Trope Talk: Reformed Villains
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ต.ค. 2024
- Everybody loves a villain, or so I've been told. But in my experience, everybody REALLY loves a character that USED to be a villain and got BETTER. Today we'll be talking about some of those lovely people, how they got where they are today, and of course, all the fabulous ways an enterprising writer can toy with such a character and use their unique brand of tragedy to bend their audience's emotions to their whim.
BEFORE YOU ASK: Since about four separate people in my life brought him up, Darth Vader is not in this video because his redemption happened by way of him dying. "Redemption Equals Death" is actually a separate trope from this one - this is about villains AFTER they reform into heroes, not villains that do one heroic thing before dying.
Noteworthy examples used: Prince Zuko, Prince Vegeta (a lot of princes started off evil I guess), honorable mentions go to Scar from Fullmetal Alchemist and roughly two-thirds of the cast of Fairy Tail.
Who's your favorite former-archnemesis-turned-weird-family-member? Let me know!
PATREON: www.patreon.com/user?u=4664797
MERCH LINKS:
Shirts - overlysarcasti...
All the other stuff - www.cafepress.c...
Find us on Twitter @OSPTH-cam!
Nickelodeon: So what route are you planning on going for Zuko.
ATLA Writers: All of them.
Nickelodeon: What . . . . what do ya mean al-
ATLA Writers: *ALL OF THEM*
My favorite thing to see on the internet is the spreadsheet of alignments like choatic good and lawful neutral and all of them are just a picture of Zuko at a different point in the series.
@@whoknows7968 Showing both the complexity of characters and that how good the writers were as all of them still fit with Zuko.
th-cam.com/video/FIEMdQSMEEM/w-d-xo.html
Zuko wasn't even consider until late in development and they realized that the fire lord is to far away to be felt as a threat.
MY HONOR
“But wait! There’s someone you forgot to convince! It’s your audience”
*No, it’s Katara*
That's rough buddy.
And some people ship zutara
@@royalflush5228 It was possible for ten minutes at the end of Season 2...
@@windwalker5765 thanks you for saying that
@@royalflush5228 I mean, not that I’m unhappy with the ending we got, but the writers could’ve potential taken a different direction and made Zutara possible. That being said, in the end, it makes much sense that we got Kataang. Even if I’d get enjoyment from the other ship, it would’ve been messy writing to have it any other way.
My favorite thing about reformed villains is when they spend at least one or two episodes wondering how they didn't beat the heroes when their such goddamn idiots.
While I do love that trope please also consider “Holy fuck I could have died so many times if these people weren’t such paragons”
@@gennybaratta2460 So like, a minor antagonist who doesn't realize how much of a small fry they are compared to more serious threats?
I'm imagining something like this:
"Holy heck, what was that attack? Did you just learn how to do that?"
"No, I've been able to do that for a while."
"Why didn't you ever use it when you were fighting me?"
"If I used it on you you'd die."
" I can't believe we we were losing to you guys! "
“He’s clearly a master of evasive maneuvering”
*cut to Sokka holding the map*
“You have no idea where you’re going, do you?”
@@caroline8590 Also, "I don't know why, but I thought this thing would be a lot faster!" (Zuko referring to Appa)
"Somebody get this kid a hug, a nap, a hot meal, and a god damn friend" Truly Zuko in a nutshell!
Yeah! Put him next to a nice warm fire.
Aang: Will do
@@lukeedbrooke4903 That reminds me of one of the lines from season 1
Aang: Do you think we could have been friends?
Zuko: NO! *Attempts to incinerate the guy he's supposed to capture*
honestly, that was my first thought and consequently mindset for the rest of the show after watching episode 15.
Maybe some therapy too
“Zuko, look! It’s your honor!”
“Where?”
Brilliant.
Hey Zuko, I got you a video game
(Hands him Dishonored)
*Laughs in pure evil*
@@redman7775 that's some hardcore villainy
Redman 777 Ngl the similarities of a (sometimes) masked assassin who has been framed and or lost their honor and now has to restore it are uncanny
zuko in court:
"your honor"
"my what!"
@Derian Setoguchi... That stings..
'A military uniform that incorporates a skull might not belong to the armies of good'
"Hans are we the Baddies?"
It's a matter of perspective, really.
You beat me to it
Exactly what I thought when I heard that!
Funny thing is though the skull isn't just a nazi thing but was actually used as a general symbol in the German army before ww2. Even France Britain and America have used skulls before on military uniforms.
HERESY. THE ARMY OF THE GOD EMPEROR IS ALWAYS RIGHT
Most times: “hey remember that time you tried to kill us?”
DBZ: “hey remember that time you killed us?”
Vegeta: THat's BS! I haven't killed anyone since I got to this stupid planet! ...Not from lack of trying, mind you.
@@Acesahn You killed Nappa. By the way, how’s his Hollywood career going?
You missed something in Zukos motivation for becoming good. His father wants to burn a continent full of people to ashes, people Zuko lived amongst and was treated with decency by, more decency than his own people ever showed him.
So a little push.
He probably should have mentioned that first, like team avatar might straight up let him join just by hearing how horrible his father's plan is as to them it would make sense that people would hate that and reject the plan. (Even zuko)
There's a reason Sokka's the smart guy and not Zuko
But he never brings it up, ever. You can insinuate that's what he feels, but absolutely nothing about his actions proves that he understands how messed up the Fire Nation's actions are. The fact that he turns back to the bad side at the end of Book 2 proves that the injustice to the people outside of his nation isn't strong enough of a motivation for him to join the good side. Throughout the entire series his conflicts is with himself and his own family, never the people who suffer from the war. The only times it's kind of adressed is when the girl's family takes care of Iroh after he was posioned, but during that whole conversation Zuko is brooding about his own problems, and it doesn't look like he cares even a little about how the girl and her family suffered. It's true that in "Zuko alone" he does experience the suffering first hand, but since at the end everyone rejects him once they find out who he is, any empathy he had for them is thrown away
@@100lovenana That's not true. If I remember right Zuko sees a lot of little things about the war and what it does to people. Sure, it's not enough to stop his pursuit of Aang since even by the end of Season 2 he's just that motivated to get his father's attention. But he definitely understands how messed up the war is; it just doesn't manifest in his actions because, as far as he's concerned, the war and capturing Aang are two different things. He wasn't even considered an asset to the Fire nation before Aang showed up again. So when the show starts he's entirely disconnected from the war (and he tries to keep it that way until he is no longer able).
