This is a coach/organization problem. You can't blame a mid or high prospect for letting up slightly in camp (they have many years of pro hockey left), and you can't blame an undrafted invitee for going full throttle (they might be out of competitive hockey any day). The rules of engagement need to be clear when you are mixing these groups of players together.
Very well said. Personally, I hate Dillingham for this hit. However, His career is on the line. He needs to show his upside, and his upside is (very clearly) he's a good hitter. If you don't want these issues, lay the groundwork in an off ice meeting is absolutely the right way to go and I blame the organization for this hit more than Dillingham after reading your comment.
@@rakketz5976 " lay the groundwork in an off ice meeting" So would the meeting go something like.... "Hey we are all on the same team here, don't fucking kill one of my guys trying to make the team"? Coach probably thought he didn't need to explain that...
@@jacksonpundyk7367 Not to split hairs here, but it's development camp, not training camp. There is a difference. No one there is a bona fide NHLer and no one on that roster has played a single NHL game yet, so it's fair to assume some players may not be going at or expecting 100% effort in the physicality department.
So what are you saying… guys who are there because of their physicality have to tone it down so the skilled players can showcase their talents with their heads down? I don’t care what you call the camp, training or development, it’s still hockey.
@@Bushman9 I'm not sure if your reply was directed at me, but I got a notifcation for it, so I'm going to reply to it anyway: We're saying that if it's supposed to be safe for guys to skate across the blueline with their heads down, everybody should know that. Clearly that isn't the case, but for whatever reason, Hirvonen seems to have missed the memo.
Played with a guy who was a mid round pick to the London Knights. His first tryout with the team he had nothing to lose, played super physical, made it to the final round of cuts and was one of the last D cut from the team. Next season he expected to make the team, toned down the physicality, he said "I didn't want to hit guys like Marner, Dvorak or Tkachuk then be teammates". He ended up not making the team again and ended up in the Q. When they cut him they asked "where was that physicality from last year?" It's really a lose-lose situation for physical D men at tryouts. Since he told me that story I think 'fuck everyone else at tryouts, they're not your teammates until they're your teammates'.
Almost reminds me of when Clarke MacArthur had his career ended in a training camp scrimmage.. Bobby Ryan dropped the gloves with that guy on the spot.. I forget his name
Adam Deadmarsh had his career ended in a practice, as I recall. Concussion with symptoms (light sensitivity, vertigo) that in some cases didn't fade for like, 10+ years
I've seen hits like these at invitational rookie camps in juniors. Between guys who aren't part of the organization yet and compete for a spot... but these guys are in the pipeline already, that's overkill
@@edschramm6757 You can add Joonas Donskoi to the list, too. He and Kole Lind collided at the Kraken's training camp last season and he's not expected to play ever again.
What earned Dillingham a camp invite? His defensive play & physicality. What do they always tell these guys at these camps? We want you to play your game, do what got you here. Textbook clean hit.
@@keithm3241 No the player skating with the puck eliminated his ability to make the team. There is no way an NHL player gets hit like that by someone that hasn't even been drafted.
The problem I have here is that if Dillingham doesn't make contact, Hirvonen goes around him like a traffic cone (which according to some, had already happened a few times already). In his situation (as a heavy, physical, defense first defender), he has to play his game if he wants an invite to rookie camp later this summer. If he just lets guys breeze by him, he's going to get cut real fast. You simply can't invite these fringe guys in and tell them they have a chance if you're not going to let them actually try. Now, as for the collision itself, there was nothing wrong with the hit, as stated in the video. What makes the end result so bad is that Hirvonen either had his head down and didn't see Dillingham commit to make the check, or simply wasn't expecting to get hit (or some combination of the two). Speaking from experience, either is a good way to end up concussed. I don't know if Hirvonen wasn't told that the scrimmage was full-contact or what, but it's pretty much Hockey 101 once you start hitting that you don't skate through the middle of the ice the way he did there, regardless of the whether it's a scrimmage or an actual NHL game. I sure hope the kid is okay, but I can't get behind the argument that you don't make a body check on someone and let them get by you because it's a scrimmage.
Clean hit, the kid ran into a brick wall. It's a shame he got hurt, but this isn't pee wee hockey. I don't mean to be heartless, but the leafs don't need more pampered softies on the team. This kid either comes back having learned a valuable lesson, or it's out the fkn door.
Dillingham was invited because of his style of play. This could be his only shot. They always tell you to play the way that got you there. He did & did it cleanly.
Yeah, he made a good play, but this is still a scrimmage. Can't really take contact out of the game tbh, so no real easy fix to it outside making it noncontact. Could do that for a scrimmage, but it is prolly better to just move stuff off ice and when on ice to run drills or something
Dude, there's levels you play at, even in the NHL. Yeah, you're a physical guy. There's four or five different ways you can make that hit without putting his lights out and still stopping his momentum. The hit was stupid and just put one of the teams rising stars on the sidelines for some AHL four line grinder. It also jeopardized a top picks career for what? Your moment in the sun for five minutes? Absolutely not necessary and just shows Dillinghams inability to tamp down his ability to make every check a dangerous one, even in a team friendly scrimmage.
If it was a dirty hit I'd say it's completely uncalled for, but the entire point of development camp on ice is to essentially prove your worth to the team. The NHL is an absolute monster to get into, if you're not showcasing every aspect of your game whether it be physicality, skating, passing etc. You aren't gonna make the NHL. Yes it's unfortunate but he's also gotta learn to keep his head up.
Always hate to see someone young hurt like that in training camp. But you are not wrong, if your style of play is being physical you have to try and show that in camp if not then what are you doing there? Don´t think it was dirty at all just unfortunate.
Agree. I wish there was more to the video to see how long he had the puck beforehand but if the only people you see infront are three guys in a different color jersey, you better have a move or pass to get around that or be ready to make physical contact.
I really wish we had the 2 seconds before the hit. It's incredibly tough to tell what happened, but from their position it looks like puck-carrier tried to go feign going across the middle and then cut sharply right into the defender's angle as the defender is going stick on puck. That's an extremely cocky move. You almost have to feel for Dillingham in that case. It's not even about trying to lay a hit, it's that you didn't come out to a development camp to just let people dance around you--there's no ill-will there, just playing basic defense. He kept his stride, back leg pushing, but doesn't drive off his lead leg or raise up to deliver more contact. TH-cam can slow it down even more and you'll see he's almost spinning off to limit impact. Puck-carrier ran himself into a brick wall.
the way he landed after being hit gave me trauma because of the hit on nathan horton in 2011, almost the same play, and that lead to career ending injuries for years afterwards
yeah, guy is a second round draft pick skating with his head down through the neutral zone. He should know better. Good news is if he's just got a concussion this can be taken as a good lesson and a wake up call
I mean the easy way to solve this problem is the coaches should set an expectation before practice. If they do or don't want it to be game conditions, they should say so.
