@ amit kumar Yes, 500 quid is entry level for a serious cyclist watching this channel. New or from eBay, spend it enjoy the ride for years (maybe decades) and look at it as amortized investment.
amit kumar bear in mind this is just a DT Swiss advert. My “good” wheels retailed at £550 and I paid more like £350 at sale price. They are undoubtedly a better ride than the stock wheels on my Giant TCR, have covered 10,000km so far, self serviced hubs twice, and expect to get another 20,000km+ from them, if not considerably more. On a £1700 bike I consider that a good investment but the law of diminishing returns (and a family) make it pretty difficult to justify anything better- I love every ride I do and doubt I’d get 3 or 4 times the enjoyment from very high end wheels (and I see very few others on the road with very high end kit). Don’t worry about it, buy what you can afford and enjoy the ride.
@@jeffs5519 serious cyclists watching this? He is explaining what the difference between rim brakes and a disc brakes are, this is ment for beginners I think.
If you are upgrading your bike, £500 is entry level. If you are too tight to spend £500, then you are into the wrong sport. If you are too poor to afford £500, go out and hustle. You could make £500 in less than a month, reselling things from car boot/garage sales on eBay.
Carbon doesn’t dissipate heat as well as aluminum and can reach such high temp that the resin can liquify and destroy/wobble the rims mid ride. Do not ride the brakes with carbon. Typically not a problem unless you’re an unconfident decender.
@Drew Kangaroo carbon ceramic is a little differnt to normal carbon and as the brake is to the rim itself at high temps the resin melts and the rim falls apart under you on a long fast decline with alot of braking
@@Whatsth3ruckus You'd be lucky if your innertube blows out before the rims heat crumble. It'll probably still destroy the wheel but it's probably more controllable to slow down and stop with. The "heats up more quickly" is kind of an illusion. It's not so much that heat is generated more quickly, it's the material doesn't dissipate the heat as quickly. The end result is the same "Reaches higher temperatures faster"
I mean... he should have gotten a lower range rim and compared that to his mid range. And then compared the mid to the high end... not everyone has that kind of money
@@OriginalAustinOblivion 1600 is not high end though. Princeton Carbon Works or Lightweights are high end and they cost more than double the DT Swiss' price tag
This is all very well, but without quantifying the benefit of the "improved" features, it's a bit meaningless. How much extra speed (or watts saved) does the extra £1200 deliver, on the flat / climbing / downhill ? Interesting to see that the premium wheels are actually heavier than the budget wheels.
Learn to build your own wheels. You can build a high end set of lightweight wheels for around the same price of the budget wheels shown here. For example I recently built; Dura Ace 7900 NOS- £180 Lightbicycle 700C-FALCON-rim RRU55T02-25mm wide-55mm deep with Grooved Graphene Brake surface Tubular - £305 Sapin CX Ray spokes £128 Total £613 (for my Budget £2000 6.8 Kg build) My Budget Wheels would be Shimano FH-5800 hubs + H Plus Son TB14 Road Rim + Sapim Laser spokes Typical cost would be around £220
I use aluminum chinese wheel, 45mm deep 2kg weight and very durable and it only cost around 190$ Im 95kg, hit some potholes and the wheels is still true AF (The true budget wheelset in my definition)
The percentage of comments that disagree with this video’s definition of budget is both staggeringly high and hilarious! I also concur with the disagreement.
I've recently tried Canyon Bikes with differing premium wheelsets. The carbon rim brake bike (The Ultimate CF SLX 9.0 Di2) is kind of hard to stop quickly downhill and I kept finding myself going a little faster till I end up at the bottom of the hill, The carbon disc brake bike (Aeroad CF SLX Disc 9.0 Di2) managed to stop quickly mid-way down hill and was able to control my descent. All in all, I might hop on to disc brakes some day.
A video that highlights the disconnect between reality and the bubble of journalism. Nearly £500 isn’t budget, for so many people it’d be a very large outlay.
Right, for 500 quid you can get nowadays and entire bike, well kept maybe even carbon if the deal is really good...I mean an entire bike! This guy in the vid above, simply lost touch with reality, and just talking to a camera in his LA LA Land, juggling with top end wheels in both hands.......
I made it to 1:26 before I had to come to the comments to make sure they were satisfactorily incredulous. Not disappointed! What I am disappointed with is the quality and content of cycling weakly's videos.
how bad are rim brakes with carbon rims in wet/damp conditions ? s it completely no-go ? Imagine i'm riding in a cloud or fog (no rain but everything is wet), can i stop my bike? or for first 10 meters brakes don't slow down the bike ?
Mr Stanhope I’m about to buy my first carbon Wheelset and from what I have read on more detailed and budget oriented reviews and forums, you should ideally get something between 45-55 or 60 mm deep. Everything below that doesn’t give you the “free speed” or sustained momentum you want from carbon wheels, so you are best off buying a good set of alloy wheels instead if you are looking at 25-35mm carbon wheels. And anything above 65 mm probably isn’t very clever as well as a first deep Wheelset for most because of the high crosswind effects and the limited all round versatility for climbing, etc. But I am also still sceptical about how big the actual performance gains are and mostly also consider them because I want to add some bling to my bike
@@Paganizondaf650 What wheelset are you going for? I do look at carbon wheels but can never decide if the benefits outweigh the cost? Genuinely curious as to speed gains plus if they are more comfortable.