It's only in Season 3 that his need for his father and the actual consequences of the war are directly in conflict with each other. He tries to talk down his Father during the war meeting and touches on what he saw during his banishment (so... he _does_ bring it up), but that only convinces his father to go further. He's clearly affected by it afterwards (it's told out of order in the show, but that's what happens). And overall, if he'd thrown away his empathy, then he wouldn't care to stop his Father from torching the planet. He'd probably leave his family, but if that was his only conflict, why would he risk his life trying to stop them? Why bother gaining Aang's trust? Why aren't those actions proof?
@100lovenana actually he does bring it up when he tells his father he attempt to leave the fire nation.
“Growing up, we were taught that the Fire Nation was the greatest civilization in history, and that somehow, the war was our way of sharing our greatness with the rest of the world. What an amazing lie that was. The people of the world are terrified by the Fire Nation. They don’t see our greatness. They hate us!“
At the beginning, Zuko like the rest of the fire nation just see the fire nation as the greatest thing ever.
But after seeing the world for himself, and what the fire nation actually is, he starts seeing the truth.
He does make the bad decision in Ba Sing Se, because at this point his desire to be recognized by his father was still strong, but actually getting to live among the rest of the world population was one (of *several*) factor.
"But there's someone you forgot to convince...it's your audience."
The audience? Screw that guy, he owes me $5.
but I already payed you by buying your book
Oh, hi, Disney, didn't see you come in there!
I'll convince the audience when I'm convinced you've fixed that damn door
Convince the audience? Ill do that when you fix that bookshelf
@@ronjayrose9706 Nice Spiderman reference
Remember when Appa licks Zuko and everyone is so confused and Zuko is soaked and partially traumatized from his huge tongue showing affection. Appa liked him and was thanking him for setting him free when he was chained up. Animals remember these things. Loved that scene.
7:06 - "that blood loss is suspiciously rusty water under the bridge"
This might be my favorite mixed metaphor ever.
Please explain.
Same
@@manekou3303
The phrase "water under the bridge" means that the event in question is in past, that the person has moved on from the subject in question. Blood contains iron which is normally protected from rusting or 'Oxidizing' due to the controlled environment of the body. When blood is removed the body, say, with a sword, the iron in the blood is exposed to air and water and can rust like normal iron. So that suspiciously rusty iron joke is like someone having this conversation:
G:"Oh that fighting's all in past."
V:"There's literally a puddle of your blood right there."
G:"That's old blood now, I've moved on."
V:"IT'S STILL WET!"
@@voltronimusprime3833 thank you so much.
It is actually at 7:11
6
3
6
"So you see, we're trying to overthrow an evil god before she eats the sun."
"...I just wanted your wallet"
I feel like I've read this before. Isn't this from the Kane Chronicles?
@@RHKang-hl3ps yeah, I think it is
Lol
This is basically Dedede.
That, or some early Dragon Ball baddies like Yamcha and Tenshinhan.
That's how Asmo met Daenir, lol.
“Somebody get this kid a hug, a nap, a hot meal, and a goddamn friend.”
That’s how I feel about all my favorite characters.
Todoroki,Sasuke???
That happens way too often, like they NEED a hug
Nishat Lamisa Athoi everyone needs a hug.
*FREE HUGS!*
*sends virtual hug*
I just want everyone to be happy . . .😭
You forgot to mention that villains always have the best songs.
*_We are number one!_*
Andrew Ramlall Hell's Bells is Subarashii.
(Yes, I know this song wasn't actually used in the show)
BILL CIPHER'S IT'S GONNA GET WEIRD!!
Prince Ali, yes it is he, but not as you know him...
P is for Priceless, the look upon your faces
E is Extinction, of all your puny races...
"...getting the evil gunk scrubbed off by a friendship laser..."
Dear God I can't believe how accurate that description was.
FrIeNd ShIp Is StUpId MaGiC
@@strangent404a7 You clearly have no idea about what this show is about, kid 0_0
You are aware that Alicorns are dark sorcerers? So called "friendship lasers" are in fact form of dark magic, what in synchronization with elements of harmony is used to reverse damage cause by dark magic itself. Ponies don't brainwash everyone, but only those corrupted by darkness on the first place. Most redemption arcs are basic, because true redemption arc is about protagonists who almost all were villains in the past. One of exception of that is Discord, who in fact never was the villain, but most people think otherwise not aware that his goal always was to reveal Daybreaker's evil plot, before finding one that she has none.
TheRezro dude. It’s a TF2 quote. Lay off.
Also what the hell are you talking about? Alicorn dark magic, where in the show was this said or are you just talking out of your ass?
@@TheRezro The award for taking a children's show about talking ponies way to seriously goes to....
to be fair the real problem normally has to be worked though over time, the friendship lazer seemingly just gets rid of anger and the power of anger.
but yea, giant friendship lazer for the win (:
I knew she was gonna mention zuko, he is like the
king of reformed villains... or the firelord of reformed villains
The whole fire nation is technically a reformed villain so...
I bring you, Megamind
@@azekia Legends Of Korra be like:
Everything changed when the Fire Nation got their shit together.
She's gotta force in Avatar The last Airbender somehow
@@justalilbugman I mean it is a great example in so many cases, atla has so many tropes pulled off so well and it never tries to subvert or change them it just embraces them.
We need a story where the villain gets redeemed, only to have to fight the now fallen hero at the end. Ideally, we'll be too focused on the villain redemption to notice the signs in the hero until a second viewing. Imagine suddenly realizing Ed Elric became the bad guy when we weren't looking, and we had to root for Envy to kill him. It would be twisting the whole knifeblock if done right.
So like Luke turning to the dark side with Anakin on the good side?
Huo yuan jia started off good then turned bad and finally redeems himself later on
Oooooooooh
No but yes but A H H
Didn’t the manga Magi do this? Well something similar to this. SPOILERS for magi manga..........
when sinbad, the hero, became evil and now the protagonist and the redeemed reform villains now had to fight him.
That's the plot of megamind
you forgot the most important reformed villains, Megamind
Villain? He was a reformed SUPERVILLAIN!
What about the greatest reformed villain
Dr. Doofenshmirtz
He never was REALLY evil.
@@RubyCarrots3232 He stole caused chaos and caused people huge inconvenience, or do you think Bernard wanted to be stuck for months in dehydrated state, that' assuming Megamind ever bothered to re hydrate him.
Salt Tea one of my favorite movies oh god
It’s 2020 and I still will never shut up over Zuko’s development. His entire arc is literally the best arc. I love him so much.
