I think the problem comes from Chris Paul's reputation. He is called the Point God and his strength are efficiency and low turnovers as opposed to players like Westbrook who have better numbers thanks to riskier play. People don't expect him to put up 30 a game. But in this series he had a ton of turnovers and shot poorly, which makes it hard to ignore. He did the opposite of what he is celebrated for.
actually cp3 is capable of putting up big numbers on great efficiency and low turnovers. He did so many times in these playoffs. He had 2 30pt games and 2 28pt games, so 4 games at or near 30pts in these playoffs round 1 and round 2. I get your point that he is not really expected to score so much, but he has shown it many times especially in these playoffs and you cannot ignore that. Like, he didn't miss a single shot, not a single shot, in one game vs the pelicans in these playoffs. He scored 33 points on a literally perfect shooting night. How can he go from scoring multiple 30pt games, to then scoring less than 15 points in 5 straight consecutive games? I'm not even mentioning the big turnovers. Also what's crazy is that his efficiency was still good during those 5 games...he simply attempted wayyy fewer shots than in previous games. Why? I don't understand at all, because the mavs defense was more focused on booker than him...so why did he attempt so few shots? It is pretty bizarre imo.
@Thomas Lequesne what series are you talking about? The video talks about all of his playoff series. Lol Also I'm not sure how you can bring up CP's reputation and NOT mention how much of a complainer he is. Yeah it's a player's job to compete and win. If you can fool a ref to call things in your favor then do so... BUT CP3 is such a baby! People who are not fans of his or the team he is on hate how much he complains and tries to bait players & refs. It's not fun, entertaining basketball. Just like Harden's play style in Houston where he was getting fouled every play. So anytime CP3 does have a bad playoff game or series, the media and fans are harder on him.
@@ItsMrGQ2U doc has a ring from a Celtics team that had prime pierce, garnet, rondo and ray allen that went up against a lakers team with a injured Andrew bynum and Kobe who was gassed
@@lordquastheonly okay and?… how many stacked teams has Chris Paul been on?… & Garnett, Allen and rondo were not in their prime… Rondo had barely been in the league for 2 years and Garnett and Allen were in their 12th-13th years… 🤡
To be clear, all superstars have had bad games, and in some cases, bad series, in the playoffs. With CP3 though, we have seen a lot of highs and lows with him that people are tired of not seeing him get the title
It's not just that, it's that Chris Paul is just now starting to get the criticism all the other superstars/stars get when their teams consistently underperform and lose early in the playoffs. He gets the critism a top 10 point guard of all time gets when he's only made it past the second round twice
Isaiah Thomas said it best Chris Paul tries to have these perfect stat line games but when you need him he’s either hurt or just disappears like this last series with Dallas. Everybody labels chris paul the “leader” of the suns and in close out games just because he was barely missing doesn’t mean he was positively impacting the games. Two things can be true
Even Booker kind of hinted at it saying hed rather go 16-17 than 16-16. If a star is having a really good game you would think he would take more shots instead of opting for the efficient game
@@skproductions8495 Booker ain't even It himself. Half of Phoenix failures gotta go to him. He can't even get the Suns to the playoffs. They needed CP3 at age 36-37 to come do it. Cp3 played horrible but Book was no showing.
@@daevonthesavage7483 he was in the league for 5 years without making the playoffs and if it wasn’t for a technicality the suns would’ve been playing for the 8th seed in the bubble. Chris Paul came in to a situation where the team was taking a step forward with or without him, he just sped up the process and since he’s been in Phoenix everybody says Chris Paul is the “leader” of the team but d book gets the blame when people act like he was just stat padding but he’s been the same player with or without Chris Paul just say you want book to average 30
@Disgruntled Simp Mod Stacked Team??? Every team he's been on theres always been a better team. With New Orleans, the Spurs Lakers, Celtics etc. With the Clippers there was the hawks, the warriors were emerging, Cavs, Lakers(11-12), Chicago with D rose, Spurs, Celtics. With Houston there was the warriors with KD, and with Phoenix theres the bucks, the warriors, the nets, Celtics, Heat. So how tf was he on stacked teams
By his own estimation CP3 choked or was injured in 7 of the 9 sample playoff series and came to the conclusion that he’s not a choker and went so far to actually argue CP3 improves in the playoffs. Why am I feeling he’s not completely objective
Yes, just because they are the favorites doesn't mean they already won. They have to get the job done either way. But you can't blame totally someone for losing while being the underdog and performing on an all-time high. At the end of the day, basketball is a team game and injuries exist. But thats just my opinion.
Yea no just because you are underdog doesnt mean you already lost the series either the bulk of the blame has to go on the superstar feet because if they win and the superstar doesn’t play well they will still get the bulk of the credit
sounds like a excuse ? name one team where the opposing team was better then the clippers. Sure the spurs but who else. They had chances to make the wcf but choked. 2012 vs the spurs cp3 was horrible and 2008 vs the spurs in 7 games they were up 2-0 and duncan was struggling in that series vs Tyson Chandler. Cp3 in game 3 during the 4th quarter cp3 scored only 2 points at the 11:13 mark and the rest of the quarter dude went 0 points on 0/3 fg and what about game 7 during the 4th quarter in the last 6:50 cp3 scored 0 points on 0/2 and 1 turnover and got outscored by parker. next year in the 1st round vs the nuggets he got outplayed by Billups in game cp3 scored 21 points on 36 % shooting and 4 turnovers and the next game paul scored 14 points on 5 turnovers also in game 4 paul had his worst game in that series scoring 4 points on 28 % with 6 turnovers and in the elimination game cp3 scored 12 points 31 %, what about that series vs the thunder where cp3 choked in game 5 also in houston they blew a 3-1 lead when harden was playing horrible and they didn`t have their best defensive PG PAT in that series, 2021 finals cp3 played horrible in last 3 games, this year vs the mavs .
Look if we want to consider a guy to be a top 3 PG of all time you can’t blame his teammates every time he loses in the playoffs. You gotta hold him to the same expectations as steph and magic.
That's facts. People love calling him the best pure PG in the league, but don't hold him to the same standards as Steph. Curry had one bad Finals and people still talk about it, while Cp3 has had multiple bad performances, and all I hear are excuses for him.
@@hoody_yt Nah. People use that 2016 performance to discredit what he did in 2015 and all the years after 2016, even though he has never performed that poorly ever again. That's where the whole Curry isn't clutch narrative comes from, and it's the most common criticism of Curry's career. The only time Curry has been given a pass was the 2019 Finals.
12:35 Rockets is no business competing with Warriors in 2018? Come on bro, Houston is best team in the league with franchise record 65 wins and your saying they have no business competing with the Warriors? They are the only team has the potential beating the healthy Warriors with Durant on the team.
It’s fascinating how quickly the narrative can change on someone. Before Chris Paul’s Thunder stint, people crapped on him all the time about his playoff failures, then CP3 nearly beat the Rockets with an underdog Thunder team, then he leads the Suns to the finals (plays great throughout) and everyone’s talking about how he’s so underrated including in the clutch. Then he has 1 bad game in the finals, they lose the finals, CP3 chokes against the Mavs and we are right back to the Chris Paul always chokes narrative. I personally feel Chris Paul is a player that has shown time and time again that he elevates his play during the playoffs (Go back and look at the close out games in the 2018 Western Conference semi-finals and 2021 Western Conference finals for examples), but he doesn’t do it often enough to be considered a super clutch player. On top of that, he has a few notable failures that stick out to people more than his successes, especially since a lot of people hate Chris Paul. Is CP3 a mamba-like killer, no, is he a perennial choker, also no.
It is called "recency bias" and happens on every sport tbh. Fans, especially the more casual fans, praise or disrespect players based on what they did the past year or even the past few months.
“Clutch” “choker” “mamba mentality” and whatever other terminology is just low IQ NBA-astrology tier bullshit anyway. No player has ever won a championship on their own and LOW did a great job showing what’s held CP3 back his whole career (essentially just bad luck)
@@gobot581 I’m surprised LOW didn’t even mention it in the video. Wasn’t it for game 5? LOW made it sound like he just fell off a cliff after the first 2 games
As if CP3 and Harden wouldn't have found a way to choke after that series. Lebron was wild those playoffs and the Rockets defense just wasn't great they just relied on the 3. Warriors had a great defense when healthy 2015-19. Also the very next year they lost when KD went down. They didnt have the heart.
so close to losing? You remember that he was healthy the year after right? And KD (the best player in GS) was injured. Y'all lost at home. What should haunt you is the fact that y'all went 0-27 from three in the last stretch of the game
@@Uchawibeatz the year after the rockets didn’t win 65 games cause of injuries. that’s the year harden scored 30 points 32 games in a row. he had to carry the team for the majority of the season. so yeah, we lost the next year, but that rockets team wasn’t nearly as good as the one in 2018. plus the warriors had home court advantage in 2019. also, we were close to winning. we went 7 games with the greatest team of all time, fully healthy. no other team can claim that. just because i didn’t *specifically* put the rockets missing 27 threes in my initial comment doesn’t mean i don’t acknowledge it. it’s part of the context of being “so close”, do you get it now?
I've never really blamed CP3 because I've always thought he had overrated teammates. Prime Blake Griffin, and current Devin Brooker are in my opinion two of the most all-time overrated players ever. When he was in LA he had Blake Griffin who should have played center but always played power forward. Blake was a terrible shooter who became an okay shooter as his athleticism began to fail. He was a terrible defender and mediocre rebounder for somebody of his size, athleticism, and purported skill. And in Phoenix he's had Devin Booker, The guy who complained and cried about being double teamed in a practice. The guy who consistently underperforms in key games, the guy who is vastly overrated in his basketball ability. He is an ok defender, decent shooter, great all around scorer, mediocre passer. And not particularly clutch. So while CP3 is certainly not without blame in these failures, it's not all on him.
Let’s not forget on the rockets where he had harden taking all the shots and not really being that much of a playmaker as people say he was especially in the post.
