BIG 3 Upgrade with 2 Gauge Welding Wire + TESTING!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 ก.ค. 2017
- 2 Gauge Welding Wire: amzn.to/2ude5Pe
2 Gauge Lugs: amzn.to/2vnB4HO
Hammer Crimper: amzn.to/2vnJu1x
Klein CL800: amzn.to/2tu0RAQ
In this video I go over my recent big 3 upgrade using 2 gauge welding wire. This wire rocks in my opinion, looks better and costs less. I'll also show you exactly how to test amperage from your alternator.
**This channel is for entertainment purposes only! Do not do what I do. Do not take my advice. I am not a professional. The methods I use may be completely wrong and/or dangerous. Please seek professional help with anything and everything and do your own due diligence (research). Working on cars is extremely dangerous. I am not responsible for any loss of life or limb or property. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. THIS CHANNEL IS FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY!**
FTC Disclaimer: I am an Amazon affiliate. As such, I earn a percentage of sales made through Amazon Affiliate links found in the description of my videos and on my website and other places.
Pro tip: Watch for jumper cables going on sale. At Princess Auto, I bought a 25' set of #1 cables for $30 on sale and hacked them up for my "big 4," upgrade." The beauty was they were fine stranded copper, red/black, with a super flexible insulator.
I am late to the party, but I have been doing this upgrade to cars for the past 20 years using welding cables for their price and pure Cu construction also car audio applications. One thing very important with these cables is that they are not rated for high temps. When using them in cars, especially in the engine bay I always sleeve them with high-temp tubing. The cables themselves are very good at chemical corrosion and physical damage, however lack high temp resistance in their shielding and are usually rated to -30 to +50-80 C. I use 2 types of e-glass and aramid woven tube shielding on top when working in an engine bay, temp resistance 550 to 1200 deg C. Some cables (starter) run close to exhaust pipes and cats and especially on turbo vehicles an uninsulated cable is a disaster waiting to happen. Just my 2c. Very well done video.
I didn’t do the big three but what I did do was a big difference! I measured the resistance of my ground straps on my car and they were over 600 ohms. I pulled the straps off and wire brushed everything! One thing I wish I’d have done was add some dielectric grease. The resistance went from 600 to less than six!
1¹¹
Should be 0ohm.
Dielectric grease is an insulator.
@@LoneWolfSnowplowinglol if any of my connections showed even a single ohm it's getting torn out and re done lol. No need for dialectic grease with proper connection points. Clean bare metal, copper lug terminal, crimped/heat shrink. Then lastly spray CLEAR COAT over your grounding points after tightening them down to prevent moisture from getting in. All my connections are .3-.5 ohms -.2ohms for resistance for leads so .1-.3 ohms actual
@@johndough111 you replied to the wrong person. You repeated what I said.
The big 4 upgrade makes a huge difference I have a pretty big sound system in my truck and have a 350 amp alternator. I was getting big voltage drops like you were talking about with a/c on and when bass hit headlights would dim out I didn't have money at the time for another battery and run of cable to the back but I did have some left over cable from my stereo install so I ran 0 gauge from +alt to + battery and grounded back case of alternator -battery then -battery to chassis and -battery to engine and -battery to body then connected engine to chassis and engine to body and if I forgot to mention chassis to body(these were all really short spans of cable). I had planned on adding second battery at some point and was just hoping that the wiring upgrade could do until I had the time and money for second battery. After I got done with the upgrade I can play stereo full out with bass flexing my doors and roof with a/c on and headlights don't dim at all while driving. My voltage runs at 14.4 and even in gear at idle with everything on and stereo up I don't drop below 13.2 I was completely amazed at the difference the upgrade had on my electrical system. I still plan on second battery at some point but it is no longer an issue. Btw...the upgrade even helped by getting rid of a small amount of noise I could hear between songs coming through speakers. No matter what you are adding to oem electrical system whether it be radio and amps, lighting, fans, winches or whatever the very first thing you should do is upgrade your grounds!
are you talking about your grounds when you said "then connected engine to chassis and engine to body and if I forgot to mention chassis to body(these were all really short spans of cable"?
The flat braided ground straps are there to reduce or eliminate "RFI" (Radio Frequency Interference). You can get them in different widths and thicknesses. They are important to keep connected from the chassis to the body so that you do not damage electronic equipment.
Remember, AMPS = HEAT. Devices like those fans use a certain number of watts. Voltage X Amperage = Wattage. If your voltage drops, amps go up, so that the device gets the same wattage. Any time the voltage sagged at idle, those fans were drawing way more amps then they are supposed to in order to get the proper amount of watts. 13.8V X 35A = 483W. 11V X 44A = 483W
You should have put marine grade shrink tubing on each of the crimped connectors. This prevents water and other contaminants from entering the wire/crimp and corroding the connection over time. Also, use a connection cover and/or dielectric grease on each connector.
That smaller pulley for your alternator is also going to put more demand on the alt & cause it to fail mechanically sooner than its normal life span too I think.
6:38 Slight correction there. It is AC that is more likely to travel on the outside of the conductor. This is due to to something called "skin effect" in which the fields of the AC current push it to the outside edges of conductor- this gets more and more prominent the higher the frequendcy. DC does not suffer from this effect (it has a frequency of zero) and thus will always use the entire cross section of the wire- meaning no difference between more or less strands.. as long as your wire gauge is correct, you will be good. :)
Edit: Having more strands is still advantageous as they are more mechanically flexible and less likely to break under their own weight, nothing to do with DC current capability though.
