Great to see this concept with enormous potential even if it takes longer to develop. Perhaps someday it could even power a transportation craft. Urgency of energy progress demands not putting all eggs in one basket.
Considering how much they've accomplished in the amount of time they have, compared to more well-known projects, they'll succeed long before ITER accomplishes anything...at all. Assuming Helion isn't just scamming it's investors. It sounds good...but it still feels like another "Solar Freakin Roadways".
@@DoremiFasolatido1979hey, I liked the idea of solar roadways. Bottom-illuminated lanes, solar energy extracted from all roads all day, heating during winter to melt ice and snow, etc. It was an excellent idea, just way too expensive to be practical.
I saw this device in relation to my work and didn’t think anything about it, didn’t know what it was. Then watching a video this weekend, I was like I’ve seen this machine before. Found out at work it was this machine. Small world. Best of luck guys!
As an enthusiast of cutting edge tech, i love that (minus the calc) i could understand far more of this than expected. I have just recently watched the 18 Dec 2022 video "A New Way to Achieve Nuclear Fusion". This brings me hope that if we think outside the classic square we can achieve amazing things. I'll be watching
They're not going to finish construction of their next prototype by the end of 2022. Perhaps if they had consistent progression they could do that, but as it stands the net-energy should increase more in spikes than on a curve. The next spike, according to them, is in 2024 (Their seventh prototype, polaris).
If you listened carefully, you would have heard him say that barely _anything_ in this prototype yet meets or exceeds future deployment targets. The positive side of this presentation is not yet any crippling show-stoppers. If I've got things straight, this protocol had a very low pulse rate, so they have barely _started_ to deal with heat extraction problem in its final form. Check out _Intel To Wind Down Optane Memory Business_ from earlier this summer. This was a novel storage physics that actually worked well enough to sell for a number of years, and yet it finally failed commercially all the same.
No - Trenta does not use cryogenic superconducting magnets, nor will our future fusion devices. Because Helion uses a pulsed, non-ignition approach to fusion, our machines can use standard aluminum electromagnets that operate at forces ~ 10 Tesla.
Short, simple version: Great results after first year of operation. Machine is working as expected. Scaling laws established with LSX in the 90ies are still met, or maybe even exceeded with Trenta. There are still some challenges, mostly with materials for magnets and divertors that they are working to resolve. Note that those are (probably) not a big factor for experiments, but could affect the economics of later, commercial machines. What stood out to me was the extreme ratio of ion to electron temperature. That is one of those things that will enable them to use advanced fuels for future power plants.
@@USSSkipjack uhhh yeah, that last part DEFINITELY stood out to me too, and not because it's a good thing. They're basically admitting their plasmas will be in EXTREME thermodynamic disequilibrium, ie. it will be a highly non-maxwellian plasma. This is very bad. It rules out ever achieving a burning plasma or reaching Q factors greater than 1. This was established from first principles by Todd Rider in his 1995 master's thesis.
@@Muonium1 IIRC, this is not what Rider says. Most of the fusion happens at a high Ti:Te ratio. Generally P(fus)/P(loss) scales as Ti^1.5 / (Z^2 * Te^0.5 ) So a higher Ti:Te is actually beneficial. For Helion, the Ti:Te starts out high, but eventually trends towards equilibrium, but at that point the pulse is already over and done. A high Ti:Te is a property of many pulsed fusion designs, btw.
@@Muonium1 It sounds like they are envisioning a reactor at Q < 1, and somehow recapturing the input energy. But I do have some doubts. Since it sounds like the plasma duration is shorter than the ion collision time, all the energy that goes into heating the ions doesn't get a chance to be used before it hits the diverter. AFAIK, there's no advantage to having Te in equilibrium with Ti, since that's extra heat wasted in electrons and will create a lot of bremsstrahlung.
At the end of the day, can you sum up progress with a bit more focus on how your team proposes harvesting the fast magnetic pulse into electrons, accumulating the charge, transforming voltage into grid voltage, and producing usable utility grid electrical power at scale. I have the sense that the machine is similar to harvesting lighting bolts into usable energy, a tough task. Also would be good to share ratio of consumed power to produced power, in that this invention's power production success is when power output exceeds power input, of all the electrical power needed to operate the multiple elements of the systems roughing pumps, diffusion pumps/ turbo molecular pumps, vacuum gages, control and logic electronics/ diagnosis equipment/ simulation computers/ electromagnets/ overhead lights/ desk computers/ safety systems, etc. Like others - have enjoyed learning about the history, the availability of special fuel, the high temperature electrons, the high temp materials, the differential pressures, the wear on materials, the linear device physics, and lots of run-time results. A good summary of the roadmap and schedule towards making net energy production progress is most helpful. If your inventions energy balance is now 10 watts in and 1/4 watt out, this is quite different than if your 1 watt in and 0.8 watts out. Thank you.