I gotta agree Devin Booker is kind of overrated for example being compare with Kobe. But for example last year against Bucks he drop back to back 40 points games yet Chris Paul didnt perform so great so he is to blame too.
“2018 rockets had no business competing with the warriors” is honestly untrue. Beyond having homecourt, multiple warriors players have said that this rockets team was the one that scared them the most and had them on the ropes/closest to beat them. They literally were formed to beat them, and were able to be up in the fourth quarter of game six and game 7 without CP.
Why’d we not bring up the 2019 Rockets? KD got hurt and they couldn’t even push it to 7. They let Curry go from 0 first half to 30 in the 2nd half to close them out
- Agree. CP3 is a great player. The real kicker is blowing series leads. You can have bad games in a 7 game series but to blow several leads? That hurts his legacy. 2-0 vs Spurs in 2008 2-0 vs Grizzlies in 2013 3-1 vs Rockets in 2015 2-0 vs Blazers in 2016 (broken hand) 3-2 vs Warriors in 2018 (hamstring) 2-0 vs Bucks in 2021
The 2018 Rockets is 100% on James Harden. The Rockets was up double digits at the half of Game 6. You have to get that done. Should've never been a Game 7 to being with.
More like 60%. The whole team missed an impossible 23 threes _in a row,_ but Harden wasn't shooting every single one of those. For me, that embarassing 2018 WCF Game 6 choke-job is 60% Harden, 20% D'Antoni (a coach with his experience couldn't switch up tactics?), 20% role players (these are supposed to be some of the best basketballers on the planet, on account of making it to the NBA - couldn't they have taken it upon themselves to try more close-in shots?)
@@henryviiifake8244 in today's basketball, the midrange is foreign. Players ain't tryna be complete. One fan called the midrange a "pop's game." So nah they ain't gon think of more close in shots unless it's layups or dunks
@@daevonthesavage7483 Yup this is why cp worked so well for that team. He would always hit timely midrange shots that were usually open due to how the rockets play with 3s and layups. It’s sad that harden for some odd reason acted as if he isn’t capable of doing exactly the same. 🤦🏾♂️
You really want him to beat the greatest team of all time alone? What kinda standard is that Prime Lebron James couldn’t win a game against them in 2018.
Where are these excuses for other players. If he’s that dude and the point god and all that why hasn’t we won anything as a player not even mentioning a title. He’s Stockton with a fade and line up
I'm sick of people asking that when it comes to CP3. These excuses have been made for other players many times. People just like have selective memory and pick and choose when it acknowledge it.
@@Jaykurosakii That was only two years Buddy he made the playoffs 19 times in his career with a record of 85-87 in playoff games and only wining 16 out of 34 playoff series him and Karl definitely choked a bunch in the playoffs
@@waunthomas598 you just looked up some statistics that didn’t prove anything you wasn’t even alive when he played so you definitely don’t know what you are talking about and can’t show me any clips of him choking
That Chris Paul against the Spurs series you were talking about in '08 is reminding me a lot of this series that Giannis just went through it against the Celtics basically having to solo squad it because your team didn't show up or is injured
CP3 isn't a playoff choker, he's just not dependable. He's either hurt, inconsistent or both. He can't be the main cog to a championship team. At best, he has to be Jason Kidd for that Mav's championship. Timely but not pertinent
@@jemariohawkins5643 you are aware that lebron has 4 rings and had one of the greatest playoff runs ever in 2018 and made it to the playoffs 15 times and the conference finals 64 times correct?
@@ohnoitschr1s479 four rings with three different teams as well as appearing in eight Finals in a row. Really really impressive resume. I'm by no means a LBJ fan but the constant cherry picking and comparison to MJ or others is incredibly disproportionate.
It’s crazy how far people will go to defend this guy I’m hearing all the excuses in the world like they don’t happen to everyone where’s the consistency?
@@trvspvrk Point was more that these same “legitimate facts” aren’t extended to most other players. Steph Curry is a choker, doesn’t matter what the circumstances are. Lebron is a choker doesn’t matter what the circumstances are. Harden and KD are chokers, doesn’t matter what the circumstances are. CP3 isn’t a choker because look at the circumstances.
Bro... why can't we just slander Chris Paul? Why when the moment Chris Paul plays like trash everyone immediately tries to defend him and deflect to his teammates. Damn, let us slander cliff Paul bruh.... trying to suck the fun out of shit...
I think the fact that he always seems to be injured and when he isn't injured he doesn't meet post season expectations for me i know i can't reky on him in the playoffs
CP3’s problem is that he’s 6FT nothing. Iverson and Isiah Thomas were small too but they at least had a speed advantage. CP3 has average speed which means he plays strictly off of fundamentals. When you’re small and have zero physical advantages, you have to play harder than everyone else in order to compensate. This is why CP3 usually gasses out in the Playoffs or he ends up hurt.
The man is a great playmaker, an efficient scorer, a good ball handler, and his IQ is up there with the best. I wouldn't call that "6ft nothing". Also, he's shown that you don't always need speed and athleticism to be great.
Young MVP candidate Chris was blowing past guys he wasn’t Westbrook or Rose but he was a great athlete. Dudes like 37 even Lebron has lost a few step he was just so much faster and stronger that it’s not as noticeable
Idk man. I am seeing a lot of defense for CP3. What he has done this year was inexcusable. The years where he was hurt for close out games I don’t hold against him. I can’t help if his hamstring turns into a problem. However I keep seeing people defending CP3 on this year. I don’t get it. Booker choked absolutely no question. But look at this blown lead. Look at the bullying of the Suns the Mavs put on. If LOW, who I can tell loves CP3 from past videos and streams I’ve watched, can say he played a part in the choking of the series there has to be some truth in it.
Was CP3 and his teams unlucky with injuries? Yes Was CP3 favored in all his series? Not all the time Did CP3 have good playoff games? Yes Did CP3 have bad playoff games? Yes The thing is whenever CP3 has bad games, it comes in the worst times possible. Those simply outweigh those other good performances that he has had especially for someone who hasn't won a championship
@@jemirtoussaint7360 I mean he set a high standard for himself so he should be disappointed in his recent showings. That being said, if he really was bugged by a hamstring injury, there isn't much he could have done
@@jemirtoussaint7360 so everyone can be overly critical of Harden Westbrook Kyrie even Lebron at times but we draw the line at the CP3? I don't understand you people
The question has to be asked “how far can you go and what can you reasonably expect with a superstar small guard”. Outside of Isaiah Thomas, CP is the most accomplished small guard in league history. In my opinion CP is the best floor raiser ever but he is just to small to be the best player on a championship team unless everything around him is literally perfect. Ex. Stephen Curry in the warrior system
@@rence5785 the team wins no championships with Draymond Green, and Andre Igoudala. They were primarily ball movers. The. system is based on ball movement, trust, and defense(when they have good defenders on the roster) Steph is the focal point of the system run but is not the system
@@Skyepuppies they won 15 games without steph dude. And that ball movement happens because of steph's gravity. His off ball movement attracts 2 people almost all the time. They were also the 4th seed before steph got hurt last yr, then GS fell to the 10th seed while he's out and still carried the team to the 8th seed.
Honestly CP is more accomplished than Thomas, only thing IT has is 2 rings, which is the main thing players play for but looking at their accomplishments CP has definitely done more
The first series is on a slant!!! You failed to mention David West had 2 30 point games that series or CP3 inability to guard Tony Parker. Or the fact that NO won the division that year and split 2-2 with San Antonio. David West outplayed Tim Duncan. They just blew their chance! Stop softening what it was!
This is why I watch ur mini-documentary videos u are very well detailed and don’t cave to what some of ur viewers want to hear thx for these vids man I enjoy it gives me a better perspective on things in the NBA world
If you look at the number of leads lost then yeah you gotta say he is. But simply just for my opinion I put Harden above EVERYONE. In alot of CP3 meltdowns it seems as if he just isnt playing all that great. Whereas Harden? Its like he either gives up or is simply swallowed by the moments.
Nah Harden is over CP3 in this one Chris isn’t going to escape being called a chocker but James has definitely fumbled the bag on way more occasions than Paul. But Your top 3 is accurate & the Username checks out Bingo on this comment 😂 ah see what I did there
That was two games. How did he perform in the other four? E.g. His turnover at the end of Game 5 directly led to the Suns losing that game, so *in that particular case* it wouldn't have mattered if he dropped even another 70-piece beforehand. Plus the Bucks as a squad showed up on defense in a way the Suns didn't, not just Giannis unlocking God Mode like Goku with Ultra Instinct. 🤷♂️
i understand the take and i love low but even still i think at some point we have to hold the player accountable for not being healthy when your team needs you the most. i find it crazy that we only put the injury context on the players we like. if you like bron, k love nd kyrie was hurt. if you like curry, he was hurt in 2016 and dray got ejected and their big was hurt. if you like kawhi, we havent seen a complete clippers team yet someone is always hurt
@@benjaminan1183 Paul George was hurt on and off almost all year he missed about 25 games Reggie Jackson only played 17 games for them and pat Bev was injured in the playoffs
@@lordquastheonly the sad part is Chris Paul was healthy enough to play u break a foot you’re not playing so if u can play I would expect you to perform I’m not gone keep saying well he’s hurt so he sucks cuz if it’s like that he shouldn’t play
You didn’t mention 2019 against GSW when KD got hurt and he played mid at best. 2017 despite the fact griffin got hurt, he had a chance to at least win the series, but he folded in game 7. 2012 he got destroyed by San Antonio and played like trash. I personally don’t blame booker as much because he is still somewhat young and cp gets all the credit when they win so he deserves criticism when they lose
Even if you can back up that Chris Paul isn't exactly a playoff choker, it still doesn't change anything about his legacy. People aren't looking into how Chris Paul's performed in those series. They are just going to look at the fact that Chris Paul blew those leads and make their assumptions around that. It's sad and I don't exactly agree with that mentality but it is what it is.
