WATCH THIS before installing lithium batteries on your sailboat ⚡ [RYAN'S TECH CORNER]
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 มิ.ย. 2024
- Is it dangerous to install lithium batteries on your sailboat? Will your boat catch on fire just because you wanted those extra amps? From fire hazards, dump loads and self-destructing alternators... We bust all the myths about installing lithium batteries on sailboats:
02:34 Will my boat burst into flames?
09:24 Can I buy "drop-in" lithium batteries?
11:24 Are External BMS are superior to Internal BMS?
15:13 Are dump loads a widespread problem?
18:56 Will my alternator self-destruct with lithium batteries?
Read the FAA report about lithium batteries: www.fire.tc.faa.gov/pdf/TC-16...
⚡ Get 10% OFF Dakota Lithium batteries with code RYANANDSOPHIE sitewide, on all orders at: bit.ly/43C4ulL
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![How we made our Sailboat's Engine 50% quieter - [Ryan's Tech Corner]](/img/n.gif)
We’ll repeat it here: YES, Ryan co-founded Dakota Lithium, and we are 100% partial to the brand because he 1/ he has a clear and *disclosed* stake in the company, and 2/ we’ve used those batteries onboard in the last four years through thick and thin (and genuinely love them). One of the points we make is that not everyone is transparent about their financial interest to spread a certain type of information, and we take the stance to keep it real in all circumstances. And let this be a reminder that you can make your own decisions, and that those decisions turn better the more information you get :) we hope this was helpful!
You did a great job of keeping the video "clean"!
We actually got some of your batteries in the start of summer and love them. We went with Dakota Lithium because they seemed to be open and honest,. (And rugged, because we beat the hell out of our gear!)
Looks like you haven't heard of *_SUPERCAPS?_* I have 6x 80a/hr(480ahr) 12v caps on my 45' cruiser. My boat is the first in the world equipped with them. They are 98% efficient, 1 million cycle lifespan, no chance of them exploding or burning. No gas or chemicals stored or emitted. They operate between minus 50⁰C and 80⁰C. They can be safely discharged to 0v and stored under the workbench for 6 months and recharged when needed. They comply with all international aviation safety regulations and can be flown on a passenger aircraft safely and have a 10 year factory guarantee. I have had them on board for 3 years and are performing at 100%. I run a 12v 1.2kW windlass(100A). Autopilot, nav station, all lights, pumps, 80L freezer @ - 18⁰C and fridge @ 2.5 to 4.5⁰C. 2x 330W pollychrystal solar panels, 100-50 Victron MPPT and 12v to 12v- 30a Victron charger for changing with alternator. Lithium is sooo last Friday's technology. Cape Town South Africa.
@@grantpedder7719 Do tell us more. Do you have a video of your setup with more details?
Based on the thumbnail I was cringing, waiting for another video speaking in generality by a recent first time user / DIY (which seems to be the primary youtube information source!).
As someone who started in lithium ion cell manufacturing in 2010, I have to say I'm extremely pleasantly surprised. Ryan, you are 10/10 on all points as you well know. Anyone reading this, I can attest this is sound balanced advice and not a Dakota commercial.
Key points is that often to make it an effective installation, you need to assess everything directly interfacing with the lithium side of the battery bank. He mentions this but it's worth reiterating.
Great video Ryan.
Wow, that was a really clear and well presented topic for all of us to be able to follow and understand. Yes, even an electrical nerd can admit it's not always clear due to too many subjects and no clear or full explanation to sort out the devil in the details. Great job and well done Ryan.👍👌⛵🏖️
Ditto. Couldn’t have put it better myself 😊👍
One important point to add is that on high current situations ( above about 200amps) the quality of the cable crimps and connections is very important. A lose or corroded connection can go from fine to fire in seconds in high current situations. That is why where possible I recommend to use a higher voltage house bank 24v or even better 48v, because the current for the same load is much much less.
I know this from personal experience... very valid point!
Me too. Wish I would have upgraded to 48v and not stay in 12v. Way too many amps on my systems and super thick cables
Hey Sophie, I fully approve of Ryan.
Hey Ryan, Thanks for being "technical". I get & respect "technical". Keep feeding brains!
What an awesome video! This is exactly what people need to know when thinking of going lithium and you’ve done an incredible job explaining it all in a simple easy to understand way. Thanks for putting it out there you guys 🙌
Thanks guys
Great Video! Would love to see a video on the installation that covers all of the aspects mentioned in this video; wire sizing, adjustments to be made, etc.
👍☑🏝 ME TOO!!!
👍⛵️ ME TOO!,
Me three!
Ryan-
I never comment on videos, so this is my first. This information was excellent! I appreciate your transparency. Well done. Thanks!