Mr Stanhope they are definitely not more comfortable. Carbon rims themselves are much stiffer than aluminium ones and through that most Wheelset range from stiffer to ride quality impairingly stiff. A speed gain of about 2-3 km/h on your average speed is possible. I’m looking at the Roval CL 50 disc
I went from 700 euro lightweights to mavic exhailt carbon wheels around 1000 and a slight bit heavier I must say the difference was night and day I highly recommend them. Tyres make a difference too cantbeat the conti grand prix 4000
Just for comparison, you can get top quality carbon, deep section wheels, UCI approved and weighing just over 1300 grams for around £500. Even Hunt will sell you a set of top quality, 1500gram alloy wheels for £400. I'm not sure what's going on here.
The video was actually very informative, I now know the reality you live in so I can make an informative disicion abouts clicking your future videos... Thank you very much and continue the work...
you are very wrong about spokes mate. Flt ones aren't lighter, in fact are the very same as rounded ones, but they are prensed in the factory to be more aero, mass is the very same, it only changes shape.
How much for 'budget' wheels ??????? What a great way of putting off potential newbies 😕😕😕 I think Cycling Weekly needs to review who it's target audience is, as judging from many of the comments here, you are aiming at the elitist rider and not a general audience!!!!
This is probably first time I'm genuinely surprised at use of word "budget" in comparison videos. I mean there are often cases when you reasonably can call stuff budget when it's more expensive than common stuff, especially in niche interest group, but holly molly.
Since when was £500 entry level?!?!? I upgraded my old stock wheels for a set of Cero AR24 Evo's for only £189 and that included a free set of Continental tyres! The Ceros are lighter at only 1499g also.
The entry level DT Swiss road wheels are the P1800. Not the PR1600. The PR1600s are midrange wheels. Also some of the high end wheels by DT Swiss are still made of aluminium. Like the PR1400 and the oxic, also the 35mm PRC1400 Carbon wheel is heavier than the Aluminium PR1400 dicut so carbon wheels are not always lighter. Also DT Swiss hubs are upgradable so you can have the same engagement in any of the DT wheels 1600 and up. Finally, carbon rim wheels deal with heat less well than aluminium. You are more likely to pop your tyres on a hot carbon rim when coming down a hill than aluminium. Try to do more detailed research for the next video, new riders will trust what you say so it's important you get it right. As a DT Swiss dealer I would prefer you to buy carbon wheels because I make more money on them... but if you see my bike you will see the TOP of the range DT Aluminium wheels on it. 😉
The answer I was not only looking for but also intuitively felt was correct. Carbon wheels are nice because they look fancy, are really stiff and come in crazy aero shapes which might or might not save you 0.7 Watts. And they look fancy. Also, they look fancy. On the other end, a solid DT swiss asymmetrical rim, aero spokes and a 240 hub looks boring AF but it's light, stable, eats everything you throw at it and you don't have to sell a kidney. But they look boring AF.
For budget wheels id go for the HUNT ones at £329 about 1420gms. Spot on for BUDGET. I'd put them on a decent bike given there performance at that price point.
I was wondering whether to upgrade my wheels but you’ve convinced me it’s a total waste of money. For an extra £1000 I can get a pair which is made of carbon but still slightly heavier as well as being less robust. As I’m not a pro rider the aerodynamic benefits must be regarded as of negligible value. The angle of engagement argument is just pointless. It’s only ever of any benefit when you stop pedalling and restart, and a difference in angle of 10 degrees can hardly be worth more than 1/100th of a second in catching up with the freewheel. I could work it out but I really can’t be bothered. The key reason for getting carbon wheels, it seems to me, is to demonstrate just how much money you can afford to waste.
I’m not sure what I was supposed to learn here... maybe the title could’ve been more in line with the subject cause pretty much what I got, in general, was: Budget wheels - aluminum (check) Expensive wheels - carbon (check)
Hambini, the engineer said that these aero wheels have turbulence and when the wind hits the sides of the wheels than it is no longer aero dynamic. So go with the wheel sets have less dish on the rims. I do have a slightly aero wheel set by DT Swiss and they are the DT Swiss R460 with Shimano Ultegra Hubs. They do work fine and they are fast on a downhill. They did cost me nearly $300. A good deal!
Aluminium rims will overheat less than carbon ones due to braking, while also offering better braking power even in ideal conditions. Don't know who told you that carbon rims offer better braking in the dry or that are less prone to overheat than aluminium ones.
Yes that age old cycling saying "you would ride your bomb proof wheels in the winter and your deep section carbon wheels in the summer". I remember Mercxx saying that after his first grand tour win.
Indeed. And Vittorio Adorni, in second place, turned to him and said, "But Eddy, what the hell is a 'deep section carbon wheel'?" Merckx just shrugged. "It's just a saying. Sayings don't always make sense."
