Guys, Bird Strike even with a single engine loss doesn't cause huge Hydlaulic problems. For now it is still a mistery of why there was a belly landing with no flaps and reverser2 open. My deepest condolences to the families and loved ones of those who tragically lost their lives in this heartbreaking incident.
ads-b 데이타는 58분에 끝나있지만 목격자에따르면 항공기가 복행후 공항을 중심으로 1회(이상) 회전했다고했습니다 그 증거로 원래 남쪽에서 착륙접근하는게 통상인데 이번엔 북쪽으로부터 최종착륙을 시도했습니다 그리고 영상을 자세히보시면 버드스트라이크는 엔진 두개 모두에 영향을 준것으로보입니다 부기장측엔진이 폭발하여 불꽃을 일으킬때 기장측 엔진에서도 연기가 피어납니다 말씀하신대로 진입속도가 너무 빠른데다 최초 터치다운위치가 활주로절반을 지나치는 정중앙부근이었습니다! 이건 미스테리입니다! 그리고 엔진측면커버는 열려있으나 리버스트러스트도 작동하지않는것처럼보이구요 랜딩기어도 작동하지않았고 모든 악재가 이 비극을 위해 작동했습니다 제생각을 덧붙이자면 조종사는 최초터치다운순간 활주로길이가 부족하다고 느끼고 리버스를 취소하고 다시 재가속을 준비했으나 리버스가 해제되지도않고 바닥에 달라붙은 항공기가 상승하지도못했다고생각해볼수도있겠습니다
Fantastic analysis. Where others rush out information without any thought to what they are writing, you take the time to dispel obvious untruths. Thank you Prayers to all those lost and their families 😔😔💔💔
That's what happens when big media conglomerates buy news channels as just another billboard to show ads on. Suits get sent in to cut costs, and "content" - real journalism and expertise - is a cost to them. Just big business in action, over and over. Once you see it....
Hi Dennis, I am a retired Australian ATC with 35 years in aviation. All ILS and associated navaid installations should be engineered to ICAO standards which means they should be frangible inside the runway safety area. This makes sure any obstacles cause minimal damage with an impact with a vehicle or aircraft. I was horrified to see the construction of an embankment and other concrete forms within the runways safety area (as it appears from this video). The pilots did an excellent and valiant job keeping the aircraft aligned with the centreline as much as they could with no steering control. This would have been a mostly survivable accident if not for the badly designed runway infrastructure.
No BS, no fluff, dude gets right into it and just keeps on dishing out high velocity information without any fluff at all. I wish more content were like this across all topics.
The fact is - it was a 737-800 assembled in Boeing Renton WA. Also in December 2024, a KLM skidded off the runway after an emergency landing in Olso - one Air India same in Halifax. All of the Boeing 737 800 were assembled in the same UNION-controlled factory in the State of Washington
@@BernhardSchwarz-xs8kp And what is the relevance, particularly as no one yet knows the exact cause of this incident? It is very poor form to speculate on something of which you have no idea and no one yet has an idea.
@@bobvidoni5898 Repetitive of exactly the same nature are never coincidences. 3 incidents where the hydraulic system failed, unable to manipulate the landing gear or flaps - 3 times within 3 days in December 2024 - 19500 passengers were killed in exactly the same type of scenarios on 737 800 planes - that is not a one-time event. Dozens of incidents of "missing screws" and panels flying off the plane 737 Max repeatedly - all assembled in Boeing Everette both 737 - 800 and Max in the State of Washington where the UNIONS are in control - and forced Boeing to shut down all Defense Department production in Washington for safety reasons - that is not a one-time accident.
I guess it depends. If there are buildings somewhere after that concrete wall, it makes perverse sense to have that as a "the people on the plane die, but not the people in the buildings" kind of barrier. In this case, though, there doesn't appear to be buildings there.
I am Korean. I am living in Korea. Since this happened, for all day, I have been listening to Korean media and your video is the most credible source of information about this accident, so far. Everything you said, I 100% agree.
@@cobraskenpo2299not so much that the antenna were there (that’s quite common). It’s the fact that they were raised up so high atop a substantially built up and reinforced concrete pad. It’s the pad which caused the damage and not the antennae. I have suspicions that it may well be something to do with the need for robustness as a result of the threat posed by their Northern Cousins. Although, what purpose such a thing would serve even given the want to make their infrastructure robust as a result of the above mentioned threat is anyone’s guess.
I’m Korean. The media doesn't analyze accidents much. They just compete with each other to see who posts more news and faster Your analysis is more accurate than the Korean press I hope this case will be resolved quickly and new regulations will be made + The media did not refer to the entire Korean media, but to some media outlets May the deceased rest in peace
Your comment on the South Korean media is really interesting. What you describe is tabloid-level coverage and kind of scary if that's the generally accepted media model.
@@y6cd3sdzHs1g korean media copies comments from communities like reddit and make a news out of it. You think I’m joking right 😂 I wish I was. And yeah, thats the main media including national television.
Most likely many people immiediately thought why this concrete thick wall has been built so close to the runway. This is great coverage, precise and much more informative than what tv channels and networks provided. Many thanks!
@@peterk5981 they even make it clear the pilots took the runway is the reverse direction to normal flow, Aka it was not at the end of the runway but the operationally start.
People have actually not taken notice of the wall before this video. The wall was soil by the way. There was concrete in it to anchor the pins holding the signals. If you look at the side view of the wall after the crash, you can tell that the real issue were the solid metal pins. The plane would have kept moving, if it had not been for the pins. I wonder if anyone even knew about the mass of conrete in the soil and the fact that the pins are solid metal that was working at the airport at the time of construction or currently. It certainly is a very unususal design that would have most likely been changed, if people had been aware. Very strange accident from beginning to the end - and what a horrible end.
I am Korean. I feel deeply heartbroken that such a terrible incident has occurred in Korea. The immense sorrow and shock seem to have caused the Korean media to lose their composure, and there isn't much coverage that explains the situation clearly. This TH-cam channel, however, provides a calm and objective explanation of the events, and it has been incredibly helpful. Thank you.
Nice video. Spot on with my exact same thoughts. Experienced 737 guy here with 17000 hours of 737 time. The bird strike/compressor stall issue doesn’t itself lead to a gear up no flap landing with a single reverser deployed (ironically the reverser that is on the supposed problem engine). The loss of an engine does not promt a loss in hydraulics because there is still an electric pump supplying pressure to the associated hydraulic system. Same thing with the flaps. The gear can be alternate extended with the pull cables, and the flaps have an alternate electric extension system. Something that could have happened …. Say they have an engine problem, and after initial reaction and go around, mistakingly shut down the wrong engine in the initial stage of the checklist. That puts them maybe 3000 feet just now north of the airfield, no engines, no apu running yet. The windmilling engines can provide enough hydraulics for flight controls, but they are down to emergency battery power only as far as electrical goes. so they are able to turn around and land opposite direction. Accounting for what is now a tailwind, clean config, and a very long high energy landing. . They don’t have time to get any flaps or gear out, or they are afraid that the added drag from those devices won’t allow them to make all the way to the runway. That would explain some of what appears to be erratic behavior by this crew. Something here went truly weird. It’s my experience that a cascade of mechanical failures, while possible, is a lot less likely that the possibility of a crew failure. A breakdown in judgement and crew resource management. Nobody wants to throw the pilots under the bus, it’s too early for that, but every 737 pilot in the world right now is scratching their head wondering the same thing…. And that wall with the loc antenna. Great observation, why would they do that? That certainly caused this accident to be a lot deadlier than it needed to be. RIP to these unfortunate souls!
Seems like crew on final approach decided to reconfigure aircraft for aborted landing (flaps up, gear up, spoilers disarmed and full throttles) but were constrained nonetheless to touchdown at last minute
@ a water landing is very hazardous. Sully made it look easy, and truth be known he got super lucky. Engines or wing can “dig” into the water and things go sideways fast. Landing on a runway would be highly preferred. If these guys were zero engine and gliding it might explain how fast and far down the runway they were. I haven’t looked at the airport proximity to water. Water would be better than buildings or rugged terrain for use. So it’s hard to say. If they did shut the wrong engine down, then the ensuing shock of their actions would render their judgement and actions after that event suspect as well. At that point they are trying just to survive. It’s a situation they aren’t trained for, because there is no good outcome.
Seriously, a huge credit to you! None of Korean presses pointed out the concrete wall before Koreans leave the comments on the national news clips about what you explained here. They all blamed the birds in the very beginning. Big thanks to you!
Everything was going well until they hit that "Concrete wall/bunker" at the end of the runway. I wonder if the people who made that wall are happy with themselves...it may have just saved 1 or 2 of those antennas.
This is a sound preliminary analysis/overview. As a current 737-300/400 & -800 pilot myself, I too am mystified by the lack of manual gear extension*, lack of flaps set to at least 15 (maximum recommendation using the electrically-driven alternate system), under an (unlikely) assumed loss of A & B hydraulic systems (the deployed #1 thrust reverser implies that at least the Alternate hydraulics were functioning). Further tellingly, the alternate flaps extension system drives the leading edge devices to full extension upon the first tap of its toggle switch using Alternate hydraulic pump pressure. A significant birdstrike to an engine simply can’t render the airframe’s hydraulic system inoperable. Even the complete physical loss of an engine, wouldn’t keep the landing gear retracted and alternate flap system inoperative (its 3 pylon-attachment shear-bolts are designed to snap, thus jettisoning the engine in the event of a catastrophic fan seizure, instead of damaging the wing.) Both engine-driven high volume hydraulic pumps are backed up by respective lower volume (but adequate) electric motor driven pumps located, along with their respective reservoirs, in the main landing gear well, well separated from the engines; co-located is the Alternate hydraulic pump for a total of 3 electrically driven hydraulic pumps in addition to the 2 engine-driven pumps. I seem to be implying something here… Along with the 12/25 EMB190 crash, I am very interested to learn what the CVR and FDRs reveal. *I once had to pull the handle-cables in a since-retired 737-200 during a system-A hydraulic glitch one night approaching Anchorage. It’s not difficult and each gear assembly drops and locks down within seconds.
@@EstorilEmYes they are. But krueger/slat use hyd power from stdby system (in alternate mode) They go to full extension after one pull from the switch on over head panel. Flaps will go down but with electrical motor (they can go up or down thanks to the switch). Btw, with alternate mode engaged, krueger/slat cannot be retracted when they are in full extended position.
@@EstorilEmit seems only trailing edge is but not leading edge, so far I read. And only trailing edge can be both extended and retracted but leading edge can only be extended. Either way I straight just asked the question regarding manual gear extension and alt flaps.. very strange and concerning.
So many red flags, engines at full power, one in reverse, no flaps, no gear, no slats, no up elevator, no deceleration. Yet this aircraft had no issue lining up with a runway. No one can explain how.
Keep an eye on Gematria values for this story....this kind of stuff that instantly makes international news when most of the time, it would never, is part of it.
And there should be no excuse there have been tons of pilots who were faced with this example in the past and they made it out alive, they set the example on how to deal with these situations. The runway at this airport is only 9186 feet long once they realized they had a failure they should’ve directed to Incheon and land at their 13123 ft long runway where there is also more advanced services.
As a passenger that just left that airport 3 days ago thank you for your analysis Sir! It could have been me chard by now. After flying 6 planes from South Korea to the islands South in the Pacific I felt lucky and blessed. Thank you God. I have these crazy thoughts before I went back home. You wouldn't believe some of the airlines I took (AirAsia/Cebu Pacific). Prior to take off you can hear the engine so loud and shaky. I was alarmed but them crews and other passengers don't care. Anyhow we all made it to our destinations. My thoughts and condolences to the passengers and their families.
@@tavuong666 I thank God that I made it through alive. Imagine 6 airlines I have to take to reach my island bruh (Panay island). I always take Korean air they're safe and reliable. I don't take Philippine airlines. My Condolences to the families. As I said I was just in their airport.
@@classictravelconnections8107 Sis when you sell a ticket please make sure that plane isn't ready to go to the morgue. But honestly I haven't heard of an air disaster this magnitude in our islands. Infact when I left Canlaon Volcano is erupting nextdoor Island. How in d heck they go around it. We even got hit by ashes and earthquake nextdoor but flight was canceled only in the beginning the rest they flew like a bird around it.
As a retired Boeing flight attendant as of 1 year ago, this is the most accurate, detailed, and comprehensive explanation to date. I learned even more than reported with your honesty, forthcoming, and compassion insights. Thank you from the aviation industry. My heart aches and cries for the immeasurable loss suddenly thrust upon these families and their loved ones as they try to navigate through unspeakable pain. 🙏🏽 Prayers for strength, any comfort, and answers going forward for these lost souls. 💔🌹❤️🩹
@@swiftadventurer Flight attendants are not waitresses or servants, they're professional crew members whose primary responsibility is safety and inflight procedure, not just bringing you tomato juice and eye masks. Most have hundreds or thousands more hours in the sky than you or I do, during which time they usually get to know the characteristics of their airplane and have the opportunity to observe pilot behavior and generally how commercial aircraft work. Does that make her a technical expert in aerospace or news reporting? Of course not. But it does mean she may have more exposure and experience in this topic than the average viewer, and her opinion is valid. Also, don't be a jerk.
@@its_clean Mama's comments are NOT about serving cabin passengers, are NOT about number of hours in the sky, are NOT about airplane characteristics, are NOT about pilot behavior... IF, which I can agree as you propose, those are Mama's area of expertise. RATHER, her comments ARE about the ACCURACY AND COMPREHENSIVENESS about a TH-camr's upload in comparison to all other uploads, WHICH she implies IS her experience and has extra credence specifically because she prefaces her comments with said experience. Therefore, answer the topic of THIS portion of the comments... why don't YOU think it is funny that people do EXACTLY what I have described, despite how much of a jerk you are for concluding that I am jerk?
Thanks for this analysis. I was trained as a Civil Aviation Engineer by the CAA in New Zealand. We had it almost beaten into us, that every navigational aid on the airport needed to be frangible. Yes - antennae were mounted on concrete - but the concrete was level with the ground, and fixing bolts were actually hack-sawed to ensure that they would shear at ground level. I'm sure that there is going to be some serious questions asked about that ILS Localiser installation.
Why on earth would one build a concrete wall as an intentional stopper at the end of a runway?!? If an emergency stop can be at all imagined to possibly ever be needed, then you don't design a 100% murderous barrier! It's disguisting! I feel some planners and decisionmakers ought to spend years in prison!
Jeju also had two flights suspended in 2022, and 10 pilots and maintenance crew suspended for ignoring safety procedures. So sounds like they have multiple issues. That said the country has a pretty good safety record, so it's possible the 2022 thing was just due to good safety monitoring.
