Thanks good information , I'm dealing with 43 inch wall cabinets that are a full overlay door and close to the ceiling I'll have to build on heels to the crown molding first and use that method , Thanks .
Interesting... We do a lot of full overlay doors and we usually install blocking flush with the cabinet box to fasten our crown molding to. We have the mullet effect that you're talking about but it has never appeared abnormal to myself, the crew, or clients. We have never considered it a problem. I will take this into consideration.
Super video. The "non-mullet" installation looks really good. Great explanation about how to install when your cabinets have 90 degree corners. However, what do you do with that corner cabinet that has two 45 degree angles off the sides of the face? How do you get the crown projecting over the door, but still have the sides flush with the cabinet? Do the corners of the crown go over the edges of the door, or do you do some kind of jig-jog with the crown to line it up with the door? Thanks in advance for your sage wisdom!
Thanks for the kind words Brad! Yes, corner cabinets get tricky quickly! I always aim for "visual balance." With that in mind, there are a couple of things you can do to get close. If the corner cabinet door overlay is adjusted so that the face of the door is roughly 1.5" narrower than the cabinet face I would recommend adding a filler piece above the door to bring the crown out even with the face of the door and angle the filler piece inwards at 45 degrees on both sides so you can miter the crown for the returns. This would create a slight gap where the door doesn't cover the filler, but I think this would provide the best visual balance for this situation. If the door is the same size as the cabinet face I would probably put the filler piece in the front, but cut the ends at 90 degrees, so it covers the full width of the cabinet face, then cut pieces for the ends (returns) that each have a 45 degree cut to join with the front piece. The end fillers will need to be proportionally thinner than the face piece (the 45 degree angle on the end fillers should be equal to the thickness of the face filler). What this does is line up the corner of the moulding very closely with the edge of the door and it reduces the imbalance between the face and the ends. If you use a face filler of .875" the corresponding end piece would only need to be .5" thick. This brings the crown forward .875" at the front and .5" at the ends. I do not think going with a 5-piece method where the crown returns in .875" between the face and the ends will be the best visual balance. I think it would bring unwanted attention to the situation, compared to either of the 3-piece methods listed above. I know that was a long and rambling answer, but I'm hoping it helps. Best of luck! ~Dan
I like this idea but, I have a concern that your video doesn't cover. Our "full" overlay doors are about 3/8" below the top of the cabinet. The top edge of the door is 3/8" below the top edge of the cabinet. If I do what you're suggesting, and was planning to do, there will be a 3/8" gap between the board that the crown nails to and the top edge of the door. So I guess I could rabbit the board to drop it down and reduce most of the 3/8" gap. What I'm wondering is; what do most people do in that situation? Leave the gap?
@@keystonewoodspecialties1973 i've got same issue i think-- vertical side rail protrudes abt 1/4" from side wall of cabinets with full overlay doors.. I've seen videos that show notching that out-- tough pill to swallow cutting my wood cabinets! which may be what @bruce q is describing
@@jpvmd Hi jpvmd! I've seen installers address your situation two different ways: 1. Exactly how you described, by notching the face frame where the crown moulding turns from the face to the end. 2. I've seen installers install a piece of inverted scribe moulding towards the top of the cabinet end to build out the end flush with the edge of the face frame so you don't have to notch the face frame and your crown moulding can be installed on top of the scribe. Some will hold the scribe flush with the bottom of the crown, others will extend it down a little bit with the radius of the scribe exposed. Hopefully that helps! Happy installing! ~Dan
I'm needing to replace kitchen cabinet 2" crown molding and still match the existing molding on other parts of the cabinets. House built in 1998 and I can't find matching molding at either Lowes or Home Depot. Coincidently, I came to this video and noticed my crown molding I believe matches the sample shown during the beginning of your video. Any suggestions how to match this or where to buy 2" molding?
Great video I wish you could have opened the cabinet door to have a peek at it … what is the name of that crown molding you used? Do you know if it comes in a shorter version?