ATLA & FMA:B are probably some of the best character driven shows I've ever seen.
Zuko is pretty much the only character that I have no problems whatsoever with people being obsessed with.
I’d argue Catra’s redemption arc in SPOP is either tied with or a close second to Zuko’s redemption arc.
It really speaks volumes that a children's cartoon wrote a better character arc than most "sophisticated grown up" shows and movies. From an English scholar's perspective, it is a nearly perfect character arc. So no, you should not shut up about it.
@@maxfieldjoyner5244 what's SPOP
The myth of consensual Joining the Good Guys:
Reformed Villain: "I consent!"
Good Guy Gang: "I consent!"
The Audience: "I don't!"
Isn't there somebody you forgot to ask?
"Vegetalo, we'd be glad to have you on our team"
"Guys, Vegetalo killed my entire family. Remember that scene where he was like..."
"LOOK UPON YOUR DEAD FAMILY, SOSKE BOSKE, EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM SLAIN BY MY HAND"
guess I was a little 'vegetaloco' back then
I read that as vegetable
prozd aye
“FUCK YOU SOSUKE BOSUKE
I HATE YOU SO MUCH
I WILL NEVER REGRET THIS”
But sosuke, he has a funny moustache now!
A reformed villain? Oh man, like Zuko! I hope she'll mention Zuko
"Let's take Prince Zuko as an example"
Hell yeah
I opened my dictionary to "awesome", and it had a picture of Prince Zuko.
Zuko is the bomb.com
*Look at video title* "Oh, cool, they did that with Zuko, it was awesome."
10:37
Ikr? Zuko = best. Zuko is king (firelord, whatever)
Hey! Why not make your own awesome characters? That's a lot more fun than harping on the epicness of a single one.
...Also,
I wonder if she'll mention Zuko...
"Let's talk about Prince Zuko"
JUST WHAT I WANTED
I bet Red's adding Prince Zuko
Lmao she literally said that as I read this. Awesome.
i mean he's like the best example of reformed villian his arc just kicks ass because of playing with heel run tropes
Like 3 to 4 times.... because he is just that good of an example.
THAYS WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY LOL
Villain: You see... I was treated terribly by my family!
Hero: What does that have to do with those 50 orphans you killed?
Villain: Well, the thing is... shit.
Jake Peralta: "Cool motive, still murder."
Hey, at least my OC Sayo was just kinda cranky meanwhile she went through crazy brutal shit
"I saved them from dealing with terrible families!"
Count Olaf
“They didn’t have families… I was jealous.
the first thing that came to mind when Red said "they seemed to have retained some old habits" was:
"Sun, we don't kill people."
"I think you mean *you* don't kill people."
No you’re a Buddhist now. Buddhists don’t kill people
(I think)
What show is that from?
Overly Saracastic Production's miscellaneous myths about the Journey to the West.
Ahh, thanks!
The Amazing Nol the best part, while actively snapping somebody's neck.
A quote I heard from somewhere that I think describes Avatar: The Last Airbender's redemption arc really well:
"We came in at the beginning for Aang. But we stayed until the end for Zuko."
Zuko is the best character, hands down. I was surprised by the amount of growth that the main trio has throughout the series. And Uncle Iroh is just someone everyone needs in their lives lol
and to clarify the main trio is sokka,momo and appa
...yeah, that's pretty much how it went for me. Aang and his shenanigans were nice and all, but over time, Zuko's story held my attention more.
Azula was great us well
Came for the history, stayed for the mythology, and now trope talk is my favourite series.
i think that explains most of the fan base
Trope talk's my favorite, but I discovered then in reverse order.
Its funny because I was introduced through Trope Talks. XD
Luke van Kleef, that's interesting. I found them history first because I was researching something for a book I'm writing and found it helpful so I subscribed not even knowing about the other series. The mythology was a nice surprise because I borrow a lot from myth in my writing and obviously plot tropes are interesting for a writer so... the perfect channel. It's everything I already spend time researching, all in one place!
honestly
You know who was the best villain with layers, evil plans, and great fight scenes
Dr. Doofenshmirtz
Hamburger Sandwich
And don't forget the backstory and songs! A villain is nothing without either of those.
@@longliveplanetawesome3223 tell that to Johan liebert or joker
“You hot dog is not as great as my bratwurst”
Great one liners down.
YES.
straight facts
"Hans?"
"Yeah?"
"Have you looked at our caps recently?"
"No, why?"
"They have skulls on them. Hans, are we the baddies?"
Hans - No! We fight to secure the future existance of our people. Should we fail in our fight tens of millions of our own will die by the hands of our enemies.
The Allies where the bad guys. (talking about leadership not grunts)
@@gunarsmiezis9321 - Are you seriously taking the stance of a Nazi sympathizer? Please tell me you're joking.
@@gunarsmiezis9321 If Nazi Germany had won the war, a lot of people would have suffered anyways. The Soviets were bad, but that doesn't mean the Nazis were good for opposing them.
In my opinion, Imperial Germany should have won WW1, that would remove both the USSR and the Nazis.
@@gunarsmiezis9321 If Germany had won then a lot of people would have suffered just as others did under the USSR, but all across Europe rather than just the east.
@@PsychShrew I and everyone I know, would take nazi occupation over boļševik occupation any day.
I feel like the bottom line of this trope talk is "Avatar did it right." xD
@Ham Family Certainly not
To be fair, that could be the point of almost every trope talk
@Ham Family
Avatar never fails
The more I hear of that show the more I need to watch it
@@aiiiia9971 Definitely watch it if you can! I didn't watch it until quarantine and the hype is very accurate
Concept: A villain tries to do a "redemption equals death", but is stopped by one of the heroes, not because the hero in question particularly values the villain's life, but because the hero considers dying to do one good thing after all the bad that the villain has done to be a cheap way of avoiding responsibility, and instead demands that the villain actually work to make amends and undo the damage that they've done, saying something like this:
"You want to just do one good thing, die, and be remembered as a good person, as if none of the evil you've done counts. But you don't get to do that. Every bad thing you've ever done still happened, and being heroic in the last five minutes after a lifetime of evil doesn't make you a good person. You have to own up to what you did, and undo as much of it as you can, no matter how long it takes. You have to work to become a better person. Dying is easy, but living with the consequences of your actions is hard. I'm not letting you take the easy way out."
I agree
Watch Monster.