I suspect this has been a jet blast wall previously, possibly with a different runway layout. When things changed they decided is was easier to put the localiser on top rather than remove lots of steel-reinforced concrete and earth.
Former Marine pilot here. So many questions remain. Two surviving crew members also said that a bird struck the first engine, but it still does not explain why the landing gear did not deploy. This has to be one of strangest runway designs I’ve seen and I used to fly in and out of South Korea on multiple occasions.
It could be a pilot error, they might forgot to deploy the landing gear. My question is if only the right thrust reverse was used and flaps didn't work, how did the plane not slide onto the right? Is it possible that the shadow on the video is not due to thrust reverse but a damage to the engine?
Well it did land in the opposite direction than typical. And there are houses not far from the end of the runway. HIndsight is 20/20. Maybe they thought runway overshoot in that direction wouldn't happen. There are countless examples past and present where the design never thought something would happen but it does.
@@veraboltonRecall to the PIA8303 belly incident a few years ago. Poor CRM and lack of QRH referencing. Both pilots fixation on landing the plane at all costs, swiss cheese chain of events - lowered gear, then overspeed and raised gear, no flaps and no landing config. Ultimately floated and touchdown way too late. Now look at the Jeju crash and see the similarities - no flaps, very late touchdown, lack of reaction (no spoilers, no reversers). Some latest eyewitness an hour ago even recalled seeing the plane overhead with its gear down at some point; which means it was likely raised and forgotten about - the same factor that meant PIA8303 landed on its belly. Clearly similarities, both in actions and how blatantly basic configs and QRH were followed, even if it was a bird strike that caused a compressor stall. Engines were running upon the impact with the wall, and they grounded pretty much on the centerline, so definitely not a handling or hydraulic issue.... Hope I'm making some sense here 😅
@@IsabelleSt.Pierre-q2n they should of been on landing configuration long before even entering bravo airspace. I fly solo and can get my aircraft configured properly. Many many questions.
They are saying the bird in the engine was more serious that it looks from the videos. It started an internal fire that damaged the hydraulics and was spreading to the rest of the plane internally... but who knows...
I thought your spot on preliminary analysis was one of the best I’ve seen. As always, we’ll leave it up to the accident investigation professionals to really nail this down. I’ve run this video multiple times. One by one, you were hitting on every note that I had jotted down and much more. I’m a retired military and corporate aviator with a background in aviation safety and accident investigation. I’m not typed in the 737. Largest type in the Gulfstream GVI (G650). I’m going to put in a plug in here for Laminar Research’s desktop simulator - XP-12. Obviously not a level D sim, but I’m been extremely pleased with it’s attention to detail, especially with its 737-800 aerodynamics quality. I set up the 737-800 on runway 19 at Muan Int’l Airport. Set the weight at 146,000 lbs. Flew one approach and landing as you had described (clean wing, no ground spoilers, gear up). Touched down just past the aiming points and stopped with about three hundred yards remaining. I did a second run with 40 flaps, gear up, ground spoilers and TR’s deployed (forgot to kill the left TR), hit the aiming points this time and stopped adjacent to the terminal. Hope the cockpit voice recorder and the “black box” are found and in good shape.
The media has a much broader range of subjects to cover, and only so much staffing with which to do it. This pilot doesn't next have to pivot to the latest health-related research, followed by a weather-event story, followed by war coverage followed by financial news followed by...
Because they have no political axt to grind. This plane was a Boeing 737 800. Do your research It came out of Renton Washington - this model has so far killed 1950 passengers all in similar accidents. Skidding off the runwayIn December just a few days apart one KLM 737 800 skidded off the runway after an emergency landing in Oslo - one Air India in Halifax.
I am a career USAF officer and applaud your excellent analysis of this almost preventable tragedy! Would there have been the loss of life, yes, but I suspect that it would have been far less than today's total. Wonderful job!
Mate, this is just Boeing alone. I'm sure we'll hear more about the F35s that seem to like going underwater, or "touching ground" unexpectedly. Made in USA!
@@_._._._._._._._._._._._._.____ Yep. 2020's made in usa is 1980's made in china. 😅 "Most powerful country in the world" can't do Even flyable planes😅
I ‘m Korean. Thank you for addressing the Jeju Air accident in Korea. Amid the deep sadness, your detailed explanation provided some comfort and understanding. Domestic news frequently mentions bird strikes, but your description of the aircraft’s operational structure greatly helped in comprehending the accident’s cause. I sincerely appreciate your thorough and thoughtful explanation.
A sad way to end 2024. Surely this accident could have been prevented somehow? I pray the loved ones of those lost can recover from this. I hope this year's misfortune only bring better change to the country (less corruption, better social net, healthier work / life balance).
Your analyses answered a lot, Denys. I read quite a few comments by the Pilots here and thought the same (after seeing the crash on TV) - this tragedy, most likely, would be much less horrible. I guarantee the thorough and complete investigation will clarify all circumstances of this devastating accident. My condolences to families and RIP to all innocent souls
This accident sounds similar to Pakistan International Airlines Flight 8303. The copilot thought they needed to do a go around while the captain, who was flying the plane, thought they were going to land. The copilot retracted the landing gear to do the go around and then the pilot tried to land with the landing gear up. This was a communications failure in the cockpit causing the pilot and copilot to not be on the same page.
Plausible. Would be tragic if this later turned out to be one of those infamous cases where the Captain and FO disagreed or miscommunicated but the FO was too afraid to speak up because of the seniority of the captain.
I am not good at English. Please understand. Im an air traffic controller In Korea, more than 15 years experiecned . i worked muan airport tower as a team leader, one and half years. this accidents is very sad for me. Due to runways surface angle, the LOC antenna is need to be more higher position, of course, for a aircraft safety all of airports obstucles have to soft. but many airmen do not know the LOC antenna's soil hill has internals inside is concrete. so am i. i was very embarassed why inside has concrete? at the time of the accident, i think a tower air traffic controllers may don't know this factor. contrastively, the wall of airport is made of loose block. a few years ago a car was hitted the airports wall. break through a wall, driver was severe injured not dead. but why LOC antenna's soil hill is made by concrete? its need to investigate. I think it's going to be included in the accident investigation report. 179 Souls. Rest In Peace... ------------------------------------------------------- What i meant to say was [ I'm not good at English] → Im not a native english speaker, Please stop the argument.
많은 전문가들이 런웨이 끝부분에 단단한 콘크리드 장벽만 없었어도 이런 대참사는 벌어지지 않았을거라 지적하는데 도대체 이런 안테나 콘크리트 장벽을 누가 설계했는지 해명하라 해야 하고요, 안테나 장벽을 이참에 다 뿌셔 버리고 활주로와 같은 방향으로 혹은 멀찍이 떨어져 설치하도록 해야 할겁니다. 짧은 활주로에 미쳤다고 단단한 콘크리트 장벽을 떡하니 가로막고 있게 하는 것 골백번 생각해도 미친 디자인입니다!
I am a former airline Captain with extensive 737 experience. This is a very good analysis of what we know so far. I believe that the voice recorder will answer many questions about this tragic accident. I can’t understand why that reinforced concrete was placed at the end of the runway.
we all know why they are there, as a former airline pilot you have seen many things like that wall at numerous airports, and you are also aware that there is usually a common sense reason for obstructions like that. you should not be confused by this - IF you were an airline 'captain'. Also ... 'as an airline pilot' .. you should of also noticed he landed at the end of the runway and nowhere near the beginning, or even the middle. he landed at the end - and there was no way that plane was going to survive that without running off the end of the runway at high speed.
@@armastat My pilot experience is a matter of public record on the FAA.gov website. I have 35 years of experience in many aircraft types and 22000 hours of flight time. And, no, I have not seen concrete walls at the end of runways . As far as where he landed on the runway, I never even mentioned anything about that.
@@armastat My pilot experience is a matter of public record on the FAA.gov website, 22000 hours of total time and 35 years of experience with multiple type ratings. Are you even a pilot?
I hope this video be seen by many koreans; we need to know seriousness of hard soil wall including concretes. Our main media only shows bird strike and landing gear loss which is to evade the topic: why there are soil hill
The Korean media is looking too much at what the pilot did, what happened with the landing gear, but not the engineers and government being responsible for such a concrete wall was responsible for almost everyone dying. The media is disappointing.
@@Bazza5000 난 관련자가 아니라 전문적인 부분은 모르지만, 파일럿에 관심이 집중되는 이유는 한쪽 엔진이 멈춘 상황에서 생각할 수 있는 조치를 모두 생략하고 2분 만에 곧바로 배면착륙이 이루어졌기 때문입니다. 첫 랜딩 실패 후 매우 짧은 회전으로 활주로의 중간지점에 착륙. 심지어 랜딩기어 수동조작도 하지 않고 곧바로 착륙할 수 밖에 없었던 상황에 의문이 있기 때문입니다.
@michaelotoo5543 Oh! You have the black box recording. Awesome! Please share with us what exactly happened in the cockpit to determine that the pilot panicked. I'll wait.
First of all my condolences to the families affected by this tragic accident. 🙏🙏🙏 My biggest concern regarding the pilot-in-command’s handling of the belly landing is why had he used up so much runway before contacting the ground? From the angle shown on the video, he was approximately 2/3 down the runway before making ground fall. Hopefully the FDR and CVR and upcoming investigation will reveal what occurred. Unfortunately there are not enough Capt. Sullenberger’s at the helm of today’s airliners.😞
I agree, who designed that airport infrastructure? What standards were they following? Will any of the airport administrators be brought up on charges? There will probably be 182 lawsuits filed that will expose a lot of the shortcomings of Korean aviation and their regulators.
@@michaelotoo5543 I heard from a source that the plane was losing energy, and its really hard to act fast and stay calm in these high intensity situations. Piloting the plane is extremely stressful, so please be respectful. Also, its still the wall's fault because it really didn't have to be there and made of that material, otherwise the plane wouldn't have exploded and more lives could have been saved.
FYI: The plane was landing in opposite direction of the runway for some reasons, confirmed by main Korean medias. The person who shoot the video of crashing plane all medias including this channel are using now also mentioned in an interview that he began recording since seeing the plane flying differently than other planes, making popping sounds, making too short goaround and finally landing in opposite way. He is a small restaurant owner near by and the video was shoot from his shop.
Stupid question: do airports record every single landing and departure? If they don't, that man is a heroe as he provided a key element to ensure this never happens again.
@@__eee__ it's not a stupid question. It's a very logical question considering how ubiquitous and cheap camera systems are. With multi-million dollar budget for an airport, installing high-res camera system isn't so out of line.
@@__eee__airports have cctv running 24/7 but they are wide view camera so the planes appear very small on screen and you wouldn't be able to see small details
I'm a former aviation technician and I'm glad a pilot's finally voicing their opinion because I concur 100% that a bird strike does not cause a landing gear failure. In my opinion if there was a known gear failure all you can really do is attempt a belly landing but doing that requires an extremely long runway and/or empty field after the runway. If there was a known gear failure I don't see why ATC wouldn't have had them go around while they determined the longest and best runway to attempt a landing on....... They may have even diverted the plane if there was another airport close by with an extremely long runway. It makes no sense that these pilots attempted to land this plane on the belly of a runway with a retaining wall at the end. It's my honest belief that they did not know the gear wasn't down and locked. All I can assume is that when they actuated the gear switch somehow, some way the indicator lights all came on and maybe the pilots believed that the gear was down and locked and that's why they attempted this landing.......... Either that or it was a suicide mission...... Both the pilots and ATC should have known this was an inappropriate runway to attempt a belly landing. I honestly think the pilots thought the gear was down but didn't realize it until it was too late. I'm hoping we get to see the official report on this.
Apparently the ATC directed pilots to land in the other direction (without a concrete wall), and outside observers said all planes were landing/taking off in that direction so it must've been the headwind direction. Pilots missed their first approach and made a strange decision to just turn around and attempt landing in the other direction (into a tailwind and into the wall) instead of making a full go-around.
Thank you, Denys. As a pilot myself, I view this early report as a responsible and professional perspective given the lack of details as well as conflicting reports.
Dennis. your analysis is the best available. Independent and objective. It is unfortunate that I have now been introduced to you twice in one week. You have been way ahead of the story on the Baku flight and this one. You are doing the world a service with your unambiguous and honest reporting.
I cannot even imagine what it must have been like for the 181 souls on board this flight and for the loved ones at the airport waiting for their arrival...witnessing this will forever be imprinted in their hearts and minds. Dont forget how this impacts the first responders and firefighters. Practicing for an 'advent' is not the same as this catastrophic accident. Captain Blog really great reporting and evaluation putting yourself in that cockpit. No judgement just factual analysis. All will be revealed in the investigation. Tragic and sad time for South Korea, condelences and sympathy to all the loved ones and for tragic loss for the Airline which has had a good track record.
@@MarcusN-kp1jnthey knew since we have evidence of passengers messaging family about bird strike and problems asking if they should say their last will
@@MarcusN-kp1jnFrom the news, passengers received crew’s information they were allowed to phone call in last a few minutes. Then There were 2 msgs from passengers Kakao (Korean version LINE or WhatsApp) released. The first one: A daughter tried to call her mom but her mom miss the call. The daughter left msg told her mom “mom I love you” The second one: a passenger text his/her family member, told them about bird strike issue and cannot land. Family asked him/her “When did it started” He/she replied “Should I leave my last word” then never have further words.
I am a former 737 700/800 and 800max instructor. I agree with Denys. Something seems very off with the pilot judgement in this landing. Why was the gear not manually extended? Why were flaps not used? If the right engine had failed it is explainable why they opted for an immediate landing but why no flaps? It looks like they had adequate control so I would doubt complete hydraulics loss. Also, why did they land to the south after attempting an apparent landing to the north according to ADSB data? If they had a tailwind, that would have greatly increased their landing distance. I have seen so many airline accidents lately where pilots seem to have a lack of general knowledge of systems and good judgement. Pilots practice emergencies, but when real ones occur you should be thinking clearly and not making impulsive decisions. My condolences to the families that lost loved ones.
I believe. korean pilots dont have time during landing. it's unlucky that birds strike cause landing gears not to be function. manually landing gears are not enough time.
I don't think the pilot had much vertical control. for some reason it took him most of the runway to actually get it on the ground. if u pay attention to 'where' he actually touched down it was way pas the beginning of this very long runway and he touched down within 1000 of the end and the wall. no way it was going to stop. He may also have been focused so hard to 'gently' hit the ground that he instead used up all the runway in the air trying to be gentle and didn't realize he ran out of runway.
I agreed that this is pilot error no need to argue many pilot have commented many engineers and experts I don’t trust media outlets this comment is enough to explain the tragedy
@@ccuellar6212 dont hink S Korea has that problem, but there is a worldwide shortage of good pilots (the best ones tend to be ex military combat veterans. and we have had no big wars lately so they would get experience). So airlines have been hiring not so well trained pilots in last few years. I'm pretty sure this was a relatively inexperienced flight crew, since some obvious mistakes seemed to have been possible here.