Yes! Many people don't know this. A lot of companies will try to charge you more for cables with more strands. It's a waste of money it only matters about the amount of copper inside the wire. The strands only make it more flexible.
I’ve been turning a wrench and fixing my own vehicles for a long time. This guy knows his stuff. What I like, is the simplification in which he communicates. I’ll probably end up referring people to him. Great job.
All he did was parts changing. There was no skil whatsoever in his ability to diagnose his problems. THEN never showed the final outcome at the wnd!
I've been ASE master certified for 35 years and u laughed at every thing he did in this video.
Loved the video for a couple of reasons. It takes guts to put yourself out there and share the things you are doing for millions of people out there to comment, whether it be positive or negative. I have not one clue what half of the comments were talking about down below with all this electrostatic zero emf and flux capacitor talk, but by God you sparked some good comments/debates with your video which is awesome. I'm no expert by any means so I find myself in situations like yourself quite often..... trying to figure things out on my own. But seriously, "constructive criticism" is a good thing when it's sound advice coming from people that have had more experience in certain fields. So thank you for posting and thank you TH-cam world for the funny comments but also the serious ones that help us learn from some of the mistakes we might make as DIY'ers or "Shade Tree Mechanics". Making it possible for us to correct things before we find ourselves running for the fire extinguishers.
Such an awesome comment, best of luck
Shop light under the hood on hooks is one of the smartest ideas I've seen!
been doing that shit for yearssssss
Princess auto sells them for $49.99
Group 78 battery has generally more CCA. Just an upgrade that's very easy. You can switch all your bulbs to LED's too. May have to switch to an electronic flasher. Great easy upgrades that can add to what you have already done and you can make more vids of the process as well. Auxbeam and superbrightleds are both great sources.
You most definitely need shrinkdown on the lug connection to prevent water ingress. Copper grease would perhaps have been a better fix than throwing oil on the bare metal. Also, some red tape or shrinkdown at various points along the +ve cable would make it obvious that this was the output side of alternator and perhaps avoid confusion if ever there was some jump starting to be done.
Hello Nice work. Back when when was working on Japanese cars the Hot Tip was called "Hot Earth" all it was was welding cable from the battery negative post to the engine block. But it did improve the idle, a tiny bit of fuel economy, and may be some horsepower as well. Take care and keep up the great work.
It is awesome that you finally did a test to see how many amps your vehicle was actually drawing. Just remember your alternator wants to run at about 70% of what it is rated for. Always calculate about 30% to protect your alternator and also for added accessories in the future. I would say also for parasitic loss, however you have upgraded your cables so it's pretty much overkill with no loss. It was nice to see you do this video. I was able to compare it to my comment before on the other video to see how far off I was, I wasn't that far off. However I assumed the electric fans would of drew more current/ amperage. Thank you for the great video it's always interesting to see what you're going to do next.
Engine bay looking like a Zipline adventure Park lol
Lmfao dkm
😳😂😂😂😂💀
big three: Upgrading + wire from alt to battery, upgrading - from alt to to chasis, upgrading - from battery to chasis.
Wire from Alt casing to battery neg.
@@wolfheart2443 yeah try that 😂😂
@@michaelf.2449 the ground for the alternator
Good information. I would suggest that you use shrink wrap on the ends of the wires. It helps keep out moisture.
I would keep an eye on the alternator alignment with the belt from where you forced a gap with the ground. Could cause issues.
You need a better alternator that had a higher amp rate at idle. Your fuses pop because its pulling more then 40 amps. When voltage drops your fans require more amperage to make up for the lost in volts.
he also did not mention if it is going through a relay first.. it should be.. but perhaps if not the initial draw is too much for the fuse
deepsquat600 he probably didn't put in a temp sensor, and he has a switch to turn it on and off. It needs to run thru a relay at the very least.
yes
234yomo exactly, I just bought a 270 amp Alternator that produces 200amp at idle and 300 at 1600rpm. ALWAYS avoid copper clad aluminum wire, if your fat wire is too cheap it is likely alumnum
@@homefront3162 that welding wire is pure copper.
Good video man , well thought out. I build wiring harnesses for a living so..... dump those brass lugs and get some plated ones and defiantly heat shrink all your wiring at the lugs and fans alternator . The welding wire is the hot tip dude.
You did good by going with welding cable. Stuff's super cheap, true to spec OFC and made in the USA. 🇺🇸👌 I'm using 2/0 gauge power/ground welding cable for the sound system in my car. Still have to do my big 3 upgrade though.
Separate the 2 fans and put the 2nd fan on a different circuit that kicks on at a higher temp. That way it won't need as much power till it really gets hot.
I used 0/0 gauge welding wire and it works great! I have dual batteries so I have more wires. B- to alternator housing, B- to block, B- to frame, B- to body. B+ to alternator, B+ to second B+ (the grounds on the second battery are the same but other side of the truck and I grounded on to the ac housing instead of having a second ground on the alternator
I want to thank you for this video.
1st. You have to make sure that your alternator generating more than enough Amps. In that case i saw that car using roughly 100 amps, but that alternator generating just 60 Amps. There are too many options, for example smaller pulley, more Amp Alternators, you can even use multiple alternators
2nd - when you managed to get these Amps, you'll definitely face with one more issue. BATTERY LIFE. For this problem, you can get more Amp hour battery, or even using multiple batteries too (make sure that you connected these batteries parallel 😃)
I've got a 140 amp alt. Did the big 4 with 2 guage welding cable. What a difference. Amp doesn't dim my lights now. Better Amps at the amp.