Yet Luke from Percy Jackson’s is remembered as a hero
Honestly, in that scenario, I’d rather them die because it’d feel vindictive on the heroes’ part to keep them alive.
If they’re going to let them live, it should be a good thing.
@@pn2294 It is a good thing, because now the villain is taking responsibility and trying to undo or make up for what they've done, instead of getting to take a coward's way out of responsibility for their actions.
10:57
"Snape, you traitor!"
"Yes, Harry, I am a traitor! Because I'm about to betray someone... right... NOW!!!" (stabs nearby Death Eater)
Watch A Very Potter Musical, it's great.
ayyyyy, starkid
THAT'S ABSUUUUURD!
This is the literal last place I expected an AVPM reference, but I'm cool with it!
Thankfully, Dumbledore’s in Pigfarts
The stages of watching a Trope Talk video:
1. Watch the video all the way through and listen to Red's analysis.
2. Re-watch it and pause to enjoy all of the pictures and visual jokes.
That's actually the stages with ALL of Red's videos. Miscellaneous Myths included
I Do that too xD
Actually I pause and rewind my first watch.
ESPECIALLY 0:44! c':
“Hey, they did this with Zuko too, god that show is good” 10:37
If that ain’t a mood
*Sees title*
Me: I wonder if she'll talk about Zuko?
Red: Let's take Prince Zuko from Avatar as a good example
Me: HELL YEAH!
Edit: That to talk. Thanks, IamPandora Bitches.
This comment is hilarious, but you wrote down “that” instead of “talk.” Just wanted to let you know so you can change it. :)
@@iampandorabitches1912 And change they didn't
@@Norirane been a long time, it is
Seriously, "Airbender" is a paragon of great story-telling.
Red: Let's take Prince Zuko-
*called it*
on the topic of zuko, the reason he works so well on a fundamental level is because he is the second protagonist. You can tell from the care put into his character and the similarities to aang that they have the same narrative weight, and that is conveyed without a shred of doubt to the audience. Even if they oppose each other, neither character is a villain, only the circumstances surrounding zuko can really be called villainous. Team avatar are all important, but it is clear even without retrospect that aang and zuko are a much larger focus for the story than the rest of the group. Aang and Zuko are foils, but there is so little difference that said foil is reflective.
Another interesting foil element between Aang and Zuko: Zuko occasionally does the honorable thing in his villainy, while Aang occasionally does the dishonorable thing in his heroism. This is as early as Episode _Two,_ where Zuko makes and keeps a deal while Aang breaks it. Another pair that springs to mind is Aang's lie at the end of The Great Divide and Zuko being the Blue Spirit. From my perspective, Zuko is a deal-keeper and truth-teller, even when it actively harms his cause, like at the end of Zuko Alone. By contrast, Aang is selfish, a liar, and someone who unthinkingly makes problems for others to clean up. When Zuko's a villain, this simply makes their contrasts interesting. After he becomes a full-on hero, he suddenly becomes the justifiably Best Character. As the show went on, the only reason why we felt we couldn't fully root for Zuko was because he was one the Bad Guys' side because his bad personality traits were balanced by his good ones. Then Season 3 rolls around and Aang becomes a piece of shit, to a certain degree, while Zuko only has upward movement.
Next video should be heroes going to the dark side, obviously.
Want to see a show that did that perfectly? Watch Cardfight Vanguard (Yes, it's a cardgame anime, but a dang good cardgame anime)
VampCoffee I'll consider doing it as my next trope talk
VampCoffee Dark Swan and Dark Hook
Oh, they don't do that. Stupid plebs like dem heroes too much!
Also, going to the dark side is (usually) a depressing turn of events for the readers, so ending a book with that is... well, a dick move, and it won't sell that well.
Although, if you have the marketing power of G.R.R Martin, then you can literally sell porn as religious low fantasy.
Pumpernickel Rye I'll consider talking about Griffith in my character disection video after my next trope talk
Can we just hand the "best reformed villain" award to Zuko already? I mean, ATLA was fantastic. It made you want the good guys to win while also making you question the morality and affects of them winning. It made you take war seriously. And yet it was still so entertaining. Just, ah man, that show...
Vader I beleive is the best in meaning, but Zuko is the best as this trope
Zuko is king!
I cannot write more about him because i haven't got the time to write a 1000+ pages essay right now, ok? ;P
Even as a kid it always made me think in the early seasons "Hm, Sakka's kind of benderest against the fire nation, they aren't all bad, just have bad leaders" which just showed how it makes even KIDS think about political issues that have been important for centuries.
Vegeta and spike from buffy are a tough contest.
And Illyria from angel.
I absolutely want a villain who's reform starts with waking up and looking at his military uniform and going "when did my insignia become an angry flaming skull? Am I the bad guy?"
Or try to read the bible and other theological book
@@gandalflotr2898 Why bring religion in to this? Sounds like it'll just bog down the movie with alagory to me.
@@Draiocht012 well the religion story got some best redemption
And the moral of the story is that Avatar: The Last Airbender is the best.
Ready Player One- play less videogames, so you can watch more Avatar
Percy jackson- You might not know whats gonna happen, even if it's ordained. so finish watching Avatar
LazyTown- Exercise more, so you can copy the Avatar characters moves.
Voltron- Teamwork is great, so bond while watching Avatar
Super Smash Brothers Subspace Emissary- Villains can be your best friends, like how Zuko made the third season of avatar as good as it was AND JUST WATCH IT RIGHT FREAKING NOW
and Kylo Ren is the Worst Zuko rip off ever!
*reads title* did someone say PRINCE ZUKOOOOOOO
Ooooooooohhhhhhhhhhh yes!
I though you image was papaleta
HONOR
Confirmed: Zuko is the best written character ever.
Sorry, was there even a contest?
Honour restored.
Zuko is amazing
Iroh is also amazingly written
*Inhales*
HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOUUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!
My personal favourite type of reformation is where the villain actually gets along really well with the heros when they're not fighting and have some really good dynamics with them. Bonus points if they have to team up to fight some dude that threatens both the villain and the hero. Also, to me, a redemption is alot more believable when the villain has nothing personal against the hero. If it's more of a 'listen dude, im just doing this because my boss told me too'.
"obviously Iroh is not his 'insane awful family'" ♥
No, Iroh is his "Adorable AWESOME Family."
Anymore. He joked about what he would do when he brought down the walls of Ba Sing Se. He even declared himself "a different man" from the last time he was there.