You do know airports have shorter and longer runways for different aircraft’s. If the landing gear would have function it would have stopped before going straight to the concrete wall
Muan International Airport in Chollanam-do started operations back in 2007. However, since its runway was much shorter than any of the other international Korean airports its was seldom used. Due to Korean gov't safety concerns it was only granted international flights status for a few flights to/from China and South-East Asia. Financially, Muan International has been losing money for years - it handles about one flight daily. By far its greatest hazard is that it is located in the very center of a migratory bird sanctuary - hardly a safe area for an airport.
Korea has something like 13 airports that are supposed to be "international airports". Back in the 1990s/2000s every politician/local official wanted to flex and build their own airport in their region to bring in "business". Given how small Korea really is population and land wise, it makes zero sense and was nothing more than a total waste of tax money. Only Incheon and Busan are profitable, even at that Busan is barely profitable. Those are huge cities. All other cities basically have ghost airports that have basic staff on hand and looks dead including Muan. Most have only 3 gates. I just flew out of Muan a few days ago and it looks just empty inside other than flight crew servicing the check in desk.
@@diannedai637 Agreed. It's surrounded by known bird sanctuaries so it's the vanity and greed of the local government to keep it operating to generate some revenue. It should be used only for small planes, if needed.
As Korean, It's hard to hear that news.. Maybe this accident can be worst air disaster in Korean history... 7C 2216 Captain (Han kwang seop) has 6823 flight hours and became Captain since 2019 March. First officer (Kim gyeong hwan) has 1650 flight hours and became First officer since 2023 February.. It's an unfortunate news...
What annoys me is everyone aboard was alive when the plane belly-landed and skidded down the runway, they were all killed when the plane crashed and blew up when it hit a stupid barrier?
Would you mind to elaborate 'stupid barrier'? Am I correct if I understand that you might indicate that the concrete barrier is against airport safety system?
@@bhbpeak Yes, that's what they mean. The localiser antennae is usually just built on the ground or a metal lattice structure so it wouldn't cause total loss of aircraft if there was a runway excursion like here.
Yeah I was seeing the belly landing an thought everyone would be okay since it's happened lots but then it smashed into that concrete barrier for the antennae's. Most airports just have them built on the ground or on a metal lattice that would crumple if a plane hit it after a runway excursion. This should have been survivable.
Hello, I want to say that your observations are spot on. Thanks for the update on the hydraulic system for this aircraft. I'm a 31 year 737 pilot, having flown B737 100,200,300,500,700,800,and MAX8 aircraft, with just over 21,000 hours in type. I agree with all of your points. It looks like they touched down very long and fast. That's the reason for the excursion into the concrete wall. My initial reaction and questions revolve around your point that they didn't try to manually extend the landing gear. It also appears that they didn't try to use the standby hydraulic system to extend the flaps to the flaps 15 position. This would have enabled a much slower approach speed. My condolences to all the victims and I hope the FA's that survived make a full recovery.
With so many odd and unexplained things surrounding this crash, perhaps there was a problem concerning the mental stability of the pilot or copilot. Perhaps one of them crashed the plane intentionally, knowing that there was a strong concrete barrier at the end of that runway.
@@edschultheis9537 Malice is the last option on the world.. first it comes gross incompetence, then mechanical failure...then a hundred other things..then malice,.
It’s been an sad week in aviation with too many lives lost and your analysis has been truly helpful in cutting through the nonsense from the major outlets. Your calm breakdowns of what is visible and what we can reasonable take away from what we can yet see has been invaluable. I cannot thank you enough for the work you do.
Pilot Blog, thank you for the fantastic report on this airplane crash. You alone put our national media at shame! PS- My thoughts and prayers are with the families that have lost a loved ❤ one in this tragedy. We are praying 🙏 for you and your families.
Your accent and frankness is very refreshing compared to some of the clickbait on YT. Reminds me of colleagues I’ve had from eastern Europe, no bullshit.
It’s matters - TH-cam can’t just be American POV and accents. And I say that as an American. It’s good to have a variety of cultures and speaking patterns reflecting the entirety of the internet.
The most accurate analysis available to date. The airplane appears to be configured for a go-around rather than for landing. The fact that the thrust reversal is deployed on the right hand engine only may be linked to the bird strike that allegedly involved that engine (it had some damages anyway). Further analysis will tell us if there was some communication issue in the cockpit, leading the pilot-flying to try to land an airplane configured for GA. Looks like a nasty combination of factors (bird strike + communication + concrete wall at the end of the runway) led to this disaster. For sure the concrete wall holding the localizer antennas was a deciding factor.
Its always a chain of events not a simple system failure. Were the pilots ex-military which can lead to a higher ranking pilot ignoring the real commander. Many years ago another Asian airline had to make big changes to their crewing because of this problem.
Thank you Denys for bringing up the issue of the extremely robust obstacle at the end of the runway. There is no excuse for the very hard object just off the end of the runway. If there had been more runoff without a hardened obstacle at the end of the runway they would have had a good chance of survival. I've seen this kind of thing before. Why responsible airport management would allow this is beyond all reason. Yes, there should be strong regulation against this kind of stupidity. This is not the first time people have died because of this kind of criminal irresponsibility. It should be the last time for sure.
Hopefully that sends a message to other airports that have a brick wall on their runways. I mean, I understand why some do and thats to stop planes from crashing into residential areas, but to save them and not passengers seems absurd.
"4000 dead after plane hits town and causes massive fire because there was no barrier to prevent it from just continuing past the runway till physics said stop"
@@23ofSeptember a brick wall is not as dangerous because of individual bricks but the airplane in this video hit a solid concrete wall that is very thick and made out of 1 solid piece of concrete
@@TurnerBrendan Yes, I understand it was a dirt mound containing concrete and the locator beacons. Whatever it was, shouldn't be there and should be removed from other airports if need be.
I worked in airfield management in the Air Force. There is strong regulation against this. That's not supposed to be there. The airfield manager at that airport is in trouble
The localizer is typically built on a concrete slab, the top of which is flush with the ground surface. Everything above the surface is designed to be frangible. The slab itself is excluded as it is below the surface.
Except for the part where this was “ preventable “ very helpful for the families and investigators to hear this narrative from a young tuber before the fire is even put out .
For someone who is a huge fan of being able to fly, yet not quite an aviation enthusiast, It's pretty awesome that you provide these vids. I am thoroughly surprised that twice in one week I've been able to find reliable information and I appreciate that it was you twice xD you've earned a sub
I have listened 100s of news and blogs about the incident. This is the only most informative and curiosity satisfying blog. Thank you for creating this and an update... I so much desire you can post more updates.....
@@Quotenwagnerianer I suppose the engines would also dig into the arresting material, but would they dig into it as efficiently as landing gear? That i do not know.
First time I have ever seen your pilot blog. I watch your other channel on Ukraine every day. Very good reporting. I wish it was on a different subject, but it is what it is. Thanks for great reporting.
Yet you ppl still take your time clowning the airway design or whatever thinking the people designing stuff like this arent 10x brighter than you could ever hope to be. dimwits
Thank you for your objective and calm insights. As a Korean, perhaps due to the chaotic state of the country, it feels difficult to trust any domestic information. This kind of information was much needed. Thank you for uploading the video.
Walls, trees, building, busy freeways, hills, radio towers, etc can be found at the end of most runways all over the place. its not unusual. what is unusual is landing a plane 8000' down the runway onto the last 1000' (and going faster than needed) and expecting not to hit something.
@armastat Still, a concrete wall at the end of the runway is a stupid idea...this plane didn't land in the residential area, plus errors happen and we know that if it was a normal buliding normal wall or even a tree there could be more survivors
If not for that reinforced concrete locator foundation, the plane may very well have not exploded. A comparable accident at SFO cost the lives of 3, while all other passengers walked away, because a structure caught the aircraft's tail and separated it from the fuselage rather than impacting the fuselage from the front. The plane almost cartwheeled, but it did not explode. Structural separation decreases mass and thus impact force, so the concrete block fence 200 feet beyond the Muan locator foundation would have slowed the skidding plane instead of exploding it. The lengthy landing distance may have been due to the airliner floating in ground effect while dissipating energy, yet the pilot may have throttled up prior to touching the runway in an abort attempt after realizing that the landing gear were not down. Maybe. The big question to me is, why did the pilot need to get to the ground so quickly that he came in hot? Did he shut down the wrong engine after a bird strike?
@@kctoon5062 have same questions about why the plane was so fast, but I think that in his rush, he forgot ground effect being something to deal with. There may have been a few seconds of wth? or maybe even thinking he was on the ground but puzzled as to why there was no horrible grinding noises. One possible reason for many of the strange thing was hey had completely lost the indicators on the instrument panel, so no gear indicators, airspeed, etc. sounds unlikely but would explain much. I find that there being no report about any radio conversations from the plane very puzzling.
@@kctoon5062 Plus keep in mind. 'If not for the wall' comments are wrong. both logically and factually. its 'If not for the excessive speed'. He was going over 50% faster than he needed to be. That is what came first - and what made all this happen. there is no apparent reason for that speed.There may have been a cause for it - but there seemed to be no attempt to compensate for it. If not for that - he would NOT have hit the wall, despite landing so late. even the ground effect would of been much less of a factor at a lower speed, he would of landed much much sooner and had less speed to shed, even if he reached the wall he would of been going at a small fraction of the speed he was when it it.
The Aberbaijan crash was blamed on a "bird strike" till we all saw the missile damage to the tail section. To blame this on a bird strike "in adverse weather" when it was a clear blue sky is just next level nonsense. It does seem however that the flight crew impacted very long down the runway. They had 2 kms of runway to use but still seemed to go off the end at a high rate of knots. So many questions yet to be answered. Good video.
Birds catching strays for every crash. Seems the common misinformation phrase official sources seem to like. I'm no pilot but so the flaps and slats on the wings looked wrong, no landing gear, no sign of smoke.
Thanks very much for your help. My heart goes out to all families of the deceased. I worked on aviation 16 years. I landed a lot of times in another very dangerous airport Funchal Madeira island. No wall at the end of the runway but sea and cross winds. I felt my heart broken watching this. Blessings to you all
Great to hear someone familiar with the aircraft go through the checklist etc. Answered a lot of my questions and raised others. I was an aircraft maintainer for almost 39 years so I see a lot of red flags. We will have some answers once flight safety does their thing. Thanks for your excellent video.
Sadly I don't think so, because in asia you have to "safe face" so even with Samsung having work induced incidents of blood related diseases they would not acknowledge any wrong doing until the public had the demonstrated against them for years. th-cam.com/video/Sd56BkWXM2I/w-d-xo.html
@@MrBIDNEZZMAN I know exactly what you mean, I live in Thailand. This is a more clear cut case imho. They are going to have to answer the questions at least. It could be as simple as "it was a jet blast wall".
They don't put reinforced concrete structures at the end of runways to stop airliners. Runoffs are used, just like in F1 race courses. In any event, no buildings were endangered within a direct line of the runway; and the plane could have slid for another half mile before threatening a parking lot. My old college hired a financial district architect to design its new performing arts building. The building was complete chaos for theater, but it had lots of offices! I doubt that whomever made the design decision to embed the locator antennas in reinforced concrete knew or obtain access to information with regard to runway safety. Cancel Reply
Airport banned from international flights, but the day after the president was impeached, a leftist political party changed it to allow international flights🫢 Muan Airport in Jeollanam-do was politically built for a left-leaning region without considering economics, and the tragic accident occurred due to a leftist political party's push to allow international flights.
Hi Dennis, as a brazilian i couldn't help but feel an immense deja vu from this, It remind me so much of the crash of the tam flight in congonhas airport... Perhaps if they had the Runway End Safety Area (RESA) just like we have after we learned that bitter lesson they would all be here ......
Airport engineer here. Looks like that localizer was about 260m from the runway end and has been there since at least 2004 on a built-up berm per google earth. Depending on other runway criteria, ICAO design standards, of which South Korea has been a part for ages, require 240m minimum clear runway end safety area. Common sense dictates more safety area if you can get it. CS also dictates not to put a giant concrete and earth berm immediately after your 240m minimum distance FFS! I always preached to my designers that minimum standards were just that, minimum. Do better everywhere you can. Why those went 20+ years without being replaced with frangible legs and the berm removed is a question I hope everyone will be asking. IMO that pilot did everything they could with no gear or flaps, airport infrastructure killed these people. Airport staff has their 240m get-out-of-jail-free card but that doesn't mean they could not have done better. Looks like the localizer at the other end was removed between 2022-2024, it had the same bunker-style setup.
It is one of the lowest traffic airports in Korea.. Dunno why the berm was built, but not being profitable certainly was a reason why it was never changed. Perhaps both the wall and berm are as a result of noise complaints for thr residential area. Built the berm when building an ILS and get two birds with one stone... More noise abatement and a robust localizer mounting.
According to Korean people, this exact plane had small explosions in the engine on a previous journey the week before. It was looked at by the engineers but got clearance.
But still, how an engine explosion broke the hydraulic system? They don't even lower the landing gear manually. It's a catastrophic accident through and through....
For sure, the first time I saw this, I couldn't believe that a solid construction like that concrete Antenna base would be built at the end of a Runway, it pretty much guarantees zero chance of there not being casualties in what would already be a potentially life threatening crash landing....
@jnunez1203 Then, in that case, the Airport designers have not allowed for every possible contingency plan that an Airport should have in place, and this particular crash proves how inadequate their design truly is....
This reminds me of the 777 accident at SFO back in 2013. Not saying (or sure) if all the pilots were Korean, but I remember there were many odd, illogical decisions made on the accident too and it came down to the uniform military training of the pilots not allowing them to be flexible or critical of each other's decision making.
at that exact moment I just woke up and getting myself a coffee... I don't know because this tragedy happened in my country, for some reason I feel so guilty Rest in peace for those who lost their lives in this terrible accident.
There is no guilt for it, you have no fault in this. Just celebrate life and enjoy it, and share your condolences to those who lost their family member in this tragedy, it's just life.
This crash is an unimaginable tragedy and I feel sad for you feeling guilt. Please accept my condolences for you, for the victims and their families and for South Korea 🇰🇷. I am praying for the souls of the victims, comfort for the families and all of South Korea.
@@FlaminHotChipsAgreed. People don't care about prevention. They only do something after a disaster happens in front of their eyes. And maybe not even that. Most people are dumb.
There are international standards that require obstructions in the runway safety area to be frangible. They are well known and complied with at all major airports that handle commercial flights. Not maybe complied with, but almost certainly. This obstruction is likely due to lax oversight at smaller airports in a less developed country. I would not be surprised to learn that the issue was identified in inspections but never corrected.
