I made a little mistake at the beginning of the video when I said 'damage per second'. This video focuses on firing speed. If you liked this kind of video than share it with your friends. Thanks for watching guys :) -Salty
bow has more dps on light targets, but on heavy targets you'll need a crossbow to pierce the armor, in any case late game is about the same as you said
another problem: the crossbow uses strength, the bow uses agility. since most close quarter weapons also use strength, it costs you less, in the end, to use a crossbow and that makes the crossbow superior.
@@TheDunestyler not really, only when u make a strenght/meele focused character. Your strength value is a factor for meele dmg calculation and dex for range dmg. So if u want the most ranged dmg u have to skill dex and therefore use bows. It's like how rapier requires only 50 dex for a 100 dmg it's for characters that use bows/ranged primarily and have next to no strength so the dmg of the weapon is really high to make up for that. It's the same for crossbows with dex
I amazed how much is in this "OLD GAME". So much charm. The world feels like a real place that doesnt care about you, but you can change that for bad or good. Awes9me vods man.
What contributes to this great "charm" is imo this fantastic music that they created for this game. Man, when I hear theme of Khorinis, nostalgia hits me hard af
As for damage. Bow is generally better as ALL ranged damage comes from Dex. Because you're pumping Dex for your bow anyway, you'll do damage on par or significantly more than even the best crossbow. But Crossbow is a fine secondary/first strike weapon for strength builds.
Damages comes not only from Dex but also skill level. And when you build your character for Strength because you prefer melee then Crossbow is better because you can at least draw a strong Crossbow then, while a bow would not even be equippable. Your damage won't be as good since you don't have Dex but this makes it possible to use range and melee when you're leveling up exclusively Str.
Hey there! It's good to see that someone still does such videos about g2. For gothic 1 and 2 the crossbow it's definitely more effective. The damage difference makes the crossbow a lot better as the shooting speed it's insignificant. In gothic 3 the crossbow it's just for appearance, being completely useless. Keep up the good work
but you need strength for crossbows. If you're going to invest in dexterity anyway then the better deal is the bow since you don't have to invest in strength. Crossbow is nice as a secondary weapon for strength builds, but if you're going to play ranged the whole game then the bow would be better.
yup therefore bow is always the better choice for the range perspective. But the crossbow is a usefull first strike weapon for strenght builds aswell so it has its purpose which is quite nice.
IDK, I just finished paladin one hand playthrough and I didnt had much space for upgrading dex on the way. Also I did it without Claw of Beliar because I thought for Paladin it is a no no and also this weapon is somewhat OP. So for Dex I will go bow for sure next time :)
Seen a lot of Gothic activity in my recomended lately... thought you were someone else... now i finally clicked and BAM, instant subscription :D good content m8
Another cool video :) when I was playing as bowman I've found out that even if you pass 100% on bow skill, your shooting range is still increasing :) I think I had about 110% and actually didn't have to use my sword in the walley while beating orcs beacuse the distance was so long that they didn't even know what's going on and stood at one place :D
I prefer crossbows because of the strength requirement. This way you can train both 1H/2H AND Crossbows. That being said, crossbow training itself is just pumping the remaining learning points into something, after I trained my 1H/2H to the max, and learned some alchemy.
Dunno about Night of the Raven, but in Gothic2, crossbow is overall superior because of avaiability and dmg/dex requirement. 1) Kill everything except the wargs/lizards on your way to khorinis 2) Jump over the wall and talk to Lester. This should give you 2 lvls/20 LPs to work with 3) Invest at least 15 LPs into dex. Leave khorinis out of the back gate, turn left, avoid the mobs and go the way up, do a sharp right turn and get the 40/25 x-bow at the stump 4) You will now 1shot scavengers/molerats/wolfs/rats/goblins and 2shot field reavers/lurkers/lizards 5) 1shot your way back down to khorinis and up the way from khorinis to the bar on the way to onars farm, and take the 2nd left turn past the the hunter's camp, and 1shot your way following this path (careful to avoid the stone golem) and pick up the 55/40 crossbow hidden near the bridge 6) With the xp you have attained, you kill your way towards onar's farm and get 30 or more dex from Torlof for your new weapon. 6) Pick up the 15 dex amulet if you chose militia/paladin after talking to Lord Hagen and beat down Udar in the Castle in Mine Valley for his 85/70 crossbow. You now have the 2nd strongest crossbow at the start of 2nd chapter, and it is as strong as the strongest bow. 7) If you make sure to train to 100 dex @ Diego in chapter 3 and then trink and brew every dex potion, pray for your 22dex as pala etc., you will 1shot Lizardmen in chapter 4 and orc elites in chapter 5/6. Bows cant compete with that, because if you 1shot them with an x-bow but not a bow, the bow will require longer, negating the little speed advantage it has. Weapon skill is not as important, as you can get very close and be guaranteed to hit almost. I also don't train x-bows further than 59%, because the knee bending thing can be problematic when firing from a ledge or similar. All of that said, though I knew about the bows superior drawing speed, I didn't know about the small firing speed advantage of the bow in lower levels, much less the catch up at master level. I was under the impression of equal firing speed. Nice video!