@@bluesbest1 You just made me realize Iroh is a reformed villain
Uncle Iroh is best family
He still had a complicated past where he almost destroyed Ba Sing Se, killed who knows how many as a General in the Fire Nation, and got his own son killed in his invasion. Afterwards he became the most righteous dude, but he too is a product of his environment like Zuko when we meet him
It's also annoying when former villains who could pose a major threat to the protagonist become or seem significantly weaker when they complete their redemption arc.
Triple Catnip This is usually a result of the newly reformed villain showing moral or personal restraint, and thus don't use their abilities or mind to murder others. Venom only knocks out and immobilizes antagonists as a hero, but had no problem tackling someone and biting their head off as a villain. It happens in many works, but not all.
When I redeemed The Shadow(No relation to Sega), he kept all of his personality and power and effectively became the most badass 'good guy' that I've made.
Hey, Bladewolf's on your side!
Cool!
We took away his chainsaw!
Excuse me, WHAT?
@@AvalynTheAccursed Would you care to elaborate on that statement?
@@bluesbest1 The Shadow is a character for a game I've been working on. He USED to be a MAJOR antagonist, but after he was originally defeated and supposedly killed, he had some time to reflect on the horrible things that he had done while he was regenerating. And he realized that he was kind of a dick. So he made nice with the main characters and joined them. In fact, Shadow VERY often comes at really nasty times to help out. Usually when I'm looking for a character to come in and start whooping the bad guy's ass to save someone or something, I turn to Shadow. Hell, at one point, he even whooped one of my most powerful villains!
"Good bad guy pretending to be a bad guy to thwart both the heros and the villians"
"Ssssnape"
Yes!
He's still an asshole but hey cool char
And the green hornet
I hate to love that guy. And that makes me like him more!
Hell yeah!
Zuko has one of the best arcs in fiction, period. Also one of the best character redesigns.
"Ironically, I once hired a man with a similar ability to kill the avatar myself."
Priceless callback in TLOK.
Zuko is honestly one of my all time favorite characters because of his complexity and how he teeters back and forth between bad and good through almost the whole series. And the way Team Avatar responds to his various changes is also amazing. Just...Zuko /cries
Same here. In my opinion he's one of the best written characters I've seen, and hands down has the most believable redemption arc. It's sadly somewhat rare to see characters struggle with that choice and going back and forth so much, but in Zuko, it was beautiful to see him arrive at his own conclusion after two and a half seasons of struggle and mistakes.
As far as Avatar goes, Zuko is my all-time second favorite (behind Uncle Iroh, because Uncle Iroh). I have never seen a fictional character undergo so dramatic a change before or since.
I think Peridot is a good middle-of-the-road example. She definitely turns because the heroes showed her the light, so to speak, but in the end it has to be her choice to stand up to Yellow Diamond.
Kiapet 2 Peridot is similar to Vegeta.
I mean, the show is stuffed full of Dragonball Z references, and she's a short former villain with crazy big hair.
It also pulled off the JK still good scenario in the span of like 11 minutes.
Litearly any villan in Steven universe is areformed villan
Even the show's big doomsday device is a reformed villain!
I would love a trope talk on just “Redemption”, more specifically on the idea of whether certain characters “deserve” redemption. I’ve just seen so much bs discourse on ppl arguing whether a specific unnamed character in BNHA deserves to be redeemed or not, I’d really love your take on it.
*cough* Arthur Morgan *cough*
What does BNHA stand for?
@Sorow Fame Boku no Hero Academia. It’s a manga and an anime and is called My Hero Academia in English.
Isn't redemption, by its own definition, not something that someone "deserves"?
@@matthewmuir8884 hmm now that u mention it yeah as its the action of gaining something
My favorite type of reformed villains are the “how dare you infect me with morals”. It’s just so fun
Hehe, agreed. "I REALLY. Hate. People. They are, without question, a complete _writeoff_ of a species, _and how dare you make me care about them?!"_
You forgot to mention my favorite type of redeemed villain: the villain who wasn't actually as bad as you originally thought and only seemed to be evil because of circumstances or because you only ever see them when they are at their worst or because you only really get to view them through the eyes of a morally righteous hero. Usually, these characters are actually morally grey and are neither explicitly good or evil, and tend to be some of the best and most complex characters in all of fiction. My personal favorite example of this trope is Jaime Lannister, although there are probably other great examples as well.
That describes Professor Severus Snape to a T.
Styxx from the Dark Hunters
The best example of this is Itachi Uchiha from Naruto.
Yes yes yessssss i was waiting for someone to talk abt *Jaime foooking Lannister*
That's still literally Zuko though.
Godammit this is like the 5th youtuber I've stumbled on in the last month who gushes over Avatar. I'm going to have to just buckle up and binge the whole thing, aren't I?
Do it, if you like/don't mind animation, you will not regret it. It's a really beautiful show, both in story and in visuals.
YEP! It starts out kinda typical kids show but stick with it till at least Jet's episode and you'll start to see what all the fuss is about.
DO IT IT IS SO WORTH IT
11 months later...how was it??
We need to know if you followed through!
10:58
"'Still very evil'?"
"I panicked! And it worked, didn't it?"
"It really shouldn't have."
“It really shouldn’t have” Every idiotic Shōnen plan ever that miraculously works
I love how in every single villain trope talk Avatar: The Last Airbender comes up
Pretty much EVERY trope talk, full stop 😆 I'm curious though when people say "That means it's a super great show!!" As if the mere presence of tropes is somehow an imprimatur of greatness...? Whereas calling a media property "trope-y" is normally used an insult. There seems to be some successful subversion of tropes in ATLA, which certainly takes good writer skills, but a lot more playing them straight, which to me feels more like paint-by-numbers or writer bingo...?
@@anna_in_aotearoa3166when a show handles a trope (almost) perfectly, you don't analyze it because it's a good example, but because it has set the example for other shows/ us writers to follow. As in to take inspiration, not to be a formulaic writer.
@@quak8246 Think I see what you mean - ATLA is being cited so often not just because it uses tropes, but because they're used well...?
@@anna_in_aotearoa3166it’s the best example of alot of tropes. Redeemed villain? Zuko is the among the best in modern fiction. 5 man band? Not until the end, but it’s still great. Etc, etc
I keep seeing this confusion happen.
The ANTAGONIST is in direct conflict with the PROTAGONIST (main character)
While a VILLAIN, is a character whose evil actions or motives are important to the plot.
The key difference between the two is such, a villain can be the protagonist.
