BLOWN UP! Do I Regret Honda K24-Swapping my Ferrari? // Race Engine Teardown
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ย. 2024
- www.stanceworks...
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Hey guys, Mike here!
I just wanted to say thank you all so much for the support! I really hope you dig the new merch. There's no better way to support he channel and the racing efforts, AND you get something awesome at the same time.
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LS
I'm suprised seems like no one asked you about a Subaru engine swap. Some of their owners pump them up to 800HP. Such a flat engine would also lower the center of gravity.
I noticed the lack of ‘244’ on the merch, seems intentional now after switching to the K20!
Can’t wait for my GTK shirt to show up!
Love the shirts my dude! Got my order in, thanks Mike, and good luck on fixing the issue. You inspired me to get a Kseries swap for my b15 Sentra. Much much respect. Cleanest builds ever.
I hope you stick with the K24 and improve upon it. A smaller turbo will make it rocket out of the corners. People are making all kinds of reliable power with this engine, I don't see why you can't do the same. Keep improving on your design!
What a testament to Ferrari's design team ... not the engineering squad, they got the short stick ... but that thing is still gorgeous almost 50 years later
That's the whole reason I bought it! One of the prettiest cars ever made, no question.
Pininfarina, not Ferrari.
@@saltpeter500 That's true!
Pininfarina designs pretty cars.
Was about to say the same, the one thing NOT designed by Ferrari 😂
it's sad to see the engine let go. From what i have seen online with how the k24s blows up the most is by over revving the engine for an endurance type of load on the engine. Good on you for stepping down to a k20 you will enjoy the extra rpm that that engine will give you and i hope the issues are fixed for you this way
What this engine fully built ? i feel like the only thing that can go wrong on a Honda is the rods like you get perfect rods and youre set right?
@@repingers9777 It was a fully built engine from 4Piston, think Mike mentioned in an earlier video it cost $12k.
@@cbwilko thats actually less than i thought it would be lol 😅
@@repingers9777 not really..even if a fully built engine but used in "wrong range" or out of its sweet spot... it does exactly that blew things up...
in my opinion for track high revving nature... keep using the K24 tall deck block...but with k20 shorter stroke crank keeping 2000cc displacement... with longer rod ratio, short stroke, then revving it high up over 10k rpm would be no sweat for engine specced for track competition
@@AmirPomen i do agree with you that a destroked k24 is the way to go, but what makes it difficult is that it is not as of the shelf as a k20 and for racing that is a bit more desirable. The destroked k24 is bit more expensive and need a little more machine work so when in need for a new engine downtime is a bit longer. maybe it would be a good option if the need for less turbo lagg becomes a bigger problem with the k20 then the pros of more displaysment and rpm is a bigger plus
My last 4P motor blew up with hole in the engine just like yours. I’ll never use 4P engines again. Looking forward to what they say about your engine failure.
I always love when these videos drop man, keep it up. You're inspiring me to jump head first into the F430 with the same kind of energy and determination (but like 10x the technical skill, haha) Keep it up dude
Thanks Alex! Much appreciated. Keep up the hard work, yourself!
Is there a k24 in the f430’s future?
0:04 in and I already know the answer to whether or not you regret K swapping this car is that you absolutely don't regret it.
Let’s hope 4P is more courteous to you (of course they will you have popular TH-cam). The K360 we had scattered very early in its life. When I tore down the motor was completely full of blasting media. 4Ps only reply was that they don’t use blasting media?? You can’t tell me that pretty red expensive valve cover they put on my motor was never blasted. Live and learn. Trust no one no matter how “great” they are.
They are know to do half ass job. There is tred on k20org about them being shits.
I would hope that the transmission builder might also step up to help out and discover why their brand new, high performance, competition grade piece, ate a turd after almost no miles in use.
Quaife you mean? Yeah I agree.
Pretty sure Mike mentioned that he was at fault for that in a previous video. He said he had set the new one up in the correct way....but then the engine blew!!!
Quaiff are known for extremely high quality and well tested gear and have a great after sales rep. I almost guarantee it was install or adjustment error that caused the failure
not quaifes fault.