Hi Tim, If you're using crown moulding with the heel attached and you have room from above, I recommend screwing down from above into the cabinet. You can also nail from above, but I prefer screws. If you're attaching the crown to a nailer block you'll probably need to nail through the finished side into the nailer. If you're looking to avoid that you can either glue and clamp it, or use CA Glue, like Starbond. It bonds in seconds, so make sure you have it in place. Hopefully that helps! ~Dan
Very good video. I am curious if you have ideas for installing an elevated crown moulding where the ceiling height is say 4-6 inches above the cabinet top? I am using IKEA full frame cabinets and struggling with how to connect nicely a crown moulding. thank you. Just discovered you but will watch more. Keep safe and thank you for making a difference.
I prefer to use 7/8" thick solid stock, which is roughly the thickness of the door plus the space between the door and the cabinet (~1/8"). If you have thicker doors, I would adjust the thickness accordingly. I typically only finish 1 long edge, which is the edge pointing down, and then install the crown flush with the bottom of the blocking material. I hope this helps! ~Dan
Just out of curiosity how to you plan to install that crown with a heal after the cabinets are up and they are 36" uppers in a standard 8' ceiling? I have found that (all in 1) heal crown combo making for a very sloppy install and problematic. Help me out if you can.
I only use crown with heel when I have enough room above the cabinets to fasten it from above. However, I do know of some installers that will use crown with heel even if the crown goes close to the ceiling. They will drill and screw the moulding from underneath. Whenever I'm installing, I prefer to use the blocking method and use conventional crown moulding (without the heel). Hope that helps! Happy installing! ~Dan
I plan on installing crown using the “heal” method and pulling the front out so the crown is almost flush with the overlay door front. But I have a problem. I have two taller wdc273615 diagonal wall cabinets that I want to wrap all the way around back to the wall with crown but when I pull the front crown forward, it also moves the side crown away from the sides so I have a large reveal on the sides too. If I cut the heal and crown to be flush with the 1/4” stiles on the sides, the miter joints move inward on the front and don’t align with the 45 degree corner of the cabinet. I’m afraid this will not look right either way I do it. Any suggestions?
There are definitely some no-win situations where you have to make compromises to get the best look in the situation at hand. It sounds like this might be one of them. If you send some pictures of what you’re up against to info@keystonewood.com I’ll be happy to give some recommendations. ~Dan
Thank you for explaining minor cosmetic details that only seasoned carpenters would notice. No real connection to a mullet hairdo 😏Also, I think video title should change: "crown molding overlay recommendations👍🏻
Very good…… but for simpletons like me, you have forgotten to address the issue of measuring and cutting the 45 degree cut. Surely that is part of “installing crown moulding”. My web search continues 😊
THANK YOU! i literally had no idea how to install the molding with the "heel". thank you so much for the video!
Thanks good information , I'm dealing with 43 inch wall cabinets that are a full overlay door and close to the ceiling I'll have to build on heels to the crown molding first and use that method , Thanks .
Interesting... We do a lot of full overlay doors and we usually install blocking flush with the cabinet box to fasten our crown molding to. We have the mullet effect that you're talking about but it has never appeared abnormal to myself, the crew, or clients. We have never considered it a problem. I will take this into consideration.
I too have never heard of the mullet effect. I'm kind of guilty myself doing that sometimes 😬.
Can you do a video with starter moulding, thank you 😊
Thanks for the lesson. Where can you buy crown molding with a heel?
You will have to make it. Add a 1x2 to the crown. Glue and pins nails, or finish nails.
Your explanation of the heel crown save the day! Thank you!
Super video. The "non-mullet" installation looks really good. Great explanation about how to install when your cabinets have 90 degree corners. However, what do you do with that corner cabinet that has two 45 degree angles off the sides of the face? How do you get the crown projecting over the door, but still have the sides flush with the cabinet? Do the corners of the crown go over the edges of the door, or do you do some kind of jig-jog with the crown to line it up with the door?
