last few minutes especially 🖤
Having a BPD narc gf is pointless. They will break your heart.
What a dangerous and toxic thing to say. I think it's more accurate to say that about toxic people who don't want to heal, in general. And NPD are BPD are different. Idk if you can be both so easily. Narcissists are horrible, but even they are capable if they want to change. I'd never be with a narcissist. It's be able to with most anyone who agreed to work on themselves. Sorry, I'm just defensive because my sister is BPD and she's really misunderstood and very sweet. As her favorite person, I know it's hard to handle her. But you just have to realize it's mostly cptsd and learn how to support someone in that way, if you have the motivation to love them and stay. They're just a lot of work because their parents never taught them better.
@@DelphineTheWorstBladeEver I tried everything.The rage and the disrespect was too much for me.
@@DelphineTheWorstBladeEverI'm sorry but they will suck the life out of you and leave you an empty shell.
I'm a borderline that's becoming a reiki practicioner and when the treatment broke the illusion I was living in, I've became disabled with PMDD and have cried for a year now on and off. Lost my ability to feel music. He is right in saying if we face who we are we wouldn't survive because i feel like im dying literally. Body is breaking down. It's not because of facing who I am though even though that's hard e.g.. realising I'm a people pleaser. But it's what people have done to me for 30 years. Psychological & emotional abuse that's made me into someone that enables people to disrespect me & boundarys where I do nothing until i split which I see as me having a moment of facing what i brush under the carpet so i blow. Knowing I've not honered myself & the people who say they love me abuse me. What I'm not surviving is seing relationships for what they are. (Being only ok if I shrink myself, no boundary, no love, codependancy, a illusion ) bpd for me is reaction to emotional abuse. Splitting is me facing what i suppress all at once where I assume that the person must be a narcassist given information. So I rage as im dealing with a psychopath in my mind) pmdd makes me face the truth. The more my emotionally abusive bf heals the less the pmdd makes me think hes bad. We attract narcassistic people so we will act accordingly. 30 years of fighting peoples gaslighting & tactics that is unconscious in them. And making sure I don't become a hypocrite fighting against what I'm guilty of myself.
You are not alone🕊 any change breaks habits and patterns. Get up and repeat. Your relationship with yourself fix 1st all day everyday 🙏🏼
Thank you for sharing
Always the victim...
@@bloom_meister9541
I shouldn't entertain you, & yet:
I was moved by her comment & then enter, you 🙄 & NOW, I am feeling fiercely loyal to the original commenter, though i dont know either of you, i can see clearly that you are needing to adjust that stick up your arse, & learn some manners or common decency. It's quite gross, to scavenge the internet, looking to kick someone in a moment of vulnerability. It's not cute. Did it make you feel better? (This is intended as rhetorical question). Take care
@@bloom_meister9541 also, she was very self aware here. Take notes.
Yes very addictive! After 4 relationships with BPD women it’s hard to go back to the less intense love of a more stable person. It’s such a balance..is the amazing pure love worth the energy it takes to maintain the relationship & yourself? Still don’t know the answer to that but damn I’ve been to the stars & the gutter many times
*I practically did everything told in this video.*
Guys, only different thing happens at the end she leaves you but makes a "closing speech".
Hell, I had no idea she had BPD. My problem was I never had a gf, she was first and I don't have any attachment problems. Her unacceptable behaviours almost made me leave her, however she insisted to be together causing drama.
My borderline ex is somewhat on the severe spectrum even with the proof of her emotional cheating she called them "friends" and the things she was saying to them were "jokes". Everytime she verbally assualted me and i stood up for myself she said she just cant talk to me because im so "sensitve" and cant take a "joke". Its all just a big game to her. She got very cruel towards the end. She would text me as if i just didnt understand how emotions work and I just dont understand while sending multiple hysterical laughter emojis as if i were just beneath her...because i just "wouldnt get it" even if she sat me down and explained to me how she met (literally most of these ppl shes never even met in real life and were just "cyber friends") these ppl and how their relationship worked..completely nuts
Was her name Crystal?