You mean its the easiest way?! Cause you can get 120 dmg 1h Sword and with level 7 :D and also have 80 dmg bow. And later you just 2 shot every orc without getting hit. Also Dex helps with stealing and lock picks. And you can max its pretty easy. Its even posible to oneshot most orcs with bow :D
Way more important: The Bow is the main Weapon of a Dex Build (Archer), while the Crossbow is the secondary Weapon of a Strengh Build (since you need strengh to use Crossbows)
bow and crossbow damage depends on dexterity. the more dex u have, the more dmg u do. Its not weapon dmg only. That means the bow is way better than the crossbow because of, bows need dex to wear and crossbow need´s strenght. U cannot have alot of dex and alot of str too in Gothic 2. U have to decide atleast, melee or range, as a range character u wont take down the late game part with a crossbow. It is possible, but not for the average player, and its very hard. Crossbow just doesnt scale that much in the late Game. -- sorry not the best english
This was VERY useful, thank you :) For those who still don't get it (and given the number of comments, it seems to be a lot of people), let me try that again: - bow => for people preferring dex over str, and fighting with Rapier/Masters Sword/Betty over everything else - crossbow => for people preferring str over dex, and fighting with heavy 1h or 2h weapons It's simple as that. Basing crossbows on str was a good balancing act NOTR (one of the few things that made the game easier for some builds). Now, I can already see someone saying, 'but it's illogical to go with str when bows are so powerful' - maybe, but, believe it or not, some people prefer melee combat over ranged combat because it's more exciting and fun! I have played through the vanilla Gothic 2 a good 30 times, then the same number through NOTR, and I NEVER used a dex based character - it was ALWAYS strength. Only recently, I tried the dex based hunter with bow and Masters Sword and... it was interesting - mowing down orcs with your bow and all. But it was also... BOOORING! That's because, with melee combat, you actually have to have skills as the player to win a battle, while with range combat, your character does all the work. All you do is pick a target, and press forward and watch him fire, and fire, and fire... BOOOOORING! Mage has a similar problem for me - once you have magic that can quickly kill most orcs, you just cast, cast and cast... IMHO the melee combat in Gothic is simply funnier to play. And when you go with melee, you usually go with strength, ergo, you want to have crossbow as your backup (even with pure STR character, you will have 40-60 dex anyway). It's not about logic, it's about fun, and whatever works for you.
you need to remind, that both weapons scale with agility So the bow will be more effective, cause u have to scale strength for the crossbow...i think the crossbow is an ok weapon for swordfighters in the Same way the rapier is for marksmen and thanks for the video:)
Hi, can you please make a video about the difference in 2handed melee weapon speed on level of a novice, fighter, and master. I have a sensation that there is abolutely no difference between a master and a fighter.
Isn't the principal of these two that bow is faster but does less dmg? Like.. in general, in every game and I believe in history too? I might be wrong tho.
In Gothic 1 i found myself using the Bow much more that the crossbow. While in G2 the crossbow as a clear winner for me. I think(tho im not 100% sure on this) but i think that the crossbow damage would also scale up with your STR and not just your DEX like the bow did. So it didnt really matter to me much how many bolts i could fire per sec considering that most enemies would die in 2 shots with how high my stats were.
Does crouching affect crossbow shooting speed? The crossbow shot much faster when crouching in the video. Or is it really just about the master skill level?
Actually i have something interesting about valley of mines, pass the orc wall with cheats then go to where in gothic one u get a focus with gorn, that old monastery or something, then go to the canion under in and walk for a while until u find the end, try this in chaper 4 and u will be surprised ;) (i know this trick location on all maps)
Well.. crossbows have higher damage, but you need to max strenght to use them... but if you max strenght you will dont have enough points for dexterity so your shots will be weaker/less acurate(depends on which gothic you play) - Me for example playing a mod Archolos for G2 currently.. and I decided to max dexterity. I have crossbows in my inventory that are stronger than my bow and if I could I would equip them.. but I cannot. Their strenght requirments are insane for me. So I view bow as a primary weapon if you want to play ranged specialist. And a Crossbow more like a Secondary weapon when you play classic melle fighter(As prooved many times since this was my most played character.. with absolutelly no dexterity I could do decent damage still)
If you're playing a classic Paladin or a classic Dragon Slayer you'll need far more strength, which would enable you to use the most powerful crossbows. Not only does this apply to the endgame, but also midgame: If you're pushing for 2hand swords with high strength, you'll quickly be able to use the regular crossbow while the really good bows acquire too much dexterity until you take all the potions and stone tables.
that depends what you want to know about it. The later you pick it up the better because you safe yourself some hp that youd need to upgrade it further (it maxes out always at lvl 4x). I usually get it before going into the valley of mines (i hope thats what you call it in english, im from germany so im not 100% certain here) at around lvl 28 most of the time and use it when im playing dex characters focusing on bow and 1h skill.
in a gothic 2 mod L'hiver, crossbows require strength and bows dexterity. Master swords/rapiers require dexterity. This is how it should've been in vanilla. In gothic 2 vanilla I have absolutely no reason to bother using dexterity
That would break his stupid assesment in half.... Bows are 1 to 1 in terms of what the requirements are and what base damage you deal without any modifiers on world of gothic which is basically the de facto site for gothic the best bow is 160 dexterity required to 160 base damage..... the best crossbow is 150 strenght required to 180 base damage also there is a magic crossbow 200 damage with 75 strenght.... it's clear as day...