Thanks in advance for your sage wisdom!
Thanks for the kind words Brad!
Yes, corner cabinets get tricky quickly! I always aim for "visual balance." With that in mind, there are a couple of things you can do to get close.
If the corner cabinet door overlay is adjusted so that the face of the door is roughly 1.5" narrower than the cabinet face I would recommend adding a filler piece above the door to bring the crown out even with the face of the door and angle the filler piece inwards at 45 degrees on both sides so you can miter the crown for the returns. This would create a slight gap where the door doesn't cover the filler, but I think this would provide the best visual balance for this situation.
If the door is the same size as the cabinet face I would probably put the filler piece in the front, but cut the ends at 90 degrees, so it covers the full width of the cabinet face, then cut pieces for the ends (returns) that each have a 45 degree cut to join with the front piece. The end fillers will need to be proportionally thinner than the face piece (the 45 degree angle on the end fillers should be equal to the thickness of the face filler). What this does is line up the corner of the moulding very closely with the edge of the door and it reduces the imbalance between the face and the ends. If you use a face filler of .875" the corresponding end piece would only need to be .5" thick. This brings the crown forward .875" at the front and .5" at the ends.
I do not think going with a 5-piece method where the crown returns in .875" between the face and the ends will be the best visual balance. I think it would bring unwanted attention to the situation, compared to either of the 3-piece methods listed above.
I know that was a long and rambling answer, but I'm hoping it helps. Best of luck!
~Dan
Thanks Dan, I have always hated install crown mudding. Thank showing us the diffrent between them 2. 🙏
I like this idea but, I have a concern that your video doesn't cover. Our "full" overlay doors are about 3/8" below the top of the cabinet. The top edge of the door is 3/8" below the top edge of the cabinet. If I do what you're suggesting, and was planning to do, there will be a 3/8" gap between the board that the crown nails to and the top edge of the door. So I guess I could rabbit the board to drop it down and reduce most of the 3/8" gap. What I'm wondering is; what do most people do in that situation? Leave the gap?
Finally!! Someone provides a video with explanations I was looking for!! Thank you!!
If your moving crown molding out to to the face of the door what do you do about the side of cabinets with the side rail sticking out
Hi Bruce!
I'm not sure what scenario you're describing. Could you send a sketch or a photo of the situation you're describing?
Thanks!
~Dan
@@keystonewoodspecialties1973 i've got same issue i think-- vertical side rail protrudes abt 1/4" from side wall of cabinets with full overlay doors.. I've seen videos that show notching that out-- tough pill to swallow cutting my wood cabinets! which may be what @bruce q is describing
@@jpvmd Hi jpvmd!
I've seen installers address your situation two different ways: 1. Exactly how you described, by notching the face frame where the crown moulding turns from the face to the end. 2. I've seen installers install a piece of inverted scribe moulding towards the top of the cabinet end to build out the end flush with the edge of the face frame so you don't have to notch the face frame and your crown moulding can be installed on top of the scribe. Some will hold the scribe flush with the bottom of the crown, others will extend it down a little bit with the radius of the scribe exposed.
Hopefully that helps! Happy installing!
~Dan
I'm needing to replace kitchen cabinet 2" crown molding and still match the existing molding on other parts of the cabinets. House built in 1998 and I can't find matching molding at either Lowes or Home Depot. Coincidently, I came to this video and noticed my crown molding I believe matches the sample shown during the beginning of your video. Any suggestions how to match this or where to buy 2" molding?
Where can I buy that molding
Great video I wish you could have opened the cabinet door to have a peek at it … what is the name of that crown molding you used? Do you know if it comes in a shorter version?
where can I get that full overlay mouding?
How do I nail/screw the heel to crown? I have plenty of room above as the ceiling is vaulted, I don't want to nail on the crown finished side.