Consistently being Injured when you’re needed the most Is choking. And yes I know Injuries happen but at what point do we let that be the excuse every time ?
How often you hear this argument of "they were up 2:0.". Everyone knows the series starts when both teams played at home. Its completely normal to have a standing of 2:0 after 2 games as the team with home court advantage 😂😂
As a clippers fan myself that 2015 series stung really really stung because imagine that conference finals during that time the one team that could give Golden State a significantly hard time was the Clippers that could have easily gone to 7 games and possibly history would have been written a little differently because the clippers during that time could have prevailed But history is written by the victor and Houston what's the victor in that series
CP3 averages around 22/9/5 with 55% FG in his over 30 career closeout games. He really only had like 5-6 bad games in his career and people call him a choker.
Because you will only get a handful of actual championship chances. Closing out the 35 win Pelicans is not impressive it's what you're expected to do, it's when you're facing an equal opponent that matters. Plus Chris Paul is supposed to "make everyone around him better" where did that go in the playoffs
Means nothing if he didn't hit the big shots at the right times, which obviously he didn't! Can't fool real fans by just throwing out numbers, they need some context to be completely accurate
@@EyeEmEl Plz re read my comment. Im a clippers fan. Blake Griffen been bitching about CP3. He only passes to easy assist guys. He ain't no Nash or even Rubio with the pass game. We had a lot of tools that he never leveraged because easy shovel passes help him when it come to contract negotiations. Look at the roster and see who we had. We had the one of the deepest benches in the league at the time. However how can u ask for men to do something in the playoffs that they never did in the regular season. CP3 always being injured is usually due to him doing to much. He had support n wasted with the clippers. Cliff Paul has always fooled a lot of people. I dont expect u to agree, just saying my piece.
went back to this video and we forgot about the series where he averaged 12.75 PPG on 36.8% FG against the spurs while the clippers blew a 24-point lead in game 3 in an eventual sweep
This video screams "I'm a CP3 fan." When the warriors blew a 3-1 lead, they were criticized, Especially Steph. When the Thunder blew a 3-1 lead to that same Warriors team, KD and Westbrook were criticized. If we're not gonna be consistent with Chris Paul, we shouldn't be critical towards these stars at all.
TMac isn't too far behind in my view. Came up small in 03 with the Magic against the Pistons after being up 3-1. Lost game 7 putting up a putrid 21 pts in the most important game of the season. Same thing again in 05 with the Rockets after being up 2-0 against the Mavs losing game 7 by 40, and again up 2-0 with Rockets against the Jazz losing game 7 at home after leading the series 3-2 even. It happens. Things happen, circumstances are involved, it is what it is. Not everyone gets an NBA Championship in their career, and it doesn't diminish what they've done for the game. CP3, I'm sure, will retire one day feeling unfulfilled somewhat without winning a ring but in no way will leave any doubt that he gave it everything he had, and that I can appreciate.
Chris Paul will never win a ring as a starter in the NBA. I know that's pretty obvious, but it seems like some people still think that he is the "Best point guard ever" 😆 🤣 😂
It’s so hard to admit he’s a choker for me but I think it’s true, I have been the guy making every excuse for cp3 when his teams implode… even in this last series vs the mavs I was telling everyone the suns would win and chris would bounce back. It’s a tough pill to swallow he’s been my my favorite player for over a decade.😩 TLDR: I need a hug😩😩
As a Bucks Fan, I'd say he's not a playoff choker. No team led solely by a Small Guard, (aside from Curry & Isiah) has won a championship. Chris Paul took the Suns to the Finals and ran into the 2nd or 3rd Best Player of our Generation Giannis Antetokounmpo. This Year he choked & Gassed out, just like 2015, but aside from a few blips, he's been a good playoff performer to his standards.
@@lordtarroc hes 6 foot on a good day. you're telling me there's not a big difference in someone thats 6 ft vs 6'3? or how about someone thats 6'6 vs 6'9?
You could make this a series for superstar players that most basketball fans believe should've won a ring. Or just great players who came close in general.
@@urbaindelva7869 relying on CP3 to show up is like banking on a role player to explode. He's hella inconsistent. If only he gets greedy with scoring,he could have a title already. Only Magic won a title being a pass-first PG.
How is being injured = "disappearing"? He has little to no control of when and how he'll get injured. What he _does_ have control over is when he's playing like 💩, and for that he _should_ be catching flak.
I feel like another player that should be more criticized is Kevin Durant. That man has done absolutely nothing in the playoffs except for when he was on the warriors.
I remember watching CP3 when he used to be with LAC. I like him as a player as he's a legit baller. However seeing him leave LA and go from team to team only to always come up short says something. He's not that guy that makes everyone around him better. Yeah he can score and get assists but when it really matters he just folds. The past two years were his best shots at a title and ring imo. The team he has had in Phoenix was probably one of the best supporting cast, scorers, defenders and solid bench and a guy who is a scoring machine in Devin Booker. I get that you get passionate about what you love but sometimes he comes off sounding and looking like an asshole to his team. The one thing he did with Booker and actually the whole team was underestimate Dallas. I didn't have Dallas going to the finals or winning a chip this year, but I knew they were still dangerous enough to rally back. Be humble, true to yourself and be the best you can be for you and your team. He's had a great career and is a HoF no question about it. Can I say he's a better PG than say Stephen Curry? No at least not in my book. I might have Dame ahead of him but that last one is probably bias as I love Dame Lillard lol
@@thuggwaffle8825 people talk about CP3 like hes worse than Harden. Harden regularly disappears in the playoffs but where were the videos and hate crusades?
Harden's "choker" label has been overexaggerated too imo. Not gonna say he's had great moments, but some of his bad ones weren't as bad as people think.
I think that it's a mixed bag when it comes to Chris Paul. Like you can say that it's only three series, but I guess the question is whether or not you can define that as enough to be considered choking. Lebron had 2011 and he's never really lived that down. That's the only series that he's really choked in unless you count 2021 where I mean he did kind of give up, and don't quote me on this, but he still got decent numbers, right? Curry has consistently been really clutch except for one series, and he's also been labeled a career choker. I guess my thing is that I really don't get why some players are chokers and others aren't. Like Dame will get swept by Curry while severely underperforming, but Dame is way more clutch? PG and Kawhi both choked in 2020, but only one of them got hate for it? People meme the hell out of Embiid for being a choker, but he's been the only dude for how many years to consistently perform on that team? You know I mean other than Butler, but they traded his ass anyways in what will probably go down as one of the bigger regularly scheduled Philly Ls in history. We don't really even have a definition of choking, so how are we supposed to know what it means?
In my opinion Harden is the biggest playoff choker in NBA History. Unlike Paul he isn’t been injured for most of the series. His stats are worse in the playoffs then regular season and even worse in close out or elimination games.
I think people are tried of the under performance totally. He was suppose to be what Steph is in accolades. It's like a woman that cooks cleans looks great, is highly intelligent, but she's always single eventually you just give up and say something is wrong with her
Solid video. So many people are going to point to CP3’s statistical production as a reason why he’s not a choker. That just means they are ignoring the details and critical decisions/mistakes he made down the stretch of huge games. His entire postseason career is filled with a litany of series-altering mistakes, which isn’t a good look for someone who has, arguably, the highest basketball IQ of all time. He’s a choker and a fraud.
I see there’s a lot of ppl that are ignorant on the fact of why CP3 is called “Point-God”. It’s not because he’s perfect or unbeatable but it’s because he is the crim dela crim in regards to what a TRUE point guard should be. Score when needed, holds defense, gets everyone involved, efficient, a coach onna court.
As a CP3 fan I feel like him being a pure point guard hurt him. He's basically the leader of the team doing almost everything and only asking his partner (Griffin, Harden or Booker) to score a lot. Every time they come up short his team fails unless Paul drops 30. CP3 has to become a 25+ ppg player to hope to get a ring. They choked againts the Mavs tho.
@@trupimp2211 They objectively did not need CP3 in Game 6 of the 2018 WCF to win. They just played like 💩. That Rockets team had 23 _consecutive_ bricks. 🧱🏀 All else being equal, they only needed to hit a few of those to reach the Finals.
@@henryviiifake8244 True but honestly they could have easily been like the teammate they are missing in cp and actually take midrange shots to stop the bleeding. But sadly mike and harden live and die by that 3 standpoint.
In my years of watching Paul, the common factor to the blown 2-0 leads is the desire of a 3-0 lead. Once you win Game 3, you automatically win the series. This is because no team in NBA history has ever come back from down 3-0. Paul seems to want the 3-0 lead so bad that his teammates feel pressured to pull it off for him. The best way to prove this is with the Clippers, who were down 2-0 to the Mavs, Jazz and Suns in back-to-back-to-back rounds for the 2021 NBA Playoffs. The mystique of a 3-0 lead was so enormous for a lot of reasons, especially with the Clippers coming off the greatest 3-1 collapse in NBA history, that if opponents were to win Game 3 for the automatic series win, it would have meant the end of the Leonard-George duo and back in the lottery. Ty Lue realized this and decided to use the 3-0 lead to his advantage, knowing that opponents were distracted with the desire of a 3-0 lead over simply having to earn it.
For 2019 context, cp3 played fine averaging 17 amd 6 on 44:31:79 splits. The only game that was bad was game 5. But game 6 he stepped up with 27, 9, and 6. However, harden had 4 turnovers in that game 6 alone. Also, role players like eric gordon, clint capela, and gerald green were missing their shots as well. And the warriors were expected to win the series even with kd injured.
Meanwhile james harden average 35 7 and 5 on 44 35 82 split. And the rockets second leading scorer was eric gordon. And somehow it was james hardens fault.
