Lloyd George's plan for the Italians and Yugoslavians to sort out their conflicts is literally Bart's plan to end the teachers strike by locking Skinner and Krabapple together in a room in the Simpsons.
An annoyed third party locking both sides of a dispute in a room until they reach an agreement is not as rare as you might think, and should probably be employed more often.
There's a great song about this topic called "Uropia O Morte", which really gets across the bitterness that many Italians felt in the aftermath of the Great War, from the perspective of D'annunzio as he chastises the listener by demanding; "you said we didn't bleed enough; are we bleeding enough for you now?". The song and its whole album (Le Cenere Di Heliodoro) doesn't attempt to justify what he and other Europeans did in the inter-war years, but it plays with ideas of the "Utopian Europe" which Wilson had imagined at the end of WW1, and how such lofty ideals were often hijacked by all kinds of groups to create their own "Utopias" - often through violence.
@Jim lastname I am not sure, what you mean by "modern musicians", but the band still exists and writes new songs. The are just unpopular and sing a lot about European history.
@Jim lastname they sing in English, at least, the songs, I've heard. Yeap, you're right, I am from the East of the Carpathians, Odesa, Ukraine, to be precise. Western part of the Northern coast of the Black sea.
I can see it going anywhere. From the left side to the right. A known commie Mussolini went national cause he believed nationalism can unite socialists. And that 1 thing somehow made all his views opposite.
@@Void_Wars It lasted 23 years, was preceded by protofascists like D'Annunzio and followed by crypto-neo fascists that even managed to return to the government in Italy (allied with Berlusconi), stay at the government for a decade and ready to return to the government (with Salvini) after the next elections.
Mussolini bribed him to stay out of politics. "When you have a rotten tooth you have two possibilities open to you: either you pull the tooth or you fill it with gold. With D'Annunzio I have chosen for the latter treatment."
@@jessealexander2695 Thanks for the info, but it is not relevant to the current case. Austria only has 9 states, no provinces. Each with their own representative legislative body and state laws. It is being discussed by some to replace such a redundant system in such a small country, but currently federalism is still strong.
@@ronik24 I think you've misunderstood Jesse's comment (because it _is_ relevant). In the Canadian federation the provinces _are_ states with their own legislatures & jurisdictions. If the term 'province' has connotations of national administration, or lack of federalism-in Canada that is not the case. Canadians will understand provinces & states to be equivalent, and may use the terms interchangeably. That's what led to the error in the script.
Yes & no. It is kind of linguistic feature. Constitutionally Austrian states is pretty close to provinces elsewhere. But yes @ronik24 is right in this case.
@@vladob3 What? No, not at all. A province is a part of a centralist state. In a federation every state has it's own government, legislature and jurisdiction. This is the case in Austria and Germany for example, that's why they are called federal republics ("Bundesrepublik" in German). So no, that is not at all a linguistic matter, it is factually something completely different.
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Yes it is very interesting. D'Annunzio invented a lot of the imagery of Italian fascism such as the black shirts and the straight arm salute, which he claimed was an ancient Roman tradition. According to "the Pike" biography, it never was.
I agree. As a History freak I could not believe my luck at finding this series covering conflicts barely touched upon in most pre war History vids. Well done!
If Fiume regime fully embraced futurist thought and eventually overtook Italy with help from France, it would lead to rise of Italian Shogunate led by Harukichi Shimoi. Source: HoI4, Red Flood
@@woah5546 He was indeed malevolent. He was an anglo saxon protestant suprematist and hated hungarians, italians and germans with a burning passion. For some reason he did not have a strong opinion on slavs, probably because in those years a huge influx of germans and italians was entering the USA, and not slavs.
There was another Treaty of Rapallo signed between Germany & Soviet Russia in 1922 in which the two countries began economic, political and military cooperation. In a secret clause of the Rapallo Treaty it was agreed that German troops could secretly train on Russian soil in direct violation of the Treaty of Versailles.
One of the most fascainting periods. Anyone interested in learning how fascism rose should learn about the Italian case first, even though most people start and end with German Nazism.