Fantastic!!! I'm an electrical engineer (but not working with battery technology) and was searching for information on LFP safety and your video popped up. This is absolutely the BEST video on the subject that I've come across. Thank for this.
Your background is very impressive. I can tell you from first hand experience we had the insurance discussion with the Gowrie Group after recently shopping insurance for new navigational limits that cover the West Indies. We were specifically told no Lithium… sort of, Gowrie uses Markel’s Jackline policy and we were told they would not provide more than $250K hull coverage if the vessel had Lithium. From our conversation with Gowrie, I don’t expect this to change or get better until the ABYC takes a stronger position to support Lithium technologies and even then, I would expect insurance companies not to insure any vessel where a professional lithium installer was not used. Hopefully companies like Dakota are out there working with the ABYC to drive change in this industry. Until then, my AGMs were installed in 2019 and I have to wait for them to reach end of life. I keep telling myself, every year the technology gets better and less expensive, but I sure do get jealous of those boats with nice Lithium house banks. One comment I would add is that you did not have much to say about battery bank capacity and I have read that one big issue are these owners who install large banks and short cycle their lithium batteries however, this really isn’t a fire risk as much as a degradation of the battery lifecycle. Anyway, great video and I have put Dakota Batteries on my list along with Battleborn. Anxiously awaiting for the insurance companies to catch up. 23:54
If you are searching for another subject for a tech talk I would like to see a series of discussions about the different parts of a charging system. Solar panels, mppt, bms, inverter, shore power, batteries and how to integrate them. I have seen a bunch but they always thought a quick overview and don't go into quite enough depth.
Eg. MPPT. How to choose the right size, why have multiple mppt's
Or Inverters: string inverter vs micro inverter vs power optimizer. Choosing inverter size. Configuring boat wiring for AC and DC.
Great idea
There's a terrific series of talks and lectures in boat electronics on TH-cam y a channel called Pacific Yacht Systems, and I think you'd find a great follow on from Ryan's excellent introduction. I'm presently juggling just what the heck to do for my Next Boat, but am getting there. As of now, a strong 316 Stainless Rear arch for about 800 watts of solar, plus wind gen, space on a bar for antennas, plus power Davits . No Generator, but a Balmer XT 250 amp engine alternator with a built in Smart regulator, or, what alternator plus installation kit Balmar recommends. I'm getting a 3 cabin layout, with aft port cabin ripped out for a house racked Battery Bank, plus all charging and inverter systems in one control room type layout, to keep easy fastaccess to everything. It'll help balance a 100 mtrs of 10mm chain plus anchor up front. Standard the boat comes with a 4 small battery bank under the aft starboard Cabins bed, a d I'm thinking extra diesel tank under there. Large Watervtank is amidships under the dinette sofa, forvtopping up with a Watermaker, so forward, midshipman, and aft will have a nice eight distribution low down in the boat. I'm thinking 4 or 5 x 200ah SOK high quality batteries for the House Bank. I plan on running the internal diesel engine under moderate load at about 2 hours a Day. one hour just before sunset, one hour just before Dawn, for hot water for 2 showers a day. zduesels hate being run without a load, and a load cleans their insides and keeps them in peak condition, hence the extra fuel tank just in case. Not sure if Ryan has mentioned Galvanic isolators, they're important, but galvanic Transformers are worth the extra. Best Wishes and Fair Winds. Bob. 👍🙂
Precise and well structured! On the maximum charging current: Rather large solar panel installations get more and more popular and together with high output alternators, especially on a catamaran, all on independent charge controllers, you can easily create exactly the scenario you described. I missed mentioning the myth that Lithium batteries offer more cycles, charging/discharging at higher C and more usable capacity of their nominal capacity. While all of those are true individually, they are not in combination. If the desire is to obtain the longest life time, the regular charge/discharge current should be planned by data sheet. Sometimes advertising suggests things would be easier than they are. I would love to see more tech corner episodes!
You have just cleared up multi arguments on a Facebook group… thanks. Too many people generalising on Lithium batteries. Thank you for your in-depth explanation.
Beautifully presented 👍🇦🇺
Excellent teaching, Ryan! Thanks.
Thanks, Ryan. Clear and very informative. Much appreciated.
Live your honesty Ryan
Thanks Ryan.
You explained this very well.
Excellent overview, thank you Ryan!!
Thank you so much for such a clear overview! Appreciate the transparency!
Thanks for a good summary. Very helpful.
Well laid out and very informative, Thank you.
I don't often comment but I couldn't resist here!! Thank you so much Ryan. Your ability to clearly talk about complex systems was/is amazing. Thank you so much for making this one!!!!