Reminds me of a scene in the Don Cherry movie, where he got invited to Leafs training camp and then dummies their “superstar” and then gets kicked off the ice and never sees the NHL again. This was in the '60s and 70s too, star players are harder to find than goons who wanna make a name for themselves.
My favourite scene is when, Eddie Shore ties the goalies neck to the crossbar because he didn’t want him going down to stop the puck, then starts taking shot on him and he keep trying to go down to stop it. Guy was the definition of his generation.
That was a fantastic documentary/movie! Loved every second of it! Too bad the kid that got knocked out in this play didn't watch this movie or listen to the message: Keep Your Head Up Kid!!!
I feel completely 50/50 about this. On one hand, don’t injure your own team mate in camp, chill out. On the other hand you’ve gotta understand this guy is trying hard to show himself as an NHL player and he doesn’t wanna just let the guy skate around him.
Seeing as the puck carrier just about skated into the defender I don't see an issue. Defender hardly moved just lowered his shoulder .Keep your head up
Exactly what happened and that’s on the forward. Spacial awareness is an important part of being able to successfully pull off tight moves in tough areas and roni failed in this situation. Maybe it’s the smaller ice but more likely it’s being too comfortable skating with your head down in traffic areas. Don’t do it !
It's getting to the point where your voice just talking literally anything hockey, I don't care if you're discussing paint color on the lines, is just so soothing. You're gonna need to beef it up like a video every four hours. Then I'll be fine! All jokes aside, love your content and can never get enough of this channel! My son is 8 and I love that I can show him your view and you give such great level headed advice and input. The best part, he listens because it's not coming from me haha
Reminds me of the prospect tournament between St. Louis and Detroit last year, where St. Louis had a few 24/25 year old "prospects" that were gooning it up and trying to injure as many players as they could.
If I saw a player do that in practice my first thought wouldn't be "he's a good hitter" it would be "he either lacks body control or psychological control".
Just coming back to this video to point out that Nolan Dillingham (along with Tyler Weiss, Tate Singleton, Neil Shea, Brock Caufield and Jackson Berezowski) have been signed to AHL contracts by the Toronto Marlies today.
If there were ground rules (there werent) about hitting then id say its BS move. But the scrimmage was physical & intense from the get-go. Great hit. Just sucks the kid got hurt.
I se nothing wrong with the hit. Kid is trying to make the team, and he made a clean hit. It wasn’t late, it wasn’t contact with head. Keep your head up.
Hockeys a tough game, you can’t let your guard down let alone keep your head down when you move across centre ice with the puck. He’s looking like Tavares out there. Some people learn from hits like this, let’s hope.
I've been to a few inter-squad games for the Bruins. Those games are very physical and there is always more than one fight. Guys are trying to make a name for themselves. If you don't want to get bulldozed, keep your head up.
Damn you Finland. This what you get when you don't practice hitting. I remember when I played hockey as a kid, and at about 12 years old, D-juniors, we were allowed to start body checking. We only had one practice where the coaches approached the topic. Only one. Shoulder to shoulder, no jumping, no hitting from behind, and how to brace yourself against the boards when getting hit. Good points, but that was it. This happens every year in our "elite" league, Liiga, where many young players get severely hurt from normal hits , because they haven't been taught the physical aspect of the game and are not expecting to get hit at all.
It’s shocking to me how many people think this sort of contact during a prospect camp is out of the ordinary. For any contact or combat sport, the second you put that gear on you have to be prepared to endure the risk of participation. Here, the stakes are at the highest. Guys are fighting for their livelihoods, paycheques, and futures. Go to any Junior A or WHL spring prospect camp and you’ll see 16 year olds taking off their helmets and squaring off with 18-20 year olds to get their name noticed, and these kids aren’t even getting paid. I do not fault this guy one bit for stepping up for that hit. He’s trying to get paid just like everyone else there.
@@ImGettinWeird It’s a competition to make the team. Hockey is a contact sport. It’s unfortunate the guy got laid out but you can’t half play hockey or you’ll find yourself in a suit reading about it.
@@gordonbgraham I know it's a contact sport but I just don't agree with trying to kill each other. You can still play the body but you don't need to injure each other either.
@@ImGettinWeird I don’t think he was trying to kill him. That was the play there. Take the man not the puck. Clean hit, just a tough lesson learned by a guy who is used to playing on Olympic size ice where most entries are made on the huge openings on the outside. Cutting inside at the blue line or just inside the blue line has consequences. In hockey circles that’s known as the trolly tracks. This is development camp. The kid learned a hard lesson which will help with his development.
Easton Cowan (TORs 1st round pick) got laid out in this same scrimmage with a big hit. Nobody is crying about that. Solely because there wasnt an injury like there was here. Both clean. Unfortunately Hirvonen got hurt & fortunately Cowan didn't.
Cowan is a tough Farmer Guy who worked on a Farm I like how Tough Cowan is the Leafs need more players with Grit mixed with skill and speed the Leafs need some defensive depth aswell
@@JJnSFarms It's how the Panthers lost the Final, Play clean and you'll go places, but don't get pushed around, play that fine line like how Vegas played and you'll be put on that cup
There is nothing wrong with that, if he can't survive that hit and avoid it, he probably can't handle the NHL. Tryouts are just that, everyone showcasing what they bring.
Idk, i remember during soccer tryouts there was a guy going hard with slide tackles and just taking guys out. It annoyed all of us. We were all teammates, and there's no need to harm each other. At the same time, big hits like those happen in the nhl. It was a slip up from both guys, and we just hope him and everyone else is doing okay. Shits gonna just happen sometimes.
@banshee107 that's just a haters mentality lol. It's quite a physical sport. You're not flying into body checks, but the possibility of injury is definitely there
Thats a big difference I think. Normally you never go hard like that with slide tackles in practice in football (soccer) In hockey camp you have to show your worth and if you are a physical player you have to show it.
These kids play hard even in practice. There is no taking it easy. Their careers depend on it. Good hit. Part of being good in the NHL is being able to either avoid such hits or being able to take your lumps. Nothing wrong with that hit.
This isn’t practice. This is the shit attitude the hockey community has that results in careers ending early. Everything is wrong in that hit in a dev camp scrimmage
@@krakenspectacor It will be far worse in the NHL. If you can't handle the heat get out of the kitchen. The "I wasn't ready" excuse didn't work when we were kids why would it now. This is a mans sport and boys get left behind.
It was a big hit because he skated across the middle of the ice with his head down. You can't blame the dman for being in his way. He's doing his job, development camp or not. It wasn't a dirty hit by any means. It was pure arrogance by the puck carrier.
