"There are two ways of doing things: The Great Western way, or the wrong way." A quote from duck plus i liked theirs Duck theme. are you a Thomas & Friends Fan ?
Love your work. Also noticed the clever use of “Duck’s Theme” in there, since his model type also appears in the video and it is all about GWR. Look forward to more.
A few years ago, I was buying OO gauge MK2 Regional Railways coaches for my model railway. One of them confused me when it arrived because it didn't look like the others. I did some research and found out it was a GWR Autocoach... which someone had, inexplicably, painted in Regional Railways livery. Rather than repaint it to be realistic, I took one of the 0-4-0 tank engines I'd never use (I like more modern stuff, but tank engines are what people get you when you're young) and repainted _that_ into Regional Railways livery. It's absurd, but hey, that's the charm of it for me.
And you can still see these steam loco hauled push-pull trains, and the steam powered coaches in use today, as there are preserved units on various heritage railways.
Being both a life-long rail fan and locomotive engineer, I never knew that a railroad had developed and operated a steam powered push-pull operation! Thank you for the top shelf education! Cheers.
This was a really interesting and informative video. I remember reading the railway series books as a kid and I was always confused on why Duck's coaches, Alice and Mirabelle, were referred to as autocoaches. Now it all makes sense and is really cool!
Here's something: Duck's class, a 5700, wasn't auto-fitted to use these coaches (unless you imagine him being fitted at Crovan's Gate Works); if you see a pannier in an autotrain nowadays, it's likely a 6400.
@@vincentmorris8431 Interesting. I could imagine him being fitted at Crovan's Gate, since those coaches were specifically given to him by Sir Topham Hatt. What about Oliver, though? I think his coaches, Dulcie and Isabelle, were also autocoaches.
Oh hey, that's Duck's theme! Also i think Thomas has this feature when pulling Annie & Clarabel. Although where i learned this was from a fanmade story, rather than an official one.
Actually, if you pay close attention to the illustrations, Thomas is sometimes seen pushing Annie and Clarabel backwards, and even with a red tail lamp mounted!
Someone's a fan of the GWR... But they came up with an idea decades ahead of its time and unlike most such experiments that fail, they stuck the landing. So yeah, they kind of deserve it.
Im glad someone did a video on this. Oliver from Thomas and Ffiends had Auto coaches in the Railway Series but never made it to the television screen. I have Oliver in HO scale and got mynhands on an Autocoach so i can run him backwards. Its really fun explaining to people what it is especially given here in America we didnt have anything like that although our solution to Branchline trains were the Gas powered Doodlebugs and later the Rail Diesle Cars.
@@owendinostudios1200 i thnk that may have been done intentionally in because many of the engines shown were Panier Tank engines and that was one of the tank engines used for Auto coaches. Heck i think one of the two in the books were assigned to Duck if im not mistaken.
@@owendinostudios1200 Yeah i remember that but i dont think theyve done much with them lately which is a shame thats a jnique piece of railroad history unique to The UK that is being under utlized but then again Thomas and Friends isnt in to Real World Building as Earlier seasons of Thomas and Friends were.
2:14 Page 97 - 99 of 'A Pictorial Record of Great Western Engines Volume Two' has two images, one of 2120 with this casing on it and 2140 with it removed as well as several diagrams
The Great western really did like experimenting with other things that other railways didn’t like here the Auto coaches, and even some steam powered rail motors
Fun fact. in America commuter Railroads still run push-pull trains powered by diesel locomotives. The coach with the locomotive controls is called the cab car.
That is correct. My local commuter network, Metra, does as well, and even has one car in daily service dating from 1949, #553 in Chicago and Northwestern livery. Most, including the cab cars, date from the 1960s to 2000s.
Just to clarify: at 02:46 where you talk about the 0-4-2 1400 class (first built in 1932), you are actually showing a picture of an engine of the 0-4-2 517 class (last built in 1885). You don't explicitly say it is a 1400, I know. Nice video, by the way.
As a kid I used to come back from school from Dorchester to Radipole Halt in an ex GWR autocoach running ahead of a 1400 0-4-2T loco. There was a speed indicator in the driver's compartment and it would sometimes hit 80mph descending from the Bincome tunnel. (That is my memory - did I dream it? I don't think so but I am no longer 100% sure.)
"We'll connect all the controls with long shafts through the coach! What could possibly go wrong?" :D Here in Southern California, we have the modern version of this with single diesels at one end of a string of passenger cars, but the controls in the other end are electronic rather than mechanical. It works pretty well, until somebody parks a truck on a level crossing and there's nothing in front of the engineer and passengers but the end of that rail car...