I just did the big 3 to my trucks. I installed big sound systems in them. I also installed a volt meter. You should also install a volt meter to keep an eye on things. 👍
I have had this issue before as I had said in my previous comments. The constant amp draw on a fully loaded suburban is about 110amps. A 140 amp alternator only puts out 140 at Max rpm for the alternator. The smaller pulley will make a huge difference. a conatant high engine rpm for extended periods of time will stress the alternators voltage regulator
1 road, this is my EXACT same thought.
Dual batteries is a bandaid not a fix. Dual alternators or smaller pulley would be more of a true fix for the problem. Keep in mind you might add a higher power stereo, in car entertainment or use higher power Accessories. I have a lot experience with these exact vehicles.
This is why they jumped up to 145A standard alternator when 05+ GM trucks went to the dual E-fan. If you buy an ACDelco AD244 series alternator that they used, their Idle output is 100A+ and any decent alternator should be seeing peak or rated output around 3k RPM or less, so that Powermaster alt is junk.
could get some glue lined heat shrink on those lug connections.
Yep hes asking for trouble
Love the idea of hanging the fluorescent light fixture from your car hood!
Thank you for taking the time to put this vid together. A few things could have been done a bit neater but for somebody learning as they go, you’re doing excellent! I’d recommend going with a higher output alt as well as a better battery (optima, xs power, dc power, etc). For more advanced examples of big three wiring or wiring multiple batteries, spend time looking at SPL competition audio setups on TH-cam. Multiple alternators + many extra batteries in a single vehicle is quite common in the SPL competition “scene”.
Regarding current flowing on the wire's surface. This property is found when Radio Frequencies are in play, not DC. More strands mean more flexibility in automotive use.
I know this is a highly debated topic and I am not an engineer but have you ever seen the wire made by monster wire it has a pvc filament in the center to promote voltage travel
The reason for usually using stranded wire in DC applications is because DC does travel on the outside of each strand. The more strands equal less resistance, therefore less heat. AC on the other hand travels inside the strand and therefore solid wire is usually used.
@@battleofathens5986 you are absolutely wrong. DC flows through conductive material just the same as AC. The difference being it only does so in a singular direction. Also, a higher strand count increases resistance and heat due to electrical energy being dissipated by "skin effect". All wire has "skin effect" and when you increase the surface area of the wire by increasing the strand count, you in turn increase the "skin effect" of the wire. So therefore, a wire using the same material with less strands can be smaller and still handle the same current. The only real benefits of a higher strand count is flexibility and the fact it can handle vibration better
beardedforlife correct!...... I’m sorry I misspoke when I said that beardedforlife is correct. Indeed as Walter has said he is incorrect. Skin effect is a characteristic of a/c. It is more pronounced the higher the voltage. As in 5kv-500kv.
@@beardedforlife3740 you are quite incorrect. I am an electrical engineer. For a DC current, the rate of change of flux is zero, so there is no back emf due to changes in magnetic flux. Therefore, the current is uniformly distributed throughout the cross section of the conductor. ... Skin effect is process in which the electrons inside the metal conductor wire tries to move near the outer edge. Skin effect is an ac-only phenomenon.
Nice work on upgrading your cables. At the beginning of the video I was screaming alternator, but I see you upgraded to the 140 amp alternator. The problem is simply the alternator does not put out enough power at low rpms. You may be able to turn your idle up some, just 50 to 100 rpms might make a big difference. I dont suspect you will have any problems with your current set up unless you plan on idling for extended periods of time. If you simply dont like the gauge dropping at the stop light, I believe the dual battery set up would help stabilize your system. It will double your amp hours.
Hello Brett, thanks for your comment. Yes, I did upgrade the alt to 140amps but I'm still having issues at hot idle. It's not only the fact that the gauge drops, it's that when that voltage drops, amperage goes up. This means that with an insufficient alternator the fans will try to pull more amps thus creating more heat and exacerbating the problem. Fuses start popping and/or melting... you get the idea. So far, I've learned how to drive it to deal with it but now I'm at a crossroads as to what to do. Do I spring for a much higher output alternator that costs $400 or more or do I yank those fans out and go back to stock which just costs me time? I'll be making that decision soon and you can bet there'll be a video about it! haha.
Hey 1 Road, thanks for your reply, I feel special now, and obligated to help diagnose all them amperes running wild in your suburban. My interest in this is Im a back yard mechanic, have a Suburban that looks exactly like yours, and have a degree in Electronic engineering. Lets get right to the problems i see, your alternator is not turning fast enough at idle to meet the demands asked of it. This is what I got from your amp testing::: alternator putting out 70 amps idle 115 amps at speed full load(everything on)
truck pulling 60 amps at full load(stock)
fan pulling 35amps byself and 27amps at truck full load
So at idle, you only have 10 amps to spare with your headlights and blower motors running. 70-60=10. So your having a negative 25amp draw on your battery at idle with everything on. I guess I would expect more out of the alternator., but they are sending you a rpm pully that might wake it up, it needs to spin fast enough to meet its threshold or its not gonna put out. (thats what she said). Thats where a dual battery set up would help (when you have a draw rather than a charge).