As a coach at a higher level in youth hockey, I will say that you want to see guys in tryouts play at their highest level of intensity at all times, and if a guy needs to pay the price, they need to keep their head up and match that intensity. That said, I wouldn't be happy to see one of my guys that's a lock for the team get dummied by a guy that's on the bubble. The way I work it is that my first 2 skates have no scrimmages, and I'll just sign the guys who are locked in and tell them no more skates to avoid injury. I expect everyone to be going at full intensity if they expect to make a team. That said, an NHL training camp is different than tryouts for a youth AAA team for sure. I will say that if that's Matthews or something - Even more interesting Bedard because he's at a rookie camp now and a lock to make the Blackhawks, you better let him off the hook. If you level one of those guys, you better just get off the ice, take your gear off and go home. But with this type of camp where it's all guys trying to be seen, I'd say its all fair game. All of these guys are playing their asses off for sure. This is a huge opportunity for all of them.
It's a nice hit. Making a good clean open ice hit is very difficult. If you want to be able to do it, you have to be able to practice it. It really doesn't look like he put anything extra into that hit but, the power came mostly from good technique. There's times in the game where you hit someone a lot harder than you think you are, depending on what that player is doing and the angles.
It's a scrimmage during development camp between teammates. If you've ever been to one, you know there's basically no hitting, especially not open ice hitting. Who the fuck practices that on teammates in any case ?
@@MTLGSE I've never been to one where the possibility of making million of dollars if I impress the right people with my play is a possibility. I doubt you have either. Both of the these guys were no-names as far as any fan is concerned, but because of this play both of them are being looked at a lot more.
"Protect yourself at all times" simple as that. It is big business, big stakes, and being judged by small time people over the internet. Does not add up. Nobody in that position cares what any of us think. Simple formula.
First clean hit. Actually, he ran into an almost stationary defender. Two . Unless Jr Camps Midget Bantam tryouts have changed, checking sorry body checking was part of getting you noticed." Come across center with your head down be expected to get hit .. 3 Development camp if scrimmages are part of camp tthey should be told that no physical body checking !! Which defeats the purpose of scrimmages . All Coaches Management have instructed all players that be prepared to be hit ! Last an player invited to a Development Camp may be their only shot chance , they thought enough of the player to invite them the other players might want to pay more attention to why not how come
If you truly watch it, he skated right into it. A Clean open ice check is nearly impossible without a player being caught off guard. KEEP YOUR HEAD UP!
I think both points have some merit. On the one hand, yeah, if this guy is a bit more of a physical player, he's naturally going to want to show a bit of what he can do in the hopes of catching someone's eye and making a good impression. And yes, keeping one's head up is never a bad lesson to learn. On the other hand, no one is really expecting to get laid out like this during camps because they're more like a group job interview than anything else. The crazy pressure that can come with your normal job is rarely something people see in interviews regardless of the field of work -- and hockey is no exception. Ultimately this is something that falls at the feet of coaching and the Leafs organization. You need to make it pretty clear up front what level of play/physicality is expected or tolerated in camp. If players know ahead of time that a bit more is going to be considered acceptable, they can prepare accordingly, but if you don't say it explicitly it leaves everyone a bit unclear and stuff like this happens.
This reminds me of when I went to training camp for the Blackhawks. Duncan Keith laid out Ben Smith at the blue line (didn't knock him out, but crushed him). I don't mind this. If you want to win, you have to practice like you play.
I agree with you. Had a twitter argument with someone who kept telling me it was a clean hit like yes, clean, but not necessary though. Not a good way to get noticed. Playing out a top prospect isn’t getting you positive attention.
It’s a skills development camp not a prospects camp. Laying a hit like that, while skillful, isn’t something you can really develop at a camp. Focus on the clean part of your game there.
@@braygun44 Let the guy skate around him, so he looks like a pylon and gets cut before the next skate -- ruining a potential career for millions of dollars over the course of a decade. Common sense That's like being asked by your boss to prove yourself on an assignment and half ass-ing it so the other guy looks better and gets the promotion. Do you hear yourself?
@@ValhallaRaven hes there to prove himself, he did that, if the coaches didn't say its non-contact or 50% then he did exactly what he was supposed to do, its a tough spot but you have to look at it from the players perspective
Hits like these are honestly a product of a different time in the NHL, in least in terms of doing it in practice. Still, its a clean hit, and you shouldnt expect that guys are just gonna lay off you cause some of these players may never play pro hockey again. There was a story from the Atlanta Flames in the 70s where their top pick at the time Jacques Richard kept coming up the middle of the ice with his head down in practice. The coach told the players to take it easy on him until the teams veteran defenseman Bob Paradise decided he had seen enough, and completely laid Richard out as he was coming up the middle. Obviously thats the product of a thankfully bygone era, but theres still a precedent you have to learn when your in the NHL. Keep your head up. IMO, its better he learns that here than with some AHL goon completely making him forget what city hes in when he does the same thing. Alex Hemsky ended his NHL career cause he didnt keep his head up after 800 NHL games. Theres a million examples of guys always playing with their head down cause they never knew what it was like to get hit, until well. Eric Lindros for example.
As a former rugby player. When we had off season training you go hard because you want to make the active roster. Doesn't matter that it's training. You wanna prove yourself, and that is what the kid in the white jersey did. It sucks to see that he got laid out but jesus christ it's a basic thing in hockey keep your damn head up. Hockey is a contact sport.
Hard to say what should happen, on one hand you don't want your players knocking each other out during camp but it was a clean hit. Its unfortunate how everthing played out but what can you really do besides just play it by ear.
Actually, the Hawks are the only team having an all off-ice camp. It also helps that Chicago has stockpiled enough quality prospects over the past couple of years, and they don't need to bring in undrafted players to bolster their prospect pool. No need for on-ice auditions of undrafted players.
As a "team" development camp. It should be explained before they hit the ice what the level of physical play is allowed. The guy learned a lesson to keep your head up and don't dangle into the middle of the ice before the blue line. He'd never get away with that in any real game.
The first rule of hockey is always be look round. 2nd rule is don't skate with your head down. The plyer that hit him was only doing what he was supposed to do if the guy had his head up he would not have been hit so hard and could have prepared. It is the same as a person walking down the street reading their phone and not looking where they go when they walk into someone.
Don't have too much of a problem with this happening in a scrimmage portion of a time where you're looking to get yourself noticed especially in the case of professional hockey. I have a much bigger problem with these kind of hits happening in drills though. In that scenario you already know where somebody is going to be on the ice and the precedent has been set that you're just doing skill work. Seen it happen a few times in that setting and it always messes up the mood in the dressing room and its bull** and not fun for anyone especially when you should be building the chemisty and mood on and off the ice at those times with potential future teammates. 💯
Hey, the pertinent question is: was this the development camp scrimmage, or the SELECTION camp scrimmage? Because if it was for roster selection, then there’s nothing wrong with this picture. If it was actually development camp…well there is never supposed to be hitting in a dev camp scrim. Knowing which camp this happened in makes all the diff.
I get the need for the Dillingham to play hard to try to make an impression but for an intersquad development game, I think he should've let up a little or if the hit had to be made then yell "heads" before making contact so Hirvonen could brace himself for contact and mitigate concussion risk.