Yes, just thinking about the exquisite and profound math behind them makes me crave a gilded and overpriced bottle of wine and an actual pie that I can enjoy while smoothly riding away into pure existential bliss as I contemplate the joy that is a $2000 set of bicycle wheels.
Disliked. Full of lies. Usually companies spend money on the frame and gear set. So a 1500£ bike might have a wheel set around 100-200£. The frame might be around 500-700£. The wheels are upgradeable! Why would they sink money into something the buyer might not notice so much and a serious rider would upgrade. FYI my 290£ bike is coming in this week and am hearing of budget 500£ wheel set.
Just get a good pair of hubs like a Hope RS4, 32 hole - £200 Just buy some aluminium rims such a pair of Mavic Open Pro Tubular CD Road Rims - £85 Just build them with some Sapim CX rays - £120 - Weight around 1400 grams Glue some Vittoria Corsa Graphene tubs on your wheels. Total cost is around £500. These would not be called entry level budget wheels.
You can get 32 hole mavic open pro wheels with DT swiss double butted spokes, brass nipples and ultegra hubs for about 340 or so us dollars. Oh and they come tubeless ready if that's your thing
As many people have already said, this should have been a comparison between a budget manufacturer and a high-end one. For instance: some 200 euro chinese oem rims (Farsports, lightbycicle or even yoeleo) on novatec, bitex or Miche primato hubs vs swisside rims on dt top-of-line hubs. spoiler alert: the difference is not big ;)
Looking for advice related to budget upgrades. I have Axis Sport wheels and esport tires on my specialized diverge. I can get a set of Lightly used DT Swiss r470 with WTB riddler tires for what looks like a reasonable price. Is this upgrade worth it (will it make a difference)? It looks like I save 300g on the rims alone.
Hey. Now i have a dillema . I have a older more worn mavic ssc (hubs run great..wheel is true just the brake rim is concave) ..and quite new specialized axis 2.0 roughly 350gr heavier than mavics .i can kinda sense a speed/acceleration increase on mavics Which would you use? (Commuting .casual)
Budget verses premium ? I'm still riding on the same 27 year old tires that came with my vintage specialized mountain bike when I bought it new back in 1992.
Pr1600 is NOT entry level wheels and definitely theay do not come on bikes 1000”-1500 price point. They don’t even come with bikes at 3000 price point.
Why are hubs with less engagement more durable? I would've guessed a hub with more engagement is more durable because the load is spread out between more pawls.
I watched a video aimed at bike noobs about general things to do and not do, many of them obvious. The next video I watch is seemingly aimed at Olympic athletes and compares expensive high end "budget" gear to really high end and actually premium "premium" gear. Both are from the same channel. I can't decide if they are trying to make videos that are relevant to normal people or bike fanatics with lots of money to waste.
Who the hell is this vid for? If you are so much of a beginner you need the types of wheels and braking systems explained you ain't in the market for either of those wheel sets.
I think I've missed a trick !..... when I started riding 1999,a good bike was £600 . A top bike £1600 . I paid a visit to a top shop recently and had to do to the doctors for medication afterwards . Today a "good " bike is £5000!!!!...a top bike £9000 . (The best bike was £12000)
l got my shimano RS wheelset for $125CDN from wiggle and now with over 2000km on them they work great and still true ,weight 4.6lbs with 32a/ 11-32 CASSETTE half of what the original steel 27s weighed . And l ROLF wheels that came with my old TREK carbon ,semi aero , that work great too but do catch those side winds so l can only imaging what super deep section wheels would be horrible around here !! So my only upgrade would be lighter when time arises and only carbon if the price is right and MUCH less weight ,at least a kg if l m going to spend the money .....
The hub engagement is interesting with MTB where you regurarely stop pedalling. It brings almost nothing with road cycling. That's not going to give you a second
Get "prime Pro Road wheelset" on wiggle. They are good. There's aero ones too for £499. Think I paid something like 300 for set and they weigh just over 1500g. Not far off mavic and other good brands. They are currently £244 in a sale
Despite its depth, will the prc 1400 be more efficient uphill than the 1600 spline ? I currently ride a pair of ARC 1100 disc in 65mm (which came with my new bike). So far, going uphill with these wheels is not really a problem. I wonder if I would notice a huge difference between my current ARC 1100 65mm and a pair of ARC 1100 48mm ? Is it worth it to change ?
If people want quality wheels "(budget wheels 500 £)", they should buy a frameset instead of the complete bike. Most manufacturers save the money on the package in the wheelset. If you want what he refers to "budget" wheels, you'll be looking at a very expensive bike. The only realistic option is to build the bike yourself. An added bonus is that you can customize the crank arm length to suit your legs and the stem length, as well as gearing and tires etc. Much better to get the exact parts you need instead of upgrading and replacing.
Carbon braking doesn't dissipate heat very well. No issue with tubulars but most people are running clinchers. Carbon clincher wheels have the greatest chance of failing under excessive heat from braking. That's the main reason why disc brakes exist for road bikes. Companies have spent millions of dollars over the years , and haven't been able to solve that issue. Well, they did find a solution. They moved the brakes...ala disc brakes.