Yeah, exactly. Villains are evil. Antagonists are against the main character, but don't HAVE to be evil.
Ainz ooal gown sends his regards.
What I got out of this video: God I want to watch Avatar again
Redeemed Villains are probably my fav type of characters when done right...its just interesting to see someone come back from the depths of hell and see how theyll change.
I just love to stab your puny hearts and twist that knife further...and further...and further.
This is why I take great joy out of making characters like Azula, Ken, and Cynder, out as total psychopaths, who treat their love interests as disposable pawns.
A fun way to play with this trope is to introduce the ‘bad guy’ to the aduience AFTER their redemption arc and slowly show in backstory/ allude to their dark past over time, it can give ya some interesting audience recations when they realize their perfect angle actually fomes with a lot of baggage
like rose/pink from SU or Virgil from Sander Sides
Dalinar?
While he wasn’t really a bad guy, Trace Heartnet had this in the manga. You don’t realize that the goofy dude who acts like a cat was one of the coldest killers in the world until you see his eyes when he caps a dude for killing a criminal under his protection and pissing him off. That was in the first chapter, but it doesn’t go into detail about him until later.
Train*. Why the hell did autocorrect put Trace?
Literally Dalinar Kholin from Stormlight Archive
"Suspiciously rusty water under the bridge."
What a choice line that is. :)
What about when a reformed villain becomes part of a five man band? They'd be best fit as the Lancer, but I'm partial to one who is overcome with such guilt they end up being the Heart
Hey they did this with Zuko too
Like Lancer?
@@32th yeah he was the lancer.
When Aang disappeared, he took over as leader. Plus he’s a foil to Aang from the beginning of the series, and vice versa.
They'd also be a pretty natural Big Guy, assuming they don't get depowered when changing sides. They've been presumably fighting on-par with the entire rest of the team until recently, so they're most likely able to solve problems anybody else in the team would struggle with.
Have you read the Promise?It is a comic addressing " What happens when your reformed villain (Zuko in this case) disagrees with the rest of the squad on a complex issue?"
I only just finished reading it, so I don't know the general consensus, but tbh Zuko was in the right and I was so annoyed that everyone was getting angry at him.
Comic by who and where can it be read?
If the comics, specifically the post-canon comics, weren't literal garbage, I'd be inclined to read it. Unfortunately, there's too much universal character assassination for me to even consider any of it.
Something I wanna see more of is villains who realize “Oh, I f***ed up.” And then die. No super-special redemptive action, just an acknowledgment they majorly screwed up.
So...Arthas?
Technically that would fall under redemption = death right?
Or at least death = sympathy idk
@Shearman77 uhhh…wak-fu, I think? That’s hearsay though.
I know I’m 2 years late, but The Dragon Prince did something spectacularly well like this in its newest season. I won’t be specific, but it’s great. No redemption, just acceptance of the deeds and the consequences
I did this with one of my own villains
Zuko this, Zuko that, Zuko Zuko Zuko XD!!
I don't blame you. Zuko is an amazing character.
"heartfelt chat with the hero where he learned their side of things." In anime parlance we call this Talk-no-jutsu. This is Naruto's greatest power. Which pairs very nicely with his power of friendship.
yeah but atleast naruto did it way better than any other power of friendship
@@alfa01spotivo no they really didn’t soul eater did friendship way better
I always end up reforming my villains because, in the words of a wise monster... "ONCE YOU NAME IT, YOU START GETTING ATTACHED TO IT! NOW PUT THAT THING BACK WHERE IT CAME FROM OR SO HELP ME!"
Too true... U_U
Thank you Mike Wazowski. I salute you.
The whole of Xena: Warrior Princess is the story of a redeemed villain. She used to be a fallen hero black knight style villain and has a crisis of conscience and begins adventuring to make up for years of villainy.
And in the related Hercules series she spends some time being an actual villain.
Three ways to do a reformed villain well:
*1.* The villain helps the heroes, but pays for their evil deeds with their life in the end. This method should be reserved only for villains who've done truly unforgivable things like Darth Vader & Vegeta.
*2.* The Villain is defeated, but has to endure the ire of everyone around them and earn their trust over time. Villains who have done bad things, but still have the potential for good like Ken Ichijouji and Sunset Shimmer benefit from this method.
*3.* The hero saves the villain's life and so the villain is indebted to the hero. This method tends to work best for villains who were taught to fight on one side but still have their own conscience and feel the need to repay the other side when the other side shows them kindness. Dinobot and Ilia Amitola are prime examples of this.
Third option: In more complex stories, multiple factions may exist. Former antagonists may through circumstances end up teaming up with the protagonists against a mutual enemy. Classic examples are Scar and Greed from Fullmetal Alchemist.
True
Exactly. I agree specially with the 1st type of antagonist.
If a guy killed even just a single person (for whatever reason), he/she *should* pay for what he/she did. Perhaps not by death, but by constantly being tormented by his own nightmares or by the “ghosts” of his past, or, perhaps, by the law itself.
And, in case of someone that killed dozens, hundreds or even thousands/millions of innocent people, it simply would be stupid for a writer to want for that kind of antagonist to suddenly “become good” (perhaps repentance is an option, but still, a killer’s a killer, someone that’s crazy and has very little possibilities of *actually* realizing what he/she had done).
The Evil Queen, AKA Regina, from Once Upon A Time is a great example of number two.
Regarding the first option; it's also okay if they face trial and imprisonment/ some other form of punishment so they can atone. That's a bit more iffy and less dramatic, but it works too.
"maybe a military uniform that incorporates a skull might not be good guys."
looks at the entire imperium of man
Compared to everyone else they are the good guys
@@blackvial Deep grey is less dark then pure, undilluted extra-black, this is true. Them being "Good" guys, ehhh....... they have a few of those. And a whole lot of villians.
Tau?
@@neilcaiman1174 The more they delve into Tau backstory the more "actually these guys are also the bad guys" they get.
I think the Orks are probably the heroes of the 41st millenium. Which also probably explains why they live in a galaxy that is basically their vision of a perfect afterlife.
@@a-blivvy-yus what did the tau do?
me: please mention Zuko please mention Zuko please...
Red: Let's take Zuko from Avatar
me: YES!!! :D
I think you missed another "oh no did they revert?" Option which is, "it's all a big misunderstanding, they were doing something good but the good guys were being overly suspicious."
1:56
"Let's take Prince Zuko from Avatar...."