This is the NHL baby. Everyone on that ice is trying to impress the coaching staff. I guarantee you that at some point those coaches will remember that kids hit and they will think maybe they have the next Ryan Reeves here. I feel bad for the kid that was laid out though. Just glad that young man was not hurt.
I see this as more incidental. If you look at what's going on, all he really did was slowly back into a guy that was skating really fast with his head down. I dont think he intended this hit to be as big as it was.
Imagine being a defensemen whose job is to keep them from crossing the blue line. Only to get in trouble for doing exactly that. They tell you to skate with your head up for a reason idk how you get to the NHL playing with your head between your legs
Development shouldnt be hitting but building players able to deliver and absorb them. It should be stick work in development. You always need your D to have decent sticks, some plug knocking out guys while the puck constantly gets past them to be scored on isnt going to help your team much. You can also stop a player or hit them by impeding the play you dont need to impede their longterm health. I laid huge hits in football and lead in sacks and no one ever got hurt or mad at me for them. If I was a GM I would be furious at my development coaches for letting this happen at all.
Why would you EVER cut through the middle with your head down? Just because it is development camp doesn't mean you can do whatever you want. You wouldn't do this in a game, or the same thing would happen. Practice how you play.
Keep your f@$"ing head up. Development camp or not, this is elite level hockey. I'd love to see a guy trying a Michigan/lacrosse goal get pumped like that.
I was never the same after my first major concussion. Foremost, I hope the guy is ok. But, I thought it was a clean hit. The man is playing for a spot in the NHL.
To be honest, this one is on Roni. It's not like he is charging nor that there's too much power. Actually there ain't even that much power. With his head up, Hirvonen would've barely felt it. Looks like Toronto felt the same way, since Dillingham got a deal. I cheer on the Leafs, and Hirvonen, but in my eyes Roni just showed he ain't ready for the big league yet. I can agree we don't need bonecrushing checks on development camps, but if you look closely, this wasn't even one of them.
It’s a pick more than a hit. Wasn’t like he got Kronwalled. You want players to finish their checks and that’s what happened. This is more of a spectacular accident than anything. It’s the Leafs so NHL fans are looking for their trademark drama IMO.
Unless it was stated that they weren't supposed to be physical in this camp before it started (which we have no idea because we aren't there) then there is no problem with this. Also keep your head up.
it’s called being professional. this was unacceptable for a training camp. like, yeah, always keep your head up, but there’s nothing in it for you if you get a big hit. if you’re there they already know what you’re capable of in the first place, so there’s no point to laying someone out like that. like, congrats? you just concussed a potential teammate.
Even if it's a camp, I see nothing wrong. Dillingham is an invitee and he was wanting to get eyes on him. In hockey it's physical, you should always expect a hit no matter what type of hockey game is being played. I think Hirvonen said himself that it was a good hit. I hope Hirvonen is okay, but some thing's in hockey shouldn't be removed just because it's a camp.
@@terrencewpg6902 when you’re throwing a clean hit like this, there’s absolutely no intent to injure. If Dillingham was trying to injure Hirvonen, he would’ve done it by head hunting, and that wouldn’t and didn’t happen.
If you’ve battled your entire life to make pro hockey or potentially even the NHL and you get the opportunity to wear the crest of an NHL organization, I don’t care if it’s on a frozen lake…you play like your life depends on it. If there’s a 1% chance of this camp getting you a shot at the NHL then you work your bag off and if there’s a clean hit available you finish it. End of story. I don’t blame him one bit. For context I’m an active minor pro in the US. Guys will finish hits like this in training camp to earn a spot to make $700 a week and it’s understood. This is the NHL, you don’t fly by a hit ever.
This is a coach/organization problem. You can't blame a mid or high prospect for letting up slightly in camp (they have many years of pro hockey left), and you can't blame an undrafted invitee for going full throttle (they might be out of competitive hockey any day). The rules of engagement need to be clear when you are mixing these groups of players together.
THIS.
Well said
Very well said. Personally, I hate Dillingham for this hit. However, His career is on the line. He needs to show his upside, and his upside is (very clearly) he's a good hitter. If you don't want these issues, lay the groundwork in an off ice meeting is absolutely the right way to go and I blame the organization for this hit more than Dillingham after reading your comment.
Assuming that this WAS NOT discussed beforehand in pre skate/pre camp meetings, I completely agree.
@@rakketz5976 " lay the groundwork in an off ice meeting"
So would the meeting go something like.... "Hey we are all on the same team here, don't fucking kill one of my guys trying to make the team"? Coach probably thought he didn't need to explain that...
Whatever was expected from these players at this camp in terms of hitting/ contact should have been made crystal clear by the coaching staff!
@@jacksonpundyk7367 Not to split hairs here, but it's development camp, not training camp. There is a difference. No one there is a bona fide NHLer and no one on that roster has played a single NHL game yet, so it's fair to assume some players may not be going at or expecting 100% effort in the physicality department.
No sir...the players are already well aware of what this camp is for and that guy who threw that hit is already on a bus to go home
So what are you saying… guys who are there because of their physicality have to tone it down so the skilled players can showcase their talents with their heads down?
I don’t care what you call the camp, training or development, it’s still hockey.
@@tylerjohnson8973 how so?
@@Bushman9 I'm not sure if your reply was directed at me, but I got a notifcation for it, so I'm going to reply to it anyway:
We're saying that if it's supposed to be safe for guys to skate across the blueline with their heads down, everybody should know that. Clearly that isn't the case, but for whatever reason, Hirvonen seems to have missed the memo.
Played with a guy who was a mid round pick to the London Knights. His first tryout with the team he had nothing to lose, played super physical, made it to the final round of cuts and was one of the last D cut from the team. Next season he expected to make the team, toned down the physicality, he said "I didn't want to hit guys like Marner, Dvorak or Tkachuk then be teammates". He ended up not making the team again and ended up in the Q. When they cut him they asked "where was that physicality from last year?" It's really a lose-lose situation for physical D men at tryouts. Since he told me that story I think 'fuck everyone else at tryouts, they're not your teammates until they're your teammates'.
100%
Very good perspective on this
Almost reminds me of when Clarke MacArthur had his career ended in a training camp scrimmage.. Bobby Ryan dropped the gloves with that guy on the spot.. I forget his name
Patrick Sieloff, iirc
Adam Deadmarsh had his career ended in a practice, as I recall. Concussion with symptoms (light sensitivity, vertigo) that in some cases didn't fade for like, 10+ years
I've seen hits like these at invitational rookie camps in juniors. Between guys who aren't part of the organization yet and compete for a spot... but these guys are in the pipeline already, that's overkill
@@edschramm6757 You can add Joonas Donskoi to the list, too. He and Kole Lind collided at the Kraken's training camp last season and he's not expected to play ever again.
I might be thinking of something else, but wasn't the hit on MacArthur a blatant elbow to the head, too?