Yeah, but there is kinda a huge difference that I noticed. On a long range the accuracy is far better on the crossbow than the normal bow (you took around 6 shots on those 2 orcs with the bow, but with a crossbow your shots would't miss). Plus, maximum damage is granted on the crossbow as well, around 20 or 40, I don't quite remember well.
Yeah but even if u get less shoots with with crossbow. The crossbow overall has more DMG. At maxt level with the best crossbow u need 2 shoots for an normal orc warrios while with the bow you need 3. So there is that. That's alot of debating on who's better. Overall both are. There advantage and disadvantages. Firs one is like you said the bow is overall faster and is easy to scale since it uses dex. The crossbow needs str to equip but uses dex as DMG scaling. So you have to invest more in them and that's why the crossbow have much more DMG then the bow cuz the developers realized you can't max put in str and dex in the same time. So they have the crossbow more DMG with a little drawback while the bow doesn't have as much DMG as a crossbow but is much faster. Both are good and both are worth trying and playing with since is very fun. Just a disclaimer for those who play gothic one idk about 2. I use in gothic 1 and 2 an additional extension on steam where you press Z and accelerates the game 3 times or x 3 speed. That makes the walk of you and any action of any npc in the world go x3 time speed . Works in combat but is risky since you can die faster. The problem comes with the crossbow. If you use the same acceleration program and press Z to speed up time then the crossbow won't shoot. It will get stuck and you won't be able to shoot. Only the bow works. This is not a major problem if you don't use x3 speed time acceleration like me. That mode helps you clear the game faster and more smooth.
you dont need it anyway, there is staff that gives u + 20 mana or something and u can get it very soon and when u equip and unequip it, you regain that 20 mana, meaning u have infinite 20 mana and heal cost 10
Just fyi as someone who played these games like 5 times each. The bow is OP. Magic is basically trash except for very powerful scrolls. Melee will make you punch your keyboard until you learn the tricks.
I always used Bow, but then on other playthrough I decided to go for Crossbow.. and it was annoying.. because if you're a mage you have to put LP in STR to use it properly.. while Dex is a must for pickpockets and other ability so you can move faster.. to me Crossbow is waste of points
As much as the effort is appreciated... What's the point of the speed comparison in ranged combat? Ranged damage is Weapon Damage+DEX, regardless of the weapon type, and you need a sh*t load of STR to equip a good crossbow. Looking at my only attempt at playing archer in G2NotR (some min-maxing, but pretty far from going all-dex, or hitting every civilian in the face for exp) I was at 160+240, while having a meager 65 STR. So, basically to surpass it with the best crossbow I'd have to acquire 85 more STR. Basically... What's the point of wasting your LPs on STR, even if you are to acquire them, when you can spend them on something more useful? Speed is meaningless if your damage is enough for two-shotting the Orcs (and one-shotting Lizardmen for the matter of being Dragon Hunter), IMO.
CBs have nore damage, but Bow is faster, even if it's a little margin. Bow is definitelt better early, because like you shown in video CBs speed catch up at 60. Tho Bows are fun to just kills orcs from up close because you can strife and shoot without taking damage, if the terrain is even. CB is too slow for that even on 60 with kneeling animation.
@@maszkalman3676 nope damage formula for bows and crossbows is the same weapondamage+dexterity-armor= damage dealt meaning damage for range is soley scaling with dexterity the same for dexterity melee weapons which have dex to equip but weapon dmg scales with strenght.
Rapier is dex based as far as I remember, but yeah, no mid or late game dexterity melee weapons. As for weapon damage types (slashing, piercing, crushing) that would've been cool but was probably too hard to implement and not essential.
@@davorbrijacak there is the master sword which is pretty brutal for its requirements aswell just as good of a ratio as the rapier but higher (its 120 for 60) and ususally if you go for dex builds you want to pick up the claw of beliar as your weapon anyway because the bonus damage (also appearing when enemies block attacks) beats the fact that you actually didnt skill a lot of strenght (at least thats the way i always went and it worked smooth).
Bow is dexterity, thus you must lvl it up quite a lot(if i remember correctly it's way more than 200 dexterity, maybe more than 250 to use best bow in the game+more damage). It's better for a thief\agility character(but melee weapons that use dexterity kinda suck and they scarce). But crossbows use strength stat for damage and weapon requirements, thus it's a must for melee\warrior character. Personally i prefer crossbows, they do less damage than bows and there are much less variety over bows(you will use like 2 crossbows first half of the game versus 4-5 bows or so) but they use strength so you can use one-handed or two-handed weapon as main weapon and use crossbow to kill 1-2 enemy before they reach you. Also they are good to kill mages and run-aways npc.
the time you pull off your range weapon matters the most,you may not be able to kill someone with a crossbow if he's near you and he dies after 2 shots which will not happen with a bow,so yea bow is the winner
Are you dumb? With a reanged weapon draw time conuts the least it's pre meditated you attack the enemy first... also crossbows deal more damage to requirement +30 more......
bow is much faster, crossbow have much more damage, but bow is definitely faster. and every blow stun enemies for a milisec so it better to use even with less damage
I never seen much point in crossbows in this game. They require strenght to wield but still do demage based on dexterity. So in order to do big demage with them you need both high strenght and dexterity. With NotR it's preety much impossible without going out of your way to max out character and doing stuff like beating up every NPC for experience. Alsways prefered to just use bow and max out dexterity or max out strenght and only use swords never caring about crossbows.