Excellent video! Answered my questions. Thank you.
Great clear and concise video. Thanks Ryan!
Thanks so much for taking the time to make this video. Such a great overview and walkthrough of the chemistry and technology.
Excellent presentation. Thank you.
Nice work, Ryan. Thanks for the time and thought you’ve invested in this. Very well structured and informative!
Great information. Thanks for taking the time to do this.
Very thorough Ryan, great job!
So well done! Thanks so much for this video!
Excellent video - many thanks.
I was about to climb all over this thinking that this was going be wrong on so many levels…..I was wrong. Good job! One thing that I’d like to mention is, If an LFP batter does enter thermal runaway, it is not as severe as a cobalt containing battery. LFP cells don’t generate as much oxygen so those fire can be extinguished.
Well done and informative Ryan. Thanks for making this.
Incredibly well done and informative video. Thanks for explaining things so thoroughly, yet simply.
Thank you Ryan , it’s nice to hear this information from a reliable source👍👍
Wow, just WOW!! Ryan you were born for this! Clear and authoritative with humility, you're a unicorn! And Sophie, amazing edit! Seriously, one of my favorite videos of the year! Now I'm off to look at Dakota cranking batteries for my new boat!
Great explanation. Complete and clear. It condensates several books of incomplete partial info in a single video. Congratulations!
Thanks Ryan
Your advice is well taken
Thank you Ryan very informative.
Great content and excellent delivery Ryan! Thanks
Ryan, That sure was an education on batterys. Thanks for the eye opener.🌴
Really great information!!! Thanks!!
Excellent video! Many tidbits not covered in other videos. Appreciate the candor. 👏
It took me a couple years to piece together all the info in this video. Our lithium system has been up and running for a couple years now and we love it. Great video and very informative!
Great insights. Thanks!
Awesome info ! Thanks for sharing👍
Please keep doing videos on sailboat electronic systems. It is really helpful! Thank you!
Thanks for this Ryan. Really clear explanation. Regarding insurance: I've converted my boat to electric motor powered by a 48V LiFePo4 battery system. My insurer was very unwilling to take on the risk (basically as you said they didn't really know what the risk was). I put together a full design document explaining my choices and the background research that led to them and as a result they were happy to fully insure the boat. Although I don't have your experience, I do have a degree in Electronic Engineering so I am at least able to evaluate the accuracy of the information I am reading and make safe choices based on that reading
I also agree with you comment about marine electricians: I tried to get my local marine electrician to inspect the work I had done (not just the 48V systems for the motor but the 12V systems and the AC systems) and they were clearly out of their depth.
Appreciate the presentation/explanation on lithium batteries. Am glad you put in the caveat on installers of lithium batteries as I’ve met far too many techs that were worthless. I’ll use this video as as primer for such batteries and I’ll watch it 1 or 2 more times . Thanks.
thank you Ryan for your insight and knowledge and myths about lithium batteries.
Another great info video, clear and easy to understand explanations
thank you
Really excellent presentation Ryan , congratulations!
Thank you Ryan for this and other videos on the subject. Great help and will explore Dakota for my project.
What a great episode thanks Ryan, well worth the watch and knowledge you shared
So, so good! Thank you!
To explain things like these, clearly like you do, needs a very thorough understanding of the matter.
Everyone considering lithium batteries should see this!
Fair winds!
This video is so much needed for people!
Just found my way to the channel a few weeks ago and had no clue there were videos like this on it also. I really love geeking out on things but from time to time I also enjoy an overview on a subject that I am not confident enough to say I completely understand to help me see what I need to study up on. Thanks for the information.
Ryan, excellent job on the Lithium episode!! I watched it with my husband and although I'm not mechanical inclined as my husband, I was able to follow right along and understood everything you described/explained. Thank you for the honest input on the myths of Lithium. I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on disposal/recycling of used Lithium batteries as well.
Great gouge Ryan. Thank you
That was a lot of great info. I'm glad I found this channel.
very informative, thank you!!
That was a really excellent explanation about installing 'Lithion-ion' batteries in a boat. Succinct and easy to follow. Well done.
You do a good job explaining things.
Thanks Ryan, that was excellent. I love the thermal run away explanation and chemical composition. I’m going to make this required watching before I defend my use of LifePO4.
Great presentation! Need more of these
You did a video a while ago about installing lithium batteries and this is even more info . Thanks for the update , now i know why you are knowledgeable on this subject .
Ryan that was a very good explanation of the problems and myths of lithium batteries.I’m very interested in this,Thank you for explaning why there can be problems if done incorrectly.
That is a great video Ryan, Thank You.
Thank you Ryan. You are a wealth of information.
Great tutorial!