Quaife also probably rates the trans for less HP and torque than hes probably pushing through it.
The guys at 4piston are truly amazing! They’ve been super helpful with all K series questions I’ve had, and any/all parts. I would honestly be surprised if they didn’t offer to take a deep dive into the engine for you and help you diagnose what really caused the catastrophic failure.
So glad to hear you're going away from the K24 to a K20. Much better geometry for a race engine. These have been the go to in the Lotus Elise/Exige world forever to make a super light, super horsepower, high revving engine. I think it will be far happier than that K24 was. In racing, there is a replacement for displacement and that's RPMs.
I'd do a k24 block, with k20 head and destroked crank with a longer rod, motoriq just did thus exact build, gives you about a 2.2 liter roughly of displacement, revs easy and free but more torquey still than a regular k20
@@MineZilla123 Yes, MotoIQ is the go.
I was thinking maybe a Ferrari engine? It’s a radical idea I know.
But now stansworks has entered top flight racing maybe it’s time?
This is one of the coolest project cars in my opinion. swapping a k series in a Ferrari of all things is unique (from what I've seen) and seeing it run on track is a highly satisfying watch for an old mechanic like me. Awesome build with the modern updated looks. just a big win for viewers like me that just discovered your channel. Suck big time with the blown engine and the trans problems but this makes it even more interesting to watch how you will overcome these issues. keep it up! subbed and liked
I have seen some mixed experiences recently when it comes to the 4piston stuff. I wonder if it would have been worth having a third party look over the engine before immediately sending it their way. I know MotoIQ is in CA and those guys are some of smartest around.
Yea i see them pointing to a fault not related to the assembly
Yes, MotoIQ have a video on building a bullet proof K, very comprehensive.
@@FairladyS130 I dont think they have done a ton of them but they are just so thorough I would trust them with almost anything.
You could have used a OM 606. Its relatively cheap, 3L light and makes about 740 ft lbs at 600 hp. Some models can rev up to 7k rpm desoite it being a Diesel engine.
A timeattack Ferrari with a diesel. Like your creativity (and love diesels) but really? Imagine rolling coal with a car like that lmao
Legendary engine but longer than the K as it has 6 cylinders, fitting it in the bay with a FWD transaxle on the end would be a challenge.
I believe you can care less about others opinions. Your decisions doesn’t need a long backstory/ explanation. we are following your build! This build is tastefully done, inspiring and fun to follow 👊
As tasteful as a troglodyte's
Hope it works out well with 4p. As others have said, high power in circuit racing isnt super easy, not for LS or K24s either. Cant compare to drag racing, you already have 10seasons of drag racing run time in that engine:)
Exactly! We're asking a lot from a small engine. But I feel confident we can make it last.
@@stanceworks im sure you will get there, these things take development for many seasons in most cases. Could there be issues with oil foaming? Can happen in dry sump systems.
The system I use has an oil-air separator. Not likely.
Going for a drag racing set-up and material was just the wrong way to go.
K24 motors are bulletproof if build to accommodate the use case.
Dang, I love everything about this episode. Blameless culture FTW. Assigning blame prevents improvement in the future. Root cause analysis! The whole thing was like a forensics study. Thanks, Mike, for sharing this story. And of course, I still appreciate you being one of the few YT people not just building car after car, but getting out there and driving them, racing them 🤘🏼
Would have loved to see that thing with a Volvo whiteblock engine instead of a K24 :p It would meet the same FWD engine backwards requirements, and can be brought up to similar levels of power, and the sound would be so amazing. Like half a v10.
might as well go Audi RS3 engine then
Good move on the smaller turbo! I would turn the power level down a little, and get the suspension dialed. Consider a few different driving schools. It will steapen the learning curve dramatically!
This car is perfectly you. Having admired all things Stancworks since stumbling across some black E9 photos 10 years ago, this build is perfectly suited to you. The 70/80s aesthetic the rice burner race tech; just perfect. Dealing with this on 210k subscriber budget shows amazing commitment.