I just finished G2 Gold again and I think comparison of these two are pointless. Crossbows require Strength and Bows Dexterity. Either you play a Strength oriented warrior and use crossbows as secondary weapon or you use one of those few swords which have Dexterity requirement because you mainly want to use archer oriented character. You don't get enough points to train up both Strength and Dexterity (maybe in original G2 but not in the expansion). Dexterity is added to your range attacks (both crossbows and bow) and Strength is added to you melee attacks (both Dexterity and Strength swords). In other words if you want to use crossbows you need to train Strength just to equip those and will lack extra ranged damage from your low Dexterity but will be able to use better melee weapons with your Strength added as extra damage. Bows have Dexterity requirement which is also added as an extra ranged damage but you will be able to use only Dexterity swords which are not as strong as Strength swords and will also lack enough extra damage from your low Strength stat.
There are a few factors that make bows superior to crossbows aside from the ones you have already mentioned. Firstly, tablets give 30 points in bows, but only 20 in crossbows. Secondly, bow trainers are much more accessible. Wolf will train you up to 90 from chapter 1 onwards for free and Bartok allows you to learn the basics early on; crossbows only have Dragomir whose service you unlock relatively late and who only goes up to 70 - a nightmare you insist on reaching 100% with tablets. It is even worse in the main game where Dragomir only teaches up to 60 and there are no tablets at all. Bows are objectively superior (although I wouldn't hold it against anyone doing crossbows for flavor).
@@soldatnr444 ok my English is poor so I use translate Google . Gothic is a Polish game because many Polish People play it. this is such a meme that Minecraft is a Polish game :). Saradoc is youtuber who is German, he plays Gothic and on his live streams chatting only Polish People. I don't know if you understand this .Sorry for my very poor English 😉
I made a little mistake at the beginning of the video when I said 'damage per second'. This video focuses on firing speed.
If you liked this kind of video than share it with your friends.
Thanks for watching guys :)
-Salty
bow has more dps on light targets, but on heavy targets you'll need a crossbow to pierce the armor, in any case late game is about the same as you said
Well if u go deep , attack speed is also dps. More shots per minute = more damage in a minute.
Btw thanks for a Gothic channel. Game of my childhood.
Thanks for pinning my comment :)
another problem:
the crossbow uses strength, the bow uses agility.
since most close quarter weapons also use strength, it costs you less, in the end, to use a crossbow and that makes the crossbow superior.
@@TheDunestyler not really, only when u make a strenght/meele focused character. Your strength value is a factor for meele dmg calculation and dex for range dmg.
So if u want the most ranged dmg u have to skill dex and therefore use bows.
It's like how rapier requires only 50 dex for a 100 dmg it's for characters that use bows/ranged primarily and have next to no strength so the dmg of the weapon is really high to make up for that. It's the same for crossbows with dex
I amazed how much is in this "OLD GAME". So much charm. The world feels like a real place that doesnt care about you, but you can change that for bad or good. Awes9me vods man.
What contributes to this great "charm" is imo this fantastic music that they created for this game. Man, when I hear theme of Khorinis, nostalgia hits me hard af
the only one of its kind. cant believe the game is almost 20 years old. 20 YEARS. fuck we are old.
@@senjusan6359 Kai Rosenkranz is a master of his craft.
You're like the ''Spirit of the Law'' of Gothic :)
He haven't included spreadsheets formed by DMG of particular weapons and other stuff
"I've always hated crossbows. Take too long to load."
- Yoren of the Nightswatch
Gothic 3 agrees
As for damage. Bow is generally better as ALL ranged damage comes from Dex. Because you're pumping Dex for your bow anyway, you'll do damage on par or significantly more than even the best crossbow.
But Crossbow is a fine secondary/first strike weapon for strength builds.
Not In Gothic Classic. In NOTR Crossbow wielding depends on strength, and in Classic it depends on Dexterity.
@@NeverStopPlz no, he speaks about dmg , range dmg is always weapon dmg + dex , crossbow needs str. but stil dmg is dex + crossbow dmg :-)
@@originalniM2 I take it you never played the Classic Gothic 2? (without Night of the Raven addon) Read again what I wrote.
Damages comes not only from Dex but also skill level. And when you build your character for Strength because you prefer melee then Crossbow is better because you can at least draw a strong Crossbow then, while a bow would not even be equippable. Your damage won't be as good since you don't have Dex but this makes it possible to use range and melee when you're leveling up exclusively Str.
@@kooroshrostami27 Skill level is for crit chance it wont increase your dmg just increases your attack speed and chance to deal bonus dmg.
6:29 To be continued :)))
Came here by accident- I didn't play gothic for more than 15 years (seriously) and still watching the whole vid :D nice one!
Hey there! It's good to see that someone still does such videos about g2.