The best video on this subject....I am buying a beneteau oceanis 60.....you have clarified my thoughts on battery instalation...
Hi Ryan, I really quite enjoy this episode. Thanks for the tech talk.
Our Dakota Lithium batteries (4 x 280 AH) are ordered and on the way to Maverick in Guatemala!! So excited! Thanks for the great info and a fantastic product, Ryan!
Great video! Thanks for sharing ;)
Awesome topic and presentation, very well done.
Really great talk. Love the tech corner!
It is amazing what a few years of vloging can do, knowledge aside you have become a very articulate, persuasive speaker. great info, great video. Thank you for sharing
Outstanding vid thank you
Awesome video Ryan, so many 'drop in' conversions happening in the UK. Will share this video with my yacht club and all boaty friends😁
Excellent presentation and very informative
good in depth review.
thanks great info video
When a video like this comes out that has great feedback and is packed with info, THAT is when I star it. Honestly Ryan, I didn't fully understand everything, and that's a GOOD thing! It just means to go over it again a few times, just as we have to with any subject we're just learning. GREAT video, thank you thank you for all the good, detailed and verifiable info!!!😁
Thank you for your experience ! Merci Sophie et Rian pour cette video qui demolit non pas les myths mais les ragots de ponton ;)
That was great. Ryan you are exactly right about finding a marine electrical technician to do or help with the install. Most are just interested in selling stuff and have very limited or zero real knowledge or experience. I’m been thinking of making the change for awhile and I’ve made sure when I had to get a new inverter/charger it had a lithium setting. Same with my mttp controller. As for my alternator, it had an internal regulator and it’s charge output after a few minutes is so low it almost useless. In order to make a switch worthwhile I think I will need a new belt system for a new alternator a long with a regulator that is a bit more flexible, programmable and can talk to the other components. That probably my next step with batteries after that. A few years ago when I got out 3000 watt inverter/charger to run my wife’s air blower I pit in all new wires for the batteries. They are massive and all are doubled up. Just for smiles I think she has used the hair blower three times! 😊. Thank you again for the informative video. I will definitely look at getting your batteries when I make the change.
Very informative video.
Thank you for the incredibly useful and mind-opening information. I for one have learned a lot from your video. Please keep 'em coming.
Absolutely agree 100% 👍🏼 well done video. I have a 100% electric LiFePo boat and can't agree more with the information you provided. Keep bringing important topics on proper LiFePo battery installation. Thank you!
🤙🙏 Ryan, fantastically helpful and valuable explanation. Thanks ⛵️
Excellent video with great info. Ryan, you are really in your element in these technical videos. I can tell because I saw you smile. 😁
Great video Ryan. Clear, concise and well structured. It makes me want to play it on a loop in my store so I don’t keep repeating myself 🤔🤔😜
Love it... I could just finally setup that coffee shop and just stand there and talk
Very good video, thank you!
This video is guaranteed to save lives and property, one of the best Ive ever seen, thanks for making it!
FANTASTIC VIDEO !!
I'm already into LiFePo so I'm up to speed on the issues....just to say you covered all the issues really well, and VERY articulately and easily followed...THANK YOU !
...one thing about alternators though...those of us that switched to AGM years ago SHOULD have already switched to a high-output, i.e. high-charge-rate alternator when we switched to AGM, because that's AGM's best feature too...they can take pretty much all you can dish out to them...since there's no liquid acid you need to worry about boiling....
...so our AGM high output alternator shouldn't have much, if any problem dishing it out to our new LiFePo's.
Well done Ryan, I feel like I have a much much greater understanding of lithium batteries 🔋 now. Thank you
Thank you that was well done!
Ryan,thanks a lot for another incredibly informative video. As we have the upgrade to lithium on the planning for next year (partially based on your earlier video on installing it on Polar Seal) this was the perfect conversation starter. Thank you so much.
Very informative!
Most outstanding presentation your explanation is extremely comprehensible
This is an excellent video! One point that is consistently missed about BMS safety: If an extreme overvoltage event occurs (imagine a lightning hit, alternator voltage regulator failure, or inductive flyback), especially when the battery is at a 100% state of charge where it will present nearly a zero load to charging -- the voltage rating of the BMS MOSFETs may be exceeded (say 60 volts for example), and one or more MOSFET may fail SHORTED. In which case, all forms of charging protection has vanished. BMS overvoltage protection is only valid provided the overvoltage does not exceed the MOSFET junction ratings.
In my own sailboat installation, I have "crowbar" didoes: 18 volt 100 watt zeners installed across each battery's terminals to absorb a momentary voltage transient to protect the BMS MOSFETs. It only takes microseconds to fry a MOSFET junction. I've never seen a BMS with this protection.