Your build quality is exemplary... and not just for youtube. Now, the way you accept this setback and explain everything for better or worse, really makes this one of the best automotive channels on TH-cam.
I believe Brent from PFI could help tune the torque out down low so it don't do this again. To much torque at low rpm is what tends to window these k series motors.
They tune torque out of even the 2jz's for track use its to much cylinder pressure for to long that breaks all engines. He could just boost control the max touque hit out and less timing it may have lasted a very long time. I would keep the setup and try again with softer tune but same peak hp. A smaller turbo will make more torque and more cylinder pressure at lower rpm that's more rod and bearing pressure.
@@sean.d7171 that's exactly what I thought.
@mikellewis2346 yeah I was repeating what you said sorry but it's something experienced tuners and people like yourself already know.
Glad to here 4pistons is helping to get it up and running. Already ordered. Shirt from you to help. Great video, hate when people try to blame someone else for an unknown root cause. Like that, you don't jump to conclusions.
Few comments saying maybe go with a K20 over K24, I’d actually have to agree for this application. I have a high comp NA K24 and love it, but the K20 could be the right way to go.
A shorter-stroke engine with a smaller turbo should be better for you anyway since you weren't yet approaching the power potential of the previous engine. In addition to less turbo lag, one might also expect lower amplitude vibration at any given RPM as compared to the first engine, which might have a positive effect on the ever-loosening fastener situation.
A question, does the 4Piston K20 block have the offset (Desaxe) crankshaft, or do they go with the taller-deck K24 block, but with longer rods to make up for the shorter-stroke crankshaft, but with a more advantageous rod-to-stroke ratio?
I'm no one but this is my favorite build on the internet, and i love your informative delivery, thanks
Everything about this channel is just so damn impressive!
The projects, the craftsmanship, the skills, the knowledge.
The videography, the editing, the background music, the narration and story lines.
And the just the absolute class act that you are! Your attitude towards the super lame internet haters, towards the ups and especially the downs, and the way you just take the high road all the time!
Absolutely stellar production, Mike!!!
- Oh, and: K24 swap all the things!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Kyle from BoostedBoiz has a turbo K20 and a Quaife sequential in his MR2 and that has been very successful for him, he has all sorts of knowledge about turbo K20 racing, Drag Week and Rocky Mountain Race Week are hard on everything.
Safety wire is a good option, but so is paint marking. If it's a issue with something backing out you can paint strip the bolt/nut and visually check if the paint is cracked broken. Good for items that may be frequently be removed.
Safety wire items that are hidden or not easily accessible and of course AN fittings if needed.
Good Luck and enjoy the channel.
I understand you want to choose proven platforms but the Audi/VW 07K 5cyl would fit, be affordable and sounds amazing.
This needs more likes!!!
YES!!!
I 110% believe in your concept from the beginning and still today. The K-motor would be my go-to motor in building this track car. I like everyone else feel very very sorry for this blown up engine, but you will find the reason, then properly addressed you’ll be back out there, Making It Happen!!!
Wishing you and your great team all the best over the holidays and look forward in seeing this great track car in ‘24 doing the business 🏆
Keep pushing man, can't wait to learn with you
Going to need to make a new badge for the back... 204GTK
Yea ...I was gonna recommend the K20 over a K24 setup due to the K24s famous harmonic vibration issues ...which makes me suspect that your engine failure is very likely down to a fractured Oil pump gear setup(If you are still utilizing the OEM location Oil Pump for the lubrication requirements(I know that you have a dry sump unit, but the Oil delivery system can vary depending on the unit) ...I hope it works out!
K24 destroked to 2.2 mite even be the better way to go. K20 is allways a great engine to road race with do to being built for high rpm racing. I run a jdm k24a in my 07 si and love it, but in stock form maken 220hp with super low gear ratio 6 speed. If i were to go for big power id rebuild the k20z3 that i got still in my shed for that reason.
IMO you should have developed the chassis tuning to get the maximum corner speed before the engine power. You would have been doing fast laps with only 10PSI boost if you drove it well and did not have mechanical failures. If you can maintain reasonable speed though the corners, you don't need a highly tuned engine against people running VW Golfs and similar cars in the "club class" at WTAC.