Hi Tim,
If you're using crown moulding with the heel attached and you have room from above, I recommend screwing down from above into the cabinet. You can also nail from above, but I prefer screws. If you're attaching the crown to a nailer block you'll probably need to nail through the finished side into the nailer. If you're looking to avoid that you can either glue and clamp it, or use CA Glue, like Starbond. It bonds in seconds, so make sure you have it in place.
Hopefully that helps!
~Dan
finding crown moulding with heel in the US? Do you know of a commercial vendor or should I just build it by gluing crown to 1x2?
Very good video. I am curious if you have ideas for installing an elevated crown moulding where the ceiling height is say 4-6 inches above the cabinet top? I am using IKEA full frame cabinets and struggling with how to connect nicely a crown moulding. thank you. Just discovered you but will watch more. Keep safe and thank you for making a difference.
Great video and visual examples like this way or teaching defiantly nice layout
Good video , may I know where could I find crown with return bottom? searched on some box stores but no luck finding
Make your own
what kind and size board do you use for the blocking method? something like 5/4 ripped, finished and installed?
I prefer to use 7/8" thick solid stock, which is roughly the thickness of the door plus the space between the door and the cabinet (~1/8"). If you have thicker doors, I would adjust the thickness accordingly. I typically only finish 1 long edge, which is the edge pointing down, and then install the crown flush with the bottom of the blocking material. I hope this helps!
~Dan
great video. Where can I find crown with a "heel?" Google has let me down!
You have to make it yourself
Just out of curiosity how to you plan to install that crown with a heal after the cabinets are up and they are 36" uppers in a standard 8' ceiling? I have found that (all in 1) heal crown combo making for a very sloppy install and problematic. Help me out if you can.
I only use crown with heel when I have enough room above the cabinets to fasten it from above. However, I do know of some installers that will use crown with heel even if the crown goes close to the ceiling. They will drill and screw the moulding from underneath. Whenever I'm installing, I prefer to use the blocking method and use conventional crown moulding (without the heel). Hope that helps! Happy installing! ~Dan
Great video. I always wondered and you did a great job explaining.
Super helpful - thank you!
I don't get it - the front and side look 100% the same from where I'm sitting
I plan on installing crown using the “heal” method and pulling the front out so the crown is almost flush with the overlay door front. But I have a problem. I have two taller wdc273615 diagonal wall cabinets that I want to wrap all the way around back to the wall with crown but when I pull the front crown forward, it also moves the side crown away from the sides so I have a large reveal on the sides too. If I cut the heal and crown to be flush with the 1/4” stiles on the sides, the miter joints move inward on the front and don’t align with the 45 degree corner of the cabinet. I’m afraid this will not look right either way I do it. Any suggestions?
Where did you find crown with that return bottom? I want to use something like what he used in this video but I cannot find it anywhere!
There are definitely some no-win situations where you have to make compromises to get the best look in the situation at hand. It sounds like this might be one of them. If you send some pictures of what you’re up against to info@keystonewood.com I’ll be happy to give some recommendations. ~Dan
Thank you!
Thank you for explaining minor cosmetic details that only seasoned carpenters would notice. No real connection to a mullet hairdo 😏Also, I think video title should change: "crown molding overlay recommendations👍🏻
Very good…… but for simpletons like me, you have forgotten to address the issue of measuring and cutting the 45 degree cut. Surely that is part of “installing crown moulding”. My web search continues 😊
Hi. Did you find a good link on the 45°? I’m facing the same issue now as I start my install.
Finally it's explained correctly
Excellent video. Thank you
Thank you for you’re knowledgeable video!
You didn't show HOW to do it. How do you make the crown molding come out flush with the door?
Great info.
Great vid thanks
I learn something new - good job thank you
Thanks in the process of installing crown molding now. I like the heel method and will try that out.
I've installed cabs for 25 yrs and quite frankly we don't use any of these methods
😎
Thanks
It looks like I installed all my cabinets upside down.
Great explanation! Thanks!