The term "budget" is subjective. And for most of us 1k-500$ isn't. Put these head on with the *_real_* budget chinese off brand wheels like Superteam and Yoeleo, etc., and you see basically no difference but save a bit of weight.
Why do you say carbon wheels are lighter ? You weight both at the beginning and the aluminium set is 1.58kg while the carbon is 1.63 (lighter material but more of it due to the rim depth I guess).
Weighs the wheels while extolling the expensive wheel as being lighter...only to have the carbon wheel be heavier than the budget wheel. Also, carbon rim braking surface is better than aluminum braking surface in braking performance? Who wrote this stuff?
i don't think rim brakes perform less with carbon wheel on wet .. team ineos uses rim brakes with no braking problems on wet stages in this year's giro .. they are even often in front of the peloton and are flying on descents with rim brakes on carbon wheels
You missed the part of the warranty. ENVE wheels cost 3 grand for example, but in return you get a no questions asked lifetime warranty and free crash replacement on your wheel set (also covers spokes, hubs, nipples, labour cost and postage). I could lay my wheel set down the drive way and ride over it with my car, for a new set, should I think that the rims had too much rock strikes on them or whatever...
For what reason a hobby rider need carbon wheels that are heavier and more expensive? since we riding bikes we love numbers, so how much stiffer and more aero is the bling bling carbon wheel? 5%? come on guys, dont sell us this bullshit.
65mm is huge in wind...if you want to die beneth of wheel of cars...this is the choice. I have mavic cosmic pro ust sl 45mm, in lateral winds must to push counter strong if you want to finish alive the ride😀
Up next: Which car is best the budget Bugatti Veyron or the performance Bugatti Chiron?
Bugatti are doing a budget range now? I must check this out
You've got a pretty big budget if you can afford either.
@@happydays8171 I think that's OPs' point... the Budget wheels att 495$... 🤣
They're all budget, compared to a real one.
HAHAH exactly my thoughts.
Never seen a bike from £1k to £1.5k with a £500 set of wheels on!
chris white exactly
What about Decathlon Bikes? They usually come with mavic wheelsets which cost about 4-500 bucks..
@@ooldmka just done a quick search and the £1.4k Van Rysel RR900 comes with mavic aksium wheels that are for sale on decathlon for £143.99
chris white Doesn’t make any sense at all, unless that’s either a genuine mistake or a sales plug...
One exception I had was. Moda Rubato. 1000 pounds bike with American Classic aero wheels. But the groupsetupset was microshit (microshift)
so budget wheels are 500 quid...damn, i need to stop watching this channel. makes me feel poor af so regularly.
@ amit kumar Yes, 500 quid is entry level for a serious cyclist watching this channel. New or from eBay, spend it enjoy the ride for years (maybe decades) and look at it as amortized investment.
amit kumar bear in mind this is just a DT Swiss advert. My “good” wheels retailed at £550 and I paid more like £350 at sale price. They are undoubtedly a better ride than the stock wheels on my Giant TCR, have covered 10,000km so far, self serviced hubs twice, and expect to get another 20,000km+ from them, if not considerably more. On a £1700 bike I consider that a good investment but the law of diminishing returns (and a family) make it pretty difficult to justify anything better- I love every ride I do and doubt I’d get 3 or 4 times the enjoyment from very high end wheels (and I see very few others on the road with very high end kit). Don’t worry about it, buy what you can afford and enjoy the ride.
@@jeffs5519 serious cyclists watching this? He is explaining what the difference between rim brakes and a disc brakes are, this is ment for beginners I think.
You are poor. Just embrace it and quit whining.
@@jeffs5519 A serious cyclist would know these are both obsolete in 5 years.
£495 budget? Come on! Also show me a £1,500 bike which comes with these as standard!
Exactly
@@skinnbones11811 Exactly 2.
@@seakayaker20 exactly 3
more like 100-250 for a nice budget wheels
If you are upgrading your bike, £500 is entry level. If you are too tight to spend £500, then you are into the wrong sport. If you are too poor to afford £500, go out and hustle. You could make £500 in less than a month, reselling things from car boot/garage sales on eBay.
3:50 Carbon braking "immediate"? "Able to withstand really high heats"???! Don't trick people, and don't get them killed…
Carbon doesn’t dissipate heat as well as aluminum and can reach such high temp that the resin can liquify and destroy/wobble the rims mid ride. Do not ride the brakes with carbon. Typically not a problem unless you’re an unconfident decender.
@Drew Kangaroo carbon ceramic is a little differnt to normal carbon and as the brake is to the rim itself at high temps the resin melts and the rim falls apart under you on a long fast decline with alot of braking
@@The_High_SeAs I thought the problem is that carbon rims heat up too fast sometimes and can lead to an inner tube blowout.
@@Whatsth3ruckus You'd be lucky if your innertube blows out before the rims heat crumble. It'll probably still destroy the wheel but it's probably more controllable to slow down and stop with.
The "heats up more quickly" is kind of an illusion. It's not so much that heat is generated more quickly, it's the material doesn't dissipate the heat as quickly. The end result is the same "Reaches higher temperatures faster"
yeah lost me when he said that those carbons where lighter and you can see that the aluminum where ligther at 1.5 compare to 1.63
get a grip Cycling Weekly.