Why the word fascists in describing the actors of these event The dispute was about the london treaty that said you will get Dalmatia and much more if you join the war Right or wrong the treaty made italy get into the meat grinder Fact
Lots of people taking part in the Fiume adventure were certainly far from the fascism ideology (as it later became). Defining them fascists just because mussolini (as pragmatic as he was) COPIED their rituals is oversimplifying
On D'Annunzio, he was, and still is, well known here in Italy for being generally a weirdo. For example, there's a rumor he had his lower ribs surgically removed so he could use his mouth to "please himself", and while said rumor is false it's exactly the kind of weird stuff we expect from him.
1 MOVM (Gold Medal of Military Valour) 3 MBVM (Silver Medal of Military Valour) 2 MBVM (Bronze Medal of Military Valour) 3 CROCI AL MERITO DI GUERRA (War Merit Cross) 1 Ordre national de la Légion d'honneur 3 Croix de guerre 1914-1918 1 British Military Cross 2 promozioni per meriti di guerra (field promotions) Distrintivo di Mutilato e Invalido di Guerra (War Mutilated) These are the facts! The rest is just useless rumors.........
I had read about this on Wikipedia and it was fascinating to learn that Fascism wasn't Mussolini's creation but D'Annunzio was it's forefather. Thanks for this episode, the Post-war years are very interesting and even more underrated than WWI
@@sdsd2e2321 He's right though. Fascism has no inherent substance outside of esthethics. It can cover any and all policy positions, its core remains violent enforcement of an esthethic. It's why fascism is different different places and at different times.
@@Taeerom Fascist movements, no matter where have always been: nationalist, anti-capitalist and anti-communist, proposed a "new man" and as an alternative to both communism and capitalism. But yes, there are large variations
Can we all just appreciate that Britain and France were so tired of all of this they just said to Yugoslavia look m8 if u don’t stop we won’t stop Italy from taking the land we promised Italy.... wait I know that makes us look bad cuz we admitted to lying but shh
10:26 ... Šušak is to Rijeka like Brooklyn is to Manhattan. Šušak was majority Croatian and administered by Hungary pre-1915. Rijeka proper was administered by Austria and thus a bit more liberal with regards to freedom of the press. It is important to note that today, you can not visually separate Šušak from Rijeka, they are both integral parts of the metropolitan center, and you can draw same parallels with Bda and Pest becoming Budapest.
During D’Annunzio occupation of Rijeka (Fiume ), he & his gang heard that on Krk island, where some medieval nobles were buried, they could find some treasure in their graves. While digging & desecrating the graves, two local women tried to chase them away & they were both killed. Some locals did shoot back on D’ Annunzio & his men, and those shots were noted in European history as first shots against fascists.
A fair enough presentation encapsulated in the minutes. Thank you. Our family was burdened, through marriage to a brother by the Albanian nomenclature in 1998 from Boston, and like a lunar shadow nest living through that has paralleled to viewing these 25 min histories. Has he considered delving into A. Goebbel and the effects of The Ursulines at that time ? Or, how DeValera of Ireland not only copped out, he comped the remainders from War Crime Trials in Ireland ?
Im a bit critical to how you guys are starting to portray ethnic conflict in this series. It might seem semantic, and keep in mind im still a big fan, but is reducing things to "Italian/Croat/German speaker" etc not a bit reductive? How would you even source that? Many slavs and italians near the italian border were bilingual. Whats the issue with saying for example in 10:55 that the city was half people who identified as italian and half people who identified as Croatian. If there is a deeper reason behind it and im making a fool of myself i would appreciate to be enlightened lol
It's quite simple: even with 25 minute episodes we need to reduce the complexity of these conflicts somewhat. And we're already doing our best to also include ideological and social factors (for which we already get heavily critized by the nationalists on TH-cam). On top of that we need to work with the numbers we get from the secondary sources.