Like the massive steel tower at Adis Ababa, that tore off the wing of the East African SVC10, that had a brake failure, over-ran, when abandoning take off.. causing fuel spill, fire and deaths.
Great analysis Dennis. One thing that I saw that no one is commenting on is; with a long runway, why is the plane landing on last thousand feet. You can see the last Aiming Point (white boxes) pass under the aircraft shortly after touchdown.
At 6:07 in the video, at the time of an apparent bird strike on engine No. 2, the flaps appear to be extended. If so, then the pilot may have called a Mayday, aborted his approach, and rushed through a 180 while retracting his flaps to get out of the air faster. With the increased emergency work load, it would have been easy to forget to redeploy the flaps to land. This might also explain the gear being up and the throttle appearing to be applied while the aircraft is sliding down the runway. All speculation at this time.
As an aircraft engineer i find that very strange the only explanation for that aircraft not being configured for a normal landing ie flaps extended etc is a hydraulic failure of some kind. Bird strike unlikely to take out all the hydraulic systems.
Agreed. Failed TOGA? has happened before when the 2 pilots miscommunicated, one was landing the plane when the other was doing a TOGA, wheels up, max power ..
The flaps have an electric backup IIRC, and still doesn’t explain why gear wasn’t gravity dropped (we know they didn’t even try as the nose gear doors are clearly still shut.) Also they lined it up with the runway perfectly so…. that plane still had at least alternate hydraulics.
@ no, thinking that this plane crashed because it is a Boeing makes you an oaf. The 737-800 has been in service since 1998, this specific plane since 2009. The media sensationalized the Boeing 737-MAX failures and then you uniformed doofuses all assume that the cause of every crash is Boeing Boeing Boeing. You’re all like children, you have no idea what you’re talking about. Just shut up and let the people who actually know what they’re talking about talk about the facts as the reports come out.
What a terrible thing to happen! So many people killed. Thanks Captain Denys for your analysis of what may have happened. Thanks for mentioning the concrete wall and questioning why it was put there. Sympathies to all the rellies who are grieving.
Condolences to those who lost loved ones in this terrible tragedy. I just gotta say, this particular video covered the terrible event perfectly and explained info that even those who are ignorant of the more specific circumstances could understand. RIP to the people lost... seriously.. tell your loved ones how you appreciate them when you can.
I am a pilot, an aeronautical design engineer, radar and systems design engineer and was a senior engineering officer in the RAF. There are several phases to this incident. The original intention was for the aircraft to land Northbound; on the approach something happened to the right engine, it may have been a bird strike or a compressor stall. After an engine is damaged it is possible that repeat compression stalls occur. The recovery from a compressor stall is reduce the throttle back to flight idle and then to advance again slowly, if the stalls repeat the engine must be shut down. The ATC advise that there may have been a bird strike, which was acknowledged by the pilot. At this point the ADS-B data is lost. It is likely that a TOGA was initiated and that the aircraft was configured accordingly, flaps/stats neutral and the undercarriage retracted. At this point an emergency was declared (MAYDAY). Soon after the pilot elected to land Southbound. From the video it is apparent that the aircraft was not correctly configured for landing, there were do flap/stats deployed and the undercarriage was not extended. This begs two questions:- 1) Why did the pilot elected to land so soon after what appears to have been an issue with one engine? In this situation normally the procedure would be climb away gain height and then run the checklists and troubleshoot problems, before attempting another landing. Were there other problems that required an immediate landing. 2) Why was the aircraft not correctly configured for landing? Was time so short that they did not have sufficient time, because of other factors, no hydraulics, etc.
The design of the concrete wall at the end of the runway is absolutely stupid😮without it, the plane might be able to survive without so much destruction and save lives. RIP for the victims. Good analysis.
There are houses in the other side of the concrete wall, albeit a little further away. Maybe the concrete wall was put there for their protection. Clearly some municipal regulation failures. Houses should not be built where planes night overshoot the runway.
@@preptplus, I hope you watched the video. The houses are off the centerline of the runway, and there is a brick perimeter wall, which is different from the reinforced concrete wall that was under the localizer.
@@seriouscat2231 Still not a great place to live - off-centre at the end of the overshoot area of the runway, brick wall or no brick wall. Just bad municipal thinking. Bad planning. The whole situation shows bad thinking by a number of people. Overall responsibility is with the authorities.
Literally the first thing I said when I saw the video was that "They would've survived if it wasn't for that wall"... I'm so devastated at this loss of life, that, as you said, could've been avoided...
I am a pilot who has flown the B737-800, B737-900, and B737-900ER for about six years. Based on the information reported in the news, it seems that the aircraft, while approaching RWY 01 at Muan Airport, encountered a bird strike, resulting in a go-around. The plane then made an emergency landing on RWY 19 after sending three MAYDAY calls and attempting a belly landing. I suspect that the simultaneous failure of both engines, possibly a flame-out of both engines, may have occurred. The decision to perform a belly landing so urgently without lowering the landing gear likely points to the possibility of both engines having flame-out. However, after landing, the aircraft collided with an obstacle at the end of the runway and exploded. This raises concerns that Muan Airport's facilities may not have adhered to the required regulations.
Thank you so much Denys. I see from comments I am not alone in really valuing your analysis and I also appreciate when you admit you aren’t sure about something. Your fast response to the Azerbaijan flight was the first place I heard the cause was Russian air defense and with supporting photos (I feel like I was 1-2 days ahead of mainstream media/CNN). Here too I really appreciate your analysis and mention of the concrete barricade. How tragic. Clearly without it the plane had a better chance. And why are there houses so close anyway… As always, your other channel is one of my main Ukraine news sources.
Thank you for a great covering of this tragic event. RIP to everyone that lost their lives in this crash. Sending my condolences to all the loved ones of the passengers and crew. 😢
After the 737 initiated a go-around on final approach to runway 01, the crew retracted the gear and flaps, leaving the aircraft in a clean configuration, indicating that the hydraulic systems were functioning normally. However, they then attempted to land without extending the flaps or landing gear, ultimately touching down in the last third of the runway, as shown in the video. This suggests the crew may have made a rushed decision to land for unknown reasons, resulting in this fatal accident. Reasons for such a rushed decision that come to mind are either a loss of thrust on both engines or some kind of uncontained fire in the cabin.
It is indeed a very unusual situation, but perhaps the startled effect due to bird strike and consequently an engine malfunction, caused the crew to momentarily forget to raise the landing gear on the go-around. However, after watching the video several times, I can hear the engines running upon the “belly landing”, suggesting that a complete loss of thrust on both engines might not be the reason for the rushed decision.
The first thing I noticed was how fast it was going, the flaps couldn't have been extended, bird strikes tend not to cause a loss of landing gear and flaps/hydraulic failure (very unusual), and no need to have a reinforced wall for the ILS, although very easy for us to comment/criticise here, an absolute tragedy and condolences to the families involved.
In theory we have two data sources for the speed of the aircraft during landing: the FDR and the video(s). The speed can (and probably will by some) be calculated for various points of the landing scrape by anyone with a good viewing of the video of the scrape here (for example), assuming the presentation speed matches the recording speed; those calculations (correct or not) would certainly be available before any FDR data are released to the public.
that must mean that literally the only people who survived were the flight attendants strapped into the back jumper seats of the aircraft, that’s absolutely horrifying.
What a career-ending tragedy! I’d be ready to call it in as a flight attendant after something like this. What a traumatizing experience and the survivor’s guilt…
Guys, Bird Strike even with a single engine loss doesn't cause huge Hydlaulic problems. For now it is still a mistery of why there was a belly landing with no flaps and reverser2 open. My deepest condolences to the families and loved ones of those who tragically lost their lives in this heartbreaking incident.
Great job! Youre working hard when other channels take breaks, thanks alot
ads-b 데이타는 58분에 끝나있지만 목격자에따르면 항공기가 복행후 공항을 중심으로 1회(이상) 회전했다고했습니다 그 증거로 원래 남쪽에서 착륙접근하는게 통상인데 이번엔 북쪽으로부터 최종착륙을 시도했습니다 그리고 영상을 자세히보시면 버드스트라이크는 엔진 두개 모두에 영향을 준것으로보입니다 부기장측엔진이 폭발하여 불꽃을 일으킬때 기장측 엔진에서도 연기가 피어납니다 말씀하신대로 진입속도가 너무 빠른데다 최초 터치다운위치가 활주로절반을 지나치는 정중앙부근이었습니다! 이건 미스테리입니다! 그리고 엔진측면커버는 열려있으나 리버스트러스트도 작동하지않는것처럼보이구요 랜딩기어도 작동하지않았고 모든 악재가 이 비극을 위해 작동했습니다 제생각을 덧붙이자면 조종사는 최초터치다운순간 활주로길이가 부족하다고 느끼고 리버스를 취소하고 다시 재가속을 준비했으나 리버스가 해제되지도않고 바닥에 달라붙은 항공기가 상승하지도못했다고생각해볼수도있겠습니다
Denys, just one question. Lets just say if there was a hydraulic failure, could the pilots still use gravity to deploy the landing gears?
Fantastic analysis. Where others rush out information without any thought to what they are writing, you take the time to dispel obvious untruths. Thank you
Prayers to all those lost and their families 😔😔💔💔
why they have Concrete wall at the end of the runway surely they should leave it open for a a few kilometers why Concrete wall????????????
It's amazing how much more information you get from a TH-camr than from a billion dollar news network. Great video!
That's why the networks are going down.
This is not news, it is actual speculation!! Nobody knows what went wrong! The investigation will reveal that.
That's what happens when big media conglomerates buy news channels as just another billboard to show ads on. Suits get sent in to cut costs, and "content" - real journalism and expertise - is a cost to them.
Just big business in action, over and over. Once you see it....
Still no explanation though. And he had no news on other global events. Billion dollar news networks for the win.
What if he's just making everything up?
Hi Dennis, I am a retired Australian ATC with 35 years in aviation. All ILS and associated navaid installations should be engineered to ICAO standards which means they should be frangible inside the runway safety area. This makes sure any obstacles cause minimal damage with an impact with a vehicle or aircraft.
I was horrified to see the construction of an embankment and other concrete forms within the runways safety area (as it appears from this video).
The pilots did an excellent and valiant job keeping the aircraft aligned with the centreline as much as they could with no steering control.
This would have been a mostly survivable accident if not for the badly designed runway infrastructure.
100%
They actually could have survived if they did not keep the aircraft centrelined...
maybe a stupid question, would it be a better idea to land in the water in this case? because high speed, no break, no landing gear...etc
@@ShadowRap-y5l Using the air brakes might have helped.
I am not an expert, but I believe runways are supposed to be usable in both directions... in case of emergency.
No BS, no fluff, dude gets right into it and just keeps on dishing out high velocity information without any fluff at all. I wish more content were like this across all topics.
The fact is - it was a 737-800 assembled in Boeing Renton WA. Also in December 2024, a KLM skidded off the runway after an emergency landing in Olso - one Air India same in Halifax. All of the Boeing 737 800 were assembled in the same UNION-controlled factory in the State of Washington
@@BernhardSchwarz-xs8kp And what is the relevance, particularly as no one yet knows the exact cause of this incident? It is very poor form to speculate on something of which you have no idea and no one yet has an idea.
@@bobvidoni5898 Repetitive of exactly the same nature are never coincidences. 3 incidents where the hydraulic system failed, unable to manipulate the landing gear or flaps - 3 times within 3 days in December 2024 - 19500 passengers were killed in exactly the same type of scenarios on 737 800 planes - that is not a one-time event.
Dozens of incidents of "missing screws" and panels flying off the plane 737 Max repeatedly - all assembled in Boeing Everette both 737 - 800 and Max in the State of Washington where the UNIONS are in control - and forced Boeing to shut down all Defense Department production in Washington for safety reasons - that is not a one-time accident.
@@bobvidoni5898 to be fair, YOU are speculating no one knows what happened... you don't know that for sure, do you , Bob ?...
That reinforced concrete wall in the immediate end of the runway is so absurd. What a tragedy.
Don't know if true... heard airport was under construction
I guess it depends.
If there are buildings somewhere after that concrete wall, it makes perverse sense to have that as a "the people on the plane die, but not the people in the buildings" kind of barrier.
In this case, though, there doesn't appear to be buildings there.
crash test with real people inside.
@@tocreatee5736 Now they know Concrete barriers near a Runway is BAD, lucky they were just dummies :o
They did fly boeing :(
This may be a windy area so all must be very strongly build to resist the huricanes.
I am Korean. I am living in Korea. Since this happened, for all day, I have been listening to Korean media and your video is the most credible source of information about this accident, so far. Everything you said, I 100% agree.
Korean Media always lying !
Not only about Comrade Kim, but everything else as well !
Condolences!!!!
Who was the idiot that put the antennas in the runway path????
@@cobraskenpo2299not so much that the antenna were there (that’s quite common).
It’s the fact that they were raised up so high atop a substantially built up and reinforced concrete pad.
It’s the pad which caused the damage and not the antennae.
I have suspicions that it may well be something to do with the need for robustness as a result of the threat posed by their Northern Cousins.
Although, what purpose such a thing would serve even given the want to make their infrastructure robust as a result of the above mentioned threat is anyone’s guess.
Prayers from India ❤😢
I’m Korean. The media doesn't analyze accidents much. They just compete with each other to see who posts more news and faster
Your analysis is more accurate than the Korean press
I hope this case will be resolved quickly and new regulations will be made
+
The media did not refer to the entire Korean media, but to some media outlets
May the deceased rest in peace
Your comment on the South Korean media is really interesting. What you describe is tabloid-level coverage and kind of scary if that's the generally accepted media model.
it happens in every country with very few exceptions
오 한국인이다
@@y6cd3sdzHs1g korean media copies comments from communities like reddit and make a news out of it.
You think I’m joking right 😂
I wish I was.
And yeah, thats the main media including national television.
@@albertB215 I know you're not. Korean media is extremely dumb.
Most likely many people immiediately thought why this concrete thick wall has been built so close to the runway. This is great coverage, precise and much more informative than what tv channels and networks provided. Many thanks!
@@peterk5981 they even make it clear the pilots took the runway is the reverse direction to normal flow,
Aka it was not at the end of the runway but the operationally start.
People have actually not taken notice of the wall before this video.
The wall was soil by the way. There was concrete in it to anchor the pins holding the signals. If you look at the side view of the wall after the crash, you can tell that the real issue were the solid metal pins. The plane would have kept moving, if it had not been for the pins. I wonder if anyone even knew about the mass of conrete in the soil and the fact that the pins are solid metal that was working at the airport at the time of construction or currently.
It certainly is a very unususal design that would have most likely been changed, if people had been aware.
Very strange accident from beginning to the end - and what a horrible end.