We had a titanic accident a number of years ago when one of them running coach-first hit a heavy SUV and derailed. A friend of mine was killed and another critically injured. I see now the end coaches are more angled than they were. Hopefully they can deflect some of the impact. All level crossings are an invitation to disaster.
The GWR was only one among very many railways that used push-pull fitted sets. The idea spread very fast and most companies had them by the 1920's, it wasn't a GWR specialty as this video implies.
Commuter trains here in the States (and in Canada as well, as I understand) typically work through push-pull operations, nowadays, too; of course, these days, the push-pull functionality is achieved through placing one diesel-electric engine at one end of the train and what's known as a cab-coach at the other end - and the engine is controlled from the cab-coach by way of electronic multiple-unit, or MU, lash-ups between the cab-coach, any intermediate standard coaches (though I have yet to see such a train without standard coaches in the middle), and the back of the engine.
My idea of a video about auto coaches otherwise known as slipping coaches came true. Thank you Train of thought you are a fountain of railway knowledge plus keep up the good work.
Slip coaches are quite different to auto coaches! Slip coaches were put on the rear of an express trains and released from the train to coast into a station that the express train didn’t stop at.
An engine in the middle of the train. That reminds me of the Thomas episode "Middle engine" where Harry and Bert play a trick, forcing Percy to be a middle engine. when the other engines make fun of Percy. James gets his comeuppance when hes a middle engine. however, to avoid looking silly, refuses to move, resulting in a very angry Fat Controller.
Adrian Vaughan's twin volume of GWR loco's has pictures of said camouflaged engine. OPC publishing or their successors will also have some on file. Hope this helps.
It wasn't just the GWR using this kind of method. the Southern and one of the pre-Grouping railways making up the LMS the LNWR (and probably other as well) had this kind of equipment.
We see him pushing the coaches quite often, & sometimes with tail lamps on his front, suggesting backwards running (see the illustration in Woolly Bear, where he is laughing at Percy. He carries black lamps with red lenses, suggesting he was running backwards.)
Your photos show other companies' examples of auto or "push-pull" steam train working, which were arguably superior to the GWR system in that they were worked by compressed air and not mechanically-operated as with the GW. Where were trains in passenger service propelled by a locomotive and crew at the trailing end with no one taking care of the leading end?
The max number of coaches a GWR autotrain could have was 4. 2 in front and 2 behind the loco. I can only afford 1 autocoach in 0 gauge, and can't be bothered with a 2nd in 00 atm.
All the Thomas MLP foamers in the comments😓. Was the GWR the first railway to experiment with Push-pull? I know they are the most famous for it, having retained it much later. I know the LBSCR, LSWR, and maybe the LMS had push pull steam service too.I think there was an air operated system as well.
0:07 Does this train look like a Hamster? German railfans call it like that🤣 By the way Germany heavily relies on "Wendezüge", trains that have a steering cab in the last coach (same concept as the steam engine example in the vid
"There are two ways of doing things: The Great Western way, or the wrong way." A quote from duck plus i liked theirs Duck theme. are you a Thomas & Friends Fan ?
Gordon, Henry, and James: don't we know it
Actully its a quote from city of truo
@@ierf1098 oh
@@ierf1098 Nah, that was definitely Duck in the episode where they introduced Diesel. It may have been reused by others, but Duck said it first.
Wesh and let an engine sleep.
Love your work. Also noticed the clever use of “Duck’s Theme” in there, since his model type also appears in the video and it is all about GWR. Look forward to more.
Yeah I noticed Duck's Theme too
If Oliver has a separate theme they should have used that. He is more known in the series for his auto coachrs
@@pilotbug6100 pretty sure he does have his own theme. And while your point is accurate, Duck is more synonymous with GWR.
Oliver and duck have different themes but duck is more remembered for the GWR because he is always talking about it. That is probably why he used it.
I wander who composed the version of the theme used in this video
Adding Duck’s theme was a nice touch considering it was on the Great Western Railway, loved this.
MM-HMM!!!!!!
A few years ago, I was buying OO gauge MK2 Regional Railways coaches for my model railway.
One of them confused me when it arrived because it didn't look like the others. I did some research and found out it was a GWR Autocoach... which someone had, inexplicably, painted in Regional Railways livery.
Rather than repaint it to be realistic, I took one of the 0-4-0 tank engines I'd never use (I like more modern stuff, but tank engines are what people get you when you're young) and repainted _that_ into Regional Railways livery.
It's absurd, but hey, that's the charm of it for me.