Great thought! Actually in Rijeka (Fiume) there were different pools about that. Italian minority in the city had a pool about language rather then about nationality. Many Croats and Slovenes in the city stated that they are Italian speaking, it helped them a lot to get better paying jobs. As Rijeka (Fiume) was regarded as Austro-Hungarian, Austrian, Hungarian, French... territory in 19th century alone.. it is not so easy to put it in simple boundaries. Majority of population were south Slavs all the time (Croats and some Slovenes) but Fiume (Rijeka) was industrially more developed than neighboring regions. Therefore citizens were often searching for compromises which will benefit them most. For example even during Austro-Hungarian era, Rijeka (Fiume) had special status = citizens were abolished from army service. Strong British industrial influence was presented in the city. Torpedo was invented in Rijeka & first torpedos in the world were produced in Rijeka. Interesting fact: British navy bombarded outposts in Rijeka, because it was assumed that Rijeka is supporting Napoleon’s provinces.
The Great War Rijeka’s pools and consensuses were not that simple. Italians preferred to present pools where question was about language people are using opposed to nationality per se. Many citizens stated that they are Italian speaking as that helped them to get better jobs. Even today in Rijeka there is many “Fiumans” or “Fiumani”. It is mostly based on unique language used, which is adapted Italian language.
@@vladob3 who was the inventor of the torpedos? Giovanni Lupis, an Italian engineer from Fiume.. Lupis doesn't sound Croatian, in addition It is one of the most diffused family name in Northern Italy
@@davidetoffoletto9981 inventor of modern torpedo is (was) Ivan Vukić. This is his birth and christening name. As many in Rijeka, he was also using Italian name, because it was beneficial in business. Exact reason why it is important that 1910 census was not about nationality. It was about language.
Do you have any information on how the color photos were done. At least one looks a a 3 plate color filter overlay, but they are all using color processes that went out of use in the 1930's. My Grandparents had a color Photo from the 20's in Paris which was a Black and whiite photo painted over to provide color.
Yes! And that still stands! Rijeka may be great example for it! Schools, radio stations, churches, cultural centers... for even smallest (by number of inhabitants) minorities.
@@vladob3 Would you care telling us why are Italians the smallest of minorities in Fiume/Rijeka? Oh right, Tito had them all thrown down the foibe or expelled, and this holds true for the rest of Istria as well.
Rome was the most successful empire in history and has remained the ideal of all (clasissicalist, so not socialist) western civilization for a thousand years. It was the ideal of all the combatant nations of World War II except for Japan and the Soviet Union, though the communist regime had replaced an empire that had a direct Roman legacy. The Germans named their empire after Rome, even after losing the city itself. The Greeks continued the Roman Empire another thousand years and Greeks continued to be alternately called Romans into the 1920s, in fact Turkic speakers still call them Romans today. Everything about Rome is idealized, especially its borders, creating a Roman lake out of the Mediterranean. This was the goal of Italian nationalists at that time; this politician who said the post WWI borders were as perfect as Rome was just bullshitting to cover himself
@@joshuacondell1686 it wasn't even the capital at the end, the western half of the empire was ruled at Ravenna (and Milan before that) Rome wasn't the capital since 286AD edit: (and Ravenna remained the capital of the Ostrogothic kingdom until captured by the eastern Romans, who made it the capital of their Italian administration)
@@matthiuskoenig3378 wasn't the overall capital Constantinople if I'm not mistaken? It was the capital until 1453. The western half was conquered by the Germans (who were essentially mercenaries of the Romans anyway) and the eastern half remained for another 1000 years. People often think the Roman empire was primarily Italian, but it wasn't. It was a multi national empire which included Italy as a province. Rome itself was just the city state. To the point where when the capital was moved to Constantinople no one battered an eyelash as it was all one state.