What earned Dillingham a camp invite? His defensive play & physicality. What do they always tell these guys at these camps? We want you to play your game, do what got you here. Textbook clean hit.
leave it for the games. If coaches can't assess good skating, defending, etc. (not worth hurting players in their organization)
@@JoelER78 Nah if your gonna get hit like that here. You aint making the NHL
someone steps up to make the team by eliminating another players ability to make the team, smart move. Way to get teammates on your side
@@keithm3241 No the player skating with the puck eliminated his ability to make the team. There is no way an NHL player gets hit like that by someone that hasn't even been drafted.
@@shawnreems493 apparently you have watch these type of camps before. Maybe you should. This was not a competitive camp, this was basically shinny.
The problem I have here is that if Dillingham doesn't make contact, Hirvonen goes around him like a traffic cone (which according to some, had already happened a few times already). In his situation (as a heavy, physical, defense first defender), he has to play his game if he wants an invite to rookie camp later this summer. If he just lets guys breeze by him, he's going to get cut real fast. You simply can't invite these fringe guys in and tell them they have a chance if you're not going to let them actually try.
Now, as for the collision itself, there was nothing wrong with the hit, as stated in the video. What makes the end result so bad is that Hirvonen either had his head down and didn't see Dillingham commit to make the check, or simply wasn't expecting to get hit (or some combination of the two). Speaking from experience, either is a good way to end up concussed. I don't know if Hirvonen wasn't told that the scrimmage was full-contact or what, but it's pretty much Hockey 101 once you start hitting that you don't skate through the middle of the ice the way he did there, regardless of the whether it's a scrimmage or an actual NHL game. I sure hope the kid is okay, but I can't get behind the argument that you don't make a body check on someone and let them get by you because it's a scrimmage.
Clean hit, the kid ran into a brick wall. It's a shame he got hurt, but this isn't pee wee hockey. I don't mean to be heartless, but the leafs don't need more pampered softies on the team. This kid either comes back having learned a valuable lesson, or it's out the fkn door.
@@dislikebutton4981 Calm down keyboard tough guy.
@@fallendevonish1869 he is 100 percent correct .
@@fallendevonish1869 I essentially said the same thing that they did, but with a little more nuance.
@TheCMGiordano lmao that was my thought while writing the comment.
Dillingham was invited because of his style of play. This could be his only shot. They always tell you to play the way that got you there. He did & did it cleanly.
Well he just killed whatever shot he had because he's too stupid not to take off a teamates head in a fucking development vamp
Yeah, he made a good play, but this is still a scrimmage. Can't really take contact out of the game tbh, so no real easy fix to it outside making it noncontact.
Could do that for a scrimmage, but it is prolly better to just move stuff off ice and when on ice to run drills or something
Dude, there's levels you play at, even in the NHL. Yeah, you're a physical guy. There's four or five different ways you can make that hit without putting his lights out and still stopping his momentum.
The hit was stupid and just put one of the teams rising stars on the sidelines for some AHL four line grinder. It also jeopardized a top picks career for what? Your moment in the sun for five minutes?
Absolutely not necessary and just shows Dillinghams inability to tamp down his ability to make every check a dangerous one, even in a team friendly scrimmage.
@@ColonizerChan most scrimmages are non contact, think of it like like how they play the NHL All Star game.
he was undrafted for a reason he is never making the nhl
If it was a dirty hit I'd say it's completely uncalled for, but the entire point of development camp on ice is to essentially prove your worth to the team. The NHL is an absolute monster to get into, if you're not showcasing every aspect of your game whether it be physicality, skating, passing etc. You aren't gonna make the NHL. Yes it's unfortunate but he's also gotta learn to keep his head up.
Bingo
jackpot
Not dirty. Keep your head up with the puck.
Always hate to see someone young hurt like that in training camp. But you are not wrong, if your style of play is being physical you have to try and show that in camp if not then what are you doing there? Don´t think it was dirty at all just unfortunate.
Agree. I wish there was more to the video to see how long he had the puck beforehand but if the only people you see infront are three guys in a different color jersey, you better have a move or pass to get around that or be ready to make physical contact.
I really wish we had the 2 seconds before the hit. It's incredibly tough to tell what happened, but from their position it looks like puck-carrier tried to go feign going across the middle and then cut sharply right into the defender's angle as the defender is going stick on puck. That's an extremely cocky move. You almost have to feel for Dillingham in that case. It's not even about trying to lay a hit, it's that you didn't come out to a development camp to just let people dance around you--there's no ill-will there, just playing basic defense. He kept his stride, back leg pushing, but doesn't drive off his lead leg or raise up to deliver more contact. TH-cam can slow it down even more and you'll see he's almost spinning off to limit impact. Puck-carrier ran himself into a brick wall.
Thank you, almost like eck wasnt watching the same video.
the way he landed after being hit gave me trauma because of the hit on nathan horton in 2011, almost the same play, and that lead to career ending injuries for years afterwards
don’t even get me started on savard :(
yeah, guy is a second round draft pick skating with his head down through the neutral zone. He should know better. Good news is if he's just got a concussion this can be taken as a good lesson and a wake up call
I mean the easy way to solve this problem is the coaches should set an expectation before practice. If they do or don't want it to be game conditions, they should say so.
He did this in the ohl and that’s why he’s at the camp
Reminds me of a scene in the Don Cherry movie, where he got invited to Leafs training camp and then dummies their “superstar” and then gets kicked off the ice and never sees the NHL again. This was in the '60s and 70s too, star players are harder to find than goons who wanna make a name for themselves.
I think it may have been Ron Ellis that got checked by Cherry.
BEND YOUR KNEES MADAGASCAR!
My favourite scene is when, Eddie Shore ties the goalies neck to the crossbar because he didn’t want him going down to stop the puck, then starts taking shot on him and he keep trying to go down to stop it. Guy was the definition of his generation.
That was a fantastic documentary/movie! Loved every second of it! Too bad the kid that got knocked out in this play didn't watch this movie or listen to the message: Keep Your Head Up Kid!!!
When you're on the ice, protect yourself at all times.
I hope Dillingham gets a fair look.
I'm pretty sure he got more than a few looks. But, unfortunately, probably not the kind he wants...
He'll get a look at the exit door, but that's about it.
I want to see him catch Brad Marshand with one of those brick wall stops.
he was undrafted for a reason
I feel completely 50/50 about this. On one hand, don’t injure your own team mate in camp, chill out. On the other hand you’ve gotta understand this guy is trying hard to show himself as an NHL player and he doesn’t wanna just let the guy skate around him.
Bro thought he was playing nhl hockey In a development camp in July 💀
Seeing as the puck carrier just about skated into the defender I don't see an issue. Defender hardly moved just lowered his shoulder .Keep your head up
Exactly what happened and that’s on the forward. Spacial awareness is an important part of being able to successfully pull off tight moves in tough areas and roni failed in this situation. Maybe it’s the smaller ice but more likely it’s being too comfortable skating with your head down in traffic areas. Don’t do it !