Network south east autocoach? 🤣
@@Interdimensional27 I'm sure Everard Junction would love to have one of those
You could’ve used it as a DBSO though
@@Sarahbryson321 I *could* do that, but it wouldn't look right next to more modern coaches.
And you can still see these steam loco hauled push-pull trains, and the steam powered coaches in use today, as there are preserved units on various heritage railways.
Being both a life-long rail fan and locomotive engineer, I never knew that a railroad had developed and operated a steam powered push-pull operation!
Thank you for the top shelf education!
Cheers.
This was a really interesting and informative video. I remember reading the railway series books as a kid and I was always confused on why Duck's coaches, Alice and Mirabelle, were referred to as autocoaches. Now it all makes sense and is really cool!
Here's something: Duck's class, a 5700, wasn't auto-fitted to use these coaches (unless you imagine him being fitted at Crovan's Gate Works); if you see a pannier in an autotrain nowadays, it's likely a 6400.
@@vincentmorris8431 Interesting. I could imagine him being fitted at Crovan's Gate, since those coaches were specifically given to him by Sir Topham Hatt. What about Oliver, though? I think his coaches, Dulcie and Isabelle, were also autocoaches.
@@JennyBlaze253 Yes, Oliver's class were intended for autotrains
@@vincentmorris8431 Ah, I see.
Real quick, since I don't know steam engine classes, what class is Oliver?
@@JennyBlaze253 He's a GWR 1400 autotank
Oh hey, that's Duck's theme!
Also i think Thomas has this feature when pulling Annie & Clarabel.
Although where i learned this was from a fanmade story, rather than an official one.
Thomas doesn't have Auto coaches Annie and clarabel are push and pull duck has Auto coaches in the Railway Series same thing goes for Oliver
@@LMS5935 I think Thomas had that feature in The Railway Series books, but not on the TV series.
Actually, if you pay close attention to the illustrations, Thomas is sometimes seen pushing Annie and Clarabel backwards, and even with a red tail lamp mounted!
@@exarkun42 did you read my comment I said push-and-pull coaches they're different from Auto coaches Annie and clarabel are Push Pull
@@robertknight4672 we do see Thomas a couple of times backing Annie and Clarabelle as if he is Push Pull in the TV series
Great video, as usual!
Also, love the orchestral Duck theme in the background!
I knew that music sounded so familiar.
I eat onions
I can’t believe you’re almost at 20k subscribers already, I remember a few months ago when you only had 500 subs. Great job!
Same
YT is promoting them more to people like me. They are a quality video.
@@millomweb yes
I can see why Duck holds great pride for the Great Western Railway 🚂
Someone's a fan of the GWR... But they came up with an idea decades ahead of its time and unlike most such experiments that fail, they stuck the landing. So yeah, they kind of deserve it.
0:54 was probably the inspiration for the season 6 episode ‘middle engine’
"Oh, Isabel's a funny coach,
"And so is Dulcie, too!
"If I didn't look after them,
"They'd know not what to do!"
-Oliver
Thomas’s coaches are multiple units as well. Annabel and Clarabel…
I've been on that Auto Coach at the Didcot Railway Centre.
Dude I’ve searched on TH-cam but there were no results for the history of the autocoach this is the only one I could find
Im glad someone did a video on this. Oliver from Thomas and Ffiends had Auto coaches in the Railway Series but never made it to the television screen. I have Oliver in HO scale and got mynhands on an Autocoach so i can run him backwards. Its really fun explaining to people what it is especially given here in America we didnt have anything like that although our solution to Branchline trains were the Gas powered Doodlebugs and later the Rail Diesle Cars.
Man I wish they adapted the auto coach for the TVS. Also,mit’s funny how the background music is Duck’s theme redone
@@owendinostudios1200 i thnk that may have been done intentionally in because many of the engines shown were Panier Tank engines and that was one of the tank engines used for Auto coaches. Heck i think one of the two in the books were assigned to Duck if im not mistaken.
@@PennsyPappas it’s funny how they brought in the slip coaches in season 18 I think
@@owendinostudios1200 Yeah i remember that but i dont think theyve done much with them lately which is a shame thats a jnique piece of railroad history unique to The UK that is being under utlized but then again Thomas and Friends isnt in to Real World Building as Earlier seasons of Thomas and Friends were.
I sometimes use old slow coach with either duck or Oliver on my wooden railway layout
"The Great Western Railway Might Have Been Ahead Of It's Time" Don't Forget Slip Coaches
Yeah, slip coaches would be perfect for this channel!
@@Desmaad guess what
I always thought these coaches were incredibly impressive.
2:14 Page 97 - 99 of 'A Pictorial Record of Great Western Engines Volume Two' has two images, one of 2120 with this casing on it and 2140 with it removed as well as several diagrams
Ooh good to know! Is there anyone online where I could find said image?
