Great advice Andy ; well explained within a perfectly timed video. Too many educators make it too complicated (too long) for the less experienced and novice. A big problem with getting colours "right" is many don't give themselves time to learn how to "read" the photo on the screen . From my distant minilab days; the girls are better than the boys at reading colours. Back then it was read the negative to print positive colours. In later years; if a printed photo was returned "wrong" from a Pro lab , it was mostly my misreading colours when editing. No calibration tool would fix what I misread. Back then , I manually set my screen with Fuji calibration photos and digital images. Generally the printed photo was basically the same as on the computer . Clients would very unlikely see it but I always got another photo printed for them . Another problem is most can not remember the actually colour they photographed apart from it was "blue" or "green" or ........ What colour is the blue sky ?. Maybe you and your students might try this . Go to the local paint shop and get a selection of a colour cards ; lets say blue because skies can be a pain in the butt. At home, pick out one card (or more) and memorize the colour before putting it back with the others . Put all the cards away for a time ; at least a day or more, and then pick out the card from the rest ---- no cheating :) . Now do it all again, try outside/inside lighting . The idea is to prove we should put our edited photo away for a time and then revisit it with fresh eyes. Doesn't matter when cyberspace sees our photo; often for just a few seconds . Some top shelve competition photographers can takes weeks and even months to make their near perfect photo . Peter Eastway (ask google) told about the months he can take . Sorry to invade
Cheers Ian. Some great tips there. And you're right about our memories regarding colours. I often take a few shots with my iPhone at the same time, not because it's any more reliable at colour balance but because it's great to have a range to pick from. :)
Kind of in limbo at the moment - half moved in - the painters got delayed by a month which is why the walls are still bare and there's no photography hung on them. Couple of weeks it should look a lot different. :)
To get the wb and tint perfect, I turn the saturation and vibrance all the way up, then get it to look as “natural” or cool\warm as I want for that photo. And turn saturation and tint down to more manageable levels again. Can’t remember who I saw doing it first like that, was another TH-camr tho. But I’ve stuck with that and really like I know exactly what lurks deep in the max saturated universe even tho I’m only using 10% of it. . 🧐
Ideally I try to use WB for "science" and other downstream color tools for "art", i.e., the WB is set once foundationally to reflect reality, then the other tools (color grading included) are used to adjust for artistic reasons, often in a local editing context. Sometimes I'll use color grading tools to, e.g., cool down shadows and / or warm up highlights. And of course all this interacts with tonal adjustments, local contrast, etc. Nice clear explanation in the video!
Hi Andy. Nice new office! I don't use any of the colour grading tools. I often use WB to shift the image to something reminiscent of how I remember the scene. I have a form of red-green colour blindness. This makes this whole area quite tricky for me. Also the Canon 6D has good colours straight from Raw. I have however started to use colour saturation and vibrance locally, perhaps to slightly enhance the colours of a main landscape subject while slightly desaturating the colours of the background. I think this is a good analogue for bringing the selectivity one sees with the human eye to the photograph, and can be a powerful yet subtle way of editing. I do get my son to check my edit before uploading though, just in case (colours!)
@@Andyhutchinson It's a citation from memory. Ansel Adams once expressed something to this meaning when he was asked how much his images diverted from the original negatives. A cult within the zone system defended a 'no manipulation' line, only allowing a standard (calibrated) process, including exposure and development of the paper. This was of course a rigid and useless standpoint. In fact, as he showed in his later books, AA manipulated his copies to exactly the limit where nobody would be able to tell, if typical editing like dodging and burning had been done - or not.
lol - it is actually in the background of all my old videos too. Not sure it'll stay there as I haven't fully moved into the office yet because it's still waiting to get painted. :)
Totally agree with the direction and sound advice that's the way to go. U confirming.
Cheers Ian :)
Good advice again thanks Andy…
No worries :)
Good advice, as usual. For me, it's "all things in moderation".
Very true. :)
Great advice Andy ; well explained within a perfectly timed video. Too many educators make it too complicated (too long) for the less experienced and novice. A big problem with getting colours "right" is many don't give themselves time to learn how to "read" the photo on the screen . From my distant minilab days; the girls are better than the boys at reading colours. Back then it was read the negative to print positive colours. In later years; if a printed photo was returned "wrong" from a Pro lab , it was mostly my misreading colours when editing.
No calibration tool would fix what I misread. Back then , I manually set my screen with Fuji calibration photos and digital images.