Me: Yesssss
zuko is my definition of "redemption ark"
it has got to be the best darn character development in the history of character development, maybe ever
I agree 100%
One Thou Wou i dont think it was the DNA thing. Because Uncle Iroh became good despite Iroh didnt have good people DNA.
One Thou Wou but i see your point.
Okay this is getting outta hand
Maybe ever
Nobody:
Some people: Megamind isn’t really a reformed villan
Me, an intellectual: *P R E S E N T A T I O N*
Wait, some people argue Megamind isn't a reformed villain? Wasn't that the entire point of the movie?
Their argument is W R O N G
@@SorowFame I’d actually argue that Megamind wasn’t a villain. He was pushed into evil from the day he landed on Earth, and once he actually got people who cared about him, he really really wanted to be good. His attachment to evil is 100% based on what other people assigned him as, even Minion.
@@zedudedaniel I’d say that he’s still a villain in that he did villainous things, if you didn’t consider someone a villain because they were pushed into evil rather than choosing it tonnes of villains would no longer fit the classification.
@@SorowFame That’s not that many. And besides, Megamind’s attachments to evil are mostly superficial. Being dramatic, kidnapping reporters, dark clothes with spikes. When Metroman ‘dies’, everything he does is mostly just childish fooling around and he quickly grows bored.
Jellal is the only reformed villain in Fairy Tail that I actually sympathize with, not only is he the only one who technically wasn't even responsible for the things he did, but he is also the only one who has to actually deal with the consequences of his actions.
Yeah, I get that. Both Laxus and Gajeel switch sides really quickly (although Laxus does disappear for a while). Granted, the part of the show when they were villains was very clearly aimed at a younger audience, and they were already established characters by the time the show started taking itself more seriously
Laxus definitely had a case of “spoiled brat syndrome”. He took it too far with his tantrum, but I did expect him to straighten himself out at the end. Gajeel was a surprise to me (I watched Fairy Tail before I got used to how shounen manga do things) which is why I actually bought him being a spy for Raven Tail before he passed the info off to Makarov.
yeah thats pretty true for most villains, the only other exception i can see is the dragon twins, they killed there parents but both were basically forced on them by there respective dragons. the stuff sting did after killing their master was something but he was also being manipulated by minerva
One of my favorite scenes in One Piece is when Robin basically bribes her way into the straw hats in a few minutes and it's entirely played for laughs.
I loved Helmeppos Redemption - which was only in form of a cover story xD
Also don't forget Franky! Everybody hated him in Water 7!
…Why, was Nico a villain before that?
@@JaelinBezel she was Crocodile's (Alabaster arc's main villian) right hand woman and she 'killed' one of the side character (although it's revealed she didn't actually kill him because almost nobody dies in one piece)
@@christina_1313 In retrospect, while Franky was an ass, the Strawhats are pirates, so nobody can really complain about what happens when bounty hunters steal their money. Besides, Franky stole 200 million berries and beat up Usopp, and in return the Strawhats trashed his house and beat up his people. Fair is fair.
Still really enjoyed that brawl, though. Watching the Strawhats act like actual pirates was great.
"Yeah, you beat my boss. That means I have a chance to get where I want to go with you guys. So let's do this." Turned into "I actually like these guys and will murder everyone who messes with them" and we love her for it
"I suffer from... Cruelladevilitis"
WOW this panel aged well.
What if..... The villain was never really the villain, they turned out to be more heroic and considerate than the hero (who was technically a villain since they gave no thought to their surroundings and did whatever they could to reach their goals) but not a lot of people realized it until they got together and really thought about it.
Imagine the villain looks like the hero and vice versa. It always confuses the newbies
J Sings To add to this, Lisa: The Painful RPG does that really well too. A brilliant, crazy, and heartbreaking game.
Longest title ever
Like Burnt Ivory King and King Vendrick?
sleeping Jellyfish I've made a story which the heroes are technically villans
This video in a nutshell: "Hey they did this with Zuko too!"
tldw: “When in doubt, be Zuko”
I kid
I just KNOW Zuko is gonna come up here.
Edit: wow ok that was quick
Ninjago loves to kill off it's villains, especially in a major act of self-sacrifice like letting go of the realm crystal or saving a kid from your fate. It kills off it's reformed baddies so much that I honestly keep forgetting that the main protagonist is one of those reformed baddies. Sure, he just wanted to be evil because his dad is and his idea of "evil" is just stealing candy and playing pranks, but he was a fairly major antagonist for the beginning of season 1(or rather, he THOUGHT he was a major antagonist), and that really weirds me out. It's something the show does sort of bring up in later seasons but I don't think the fandom talks about it enough.
In season 11, Lloyd looks into this mirror that shows you your worst personal fear (sorta like a reverse mirror of erised), and he sees his father. That is just... fascinating to me, because if we're talking Young Lloyd, his dad is someone he'd more likely see in the actual mirror of erised (either as himself or just standing there with him because the kid is lonely and sad)! WHY DO WE NOT TALK ABOUT THIS!?
8:26 Red: "Now that the bad guy in question is emotionally stable and probably not wearing quite so much black"
Me: Looks at closet. Naw looking this rad is worth being evil.
Why _do_ the bad guys get all the cool costumes tho? 🤔
_Yes I'm looking at you, Nazi Germany!_
They can still wear black… just, maybe tone down the blood red lining.
OMG Thank you for talking about Zuko and Avatar! I literally just decided last week that I was gonna research the whole series for the first time in years and its still just as good as it was when I was a kid! love you and your funniness!
Snape would have been perfect for that last “back to evil but is actually still good in the end”
maybe if Rowling had any convincing characters who weren't Hermione pre-epilogue.
snape is just a shitty person. he wasn't redeemed
But he was never actually a hero by choice, and even then he's done some shitty stuff
Because after Umbridge, Snape was the most evil character in Harry Potter.
@@gloweye Voldemort is the most evil character
"A friendship laser or something." I've never had the first two episodes of mlp described so perfectly before. I love Luna, but the two parter that set up her character really sucked.
Fairy Tail- 20 Years later: "Daddy, how did you and mommy meet?"
"Umm... I nailed her to a tree... Don't worry about it. Go play."
To be fair though, Fairy Tail did to a pretty good job of telegraphing which villains would be redeemed, and only two of them actually "joined the team." The rest either became friendly rivals, or (in the case of Crime Sorcery) anti-heroes who mostly helped the team based on circumstance.
And the ones who really deserved to die all did.