Ok on to the second problem, the fuse melting. First I would like to say I do not believe its melting cause there is a lack of voltage. In a DC circuit, Voltage and amperage are directly proportional. So if voltage drops, so does amperage(current flow). an according to your tests, that proves it. Your fan was pulling 35 amps by itself, and droped to 27 amps when you lit everthing up in your truck. So by all rights, a 40 or 50 amp fuse should not be melting. What is causing this? One factor might be worth checking out, its called ampacity.That deals with the resistivity of conductors when they heat up. Specifically the wire gauge of the fan. This could probbally be an engineering fault of flex light. I think being in las vegas with exttreme temps, the under hood ambient temperture is causing the fan wire to increase its resistance causing heat. Fuses are designed to melt because of heat caused by excessive current, creating a clean break in the fillament. your fuse is melting from the out side also, caused from a longer exposer to heat, where my thinking ampacity is playing a role. This can be corrected by thicker wire. If my hypothisis is correct, flex light is at fault. And not sure how you could or if you should run heavier wire leads from the fan.
Well I hope I gave you some things to think about. I really do wish flex light would have givin you more support also to see the project through. Ill be keeping an eye on what you do. I would like to see you see this project through, as its my belief you should beable to put a flex light fan, light bars, snow plow, and stereo amps in this truck with the meter showing full charge. Good luck buddy
@@ghostdragon5758 FINALLY!!!! I've been reading these comments a while now and nobody seems to have a clue what they are talking about! You do! I guess they have been talking to electricians(the guys that work on AC equipment!) because it's an AC motor that will draw more current at lower voltages. example--my 10,000 pound lift(I own my own auto repair shop) draws 17 amps on 208 volts, 16 amps on 230 volts--makes 2 HP in either case--AC is different than DC and I don't fully understand AC. However, I DO understand 12 volt DC! After 35 years as a professional mechanic I shgould! DC is directly proportional as you said--OHM'S LAW STATES---VOLTS=AMPS x OHMS, so at 14 volts you pulled 35 AMPS, then the theoretical running resistance of your fan motors combinbed is 0.40 OHMS so when the voltage drops to 12, the amperage should theoretically be 30. For this discussion this asumption is good enough. Actual measurement was about 27 AMPS due to multiple factors including voltage was likely not exactly 12 and the theoretical running resistance of the motors is not fixed at 0.40 OHMS--temperature, RPM, actual voltage--all of these plus other factors make estimating the resistance of running motors sketchy at best. For our purposes here it doesn't matter--we see AMPS go down as VOLTAGE goes down in a DC system. T melting fuses is ABSOLUTELY caused by the female connectors attached to the fuse terminals getting extremely hot due to high resistance!! The fan wires and the terminals are WAY TOO SMALL for 30 or more AMPS! Don't blame the fuse--he's the victim here! The bad guy is the heat created in the undersized wire and terminal due to high current. On to the rest of my diagnosis--as long as you won't be idleing longer than 5 minutes or so (provided you have a good battery) there is really no need to overdrive the alternator with a smaller pulley. Overdriving the alternator will only accelerate wear on alternator and load the engine and belt unnecessarily. In other words--use more gas and if you like to rev the engine high between shifts (like 5000 rpm or more), the alternator could possibly spin so fast the rotor windings sling out and rub on the stator!! Instant dead alternator and possibly fire due to dead short to ground for the welding cable you ran to the alternator! As for all those redundant grounds--they won't hurt anything, but they are not All helping you--you need a big cable from battery neg to engine block, a wire from batt neg to body(about 10 gage is fine), those straps from engine to frame are not for radio interference--they keep high current from running through things it shouldn't--like the shift cable and throttle cable!! They will melt and weld themselves together if the starter happens to source it's ground through them--I've seen it happen!! The only other one you need is a strap between engine and body.
@@tedstclair7145 Does the transmission also need to be grounded and if so to the battery negative or just the frame?
@@jbhcrazyskills9508 No need to ground transmission. It’s bolted to the engine so it gets it’s ground right there
I have a whole 50 ft spool of 0 gauge welding cable. Plan on using some of that for power cable when I do my LS swap in my S10. Made some jumper cables out of some of it a few years ago and they work amazing.
Man I needed that I spent a lot of money on getting the wires done I have a 1975 buick Lesabre trying to keep it together 🤑🤑🤑👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽😁😁😁😁THANKS 🤩🤩🤩🤩
Use marine grade shrink wrap on the ends. Its lined with adhesive... prevents corrosion. Also forget oil, hit that bear metal with paint or clear coat.
Bear metal. 😂
Use some heat shrink tubing around those connectors to help keep them sealed make them last longer
I enjoy seeing all the different ways people choose to tackle the same projects and your doing great by just giving your ride some love. As for your old cables it was unnecessary to remove them. It would have been more efficient to leave them and add to them. It was wasted labor for you and GM. Unless they were fried and melted shorting out everywhere they can only add to the conduction. The corrosion can be removed and heat damage is fine. Resistance is only added during the heating event which is a sign of other issues. Dealing with corrosion is part of maintenance. Either way wire away and keep in mind the balance of the system. Equalize the magnetic fields, protect the modules and sensors and have fun.
Hi, good video. FYI when I upgraded the battery leads on my old BMW motorcycle I used leads with 99.9% oxygen free copper wires - horribly expensive but incredibly effective! IMHO worth the money.😉
Each fan should have it's own fuse and relay a single trigger wire will turn on both relays to kick on the fans if you blow a fuse on one fan other should still work
Yup and have a seperate fuse/power connection powering each relay do the amps aren't all drawn through a single circuit.