I always say with enough time and money almost anything is possible. Lotus has also been using FWD setups in the back of their cars for years. A k series makes sense all around, size, space, cost, durability. As you said Mike, stuff happens when you’re racing.
great video!!
The only other engine I could imagine in that car would be a VR6, but I'm Audi/VAG guy so....
Safety wire and lockpins my friend. This is where this car takes another big leap. Love it!
Still one of sickest build from day one. K series was a great choice from day one. Knowing that you was gonna track it. Racing... Stuff breaks. People gotta understand that. Love how you pointed out everything for others. Keep up great work bro. Can't wait for more drops and see you back on track. 😁👍
Going for a K20 might just make quite a bit of difference, considering that K24 makes a whole lot more vibrations and since you're on solid mounts, perhaps K20 would run better for your application. Can't wait to see how it actually runs from your perspective when it's finally done! Loved how you've gone through all of your thought process during the build.
I wouldn't be surprised the root cause is related to the several clues you've dropped in the last couple of shows - excessive chassis vibrations. Either it's impacting the motor directly, or indirectly via a support system, such as the dry sump (ie: pressure drop 45psi moments before failure). You are running solid engine mounts correct?
I was thinking about the same thing exactly. Way to stiff engine support, unbalanced as well could also lead to lower part of the engine block failure. Cracking the crankshaft casing and alowing loss of oil pressure till it breaks aparat totaly due to vibrations.
It sucks when things break, but at least you can learn from it and build it even better next time. Very interested to see what actually failed. Keep it up mate.
What we really need for racing is for someone to develope a v4 designed to a 2liter spec, just like the porsche 918. With this engine you can use it on ferraris, rx7, nsx, and pretty much any car, and it would make it so easy to make rwd platforms, out of any fwd.
I was thinking to myself, "how do I help Mike without giving him cash?" especially after the transmission issue and now the block. Buy some merch! This is the first time I bought merch from a youtuber, excited to proudly wear my shirt when I get it. Keep it up Mr. Burrows. It'd be really fun if someone built the Ferrari in AC so you could track test it and we could drive it in a sim.
Your solution to helping him without giving cash, is to give cash?!?! 🤦
Mike, you have some of the best content on TH-cam! Forget the haters - the K was a great choice and, once sorted, will be a monster. Looking forward to the next episode!
Always love how real and humble you are about the possibility of you being the cause of the failure. Its something we all could take a lesson from you on. Look forward to hearing the autopsy dude. Thanks for the video!
For oil pressure analysis, I find it useful to make a scatter plot of oil pressure vs rpm then filtered or colored by oil temperature. Preferably with data collected above 20hz (I use 100hz on track, up 1kHz for short logs of specific behaviors). It is useful to have some known baseline data (at temp) from the dyno, street, or even garage with low G forces to compare to. You can observe issues from starvation, aeration, pressure regulation, and increased tolerances (slightly lower pressure at same temperature and RPM before the relief valve kicks in, though some damage is likely done by this point at least it can be limited) from this plot. Dry sump or accusump are helpful to reduce pressure dips but are not a guarantee. Note if you have a VVT system, it may use a variable amount of oil flow and will affect the pressure readings accordingly. MLVHD is good for this analysis, as you can click on starvation points and review other transient channels at those points, though I don't think it supports GPS.
Seperately, while hard-mounting the engine in a flexible chassis helps with clearance issues, chassis stiffness and response, it also increases stress on the engine and vibrations through the chassis.
Hey mate,
So sorry to see this happened but I think you nailed it when you said that you just have to stay positive and keep moving.
Whilst I've not thrown a rod on a K I have on other platforms and can absolutely agree with your methodology so far.
Not sure if this helps but others that have blown motors on dry sump setup on different platforms were due to "Aeration" where the oil itself after certain pressure and temp just bubbled which caused oiling issues and holes in blocks.
All the best either way mate.