@@hemelinger7792 I agree, thank you for your comment. This was a tremendous tragedy.
Your analysis is far superior to the extremely poor mainstream media reporting.
mainstream media reports are my cue to go to TH-cam for more detailed & informed coverage.
Mainstream media news anchors are usually not pilots.
on a good day mainstream media gives you misinformation, usually it's disinformation
My local news just posted the uncensored clip and called it a day. Pretty sure there were bodies in the debris cloud, but who cares right?
its because of the small eyes
I am Korean. I feel deeply heartbroken that such a terrible incident has occurred in Korea. The immense sorrow and shock seem to have caused the Korean media to lose their composure, and there isn't much coverage that explains the situation clearly. This TH-cam channel, however, provides a calm and objective explanation of the events, and it has been incredibly helpful. Thank you.
RIP😢😢😢🙏🙏🙏
Condolences to the Korean people. This is an irreparable loss.🇰🇿😭
❤❤❤❤🇰🇷😢
너무 가슴이 아프네요
😭😭😭
Nice video. Spot on with my exact same thoughts. Experienced 737 guy here with 17000 hours of 737 time. The bird strike/compressor stall issue doesn’t itself lead to a gear up no flap landing with a single reverser deployed (ironically the reverser that is on the supposed problem engine). The loss of an engine does not promt a loss in hydraulics because there is still an electric pump supplying pressure to the associated hydraulic system. Same thing with the flaps. The gear can be alternate extended with the pull cables, and the flaps have an alternate electric extension system.
Something that could have happened …. Say they have an engine problem, and after initial reaction and go around, mistakingly shut down the wrong engine in the initial stage of the checklist. That puts them maybe 3000 feet just now north of the airfield, no engines, no apu running yet. The windmilling engines can provide enough hydraulics for flight controls, but they are down to emergency battery power only as far as electrical goes. so they are able to turn around and land opposite direction. Accounting for what is now a tailwind, clean config, and a very long high energy landing. . They don’t have time to get any flaps or gear out, or they are afraid that the added drag from those devices won’t allow them to make all the way to the runway. That would explain some of what appears to be erratic behavior by this crew.
Something here went truly weird. It’s my experience that a cascade of mechanical failures, while possible, is a lot less likely that the possibility of a crew failure. A breakdown in judgement and crew resource management.
Nobody wants to throw the pilots under the bus, it’s too early for that, but every 737 pilot in the world right now is scratching their head wondering the same thing….
And that wall with the loc antenna. Great observation, why would they do that? That certainly caused this accident to be a lot deadlier than it needed to be.
RIP to these unfortunate souls!
Seems like crew on final approach decided to reconfigure aircraft for aborted landing (flaps up, gear up, spoilers disarmed and full throttles) but were constrained nonetheless to touchdown at last minute
Could they have reduced the speed and ditched it in the ocean?
@ a water landing is very hazardous. Sully made it look easy, and truth be known he got super lucky. Engines or wing can “dig” into the water and things go sideways fast. Landing on a runway would be highly preferred. If these guys were zero engine and gliding it might explain how fast and far down the runway they were. I haven’t looked at the airport proximity to water. Water would be better than buildings or rugged terrain for use. So it’s hard to say. If they did shut the wrong engine down, then the ensuing shock of their actions would render their judgement and actions after that event suspect as well. At that point they are trying just to survive. It’s a situation they aren’t trained for, because there is no good outcome.
@@cherylmillard2067water landings are very dangerous and usually one of the last choices if nothing else is available
I think this crew were plain incompetent and forgot to drop gear and set flaps.
Seriously, a huge credit to you! None of Korean presses pointed out the concrete wall before Koreans leave the comments on the national news clips about what you explained here. They all blamed the birds in the very beginning. Big thanks to you!
True, a lot of Koreans are solely blaming Boeing and the US :/ an emotional response and an understandable one, sure, but too quick
That's not understandable at all. That's just dishonest @@katelynholmes9504
I don't think the wall needed much pointing out, it's so obvious
@@jakkritphanomchit yet it wasn't pointed out at first
Everything was going well until they hit that "Concrete wall/bunker" at the end of the runway. I wonder if the people who made that wall are happy with themselves...it may have just saved 1 or 2 of those antennas.
This is a sound preliminary analysis/overview.
As a current 737-300/400 & -800 pilot myself, I too am mystified by the lack of manual gear extension*, lack of flaps set to at least 15 (maximum recommendation using the electrically-driven alternate system), under an (unlikely) assumed loss of A & B hydraulic systems (the deployed #1 thrust reverser implies that at least the Alternate hydraulics were functioning). Further tellingly, the alternate flaps extension system drives the leading edge devices to full extension upon the first tap of its toggle switch using Alternate hydraulic pump pressure.
A significant birdstrike to an engine simply can’t render the airframe’s hydraulic system inoperable.
Even the complete physical loss of an engine, wouldn’t keep the landing gear retracted and alternate flap system inoperative (its 3 pylon-attachment shear-bolts are designed to snap, thus jettisoning the engine in the event of a catastrophic fan seizure, instead of damaging the wing.) Both engine-driven high volume hydraulic pumps are backed up by respective lower volume (but adequate) electric motor driven pumps located, along with their respective reservoirs, in the main landing gear well, well separated from the engines; co-located is the Alternate hydraulic pump for a total of 3 electrically driven hydraulic pumps in addition to the 2 engine-driven pumps. I seem to be implying something here…
Along with the 12/25 EMB190 crash, I am very interested to learn what the CVR and FDRs reveal.
*I once had to pull the handle-cables in a since-retired 737-200 during a system-A hydraulic glitch one night approaching Anchorage. It’s not difficult and each gear assembly drops and locks down within seconds.
Cockpit miscommunication? Failed TOGA, one pilot was landing the plane the other activated TOGA procedures??
Great post, thanks! I thought the alternate flap extension on the NGs was electrically driven?
@@EstorilEmYes they are.
But krueger/slat use hyd power from stdby system (in alternate mode)
They go to full extension after one pull from the switch on over head panel.
Flaps will go down but with electrical motor (they can go up or down thanks to the switch).
Btw, with alternate mode engaged, krueger/slat cannot be retracted when they are in full extended position.
@@EstorilEmit seems only trailing edge is but not leading edge, so far I read. And only trailing edge can be both extended and retracted but leading edge can only be extended.
Either way I straight just asked the question regarding manual gear extension and alt flaps.. very strange and concerning.
Because it's suicide.
So many red flags, engines at full power, one in reverse, no flaps, no gear, no slats, no up elevator, no deceleration. Yet this aircraft had no issue lining up with a runway. No one can explain how.
Pilot error after the emergency. They panicked!!!! Terrible
Keep an eye on Gematria values for this story....this kind of stuff that instantly makes international news when most of the time, it would never, is part of it.
It's a Boeing, there was probably a whistleblower on the plane
And there should be no excuse there have been tons of pilots who were faced with this example in the past and they made it out alive, they set the example on how to deal with these situations. The runway at this airport is only 9186 feet long once they realized they had a failure they should’ve directed to Incheon and land at their 13123 ft long runway where there is also more advanced services.
Idiocracy with airplanes.
As a Korean, this analysis was more informative than Korean news. I feel so sad the younger rider was born in 2021, just a baby. Rest in peace....
😞💔
Omg this is really so sad and tragic and unnecessary 💔😢 my thoughts are with all these poor loved ones left behind 😭🙏🏼
한국 뉴스에서 전혀 언급되지 않은 내용을 다뤄주셔서 감사합니다.
The media today is not about reporting new as much as getting clicks.
😢
As a passenger that just left that airport 3 days ago thank you for your analysis Sir! It could have been me chard by now. After flying 6 planes from South Korea to the islands South in the Pacific I felt lucky and blessed. Thank you God. I have these crazy thoughts before I went back home. You wouldn't believe some of the airlines I took (AirAsia/Cebu Pacific). Prior to take off you can hear the engine so loud and shaky. I was alarmed but them crews and other passengers don't care. Anyhow we all made it to our destinations. My thoughts and condolences to the passengers and their families.
Hahaha.....you are funny 😁, I am an agent that sells air tickets 🎟, this cracks me dear, anyway all glory to God almighty for everyone's life.
People die and you’re thanking god?
@@tavuong666
I thank God that I made it through alive. Imagine 6 airlines I have to take to reach my island bruh (Panay island). I always take Korean air they're safe and reliable. I don't take Philippine airlines. My Condolences to the families. As I said I was just in their airport.
@@classictravelconnections8107
Sis when you sell a ticket please make sure that plane isn't ready to go to the morgue. But honestly I haven't heard of an air disaster this magnitude in our islands. Infact when I left Canlaon Volcano is erupting nextdoor Island. How in d heck they go around it. We even got hit by ashes and earthquake nextdoor but flight was canceled only in the beginning the rest they flew like a bird around it.
As a retired Boeing flight attendant as of 1 year ago, this is the most accurate, detailed, and comprehensive explanation to date. I learned even more than reported with your honesty, forthcoming, and compassion insights. Thank you from the aviation industry. My heart aches and cries for the immeasurable loss suddenly thrust upon these families and their loved ones as they try to navigate through unspeakable pain. 🙏🏽 Prayers for strength, any comfort, and answers going forward for these lost souls. 💔🌹❤️🩹
God is blessing you for telling the truth. Your truth will save lives in the future.
@@swiftadventurer Flight attendants are not waitresses or servants, they're professional crew members whose primary responsibility is safety and inflight procedure, not just bringing you tomato juice and eye masks. Most have hundreds or thousands more hours in the sky than you or I do, during which time they usually get to know the characteristics of their airplane and have the opportunity to observe pilot behavior and generally how commercial aircraft work.
Does that make her a technical expert in aerospace or news reporting? Of course not. But it does mean she may have more exposure and experience in this topic than the average viewer, and her opinion is valid.
Also, don't be a jerk.
@@swiftadventurerhere ya go 🍼 here's your bottles 🍼
@@its_clean Mama's comments are NOT about serving cabin passengers, are NOT about number of hours in the sky, are NOT about airplane characteristics, are NOT about pilot behavior... IF, which I can agree as you propose, those are Mama's area of expertise. RATHER, her comments ARE about the ACCURACY AND COMPREHENSIVENESS about a TH-camr's upload in comparison to all other uploads, WHICH she implies IS her experience and has extra credence specifically because she prefaces her comments with said experience. Therefore, answer the topic of THIS portion of the comments... why don't YOU think it is funny that people do EXACTLY what I have described, despite how much of a jerk you are for concluding that I am jerk?
Appreciate you! @@RichardBaileyrealtor
Thanks for this analysis. I was trained as a Civil Aviation Engineer by the CAA in New Zealand. We had it almost beaten into us, that every navigational aid on the airport needed to be frangible. Yes - antennae were mounted on concrete - but the concrete was level with the ground, and fixing bolts were actually hack-sawed to ensure that they would shear at ground level. I'm sure that there is going to be some serious questions asked about that ILS Localiser installation.
Agreed!
Why on earth would one build a concrete wall as an intentional stopper at the end of a runway?!? If an emergency stop can be at all imagined to possibly ever be needed, then you don't design a 100% murderous barrier! It's disguisting! I feel some planners and decisionmakers ought to spend years in prison!
Jeju also had two flights suspended in 2022, and 10 pilots and maintenance crew suspended for ignoring safety procedures. So sounds like they have multiple issues. That said the country has a pretty good safety record, so it's possible the 2022 thing was just due to good safety monitoring.
I suspect this has been a jet blast wall previously, possibly with a different runway layout. When things changed they decided is was easier to put the localiser on top rather than remove lots of steel-reinforced concrete and earth.
100% I love NZ. They know their shit 100% and are very conscious of the safety of those put into future risk - unlike BOEING and the KOREANS.
Former Marine pilot here. So many questions remain. Two surviving crew members also said that a bird struck the first engine, but it still does not explain why the landing gear did not deploy. This has to be one of strangest runway designs I’ve seen and I used to fly in and out of South Korea on multiple occasions.
It could be a pilot error, they might forgot to deploy the landing gear.
My question is if only the right thrust reverse was used and flaps didn't work, how did the plane not slide onto the right? Is it possible that the shadow on the video is not due to thrust reverse but a damage to the engine?
Well it did land in the opposite direction than typical. And there are houses not far from the end of the runway. HIndsight is 20/20. Maybe they thought runway overshoot in that direction wouldn't happen. There are countless examples past and present where the design never thought something would happen but it does.
@@veraboltonRecall to the PIA8303 belly incident a few years ago.
Poor CRM and lack of QRH referencing. Both pilots fixation on landing the plane at all costs, swiss cheese chain of events - lowered gear, then overspeed and raised gear, no flaps and no landing config. Ultimately floated and touchdown way too late.
Now look at the Jeju crash and see the similarities - no flaps, very late touchdown, lack of reaction (no spoilers, no reversers). Some latest eyewitness an hour ago even recalled seeing the plane overhead with its gear down at some point; which means it was likely raised and forgotten about - the same factor that meant PIA8303 landed on its belly.
Clearly similarities, both in actions and how blatantly basic configs and QRH were followed, even if it was a bird strike that caused a compressor stall. Engines were running upon the impact with the wall, and they grounded pretty much on the centerline, so definitely not a handling or hydraulic issue....
Hope I'm making some sense here 😅
@@IsabelleSt.Pierre-q2n they should of been on landing configuration long before even entering bravo airspace.
I fly solo and can get my aircraft configured properly.
Many many questions.
They are saying the bird in the engine was more serious that it looks from the videos. It started an internal fire that damaged the hydraulics and was spreading to the rest of the plane internally... but who knows...
I thought your spot on preliminary analysis was one of the best I’ve seen. As always, we’ll leave it up to the accident investigation professionals to really nail this down. I’ve run this video multiple times. One by one, you were hitting on every note that I had jotted down and much more. I’m a retired military and corporate aviator with a background in aviation safety and accident investigation. I’m not typed in the 737. Largest type in the Gulfstream GVI (G650). I’m going to put in a plug in here for Laminar Research’s desktop simulator - XP-12. Obviously not a level D sim, but I’m been extremely pleased with it’s attention to detail, especially with its 737-800 aerodynamics quality. I set up the 737-800 on runway 19 at Muan Int’l Airport. Set the weight at 146,000 lbs. Flew one approach and landing as you had described (clean wing, no ground spoilers, gear up). Touched down just past the aiming points and stopped with about three hundred yards remaining. I did a second run with 40 flaps, gear up, ground spoilers and TR’s deployed (forgot to kill the left TR), hit the aiming points this time and stopped adjacent to the terminal. Hope the cockpit voice recorder and the “black box” are found and in good shape.