Those fan wires looked way too thin, not your fault the company that provided them should have sent thicker cables with their product, interesting that not all fuses are made equal either lol. Great video and bargain on that welding wire I'm going to try chase some wires for my own big 3 from a source like that 😉😊
Big 3 upgrade is a must on an 08+ Grand Caravan as chances are the factory grounds are shot past 100K - or if installing any high power amplifier / inverter (if not done you WILL blow the TIPM/computers and grounds - resulting in very expensive replacement). Symptoms of bag grounds will be the engine hesitating and the dash illumination will be very erratic (noticeable at night) if stock grounds are worn enough - worse is PRND[8] may illuminate (not showing gear selected) due to CANBUS instability (Driveable however if PCM fully desyncs off CANBUS your are SOL!) . On mine I did Positive B+ to TIPM B+ 1 AWG - my alternator B+ factory to TIPM was sufficient, and the grounds were done with 4x bonded 8 AWG (Alt to Chassis, Engine to Chassis, and Batt to Chassis). My 1800W inverter ran an 1800W heater with no issue with the van's HVAC still able to run. Other thing done was a deep cycle battery and a capacitor bank is pending to handle -40 Deg C cold start. LED lights up front also help take the load off the stock harness.
I run ad244 145 amp alt on mu 2000 blazer the ad244 has beater output at idle than cs130. Good job with the big 3.
That hammer crimper seems like it would work well in a vice
James Holbrook I was thinking the same thing!!
A vise is another method of using it, yes. That or a press. They really are meant for jobsite crimping of major electrical construction, but they work wonders in automotive if you don't want to do soldering.
Hydraulic hand crimpers are awesome
The Doyle lineman pliers at harbor freight do a really fine job crimping those .
WOW! Someone else actually had the same FUSE issue that I had run into, those fuses ruined a couple things under my hood and my led switch inside my car! Yes, they are junk! o man.
I have an 89 single cab short bed. I am running a carbed vortec 5.7 from a 98 using all the vortec accessories and the 34" wide radiator. I was having the same issue before I installed the same flexalite fans. while installing I ran 0 gauge wire from alternator to battery along with new 105amp alternator and it fixed my issues. I am also looking into upgrading to the AC DELCO AD244 from the nbs Chevy 99+. Rock Auto has a 253amp for the 99+ body style for $100
Jimmie another great video. Ive been running my 99 sub while on vacation for the last two weeks with the ac on most of the time and have not encountered the massive voltage drop like you've experienced. I knew It drops some when stopped at a light with the ac on, but no where near the red zone. Ive been watching videos on AL wheel refurbishment by stripping the clear coat off an polishing them. Up in MN mine look terrible. 193k miles and running strong and got 18.25 MPG running down to MO at 70 MPH.
+B Dog how on Earth did you accomplish 18.25 mpg???
Nothing special really. I just set the cruise control to 70 MPH and ride.
found your channel about a month ago good content keep up the work
+Logan Kroes Thank you sir!
With my experience when your popping fuses like that your power wire isn't fat enough to whatever you're trying to run your power wire isn't thick enough
I am about to upgrade my alternator. I am going with the Powermaster. I don't quite have the load demand you have as I am not running electric fans. One thing that may help even after your Mechman upgrade is going ahead and adding a 2nd battery on the drivers side, many northern vehicles already have a battery tray in the spot where your vacuum canister is, you could probably locate a stock one at a local auto yard. Wiring is super easy. I put in a battery isolator, but not necessary. When you measure current, you are measuring the draw (think input) and not the output. The test tag on your altenator was rated at i think 106 amps, if you are only drawing 50 amps, that is all your amp meter is going to read. In your case you were attempting to draw more than 60 amps at idle so when you increased the idle speed the output reached the draw about 115 amps. This lets you know what you need your output to be at idle in order not see a drop in current to the accessories. I think a slightly smaller pulley would have solved your problem. Another way of thinking of this is that the alternator may have the potential to produce 100amps at 750 RPM, however if the current draw by all the accessories on the vehicle is 50amps, your meter will only show an output of 50amps. For a higher output alternator like the Powermaster a slightly smaller pulley should not degrade its longevity.
It's easier to run ALL Grounds to the Engine Block, rather than trying to stack them up on the negative Battery Terminal.
You can attach them anywhere there is a large bolt and it will work fine.
2 or 3 standard 4 gauge cables (cheap and readily available), will be just as good as one 2-gauge cable
You can also attach Battery Cables to the Tailshaft housing of the Transmission when you have your Batteries mounted
near the Rear Axle, (which is where you SHOULD put all that weight).
I like to run the Batteries AND the Alternator output directly to the Starter Solenoid, but make sure you plan ahead and check that
the terminals you are using will all fit on the Starter Stud.
Then you can attach your loads to either the
Alternator Stud,
the Starter Stud,
or directly to the Battery,
it makes zero difference.
Run ALL of your Load Grounds to the Engine Block, EVERYTHING, ALL OF THEM.
NEVER Ground anything to the Sheet Metal of the Body, you are just asking for a problem, BUT
make sure that the Body has a 4 gauge Battery Cable attaching it to the Engine Block.
A very expensive, Marine Grade Heavy Power Distribution Fuse Block, with BOLT DOWN FUSES, IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED.