For gothic 1 and 2 the crossbow it's definitely more effective. The damage difference makes the crossbow a lot better as the shooting speed it's insignificant.
In gothic 3 the crossbow it's just for appearance, being completely useless.
Keep up the good work
Krash Morra is useless???
Innos please forgive this sinner
but you need strength for crossbows. If you're going to invest in dexterity anyway then the better deal is the bow since you don't have to invest in strength. Crossbow is nice as a secondary weapon for strength builds, but if you're going to play ranged the whole game then the bow would be better.
Crossbows make more damage but you have to skill strength and dex to be very effective, for the bow you just have to skill dex
yup therefore bow is always the better choice for the range perspective. But the crossbow is a usefull first strike weapon for strenght builds aswell so it has its purpose which is quite nice.
IDK, I just finished paladin one hand playthrough and I didnt had much space for upgrading dex on the way. Also I did it without Claw of Beliar because I thought for Paladin it is a no no and also this weapon is somewhat OP. So for Dex I will go bow for sure next time :)
Seen a lot of Gothic activity in my recomended lately... thought you were someone else... now i finally clicked and BAM, instant subscription :D good content m8
Another cool video :) when I was playing as bowman I've found out that even if you pass 100% on bow skill, your shooting range is still increasing :) I think I had about 110% and actually didn't have to use my sword in the walley while beating orcs beacuse the distance was so long that they didn't even know what's going on and stood at one place :D
I prefer crossbows because of the strength requirement. This way you can train both 1H/2H AND Crossbows. That being said, crossbow training itself is just pumping the remaining learning points into something, after I trained my 1H/2H to the max, and learned some alchemy.
The answer is: Rain of fire
Dunno about Night of the Raven, but in Gothic2, crossbow is overall superior because of avaiability and dmg/dex requirement.
1) Kill everything except the wargs/lizards on your way to khorinis
2) Jump over the wall and talk to Lester. This should give you 2 lvls/20 LPs to work with
3) Invest at least 15 LPs into dex. Leave khorinis out of the back gate, turn left, avoid the mobs and go the way up, do a sharp right turn and get the 40/25 x-bow at the stump
4) You will now 1shot scavengers/molerats/wolfs/rats/goblins and 2shot field reavers/lurkers/lizards
5) 1shot your way back down to khorinis and up the way from khorinis to the bar on the way to onars farm, and take the 2nd left turn past the the hunter's camp, and 1shot your way following this path (careful to avoid the stone golem) and pick up the 55/40 crossbow hidden near the bridge
6) With the xp you have attained, you kill your way towards onar's farm and get 30 or more dex from Torlof for your new weapon.
6) Pick up the 15 dex amulet if you chose militia/paladin after talking to Lord Hagen and beat down Udar in the Castle in Mine Valley for his 85/70 crossbow. You now have the 2nd strongest crossbow at the start of 2nd chapter, and it is as strong as the strongest bow.
7) If you make sure to train to 100 dex @ Diego in chapter 3 and then trink and brew every dex potion, pray for your 22dex as pala etc., you will 1shot Lizardmen in chapter 4 and orc elites in chapter 5/6.
Bows cant compete with that, because if you 1shot them with an x-bow but not a bow, the bow will require longer, negating the little speed advantage it has.
Weapon skill is not as important, as you can get very close and be guaranteed to hit almost. I also don't train x-bows further than 59%, because the knee bending thing can be problematic when firing from a ledge or similar.
All of that said, though I knew about the bows superior drawing speed, I didn't know about the small firing speed advantage of the bow in lower levels, much less the catch up at master level. I was under the impression of equal firing speed.
Nice video!
Nice video bro. I actually went full dexterity and killed the last dragon, its so fun putting points on dexterity only
You mean its the easiest way?! Cause you can get 120 dmg 1h Sword and with level 7 :D and also have 80 dmg bow. And later you just 2 shot every orc without getting hit.
Also Dex helps with stealing and lock picks. And you can max its pretty easy. Its even posible to oneshot most orcs with bow :D
Way more important: The Bow is the main Weapon of a Dex Build (Archer), while the Crossbow is the secondary Weapon of a Strengh Build (since you need strengh to use Crossbows)
STR is needes to carry a crossbow. It's damage multiplier is still DEX. So Bow is better in any case If DEX efficiency is a goal.
Only in night of the raven, it both require dexterity in the classic gothic 2
nice ! thanks for the video
nice, great video. thanks
Awesome video
hmm very interesting video!
I love gothic
bow and crossbow damage depends on dexterity.
the more dex u have, the more dmg u do. Its not weapon dmg only.
That means the bow is way better than the crossbow because of, bows need dex to wear and crossbow need´s strenght.
U cannot have alot of dex and alot of str too in Gothic 2. U have to decide atleast, melee or range,
as a range character u wont take down the late game part with a crossbow. It is possible, but not for the average player, and its very hard.
Crossbow just doesnt scale that much in the late Game. -- sorry not the best english
Doesn't marksman skill also affect the damage?
This was VERY useful, thank you :)
For those who still don't get it (and given the number of comments, it seems to be a lot of people), let me try that again:
- bow => for people preferring dex over str, and fighting with Rapier/Masters Sword/Betty over everything else
- crossbow => for people preferring str over dex, and fighting with heavy 1h or 2h weapons
It's simple as that. Basing crossbows on str was a good balancing act NOTR (one of the few things that made the game easier for some builds).