These days, individual independent TH-cam journalists tend to provide quicker and more accurate information than mainstream media.
tbh a homeless guy on meth behind the local Wendy's probably provides more accurate information than mainstream media.
The media has a much broader range of subjects to cover, and only so much staffing with which to do it. This pilot doesn't next have to pivot to the latest health-related research, followed by a weather-event story, followed by war coverage followed by financial news followed by...
@ The mainstream media also has tens of millions of dollars to hire as many people as the need. They do terrible job. My point stands.
@@marcmcreynolds2827 lol really?
Because they have no political axt to grind. This plane was a Boeing 737 800. Do your research It came out of Renton Washington - this model has so far killed 1950 passengers all in similar accidents. Skidding off the runwayIn December just a few days apart one KLM 737 800 skidded off the runway after an emergency landing in Oslo - one Air India in Halifax.
I am a career USAF officer and applaud your excellent analysis of this almost preventable tragedy! Would there have been the loss of life, yes, but I suspect that it would have been far less than today's total. Wonderful job!
Mate, this is just Boeing alone. I'm sure we'll hear more about the F35s that seem to like going underwater, or
"touching ground" unexpectedly. Made in USA!
@@_._._._._._._._._._._._._.____ Yep. 2020's made in usa is 1980's made in china. 😅 "Most powerful country in the world" can't do Even flyable planes😅
God bless you 🎉
@@j0n_H ???
Why the wall?
I ‘m Korean. Thank you for addressing the Jeju Air accident in Korea. Amid the deep sadness, your detailed explanation provided some comfort and understanding. Domestic news frequently mentions bird strikes, but your description of the aircraft’s operational structure greatly helped in comprehending the accident’s cause. I sincerely appreciate your thorough and thoughtful explanation.
Stay strong, Korean!!! 2025 will be a better year ahead !!!! Loves from Singapore.
Korean media is compromised since 세월호 not to be trusted
A sad way to end 2024. Surely this accident could have been prevented somehow? I pray the loved ones of those lost can recover from this.
I hope this year's misfortune only bring better change to the country (less corruption, better social net, healthier work / life balance).
@@jimiyu7989 Even in sadness, we must hold onto hope and embrace the future. Thank you so much. It brings me steadiness.
@@shiroineko13 I deeply appreciate your profound understanding and consideration for Korea.
Your analyses answered a lot, Denys. I read quite a few comments by the Pilots here and thought the same (after seeing the crash on TV) - this tragedy, most likely, would be much less horrible.
I guarantee the thorough and complete investigation will clarify all circumstances of this devastating accident.
My condolences to families and RIP to all innocent souls
This accident sounds similar to Pakistan International Airlines Flight 8303. The copilot thought they needed to do a go around while the captain, who was flying the plane, thought they were going to land. The copilot retracted the landing gear to do the go around and then the pilot tried to land with the landing gear up. This was a communications failure in the cockpit causing the pilot and copilot to not be on the same page.
This sounds the most plausible because the speed was too high, almost like it was taking off.
that would be ABSOLUTELY INCOMPREHENSIBLE IF YOUR RIGHT!!!🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️☠️☠️☠️
Plausible. Would be tragic if this later turned out to be one of those infamous cases where the Captain and FO disagreed or miscommunicated but the FO was too afraid to speak up because of the seniority of the captain.
Not possible. There would be voice and sound alarms if you tried to land without the landing gear.
It's looks like they forgot to extract the landing gear
I am not good at English. Please understand. Im an air traffic controller In Korea, more than 15 years experiecned . i worked muan airport tower as a team leader, one and half years. this accidents is very sad for me. Due to runways surface angle, the LOC antenna is need to be more higher position, of course, for a aircraft safety all of airports obstucles have to soft. but many airmen do not know the LOC antenna's soil hill has internals inside is concrete. so am i. i was very embarassed why inside has concrete? at the time of the accident, i think a tower air traffic controllers may don't know this factor. contrastively, the wall of airport is made of loose block. a few years ago a car was hitted the airports wall. break through a wall, driver was severe injured not dead. but why LOC antenna's soil hill is made by concrete? its need to investigate. I think it's going to be included in the accident investigation report. 179 Souls. Rest In Peace...
-------------------------------------------------------
What i meant to say was [ I'm not good at English] → Im not a native english speaker, Please stop the argument.
The wall killed 179 people. It is the reason why this is a tragedy. Embarrassing and unnaceptable idea to place a concrete wall 😢
Probably much cheaper to build the localiser support like this than to use towers to build it on.
많은 전문가들이 런웨이 끝부분에 단단한 콘크리드 장벽만 없었어도 이런 대참사는 벌어지지 않았을거라 지적하는데 도대체 이런 안테나 콘크리트 장벽을 누가 설계했는지 해명하라 해야 하고요, 안테나 장벽을 이참에 다 뿌셔 버리고 활주로와 같은 방향으로 혹은 멀찍이 떨어져 설치하도록 해야 할겁니다. 짧은 활주로에 미쳤다고 단단한 콘크리트 장벽을 떡하니 가로막고 있게 하는 것 골백번 생각해도 미친 디자인입니다!
I think no knowledge contractors they made😢
@@beyondstratospherethis is so interesting, thank you for sharing your knowledge.
I am a former airline Captain with extensive 737 experience. This is a very good analysis of what we know so far. I believe that the voice recorder will answer many questions about this tragic accident. I can’t understand why that reinforced concrete was placed at the end of the runway.
we all know why they are there, as a former airline pilot you have seen many things like that wall at numerous airports, and you are also aware that there is usually a common sense reason for obstructions like that. you should not be confused by this - IF you were an airline 'captain'.
Also ... 'as an airline pilot' .. you should of also noticed he landed at the end of the runway and nowhere near the beginning, or even the middle. he landed at the end - and there was no way that plane was going to survive that without running off the end of the runway at high speed.
@@armastat My pilot experience is a matter of public record on the FAA.gov website. I have 35 years of experience in many aircraft types and 22000 hours of flight time. And, no, I have not seen concrete walls at the end of runways . As far as where he landed on the runway, I never even mentioned anything about that.
@@armastat My pilot experience is a matter of public record on the FAA.gov website, 22000 hours of total time and 35 years of experience with multiple type ratings. Are you even a pilot?
@@armastat okay but then why that wall was there? Explain to us. I been to few airports but never saw any conrete walls at the end of runway
They cared more about protecting the antennas than protecting a plane
I hope this video be seen by many koreans; we need to know seriousness of hard soil wall including concretes. Our main media only shows bird strike and landing gear loss which is to evade the topic: why there are soil hill
The Korean media is looking too much at what the pilot did, what happened with the landing gear, but not the engineers and government being responsible for such a concrete wall was responsible for almost everyone dying. The media is disappointing.
@Bazza5000 yes that's true
잔인하다는 이유인지 제일 중요한 마지막 벽과 충돌해서 폭발이 일어나는 장면만 딱 잘라서 직전까지만 보도하더라고요.
그래서 충돌 사실 자체를 모르고 심각성을 모르는 것 같습니다.
@@Bazza5000 난 관련자가 아니라 전문적인 부분은 모르지만, 파일럿에 관심이 집중되는 이유는 한쪽 엔진이 멈춘 상황에서 생각할 수 있는 조치를 모두 생략하고 2분 만에 곧바로 배면착륙이 이루어졌기 때문입니다. 첫 랜딩 실패 후 매우 짧은 회전으로 활주로의 중간지점에 착륙. 심지어 랜딩기어 수동조작도 하지 않고 곧바로 착륙할 수 밖에 없었던 상황에 의문이 있기 때문입니다.
@@user-up7zp7wn3q 본인만 모르는 거예요. ㅎㅎ
You are absolutely right. The first thing that came to mind when I did see this footage, was " Who put that wall there" Terrible tragic.
Don't blame the wall it's the pilot fault clearly he panicked he should of gone around
@michaelotoo5543 Oh! You have the black box recording. Awesome! Please share with us what exactly happened in the cockpit to determine that the pilot panicked.
I'll wait.
First of all my condolences to the families affected by this tragic accident. 🙏🙏🙏 My biggest concern regarding the pilot-in-command’s handling of the belly landing is why had he used up so much runway before contacting the ground? From the angle shown on the video, he was approximately 2/3 down the runway before making ground fall. Hopefully the FDR and CVR and upcoming investigation will reveal what occurred. Unfortunately there are not enough Capt. Sullenberger’s at the helm of today’s airliners.😞
I agree, who designed that airport infrastructure? What standards were they following? Will any of the airport administrators be brought up on charges? There will probably be 182 lawsuits filed that will expose a lot of the shortcomings of Korean aviation and their regulators.
@@michaelotoo5543 I heard from a source that the plane was losing energy, and its really hard to act fast and stay calm in these high intensity situations. Piloting the plane is extremely stressful, so please be respectful. Also, its still the wall's fault because it really didn't have to be there and made of that material, otherwise the plane wouldn't have exploded and more lives could have been saved.
FYI: The plane was landing in opposite direction of the runway for some reasons, confirmed by main Korean medias.
The person who shoot the video of crashing plane all medias including this channel are using now also mentioned in an interview that he began recording since seeing the plane flying differently than other planes, making popping sounds, making too short goaround and finally landing in opposite way. He is a small restaurant owner near by and the video was shoot from his shop.
Stupid question: do airports record every single landing and departure? If they don't, that man is a heroe as he provided a key element to ensure this never happens again.
@@__eee__the airports themselves dont record anything
@@__eee__ it's not a stupid question. It's a very logical question considering how ubiquitous and cheap camera systems are. With multi-million dollar budget for an airport, installing high-res camera system isn't so out of line.
When it comes to aviation accidents, don't EVER take anything the media reports as "confirmation" of anything at all.
@@__eee__airports have cctv running 24/7 but they are wide view camera so the planes appear very small on screen and you wouldn't be able to see small details
I'm a former aviation technician and I'm glad a pilot's finally voicing their opinion because I concur 100% that a bird strike does not cause a landing gear failure. In my opinion if there was a known gear failure all you can really do is attempt a belly landing but doing that requires an extremely long runway and/or empty field after the runway. If there was a known gear failure I don't see why ATC wouldn't have had them go around while they determined the longest and best runway to attempt a landing on....... They may have even diverted the plane if there was another airport close by with an extremely long runway. It makes no sense that these pilots attempted to land this plane on the belly of a runway with a retaining wall at the end. It's my honest belief that they did not know the gear wasn't down and locked. All I can assume is that when they actuated the gear switch somehow, some way the indicator lights all came on and maybe the pilots believed that the gear was down and locked and that's why they attempted this landing.......... Either that or it was a suicide mission...... Both the pilots and ATC should have known this was an inappropriate runway to attempt a belly landing. I honestly think the pilots thought the gear was down but didn't realize it until it was too late. I'm hoping we get to see the official report on this.
Apparently the ATC directed pilots to land in the other direction (without a concrete wall), and outside observers said all planes were landing/taking off in that direction so it must've been the headwind direction. Pilots missed their first approach and made a strange decision to just turn around and attempt landing in the other direction (into a tailwind and into the wall) instead of making a full go-around.
Who was the idiot that put the antennas with its concrete wall in the runway path????
@@bluerendar2194 sounds like pilot’s judgement error if true
Any idea how they managed to deploy thrust reversers with no weight on wheels?
💯
Thank you, Denys. As a pilot myself, I view this early report as a responsible and professional perspective given the lack of details as well as conflicting reports.
A concrete reinforced wall at the end of the runway is wild.
EXACTLY! Why was there a wall? Was the runway too short?
Roads, buildings ahead
Yeah, I though Korean are smart? LOL!!
@@pumpkinlashes596that's not an excuse.
is it confirmed plane was going correct way vs (right direction of runway?)
Dennis. your analysis is the best available. Independent and objective. It is unfortunate that I have now been introduced to you twice in one week.
You have been way ahead of the story on the Baku flight and this one. You are doing the world a service with your unambiguous and honest reporting.
+ 💯 % from a retired ATP. Just subscribed...
Thank you for the detailed and informative video.
I cannot even imagine what it must have been like for the 181 souls on board this flight and for the loved ones at the airport waiting for their arrival...witnessing this will forever be imprinted in their hearts and minds. Dont forget how this impacts the first responders and firefighters. Practicing for an 'advent' is not the same as this catastrophic accident. Captain Blog really great reporting and evaluation putting yourself in that cockpit. No judgement just factual analysis. All will be revealed in the investigation. Tragic and sad time for South Korea, condelences and sympathy to all the loved ones and for tragic loss for the Airline which has had a good track record.
Would have been tough . Sitting there realising that the plane is not slowing down .
they likely didn't know what was going on until the very last seconds
@@MarcusN-kp1jnthey knew since we have evidence of passengers messaging family about bird strike and problems asking if they should say their last will
I’m sure most have them had their heads down and bracing.
@@MarcusN-kp1jnFrom the news, passengers received crew’s information they were allowed to phone call in last a few minutes. Then There were 2 msgs from passengers Kakao (Korean version LINE or WhatsApp) released. The first one: A daughter tried to call her mom but her mom miss the call. The daughter left msg told her mom “mom I love you” The second one: a passenger text his/her family member, told them about bird strike issue and cannot land. Family asked him/her “When did it started” He/she replied “Should I leave my last word” then never have further words.
I am a former 737 700/800 and 800max instructor. I agree with Denys. Something seems very off with the pilot judgement in this landing. Why was the gear not manually extended? Why were flaps not used? If the right engine had failed it is explainable why they opted for an immediate landing but why no flaps? It looks like they had adequate control so I would doubt complete hydraulics loss. Also, why did they land to the south after attempting an apparent landing to the north according to ADSB data? If they had a tailwind, that would have greatly increased their landing distance. I have seen so many airline accidents lately where pilots seem to have a lack of general knowledge of systems and good judgement. Pilots practice emergencies, but when real ones occur you should be thinking clearly and not making impulsive decisions. My condolences to the families that lost loved ones.
I believe. korean pilots dont have time during landing. it's unlucky that birds strike cause landing gears not to be function. manually landing gears are not enough time.
I don't think the pilot had much vertical control. for some reason it took him most of the runway to actually get it on the ground. if u pay attention to 'where' he actually touched down it was way pas the beginning of this very long runway and he touched down within 1000 of the end and the wall. no way it was going to stop. He may also have been focused so hard to 'gently' hit the ground that he instead used up all the runway in the air trying to be gentle and didn't realize he ran out of runway.
I agreed that this is pilot error no need to argue many pilot have commented many engineers and experts I don’t trust media outlets this comment is enough to explain the tragedy
DEI hires.
@@ccuellar6212 dont hink S Korea has that problem, but there is a worldwide shortage of good pilots (the best ones tend to be ex military combat veterans. and we have had no big wars lately so they would get experience). So airlines have been hiring not so well trained pilots in last few years. I'm pretty sure this was a relatively inexperienced flight crew, since some obvious mistakes seemed to have been possible here.