Generally the printed photo was basically the same as on the computer . Clients would very unlikely see it but I always got another photo printed for them .
Another problem is most can not remember the actually colour they photographed apart from it was "blue" or "green" or ........ What colour is the blue sky ?.
Maybe you and your students might try this . Go to the local paint shop and get a selection of a colour cards ; lets say blue because skies can be a pain in the butt. At home, pick out one card (or more) and memorize the colour before putting it back with the others . Put all the cards away for a time ; at least a day or more, and then pick out the card from the rest ---- no cheating :) . Now do it all again, try outside/inside lighting . The idea is to prove we should put our edited photo away for a time and then revisit it with fresh eyes. Doesn't matter when cyberspace sees our photo; often for just a few seconds . Some top shelve competition photographers can takes weeks and even months to make their near perfect photo . Peter Eastway (ask google) told about the months he can take .
Sorry to invade
Cheers Ian. Some great tips there. And you're right about our memories regarding colours. I often take a few shots with my iPhone at the same time, not because it's any more reliable at colour balance but because it's great to have a range to pick from. :)
Thanks! Good to see you in your new office! Hope you're settling in comfortably. :)
Kind of in limbo at the moment - half moved in - the painters got delayed by a month which is why the walls are still bare and there's no photography hung on them. Couple of weeks it should look a lot different. :)
To get the wb and tint perfect, I turn the saturation and vibrance all the way up, then get it to look as “natural” or cool\warm as I want for that photo. And turn saturation and tint down to more manageable levels again. Can’t remember who I saw doing it first like that, was another TH-camr tho. But I’ve stuck with that and really like I know exactly what lurks deep in the max saturated universe even tho I’m only using 10% of it. . 🧐
Yea it's a cool tip. Simon D'Entroment did a video on it quite recently but he's definitely not the first.
Thanks for the excellent advice Andy 👍
No worries. :)
Ideally I try to use WB for "science" and other downstream color tools for "art", i.e., the WB is set once foundationally to reflect reality, then the other tools (color grading included) are used to adjust for artistic reasons, often in a local editing context. Sometimes I'll use color grading tools to, e.g., cool down shadows and / or warm up highlights. And of course all this interacts with tonal adjustments, local contrast, etc.
Nice clear explanation in the video!
Thanks mate - yep, pretty much the same here. :)
Hi Andy. Nice new office!
I don't use any of the colour grading tools. I often use WB to shift the image to something reminiscent of how I remember the scene. I have a form of red-green colour blindness. This makes this whole area quite tricky for me. Also the Canon 6D has good colours straight from Raw.
I have however started to use colour saturation and vibrance locally, perhaps to slightly enhance the colours of a main landscape subject while slightly desaturating the colours of the background.
I think this is a good analogue for bringing the selectivity one sees with the human eye to the photograph, and can be a powerful yet subtle way of editing. I do get my son to check my edit before uploading though, just in case (colours!)
Thanks mate. Sounds like a nice workflow for a natural look.
Some times I don't know what I want from a photo and starting playing with WB to guide me and some times works...
Absolutely. Same here. :)
"I don't try to make natural photographs - but I like to make my audience think I do."
Haha. Love it.
@@Andyhutchinson It's a citation from memory. Ansel Adams once expressed something to this meaning when he was asked how much his images diverted from the original negatives. A cult within the zone system defended a 'no manipulation' line, only allowing a standard (calibrated) process, including exposure and development of the paper. This was of course a rigid and useless standpoint. In fact, as he showed in his later books, AA manipulated his copies to exactly the limit where nobody would be able to tell, if typical editing like dodging and burning had been done - or not.
Good points - but what I'm most intrigued about is the new "power tower" over your left shoulder.
lol - it is actually in the background of all my old videos too. Not sure it'll stay there as I haven't fully moved into the office yet because it's still waiting to get painted. :)
@@Andyhutchinson It looks cool - what brand is it?
Company called Safemore make them - amzn.asia/d/59WzZ2Y
Good info.. sometimes wb is the first adjustment. I tend to do as little processing as possible. Rather be outside taking pictures
I hear you.
Some very sound ideas there. I often forget, and then have to restart the edit, because, the colours I have played with dont look right
Thanks Paul - yea, it's best to dial it in first. :)
Is the WB wrong in your video, or did you stay out in the sun for too long??!!
lol - just moved to a new office and repurposed my old colour grade - still trying to dial it in. :)
That's a boring explanation! I was thinking the hot Aussie sun was still too much for your pale English skin!!