The only thing I'm gonna say is this: I WHOLLY reject this idea that if a player gets hurt in the playoffs, while already being injury prone, that we should give said player a pass.. Because that's in and of itself a "factor of greatness", availability IS a factor of greatness. If it was an iron man like Jokic for example, then sure, but not in the case of players such as CP3, AD and Embiid etc, cuz THEY'RE ALWAYS HURT. That's what they do... so yeah, that's absolutely a knock on them in my book.
Your going to blame someone for not being physically able to play the game. If you want to use this argument players like Lebron, Kobe, Bird, and magic get knocked down on that all time list this isnt 2k were you can just turn injuries off
@@lordquastheonly What an absurd comparison. CP3 doesn't exist in the same stratosphere as any of those players you mentioned. The "worst" player of that bunch is probably Bird and he's literally done 10x more in the NBA than CP3. And I don't avaluate players in hypotheticals or assumptions, I avaluate them for what they actually accomplish (or in CP3's, what they don't accomplish).
Chris Paul can’t stay healthy in the playoffs. The only times he is healthy his team isn’t. Doesn’t matter though. Only things people will look back on is the W’s, L’s, and blown leads. I love the guy but I’ve lost faith in his teams come playoff time.
Nah he’s definitely a choker but for the most part he’s not a bad player in the playoffs just comes up short when it matters most however players like harden are bigger chokers then cp3
In the 1958 finals Bill Russell went down in game 3. All Bob Cousy needed to do was win 2 games. In the next 3 games he shot 37% from the field and lost the finals to the Hawks.
I will never forget that game 5 in 2014. That's when I was officially done believing in him like that. He's still a top 5 PG all time but that was unforgivable
CP3 is not a top 5 point guard of all time in any universe, 'sorry' to say :D Magic Johnson is the greatest pg of all time. Positions 2-4 go to Oscar Roberson, Isiah Thomas and Jerry West in some order. After that we have Curry, Stockton, Frazier, Kidd, Payton and so on. CP3 might just be a top 10 pg of all time but even that is debatable.
@@shinglesshingles So you did not have any arguments to support your claim after I put up some arguments of my own to counter yours but instead all you had was some personal insults? Not too surprising really...
@@Zamppa86 no I didn't need to "argue" with some one who clearly doesn't know what they're talking about and has a soccer club as their profile pic. Magic is clearly the best PG of all time and Oscar as well as Jerry West played more off-guard than lead guard and historically are remembered as SG's more than PG's. Curry is the only other PG definitively over CP3. And then the dumbass takes of Stockton and Walt Fraizer being over CP isn't worth anything, just proves you're not worth "arguing" with. As far as Kidd and Payton go there's just as much evidence to argue them over CP as CP over them. Personally neither of those guys did more with less like how CP3 did. Taking an overrated David West and Tyson Chandler along with an over the hill Peja to a 2nd seed and playoff run is way more impressive than having a hall of fame coach and all-star running mate like how the glove had and Kidd had multiple all-stars throughout his entire career and still did just as much as CP relative to their career path. So please like I said stick to soccer.
@@shinglesshingles Okey I'll destroy you then. 'Off guard' Big O averaged a triple double over his first 5 seasons so there's that. Pretty complete stats making people around him better while also scoring himself. West was all defensive caliber defender while also averaging better points than CP3 ever did alongside with 9+ assists when he needed to playmake more than score. Also a FMVP winner while playing for the losing team and so on. Also a champion. Stockton is an all time leader in assists and steals. Some people say he is even the same conversation for the greatest pure pg because of that. I'm not going that far though. Still he has more finals appearances than CP3 and better stats. Frazier is an all time great defender, 2 time champion and responsible of one of the greatest close out game performances ever in one of those finals when Willis Reed couldn't really play. Yep, he closed the series for Knicks to win a ring while this video here just stated how many times your CP3 actually choked/failed. Kidd was a mvp caliber player while he led the Nets into back to back finals. All time great on both ends, over 100 triple doubles, made his teammates better and also a champion. He made some big shots in the 2011 finals aswell even though it certainly was Dirk's team. You should also check those Nets teams Kidd led into the finals. Kenyon Martin, Kerry Kittles and so on isn't really a stacked team. Just wanted to mention because you talked about CP3's Hornets teammates. Gary Payton is probably the greatest defensive pg of all time and forced the GOAT Michael Jordan into his worst finals averages in '96 even though the Bulls went 72-10. Alongside with that all time great defense he could still score 20 and dish out 8-9 assists. He is also a champion. CP3 is an all time great no doubt but he isn't top 5 pg of all time because there are so many all time greats ahead of him with more achievements and/or better stats. CP3 has been in the finals only once and failed in the playoffs way too many times for him to be there. There's nothing wrong with being a CP3 fan, he was one of my favourites aswell when he played for the Hornets and Clippers aswell. One just has to realized and know the history. As I said there are way too many big names with better accomplishments for CP3 to be in top 5. Top 9-10 can be discussed though. I'll have CP3 in 9th or 10th above Steve Nash for example easily.
Rondo cursed CP3, he told him that he will never win a ring and looks like this is it
Beef History did a solid job going over Rondo and Paul beef.
Chris was never on a super team like Rondo. But give Rondo credit for helping the LeBron Lakers get a chip
@@robertweekes5783 and in the celtics playoffs Rondo was a real thing, we don't talk enough about the crazy games he had
Chris Paul's closest run to a ring ever was with the 2018 Rockets ..
@@MindMan424 naw it with the suns because he at least got to the finals and was only 2 games away
I think the problem comes from Chris Paul's reputation. He is called the Point God and his strength are efficiency and low turnovers as opposed to players like Westbrook who have better numbers thanks to riskier play. People don't expect him to put up 30 a game. But in this series he had a ton of turnovers and shot poorly, which makes it hard to ignore. He did the opposite of what he is celebrated for.
People call him a "God" and this "God" can't even God his way to a ring over three different decades
@@BigA678 yet he has all the other statistical accolades
@@Jates Westbrook has statistical accolades too, so does harden, yet we don't consider them God's
actually cp3 is capable of putting up big numbers on great efficiency and low turnovers. He did so many times in these playoffs. He had 2 30pt games and 2 28pt games, so 4 games at or near 30pts in these playoffs round 1 and round 2. I get your point that he is not really expected to score so much, but he has shown it many times especially in these playoffs and you cannot ignore that. Like, he didn't miss a single shot, not a single shot, in one game vs the pelicans in these playoffs. He scored 33 points on a literally perfect shooting night. How can he go from scoring multiple 30pt games, to then scoring less than 15 points in 5 straight consecutive games? I'm not even mentioning the big turnovers. Also what's crazy is that his efficiency was still good during those 5 games...he simply attempted wayyy fewer shots than in previous games. Why? I don't understand at all, because the mavs defense was more focused on booker than him...so why did he attempt so few shots? It is pretty bizarre imo.
@Thomas Lequesne what series are you talking about? The video talks about all of his playoff series. Lol
Also I'm not sure how you can bring up CP's reputation and NOT mention how much of a complainer he is. Yeah it's a player's job to compete and win. If you can fool a ref to call things in your favor then do so... BUT CP3 is such a baby! People who are not fans of his or the team he is on hate how much he complains and tries to bait players & refs. It's not fun, entertaining basketball. Just like Harden's play style in Houston where he was getting fouled every play. So anytime CP3 does have a bad playoff game or series, the media and fans are harder on him.
Can we talk about Doc Rivers playoff resume please? That deserves a deepdive💀💀
Chris Paul’s is worse…
@@ItsMrGQ2U hell no
@@vTrueDad who has more rings and more finals appearances?
@@ItsMrGQ2U doc has a ring from a Celtics team that had prime pierce, garnet, rondo and ray allen that went up against a lakers team with a injured Andrew bynum and Kobe who was gassed
@@lordquastheonly okay and?… how many stacked teams has Chris Paul been on?…
& Garnett, Allen and rondo were not in their prime… Rondo had barely been in the league for 2 years and Garnett and Allen were in their 12th-13th years… 🤡
To be clear, all superstars have had bad games, and in some cases, bad series, in the playoffs. With CP3 though, we have seen a lot of highs and lows with him that people are tired of not seeing him get the title
I love seeing him not win the title, he's one of the dirtiest players in the league
@@SuperNuclearUnicorn dont get the chris paul fans mad
It's not just that, it's that Chris Paul is just now starting to get the criticism all the other superstars/stars get when their teams consistently underperform and lose early in the playoffs. He gets the critism a top 10 point guard of all time gets when he's only made it past the second round twice
Boy all the chris paul fans are gonna hate this their getting their advanced stats and career VORP numbers out as we speak 😂
@@SuperNuclearUnicorn same
All I'm saying is Bob Cousey doesn't blow that lead
Bruh💀
👀
🤣🤣🤣
Pause
Lmao 🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣 goat comment
My takeway from this video is that Peja Stojaković is by far the worst Game 7 Performer in NBA History.
Agreed
😆 respect 😆
Completely agree
Game 7 peja vs game 6 klay
The anti Robert horry
Isaiah Thomas said it best Chris Paul tries to have these perfect stat line games but when you need him he’s either hurt or just disappears like this last series with Dallas. Everybody labels chris paul the “leader” of the suns and in close out games just because he was barely missing doesn’t mean he was positively impacting the games. Two things can be true
Even Booker kind of hinted at it saying hed rather go 16-17 than 16-16. If a star is having a really good game you would think he would take more shots instead of opting for the efficient game
@@skproductions8495 Booker ain't even It himself. Half of Phoenix failures gotta go to him. He can't even get the Suns to the playoffs. They needed CP3 at age 36-37 to come do it. Cp3 played horrible but Book was no showing.