That's exactly how my ex was, and when I confront him he'd get very abusive and ruthless i thought he was a psychopath, i stayed because i knew he was just deeply hurt and had to make me see it, he went to therapy turned out it was BPD, things got better he gave me the best times of my life like sam said it was worth the price untill he stopped therapy it all went haywire again i had to leave, eight years later and i still regret it though...
You never know by the second how things change. One minute you are turning in for bed exhausted after walking on eggshells, then if you are not 100% mentally present for a sincere "good night" or you are not attentative for 1 second, there is screaming and raging and you are begging for her to forgive you.
Your borderline description is very interesting for a stranger in this field like me. It seems to fit with "a few" women I met in life, regarding the general aspects of borderline. Especially a girl I once knew. She was beautiful and awesome, a great person actually. I wanted to date her, she told me no, we became sort of friends for a while. Then I frustrated her on something, but not intentionally, as I remember. She got angry with me among friends, and there was no fix. I was a toxic narcissistic guy at the time. As you mention I have to agree her anger towards me was to hurt me and share the emotional burden of our situation going wrong. But I felt it was also part an act, cause I guess I never truly knew her. We parted ways for a good while. Then when we saw each other again, we could only look at each other from distance. Thank you for your very insightful rich talks.
Prof Sam LOVES borderline women 😂
Why do you say that? Haha whats so good about borderline women?
Once they get under your skin, watch out. There's just something about them. They can be very childlike and they bring out one's protective instinct. They are challenging and exciting...
He's a freak!!!
My favorite talk of his, it’s a love letter in essence
Like Anna Karenina - blaming acting out with Vronsky on her demons. (As it was in a movie :) ). Amazing video. Thank you.
9 years with him. I'm exhausted. He disguarded me 2 months ago. I can't get over it. Most intense relationship of my life.
This is the best description I have found on borderline to date, and it's his birthday...I'm so upset.I wish I'd seen this years ago, then maybe I'd never have lost him.
I would take him back in a heart beat, but he will never talk to me again. He ran back to his friend (whom he'd discarded for me - not that I'd wanted him to)
He improved in some ways towards the end, it was almost as if we were swapping places...
Thank you Doctor. This has helped me to make sense of the best roller coaster of my life.
Alice: why would you take someone back like this who you found exhausting and intense?
@@escalera601 because borderlines are the opposite of each (love and hate) on the spectrum.
When it's bad, it's BAD, but when it's good it's GOOD. It's like an addiction. They train you to want the high (or the deep intense feeling of happiness and love) which they make you believe you cannot find with another person.
You spend ALL your time walking the eggshells and working to keep getting the GOOD. By human nature, we want what we've worked for.
It's sick, it's twisted and they KNOW what they're doing.
I miss the highs it's true, but overall I'm steady now and MUCH better off without him.
Think of it this way, someone who was addicted to say, alcohol, drugs, sex, food, whatever, will miss it at times, but they know it's destructive, so hopefully stay clear - same thing.
Best advice is, stay the f away from borderlines, NEVER get involved in the first place.
Unfortunately, most people don't know it's a rollercoaster till they're half way through.
It's never too late to get off tho. Good luck with your journey, stay true to yourself and who you were before you met the thing that WILL destroy your life/relationships.
@@escalera601 and there's NOTHING you can do that will ever be good enough for people like that.
Maybe you are a narcisst or bordeline too. Watch Sam's other videos.
4 years with a border . 1 passion + 1 Love + 1 crisis + 1 caos
This is me to a T!!! I am so shocked I’ve never felt so understood .. thank you 😊
If you want to stop a vice. Film yourself doing it.
If its disgusting you, youll stop.
11:15 For 20 years I managed to do this, but the thing that wrecked it all is that for those same 20 years, my BPD father-in-law was directly competing against me for the "pivotal role". In the end, he won. In his late 70s, he was able to break her with his victimization/woe-is-me guilt tripping. I believe that since he is the original sinner that caused her trauma to begin with, it was futile for me to even believe I had a chance against his evil hand. I could not convince her to remember the horrible ways her toxic family treated her in the past, so I could not give her continuity with me.