@@USSSkipjack I know. I've read the program. But still it is useful to know if the predecesor is close to the small amount of net energy and not ages away from it.
@@tasos482 I don't think that Trenta is quite producing net electricity yet. But they keep upgrading it too... Still officially net electricity is planned for Polaris, the machine around 2024 (give or take a few months).
They have large banks of parallel capacitors. You can watch the recent video by Real Engineering, starting at around the 22 minute mark. There they also talk about the capacitors' lifetimes after increasingly large numbers of pulses.
@@klaudialustig3259 We are talking about a prototype. The commercial product would probably output ac power in either 50 or 60 cps.. How they achieve that is a minor issue.
It's bewildering ot me that these companies even exist. All of them are like Theranos - with the exception they don't cheat and they don't lie - they only obfuscate as much they can.
Just because you lack the expertise to understand the talk doesn't mean it's obfuscation. The target audience for this talk is scientists working in fusion.
I don't think it's obfuscation at this point. They definitely have a lot of basic and critical problems they admit they haven't solved yet. The fact that this system doesn't use heat but rather magnetic induction to extract power avoids intractable problems with materials.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 78 | คู่เอก "ปกรณ์ vs ฟาบิโอ"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LSOmgl0Th2c/mqdefault.jpg)
I'm glad you simplified this for all us amateurs. I was worried at first I wouldn't understand.
lol
I tried to make sense of some of it. I mainly heard "Science, toroidal magnets... something, something, nice shoes.... plasma."
He didn't need to dumb it down so much. We're not Earthling children, by the way.
Quartz erosion? Why not use saphire?
More updates please!
I thoroughly enjoyed your video on the topic!
Same, was a good video
Bunch of updates on polaris construction progress on their twitter 🤩
Great to see this concept with enormous potential even if it takes longer to develop. Perhaps someday it could even power a transportation craft. Urgency of energy progress demands not putting all eggs in one basket.
Considering how much they've accomplished in the amount of time they have, compared to more well-known projects, they'll succeed long before ITER accomplishes anything...at all. Assuming Helion isn't just scamming it's investors. It sounds good...but it still feels like another "Solar Freakin Roadways".
@@DoremiFasolatido1979hey, I liked the idea of solar roadways. Bottom-illuminated lanes, solar energy extracted from all roads all day, heating during winter to melt ice and snow, etc. It was an excellent idea, just way too expensive to be practical.
I saw this device in relation to my work and didn’t think anything about it, didn’t know what it was. Then watching a video this weekend, I was like I’ve seen this machine before. Found out at work it was this machine. Small world. Best of luck guys!
As an enthusiast of cutting edge tech, i love that (minus the calc) i could understand far more of this than expected. I have just recently watched the 18 Dec 2022 video "A New Way to Achieve Nuclear Fusion". This brings me hope that if we think outside the classic square we can achieve amazing things. I'll be watching
I 100% agree with everything you said!
Q&A during SOFE conference pasted below.
--------------------------------------------
>>> Question >> Answer > Question > Answer > Question > Answer > Question > Answer > Question > Answer > Question > Answer > Question > Answer
Thank you for presenting your incredible findings and work
beautiful work, can't wait to see Polaris at 20k eV
Please do a video on the 7 and 8 Gen systems.
I like that this is getting going vs multi billion ring collider
Fascinating tech! The future is very near!
I now have zero doubt that Helion will reach net gain first, and likely before the end of 2022. Thanks for saving the world, guys. :)
They're not going to finish construction of their next prototype by the end of 2022.
Perhaps if they had consistent progression they could do that, but as it stands the net-energy should increase more in spikes than on a curve. The next spike, according to them, is in 2024 (Their seventh prototype, polaris).
If you listened carefully, you would have heard him say that barely _anything_ in this prototype yet meets or exceeds future deployment targets. The positive side of this presentation is not yet any crippling show-stoppers. If I've got things straight, this protocol had a very low pulse rate, so they have barely _started_ to deal with heat extraction problem in its final form.
Check out _Intel To Wind Down Optane Memory Business_ from earlier this summer. This was a novel storage physics that actually worked well enough to sell for a number of years, and yet it finally failed commercially all the same.
Best of luck with Polaris!!! 🙏🙏
So cool!
Great job!
Fascinating work!
Thank you.
So why not achieve net gain in a micro environment?
Does the Helion approach use or plan to use high temperature superconductors for the magnets?
No - Trenta does not use cryogenic superconducting magnets, nor will our future fusion devices. Because Helion uses a pulsed, non-ignition approach to fusion, our machines can use standard aluminum electromagnets that operate at forces ~ 10 Tesla.
@@HelionEnergy wow that sounds way more convenient than messing around with liquid helium
@@moltoniron633 Me as well
Very promising!!!
what does BTS mean?