@@daevonthesavage7483 He definitely showed up for more games than Paul
@@skproductions8495 cp showed for both series but in the end they both choked
@@daevonthesavage7483 he was in the league for 5 years without making the playoffs and if it wasn’t for a technicality the suns would’ve been playing for the 8th seed in the bubble. Chris Paul came in to a situation where the team was taking a step forward with or without him, he just sped up the process and since he’s been in Phoenix everybody says Chris Paul is the “leader” of the team but d book gets the blame when people act like he was just stat padding but he’s been the same player with or without Chris Paul just say you want book to average 30
If he’s gonna get credit for “winning wherever he goes” he’s gonna get the blame every time they don’t win when he has a series lead
@Disgruntled Simp Mod Stacked Team??? Every team he's been on theres always been a better team. With New Orleans, the Spurs Lakers, Celtics etc. With the Clippers there was the hawks, the warriors were emerging, Cavs, Lakers(11-12), Chicago with D rose, Spurs, Celtics. With Houston there was the warriors with KD, and with Phoenix theres the bucks, the warriors, the nets, Celtics, Heat. So how tf was he on stacked teams
By his own estimation CP3 choked or was injured in 7 of the 9 sample playoff series and came to the conclusion that he’s not a choker and went so far to actually argue CP3 improves in the playoffs. Why am I feeling he’s not completely objective
Cp3 act injurred
Exactly, he improves then he chokes
Wow so out of 26 playoff series, there's been 7 where he's had bad games. I guess the guy isn't objective then huh
If you can't blame someone for losing a series they weren't favorited in, can you give someone credit for winning a series they were favorited in?
Great point
Depends on the context
Yes, just because they are the favorites doesn't mean they already won. They have to get the job done either way. But you can't blame totally someone for losing while being the underdog and performing on an all-time high. At the end of the day, basketball is a team game and injuries exist. But thats just my opinion.
Yea no just because you are underdog doesnt mean you already lost the series either the bulk of the blame has to go on the superstar feet because if they win and the superstar doesn’t play well they will still get the bulk of the credit
sounds like a excuse ? name one team where the opposing team was better then the clippers. Sure the spurs but who else. They had chances to make the wcf but choked. 2012 vs the spurs cp3 was horrible and 2008 vs the spurs in 7 games they were up 2-0 and duncan was struggling in that series vs Tyson Chandler. Cp3 in game 3 during the 4th quarter cp3 scored only 2 points at the 11:13 mark and the rest of the quarter dude went 0 points on 0/3 fg and what about game 7 during the 4th quarter in the last 6:50 cp3 scored 0 points on 0/2 and 1 turnover and got outscored by parker. next year in the 1st round vs the nuggets he got outplayed by Billups in game cp3 scored 21 points on 36 % shooting and 4 turnovers and the next game paul scored 14 points on 5 turnovers also in game 4 paul had his worst game in that series scoring 4 points on 28 % with 6 turnovers and in the elimination game cp3 scored 12 points 31 %, what about that series vs the thunder where cp3 choked in game 5 also in houston they blew a 3-1 lead when harden was playing horrible and they didn`t have their best defensive PG PAT in that series, 2021 finals cp3 played horrible in last 3 games, this year vs the mavs .
Look if we want to consider a guy to be a top 3 PG of all time you can’t blame his teammates every time he loses in the playoffs. You gotta hold him to the same expectations as steph and magic.
That's facts. People love calling him the best pure PG in the league, but don't hold him to the same standards as Steph. Curry had one bad Finals and people still talk about it, while Cp3 has had multiple bad performances, and all I hear are excuses for him.
@@allenmk138 are you good 💀 people make excuses for currys 2016 finals all the time literal media members have as well 🤣🤣
@@hoody_yt Nah. People use that 2016 performance to discredit what he did in 2015 and all the years after 2016, even though he has never performed that poorly ever again. That's where the whole Curry isn't clutch narrative comes from, and it's the most common criticism of Curry's career. The only time Curry has been given a pass was the 2019 Finals.
basketball is a team sport nobody wins alone lmao
@@allenmk138 steph hasn’t won a single playoff series without klay
12:35 Rockets is no business competing with Warriors in 2018? Come on bro, Houston is best team in the league with franchise record 65 wins and your saying they have no business competing with the Warriors? They are the only team has the potential beating the healthy Warriors with Durant on the team.
It’s fascinating how quickly the narrative can change on someone. Before Chris Paul’s Thunder stint, people crapped on him all the time about his playoff failures, then CP3 nearly beat the Rockets with an underdog Thunder team, then he leads the Suns to the finals (plays great throughout) and everyone’s talking about how he’s so underrated including in the clutch. Then he has 1 bad game in the finals, they lose the finals, CP3 chokes against the Mavs and we are right back to the Chris Paul always chokes narrative. I personally feel Chris Paul is a player that has shown time and time again that he elevates his play during the playoffs (Go back and look at the close out games in the 2018 Western Conference semi-finals and 2021 Western Conference finals for examples), but he doesn’t do it often enough to be considered a super clutch player. On top of that, he has a few notable failures that stick out to people more than his successes, especially since a lot of people hate Chris Paul. Is CP3 a mamba-like killer, no, is he a perennial choker, also no.
It is called "recency bias" and happens on every sport tbh. Fans, especially the more casual fans, praise or disrespect players based on what they did the past year or even the past few months.
@@karpparino True, but recency bias is so common you’d think people would realize or at least remember stuff that happened just a few years ago.
Think about this just a few games ago he had a perfect game in the playoffs. The bias is huge
“Clutch” “choker” “mamba mentality” and whatever other terminology is just low IQ NBA-astrology tier bullshit anyway. No player has ever won a championship on their own and LOW did a great job showing what’s held CP3 back his whole career (essentially just bad luck)
@@gobot581 I’m surprised LOW didn’t even mention it in the video. Wasn’t it for game 5? LOW made it sound like he just fell off a cliff after the first 2 games
the clip of cp3 grabbing his hamstring still haunts me as a rockets fan, knowing that we were so close, smh.
As if CP3 and Harden wouldn't have found a way to choke after that series. Lebron was wild those playoffs and the Rockets defense just wasn't great they just relied on the 3. Warriors had a great defense when healthy 2015-19. Also the very next year they lost when KD went down. They didnt have the heart.
so close to losing? You remember that he was healthy the year after right? And KD (the best player in GS) was injured. Y'all lost at home. What should haunt you is the fact that y'all went 0-27 from three in the last stretch of the game
@@Uchawibeatz the year after the rockets didn’t win 65 games cause of injuries.
that’s the year harden scored 30 points 32 games in a row. he had to carry the team for the majority of the season.
so yeah, we lost the next year, but that rockets team wasn’t nearly as good as the one in 2018. plus the warriors had home court advantage in 2019.
also, we were close to winning. we went 7 games with the greatest team of all time, fully healthy. no other team can claim that.
just because i didn’t *specifically* put the rockets missing 27 threes in my initial comment doesn’t mean i don’t acknowledge it.
it’s part of the context of being “so close”, do you get it now?
@Geordie Jones Lebron isn’t beating that Rockets team be serious
@@judoka. not to forget 2 17 pt leads blown in the 4th because Harden went MIA
I've never really blamed CP3 because I've always thought he had overrated teammates. Prime Blake Griffin, and current Devin Brooker are in my opinion two of the most all-time overrated players ever.
When he was in LA he had Blake Griffin who should have played center but always played power forward. Blake was a terrible shooter who became an okay shooter as his athleticism began to fail. He was a terrible defender and mediocre rebounder for somebody of his size, athleticism, and purported skill.
And in Phoenix he's had Devin Booker, The guy who complained and cried about being double teamed in a practice. The guy who consistently underperforms in key games, the guy who is vastly overrated in his basketball ability. He is an ok defender, decent shooter, great all around scorer, mediocre passer. And not particularly clutch.
So while CP3 is certainly not without blame in these failures, it's not all on him.
Let’s not forget on the rockets where he had harden taking all the shots and not really being that much of a playmaker as people say he was especially in the post.
I gotta agree Devin Booker is kind of overrated for example being compare with Kobe. But for example last year against Bucks he drop back to back 40 points games yet Chris Paul didnt perform so great so he is to blame too.
And don't forget he cried about the Raptors mascot
Go ahead and throw harden in there too.
Blake learned to shoot the second he became washed up
“2018 rockets had no business competing with the warriors” is honestly untrue. Beyond having homecourt, multiple warriors players have said that this rockets team was the one that scared them the most and had them on the ropes/closest to beat them. They literally were formed to beat them, and were able to be up in the fourth quarter of game six and game 7 without CP.
Teams be having a come back against Chris Paul so often that even his hairline got a come back
Why’d we not bring up the 2019 Rockets? KD got hurt and they couldn’t even push it to 7. They let Curry go from 0 first half to 30 in the 2nd half to close them out
- Agree. CP3 is a great player. The real kicker is blowing series leads. You can have bad games in a 7 game series but to blow several leads? That hurts his legacy.
2-0 vs Spurs in 2008
2-0 vs Grizzlies in 2013
3-1 vs Rockets in 2015
2-0 vs Blazers in 2016 (broken hand)
3-2 vs Warriors in 2018 (hamstring)
2-0 vs Bucks in 2021
The 2018 Rockets is 100% on James Harden. The Rockets was up double digits at the half of Game 6. You have to get that done. Should've never been a Game 7 to being with.
More like 60%. The whole team missed an impossible 23 threes _in a row,_ but Harden wasn't shooting every single one of those.
For me, that embarassing 2018 WCF Game 6 choke-job is 60% Harden, 20% D'Antoni (a coach with his experience couldn't switch up tactics?), 20% role players (these are supposed to be some of the best basketballers on the planet, on account of making it to the NBA - couldn't they have taken it upon themselves to try more close-in shots?)
@@henryviiifake8244 in today's basketball, the midrange is foreign. Players ain't tryna be complete. One fan called the midrange a "pop's game." So nah they ain't gon think of more close in shots unless it's layups or dunks
@@daevonthesavage7483 Yup this is why cp worked so well for that team. He would always hit timely midrange shots that were usually open due to how the rockets play with 3s and layups. It’s sad that harden for some odd reason acted as if he isn’t capable of doing exactly the same. 🤦🏾♂️
@@henryviiifake8244 Great breakdown and I agree but the 27 3s in a row was Game 7.