I did not know about the attempt to disguise the engines! Thankyou for the terrific video Thought!
in Europe it was quite common and up to 3 coaches could be between the engine and the autocoach fitted with the drivers cab.
Here come the Duck comments. Good video btw the auto coaches definitely were the great west.... I mean the right way for the future.
The Great western really did like experimenting with other things that other railways didn’t like
here the Auto coaches, and even some steam powered rail motors
On the contrary, the other railways liked the idea so much that most of them adopted it (in one form or another) in the following couple of decade.
I quite agree. The Great Western Railway proved to be a really revolutionary railway!
I'm a subber and always watch your informative videos, no matter how bizarre they might be. LOL
Cheers, Bob from Syracuse, NY
GWR being a big brain yet again
One of the many reasons why the Great Western is my favorite of the Big Four.
The Great Northern Railway (Ireland) had trains such as these operating between Dublin and Howth.
Like what Duck said "There are two ways of doing things: The Great Western way, or the wrong way."
i couldn't agree more
“I’m Great Western and-“
@@teaoftraffic Don't, we know it
Fun fact. in America commuter Railroads still run push-pull trains powered by diesel locomotives. The coach with the locomotive controls is called the cab car.
That is correct. My local commuter network, Metra, does as well, and even has one car in daily service dating from 1949, #553 in Chicago and Northwestern livery. Most, including the cab cars, date from the 1960s to 2000s.
I got about a minute in and realized you used Duck the Great Western engine's theme from Thomas. You sneak, I love it lmao
Wonderful!
Where did you get Duck's Theme?
Hey @Train of Thought the GWR’s steam railmotor also did that too (pretty much)
I have just discovered this channel and am enjoying it very much
Just to clarify: at 02:46 where you talk about the 0-4-2 1400 class (first built in 1932), you are actually showing a picture of an engine of the 0-4-2 517 class (last built in 1885). You don't explicitly say it is a 1400, I know.
Nice video, by the way.
As a kid I used to come back from school from Dorchester to Radipole Halt in an ex GWR autocoach running ahead of a 1400 0-4-2T loco. There was a speed indicator in the driver's compartment and it would sometimes hit 80mph descending from the Bincome tunnel. (That is my memory - did I dream it? I don't think so but I am no longer 100% sure.)
I can only imagine how those "housed" locomotives looked
There are drawings & photos in A Pictorial History of Great Western Engines Vol.2.
I've travelled on one. From Chippenham to Calne. Can't remember much about it though, I was about 5yrs old at the time....
Ta.
"We'll connect all the controls with long shafts through the coach! What could possibly go wrong?" :D
Here in Southern California, we have the modern version of this with single diesels at one end of a string of passenger cars, but the controls in the other end are electronic rather than mechanical. It works pretty well, until somebody parks a truck on a level crossing and there's nothing in front of the engineer and passengers but the end of that rail car...
same kind of system with the chicago metra that runs behind my house,
New York, Salt Lake City, Seattle, Philly, Miami, Virginia - they all use that system too.
We had a titanic accident a number of years ago when one of them running coach-first hit a heavy SUV and derailed. A friend of mine was killed and another critically injured. I see now the end coaches are more angled than they were. Hopefully they can deflect some of the impact. All level crossings are an invitation to disaster.
The GWR was only one among very many railways that used push-pull fitted sets. The idea spread very fast and most companies had them by the 1920's, it wasn't a GWR specialty as this video implies.
Your first example (the Midland Railway) worked in exactly the same way as your GWR auto-coach.
Commuter trains here in the States (and in Canada as well, as I understand) typically work through push-pull operations, nowadays, too; of course, these days, the push-pull functionality is achieved through placing one diesel-electric engine at one end of the train and what's known as a cab-coach at the other end - and the engine is controlled from the cab-coach by way of electronic multiple-unit, or MU, lash-ups between the cab-coach, any intermediate standard coaches (though I have yet to see such a train without standard coaches in the middle), and the back of the engine.
other railways would adopt similar 'Push Pull' systems including the southern and London Midland Scottish
Basically the predecessor to the modern-day cab cars/driving trailers.
Commuter trains in the U.S don't have two diesels on either side. They use the CabCar, a similar idea to the AutoCoach, but with many improvements.
love your videos maybe have a look at some werid ideas like steam powered diesels
My idea of a video about auto coaches otherwise known as slipping coaches came true. Thank you Train of thought you are a fountain of railway knowledge plus keep up the good work.