It's getting to the point where your voice just talking literally anything hockey, I don't care if you're discussing paint color on the lines, is just so soothing. You're gonna need to beef it up like a video every four hours. Then I'll be fine! All jokes aside, love your content and can never get enough of this channel! My son is 8 and I love that I can show him your view and you give such great level headed advice and input. The best part, he listens because it's not coming from me haha
Reminds me of the prospect tournament between St. Louis and Detroit last year, where St. Louis had a few 24/25 year old "prospects" that were gooning it up and trying to injure as many players as they could.
If I saw a player do that in practice my first thought wouldn't be "he's a good hitter" it would be "he either lacks body control or psychological control".
Just coming back to this video to point out that Nolan Dillingham (along with Tyler Weiss, Tate Singleton, Neil Shea, Brock Caufield and Jackson Berezowski) have been signed to AHL contracts by the Toronto Marlies today.
If there were ground rules (there werent) about hitting then id say its BS move. But the scrimmage was physical & intense from the get-go. Great hit. Just sucks the kid got hurt.
Kid needs to keep his head up. He does that in the show he may actually die. If you’re playing the game, play it right
Imagine telling a prospect he's not allowed to play his hardest at an NHL camp
They took a page out of the Sens' book. Although...Ottawa players injure their opponents during preseasons, not their own guys 😅
Not even remotely the same.
Hey, scott stevens here and I approve this hit 🫡
Great hit and way to show the office who to keep and who to dump? NHL is a business, business is cut throat.
I se nothing wrong with the hit.
Kid is trying to make the team, and he made a clean hit. It wasn’t late, it wasn’t contact with head.
Keep your head up.
Hockeys a tough game, you can’t let your guard down let alone keep your head down when you move across centre ice with the puck. He’s looking like Tavares out there. Some people learn from hits like this, let’s hope.
Keep YOUR HEAD UP KIDS PROTECT YOURSELF FROM GETTING HURT
I've been to a few inter-squad games for the Bruins. Those games are very physical and there is always more than one fight. Guys are trying to make a name for themselves. If you don't want to get bulldozed, keep your head up.
Damn you Finland. This what you get when you don't practice hitting. I remember when I played hockey as a kid, and at about 12 years old, D-juniors, we were allowed to start body checking. We only had one practice where the coaches approached the topic. Only one. Shoulder to shoulder, no jumping, no hitting from behind, and how to brace yourself against the boards when getting hit. Good points, but that was it.
This happens every year in our "elite" league, Liiga, where many young players get severely hurt from normal hits , because they haven't been taught the physical aspect of the game and are not expecting to get hit at all.
It’s shocking to me how many people think this sort of contact during a prospect camp is out of the ordinary.
For any contact or combat sport, the second you put that gear on you have to be prepared to endure the risk of participation. Here, the stakes are at the highest. Guys are fighting for their livelihoods, paycheques, and futures.
Go to any Junior A or WHL spring prospect camp and you’ll see 16 year olds taking off their helmets and squaring off with 18-20 year olds to get their name noticed, and these kids aren’t even getting paid. I do not fault this guy one bit for stepping up for that hit. He’s trying to get paid just like everyone else there.
Yeah risk giving a guy thats on the same team as you an injury or concussion, good idea.
They're competing to be on the same team...neither is on the team
@@gordonbgraham ok the same organization. It's still one of your guys
@@ImGettinWeird It’s a competition to make the team. Hockey is a contact sport. It’s unfortunate the guy got laid out but you can’t half play hockey or you’ll find yourself in a suit reading about it.
@@gordonbgraham I know it's a contact sport but I just don't agree with trying to kill each other. You can still play the body but you don't need to injure each other either.
@@ImGettinWeird I don’t think he was trying to kill him. That was the play there. Take the man not the puck. Clean hit, just a tough lesson learned by a guy who is used to playing on Olympic size ice where most entries are made on the huge openings on the outside. Cutting inside at the blue line or just inside the blue line has consequences. In hockey circles that’s known as the trolly tracks. This is development camp. The kid learned a hard lesson which will help with his development.
Easton Cowan (TORs 1st round pick) got laid out in this same scrimmage with a big hit. Nobody is crying about that. Solely because there wasnt an injury like there was here. Both clean. Unfortunately Hirvonen got hurt & fortunately Cowan didn't.
Cowan is a tough Farmer Guy who worked on a Farm I like how Tough Cowan is the Leafs need more players with Grit mixed with skill and speed the Leafs need some defensive depth aswell
Clean hit!! Good job kid
HOLY SH%T. A Leaf that hits!!! Sign him!!!! lol
@@JJnSFarms The last thing we need is the refs to hate us more. Let's play a clean game and stay out of the box
@@JJnSFarms It's how the Panthers lost the Final, Play clean and you'll go places, but don't get pushed around, play that fine line like how Vegas played and you'll be put on that cup
There is nothing wrong with that, if he can't survive that hit and avoid it, he probably can't handle the NHL. Tryouts are just that, everyone showcasing what they bring.
Idk, i remember during soccer tryouts there was a guy going hard with slide tackles and just taking guys out. It annoyed all of us. We were all teammates, and there's no need to harm each other. At the same time, big hits like those happen in the nhl. It was a slip up from both guys, and we just hope him and everyone else is doing okay. Shits gonna just happen sometimes.
Hard and soccer should never be in the same sentence however I see where you are coming from.
@banshee107 that's just a haters mentality lol. It's quite a physical sport. You're not flying into body checks, but the possibility of injury is definitely there
Thats a big difference I think. Normally you never go hard like that with slide tackles in practice in football (soccer) In hockey camp you have to show your worth and if you are a physical player you have to show it.
Found you!
@@Lere LOLOLOLOL sure pal. I played both my entire life. Sit down and have a yogurt, mmm-kay?
These kids play hard even in practice. There is no taking it easy. Their careers depend on it. Good hit. Part of being good in the NHL is being able to either avoid such hits or being able to take your lumps. Nothing wrong with that hit.
This isn’t practice. This is the shit attitude the hockey community has that results in careers ending early. Everything is wrong in that hit in a dev camp scrimmage
@@krakenspectacor It will be far worse in the NHL. If you can't handle the heat get out of the kitchen. The "I wasn't ready" excuse didn't work when we were kids why would it now. This is a mans sport and boys get left behind.
@@johndesousa7379 your ignorance wrt dev camp is showing bud. No need to flex how manly you are while simultaneously looking so foolish
I’d want as many guys throwing the body around camp as possible, as long as it’s clean. This one appeared to be clean, just hard.
Guy wants to be a radko gudas. Love it!! Hopefully he gets there. Great start to show what you see on the ice. Pumped
It was a big hit because he skated across the middle of the ice with his head down. You can't blame the dman for being in his way. He's doing his job, development camp or not. It wasn't a dirty hit by any means. It was pure arrogance by the puck carrier.