@@joshuacondell1686 yes but the exarchate of ravenna, was ruled, well from ravenna! the peninsula would later be almost entirely be conquered by the longobards
Well he was already out by this time basically, after november 1918, while they won the war, Wilson's democratic party lost the midterm elections of 1918, in which the republican party, led by Senator Henry Cabot Lodge took power. Lodge was a constitutionalist, anti federalist and isolationist by policy, and started an arm wrestle with the president. As even Wilson's own VP, Thomas Marshall, disagreed with him on what to do in Europe and with Germany and the other losers of the Great War, including their Russian policy. Wilson had to juggle between Paris and Washington to try to affirm his party and the opposing party and rally support for the Fourteen Points and the Versailles Peace Treaty as well as the League of Nations. Lodge's Senate Majority refused to compromise, and thus the US never *ratified* the Versailles Treaty or joined the League of Nations, of course there is a difference between signing a treaty and ratifying it, but still, it kept the US isolationist because Cabot Lodge argued over on the basis of the Monroe Doctrine(US foreign policy guidance/doctrine set by President James Monroe, which attempted to deterr further European colonialists from the Americas, while also not engaging in European political or military affairs). Yes, Wilson did have a stroke or several ones in late 1919, which basically made him not available to campaign for the democratic nominees or his party(Radio wasn't also widely available yet) and his wife, Edith, did many of the daily tasks of the President while they "entrenched" themselves into the White House, not doing press conferences or meetings for months. Why did I write this? I don't know Sources: Risto Volanen - Nuori Suomi (Finnish book)
It makes me very happy that Germany is called German Reich (okay, Empire would be better) instead of Weimar Republic. Because the official name of the first German republic was still Deutsches Reich (German Empire). But the first article of the Weimarer Reichsverfassung ((imperial)constitution of Weimar) explained: Das Deutsche Reich ist eine Republik (the German Empire/Reich is a republic).
I completely understand why creating historical content is such a pain on YT (you explained it well in other videos), but do you really need to repeat the same speech over and over again during the last 3 minutes at the end of the recent videos (this one is the 5th one, if I counted correctly) ?
@@matthiuskoenig3378 I don't want to start an argument but the 1910 census can not ne considered reliable. Indeniably the costal part of Istria (up to and including Fiume) has always been in vast majority inhabited by Italians, built by Italians for their own people.
"Wilson will agree to no arrangement which gives any people to Italy without their consent"; and at the same time Italy gets one third of Slovenia (populated by you guessed it, Slovenes)...
Ironic Wilson didn't do the same for Germans and austrians who didn't have say or vote where they ended up after Denmark only got 1/3 of Holstien by vote allies never again allowed vote by german people . As Italian this why and with Japan we left allies . and for the record since roman times Istra has always been Identified as Italian as it was part of Italia Province Of Roman Empire .
What strikes me is how greedy these European states still were after the War. Eager to snatch what they could. Its inevitable that a bigger greedier foe should prevail.
"Based on proto-fascist, anarchist, and republican ideals" I will give you a million dollars if you can invite me to a dinner with those heavy thinkers.
Thank you so much for this great episode!!! Historical speeches, raised right hand, armed cue... it all started in Rijeka (Fiume) and was later copied by Duce and later on by Führer. That is why Rijeka is and forever will be strongly Antifascist! I would love to see additional episodes marking 1. “Krvavi Božić” = Bloody Christmas = events in Rijeka at December 1920 2. First armed Fascist cue & commemorating first ever victims of Fascism = in Rijeka at March 3rd 1922
@@vaxcucksbelongintheovens7991 l'unica soluzione sarebbe attaccarli... noi Veneti che avevamo a che fare con questi popoli sotto sviluppati li chiamavamo "s'ciavi" con l'assonanza slavo-schiavo
If a land is inhabited in half by Italians, another half by Germans and yet another half by Croats, should it be given to the Serbs by the French and the British?
@@slimsh8dy the "right" has to do with being conservative. (Italian) Fascism has been something else, something new particularly in the early and very late (1943-1945) stages. To simplify you might say that (Italian) Fascism has been "right" for what matters moral values and "left" for what matters walfare and labour. This said Fiume (Reggenza del Carnaro) was even more diverse and different from all that was seen before (and after). It has been a very unique experience with a very advanced Constitution (Carta del Carnaro).
@@nino71 I believe your definition of fascism is flawed. fascism is on the right on cultural and 'moral' issues (if you can call it that) but it has nothing in the way for welfare or labour. this is not to say that it is capitalistic or business friendly, it is a blend of the two viewpoints all in order to serve the stae. Hence i think nationalist right is not an inadmissble simplification. Simplifcation yes, but not a bad label ultimately
@@slimsh8dy I am not sure what you mean but Fascism in Italy has built the walfare state (social security, social housing, severance pay, 5 days working week, 8 hours working day, child labour law, massive public investments etc.etc.etc.) In the late stages (Repubblica Sociale Italiana) Fascism even tried the socialization of all productive assets. Have you ever heard of Nicola Bombacci? He was the first leader of the Italian Comunist Party and ended up being shot with Mussolini.