Use "ANL", "LMG", or "AMI", Bolt-Down Fuses, "Mega Fuses" are good only up to around 40 amps continuous duty,
even though they are available up to 100 amps, THEY WILL NOT DEAL WITH IT LONG TERM, they will melt and corrode with time.
The smaller fuses are only good for around 20 amps continuous, even though you can get them in 25 or 30 amp ratings.
Also, get a Battery that has BOTH TOP AND SIDE Terminals, You can thank me later.
And, if you can possibly swing it, get off the cash, and BUY AN OPTIMA BATTERY, OR 2,
FREE replacement for 3 YEARS.
They are seriously bad-ass Batteries, AND, ZERO TERMINAL CORROSION.
.
.
AC travels on the outside of the strands. DC travels on the inside.
I also like to add some solder to my crimps. You do have to be careful though because the solder will travel up the strands and make the cable stiff.
If you use Marine grade wire it is already tinned copper to prevent the creepage of corrosion up the wire, and it will maintain its integrity much longer than non marine wire.
"Hey these fuses are melting, so let me throw a higher amp rated fuse in"
OSDCrusher Yeah, never ever do that. The fuse is to protect the limits of what the wire should handle. What he did could have easily totalled the truck due to a fire.
mannys9130 I'm aware. Thanks.
Hey there's a electrical fire let me pour gasoline on it.
My guess - the low quality fuses were the reason for melting the plastic fuse housings. I would also add the possibility of incorrect plastic not rated for high temperatures along with cheap fuse blades.
Exactly ! That comment is the reason why I right to the comments section. 😁
I upgraded from a 8 AWG big 3 to a XS Power big 3 today. Major noticeable difference between the two gauges. But mine's for car audio.
👍 always best to for car audio even if it's just 500w it helps
Yea make sure u got relays on the fans like someone commented. U can also replace the cheap fuses with a isolator breaker. Make sure to heat shrink your connectors to help avoid corrosion.
Those melted fuses remind me of Jolly Ranchers haha
Hey I don't know if you changed it already but I changed my belt tensioner n voltage drop solved then 14.2 volts all day with 4 15" subs running with A/C I was going crazy 4 a min and had to recheck my steps.
My jeep's idler pully was dragging my engine down so much that when i replaced it, i honestly went from 11 mpg gas to 13. So pullys can really affect ypur idle and engine drag.
On my 90 camaro the 3g did help my volt is now in middle with ac n led headlights on i did get a bigger watt bttery 750
Good trick for those closed ring lugs is to drill a small hole on the end by the ring towards the wire so you can solder it if you want. Will give you a way better connection Imo :)
Why didn't you also do a before and after on the voltage? That's pretty important for a good system.
Really like your channel, very impressed you show the good and the bad of doing your own repair and upgrade projects. Keep up the excellent work!
A few extra tips : If you have a side post battery ...Take off the stock connection bolts with the 7mm head that strips eazy Go out to homedepot Get yourself a few 3/8 course thread 1-1/2 to 1-3/4 bolts with nut and min 2 washers per bolt screw the nut on all the way back towards the head add your washer(s) Then your cable,
You now have a head that will not strip You have more room to add cables And volt testing/boosting When buying better cables And doing a DIY buy shrink tubing sized for your cables Having a air/water tight connection will add years to your system Black electrical tape is not made for High heat and freezing weather and the glue on the tape breaks down faster then shrink tubing
Do not use Soldier to "fill" in wire gaps Soldier (TIN) is 5 times resistive than copper And fights the whole reason your upgrading your system ..
I like to add in a thin coat of dielectric grease on my very small exposed wire gap Before pulling the shrink tube over and heat sealing it ..Also a thin coat on any metal when finished ..And again after a full engine detail once a year
HOW ABOUT "ALL THREAD" 3/8 ROD. (FOR SIDE POST BATT): DID THIS ON MY 95 ZR1-LT5 CORVETTE W/ NUTS+STAR WASHERS SO ALL I TO DO WHEN I WANTED REMOVE THE CABLES WAS TO TO REMOVE THE NUTS. TO INSTALL THE ALL-THREAD SCREW ON (2) NUTS ON ALL-THREAD & USING (2) OPEN & BOX-END WRENCHES SLIGHTLY THIGHTEN THE NUTS TOGETHER THEN TURN ALL-THREAD ROD GENTLELY TIL U FILL IT BOTTOM OUT ,THEN USING THE (2) WRENCHES, LOOSEN (1) NUT & UNSCREW IT OFF ALL-THREAD & DO SAME TO OTHER NUT. THE LENGTH OF EXPOSED ALL-THREAD DEPENDS ON THE NUMBER OF CONNECTIONS BEING PLACED ON EACH BATT TERMINAL. HOPE TIHS HELPS.
I had this same truck with the same issue. I had the same 140 alt you do, I did a big 3 upgrade, and I even added a second battery. Even after all that, my volt meter still wasn't impressed. I ran an aftermarket volt meter right to the battery and it showed completely different readings than the factory truck meter. The new meter showed a constant 14.8 volts and only dropped to 14.6 under heavy load with efans and aftermarket stereo. From my understanding, I believe the factory meter displays power that the trucks computer is getting. Not what the battery has.
I have the same problem with my 95 gmc 5.7 let me know if you figure it out.
You should adapt a stock ad244 alternator and your power delivery issues would be gone. They are some stout alternators with awesome idle output.