As a coach at a higher level in youth hockey, I will say that you want to see guys in tryouts play at their highest level of intensity at all times, and if a guy needs to pay the price, they need to keep their head up and match that intensity. That said, I wouldn't be happy to see one of my guys that's a lock for the team get dummied by a guy that's on the bubble. The way I work it is that my first 2 skates have no scrimmages, and I'll just sign the guys who are locked in and tell them no more skates to avoid injury. I expect everyone to be going at full intensity if they expect to make a team. That said, an NHL training camp is different than tryouts for a youth AAA team for sure. I will say that if that's Matthews or something - Even more interesting Bedard because he's at a rookie camp now and a lock to make the Blackhawks, you better let him off the hook. If you level one of those guys, you better just get off the ice, take your gear off and go home. But with this type of camp where it's all guys trying to be seen, I'd say its all fair game. All of these guys are playing their asses off for sure. This is a huge opportunity for all of them.
It's a nice hit. Making a good clean open ice hit is very difficult. If you want to be able to do it, you have to be able to practice it. It really doesn't look like he put anything extra into that hit but, the power came mostly from good technique. There's times in the game where you hit someone a lot harder than you think you are, depending on what that player is doing and the angles.
It's a scrimmage during development camp between teammates. If you've ever been to one, you know there's basically no hitting, especially not open ice hitting. Who the fuck practices that on teammates in any case ?
@@MTLGSE I've never been to one where the possibility of making million of dollars if I impress the right people with my play is a possibility. I doubt you have either. Both of the these guys were no-names as far as any fan is concerned, but because of this play both of them are being looked at a lot more.
These men are fighting for a spot in the NHL. There is nothing wrong with that hit.
But they aren't, it's development camp, not training camp.
This is what earns an invite to training camp. This isn't a cake walk to just get invited. There are millions on the line for these guys.
"Protect yourself at all times" simple as that. It is big business, big stakes, and being judged by small time people over the internet. Does not add up. Nobody in that position cares what any of us think. Simple formula.
First clean hit. Actually, he ran into an almost stationary defender.
Two . Unless Jr Camps Midget Bantam tryouts have changed, checking sorry body checking was part of getting you noticed."
Come across center with your head down be expected to get hit ..
3
Development camp if scrimmages are part of camp tthey should be told that no physical body checking !!
Which defeats the purpose of scrimmages .
All Coaches Management have instructed all players that be prepared to be hit !
Last an player invited to a Development Camp may be their only shot chance , they thought enough of the player to invite them the other players might want to pay more attention to why not how come
Thats how you welcome young lads to the league
If you truly watch it, he skated right into it. A Clean open ice check is nearly impossible without a player being caught off guard.
KEEP YOUR HEAD UP!
I think both points have some merit. On the one hand, yeah, if this guy is a bit more of a physical player, he's naturally going to want to show a bit of what he can do in the hopes of catching someone's eye and making a good impression. And yes, keeping one's head up is never a bad lesson to learn. On the other hand, no one is really expecting to get laid out like this during camps because they're more like a group job interview than anything else. The crazy pressure that can come with your normal job is rarely something people see in interviews regardless of the field of work -- and hockey is no exception. Ultimately this is something that falls at the feet of coaching and the Leafs organization. You need to make it pretty clear up front what level of play/physicality is expected or tolerated in camp. If players know ahead of time that a bit more is going to be considered acceptable, they can prepare accordingly, but if you don't say it explicitly it leaves everyone a bit unclear and stuff like this happens.
This reminds me of when I went to training camp for the Blackhawks. Duncan Keith laid out Ben Smith at the blue line (didn't knock him out, but crushed him). I don't mind this. If you want to win, you have to practice like you play.
YES, I can hear the discussion on the ice between the players: "Hey, tone it down, this is just an INTER-SQUAD DEVELOPMENTAL CAMP SCRIMMAGE!!!!"
Lol, well it got him the attention he needed. Dillingham just got signed by the Marlies today.
You practice like you play. Hirvonen's gonna get hit like that in the NHL. Keep your head up.
I agree with you. Had a twitter argument with someone who kept telling me it was a clean hit like yes, clean, but not necessary though. Not a good way to get noticed. Playing out a top prospect isn’t getting you positive attention.
It’s a skills development camp not a prospects camp. Laying a hit like that, while skillful, isn’t something you can really develop at a camp. Focus on the clean part of your game there.
@@braygun44he’s trying to make the NHL, he’s going to do what his job is. he’s a big physical first defender.
@@TheKitKatThe oh yeah I completely get why he did it but it’s just like use some common sense, yknow
@@braygun44 Let the guy skate around him, so he looks like a pylon and gets cut before the next skate -- ruining a potential career for millions of dollars over the course of a decade. Common sense
That's like being asked by your boss to prove yourself on an assignment and half ass-ing it so the other guy looks better and gets the promotion. Do you hear yourself?
@@DrinkingBird69 no, not really. He’s not being asked to prove how physical he is. He’s there to learn how to improve his skills
Pretty tough to punish the guy for doing exactly what he’s there to do
It’s a scrimmage…
He’s there to injure a teammate during a scrimmage? 😂 Okay bud
It's his job to put his own team mates on IR. This is a new position to me...
@@ValhallaRaven hes there to prove himself, he did that, if the coaches didn't say its non-contact or 50% then he did exactly what he was supposed to do, its a tough spot but you have to look at it from the players perspective
@@ValhallaRaven he didn’t mean to injure anyone, have you ever played hockey before?
Updraft walk on. I'd do it to for a shot at the roster.
Hits like these are honestly a product of a different time in the NHL, in least in terms of doing it in practice. Still, its a clean hit, and you shouldnt expect that guys are just gonna lay off you cause some of these players may never play pro hockey again.
There was a story from the Atlanta Flames in the 70s where their top pick at the time Jacques Richard kept coming up the middle of the ice with his head down in practice.
The coach told the players to take it easy on him until the teams veteran defenseman Bob Paradise decided he had seen enough, and completely laid Richard out as he was coming up the middle.
Obviously thats the product of a thankfully bygone era, but theres still a precedent you have to learn when your in the NHL. Keep your head up.
IMO, its better he learns that here than with some AHL goon completely making him forget what city hes in when he does the same thing.
Alex Hemsky ended his NHL career cause he didnt keep his head up after 800 NHL games. Theres a million examples of guys always playing with their head down cause they never knew what it was like to get hit, until well. Eric Lindros for example.
As a former rugby player. When we had off season training you go hard because you want to make the active roster. Doesn't matter that it's training. You wanna prove yourself, and that is what the kid in the white jersey did.
It sucks to see that he got laid out but jesus christ it's a basic thing in hockey keep your damn head up. Hockey is a contact sport.
Hard to say what should happen, on one hand you don't want your players knocking each other out during camp but it was a clean hit. Its unfortunate how everthing played out but what can you really do besides just play it by ear.