Now, I can already see someone saying, 'but it's illogical to go with str when bows are so powerful' - maybe, but, believe it or not, some people prefer melee combat over ranged combat because it's more exciting and fun!
I have played through the vanilla Gothic 2 a good 30 times, then the same number through NOTR, and I NEVER used a dex based character - it was ALWAYS strength. Only recently, I tried the dex based hunter with bow and Masters Sword and... it was interesting - mowing down orcs with your bow and all. But it was also... BOOORING!
That's because, with melee combat, you actually have to have skills as the player to win a battle, while with range combat, your character does all the work. All you do is pick a target, and press forward and watch him fire, and fire, and fire... BOOOOORING! Mage has a similar problem for me - once you have magic that can quickly kill most orcs, you just cast, cast and cast...
IMHO the melee combat in Gothic is simply funnier to play. And when you go with melee, you usually go with strength, ergo, you want to have crossbow as your backup (even with pure STR character, you will have 40-60 dex anyway).
It's not about logic, it's about fun, and whatever works for you.
Hey how to edit this time in the right corner? is this a greenscreen overlay or so?
you need to remind, that both weapons scale with agility
So the bow will be more effective, cause u have to scale strength for the crossbow...i think the crossbow is an ok weapon for swordfighters in the Same way the rapier is for marksmen
and thanks for the video:)
What is the best weapon mele for dex?
What about statistical analysis?
Very interesting videos. Did you give up YT ?
Hi, can you please make a video about the difference in 2handed melee weapon speed on level of a novice, fighter, and master. I have a sensation that there is abolutely no difference between a master and a fighter.
hey man can someone tell me how to install Golden Gate Mod I can't select a folder and the OK button is greyed out
Ja moin, das hab ich mich schon ewig gefragt ))
Great to see gothic players outside of germany.
Isn't the principal of these two that bow is faster but does less dmg? Like.. in general, in every game and I believe in history too? I might be wrong tho.
you aren't wrong.... in gothic 2 the best crossbow gives 30 more damage to strenght required the dragon hunter crossbow...
Good videos man! I hope you play as Mercenary/ 1 Handed :D
In Gothic 1 i found myself using the Bow much more that the crossbow. While in G2 the crossbow as a clear winner for me. I think(tho im not 100% sure on this) but i think that the crossbow damage would also scale up with your STR and not just your DEX like the bow did. So it didnt really matter to me much how many bolts i could fire per sec considering that most enemies would die in 2 shots with how high my stats were.
Will you consider making a Gothic 2 cinematic movie version of the game?
Nameless Hero hmm that would take a lot of time and I'm not sure if there is a good audience for such a project.
But the crossbow should have a higher damage output.
Very nice analysis!
Does crouching affect crossbow shooting speed? The crossbow shot much faster when crouching in the video. Or is it really just about the master skill level?
You automatically crouch when you hit master level. So yes, that's the animation for skill above 60% that's why you shoot faster.
Ah, thanks for clarification :)
Actually i have something interesting about valley of mines, pass the orc wall with cheats then go to where in gothic one u get a focus with gorn, that old monastery or something, then go to the canion under in and walk for a while until u find the end, try this in chaper 4 and u will be surprised ;) (i know this trick location on all maps)
can you link me to a video that shows it?
Well.. crossbows have higher damage, but you need to max strenght to use them... but if you max strenght you will dont have enough points for dexterity so your shots will be weaker/less acurate(depends on which gothic you play)
- Me for example playing a mod Archolos for G2 currently.. and I decided to max dexterity. I have crossbows in my inventory that are stronger than my bow and if I could I would equip them.. but I cannot. Their strenght requirments are insane for me.
So I view bow as a primary weapon if you want to play ranged specialist.
And a Crossbow more like a Secondary weapon when you play classic melle fighter(As prooved many times since this was my most played character.. with absolutelly no dexterity I could do decent damage still)
If you're playing a classic Paladin or a classic Dragon Slayer you'll need far more strength, which would enable you to use the most powerful crossbows. Not only does this apply to the endgame, but also midgame: If you're pushing for 2hand swords with high strength, you'll quickly be able to use the regular crossbow while the really good bows acquire too much dexterity until you take all the potions and stone tables.
Any tip regarding beliar's claw??
that depends what you want to know about it. The later you pick it up the better because you safe yourself some hp that youd need to upgrade it further (it maxes out always at lvl 4x). I usually get it before going into the valley of mines (i hope thats what you call it in english, im from germany so im not 100% certain here) at around lvl 28 most of the time and use it when im playing dex characters focusing on bow and 1h skill.
Have Vatras dispose of it, it's an instrument of evil.
@@metavormgeving7576 saturas*
Słychać że akcent polski. Czemu sprzedałeś rodaków jak Jankos?
in a gothic 2 mod L'hiver, crossbows require strength and bows dexterity. Master swords/rapiers require dexterity. This is how it should've been in vanilla. In gothic 2 vanilla I have absolutely no reason to bother using dexterity
How about pickpocketing?