For motorsport: k20 >> k24! The shorter stroke in the k20 is much easier on engine internals, especially the piston wrist pins. You could build a k20 and have a machine shop balance the crank accordingly based on your rod/piston setup and rev it out to 9500+ rpm with relative reliability. Or you could go with a destroked k24 and have custom rods made to take advantage of the taller block deck, which would increase the rod ratio significantly and make high revs even more reliable. You got hella options man and I look forward to see where you decide to take this build
Love the random youtube recommendations lol.
Sad to see the K24 blown, hope you find out what took it out. In terms of people saying anything else. Your choice of engine is your own. No one elses. You have to like what is sending you down the track.
Being a Toyota V6 fan, wonder if the 1mz or 2gr would fit back there. There isnt much room in the Camry from the fire wall to the wheel centreline. At least in the gen 4s.
You have to like what is sending you down the track +1
Learned at Bonneville, safety wire all axle nuts. Love this build... keep it up!
Going the Honda route was definitely the best choice.. with the trans off, definitely pull it apart and make sure the nuts are welded on those shafts or you’re going to have the same issue. Boosted boiz Kyle has been down this road many times and he knows the trans inside and out now with having like 5 of them in his cars.
Ah man the oil pressure drop was your clue to shut it down! There should never be any significant change to your oil pressure for a given rpm and oil temperature. If you suddenly notice a change to the oil pressure and nothing else has changed, then for sure you are about to have a catastrophic failure. I'd be interested to know what your oil temps were when the failure happened. My guess is the oil temp was too high and you wiped a bearing from oil sheer. I recently went through this with a WRX engine. I was used to seeing 15psi of oil pressure at hot idle and suddenly one day I was only at 7psi hot idle and I immediately took it off the road. Thing was about to lose a bearing for sure, but I saved myself the expense of new block halves by seeing the signs early. I run an Elite 1500 in my Evo "fun car" and you should be able to set up engine protections based on oil pressure. A good rule of thumb is you want 10psi for every 1k rpm the engine is turning and also I'd set something up for oil temp as well. 4Piston is like 10min from me. Those guys know their stuff! Curious to see what they find during the autopsy!
When a crankshaft fails at the flywheel end it's worth looking at torsional vibrations - you have the inertia of the flywheel, clutch and gearbox and against that you have four pistons twanging away on the crank. This gives opportunity for resonances in the rev range (likely at very high RPM!), which can cause stresses which are highest at the flywheel end of the crank causing fatigue failures. The fillet radii on the end crank journal are important and can be rolled to improve fatigue life. I'm sure the builders will have far more knowledge on this but they may not know the inertias of your flywheel, clutch and gearbox. Looks like you may have a torsional vibration damper installed on the nose of the crank, but these can need tuning to ensure they match the rest of the driveline.
thanks Mike, it's not the same at all, but I've also lost an engine this year, and while it's still being buttoned up, it's really kicked me in gut.Your optimism and authenticity even when things go this bad, it's just awesome so thank you.
Excuse my ignorance on the car, I know nothing. But, what about making it pull up through the top easier. The rear body pull off and expose everything better. The piping and plumbing, be able to unplug/disconnect and have it remove with the rear body module. I'm sure you've already simplified everything as much as possible but thought I'd throw in my 2 sense anyway.
I personally would've kept the car yellow but if that's the only thing and just an opinion on top of that, it means nothing. K swapping that car made it easier and more budget minded friendly to find parts for and to build quickly, which when racing means more than anything. Parts turnaround is paramount at that moment and waiting on parts cost money by not being able to race. Pretty sure this car doesn't race to win money but not being able to post times does cost if there's sponsorship involved. Keep up the killer work. Watching this get built motivated me to finally finish my truck.
I get that it would’ve been a noticeable weight gain over a k-series, but I’ve thought through this whole process that a VR6, or even a VR5, would’ve been a great choice. I think the torque benefits of a 2.8-3.6L 6 cylinder would outweigh the weight penalty, and of course they sound amazing. I totally understand and respect the choice of the K24, but the idea of a VR Ferrari (a vee-ararri if you will haha) has stuck in my mind since day 1 of this build.
Props on your great attitude as always Mike, stoked to see this thing fixed up and back on the track!