You really want him to beat the greatest team of all time alone? What kinda standard is that Prime Lebron James couldn’t win a game against them in 2018.
Where are these excuses for other players. If he’s that dude and the point god and all that why hasn’t we won anything as a player not even mentioning a title. He’s Stockton with a fade and line up
I'm sick of people asking that when it comes to CP3. These excuses have been made for other players many times. People just like have selective memory and pick and choose when it acknowledge it.
Exactly
Stockton showed up in the playoffs he just went against Jordan
@@Jaykurosakii That was only two years Buddy he made the playoffs 19 times in his career with a record of 85-87 in playoff games and only wining 16 out of 34 playoff series him and Karl definitely choked a bunch in the playoffs
@@waunthomas598 you just looked up some statistics that didn’t prove anything you wasn’t even alive when he played so you definitely don’t know what you are talking about and can’t show me any clips of him choking
"who's gonna dance with cam payne before the game" LMAOOOOOO
That Chris Paul against the Spurs series you were talking about in '08 is reminding me a lot of this series that Giannis just went through it against the Celtics basically having to solo squad it because your team didn't show up or is injured
@Aftermath tell em
@Aftermath L comment
This why CP3 gets hate lol don’t compare him to other actual stars
CP3 isn't a playoff choker, he's just not dependable. He's either hurt, inconsistent or both. He can't be the main cog to a championship team. At best, he has to be Jason Kidd for that Mav's championship. Timely but not pertinent
He's a choker bro ain't no way around it
You can't average 9 points and 4 turnovers for 5 straight games and not be called a choker
@@ramonmonch so bron chocked
@@jemariohawkins5643 you are aware that lebron has 4 rings and had one of the greatest playoff runs ever in 2018 and made it to the playoffs 15 times and the conference finals 64 times correct?
@@ohnoitschr1s479 four rings with three different teams as well as appearing in eight Finals in a row. Really really impressive resume. I'm by no means a LBJ fan but the constant cherry picking and comparison to MJ or others is incredibly disproportionate.
It’s crazy how far people will go to defend this guy I’m hearing all the excuses in the world like they don’t happen to everyone where’s the consistency?
legitimate facts are excuses?
@@trvspvrk Point was more that these same “legitimate facts” aren’t extended to most other players. Steph Curry is a choker, doesn’t matter what the circumstances are. Lebron is a choker doesn’t matter what the circumstances are. Harden and KD are chokers, doesn’t matter what the circumstances are. CP3 isn’t a choker because look at the circumstances.
@@Maltesfilm and it's wild because CP3 is easily the least likeable of those players and yet he gets defended so much
i mean to be fair he gets injured a lot. it’s hard to say that a player choked when they get injured & they physically can’t play.
Exactly it's disgusting! 😂
Bro... why can't we just slander Chris Paul? Why when the moment Chris Paul plays like trash everyone immediately tries to defend him and deflect to his teammates. Damn, let us slander cliff Paul bruh.... trying to suck the fun out of shit...
Batman, I agree let's trash whoever we want. I just personally need to trash CP3. He's great, but sadly not transcendent.
@@johnjames1374 fuck em, Bob cousy better
Much love LoW. crazy how much different content you have now and i love it all. Playback is fire3
I think the fact that he always seems to be injured and when he isn't injured he doesn't meet post season expectations for me i know i can't reky on him in the playoffs
CP3’s problem is that he’s 6FT nothing. Iverson and Isiah Thomas were small too but they at least had a speed advantage. CP3 has average speed which means he plays strictly off of fundamentals.
When you’re small and have zero physical advantages, you have to play harder than everyone else in order to compensate. This is why CP3 usually gasses out in the Playoffs or he ends up hurt.
I'd say his speed was easily above average.. too bad its easily below average now
The man is a great playmaker, an efficient scorer, a good ball handler, and his IQ is up there with the best. I wouldn't call that "6ft nothing". Also, he's shown that you don't always need speed and athleticism to be great.
Young MVP candidate Chris was blowing past guys he wasn’t Westbrook or Rose but he was a great athlete. Dudes like 37 even Lebron has lost a few step he was just so much faster and stronger that it’s not as noticeable
@@bennybundi9671 prime CP3 was different sadly he ain’t him no more.
Idk man. I am seeing a lot of defense for CP3. What he has done this year was inexcusable. The years where he was hurt for close out games I don’t hold against him. I can’t help if his hamstring turns into a problem. However I keep seeing people defending CP3 on this year. I don’t get it. Booker choked absolutely no question. But look at this blown lead. Look at the bullying of the Suns the Mavs put on. If LOW, who I can tell loves CP3 from past videos and streams I’ve watched, can say he played a part in the choking of the series there has to be some truth in it.
Was CP3 and his teams unlucky with injuries? Yes
Was CP3 favored in all his series? Not all the time
Did CP3 have good playoff games? Yes
Did CP3 have bad playoff games? Yes
The thing is whenever CP3 has bad games, it comes in the worst times possible. Those simply outweigh those other good performances that he has had especially for someone who hasn't won a championship
No one is excusing this year. He ended the series like shit but being over critical of his series vs the mavs is insane
@@jemirtoussaint7360 I mean he set a high standard for himself so he should be disappointed in his recent showings. That being said, if he really was bugged by a hamstring injury, there isn't much he could have done
@@ja4309 i think that was choking meaning is, bad playoffs games at the wrong time...
@@jemirtoussaint7360 so everyone can be overly critical of Harden Westbrook Kyrie even Lebron at times but we draw the line at the CP3? I don't understand you people
Don't forget that cp3 was a liability on defense in the finals he got abused by jrue Holliday
Bob Cousey would’ve held it down😤
🤣🤣🤣🤣
This is a great comment
The question has to be asked “how far can you go and what can you reasonably expect with a superstar small guard”. Outside of Isaiah Thomas, CP is the most accomplished small guard in league history. In my opinion CP is the best floor raiser ever but he is just to small to be the best player on a championship team unless everything around him is literally perfect. Ex. Stephen Curry in the warrior system
Steph Curry IS the Warriors system.
@@rence5785 the team wins no championships with Draymond Green, and Andre Igoudala. They were primarily ball movers. The. system is based on ball movement, trust, and defense(when they have good defenders on the roster) Steph is the focal point of the system run but is not the system
@@Skyepuppies they won 15 games without steph dude. And that ball movement happens because of steph's gravity. His off ball movement attracts 2 people almost all the time. They were also the 4th seed before steph got hurt last yr, then GS fell to the 10th seed while he's out and still carried the team to the 8th seed.
You mean Isiah, Isaiah Thomas was good but has no business being in the conversation
Honestly CP is more accomplished than Thomas, only thing IT has is 2 rings, which is the main thing players play for but looking at their accomplishments CP has definitely done more
The first series is on a slant!!! You failed to mention David West had 2 30 point games that series or CP3 inability to guard Tony Parker. Or the fact that NO won the division that year and split 2-2 with San Antonio.
David West outplayed Tim Duncan. They just blew their chance! Stop softening what it was!
This is why I watch ur mini-documentary videos u are very well detailed and don’t cave to what some of ur viewers want to hear thx for these vids man I enjoy it gives me a better perspective on things in the NBA world
If you look at the number of leads lost then yeah you gotta say he is. But simply just for my opinion I put Harden above EVERYONE. In alot of CP3 meltdowns it seems as if he just isnt playing all that great. Whereas Harden? Its like he either gives up or is simply swallowed by the moments.
Paul is a playoff horror show
He certainly is one of them. Chris Paul, Harden and Westbrook are my top 3
Nah Harden is over CP3 in this one Chris isn’t going to escape being called a chocker but James has definitely fumbled the bag on way more occasions than Paul. But Your top 3 is accurate & the Username checks out Bingo on this comment 😂 ah see what I did there
@@tequanbeatty4034 😉
Booker gave you Back 2 Back 40 Point Games in the Finals. If you wanna Blame anyone Blame Giannis for being an all time Great.
2/6 games isn’t good lmao
That was two games. How did he perform in the other four? E.g. His turnover at the end of Game 5 directly led to the Suns losing that game, so *in that particular case* it wouldn't have mattered if he dropped even another 70-piece beforehand. Plus the Bucks as a squad showed up on defense in a way the Suns didn't, not just Giannis unlocking God Mode like Goku with Ultra Instinct. 🤷♂️
Might honestly be Tmac in that argument too, which is painful to say because I've been rooting for Orlando since 94.
Sadly, I would actually consider Tmac as poor playoff performer.
Well you can always stop rooting for this sorry team and pick another one
@@Lxcksdxwn Or I could be a loyal fan, you know a real fan, to my childhood team. There's always that.
Man never got out the first round in his prime despite having many opportunities and is one of the worst 4qt/ot playoff performers I’ve ever seen.
i understand the take and i love low but even still i think at some point we have to hold the player accountable for not being healthy when your team needs you the most. i find it crazy that we only put the injury context on the players we like. if you like bron, k love nd kyrie was hurt. if you like curry, he was hurt in 2016 and dray got ejected and their big was hurt. if you like kawhi, we havent seen a complete clippers team yet someone is always hurt
Next time i break a foot or something ima just score 50 points and have a quadruple double
Who was hurt on the 2020 Clippers?
@@benjaminan1183 Paul George was hurt on and off almost all year he missed about 25 games Reggie Jackson only played 17 games for them and pat Bev was injured in the playoffs
@@lordquastheonly the sad part is Chris Paul was healthy enough to play u break a foot you’re not playing so if u can play I would expect you to perform I’m not gone keep saying well he’s hurt so he sucks cuz if it’s like that he shouldn’t play
You didn’t mention 2019 against GSW when KD got hurt and he played mid at best. 2017 despite the fact griffin got hurt, he had a chance to at least win the series, but he folded in game 7. 2012 he got destroyed by San Antonio and played like trash. I personally don’t blame booker as much because he is still somewhat young and cp gets all the credit when they win so he deserves criticism when they lose
No hate on CP3 but this Statement was so Balance
You mean 2017 when he took the 5th seeded Jazz to 7 games without his 20 ppg teammate Blake Griffin? GTFOH
Even if you can back up that Chris Paul isn't exactly a playoff choker, it still doesn't change anything about his legacy. People aren't looking into how Chris Paul's performed in those series. They are just going to look at the fact that Chris Paul blew those leads and make their assumptions around that. It's sad and I don't exactly agree with that mentality but it is what it is.