"Never, for the sake of peace and quiet, deny your own experiences or convictions." (or something like that - Dag Hammershield)
Let's not forget, these videos are to encourage understanding not judgement. We ALL have qualities about us that are challenging to others
I like this sentiment. Very difficult to hold, when one is in devaluation. In addition possibly harmful. However very good point and an important yet dissonant point for those who love borderlines. Thank you. 😊
Bingo! Bc the title has me like 😬
@@sneakerhead567 It's all bullshit regardless of it's source. The human experience isn't a picnic for anyone. Character is built thru the learning of tolerance via understanding. I don't seek to persuade others to have the same opinion as me nor the same feelings that I do. God Bless
Best video! You described me perfectly and I pray that my bf thinks I’m worth it.
I would feel bad to tell somebody to do all these things for me.... Sounds like a full time unfair job. I get them with how deep I love but my emotions always cause problems.... I guess I should stay single until I can control my thoughts and emotions huh 😅. GREAT VIDEO.
IKR Same!!!🙄
The treasure at the end of the rainbow is death!
Borderline +somatic narcissist = very painfull relationship.
You're absolutely right.. I have borderline personality disorder..my last bf was a somatic narcissist.. it was a nightmare. .. the fighting.. the pain .. the hurt .. therapy for the past 11 months is helping me .
Endless suffering that ends in CPTSD. Been there.
It seems like all treatment is the responsibility of others, not the borderline. It seems like 24 hour babysitting of the borderline. It seems that healing is the responsibility of others which makes me wonder if that’s healing at all? Does the borderline take responsibility for their actions or is this constant monitoring on the behalf of others?
Interesting, I took 41 notes and listened through the entire video as if I am her partner (I am her parent). Very challenging relationship and the end of the lecture is very romantic . Thanks
Have not watched but I definitely have described my past BPD partners as Sirens. Most definitely. They are probably what they greek were talking about.
This is my favourite video. I felt the care Dr. Vaknin has in this regard. So true as well if I look at what has helped me in therapy and in life, as a person who was in the least a budding borderline.
You need to live the borderline. No one has to deal with crazy and / or abuse.
Life is too short, and you don't owe them.
Is thus kate
I wish I’d have watched this video some years ago, to help him in the right time. Now he is deeply grounded in the black hole and won’t listen 😢💔 don’t know what I can do more to help him and in the same moment try to help myself.
Amazing.. I understand this perfectly I’m not sure I can commit to this I need to look after myself and my happiness
It's crazy how accurate this is
goddammit, comrade Sam, thank you so much for this. im a third of the way through and already i know this is exactly what i needed after that last video i watched, that left me feeling a bit hopeless. ❤❤❤
As a bpd woman I love the ending, such a great video
The non BPD partner does NOT love the ending LOOL !
why would anyone want to maintain a relationship with a damaged person of this sort. I would rather be alone and sane
never again am I allowing such a toxic individual in my life
never again...I thought narcissists were bad...bpd sufferers can be equally as bad and toxic
Property gets damaged, people get injured.
The sex was unbelievable 😂
@@cowboynohorsefacts
I never do the pull away for any other reason than, I’m seeing things that make me believe they are going to leave me, so I want to avoid that pain and need to try and leave them before they can leave me
That’s sad.
I cried. I hope someday someone will love and understand me and that he will be able to handle me.
I promise it won't happen. You people are a waste of time
You deserve that! ❤️
People already got enough on their plate these days. Life is hard enough. Work on yourself please. Don't expect anyone to 'handle you' but handle the world together, with him.
You're waiting for someone designed by God for you hahahah. First you'd have to be a princess
Keep working on yourself to become more self aware and then actively start changing your lifestyle and find a spiritual path. You will learn to handle yourself God Willing and then you will find true love. Best of luck! Don't stop trying.
When I would go out I used to say "I didn't do it, it was elissa."
M(elissa) she is within me.
Also, I used to wonder why amy winehouse albums just spoke to me, I get it now. Thank you Sam.
Thank you Dr Vaknin. You are always so insightful.
How is it that the borderlime worries about being abandoned by their lover when they have object inconstancy? It seems they should not be thinking of their romantic lover at all to even worry about being abandoned if they lack object constancy
Also, putting in all this work and effort to make the relationship work seems like the perdect recipe to develop codependancy. Not sure following this recipe will lead to a healthy relationship. Always appreciate your videos on the topic of borderlines. Thank you for all your efforts.