@@adziup eh, you get enough goblin berries and potions to pickpocket most things
i never ask mysefl this question
Would me nice if you showed best crossbow and bow in the game aswell.
That would break his stupid assesment in half.... Bows are 1 to 1 in terms of what the requirements are and what base damage you deal without any modifiers on world of gothic which is basically the de facto site for gothic the best bow is 160 dexterity required to 160 base damage..... the best crossbow is 150 strenght required to 180 base damage also there is a magic crossbow 200 damage with 75 strenght.... it's clear as day...
From an evolutionary perspective, can someone explain to me why we are watching these videos?
But I think that overall the dexterity built is the better build than the strength build
Yeah, but there is kinda a huge difference that I noticed. On a long range the accuracy is far better on the crossbow than the normal bow (you took around 6 shots on those 2 orcs with the bow, but with a crossbow your shots would't miss). Plus, maximum damage is granted on the crossbow as well, around 20 or 40, I don't quite remember well.
Wasnt there some kind of buddhist teaching that if you meditate long enough you realize the bow and crossbow are one?
what about dps? Bows and crossbows have the same speed at master skill but crossbows do more damage per hit.
The video was only about their speed, not damage.
@@ASpecialGuest speed is useless since it's just money wasting...
@@maszkalman3676 Again, this video was only about speed so I have no clue why you're telling me that. I prefer crossbows myself.
@@ASpecialGuest but who cares about speed what use of this give any edge or help in the game situation.?
@@maszkalman3676 this video is about speed only, so i have no clue why you or the OP are talking about damage.
Yeah but even if u get less shoots with with crossbow. The crossbow overall has more DMG. At maxt level with the best crossbow u need 2 shoots for an normal orc warrios while with the bow you need 3. So there is that. That's alot of debating on who's better. Overall both are. There advantage and disadvantages. Firs one is like you said the bow is overall faster and is easy to scale since it uses dex. The crossbow needs str to equip but uses dex as DMG scaling. So you have to invest more in them and that's why the crossbow have much more DMG then the bow cuz the developers realized you can't max put in str and dex in the same time. So they have the crossbow more DMG with a little drawback while the bow doesn't have as much DMG as a crossbow but is much faster. Both are good and both are worth trying and playing with since is very fun. Just a disclaimer for those who play gothic one idk about 2. I use in gothic 1 and 2 an additional extension on steam where you press Z and accelerates the game 3 times or x 3 speed. That makes the walk of you and any action of any npc in the world go x3 time speed . Works in combat but is risky since you can die faster. The problem comes with the crossbow. If you use the same acceleration program and press Z to speed up time then the crossbow won't shoot. It will get stuck and you won't be able to shoot. Only the bow works. This is not a major problem if you don't use x3 speed time acceleration like me. That mode helps you clear the game faster and more smooth.
Bow is the most economical way to play the game because you dont have to spend resources on healing.
you dont need it anyway, there is staff that gives u + 20 mana or something and u can get it very soon and when u equip and unequip it, you regain that 20 mana, meaning u have infinite 20 mana and heal cost 10
You didn't count accurately with frametimes. So after the first decimal it will be inaccurate. But regardless, the video was good.
Just fyi as someone who played these games like 5 times each. The bow is OP. Magic is basically trash except for very powerful scrolls. Melee will make you punch your keyboard until you learn the tricks.
I always used Bow, but then on other playthrough I decided to go for Crossbow.. and it was annoying.. because if you're a mage you have to put LP in STR to use it properly.. while Dex is a must for pickpockets and other ability so you can move faster.. to me Crossbow is waste of points
The highest damage level goes to a crossbow, so ultimately it is better in the end.
420 LP :D
ty I searched for that comment xD
As much as the effort is appreciated... What's the point of the speed comparison in ranged combat?
Ranged damage is Weapon Damage+DEX, regardless of the weapon type, and you need a sh*t load of STR to equip a good crossbow. Looking at my only attempt at playing archer in G2NotR (some min-maxing, but pretty far from going all-dex, or hitting every civilian in the face for exp) I was at 160+240, while having a meager 65 STR. So, basically to surpass it with the best crossbow I'd have to acquire 85 more STR. Basically... What's the point of wasting your LPs on STR, even if you are to acquire them, when you can spend them on something more useful?
Speed is meaningless if your damage is enough for two-shotting the Orcs (and one-shotting Lizardmen for the matter of being Dragon Hunter), IMO.
I was just curious and wanted to share my findings :)
u shoot low on the bow and not on the crossbow physics my friend
Correct Answer: Fireball
CBs have nore damage, but Bow is faster, even if it's a little margin. Bow is definitelt better early, because like you shown in video CBs speed catch up at 60. Tho Bows are fun to just kills orcs from up close because you can strife and shoot without taking damage, if the terrain is even. CB is too slow for that even on 60 with kneeling animation.
Not sure anymore but as far as i remember Crossbow is kinda useless since you need str to equip but agi to increase your dmg you deal.
Nope it scales with strenght and dexterity
@@maszkalman3676 nope damage formula for bows and crossbows is the same weapondamage+dexterity-armor= damage dealt
meaning damage for range is soley scaling with dexterity the same for dexterity melee weapons which have dex to equip but weapon dmg scales with strenght.