He has had a lot of great playoff performances but those are swept off by the other bad performances that came in the worst times possible
His legacy isn’t determined by fans lmao
@@Channel1941 it is
you’re not wrong, I just wish that nba fans would take context into consideration more before they label players in certain ways
T-Mac is a HOF CP3 legacy is in well good hands.
Don’t forget Chris put away the defending champ Spurs in the first round- with a game winning, floating layup. Epic shot 🏀
And then proceeded to blow an 3-1 lead
then blew a crisp 3-1 lead🏀
Consistently being Injured when you’re needed the most Is choking. And yes I know Injuries happen but at what point do we let that be the excuse every time ?
THANK YOU
It literally isn't choking. You don't have to be an idiot
There’s enough proof he choked. He doesn’t show up in very crucial games. He plays good but not great. Not a superstar….
He's a head case... Dude threatened a 14 y/o boy for talking to his mother.
So it's.. essentially 50/50 on him choking? That's still pretty bad 😫
How often you hear this argument of "they were up 2:0.". Everyone knows the series starts when both teams played at home. Its completely normal to have a standing of 2:0 after 2 games as the team with home court advantage 😂😂
Chris Paul is a playoff choker.
When I saw David West in that yellow jersey I was like, "Weren't they playing the Spurs? Not the Pacers?".. forgot what year it was 🤦♂️😂
Am I the only one that hears no audio on this video 😂
I thought my phone was tripping
there's no audio on this video
I thought I was the only one
Mine won’t even play
There’s no video to be played on mine lol
For you
@@smoke7792 It works now I don't know probably just reset your phonle
Chris Paul had one good game in the Dallas series that was game 2 game 1 that man had 19 points and 3 assist
The fucked up thing is these kinds of legacy talk actually penalizes great players that over-perform and carry an inferior team, then end up losing.
As a clippers fan myself that 2015 series stung really really stung because imagine that conference finals during that time the one team that could give Golden State a significantly hard time was the Clippers that could have easily gone to 7 games and possibly history would have been written a little differently because the clippers during that time could have prevailed But history is written by the victor and Houston what's the victor in that series
CP does dumb shit when the game is on the line😂😂
CP3 averages around 22/9/5 with 55% FG in his over 30 career closeout games. He really only had like 5-6 bad games in his career and people call him a choker.
Nba is about wins and championships - Not numbers
@@ryant1506 So bill russel is the goat?
Because you will only get a handful of actual championship chances. Closing out the 35 win Pelicans is not impressive it's what you're expected to do, it's when you're facing an equal opponent that matters. Plus Chris Paul is supposed to "make everyone around him better" where did that go in the playoffs
Means nothing if he didn't hit the big shots at the right times, which obviously he didn't! Can't fool real fans by just throwing out numbers, they need some context to be completely accurate
And those 5-6 bad game being some of the biggest games of his career
just came back to this vid before the chris paul curse kick in with kd
People haven’t even watched the whole vid and already hating on CP3 cause of the title 💀
Didn't need to. Ive watched his time at the clippers. Great for his size n athleticism but a stat packer.
@@Agbahizzal how is he a stat padder? Just because this one game 7 against the Mavs?
@@EyeEmEl
Plz re read my comment. Im a clippers fan. Blake Griffen been bitching about CP3. He only passes to easy assist guys. He ain't no Nash or even Rubio with the pass game. We had a lot of tools that he never leveraged because easy shovel passes help him when it come to contract negotiations.
Look at the roster and see who we had. We had the one of the deepest benches in the league at the time. However how can u ask for men to do something in the playoffs that they never did in the regular season. CP3 always being injured is usually due to him doing to much. He had support n wasted with the clippers.
Cliff Paul has always fooled a lot of people. I dont expect u to agree, just saying my piece.
@@Agbahizzal yah I’m not even gonna waste my time debating with you
@@EyeEmEl
Silence would have been classier.
went back to this video and we forgot about the series where he averaged 12.75 PPG on 36.8% FG against the spurs while the clippers blew a 24-point lead in game 3 in an eventual sweep
This video screams "I'm a CP3 fan." When the warriors blew a 3-1 lead, they were criticized, Especially Steph. When the Thunder blew a 3-1 lead to that same Warriors team, KD and Westbrook were criticized. If we're not gonna be consistent with Chris Paul, we shouldn't be critical towards these stars at all.
Just want to thank for content you make and very captivating story telling. Thank You
TMac isn't too far behind in my view. Came up small in 03 with the Magic against the Pistons after being up 3-1. Lost game 7 putting up a putrid 21 pts in the most important game of the season. Same thing again in 05 with the Rockets after being up 2-0 against the Mavs losing game 7 by 40, and again up 2-0 with Rockets against the Jazz losing game 7 at home after leading the series 3-2 even.
It happens.
Things happen, circumstances are involved, it is what it is. Not everyone gets an NBA Championship in their career, and it doesn't diminish what they've done for the game. CP3, I'm sure, will retire one day feeling unfulfilled somewhat without winning a ring but in no way will leave any doubt that he gave it everything he had, and that I can appreciate.
0:42 I meannn.. Westbrook danced by himself
Chris Paul will never win a ring as a starter in the NBA. I know that's pretty obvious, but it seems like some people still think that he is the "Best point guard ever" 😆 🤣 😂
Harden, CP3, Derozan
Biggest playoff chokers ever?
It’s so hard to admit he’s a choker for me but I think it’s true, I have been the guy making every excuse for cp3 when his teams implode… even in this last series vs the mavs I was telling everyone the suns would win and chris would bounce back. It’s a tough pill to swallow he’s been my my favorite player for over a decade.😩
TLDR: I need a hug😩😩
That game 5 loss to okc and game 6 loss to the rockets already has him on thin ice because those losses were AWFUL
As a Bucks Fan, I'd say he's not a playoff choker. No team led solely by a Small Guard, (aside from Curry & Isiah) has won a championship. Chris Paul took the Suns to the Finals and ran into the 2nd or 3rd Best Player of our Generation Giannis Antetokounmpo. This Year he choked & Gassed out, just like 2015, but aside from a few blips, he's been a good playoff performer to his standards.
curry is not small. hes 6'3
@@orenthaljames2534 Chris is 6'1, you telling me those two inches make a big difference in their performances?
@@lordtarroc hes 6 foot on a good day. you're telling me there's not a big difference in someone thats 6 ft vs 6'3? or how about someone thats 6'6 vs 6'9?
You could make this a series for superstar players that most basketball fans believe should've won a ring. Or just great players who came close in general.
Yeah
Get a job
@@sammiejuwon Always hard at work buddy. Hope you're doing the same and working towards your goals.
CP3 when it matters. He disappears. Either due to injury or bad night.
He just mentioned a number of moments where he showed up when he was supposed to and they still lost. So wym?
@@urbaindelva7869 relying on CP3 to show up is like banking on a role player to explode. He's hella inconsistent. If only he gets greedy with scoring,he could have a title already. Only Magic won a title being a pass-first PG.
How is being injured = "disappearing"?
He has little to no control of when and how he'll get injured. What he _does_ have control over is when he's playing like 💩, and for that he _should_ be catching flak.
I feel like another player that should be more criticized is Kevin Durant. That man has done absolutely nothing in the playoffs except for when he was on the warriors.
I remember watching CP3 when he used to be with LAC. I like him as a player as he's a legit baller. However seeing him leave LA and go from team to team only to always come up short says something. He's not that guy that makes everyone around him better. Yeah he can score and get assists but when it really matters he just folds. The past two years were his best shots at a title and ring imo. The team he has had in Phoenix was probably one of the best supporting cast, scorers, defenders and solid bench and a guy who is a scoring machine in Devin Booker. I get that you get passionate about what you love but sometimes he comes off sounding and looking like an asshole to his team. The one thing he did with Booker and actually the whole team was underestimate Dallas. I didn't have Dallas going to the finals or winning a chip this year, but I knew they were still dangerous enough to rally back. Be humble, true to yourself and be the best you can be for you and your team. He's had a great career and is a HoF no question about it. Can I say he's a better PG than say Stephen Curry? No at least not in my book. I might have Dame ahead of him but that last one is probably bias as I love Dame Lillard lol
This was great research and Analysis I hope you do more videos were frequently 💪
Harden is more of a choker than CP3 but no one wants to talk about that🤐
What? Legit everyone talks about that
@@thuggwaffle8825 people talk about CP3 like hes worse than Harden. Harden regularly disappears in the playoffs but where were the videos and hate crusades?
Harden's "choker" label has been overexaggerated too imo. Not gonna say he's had great moments, but some of his bad ones weren't as bad as people think.
@@urbaindelva7869 13 missed 3s is pretty bad
@@Pokebilities harden is better than cp3 and has accomplished more in his career despite having bad performances in the playoffs
The best availability is availability, and Chris Paul in the playoffs is made of glass
if you don't want to watch the whole video, the answer is: YES
Outside of Magic Johnson who is a 6 9 PG. Has any traditional point guard lead a team being the best player to championship?
Isaiah Thomas, Steph, J Kidd (even tho he didn’t win with Nets). You could argue tony parker and chauncey billups too.
@@Dubz759 Yes, they were the leaders, but the rosters had to be built in a certain way around them.