The front bank of the original V8 is a bitch to work on. I'm replacing the valve shims on mine this very moment. Not a lot of fun, even with the deck lid removed. The 4 banger is the right choice Mike. But clearly you already know this. Looking forward to hearing what 4Piston has to say.
The K swap is a genius idea. Can't wait to see what went wrong and how you design a solution for it. Great work mate.
All that talk about choosing an engine/transaxle combo that fits...gave me an idea. DAZARRARI !!! Not suggesting it would be better than a K series, but it would make for a similarly fun project and it would sound cool.
note: Please forgive me. I've just recently gotten an RS3 and I'm going through the, "DAZA all the things," phase.
All things considered, it could have been much worse. Eric over at IDoCars runs a salvage yard and has been doing weekly engine teardowns for the last couple of years, and some crazy stuff has gone through his shop.
He's had a couple overrevs that looked like this, but by far the worst was someone managed to blow up all four pistons in a Subaru a while back. I've never seen a more blown up engine before.
Can't wait for the CSI: K24 episode!
It’s great that you are continuing the development of this car for Ferrari.
I hope that Ferrari will supply you with spare Honda engines so that you can properly test the limits.
Dont discount the dry sump , cavitation at the pump inlet. Twice I have seen undersize of the tank to oil pump line being the cause of bearing failure resulting in the need to increase the diameter and reduce pressure drop and this was on two different manufacturers dry sumped production vehicles.
Excellent…I am intrigued by the K27/Fezza ‘shotgun’ marriage…(I reckon the days of bothering about the noise from naysayers is long gone)…love your work…hope you get your carcass back down to Aus asap.
After watching the first 3 minutes of this video I think you're the perfect guy to do a little build competition with Casey Putsch. Casey's a friend of mine and you sound like you have a very similar philosophy on things. I'll enjoy seeing things develop on both channels! You've earned my subscription.
I like that mindset of yours.
Nagging and blaming does not solve the problem.
It's a shame the engine blew up, but one can only improve when things go bad.
Failure is the best teacher, I have taken many of it's classes so I can vouch for that.
K swap the world!
The K is probably the most developed and aftermarket-supported engine in the world. And nobody builds them like 4P.
I would consider a turbo different than the Garrett since you're swapping anyway. A Precision 6466 ball bearing unit should exceed your power goals while spooling faster and giving you more usable power.
Love your attitude about the whole thing, can't wait to see where this goes!
Service friendly: make sure it's easy to inspect the chain tensioner. They fail with roadracing and big cams. All kinds.
Want to go easy on the engine? Lower the rpm and not boost.
I would not go k20, because then you still need to push the valve train to high rpm.
I would go k24 with smaller turbo, 8200rpm max for safety and cams to match that (smaller cams are usually easier on the valve train/chain/tensioner).
And take what ever the drag racers say with a grain of salt 😅
LS4 in my opinion. Transverse setup and proven swap into Fieros. Much beefier and can be supercharged or turbo charged. You mentioned it as an option. Look into it more. From a cost standpoint it is a winner. Ton said aftermarket support and other support from those who have done it
Might be worth it to have 4P build a destroked (2.2L) K24 instead of switching to a K20. K swap the world!
Great video. I can't help but feel that you spend an inordinate amount of time and effort trying to defend your decisions from naysayers, whether real or imagined. I realize that this is a somewhat interactive forum where commenters can sometimes benefit a project by providing a different point of view or point to a previously unknown resource, but I enjoy watching you design, build, and race this car.
I don't care what the other viewers think about your choice of engine or brake pedal. I'm here to watch YOU, not the peanut gallery, most of whom will never build a car in their lives. Thank you for doing what you do and I can't wait to hear what happened to this engine. You rebuild your Ferrari however you want and others can build theirs with some miraculous LS swap.
Hear hear! You see a lot of TH-camrs spend a boatload of time on negative Nancy's compared to time spend on the positive commenters. Unbelievable!