The borderline suffers from intolerable abandonment anxiety. So, she leverages her object inconstancy to preempt abandonment: she abandons first (often by cheating).
@@samvaknin or pushing the partner away. This is what I do
This is very useful to me! Thanks very much!
I spent 30 years surfing this wave, from incredible high to another, with gusto! Eventually, it was time to stop and my own sanity improved 10,000 times. While they were worth it, in the end, slowing down to 25 mph saved my life.
Ladies... There's hope! That's longer than the average marriage nowadays and he seems ... Fine? :')
@@megankate4722 it wasn’t one over a long time. It was a selection. A type if you will... by choice. Until...
Ah I see :) in that case❤
th-cam.com/video/oIFLtNYI3Ls/w-d-xo.html
This video is extremely insightful. However, by attempting to employ all the techniques mentioned, anyone involved with a borderline is essentially abandoning themself to figure out the borderline’s 24/7 mind fuggery.
That man would be me...
...Just kidding, it’s been 6 months since our breakup, I would totally take he back. Being with her is equal to the pain of not.
@@CraigBozUK Beware the anger of a patient man.
Dear Prof. Vankin, you are superb
what a masterpiece.
What an amazing and personal tutorial. Thank you.
I vividly remember the first time I said something mean to someone I was in my early twenties. I just could not control myself it would not stop coming out of my mouth. I feel sorry for any person who falls in love with one of us. My reactions have become more explosive as I have grown old and it has scared me. I am using some of the techniques you spoke of doctor thank you so much.
Thank you very much for the validation. I’ve found that when properly reparenting my borderline with love, he has matured immensely. He’s now much more vulnerable. As you said, they need constant reminders, reassurance, etc. Once I depersonalized his behaviors, I was able to be more in tune to areas where he has been failed by his parents and can then assist and retrain him with unconditional love and boundaries and provide new perspectives.
Talk about a treasure. This man.⬆️🙏💗
Life is too short to be in a relationship like this, I promise you. Avoid dysfunctional people. Seek out healthy people for relationships and friendships.
I couldn't have done it. I don't have the skills, the presence of mind. I would react in the moment because all that the borderline is, is what I am not. I am rational in thought, fair play is important. I would not have succeeded.
Borderline women gotta be top 3 worst to get involved with in any relationship. They’re the most giving, loving, freaky, cooperative and friendly at 1st but without any warning they’ll flip and tear your world apart and will crush your spirit. Save your sanity fellas, stay clear of these types of women. You’ll be a lot happier.
Nobody taught me about such things (or anything useful really) as a boy, but I'm absolutely never dealing with one ever again. They are the worst--an absolute nightmare to deal with.
No other video I've seen has illustrated just how hard this all is. What he's describing is a full time job. How do you have your own life? You are basically her parent and you can't screw up or she'll cheat on you. There should be no shame if you can't take it on. The problem is they are so full of life, so free, so capable of giving you the thing that you've always wanted out of a woman, that it's almost equally hard to walk away. I suggest hard drugs. Just kidding.
Meth anyday
Once you recognise that your partner has BPD, assess yourself if you really want to stay in the relationship. Without therapy, the relationship probably will not work out and you will loose precious time trapped in repetition compulsion. If you want kids or have more professional ambition, I don't recommend it. A relationship with a borderline will consume all of your energy and exposing children to an unstable parent is just irresponsible. So get out or make the relationship a life project, but without kids.
You made cry at the end...thank you ❤️❤️❤️
You are transforming my life. Thank very much. 🙏🙏🙏
Shape shifters, unfortunately true.
So True!!! When a borderline loves you!! It’s like no other feeling in the world!! No one loves like a bpd woman.
That's awful. I spent almost 3 decades with one. Since teenage years. Way before mental health accusations were handed out like candy. And everyone
the juice is not worth the squeeze
I am listening to these recommendations and it is soo overwhelming to be in this situation. The real question is whether it is really worth going through this. Okay, you do all this stuff and then you miss out on something and you are screwed, the worst person that exists, the source of her eternal pain. It's really no surprise that she feels this fear of being abandoned. The instinct of someone healthy would dictate to run as far as your eyes can see.