3:19 oooo no, you kill him ;(
nooooo 3:53 its necrophilia ;C
How is your grumpy friend,Cronos?
1:09
how the hell u can use crossbow in this game, it's non existent u need strength and dexterity for it , for bow only dexterity
But then you want some melee and that is based on strength...
Too bad that devs did not make weapon damage based on weapon attribute :/
Rapier is dex based as far as I remember, but yeah, no mid or late game dexterity melee weapons. As for weapon damage types (slashing, piercing, crushing) that would've been cool but was probably too hard to implement and not essential.
well, I often skill both to be a good fighter and a good thief and later in the game I start skilling the crossbow
@@davorbrijacak there is the master sword which is pretty brutal for its requirements aswell just as good of a ratio as the rapier but higher (its 120 for 60) and ususally if you go for dex builds you want to pick up the claw of beliar as your weapon anyway because the bonus damage (also appearing when enemies block attacks) beats the fact that you actually didnt skill a lot of strenght (at least thats the way i always went and it worked smooth).
LONG LIVE GOTHIC! xd
bow is better cause of dex acrobatics
Bow is dexterity, thus you must lvl it up quite a lot(if i remember correctly it's way more than 200 dexterity, maybe more than 250 to use best bow in the game+more damage). It's better for a thief\agility character(but melee weapons that use dexterity kinda suck and they scarce). But crossbows use strength stat for damage and weapon requirements, thus it's a must for melee\warrior character. Personally i prefer crossbows, they do less damage than bows and there are much less variety over bows(you will use like 2 crossbows first half of the game versus 4-5 bows or so) but they use strength so you can use one-handed or two-handed weapon as main weapon and use crossbow to kill 1-2 enemy before they reach you. Also they are good to kill mages and run-aways npc.
at 100% the crossbow would be faster than the bow
Было интересно, но не понятно) Russian ok?
Why this games dont have in goggle play
La balestra fa piu danni dell arco questa è la differenza.
You tested in Night of the Raven addon and there crossbow needs strength 150 which is unable to reach only from permanent bonuses
you can be 150 strenght with the night of the raven addon in base gothic withot cheats is get 105 strenght at the end of the game...
But the crossbow is stronger:)
arent the orcs staggered?
the time you pull off your range weapon matters the most,you may not be able to kill someone with a crossbow if he's near you and he dies after 2 shots which will not happen with a bow,so yea bow is the winner
Are you dumb? With a reanged weapon draw time conuts the least it's pre meditated you attack the enemy first... also crossbows deal more damage to requirement +30 more......
bow is much faster, crossbow have much more damage, but bow is definitely faster. and every blow stun enemies for a milisec so it better to use even with less damage
I never seen much point in crossbows in this game. They require strenght to wield but still do demage based on dexterity. So in order to do big demage with them you need both high strenght and dexterity. With NotR it's preety much impossible without going out of your way to max out character and doing stuff like beating up every NPC for experience. Alsways prefered to just use bow and max out dexterity or max out strenght and only use swords never caring about crossbows.
I just finished G2 Gold again and I think comparison of these two are pointless. Crossbows require Strength and Bows Dexterity. Either you play a Strength oriented warrior and use crossbows as secondary weapon or you use one of those few swords which have Dexterity requirement because you mainly want to use archer oriented character. You don't get enough points to train up both Strength and Dexterity (maybe in original G2 but not in the expansion). Dexterity is added to your range attacks (both crossbows and bow) and Strength is added to you melee attacks (both Dexterity and Strength swords). In other words if you want to use crossbows you need to train Strength just to equip those and will lack extra ranged damage from your low Dexterity but will be able to use better melee weapons with your Strength added as extra damage. Bows have Dexterity requirement which is also added as an extra ranged damage but you will be able to use only Dexterity swords which are not as strong as Strength swords and will also lack enough extra damage from your low Strength stat.
There are a few factors that make bows superior to crossbows aside from the ones you have already mentioned. Firstly, tablets give 30 points in bows, but only 20 in crossbows. Secondly, bow trainers are much more accessible. Wolf will train you up to 90 from chapter 1 onwards for free and Bartok allows you to learn the basics early on; crossbows only have Dragomir whose service you unlock relatively late and who only goes up to 70 - a nightmare you insist on reaching 100% with tablets. It is even worse in the main game where Dragomir only teaches up to 60 and there are no tablets at all.
Bows are objectively superior (although I wouldn't hold it against anyone doing crossbows for flavor).
lul unexpected tbh
worst archer in human history. Everything bounces off.
accuracy?
the bow looks like it shoots straighter
Gothic is polish game !!!!!
Gothic is made by piranha bytes - a german developer
not a polish game at all
@@soldatnr444 gościu, Gothic to polska gra . Grają w nią sami Polacy
@@kozaklol0517 i don't understand polish, write in english or german
@@soldatnr444 ok my English is poor so I use translate Google . Gothic is a Polish game because many Polish People play it. this is such a meme that Minecraft is a Polish game :). Saradoc is youtuber who is German, he plays Gothic and on his live streams chatting only Polish People. I don't know if you understand this .Sorry for my very poor English 😉
@@kozaklol0517 Ah i understand. I misunderstood you then.
Man hört so krass, den deutschen Akzent raus. XD