Nearly $AU880 is not "budget".
Maybe choose an actual "budget" manufacturer, rather than "our sponsor vs our sponsor".
Anonymous Pi DT Swiss actually do wheelsets from around £300. Not sure why they went for a much more expensive set.
@@hogdog567
first guess: they were paid to.
$1k-1$,500 is a great price point for most of us with decent jobs and families.
gumzster
Absolutely Gumzster. Particularly when you consider wheel upgrading. All good Mate. Ride safe and ride often.
Turns out calling a mid range wheelset 'budget' will trigger half your audience
I mean... he should have gotten a lower range rim and compared that to his mid range. And then compared the mid to the high end... not everyone has that kind of money
hahahha righly so!
@@OriginalAustinOblivion 1600 is not high end though. Princeton Carbon Works or Lightweights are high end and they cost more than double the DT Swiss' price tag
@@GaminGusTav “1600 is not high end” 🧐 Did you get your butler to type that out for you? 😂
@@dcclxxvii5703 its a normal price for quality, mid range, deeper section carbon wheels but nowhere near the high end.
This is all very well, but without quantifying the benefit of the "improved" features, it's a bit meaningless. How much extra speed (or watts saved) does the extra £1200 deliver, on the flat / climbing / downhill ?
Interesting to see that the premium wheels are actually heavier than the budget wheels.
Learn to build your own wheels. You can build a high end set of lightweight wheels for around the same price of the budget wheels shown here. For example I recently built;
Dura Ace 7900 NOS- £180
Lightbicycle 700C-FALCON-rim
RRU55T02-25mm wide-55mm deep with Grooved Graphene Brake surface Tubular - £305
Sapin CX Ray spokes £128
Total £613 (for my Budget £2000 6.8 Kg build)
My Budget Wheels would be Shimano FH-5800 hubs + H Plus Son TB14 Road Rim + Sapim Laser spokes
Typical cost would be around £220
That's more like high end and higher end
Or high endless.
I got the DT Swiss P 18oos and C 1800s. I don't think anything more expensive is necessary for the weekend warrior! These come for roughly 300€.
I use aluminum chinese wheel, 45mm deep 2kg weight and very durable and it only cost around 190$
Im 95kg, hit some potholes and the wheels is still true AF
(The true budget wheelset in my definition)
Exactly..now that's a real budget wheel..these channels tend to be snobs and dont cater to the average rider.
There snake oil merchants
The percentage of comments that disagree with this video’s definition of budget is both staggeringly high and hilarious! I also concur with the disagreement.
Gen... up to now you guys have provided a brilliant channel . Don't let money ruin it .
I've recently tried Canyon Bikes with differing premium wheelsets. The carbon rim brake bike (The Ultimate CF SLX 9.0 Di2) is kind of hard to stop quickly downhill and I kept finding myself going a little faster till I end up at the bottom of the hill, The carbon disc brake bike (Aeroad CF SLX Disc 9.0 Di2) managed to stop quickly mid-way down hill and was able to control my descent. All in all, I might hop on to disc brakes some day.
A video that highlights the disconnect between reality and the bubble of journalism. Nearly £500 isn’t budget, for so many people it’d be a very large outlay.
Right, for 500 quid you can get nowadays and entire bike, well kept maybe even carbon if the deal is really good...I mean an entire bike! This guy in the vid above, simply lost touch with reality, and just talking to a camera in his LA LA Land, juggling with top end wheels in both hands.......
Real difference without ever taking them on the road? That's not real difference. The only difference that matters is while riding.
I made it to 1:26 before I had to come to the comments to make sure they were satisfactorily incredulous. Not disappointed! What I am disappointed with is the quality and content of cycling weakly's videos.
Y'all used to produce some fun and interesting stuff. Not so lately. Unsubscribed.
Wow wheels from the same manufacturer, one retailer. Pretty intense advertorial. And both wheels win. Surprise
how bad are rim brakes with carbon rims in wet/damp conditions ? s it completely no-go ? Imagine i'm riding in a cloud or fog (no rain but everything is wet), can i stop my bike? or for first 10 meters brakes don't slow down the bike ?
I bought the PR1600 with 350 hub. Fantastic wheels!
Was genuinely looking for some “budget” wheel recommendations for a new build. Stopped watching at 45secs. £500??!!
The next video should be what performance gains you actually get in the real world. Do the carbon wheels roll that much quicker to justify the price?
Yes please :) I'd love to see some real test results.
Mr Stanhope I’m about to buy my first carbon Wheelset and from what I have read on more detailed and budget oriented reviews and forums, you should ideally get something between 45-55 or 60 mm deep. Everything below that doesn’t give you the “free speed” or sustained momentum you want from carbon wheels, so you are best off buying a good set of alloy wheels instead if you are looking at 25-35mm carbon wheels. And anything above 65 mm probably isn’t very clever as well as a first deep Wheelset for most because of the high crosswind effects and the limited all round versatility for climbing, etc.