This kind of relationship can make you sick and mentally inept. Ok, I am narcissistic too and sometimes avoidant, but honestly I think I'm so much more easy going than my partner. Borderline relationships are 10/10 on the scale of difficulty.
They are everything and nothing!
It's not your job to fix people, get help if you find it's a pattern in your life
Run!
46:22 she’s worth it? She destroyed me. Thanks
Pure Alchemy🤝Harmony restored
No offense but i dont think theres any hope once u split. i am borderline and there is nothing anyone can say or do to stop me. once im gonna act out its out
split from a relationship or how do you mean?
7:53 is it the same with friendship? if borderliner didn't speak to her friend for a weak she can forget about their friendship?
Yes.
Who would be an ideal partner for BPD? I can't imagine Narcissist would be willing to take on such an undertaking on himself just to be with a borderline. It's a full time job seems like it. Can BPD have a long lasting relationship with a Narcissist, provided she is looking to get better mentally/emotionally? Or would it be like poring gasoline into a fire if she continues to choose Narcissists as she so often does?
The narcissist loves this job. He is needed as much as someone can possibly be. He is consumed. He is one of the few with a shell strong enough to survive the downfalls. Since he is never actually wrong.
Narc is the worst for this. Sam has videos about it.
Codependents are best for those with BPD
Who can love me and do all these efforts to be with me I felt bad about myself but actually everything u said is so true
When you say a borderline has the out of sight out of mind thinking cheating will always be a problem that's not fair for the one who is involved with and not suited for marriage.
Life ain't fair
its true. i cheated on my ex many times and felt no remorse at all.
@@WhyNot-cg2bi That is unfortunately true.
@@DesireeZeidel Do you mind if I ask you a personal question about it?
@@Youbarkimeow go ahead
46:30
You the Enemy.
Do not be her therapist
Excellent analysis!
To be honest. Don’t enable the borderline and the borderline will try to heal- try-😂
Sam... what is the artwork in the thumbnail. Im intrigued as to whether the borderline type, and their partners, has been depicted mythologically/artistically. I remember reading something to do with borderline woman, metaphorically speaking, being half bird or half fish. Im interested in finding out why these associations are made.
Perhaps you may be referring to the mythical term of "Siren"?
Just avoid human relationships and these problems all disappear.
Do these tips adequately apply to covert borderlines who have higher degrees of narcissistic defences and like you mentioned in another video transition to primary psychopaths in stressful moments of rejection/abandonment?
After the wild awful, intense, nightmare relationship of 10 years im afraid I'm never going to be content with normal ever again
For real.
Is it not a contradiction of sorts when you are saying not to invalidate their feelings yet, we are also supposed to not take responsibility or blame for things that are coming from them or that we did not do, and/or trying to help them reality check and help them integrate their splitting and show them that the world is not black and white etc.
In my case with my untreated BPD ex, these are precisely the things that cause her to split even more and fly into a rage and flee from me and cut off contact and give silent treatment etc.
In other words a lot of her feelings are that I am doing all of these awful things and I'm an awful monster but if I try to remind her that no I'm not all bad and that she was with me for 3 years and we had lots of good times and I was a good partner to her etc.... Or if I try to gently remind her that she is responsible for her behavior for example the silent treatments and various forms of abusive behavior towards me... This is precisely what causes her to get extremely angry and refuse to engage.
In other words she holds every interaction hostage unless I will validate her distorted delusional accusations and blaming me for everything.
How can I question her distorted perceptions and black and white thinking without her feeling invalidated? She's hypervigilant around invalidation and what she perceives as gaslighting, because any time I try to bring nuance and gray area to anything she claims I must be gaslighting her.
Respectful reality testing is never invalidating. You need to develop communication protocols.
@@samvaknin thanks for your reply.
I guess what I'm getting at is she in particular seems to be abnormally hypervigilant about invalidation, even for a borderline (?).
I am extremely careful to reality test in a respectful manner but she views literally ANYTHING that could even remotely be seen as an attempt to get her to "question her reality" (as she puts it), as automatically a sign of malicious intent, gaslighting, an attempt at manipulation and invalidation of her feelings.