Mike's projects are all pretty interesting, but what really sets Mike apart is his attitude - which is perfect for developing a one-off racecar. This car is brand new. There literally is nothing else like it. Mike's willingness to learn from the mistakes and continue to positively develop the Ferrari is what will carry this project forward. This is why the car today and the car tomorrow are going to be very different machines in so many ways. And I can't wait to see that journey.
PS Always willing to see more BMW content too! 🙂
Clearly your drivetrain choice was an excellent one Mike!
Since you were already losing oil pressure, I suspect that a rod bearing going bad started this whole situation, but what I would want to do for sure is look inside the oil pump before you send it in for the additional stage. If the pump is screwed up, that is probably the source of the issue in my mind. Will you be able to fly out to 4-piston to shoot an episode when they tear the engine down?
No need to be defensive about it, you do you and ignore the hate. Amazing project, good job.
Hey Mike looking forward to seeing the results of what they find. I hate guessing however I’m leaning towards an oil pressure issue if I was to guess. I’m not a Honda fan or a Ferrari fan however watching your dedication and commitment is what is more rewarding than anything 👊
I can understand the feeling of wanting to be on track. Just tossed around a GT3 RS on Sonoma Race Track last Saturday and that feeling never goes away 😁
Keep up the hard werk!
B
The only other engine I think that you could have gone with would be a VR6 engine which I had mentioned at the beginning of this project. But given several of your reasons I can see why you didn't do that (cost, ease of making power).
A VR6 is also a cool idea, didn't think of that. One that came to my mind is a 5 cylinder from an RS3. Or a Volvo / Ford Focus RS. Funny that a lot of people missed the way the engine is sitting in the chassis btw, you would think that when you follow a channel like this.. Still think a K is the best choice, love those little 4 bangers performing insane for relatively low costs all over TH-cam (BoostedBoiz, PFI Speed etc)
Vr6 is a better choice, but they dont have reliabilty, but the design is genious, a guy did a 4 piston design, just like the vr6 for a motorcycle and it worked really well.
Volkswagen VR6 power train should fit and is a hell of a tuff engine that can go 1000 hp relatively easy
That was my second option, but the main issue there is that there aren't a ton of them used in road race applications. It means I'd be solving issues myself instead of letting others solve them first - the K series has the advantage of being used in so, so many road race applications that most issues have been discovered and answered for at this point.
@@stanceworks I love my VWs and VR6's, but for racing? i think it's way too complex and delicate engine for that. I think you made the right choice here with the K24 and I don't really think the engine failure can be attributed to that choice.
if you use engine mounts that dampens part of the engine vibrations, it would lower tendency of everything to unscrew
Hay Man , sorry to hear what happend to you , it was a great motor sad to see it blow up after all the hard work, ,i hope that you find out what happend to the K24 ,take care of your self ,
As a purist and tradition follower i don’t personally like this, but watching all the hard work and the passion you put in this project I can just respect what you did and wish you the best for the project!!!! (I have to say, it’s a lil sick after all!)
It’s good that a large audience is behind this car. Had it been an unknown Joe with an identical engine issue… I don’t think we would see this kind of testament in customer service or interest.
I’m glad we are seeing what we are seeing.
Honda tranverse I4 was a no brainer, i know k series are gods own i4 but 700hp road racing still seams like a big ask from a 4cyl. No real expertise just thinking outloud. Car is an amazing build
in my opinion for track high revving nature... keep using the K24 tall deck block...but with k20 shorter stroke crank keeping 2000cc displacement... with longer rod ratio, short stroke, then revving it high up over 10k rpm would be no sweat for engine specced for track competition
You got this! It's good to know you're not giving up on this platform and going to a k20 is a good move! :D
MotoIQ has nice video and article on K24. Mike Kojima recommends destroking K24 so the stroke sits right between k20 and k24. I know others really like K20. Admittedly I'm only halfway through the video so you might address this later. But vibration is probably the huge stroke of 24 in an I4 configuration. Heck I think some people even argue against 3.4 2jz because stroke is too much.
K is a great swap. I think the only longitudinal setup that would fit is Subaru flat4 with transmission rear outputshaft delete. Factory 5 has kit car and I met a guy in Japan with Toyota MR Spyder with EJ20 swap. But K20 > EJ20 and K24 > EJ25. So K swap is still the best
Awesome car, loved the whole series.