I agree with John. Alot of people do it who push snow with plows and flashing lights on their truck. also winching in offroad trucks.
Will an AD244 even fit a TBI? I always thought it only swapped to the Vortec.
dude you've done some impressive things to your truck very cool great video 2
Did the pulley fix the problem? I had a similar issue and finally traced the problem to the AC blower motor. I found that the motor was on the verge of seizing up and didn't spin easily by hand. Although the blower was turning it was taking a huge amount of current to do it. I replaced the blower motor and hadn't had any power issues since.
The only thing I would've done differently is soldered the cable to the lugs and seal them with heatshrink...it ensures a secure connection and prevents corrosion. You have me curious about what my factory 140 amp alternator does at idle...I'll have to check and let you know. Good luck, enjoyed the video.
+John Moore Please do let me know. I'm just getting started in all this alternator stuff and it's extremely interesting.
1 Road so if I had seen that correctly, at idle with everything on, the alternator was producing 65-70 amps idling. The fans were consuming max 35amps, headlights and a/c blowers on using 60 amps roughly? If correct the alternator dosent produce enough to keep up at idle but more than enough at 1500rpm and up which explains your voltage drop.
Id personally say you need either a smaller pulley or again 1 step bigger alternator.
I have the 98 version of your suburban, and changed to a 250amp alternator and 1/0 wire in a full big 3, Im getting 190amps at idle, but im charging 3 batteries, so a bit different setup from you.
Ben Diblasio Which alternator are you running? And yes, you are correct in your finding. I have that smaller pulley coming and, according to PowerMaster, should give me an additional 450 rpm on the alt.
1 Road im running an alternator from a local place I deal with regularly. 15-18 alternators later I have never been let down.
I would love the info on who built your alt . Ive never seen a 250amp pump out 190amps at idle . Rule of thumb the higher the max amps the lower amps at idle . Im not saying a 250 would put out less then a factory alt at idle but usually your lucky to see 100amps at idle out of a 250amp hairpin . Now 1200/1800 rpm will usually give you full amps but anything under your lucky to get half. Also no one has said it but you also can run into issue with high rpm cut off with high amp alts . Usually over 5 k rpm and the alt stops charging . This is usually with alts above 250amp .
Might be easier to put the clutch fan back on! Also Circut breakers are better the fuses for high heat applications
Your channel has potential keep up the good work and DIY informative videos.
+ChinoDolla2888 Haha cool. Thank you for the great comment!
You need to use heat shrink wrap where the wire meets the terminal. It will help keep the elements from corroding your wire. Even some electrical tape would help. It also give your work a clean finish. Harbor freight has some for cheap that I used.
I've always ran the big positive wire from the alternator to the fuse block and from the fuse block to the battery. This way your fuse block also benefits from the big 3.
Never heard of someone fusing the alternator lol. Fusing is for the wire.
DC power does not travel on the outside of the wire strands. You have that confused with high frequency AC power. They use larger strange count wire for automotive use because it is more flexible and less susceptible to fatigue in a vibrating car. Your alternator probably wasn’t rated for enough amps at idle, but lower gauge wire always helps to reduce voltage losses. But great videos man, keep it up! :)
Strands count sir you mean
I’ve seen this a number of times. 1st does the wire that’s melting the fuse also get hot itself? I would ground to the engine block or frame. Grounding everything back to the battery can cause issues.
In my experience anytime you have heat in wires it’s usually a ground. You can also touch the alternator case to see if it’s hot. If so, that has a bad ground. A multimeter from the battery pos (or neg I forget) then the other side touching the case can determine how well your ground is on the alt. There should be hard key any reading showing up.
Solder your own batter cable ends on both ground, all grounds, and positive; remember all charge return and voltage sample connectors at the batteries. Low Voltage creates higher current and heat and popped fuses with no shorts. Current Divided by Voltage=Resistance. Excellent choice and you nailed it.
next video "vortec heads and intake swap on tbi"?
2 mins into the video and my first thought is that the power and ground wire for the fans maybe too small
try to blame it on the fuse! LOL. too small of wire causing too high resistance and melting fuse
Yes too small and should have grounded to the chassis NEAR THE FAN. You can compensate for wire that’s too thin by shortening the length. Ground wire should always be as short as possible anyway
@@codilankford6173 Too small of wire = less capacity, undersized.
It's like a 1/2 inch water line at 50 psi will flow X gallons per minute.
A 1 inch water line at 50 psi will flow more.
Pump up the pressure to 100 psi and the 1/2 inch will flow more.
Same with power, voltage = pressure/psi, potential.
@@vongrayson9047 what?? At 100psi a 1 inch pipe gonna have more gpm than 1/2. What u smokin?
ok jimmy,Jimmy, have two issues, #1 there are several types of alternators, there is one that is when you are driving, which is what you bought, and the other, which charges when driving and at ideal that is where you are having one issue, you need one that can also charge while idealing, #2 you really need to go back a d buy the 1/0 welding wire,which is really thhn so cord flexible, ground the alternator which grounds the motor, ground the frame chassis, and the ground the side wall next to the battery, then run you red wire from the battery to the alternator, and you to put at least 125 inline fuse on the red wire going to the alternator, you will have no more problems, and your vehicle will run better, you can not be cheesy with buying the wire and what you need or you will problems like you have,and ease use 1/0 wire, thanks love your channel James
From a 12 year locomotive electrician. All current flows more efficiently with fine strand wire, AC Or DC.. that’s why locomotive traction motors can pull 750 amps with relatively small cables.. we use special high strand count wiring for all the high voltage.