Flaps up, no gear, way too fast, no reverse thrust, concrete wall. What a very weird crash…
Yes, doom combination
And maybe more to come when we hear the CVR...
You do know airports have shorter and longer runways for different aircraft’s. If the landing gear would have function it would have stopped before going straight to the concrete wall
Makes zero sense!?
Gonna be on the book this onr
We pray for and My condolences to the families who lost loved one to South Korea from Thailand
Muan International Airport in Chollanam-do started operations back in 2007. However, since its runway was much shorter than any of the other international Korean airports its was seldom used. Due to Korean gov't safety concerns it was only granted international flights status for a few flights to/from China and South-East Asia. Financially, Muan International has been losing money for years - it handles about one flight daily. By far its greatest hazard is that it is located in the very center of a migratory bird sanctuary - hardly a safe area for an airport.
This airport should not be used for any airline flights.
Korea has something like 13 airports that are supposed to be "international airports". Back in the 1990s/2000s every politician/local official wanted to flex and build their own airport in their region to bring in "business". Given how small Korea really is population and land wise, it makes zero sense and was nothing more than a total waste of tax money. Only Incheon and Busan are profitable, even at that Busan is barely profitable. Those are huge cities.
All other cities basically have ghost airports that have basic staff on hand and looks dead including Muan. Most have only 3 gates.
I just flew out of Muan a few days ago and it looks just empty inside other than flight crew servicing the check in desk.
@@diannedai637 Agreed. It's surrounded by known bird sanctuaries so it's the vanity and greed of the local government to keep it operating to generate some revenue. It should be used only for small planes, if needed.
As Korean, It's hard to hear that news.. Maybe this accident can be worst air disaster in Korean history... 7C 2216 Captain (Han kwang seop) has 6823 flight hours and became Captain since 2019 March. First officer (Kim gyeong hwan) has 1650 flight hours and became First officer since 2023 February.. It's an unfortunate news...
thats so damn sad man, i watched your content a lot. Best wishes to your country
I hear you man as a fellow Korean when i heard this today my heart just dropped
Pretty sure KAL007 is still the worst in your history. But this could be second.
So these were still rookie pilots.
For sure since the airport killed these people.
Your explanation as to what had transpired is so clear...I pray for the souls of those who perished in the crash...
What annoys me is everyone aboard was alive when the plane belly-landed and skidded down the runway, they were all killed when the plane crashed and blew up when it hit a stupid barrier?
Would you mind to elaborate 'stupid barrier'? Am I correct if I understand that you might indicate that the concrete barrier is against airport safety system?
That’s sadly true
exactly
@@bhbpeak Yes, that's what they mean. The localiser antennae is usually just built on the ground or a metal lattice structure so it wouldn't cause total loss of aircraft if there was a runway excursion like here.
Yeah I was seeing the belly landing an thought everyone would be okay since it's happened lots but then it smashed into that concrete barrier for the antennae's. Most airports just have them built on the ground or on a metal lattice that would crumple if a plane hit it after a runway excursion. This should have been survivable.
Hello, I want to say that your observations are spot on. Thanks for the update on the hydraulic system for this aircraft. I'm a 31 year 737 pilot, having flown B737 100,200,300,500,700,800,and MAX8 aircraft, with just over 21,000 hours in type. I agree with all of your points. It looks like they touched down very long and fast. That's the reason for the excursion into the concrete wall. My initial reaction and questions revolve around your point that they didn't try to manually extend the landing gear. It also appears that they didn't try to use the standby hydraulic system to extend the flaps to the flaps 15 position. This would have enabled a much slower approach speed. My condolences to all the victims and I hope the FA's that survived make a full recovery.
With so many odd and unexplained things surrounding this crash, perhaps there was a problem concerning the mental stability of the pilot or copilot. Perhaps one of them crashed the plane intentionally, knowing that there was a strong concrete barrier at the end of that runway.
@@edschultheis9537 Malice is the last option on the world.. first it comes gross incompetence, then mechanical failure...then a hundred other things..then malice,.
This accident will be attributed to pilot error. I think they panicked and didn't follow procedure.
When they get the CVR decoded it's likely to be fairly ugly....
@@edschultheis9537 extremely unlikely, if suicide was the case, it would have done it earlier with or without the birdstrike
It’s been an sad week in aviation with too many lives lost and your analysis has been truly helpful in cutting through the nonsense from the major outlets. Your calm breakdowns of what is visible and what we can reasonable take away from what we can yet see has been invaluable. I cannot thank you enough for the work you do.
Pilot Blog, thank you for the fantastic report on this airplane crash. You alone put our national media at shame!
PS- My thoughts and prayers are with the families that have lost a loved ❤ one in this tragedy. We are praying 🙏 for you and your families.
Your accent and frankness is very refreshing compared to some of the clickbait on YT. Reminds me of colleagues I’ve had from eastern Europe, no bullshit.
He is from Ukraine. Has been a pilot for a long time . He is a pilot till now . 🫶🫶🫶. He is no nonsense guy.
why does the accent matter??
It’s matters - TH-cam can’t just be American POV and accents. And I say that as an American. It’s good to have a variety of cultures and speaking patterns reflecting the entirety of the internet.
@@KimoKimochii The accent gives it more legitmacy.
Agreed 🇺🇸❤️
Thank you for a very clear, thorough understanding of what happened. Very tragic and sad! Was a passenger, whom traveled for 30 years.
The most accurate analysis available to date. The airplane appears to be configured for a go-around rather than for landing. The fact that the thrust reversal is deployed on the right hand engine only may be linked to the bird strike that allegedly involved that engine (it had some damages anyway). Further analysis will tell us if there was some communication issue in the cockpit, leading the pilot-flying to try to land an airplane configured for GA. Looks like a nasty combination of factors (bird strike + communication + concrete wall at the end of the runway) led to this disaster. For sure the concrete wall holding the localizer antennas was a deciding factor.
Its always a chain of events not a simple system failure. Were the pilots ex-military which can lead to a higher ranking pilot ignoring the real commander. Many years ago another Asian airline had to make big changes to their crewing because of this problem.
In Korea, military service is compulsory for men. So everyone is ex-military in this case:
@MAX-z7a OMG. I've worked in the East and that sounds so Eastern culture to me.
Why no flaps? also for a go around u have the flaps configured
Thank you Denys for bringing up the issue of the extremely robust obstacle at the end of the runway. There is no excuse for the very hard object just off the end of the runway. If there had been more runoff without a hardened obstacle at the end of the runway they would have had a good chance of survival. I've seen this kind of thing before. Why responsible airport management would allow this is beyond all reason. Yes, there should be strong regulation against this kind of stupidity. This is not the first time people have died because of this kind of criminal irresponsibility. It should be the last time for sure.
Hopefully that sends a message to other airports that have a brick wall on their runways. I mean, I understand why some do and thats to stop planes from crashing into residential areas, but to save them and not passengers seems absurd.
"4000 dead after plane hits town and causes massive fire because there was no barrier to prevent it from just continuing past the runway till physics said stop"
@@23ofSeptember a brick wall is not as dangerous because of individual bricks but the airplane in this video hit a solid concrete wall that is very thick and made out of 1 solid piece of concrete
@@TurnerBrendan Yes, I understand it was a dirt mound containing concrete and the locator beacons. Whatever it was, shouldn't be there and should be removed from other airports if need be.
I worked in airfield management in the Air Force. There is strong regulation against this. That's not supposed to be there. The airfield manager at that airport is in trouble
Although very tragic, your articulation and understanding is first rate.
Many thanks.
Prayers and condolences to all concerned.
🦘🇦🇺👍
من صنعاء، اليمن، أبعث بأحر التعازي إلى جميع عائلات الذين فقدوا أحباءهم في حادث تحطم طائرة بوينج 737 في مطار موان الدولي في كوريا الجنوبية.
The localizer is typically built on a concrete slab, the top of which is flush with the ground surface. Everything above the surface is designed to be frangible. The slab itself is excluded as it is below the surface.
Seems they skipped the digging part to save money
Who was the idiot that put the antennas with its concrete wall in the runway path????
@@cobraskenpo2299, maybe you did it?
A concise, objective and analytical report of this dreadful tragedy, avoiding all the usual hyperbole and groundless speculation.
Except for the part where this was “ preventable “ very helpful for the families and investigators to hear this narrative from a young tuber before the fire is even put out .
For someone who is a huge fan of being able to fly, yet not quite an aviation enthusiast, It's pretty awesome that you provide these vids.
I am thoroughly surprised that twice in one week I've been able to find reliable information and I appreciate that it was you twice xD you've earned a sub
I have listened 100s of news and blogs about the incident. This is the only most informative and curiosity satisfying blog. Thank you for creating this and an update... I so much desire you can post more updates.....
The runway needs an EMAS (arresting system). That concrete wall was devastating.
The jet was going too fast for any arresting system to stop it.
If the concrete wall wasn't there they would of had a better chance of survival.
I can't see how an EMAS would work when the gear is not down.
@Quotenwagnerianer it just plunges in still i guess
@@johnnyrocket80085not by much they would hit another wall within 2 seconds with that speed.
@@Quotenwagnerianer I suppose the engines would also dig into the arresting material, but would they dig into it as efficiently as landing gear? That i do not know.
First time I have ever seen your pilot blog. I watch your other channel on Ukraine every day. Very good reporting. I wish it was on a different subject, but it is what it is. Thanks for great reporting.
no one is talking about the fact that it landed on RWY19 instead of RWY01?! Your analysis is insanely well thought out!
Bro we don’t sit here all day trying to understand what runway is longer, we have clothes to wash
Yet you ppl still take your time clowning the airway design or whatever thinking the people designing stuff like this arent 10x brighter than you could ever hope to be. dimwits
@@JimboJimbo-i4i go wash clothes instead of replying then
@@JimboJimbo-i4i In layman terms, those are just opposite directions of the same runway.
@@JimboJimbo-i4i Its one runway, the numbers are compass degrees 010 and 190. Opposite directions.
By far, the best reporting of anyone I've seen. All facts and information clearly explained. Thank you.
Thank you for your objective and calm insights. As a Korean, perhaps due to the chaotic state of the country, it feels difficult to trust any domestic information. This kind of information was much needed. Thank you for uploading the video.
Several errors, and huge catastrophic landing, plus that horrible wall. My condolences for the poor souls on-board 😢.
Walls, trees, building, busy freeways, hills, radio towers, etc can be found at the end of most runways all over the place. its not unusual. what is unusual is landing a plane 8000' down the runway onto the last 1000' (and going faster than needed) and expecting not to hit something.
@armastat Still, a concrete wall at the end of the runway is a stupid idea...this plane didn't land in the residential area, plus errors happen and we know that if it was a normal buliding normal wall or even a tree there could be more survivors
If not for that reinforced concrete locator foundation, the plane may very well have not exploded. A comparable accident at SFO cost the lives of 3, while all other passengers walked away, because a structure caught the aircraft's tail and separated it from the fuselage rather than impacting the fuselage from the front. The plane almost cartwheeled, but it did not explode. Structural separation decreases mass and thus impact force, so the concrete block fence 200 feet beyond the Muan locator foundation would have slowed the skidding plane instead of exploding it. The lengthy landing distance may have been due to the airliner floating in ground effect while dissipating energy, yet the pilot may have throttled up prior to touching the runway in an abort attempt after realizing that the landing gear were not down. Maybe. The big question to me is, why did the pilot need to get to the ground so quickly that he came in hot? Did he shut down the wrong engine after a bird strike?
@@kctoon5062 have same questions about why the plane was so fast, but I think that in his rush, he forgot ground effect being something to deal with. There may have been a few seconds of wth? or maybe even thinking he was on the ground but puzzled as to why there was no horrible grinding noises. One possible reason for many of the strange thing was hey had completely lost the indicators on the instrument panel, so no gear indicators, airspeed, etc. sounds unlikely but would explain much. I find that there being no report about any radio conversations from the plane very puzzling.
@@kctoon5062 Plus keep in mind. 'If not for the wall' comments are wrong. both logically and factually.
its 'If not for the excessive speed'. He was going over 50% faster than he needed to be. That is what came first - and what made all this happen. there is no apparent reason for that speed.There may have been a cause for it - but there seemed to be no attempt to compensate for it.
If not for that - he would NOT have hit the wall, despite landing so late. even the ground effect would of been much less of a factor at a lower speed, he would of landed much much sooner and had less speed to shed, even if he reached the wall he would of been going at a small fraction of the speed he was when it it.
The Aberbaijan crash was blamed on a "bird strike" till we all saw the missile damage to the tail section. To blame this on a bird strike "in adverse weather" when it was a clear blue sky is just next level nonsense. It does seem however that the flight crew impacted very long down the runway. They had 2 kms of runway to use but still seemed to go off the end at a high rate of knots. So many questions yet to be answered. Good video.
Birds catching strays for every crash. Seems the common misinformation phrase official sources seem to like. I'm no pilot but so the flaps and slats on the wings looked wrong, no landing gear, no sign of smoke.
"Fragmentation bird" is the new Urban Dictionary entry.
The *average* speed of the plane skidding down the runway is ~155knots. A tad too fast, but then not much to stop it.
As was mentioned in the video, and seen in the picture with the plane overhead, there is evidence of a possible bird strike to the engine.
finally!! Someone else noticed that he landing within 1000 feet of the end instead of doing it 8,000 feet sooner.
Thank you Dennis, for the report and explanation. It was easy to understand.
My condolences to the families for the lost of their loved ones.
I subscribed because Juan recommended you and just 2 days later you provide this high quality information! Thanks!
I did too.
Same, I came from blancolrio! Denys is also excellent.
Ditto!
Thanks very much for your help. My heart goes out to all families of the deceased. I worked on aviation 16 years. I landed a lot of times in another very dangerous airport Funchal Madeira island. No wall at the end of the runway but sea and cross winds. I felt my heart broken watching this. Blessings to you all
Great to hear someone familiar with the aircraft go through the checklist etc. Answered a lot of my questions and raised others. I was an aircraft maintainer for almost 39 years so I see a lot of red flags. We will have some answers once flight safety does their thing. Thanks for your excellent video.
Lovely to see my Ukrainian brother getting lots of views on his channel again, wish you all the best mate.
Excellent analysis with the limited info available. I'm sure the people responsible for the concrete wall are feeling very bad now.
I would have thought the people that put the concrete wall there are feeling GOOD as it did the job it was made for , Give your head a Shake ffs,
Sadly I don't think so, because in asia you have to "safe face" so even with Samsung having work induced incidents of blood related diseases they would not acknowledge any wrong doing until the public had the demonstrated against them for years. th-cam.com/video/Sd56BkWXM2I/w-d-xo.html
@@MrBIDNEZZMAN I know exactly what you mean, I live in Thailand. This is a more clear cut case imho. They are going to have to answer the questions at least. It could be as simple as "it was a jet blast wall".