I think that although CP3 has had choke jobs in his career, he is more than that the absolute unluckiest superstar of all time
Long as Hardens around CP3 always can say it's not me🤣
I think that it's a mixed bag when it comes to Chris Paul. Like you can say that it's only three series, but I guess the question is whether or not you can define that as enough to be considered choking. Lebron had 2011 and he's never really lived that down. That's the only series that he's really choked in unless you count 2021 where I mean he did kind of give up, and don't quote me on this, but he still got decent numbers, right? Curry has consistently been really clutch except for one series, and he's also been labeled a career choker. I guess my thing is that I really don't get why some players are chokers and others aren't. Like Dame will get swept by Curry while severely underperforming, but Dame is way more clutch? PG and Kawhi both choked in 2020, but only one of them got hate for it? People meme the hell out of Embiid for being a choker, but he's been the only dude for how many years to consistently perform on that team? You know I mean other than Butler, but they traded his ass anyways in what will probably go down as one of the bigger regularly scheduled Philly Ls in history. We don't really even have a definition of choking, so how are we supposed to know what it means?
It’s reassuring to see CP3 is passing off his legacy of playoff choking to Booker.
That shot at the very end of the game was awesome. Too bad it was as meaningless as a great shot at a local court, while you're practicing all alone.
In my opinion Harden is the biggest playoff choker in NBA History. Unlike Paul he isn’t been injured for most of the series. His stats are worse in the playoffs then regular season and even worse in close out or elimination games.
I think people are tried of the under performance totally. He was suppose to be what Steph is in accolades. It's like a woman that cooks cleans looks great, is highly intelligent, but she's always single eventually you just give up and say something is wrong with her
Solid video. So many people are going to point to CP3’s statistical production as a reason why he’s not a choker. That just means they are ignoring the details and critical decisions/mistakes he made down the stretch of huge games. His entire postseason career is filled with a litany of series-altering mistakes, which isn’t a good look for someone who has, arguably, the highest basketball IQ of all time. He’s a choker and a fraud.
I love CP and I wish him to win a ring; however, if you blew too many chances. Maybe you really didn't try enough. It's all about will to win.
I see there’s a lot of ppl that are ignorant on the fact of why CP3 is called “Point-God”. It’s not because he’s perfect or unbeatable but it’s because he is the crim dela crim in regards to what a TRUE point guard should be. Score when needed, holds defense, gets everyone involved, efficient, a coach onna court.
Bob Cousy wouldn't let that happen..im just saying
Thank you for making this video seriously thank you
As a CP3 fan I feel like him being a pure point guard hurt him. He's basically the leader of the team doing almost everything and only asking his partner (Griffin, Harden or Booker) to score a lot. Every time they come up short his team fails unless Paul drops 30. CP3 has to become a 25+ ppg player to hope to get a ring. They choked againts the Mavs tho.
Agree except in the rockets, Harden carries
@@angelgil2097 why they lose without CP3 then? Not even a CP3 fan. But Fr they would’ve been in the finals if he played, coming from a warriors fan
@@trupimp2211 They objectively did not need CP3 in Game 6 of the 2018 WCF to win. They just played like 💩. That Rockets team had 23 _consecutive_ bricks. 🧱🏀 All else being equal, they only needed to hit a few of those to reach the Finals.
@@henryviiifake8244 True but honestly they could have easily been like the teammate they are missing in cp and actually take midrange shots to stop the bleeding. But sadly mike and harden live and die by that 3 standpoint.
In my years of watching Paul, the common factor to the blown 2-0 leads is the desire of a 3-0 lead. Once you win Game 3, you automatically win the series. This is because no team in NBA history has ever come back from down 3-0. Paul seems to want the 3-0 lead so bad that his teammates feel pressured to pull it off for him. The best way to prove this is with the Clippers, who were down 2-0 to the Mavs, Jazz and Suns in back-to-back-to-back rounds for the 2021 NBA Playoffs. The mystique of a 3-0 lead was so enormous for a lot of reasons, especially with the Clippers coming off the greatest 3-1 collapse in NBA history, that if opponents were to win Game 3 for the automatic series win, it would have meant the end of the Leonard-George duo and back in the lottery. Ty Lue realized this and decided to use the 3-0 lead to his advantage, knowing that opponents were distracted with the desire of a 3-0 lead over simply having to earn it.
Nope
For 2019 context, cp3 played fine averaging 17 amd 6 on 44:31:79 splits. The only game that was bad was game 5. But game 6 he stepped up with 27, 9, and 6. However, harden had 4 turnovers in that game 6 alone. Also, role players like eric gordon, clint capela, and gerald green were missing their shots as well. And the warriors were expected to win the series even with kd injured.
Four turnovers isn’t that many
Those 4 turnovers were all in the 4th quarter.
Meanwhile james harden average 35 7 and 5 on 44 35 82 split. And the rockets second leading scorer was eric gordon. And somehow it was james hardens fault.
Don't let OSN see this video....
The only thing I'm gonna say is this: I WHOLLY reject this idea that if a player gets hurt in the playoffs, while already being injury prone, that we should give said player a pass.. Because that's in and of itself a "factor of greatness", availability IS a factor of greatness. If it was an iron man like Jokic for example, then sure, but not in the case of players such as CP3, AD and Embiid etc, cuz THEY'RE ALWAYS HURT. That's what they do... so yeah, that's absolutely a knock on them in my book.
Your going to blame someone for not being physically able to play the game. If you want to use this argument players like Lebron, Kobe, Bird, and magic get knocked down on that all time list this isnt 2k were you can just turn injuries off
@@lordquastheonly
What an absurd comparison. CP3 doesn't exist in the same stratosphere as any of those players you mentioned. The "worst" player of that bunch is probably Bird and he's literally done 10x more in the NBA than CP3.
And I don't avaluate players in hypotheticals or assumptions, I avaluate them for what they actually accomplish (or in CP3's, what they don't accomplish).
No T-Mac is because T-Mac is the only player in NBA History who has never won a Playoff series while being in the rotation.
Chris Paul can’t stay healthy in the playoffs. The only times he is healthy his team isn’t.
Doesn’t matter though. Only things people will look back on is the W’s, L’s, and blown leads. I love the guy but I’ve lost faith in his teams come playoff time.
Nah he’s definitely a choker but for the most part he’s not a bad player in the playoffs just comes up short when it matters most however players like harden are bigger chokers then cp3
Bob Cousy isn't blowing a 2-0 lead btw
In the 1958 finals Bill Russell went down in game 3. All Bob Cousy needed to do was win 2 games. In the next 3 games he shot 37% from the field and lost the finals to the Hawks.
I will never forget that game 5 in 2014. That's when I was officially done believing in him like that. He's still a top 5 PG all time but that was unforgivable
CP3 is not a top 5 point guard of all time in any universe, 'sorry' to say :D
Magic Johnson is the greatest pg of all time. Positions 2-4 go to Oscar Roberson, Isiah Thomas and Jerry West in some order. After that we have Curry, Stockton, Frazier, Kidd, Payton and so on. CP3 might just be a top 10 pg of all time but even that is debatable.
@@Zamppa86 lol stick to soccer lil bro
@@shinglesshingles So you did not have any arguments to support your claim after I put up some arguments of my own to counter yours but instead all you had was some personal insults? Not too surprising really...
@@Zamppa86 no I didn't need to "argue" with some one who clearly doesn't know what they're talking about and has a soccer club as their profile pic. Magic is clearly the best PG of all time and Oscar as well as Jerry West played more off-guard than lead guard and historically are remembered as SG's more than PG's. Curry is the only other PG definitively over CP3. And then the dumbass takes of Stockton and Walt Fraizer being over CP isn't worth anything, just proves you're not worth "arguing" with. As far as Kidd and Payton go there's just as much evidence to argue them over CP as CP over them. Personally neither of those guys did more with less like how CP3 did. Taking an overrated David West and Tyson Chandler along with an over the hill Peja to a 2nd seed and playoff run is way more impressive than having a hall of fame coach and all-star running mate like how the glove had and Kidd had multiple all-stars throughout his entire career and still did just as much as CP relative to their career path. So please like I said stick to soccer.
@@shinglesshingles Okey I'll destroy you then.
'Off guard' Big O averaged a triple double over his first 5 seasons so there's that. Pretty complete stats making people around him better while also scoring himself.
West was all defensive caliber defender while also averaging better points than CP3 ever did alongside with 9+ assists when he needed to playmake more than score. Also a FMVP winner while playing for the losing team and so on. Also a champion.
Stockton is an all time leader in assists and steals. Some people say he is even the same conversation for the greatest pure pg because of that. I'm not going that far though. Still he has more finals appearances than CP3 and better stats.
Frazier is an all time great defender, 2 time champion and responsible of one of the greatest close out game performances ever in one of those finals when Willis Reed couldn't really play. Yep, he closed the series for Knicks to win a ring while this video here just stated how many times your CP3 actually choked/failed.
Kidd was a mvp caliber player while he led the Nets into back to back finals. All time great on both ends, over 100 triple doubles, made his teammates better and also a champion. He made some big shots in the 2011 finals aswell even though it certainly was Dirk's team. You should also check those Nets teams Kidd led into the finals. Kenyon Martin, Kerry Kittles and so on isn't really a stacked team. Just wanted to mention because you talked about CP3's Hornets teammates.
Gary Payton is probably the greatest defensive pg of all time and forced the GOAT Michael Jordan into his worst finals averages in '96 even though the Bulls went 72-10. Alongside with that all time great defense he could still score 20 and dish out 8-9 assists. He is also a champion.
CP3 is an all time great no doubt but he isn't top 5 pg of all time because there are so many all time greats ahead of him with more achievements and/or better stats. CP3 has been in the finals only once and failed in the playoffs way too many times for him to be there. There's nothing wrong with being a CP3 fan, he was one of my favourites aswell when he played for the Hornets and Clippers aswell. One just has to realized and know the history. As I said there are way too many big names with better accomplishments for CP3 to be in top 5. Top 9-10 can be discussed though. I'll have CP3 in 9th or 10th above Steve Nash for example easily.