Your thinking is correct. I read about the outside flow and all that too.. I don’t know... doesn’t matter.. if nothing overheats, you are good to go.
4:19 is where it starts and you pause the video to see if someone was knocking on your door.
Switch all your light bulbs to LEDs, you'd be surprised at how much less current it draws.
+Gus Escobar in the process bro.
Not cheap at all but it will be worth it in the end. Draw less power and more mileage on the gas.
Auxbeam makes quality affordable LED bulbs.
I did that in my Grand Cherokee first week I got it
Standard LED replacement are 35 Watt instead of 55 Watt. This is exactly a gain of 3 instead of 4.5 Amp draw. 1.5 amp saved. That's it!
I am not stocked by that.
Your video was produced well. Thank you!
So 1 road, what was the ultimate outcome and did you ever solve the charging issue and what was it? I added a 16" spal fan in front of the mechanical fan. It helped the a/c tremendously but now have the same exact charging problem you have. I have the 105amp alt so I am sure I need a higher output and yes I have a relay. But before I go changing a bunch of stuff I want to make what you did to solve the issue finally. Did the wires upgrade fix the issue?
Two things, always solder those big lugs on, and also that 2 gauge wire needs to be sealed from the sheathing to the lug with shrink tubing with sealant inside. Otherwise you are exposing that copper to oxygen, which will shorten its life span, and lead to corrosion and higher resistance in the wire over time, essentially negating everything you did.
Try running a second battery or what I noticed helped is I hooked up a stereo capacitor to compensate for all the voltage drop that I was getting from my light bars the capacitor might help you stabilize voltage
Great video, thanks for sharing!
Many useful tips. You are a intelligent man. Thanks
All power and ground wiring should be the same gauge through and through
You need to run your fans off a relay. It's drawing too much power!
Bingo!👍
What you said. I was about to say the same and seen this. 👍
I assumed they had relays, if not absolutely 100% need relays. I won't even run small led off road lights without a relay, cheap insurance.
Exactly
And yes corrosion definitely affects how current flows thru a conductor. You did a good job though buddy. Thoroughly enjoyed the video.
I just sprung for the 200 amp Power Master from Summit Racing. And yes welding lead is awesome and won't break your pocket 👍
Nice! The cable seems really good to me.
@@1RoadGarage the reason your volts drop is because the amps are going up during start up,also known as in rush current..in the electrical industry wires are sized @ 125% of the motors running Amperage not Start up Amperage..the bigger the ground and 1 central grounding point is optimal to prevent ground loops
The fan should be on separate circuits so if one breaks you got one that works also they shouldn't start at exactly the same time
I think they started at the same time cause he turned the a/c on
There is a 250 amp alternator, install it and you’ll be fine. Have it on my Tahoe
Evan Watty Part number?
1 Road bnrparts on EBay, just search their inventory. They’re really good guys located in California and they’ll answer all of your questions if you give them a call. Got mine 2 days after ordering and I’m in NC. They have a good warranty also so you’ll have that assurance also
Problem with high amp alts is they tend to put out less at idle . A good 300 amp alt might do 100amps at idle.
It's not the overall rating. It's what it can do at idle.
Cool vid... keep up the good work. 👍🏿🤘🏿👌🏾
I have the same vehicle only with a diesel I was running into the same problem I did all the wire upgrades including the body ground Was a big problem but I bought a Mechman alternator best move I ever did puts out over 200 A at idle has no problem running both blowers and two air compressors in the compressors pool 80 A by themselves they have alternators that are capable of 370 amp
140 amps isn't very powerful for a high output alt, and is likely maxed out. Take a look at DC Power Inc. Solid products. My current alt from them is 320amps and 260amps at idle.
Des420 what brand alternator u using
DC Power Inc. - www.dcpowerinc.com/
Des420 they are great but they do take FOREVER, I have the 370 xp in my truck.
@Ninja I can't say you're wrong... It's not just them though. Almost anything to do with aftermarket audio is 2 weeks to a month wait time.
260 @ idle ? Wow . Ive got hairpins from them also 320 and they dont touch 200 @ idle. More like 100/110 between the 4 i have .
WTH.. When i first saw the melted fuses i knew which ones they were before i saw the package. Those fuses almost burnt my 95 BMW to the ground. While i was out one day i blew a fuse and got a pack of those in a pinch. I had some sort of electrical issue and instead of the fuse blowing it melted half of my fuse block causing an electrical fire. I had to replace the entire melted fuse box and re-wire half of the car. Ever since i have ran nothing but top quality fuses. What a shame and a pathetic fuse company glad you didn't experience the same.
Thank you very good video. Awesome information
I know this is an older video, but the stranding of wire really does not have a major impact on resistance, it's all about cross sectional area.
Going from 10 strands to 100 strands or 1000 strands will not have a major impact on resistance and therefore voltage drop, Ampacity, power handling, Wattage rating, however you want to refer to it.
The material of the wire does matter, such as going from copper clad aluminum to pure copper, but those resistance values can be looked up easily and typically pure copper is used in auto wiring.
Also just a note, by adding a ground from the alternator case, you technically did the "big 3+1" or "big 4" mod rather than just the big 3.
Was cool seeing you test how many Amps were being drawn on each wire, I suspect your biggest gains were from better grounding.