Slip coaches are quite different to auto coaches! Slip coaches were put on the rear of an express trains and released from the train to coast into a station that the express train didn’t stop at.
@@rolandharmer6402 That could be another good ideas for another video.
Love your videos, found your channel 3 days ago, and i already watched all of them! Subbed
Where is the set that ran for one season down in Cornwall, is it still in ticket?
The 0-4-2 loco @ timecode 3:01 is an LNWR loco pulling LNWR coaches, not the much later built GWR 0-4-2. Still a great video though, cheers.
I completely forgot about this, thanks for reminding me. (Also love the music from Thomas the tank engine)
Please may you make a video about the FS class 670? It is a very fascinating engine. Keep up the excellent work!
I cab here ducks theme from Thomas and friends. Nice touch to the episode
An engine in the middle of the train. That reminds me of the Thomas episode "Middle engine" where Harry and Bert play a trick, forcing Percy to be a middle engine. when the other engines make fun of Percy. James gets his comeuppance when hes a middle engine. however, to avoid looking silly, refuses to move, resulting in a very angry Fat Controller.
Adrian Vaughan's twin volume of GWR loco's has pictures of said camouflaged engine. OPC publishing or their successors will also have some on file. Hope this helps.
Glad that some steam is preserved, it should also be cleaned much often
Amazing! Great job
Oh my god finally I got to see the inside of one and its thanks to you.
Thank you.
Should have talk about the steam railmoter as it's a steam loco in the autocoach
I like how you added ducks theme in the background
There's a video called "Dulcie's ghost", by shunterproductions, that makes a great example for this video!!
Brilliant I’d love to see a push pull now days
I hear that Duck Theme, nice touch of it
"There are two ways of doing things:
The Great western way or the wrong way"
It wasn't just the GWR using this kind of method. the Southern and one of the pre-Grouping railways making up the LMS the LNWR (and probably other as well) had this kind of equipment.
I knew this already , it worked with 14XXs, panniers and some few other GWR tank engines
Always nice to hear Duck's theme
Here’s a question - did the GWR ever use auto-coaches with tender engines? I’ve only ever seen it work with tank engines.
You should cover the doodle bug next! You are literally driving the passenger car!
I got it! A Steam Railcar with an Autocoach! Stonks!
Awesome video
Not a bad idea, it's actually a pretty good idea.
Long live the GWR!
Push pulls were used between Sunderland and South Sheilds in the 1950s . Until Beeching closed the line to South Sheilds
Mom? Can we have Cab Car?
No, we have Cab Car at home.
Cab Car at home:
Are there any autocoaches in preservation
Beautiful
I thought Duck was a fan of slip coaches, autocoaches are more Oliver's thing.
Was this also the beginning of diesel railcars?
The legend says that Thomas was specially built to be a push pull tank
that's only fan fiction
We see him pushing the coaches quite often, & sometimes with tail lamps on his front, suggesting backwards running (see the illustration in Woolly Bear, where he is laughing at Percy. He carries black lamps with red lenses, suggesting he was running backwards.)
Your photos show other companies' examples of auto or "push-pull" steam train working, which were arguably superior to the GWR system in that they were worked by compressed air and not mechanically-operated as with the GW. Where were trains in passenger service propelled by a locomotive and crew at the trailing end with no one taking care of the leading end?
Trouble was, I liked to sit the direction the train was going, could never be sure I d got it right !!😄
This is where those seats parallel to the coach body come in handy.
0:17 we still do that here in Victoria australia
It wasn't just the Western Railway which used this concept.
This is some steam punk shiz right here and I love it!
The max number of coaches a GWR autotrain could have was 4. 2 in front and 2 behind the loco. I can only afford 1 autocoach in 0 gauge, and can't be bothered with a 2nd in 00 atm.
short but sweet
Very interesting.
That's Interesting I Like It
Oh so its the first cab car essentially?
(They say I waddle) A quote from duck
You just had to use that theme didn't you.
Ah, yes, Duck’s theme.
Poggers, more ToT content :)
Love this channel
Pls do one about Japanese steam locomotives or Thai steam locomotives I would be ecstatic if you did so
All the Thomas MLP foamers in the comments😓. Was the GWR the first railway to experiment with Push-pull? I know they are the most famous for it, having retained it much later. I know the LBSCR, LSWR, and maybe the LMS had push pull steam service too.I think there was an air operated system as well.
Apparently most of the British railways adopted it sooner or later. With varying forms of control.
Well done
0:07 Does this train look like a Hamster? German railfans call it like that🤣
By the way Germany heavily relies on "Wendezüge", trains that have a steering cab in the last coach (same concept as the steam engine example in the vid