But I am also still sceptical about how big the actual performance gains are and mostly also consider them because I want to add some bling to my bike
@@Paganizondaf650 What wheelset are you going for? I do look at carbon wheels but can never decide if the benefits outweigh the cost? Genuinely curious as to speed gains plus if they are more comfortable.
Mr Stanhope they are definitely not more comfortable. Carbon rims themselves are much stiffer than aluminium ones and through that most Wheelset range from stiffer to ride quality impairingly stiff. A speed gain of about 2-3 km/h on your average speed is possible. I’m looking at the Roval CL 50 disc
I went from 700 euro lightweights to mavic exhailt carbon wheels around 1000 and a slight bit heavier I must say the difference was night and day I highly recommend them. Tyres make a difference too cantbeat the conti grand prix 4000
Just for comparison, you can get top quality carbon, deep section wheels, UCI approved and weighing just over 1300 grams for around £500. Even Hunt will sell you a set of top quality, 1500gram alloy wheels for £400. I'm not sure what's going on here.
The £1100 “DT swiss” decals
The video was actually very informative, I now know the reality you live in so I can make an informative disicion abouts clicking your future videos... Thank you very much and continue the work...
I don't know about you but, as a casual rider, I'd love those cheaper ones for my ride and would never even consider the top end pair.
you are very wrong about spokes mate.
Flt ones aren't lighter, in fact are the very same as rounded ones, but they are prensed in the factory to be more aero, mass is the very same, it only changes shape.
How much for 'budget' wheels ??????? What a great way of putting off potential newbies 😕😕😕
I think Cycling Weekly needs to review who it's target audience is, as judging from many of the comments here, you are aiming at the elitist rider and not a general audience!!!!
This is probably first time I'm genuinely surprised at use of word "budget" in comparison videos. I mean there are often cases when you reasonably can call stuff budget when it's more expensive than common stuff, especially in niche interest group, but holly molly.
I’m not paying $2,000 for carbon wheels, I love my “training wheels”. Just bought a Trek Domane and rode 5 hours today
Since when was £500 entry level?!?!? I upgraded my old stock wheels for a set of Cero AR24 Evo's for only £189 and that included a free set of Continental tyres! The Ceros are lighter at only 1499g also.
What's next budget tires at $150 each.
what is the length of the seatpost?
The entry level DT Swiss road wheels are the P1800. Not the PR1600.
The PR1600s are midrange wheels.
Also some of the high end wheels by DT Swiss are still made of aluminium. Like the PR1400 and the oxic, also the 35mm PRC1400 Carbon wheel is heavier than the Aluminium PR1400 dicut so carbon wheels are not always lighter.
Also DT Swiss hubs are upgradable so you can have the same engagement in any of the DT wheels 1600 and up.
Finally, carbon rim wheels deal with heat less well than aluminium. You are more likely to pop your tyres on a hot carbon rim when coming down a hill than aluminium.
Try to do more detailed research for the next video, new riders will trust what you say so it's important you get it right.
As a DT Swiss dealer I would prefer you to buy carbon wheels because I make more money on them... but if you see my bike you will see the TOP of the range DT Aluminium wheels on it. 😉
Reginald Scot thanks 👍
The answer I was not only looking for but also intuitively felt was correct. Carbon wheels are nice because they look fancy, are really stiff and come in crazy aero shapes which might or might not save you 0.7 Watts. And they look fancy. Also, they look fancy. On the other end, a solid DT swiss asymmetrical rim, aero spokes and a 240 hub looks boring AF but it's light, stable, eats everything you throw at it and you don't have to sell a kidney. But they look boring AF.
1.58 al < 1.63 cf and yet the carbon wheels are lighter?
Bearings? Sealed or loose ball bearings which is better?
AB3 cartridge bearings
For budget wheels id go for the HUNT ones at £329 about 1420gms. Spot on for BUDGET. I'd put them on a decent bike given there performance at that price point.
Thank you never heard of them before.
I was hoping to see a comparison showing the actual performance gains. What does the extra £1000 buy you in terms of real world performance gains?
I was wondering whether to upgrade my wheels but you’ve convinced me it’s a total waste of money. For an extra £1000 I can get a pair which is made of carbon but still slightly heavier as well as being less robust. As I’m not a pro rider the aerodynamic benefits must be regarded as of negligible value. The angle of engagement argument is just pointless. It’s only ever of any benefit when you stop pedalling and restart, and a difference in angle of 10 degrees can hardly be worth more than 1/100th of a second in catching up with the freewheel. I could work it out but I really can’t be bothered. The key reason for getting carbon wheels, it seems to me, is to demonstrate just how much money you can afford to waste.
I’m not sure what I was supposed to learn here... maybe the title could’ve been more in line with the subject cause pretty much what I got, in general, was:
Budget wheels - aluminum (check)
Expensive wheels - carbon (check)
2:23 "carbon wheels are lighter"
0:50 vs 1:10
The carbon wheels weigh 1.63kg whereas the "cheap" wheels weigh 1.58kg. Please explain.
@Beemrdon The alu wheels in the clip were lighter than the carbon ones too, yet they said "carbon wheels are lighter".