@@nino71 I suppose Italian Facsism had bits and pieces of a socialist economy but by and large they practised Corporatism, a doctrine which doesn't really subscribe to capitalism or socialism. In fact, it was proposed as an alternative against classical liberalism and marxism
Wow, many of these territorial issues after WWI are quite tense. I can imagine the diplomats of all the countries constantly ordering coffee and spending many nights without sleep while trying to find rough compromises to uneasy issues.
5:05 Important is that there was no prewar Serbia & Montenegro, they were separate independent states and allies. After the war, Montenegro was absorbed by the new state in unclear circumstances.
Wilson makes me laugh. He is talking a bout the evils of the world that caused wars...ignoring the massacre of American natives and the destruction of the American Natives nations....in his own land. Not only he supported racial segregation to exist in the US. So preach to other countries but do as you want with your own. Hypocrite.
@@costante_3196 Sure thing chief right after you give sicily to the arabs,southern italy to the greeks and west to the french. We might have a convo about Croatian land
@@Bebwara Such ignorance. After the fall of the Western Roman Empire, Istria and the Dalmatian coast were under Venetian (ergo Italian) domination until the treaty of Campo Formio in 1797, that's around 7 centuries of colonization from Italic populations. Meanwhile Sicily was controlled by the Arabs for about 264 years with not that many attempts of colonization, and as a matter of fact the Arabs or Arab descendants never became the majority in no place in Sicily. Southern Italy never had such a large Greek presence. In western Italy only the older Savoy and the Valle d'Aosta have roots that can be traced to France, but those regions mainly Valle d'Aosta have many roots that can be traced back to mainland Italy. That today Fiume is Croatian is not a problem, but claiming that it always has been is false
@@thecommentaryking Imagine calling someone out with such dreadful knowledge. Dalmatia was part of croatia since petar kresimir the 4th was crowned by the pope as king of croatia and dalmatia. After the collapse of the croatian state the land was occupied but only until the treaty of zadar in 1358 parts were sold to venice in 1409 by ladislav napuljski after losing a war for the croatohungarian crown. The venitian pressence in dalmatia was irrelevant after the treaty of zadar even more so after croatia and hungary joined the habsburg empire in 1516
The guy with the pipe at 11:56 looks like: "Shoot, I'm on film! The boss will see me goofing off!" In all seriousness, I love the work you guys are doing. Absolutely professional and educational. Just one small complaint...PLEASE PLEASE STOP COLORIZING THE PHOTOS. It takes away the sense of age and history that you are trying to convey. The issues dealt with are as fresh as today's headlines...but it's from over a century ago. Seeing a photograph or film footage that looks genuinely old and untouched adds weight to that. Also, some of the colorization just comes out bad. The still of Mussolini in a crowd (26:39) has some of the clothes with off-color blotches, the two faces in the left and right foreground are still black and white (which makes them look cadaverous), and the face of the man just below the man to Mussolini's right looks like he's wearing Halloween makeup.
Lloyd George's plan for the Italians and Yugoslavians to sort out their conflicts is literally Bart's plan to end the teachers strike by locking Skinner and Krabapple together in a room in the Simpsons.
An excellent comparison!
@@jessealexander2695 Hahaha! Didn't knew you were a fan of the Simpsons Jesse.
An annoyed third party locking both sides of a dispute in a room until they reach an agreement is not as rare as you might think, and should probably be employed more often.
The wisdom of “The Simpsons” has explained - and will continue to explain - so much!
Did the representatives end up making out?
There's a great song about this topic called "Uropia O Morte", which really gets across the bitterness that many Italians felt in the aftermath of the Great War, from the perspective of D'annunzio as he chastises the listener by demanding; "you said we didn't bleed enough; are we bleeding enough for you now?". The song and its whole album (Le Cenere Di Heliodoro) doesn't attempt to justify what he and other Europeans did in the inter-war years, but it plays with ideas of the "Utopian Europe" which Wilson had imagined at the end of WW1, and how such lofty ideals were often hijacked by all kinds of groups to create their own "Utopias" - often through violence.