This here is why a lot of the teams including Chicago aren’t doing ice time at development camp
Actually, the Hawks are the only team having an all off-ice camp. It also helps that Chicago has stockpiled enough quality prospects over the past couple of years, and they don't need to bring in undrafted players to bolster their prospect pool. No need for on-ice auditions of undrafted players.
That hit is brutal
Really nice hit.
As a "team" development camp. It should be explained before they hit the ice what the level of physical play is allowed. The guy learned a lesson to keep your head up and don't dangle into the middle of the ice before the blue line. He'd never get away with that in any real game.
The first rule of hockey is always be look round. 2nd rule is don't skate with your head down. The plyer that hit him was only doing what he was supposed to do if the guy had his head up he would not have been hit so hard and could have prepared. It is the same as a person walking down the street reading their phone and not looking where they go when they walk into someone.
Don't have too much of a problem with this happening in a scrimmage portion of a time where you're looking to get yourself noticed especially in the case of professional hockey. I have a much bigger problem with these kind of hits happening in drills though. In that scenario you already know where somebody is going to be on the ice and the precedent has been set that you're just doing skill work. Seen it happen a few times in that setting and it always messes up the mood in the dressing room and its bull** and not fun for anyone especially when you should be building the chemisty and mood on and off the ice at those times with potential future teammates. 💯
Hey, the pertinent question is: was this the development camp scrimmage, or the SELECTION camp scrimmage?
Because if it was for roster selection, then there’s nothing wrong with this picture.
If it was actually development camp…well there is never supposed to be hitting in a dev camp scrim.
Knowing which camp this happened in makes all the diff.
imagine if if marner and nylander played the playoffs with the same intensity as gilllingham in the training camp
dev camp everyone is going 60% its NOT training camp
Kid just got a contract…nothing like getting on the radar 😂
sucks that the guy got hurt but leafs could use a hitter like that
Good hit. Keep your head up
I get the need for the Dillingham to play hard to try to make an impression but for an intersquad development game, I think he should've let up a little or if the hit had to be made then yell "heads" before making contact so Hirvonen could brace himself for contact and mitigate concussion risk.
This is the NHL baby. Everyone on that ice is trying to impress the coaching staff. I guarantee you that at some point those coaches will remember that kids hit and they will think maybe they have the next Ryan Reeves here. I feel bad for the kid that was laid out though. Just glad that young man was not hurt.
Dude earned himself an AHL contract!
I see this as more incidental. If you look at what's going on, all he really did was slowly back into a guy that was skating really fast with his head down. I dont think he intended this hit to be as big as it was.
Looks like they are developing concussions
Leafs transformation to full-on goon squad is progressing nicely!
“Nice hit eh” - Ross Rhea
Imagine being a defensemen whose job is to keep them from crossing the blue line. Only to get in trouble for doing exactly that. They tell you to skate with your head up for a reason idk how you get to the NHL playing with your head between your legs
This is like throwing a massive hit at the all star game, like what are you doing
Reminds me of the Don Cherry movie where he laid out a high draft pick for the same thing. "GET THAT 10 CENT HOCKEY PLAYER OFF THE ICE!"
Development shouldnt be hitting but building players able to deliver and absorb them. It should be stick work in development. You always need your D to have decent sticks, some plug knocking out guys while the puck constantly gets past them to be scored on isnt going to help your team much. You can also stop a player or hit them by impeding the play you dont need to impede their longterm health. I laid huge hits in football and lead in sacks and no one ever got hurt or mad at me for them. If I was a GM I would be furious at my development coaches for letting this happen at all.
This isnt a youth development drop in. They're "developing" the NHL prospect pool
Why would you EVER cut through the middle with your head down? Just because it is development camp doesn't mean you can do whatever you want. You wouldn't do this in a game, or the same thing would happen. Practice how you play.
best to keep your head up :)
although 77 could have yelled out he was coming !
Keep your f@$"ing head up. Development camp or not, this is elite level hockey.
I'd love to see a guy trying a Michigan/lacrosse goal get pumped like that.
I was never the same after my first major concussion. Foremost, I hope the guy is ok. But, I thought it was a clean hit. The man is playing for a spot in the NHL.
From that hit it didn't seem like the intent to injur was there
It’s on the coach. Coaches have to lay down ground rules before playing grey-area hockey like this.
Number 1 rule in any hockey, keep your darn head up. They should practice that b4 going pro.
To be honest, this one is on Roni.
It's not like he is charging nor that there's too much power. Actually there ain't even that much power. With his head up, Hirvonen would've barely felt it.
Looks like Toronto felt the same way, since Dillingham got a deal. I cheer on the Leafs, and Hirvonen, but in my eyes Roni just showed he ain't ready for the big league yet.
I can agree we don't need bonecrushing checks on development camps, but if you look closely, this wasn't even one of them.
It’s a pick more than a hit. Wasn’t like he got Kronwalled. You want players to finish their checks and that’s what happened. This is more of a spectacular accident than anything. It’s the Leafs so NHL fans are looking for their trademark drama IMO.
Unless it was stated that they weren't supposed to be physical in this camp before it started (which we have no idea because we aren't there) then there is no problem with this. Also keep your head up.
That was my game! My number was known as notoriously as my JOFA space ranger helmet.
Coach saw it 100 times by now, so…?
it’s called being professional. this was unacceptable for a training camp. like, yeah, always keep your head up, but there’s nothing in it for you if you get a big hit. if you’re there they already know what you’re capable of in the first place, so there’s no point to laying someone out like that. like, congrats? you just concussed a potential teammate.
Even if it's a camp, I see nothing wrong. Dillingham is an invitee and he was wanting to get eyes on him. In hockey it's physical, you should always expect a hit no matter what type of hockey game is being played. I think Hirvonen said himself that it was a good hit. I hope Hirvonen is okay, but some thing's in hockey shouldn't be removed just because it's a camp.
I mean sure... if you like injuring your teammates
@@terrencewpg6902 when you’re throwing a clean hit like this, there’s absolutely no intent to injure. If Dillingham was trying to injure Hirvonen, he would’ve done it by head hunting, and that wouldn’t and didn’t happen.
@@terrencewpg6902 They are not teammates. Neither has made the team yet. They are trying to get a roster spot.
If you’ve battled your entire life to make pro hockey or potentially even the NHL and you get the opportunity to wear the crest of an NHL organization, I don’t care if it’s on a frozen lake…you play like your life depends on it. If there’s a 1% chance of this camp getting you a shot at the NHL then you work your bag off and if there’s a clean hit available you finish it. End of story. I don’t blame him one bit. For context I’m an active minor pro in the US. Guys will finish hits like this in training camp to earn a spot to make $700 a week and it’s understood. This is the NHL, you don’t fly by a hit ever.
Dude people used to fight in these, it should be full tilt , keep your head up kid
Ummmm .... the guy skated right into him. The defender didn't do much more than brace himself.
Phew. I thought those were Canucks practice jerseys in the thumbnail for a second 😬
Clean hit, he did his job