Hambini, the engineer said that these aero wheels have turbulence and when the wind hits the sides of the wheels than it is no longer aero dynamic. So go with the wheel sets have less dish on the rims. I do have a slightly aero wheel set by DT Swiss and they are the DT Swiss R460 with Shimano Ultegra Hubs. They do work fine and they are fast on a downhill. They did cost me nearly $300. A good deal!
how about E1800? Good?
Hi
I have this doubt, between endurance 1400 and pr 1400.
What should buy?
And why?
Thanks
how is this budget?
My triban 520 se cost £279 , managed a few KOM !
How much quicker will these wheels. Make my triban
I just got a set of FL40 carbon tubeless wheels from ICAN Cycling. 1400g. US$550. I am also a fan of Industry Nine alloy hubs/wheels.
how is this working for you one year on?
@@joshdoesjoshstuff660 Still rolling great! Rode them today.
I got mine from Light Bicycle. They’re awesome and only cost like $600 for the pair.
Aluminium rims will overheat less than carbon ones due to braking, while also offering better braking power even in ideal conditions. Don't know who told you that carbon rims offer better braking in the dry or that are less prone to overheat than aluminium ones.
The same person who told him the aluminum wheels were budget wheels.
Yes that age old cycling saying "you would ride your bomb proof wheels in the winter and your deep section carbon wheels in the summer". I remember Mercxx saying that after his first grand tour win.
Indeed. And Vittorio Adorni, in second place, turned to him and said, "But Eddy, what the hell is a 'deep section carbon wheel'?" Merckx just shrugged. "It's just a saying. Sayings don't always make sense."
Wonder who sponsored this video? 🤔😂
Perfect explanation. In my case, I have a C24 Duracare for my all-around wheelset!
Round is most sophisticated shape of bicycle rims.
Yes, just thinking about the exquisite and profound math behind them makes me crave a gilded and overpriced bottle of wine and an actual pie that I can enjoy while smoothly riding away into pure existential bliss as I contemplate the joy that is a $2000 set of bicycle wheels.
Cặp vành giá bao nhiêu. Cao mấy phân xin hỏi.
u should try compare dt swiss with othrr bdget brand such as parqcour or token ..
$500 budget? Don’t need to watch any more.
Disliked. Full of lies. Usually companies spend money on the frame and gear set. So a 1500£ bike might have a wheel set around 100-200£. The frame might be around 500-700£. The wheels are upgradeable! Why would they sink money into something the buyer might not notice so much and a serious rider would upgrade. FYI my 290£ bike is coming in this week and am hearing of budget 500£ wheel set.
Just get a good pair of hubs like a Hope RS4, 32 hole - £200
Just buy some aluminium rims such a pair of Mavic Open Pro Tubular CD Road Rims - £85
Just build them with some Sapim CX rays - £120 - Weight around 1400 grams
Glue some Vittoria Corsa Graphene tubs on your wheels. Total cost is around £500. These would not be called entry level budget wheels.
You can get 32 hole mavic open pro wheels with DT swiss double butted spokes, brass nipples and ultegra hubs for about 340 or so us dollars.
Oh and they come tubeless ready if that's your thing
As many people have already said, this should have been a comparison between a budget manufacturer and a high-end one. For instance: some 200 euro chinese oem rims (Farsports, lightbycicle or even yoeleo) on novatec, bitex or Miche primato hubs vs swisside rims on dt top-of-line hubs. spoiler alert: the difference is not big ;)
Cycling weekly, read the comments below. You are losing touch with regular cyclists. Something to consider?
Looking for advice related to budget upgrades. I have Axis Sport wheels and esport tires on my specialized diverge. I can get a set of Lightly used DT Swiss r470 with WTB riddler tires for what looks like a reasonable price. Is this upgrade worth it (will it make a difference)? It looks like I save 300g on the rims alone.
Hey. Now i have a dillema . I have a older more worn mavic ssc (hubs run great..wheel is true just the brake rim is concave) ..and quite new specialized axis 2.0 roughly 350gr heavier than mavics .i can kinda sense a speed/acceleration increase on mavics
Which would you use? (Commuting .casual)
My canyon inflite cf slx came with dt Swiss cr 1600 wheels. The bike price was 3200€ I don’t thing that is budget bike 🤔
Budget verses premium ? I'm still riding on the same 27 year old tires that came with my vintage specialized mountain bike when I bought it new back in 1992.
I'm thinking about buying HED jet 6. They look pretty good. Any thoughts?
Pr1600 is NOT entry level wheels and definitely theay do not come on bikes 1000”-1500 price point. They don’t even come with bikes at 3000 price point.
What type of wheels you recommend for an 8speed road bike? Rim breaks*
I would love to see this channel's creators making a reaction video on this comment section and on the like/dislike ratio of this video. :D
There is no likes, dislikes really make a difference....it's all about the clicks............
Why are hubs with less engagement more durable? I would've guessed a hub with more engagement is more durable because the load is spread out between more pawls.
I had good laugh when I heard the "entry level price point".
Had an even better laugh reading all the comments :)
I watched a video aimed at bike noobs about general things to do and not do, many of them obvious. The next video I watch is seemingly aimed at Olympic athletes and compares expensive high end "budget" gear to really high end and actually premium "premium" gear. Both are from the same channel. I can't decide if they are trying to make videos that are relevant to normal people or bike fanatics with lots of money to waste.