The Rome band, that wrote this song, is great.
"If this nation is to be reborn, It will start here, in this city, today.
For it is not we who breathe, but the nation that breathes within us"
A passage to Rhodesia is my favorite album by them
@Jim lastname I am not sure, what you mean by "modern musicians", but the band still exists and writes new songs. The are just unpopular and sing a lot about European history.
@Jim lastname they sing in English, at least, the songs, I've heard. Yeap, you're right, I am from the East of the Carpathians, Odesa, Ukraine, to be precise. Western part of the Northern coast of the Black sea.
Proto-Fascists in Italy, I don’t see this going anywhere
Hi people, please support his channel. He genuinely does a week-by-week coverage of the First American Civil War.
Wow it’s almost like people lie a lot. The facists only lasted like 15 years anyways.
@@Void_Wars ...no?
I can see it going anywhere. From the left side to the right. A known commie Mussolini went national cause he believed nationalism can unite socialists. And that 1 thing somehow made all his views opposite.
@@Void_Wars It lasted 23 years, was preceded by protofascists like D'Annunzio and followed by crypto-neo fascists that even managed to return to the government in Italy (allied with Berlusconi), stay at the government for a decade and ready to return to the government (with Salvini) after the next elections.
D’Annunzio is a very interesting character, probably the first threat to Mussolini’s leadership of Italian Fascism.
Mussolini bribed him to stay out of politics. "When you have a rotten tooth you have two possibilities open to you: either you pull the tooth or you fill it with gold. With D'Annunzio I have chosen for the latter treatment."
Cyrus He also most likely had him pushed out of a window before his takeover.
There's a Jonathan Bowden talk about him on TH-cam that's worth a watch.
@@sdsd2e2321 wow
@@robinbeckford I'm not sorry.
Small correction: Austria is a federal republic (also the "first republic" from 1919), so Carinthia is and was a state, not a province.
Fielder's choice - Canada is a federation and it has provinces, probably why I defaulted to province rather than the more frequent state.
@@jessealexander2695 Thanks for the info, but it is not relevant to the current case. Austria only has 9 states, no provinces. Each with their own representative legislative body and state laws. It is being discussed by some to replace such a redundant system in such a small country, but currently federalism is still strong.
@@ronik24 I think you've misunderstood Jesse's comment (because it _is_ relevant). In the Canadian federation the provinces _are_ states with their own legislatures & jurisdictions.
If the term 'province' has connotations of national administration, or lack of federalism-in Canada that is not the case. Canadians will understand provinces & states to be equivalent, and may use the terms interchangeably. That's what led to the error in the script.
Yes & no. It is kind of linguistic feature. Constitutionally Austrian states is pretty close to provinces elsewhere.
But yes @ronik24 is right in this case.
@@vladob3 What? No, not at all. A province is a part of a centralist state. In a federation every state has it's own government, legislature and jurisdiction. This is the case in Austria and Germany for example, that's why they are called federal republics ("Bundesrepublik" in German).
So no, that is not at all a linguistic matter, it is factually something completely different.
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You said 4 different religions in Yugoslavia. What was the forth?
@@DelijeSerbia you have to join the nebula to get that answers
i am to broke
They said that D'Annunzio was ugly and had bad breath because he pissed off the aristocracy
The Pike: Gabriele D'Annunzio, Poet, Seducer and Preacher of War
by Lucy Hughes-Hallett is a great book
Yes it is very interesting. D'Annunzio invented a lot of the imagery of Italian fascism such as the black shirts and the straight arm salute, which he claimed was an ancient Roman tradition. According to "the Pike" biography, it never was.
I agree. As a History freak I could not believe my luck at finding this series covering conflicts barely touched upon in most pre war History vids. Well done!
If like I you thought Sidney was an odd name for an Italian, it turns out Sonnino was half-Welsh.
pin the minute where they talk this to me, please
@@maximilianolimamoreira5002 9min or so.