I always wonder about the K24 conversions. The K24 has a balancer shaft / oil pump as standard that's removed and replaced with a type s oil pump. That balancer shaft was there for a reason. This engine seems to vibrate a lot without it?? K20 sounds like the ideal route to go.
Really looking forward to seeing the next phase of development
K24 vibrate like mad. I will never do another K24.
Most k20s have the balance shaft oil pumps. My k20z3 does. And my jdm k24a does as well. I Rev the k24a out to 8k without vibration and no problems. Above 8k is when it's needed to remove it.
big end goes big bang - would like to see the surfaces of the big end bearings and crank, but you might not have enough oil volume or pressure if there's spalling on the crank surface, overworked the oil or overheated the bearings aka oil feed
Live and learn!! I like the K choice for an engine, that's probably why I'm a subscriber in the first place. I still hate how it sounds on my TV, maybe it sounds great in person.
Cool project, thanks for tha effort. If the K doesn't work out, a VR30 might be an option. No vibrations.
In the MR2 world (similar packaging constraints) the K-swap is popular, but more popular is the 2GR Toyota V6, which can be supercharged or turbocharged. I think one person has done the Audi 4.2 V8 (ala R8) as well.
Snapped cam? Cant wait for the analysis. Love the series, love the car.
Sure it looks it has something to do with the head
hazaa for the g30-900 -- That is what I have chosen to use in my k24 build also. I look forward to seeing what you come up with in regards to drivability and also figures -- fun before numbers is my thoughts but, be cool to see none the less.
I have an E21 to put it into but..... I am beginning to feel that that car is not really my style anymore and I have been considering a different shell.
I've always liked the style and design of the Subaru Forester GTI... Thoughts??
Sad to see but as you said "shit happens". I own two Honda's with K-24's. An Accord Euro (TSX) and a CR-V. Great to see you aren't playing the "Blame Game". Respect.
I love the transparency of showing what failed. Thanks for sharing
I had always wondered if you could stuff a Porsche flat six in there, but the K just made sense with the weight savings and all of the other components that have to fit back there. Racecar problems lol. Also, any chance we could tag along via episode of the 4 Piston breakdown? That would be really interesting to see.
Would love to see a RealStreet type teardown video. It would be great viewing and good advertising for 4P as well if they are confident in their build.
I love that you did the k swap. A buddy did a k swap E30 and I thought he was crazy until it was done.
1st...I LOVE the build, it's beautiful!!!
2nd...I had been thinking the turbo lag would be an issue. Small twins in place of a larger single....that's where my mind has always been since the start of this build, when it was yellow.
3rd....In the future, if issues with the engine choice persist, give some thought to the N54 from BMW. All of the known issues are largely due to the packaging in a BMW. That Ferrari platform should give easy access to things like the turbos, oil pan gasket, etc. They're cheap to build, the TT setup is amazing, they're torque monsters and that monsterous torque comes on super low in the rpm range. That TT V6, in that package, would be INSANITY.
Good luck!!
I'll stick my neck out and say from the damage a bearing has spun blocking the oil way. Either way it's just one of those things when developing something as you agree . As for engine choice I like the Honda swap , it's iconic and usually unbreakable like the Red top vauxhall 16v or even the 711 block crossflow ford OHV . Yes I'm that old Lol. It may turn out The K24 was let down by a freak small issue and there's no need to change . Strip down will tell , good luck with the rebuild Mike , see even in the UK we take notice !
I think you made a good choice with the K24. Especially when I saw a previous episode where you talk about room in the engine bay. But boy would I have loved to have seen a Honda J35A V6. Good luck. Love your channel.
I forgot to say that I also think the smaller K24 is light and makes less weight in the back of the car. Oh. Please curve the bill on your Ford cap. I think it will look cool.
Ok hear me out 24V 3.2L VR6 with a 6 speed 02M transmission. Cue Scotto. You definitely have looked into all the options, looking forward to seeing what comes.