Yeah, and it does a decent job easing Gajeel into a less antagonist role, with him not being trusted by anyone but Juvia for pretty a long time
Plus Rogue and Sting weren’t actually villains as the video suggests, they were just antagonists because it’s a tournament arc…. Also the villains that were redeemed were all kids when you think about it, all were indoctrinated from a young age and went through a lot of abuse and trauma whereas the truly villainous characters who were adults die or meet a fate suitable to their actions…
I literally just came here from rewatching the second part of The Day of Black Sun... You know, when Zuko turns good guy. Gotta love timing...
*"Oh but my pride! GRR! I wish I were a carrot!"*
*growling*"Mock my pride?!"
It's imo one of the funniest DBZA lines.
My favorite "reformed villain" type is the villain that has had good intentions all along and may not really even be a villain, like Satsuke and the Elite Four in Kill La Kill.
My personal favorite is reformed villains that have very personal motivations, such as loss. Then it's the heroes who help them recover and maybe even reunite with the person who made them experience said lose (if that person isn't dead or can be revived).
This video actually introduced me to the world of Avatar. I have never seen an amazing reformed villain until I watched ATLA. Now, after finishing ATLA, I'm rewatching this video and can pin point where EVERY SINGLE SCENE shown is from.
pretty much every trope talk that's a trope that's in AtLA red reminds us of how damn good that show was now I gotta go rewatch it again
*Trunks gets shot
Vegeta: "MY BABY BOY"
*Vegeta flys at Cell
Gohan: "Vegeta NO!"
Vegeta: "VEGETA YESSS"
Cell: Vegeta, no.
"Maybe one day they woke up one morning and realized that a military uniform incorporating a skull might not belong to the armies of good"
Are we the baddies?
"Maybe one day they woke up one morning and realized that a military uniform incorporating a skull might not belong to the armies of good"
Why cant the good guys use intimidation? Why cant the good guy have a neckless of all the teeth of all his slain foes to intimidate the bad guys.
@@gunarsmiezis9321 Because typically a rule-by-fear doctrine is incompatible with concepts of free will and social mobility. Typically in a book written from the Western Worldview, if a hero is ultra-intimidating, iron-fist, rule-by-fear kinda person, one of three things will happen:
-They'll become a fascist dictator who murders people for jaywalking, like Injustice Superman
-They'll get blindsided by a fascist/communist dictator, like Black Panther's W'Kabi
-They'll get taught the error of their ways, like Mwindo
I actually think a great example of this is Warhammer 40000's Konrad Curze, who ruled Nocturne (a world notorious as a haven for all things criminal and evil) through fear as a sort of psychotic Punisher/Batman and utterly eliminated crime, but then he left for a while, came back, and all of his "progress" was utterly gone as the people of Nocturne had returned to their ways in his absence, and he went berserk and, later (reportedly; no one's quite sure) allowed an Imperial Assassin to kill him because the ends of his ends-justify-the-means mentality were bad, and the only way to atone at this point (being a warp-corrupted murder Batman) was to die.
So the ultimate problem of being an intimidating hero is that it doesn't fix the problem, it just delays it as long as the source of fear is around, which is why the "good" heroes tend to be kind, forgiving, and role-model good behavior rather than threaten people into being good.
@@arueshalaetablebuildingsociety There is a diference between scaring your people and scaring your enemies.
Most societys that actualy went to battle trying to look and act intimidating, at home did not even have a compulsory state and instead ruled trough respect, kinship and mutual benifit.
@@gunarsmiezis9321 And the problem with this as applied to superheroes is that many of them are essentially "SuperCops." They don't fight foreign states, they fight crime.
It doesn't stop good guys, especially noire-style superheroes, from looking intimidating, but when it comes down to intimidation tactics, you're walking a very thin line which is pretty much the domain of Batman and Batman alone.
@@arueshalaetablebuildingsociety "as applied to superheroes" but we are talking about "military uniform"
Actually , there is another option presented in Xiaolin Showdown.
The villain actually TRIES to be good , but fails from lacking a strong moral backbone.
Which explains how he became a villain in first place.
Jack is the kind of character I hate to love. He's so charming he steals every scene he's in, but every one if his endeavors fails miserably, even that one time he tried (willingly) to be a good guy. The only two occasions I can recall of him succeeding were when he was brainwashed into goodness and the time he's shown to have off screen defeated all heros and villains.
Would like to see a Trope Talk on the "Villain Being Right" (Like Korra Season 1, debatablely season 4)
I'm not sure that Amon could be considered right. The Equalists, maybe, but the narrative didn't seem to realize they had an extremely valid point.
...Which could be its own Trope Talk, come to think of it.
Wouldnt call it being right, but a valid relatable point. Its maybe in the actions that they fail, and their relentless pursue of an end without any other care
Timothy McLean taking away bending is wrong no matter what
Bad example, but an interesting topic l.
There is a trope called Villain has a Point. The villain isn't necessarily right, but they say something that can't be overlooked as inherently wrong. The equalists have a point in that they are at a disadvantage compared to benders for reasons entirely outside their control, and, in Republic City at least, were underrepresented. In season 3, the villain had a point about the tyrannical earth queen and the moronic president, and especially has a point when one considers that 100 years of war happened because of the ambitions of Fire Nation royalty.
For an example outside of this, the villain in Spider-Man: Homecoming (the film is still in theatres so I'm not going to say what it was that the villain said).
Ultimately there is a flaw in their reasoning that leads them to go too far, but the trope is simply that the villain, well, has a point.
Dang.. Does this make anyone else want to binge all seasons of Avatar the Last Airbender?
Me
I really need to watch it but I can't find a good site to.
Same here :( I even went to the Nickelodeon site and they only have a few episodes
I already know it, but I really want to rewatch it now ^^'
Daily motion is pretty good for watching it
I just torrented the whole show.
Villain: HAHA IM EVIL
*random fuck you rainbow beam of friendship*
Villain: suddenly I feel heavy remorse for all those broken houses
Yo I've written something like this. This woman's been a bad guy for a while, but then she gets hit with the friendship laser (or in this case the holy god purification laser) and then just immediately has an "oh shit I wasn't the good guy" moment
"I must reverse the housing crisis."
When comes the "controlled by an evil influence", I tend to prefer the More Than Mind Control route, where the mind of controlled villain is actually contributing to the possession. Whether it be resentment, jealously, or insecurity, I feel that it adds layers to the person beneath the mind control and their motivation.
Ken in Digimon Adventure 02 was a great example of that! I don't really love that show, but I did like his character arc.