Title is very wrong. This is far from a budget or entry level price point
Who the hell is this vid for? If you are so much of a beginner you need the types of wheels and braking systems explained you ain't in the market for either of those wheel sets.
they make videos for people that have money but no clue. They just care about money and sponsors
I think I've missed a trick !..... when I started riding 1999,a good bike was £600 . A top bike £1600 . I paid a visit to a top shop recently and had to do to the doctors for medication afterwards . Today a "good " bike is £5000!!!!...a top bike £9000 . (The best bike was £12000)
l got my shimano RS wheelset for $125CDN from wiggle and now with over 2000km on them they work great and still true ,weight 4.6lbs with 32a/ 11-32 CASSETTE half of what the original steel 27s weighed . And l ROLF wheels that came with my old TREK carbon ,semi aero , that work great too but do catch those side winds so l can only imaging what super deep section wheels would be horrible around here !! So my only upgrade would be lighter when time arises and only carbon if the price is right and MUCH less weight ,at least a kg if l m going to spend the money .....
The hub engagement is interesting with MTB where you regurarely stop pedalling. It brings almost nothing with road cycling. That's not going to give you a second
Get "prime Pro Road wheelset" on wiggle. They are good. There's aero ones too for £499. Think I paid something like 300 for set and they weigh just over 1500g. Not far off mavic and other good brands. They are currently £244 in a sale
Great Video very informative. We are all here to learn, so I will share that "orientated" is not a word, the correct word is "oriented"
I'm a Crazy 43 year old jacked on TRT. I'll take them Pr1600 es
Since when has 500 quid been entry level,,, I can get a set of kysirium with tyres for 300
Despite its depth, will the prc 1400 be more efficient uphill than the 1600 spline ?
I currently ride a pair of ARC 1100 disc in 65mm (which came with my new bike). So far, going uphill with these wheels is not really a problem. I wonder if I would notice a huge difference between my current ARC 1100 65mm and a pair of ARC 1100 48mm ? Is it worth it to change ?
If people want quality wheels "(budget wheels 500 £)", they should buy a frameset instead of the complete bike. Most manufacturers save the money on the package in the wheelset. If you want what he refers to "budget" wheels, you'll be looking at a very expensive bike. The only realistic option is to build the bike yourself. An added bonus is that you can customize the crank arm length to suit your legs and the stem length, as well as gearing and tires etc. Much better to get the exact parts you need instead of upgrading and replacing.
Carbon braking doesn't dissipate heat very well. No issue with tubulars but most people are running clinchers. Carbon clincher wheels have the greatest chance of failing under excessive heat from braking. That's the main reason why disc brakes exist for road bikes. Companies have spent millions of dollars over the years , and haven't been able to solve that issue. Well, they did find a solution. They moved the brakes...ala disc brakes.
£500 wheels on a £1k-£1.5 bike?? My £1,899 BMC Team Machine came with £189 Shimano RS81s!
The term "budget" is subjective. And for most of us 1k-500$ isn't. Put these head on with the *_real_* budget chinese off brand wheels like Superteam and Yoeleo, etc., and you see basically no difference but save a bit of weight.
Why do you say carbon wheels are lighter ? You weight both at the beginning and the aluminium set is 1.58kg while the carbon is 1.63 (lighter material but more of it due to the rim depth I guess).
So... really? The entry level price point is now £495?
Can i have 1pair of wheelset to start my career in Cycling🥰
Weighs the wheels while extolling the expensive wheel as being lighter...only to have the carbon wheel be heavier than the budget wheel. Also, carbon rim braking surface is better than aluminum braking surface in braking performance? Who wrote this stuff?
i don't think rim brakes perform less with carbon wheel on wet .. team ineos uses rim brakes with no braking problems on wet stages in this year's giro .. they are even often in front of the peloton and are flying on descents with rim brakes on carbon wheels
Buy the wheel set you can afford to replace when you crash.
fulcrum quattro for about 250$ are nice budget wheels
You missed the part of the warranty. ENVE wheels cost 3 grand for example, but in return you get a no questions asked lifetime warranty and free crash replacement on your wheel set (also covers spokes, hubs, nipples, labour cost and postage). I could lay my wheel set down the drive way and ride over it with my car, for a new set, should I think that the rims had too much rock strikes on them or whatever...
Budget winter wheels are 180 not 500. Rubbish and annoying video from cycling weekly
For what reason a hobby rider need carbon wheels that are heavier and more expensive? since we riding bikes we love numbers, so how much stiffer and more aero is the bling bling carbon wheel? 5%? come on guys, dont sell us this bullshit.
65mm is huge in wind...if you want to die beneth of wheel of cars...this is the choice. I have mavic cosmic pro ust sl 45mm, in lateral winds must to push counter strong if you want to finish alive the ride😀
I wouldn’t pay the “budget price” for both sets!
You can buy a used pair of HED Jet 6’s for 450.00.
Why do all Cycling Weekly videos just feel like a long commercial?