They don't put reinforced concrete structures at the end of runways to stop airliners. Runoffs are used, just like in F1 race courses. In any event, no buildings were endangered within a direct line of the runway; and the plane could have slid for another half mile before threatening a parking lot. My old college hired a financial district architect to design its new performing arts building. The building was complete chaos for theater, but it had lots of offices! I doubt that whomever made the design decision to embed the locator antennas in reinforced concrete knew or obtain access to information with regard to runway safety.
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I've seen a lot of your Ukraine update videos. I didn't realize you had this channel. Thank you for all of the information you bring to us.
this isn't worth the paper it's written on. Want some real insight into the cause? Read the accident report of KE801
🖤💔🥀 Heart breaking.......Thanks Denys for reporting!!!!!!
❤
How horribly heartbreaking!! My heart goes out to all the families of the dearly departed!!!😢
Airport banned from international flights, but the day after the president was impeached, a leftist political party changed it to allow international flights🫢
Muan Airport in Jeollanam-do was politically built for a left-leaning region without considering economics, and the tragic accident occurred due to a leftist political party's push to allow international flights.
Hi Dennis, as a brazilian i couldn't help but feel an immense deja vu from this,
It remind me so much of the crash of the tam flight in congonhas airport...
Perhaps if they had the Runway End Safety Area (RESA) just like we have after we learned that bitter lesson they would all be here ......
Airport engineer here. Looks like that localizer was about 260m from the runway end and has been there since at least 2004 on a built-up berm per google earth. Depending on other runway criteria, ICAO design standards, of which South Korea has been a part for ages, require 240m minimum clear runway end safety area. Common sense dictates more safety area if you can get it. CS also dictates not to put a giant concrete and earth berm immediately after your 240m minimum distance FFS! I always preached to my designers that minimum standards were just that, minimum. Do better everywhere you can. Why those went 20+ years without being replaced with frangible legs and the berm removed is a question I hope everyone will be asking. IMO that pilot did everything they could with no gear or flaps, airport infrastructure killed these people. Airport staff has their 240m get-out-of-jail-free card but that doesn't mean they could not have done better. Looks like the localizer at the other end was removed between 2022-2024, it had the same bunker-style setup.
It is one of the lowest traffic airports in Korea.. Dunno why the berm was built, but not being profitable certainly was a reason why it was never changed.
Perhaps both the wall and berm are as a result of noise complaints for thr residential area. Built the berm when building an ILS and get two birds with one stone... More noise abatement and a robust localizer mounting.
According to Korean people, this exact plane had small explosions in the engine on a previous journey the week before. It was looked at by the engineers but got clearance.
😮😮
But still, how an engine explosion broke the hydraulic system? They don't even lower the landing gear manually. It's a catastrophic accident through and through....
@@dputra Could it be the pilots might have simply forgotten to lower the gear with everything else going on?
Is this the same one diverted to incheon a few days ago?
this exact same plane was diverted 2 days ago because there was an emergency
For sure, the first time I saw this, I couldn't believe that a solid construction like that concrete Antenna base would be built at the end of a Runway, it pretty much guarantees zero chance of there not being casualties in what would already be a potentially life threatening crash landing....
I assumed they had veered off the runway into a wall, shocking that structure is directly in line
some people are saying the run way runs backwards ,that the plane was landed on wrong direction of runway..that explains it ..
@jnunez1203
Then, in that case, the Airport designers have not allowed for every possible contingency plan that an Airport should have in place, and this particular crash proves how inadequate their design truly is....
Atc told pilot to land on Runway 19 which had a retaining wall at that end....
@bradytom5468
Diabolical naivety.
This reminds me of the 777 accident at SFO back in 2013.
Not saying (or sure) if all the pilots were Korean, but I remember there were many odd, illogical decisions made on the accident too and it came down to the uniform military training of the pilots not allowing them to be flexible or critical of each other's decision making.
at that exact moment I just woke up and getting myself a coffee...
I don't know because this tragedy happened in my country,
for some reason I feel so guilty
Rest in peace for those who lost their lives in this terrible accident.
윤혁아 한국어써라
There is no guilt for it, you have no fault in this. Just celebrate life and enjoy it, and share your condolences to those who lost their family member in this tragedy, it's just life.
This crash is an unimaginable tragedy and I feel sad for you feeling guilt. Please accept my condolences for you, for the victims and their families and for South Korea 🇰🇷. I am praying for the souls of the victims, comfort for the families and all of South Korea.
@@잉기모링-f5u why should he speak korean, barely anybody speaks korean?
@@maxiswetv7654 윤혁이는 한국인이니까
Airports around the world are anxiously examining their end of runway infrastructure.
I doubt it
@@FlaminHotChipsAgreed. People don't care about prevention. They only do something after a disaster happens in front of their eyes. And maybe not even that. Most people are dumb.
Insurance companies should take it on board if there is not a new policy to change things like this . I am guessing airports have to be insurable ?
There are international standards that require obstructions in the runway safety area to be frangible. They are well known and complied with at all major airports that handle commercial flights. Not maybe complied with, but almost certainly. This obstruction is likely due to lax oversight at smaller airports in a less developed country. I would not be surprised to learn that the issue was identified in inspections but never corrected.
Like the massive steel tower at Adis Ababa, that tore off the wing of the East African SVC10, that had a brake failure, over-ran, when abandoning take off.. causing fuel spill, fire and deaths.
Great analysis Dennis. One thing that I saw that no one is commenting on is; with a long runway, why is the plane landing on last thousand feet. You can see the last Aiming Point (white boxes) pass under the aircraft shortly after touchdown.
At 6:07 in the video, at the time of an apparent bird strike on engine No. 2, the flaps appear to be extended. If so, then the pilot may have called a Mayday, aborted his approach, and rushed through a 180 while retracting his flaps to get out of the air faster. With the increased emergency work load, it would have been easy to forget to redeploy the flaps to land. This might also explain the gear being up and the throttle appearing to be applied while the aircraft is sliding down the runway. All speculation at this time.
Дуже приємно бачити подібний аналіз від українського пілота (хоч, на жаль, і в минулому). Але серце радіє і пишається ❤🇺🇦
As an aircraft engineer i find that very strange the only explanation for that aircraft not being configured for a normal landing ie flaps extended etc is a hydraulic failure of some kind.
Bird strike unlikely to take out all the hydraulic systems.
Pilot error
Agreed. Failed TOGA? has happened before when the 2 pilots miscommunicated, one was landing the plane when the other was doing a TOGA, wheels up, max power ..
You forgot pilot error as a possible explanation.
The flaps have an electric backup IIRC, and still doesn’t explain why gear wasn’t gravity dropped (we know they didn’t even try as the nose gear doors are clearly still shut.)
Also they lined it up with the runway perfectly so…. that plane still had at least alternate hydraulics.
@ absolute tragedy whatever the reason. Maybe a failed TOGA? Cockpit error? Let’s see what the black boxes reveal.
This is one of those WTF crashes. No gear down. No flaps/speed brakes/slats, t/r’s, no way a bird strike does all that.
737 enough said
Nope. The bords are crushed if they go inside the fan of the engine.
@@eastbow6053I hope you know when you say shit like this you reveal yourself as an oaf who knows nothing about planes.
@@arcosprey4811 just by mentioning the type of plane makes me an oaf? 🤡💩
@ no, thinking that this plane crashed because it is a Boeing makes you an oaf. The 737-800 has been in service since 1998, this specific plane since 2009. The media sensationalized the Boeing 737-MAX failures and then you uniformed doofuses all assume that the cause of every crash is Boeing Boeing Boeing. You’re all like children, you have no idea what you’re talking about. Just shut up and let the people who actually know what they’re talking about talk about the facts as the reports come out.
What a terrible thing to happen! So many people killed. Thanks Captain Denys for your analysis of what may have happened. Thanks for mentioning the concrete wall and questioning why it was put there. Sympathies to all the rellies who are grieving.
Condolences to those who lost loved ones in this terrible tragedy.
I just gotta say, this particular video covered the terrible event perfectly and explained info that even those who are ignorant of the more specific circumstances could understand. RIP to the people lost... seriously.. tell your loved ones how you appreciate them when you can.
I am a pilot, an aeronautical design engineer, radar and systems design engineer and was a senior engineering officer in the RAF.
There are several phases to this incident. The original intention was for the aircraft to land Northbound; on the approach something happened to the right engine, it may have been a bird strike or a compressor stall. After an engine is damaged it is possible that repeat compression stalls occur. The recovery from a compressor stall is reduce the throttle back to flight idle and then to advance again slowly, if the stalls repeat the engine must be shut down. The ATC advise that there may have been a bird strike, which was acknowledged by the pilot. At this point the ADS-B data is lost. It is likely that a TOGA was initiated and that the aircraft was configured accordingly, flaps/stats neutral and the undercarriage retracted.
At this point an emergency was declared (MAYDAY).
Soon after the pilot elected to land Southbound. From the video it is apparent that the aircraft was not correctly configured for landing, there were do flap/stats deployed and the undercarriage was not extended.
This begs two questions:-
1) Why did the pilot elected to land so soon after what appears to have been an issue with one engine? In this situation normally the procedure would be climb away gain height and then run the checklists and troubleshoot problems, before attempting another landing. Were there other problems that required an immediate landing.
2) Why was the aircraft not correctly configured for landing? Was time so short that they did not have sufficient time, because of other factors, no hydraulics, etc.
I wonder if they shut down the wrong engine, like the Kegworth air disaster.
I sense that the pilots were in complete panick, so many mistakes. Seems all wrong decisions were made.
Thank you Denys. Excellent analysis of this tragic event.
Thank you for your input! I couldn’t help but notice your Winnipeg Jets cap-greetings from Winnipeg, Canada!
The design of the concrete wall at the end of the runway is absolutely stupid😮without it, the plane might be able to survive without so much destruction and save lives. RIP for the victims. Good analysis.
If I may; I'd like to change two words of your comment: "The design of the concrete wall at the end of the runway [was stunningly] stupid...."
There are houses in the other side of the concrete wall, albeit a little further away. Maybe the concrete wall was put there for their protection. Clearly some municipal regulation failures. Houses should not be built where planes night overshoot the runway.
@@preptplus, I hope you watched the video. The houses are off the centerline of the runway, and there is a brick perimeter wall, which is different from the reinforced concrete wall that was under the localizer.
@@seriouscat2231 Still not a great place to live - off-centre at the end of the overshoot area of the runway, brick wall or no brick wall. Just bad municipal thinking. Bad planning. The whole situation shows bad thinking by a number of people. Overall responsibility is with the authorities.
Impressive how you gathered all this data and information and created a very informative video in so short time. Thanks!
As a Former Airline Captain, Your Excellent Information is very Appreciated, Thank You So much. 👍🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Literally the first thing I said when I saw the video was that "They would've survived if it wasn't for that wall"... I'm so devastated at this loss of life, that, as you said, could've been avoided...
I am a pilot who has flown the B737-800, B737-900, and B737-900ER for about six years. Based on the information reported in the news, it seems that the aircraft, while approaching RWY 01 at Muan Airport, encountered a bird strike, resulting in a go-around. The plane then made an emergency landing on RWY 19 after sending three MAYDAY calls and attempting a belly landing. I suspect that the simultaneous failure of both engines, possibly a flame-out of both engines, may have occurred. The decision to perform a belly landing so urgently without lowering the landing gear likely points to the possibility of both engines having flame-out. However, after landing, the aircraft collided with an obstacle at the end of the runway and exploded. This raises concerns that Muan Airport's facilities may not have adhered to the required regulations.
Man, great job explaining. Very calm and polite. Thank you.
Denys, thank you for sharing this information. Our deepest condolences to all these passengers, families and loved ones from Sydney Australia. 🙏
Thank you so much Denys. I see from comments I am not alone in really valuing your analysis and I also appreciate when you admit you aren’t sure about something.
Your fast response to the Azerbaijan flight was the first place I heard the cause was Russian air defense and with supporting photos (I feel like I was 1-2 days ahead of mainstream media/CNN).
Here too I really appreciate your analysis and mention of the concrete barricade. How tragic. Clearly without it the plane had a better chance. And why are there houses so close anyway…
As always, your other channel is one of my main Ukraine news sources.
Thank you for a great covering of this tragic event. RIP to everyone that lost their lives in this crash. Sending my condolences to all the loved ones of the passengers and crew. 😢
After the 737 initiated a go-around on final approach to runway 01, the crew retracted the gear and flaps, leaving the aircraft in a clean configuration, indicating that the hydraulic systems were functioning normally. However, they then attempted to land without extending the flaps or landing gear, ultimately touching down in the last third of the runway, as shown in the video. This suggests the crew may have made a rushed decision to land for unknown reasons, resulting in this fatal accident. Reasons for such a rushed decision that come to mind are either a loss of thrust on both engines or some kind of uncontained fire in the cabin.
My deepest condolences to all the families affected by this tragic aircrash.🙏
That's a very unusual position relative to the runway to raise the gear. Usually gear is raised at higher altitude and further away from the runway
It is indeed a very unusual situation, but perhaps the startled effect due to bird strike and consequently an engine malfunction, caused the crew to momentarily forget to raise the landing gear on the go-around. However, after watching the video several times, I can hear the engines running upon the “belly landing”, suggesting that a complete loss of thrust on both engines might not be the reason for the rushed decision.
or panic. chaos ie loss of mental control?
@@TommyTCGT this is also a possibility
The first thing I noticed was how fast it was going, the flaps couldn't have been extended, bird strikes tend not to cause a loss of landing gear and flaps/hydraulic failure (very unusual), and no need to have a reinforced wall for the ILS, although very easy for us to comment/criticise here, an absolute tragedy and condolences to the families involved.
In theory we have two data sources for the speed of the aircraft during landing: the FDR and the video(s). The speed can (and probably will by some) be calculated for various points of the landing scrape by anyone with a good viewing of the video of the scrape here (for example), assuming the presentation speed matches the recording speed; those calculations (correct or not) would certainly be available before any FDR data are released to the public.
Super thorough! Your analysis is impressive. Also, my condolences to the victims' loved ones.
The two survivors are Cabin crew and they had no idea of the emergency situation. They are both conscious and they have partially testified
WOW! That MUST have been a Last Minute Issue, or the Pilots SHOULD have alerted them! ( I'm a former Flight Attendant, with 30 years of experience)
that must mean that literally the only people who survived were the flight attendants strapped into the back jumper seats of the aircraft, that’s absolutely horrifying.
What a career-ending tragedy! I’d be ready to call it in as a flight attendant after something like this. What a traumatizing experience and the survivor’s guilt…