Can someone do a newbie version of this video
Short, simple version:
Great results after first year of operation.
Machine is working as expected. Scaling laws established with LSX in the 90ies are still met, or maybe even exceeded with Trenta.
There are still some challenges, mostly with materials for magnets and divertors that they are working to resolve. Note that those are (probably) not a big factor for experiments, but could affect the economics of later, commercial machines.
What stood out to me was the extreme ratio of ion to electron temperature. That is one of those things that will enable them to use advanced fuels for future power plants.
@@USSSkipjack uhhh yeah, that last part DEFINITELY stood out to me too, and not because it's a good thing. They're basically admitting their plasmas will be in EXTREME thermodynamic disequilibrium, ie. it will be a highly non-maxwellian plasma. This is very bad. It rules out ever achieving a burning plasma or reaching Q factors greater than 1. This was established from first principles by Todd Rider in his 1995 master's thesis.
@@Muonium1
IIRC, this is not what Rider says.
Most of the fusion happens at a high Ti:Te ratio.
Generally P(fus)/P(loss) scales as Ti^1.5 / (Z^2 * Te^0.5 )
So a higher Ti:Te is actually beneficial.
For Helion, the Ti:Te starts out high, but eventually trends towards equilibrium, but at that point the pulse is already over and done.
A high Ti:Te is a property of many pulsed fusion designs, btw.
@@Muonium1 It sounds like they are envisioning a reactor at Q < 1, and somehow recapturing the input energy. But I do have some doubts. Since it sounds like the plasma duration is shorter than the ion collision time, all the energy that goes into heating the ions doesn't get a chance to be used before it hits the diverter. AFAIK, there's no advantage to having Te in equilibrium with Ti, since that's extra heat wasted in electrons and will create a lot of bremsstrahlung.
wow! INSTANE!!!! GREAT JOB!!!! :O
At the end of the day, can you sum up progress with a bit more focus on how your team proposes harvesting the fast magnetic pulse into electrons, accumulating the charge, transforming voltage into grid voltage, and producing usable utility grid electrical power at scale. I have the sense that the machine is similar to harvesting lighting bolts into usable energy, a tough task. Also would be good to share ratio of consumed power to produced power, in that this invention's power production success is when power output exceeds power input, of all the electrical power needed to operate the multiple elements of the systems roughing pumps, diffusion pumps/ turbo molecular pumps, vacuum gages, control and logic electronics/ diagnosis equipment/ simulation computers/ electromagnets/ overhead lights/ desk computers/ safety systems, etc. Like others - have enjoyed learning about the history, the availability of special fuel, the high temperature electrons, the high temp materials, the differential pressures, the wear on materials, the linear device physics, and lots of run-time results. A good summary of the roadmap and schedule towards making net energy production progress is most helpful. If your inventions energy balance is now 10 watts in and 1/4 watt out, this is quite different than if your 1 watt in and 0.8 watts out. Thank you.
I think they’re hiring, shoot them an email.
“Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic” -Arthur C. Clarke
What's the net electrical power the reactor can produce?
Net electricity production (small amount) is planned for their next machine, Polaris.
@@USSSkipjack I know. I've read the program. But still it is useful to know if the predecesor is close to the small amount of net energy and not ages away from it.
@@tasos482 I don't think that Trenta is quite producing net electricity yet. But they keep upgrading it too...
Still officially net electricity is planned for Polaris, the machine around 2024 (give or take a few months).
Polaris will produce a small amount of net electricity. The goal is for power plants that produce 50 MW of electricity.
@@elmarmoelzer2229 they're not even close ! give them 30 or 40 years, if we they are being honest, which they are not.
Perhaps stupid question: How will a Helion fusion power plant make sure to deliver a stable electricity output when the energy comes in pulses?
AC current is 60 pulses per second.
When they are producing power they can use electronics to get it in a form useful for supplying the grid.
@@marcdeckard7064 Household AC current changes direction 60 times per second. That's different.
They have large banks of parallel capacitors. You can watch the recent video by Real Engineering, starting at around the 22 minute mark. There they also talk about the capacitors' lifetimes after increasingly large numbers of pulses.
@@klaudialustig3259 We are talking about a prototype. The commercial product would probably output ac power in either 50 or 60 cps.. How they achieve that is a minor issue.
😀
It's bewildering ot me that these companies even exist. All of them are like Theranos - with the exception they don't cheat and they don't lie - they only obfuscate as much they can.
Picture it more like funding an experiment. Not a scam.
Just because you lack the expertise to understand the talk doesn't mean it's obfuscation. The target audience for this talk is scientists working in fusion.
I don't think it's obfuscation at this point. They definitely have a lot of basic and critical problems they admit they haven't solved yet. The fact that this system doesn't use heat but rather magnetic induction to extract power avoids intractable problems with materials.
@@zzasdfwas yea that's me and i call bullshit lol