She insists that me even having a different perception than her about anything and everything, automatically is an attempt to invalidate or gaslight her. She seems to see subjective perception as mutually exclusive where only one narrative can be true (hers) and any other narrative is therefore completely false with no validity.
And all such things are framed as power struggles where only one version of reality can "win" and it's a zero sum game where to believe one means to disbelieve the other.
She is forever demanding that I agree with her distorted picture of reality as a condition to even communicate with her at all.
For example she has said that I "used to follow her around and scream at her all the time.". This is completely false and untrue. (If anything, it's a projection as she would do this at times). Yet if I push back and tell her that isn't how I remember it, she says "See you won't take accountability and that's why I don't want to talk to you". But how can I have accountability for things that are literally fictional? I can't bring myself to just lie and accept responsibility for things I know are fabrications.
It seems like one of her main areas of distorted thinking/delusional perception has to do specifically with communication and attempts to get her to reality check.
She seems to have a specific defense mechanism around precisely this area, communication, which seems to insulate her from acknowledging her BPD traits.
She claimed me telling her I think she had BPD was ITSELF abusive and that she "only has C-PTSD" when clearly it's more than that (mom is diagnosed BPD, and both her mom and herself have all nine diagnostic criteria to some degree, and certain criteria to the extreme).
She will even see things that are completely innocuous and not EVEN attempts at reality testing as somehow being invalidating attempts at controlling her or gaslighting her.
For a typical example with her, normal casual or positive/polite suggestions that come up in regular conversation such as say, "Your paintings are really good! You should think about selling them on Etsy!", she will react to this as if it's a pressuring/controlling comment and she will reply angrily and hyper defensively even to things like that- "I don't need to be pressured to sell my paintings! I'm allowed to do what I want with my own paintings! Stop telling me what I need to do!".
It's truly bizarre and exhausting and off-putting because nobody was saying it wasn't up to her, and obviously that was not the intent or spirit of what was being suggested-and it was in fact a compliment and there was no intent to compromise her agency whatsoever, but she still perceives it as such. Additionally she believes things can be objectively "pressuring" or "controlling" even IF the other person has zero controlling intent and doesn't want to compromise anyone's agency. She thinks it's somehow possible to have no intent to control another, yet still somehow ACT in controlling ways towards them (to me, this would seem a boundary issue ultimately, on HER part. If she feels certain things are attempts to control her, and the person doing them reports no controlling intent, then isn't that her responsibility and she can just refuse to allow those things to control her then?)
I suppose this all means her BPD traits are just too extreme to work with? Until she gets some kind of treatment independently on her own? I wouldn't even know how to establish communication protocols since she's so hyper defensive and flees any such conversation.
@@danvorosmarty9854 I have had this EXACT experience. Reading your comments made me think we were with the same partner. I have recently, after trying every possible approach, to no avail. Came to the same heartbreaking conclusion. Until she obtains help, she has been in therapy for years but I fear only used to validate herself. I have to withdraw for my own safety and sanity. I pray 🙏 that she becomes self aware at some point and can heal. I see her pain and it deeply pains me. But I can no longer sacrifice myself. It was literally killing me.
@@bowpow00 so sorry for your experience. I definitely understand and it's pretty hellish.
@@DiogenesNephew thank you, yes I am long gone from that relationship! And thank the sweet Lord lol. Actually though just by chance I'm in the midst of her attempting a ridiculous new triangulation thing with a mutual co-worker of ours who she is now dating and they had been actively hiding it from me for months while she tried to dogwhistle to me that they were together (sending covert signals behind his back) blah blah blah. It's incredibly dysfunctional, she is truly one of the most toxic people I've ever encountered. It's very unfortunate that I still sometimes have to see her at work bc otherwise I'd never want to see her again. Hopefully one or the other will get a new job soon but I'm actually fine at this point bc Now that I understand her disorder it's much easier to not let her shenanigans affect me.
Why is it that people can not see their own personality disorder. Is it true that if you do not recognize or care enough to get personality disorder help you can't heal. Or even be happy.