So more Welsh than Lloyd George then?.....🤔
This channel's borders are as perfect as that of the Roman Empire.
If Fiume regime fully embraced futurist thought and eventually overtook Italy with help from France, it would lead to rise of Italian Shogunate led by Harukichi Shimoi.
Source: HoI4, Red Flood
This was obviously a complicated peace to work out. Great job.
"He was ugly and had bad breath, but was still renowned to be a ladies man..."
Of course he was, he was Italian!
He was also jacked
Great video on a fascinating and rarely discussed part of the post-war negotiations
Slight error, you said Fiume was absorbed in 1923, I believe it was in 1924 after the Treaty of Rome.
Ferrusian Gambit yes, it was 1924
Moreover, the annexation of Fiume in 1924 has nothing to do with the quest for Fiume/Rijeka in the 1919. Bad done video.
1:50 Tridentine Mass, where in the priest is using a fiddleback chasuble, maniple, and beautiful lace alb.
the best form of the Mass♥️
Wilson could not have been more wrong, it is clear he had not a clue of the sentiment on the ground in Italy (and Yugoslavia).
@mpinteric Sentiment is everything in politics
@mpinteric Advanced? Wilson was either brain damaged or intentionally malevolent. He left a path of destruction everywhere he went.
@@woah5546 He was indeed malevolent. He was an anglo saxon protestant suprematist and hated hungarians, italians and germans with a burning passion. For some reason he did not have a strong opinion on slavs, probably because in those years a huge influx of germans and italians was entering the USA, and not slavs.
just wanna say that this was an excellent episode about a very underdiscussed topic, i loved it!
Rote front! ✊✊✊
There was another Treaty of Rapallo signed between Germany & Soviet Russia in 1922 in which the two countries began economic, political and military cooperation. In a secret clause of the Rapallo Treaty it was agreed that German troops could secretly train on Russian soil in direct violation of the Treaty of Versailles.
One of the most fascainting periods. Anyone interested in learning how fascism rose should learn about the Italian case first, even though most people start and end with German Nazism.
Your series has shown that WW1 did not end in 1918, but rather continued for many years.
Why the word fascists in describing the actors of these event
The dispute was about the london treaty that said you will get Dalmatia and much more if you join the war
Right or wrong the treaty made italy get into the meat grinder
Fact
Lots of people taking part in the Fiume adventure were certainly far from the fascism ideology (as it later became). Defining them fascists just because mussolini (as pragmatic as he was) COPIED their rituals is oversimplifying
On D'Annunzio, he was, and still is, well known here in Italy for being generally a weirdo. For example, there's a rumor he had his lower ribs surgically removed so he could use his mouth to "please himself", and while said rumor is false it's exactly the kind of weird stuff we expect from him.
Nice
1 MOVM (Gold Medal of Military Valour)
3 MBVM (Silver Medal of Military Valour)
2 MBVM (Bronze Medal of Military Valour)
3 CROCI AL MERITO DI GUERRA (War Merit Cross)
1 Ordre national de la Légion d'honneur
3 Croix de guerre 1914-1918
1 British Military Cross
2 promozioni per meriti di guerra (field promotions)
Distrintivo di Mutilato e Invalido di Guerra (War Mutilated)
These are the facts! The rest is just useless rumors.........
@@nino71 Dimentichi che era matto da legare.
@@lordMartiya lo era, ma nel senso buono!
@@nino71 Temo che questa sia una questione di opinioni
Whenever I read about Gabriele D'Annunzio, I always think of Aleister Crowley. Those two men had a lot in common.
6:15 Illustrative map graphics. Kudos.
I had read about this on Wikipedia and it was fascinating to learn that Fascism wasn't Mussolini's creation but D'Annunzio was it's forefather. Thanks for this episode, the Post-war years are very interesting and even more underrated than WWI
D'Annunzio didn't influence fascism at all, besides it's aesthetics. Maurras and Sorel influenced actual policy.
@@sdsd2e2321 fascism is aesthetics. there is no rational ideology.
@@JohnDoe-mp1yn wowie
@@sdsd2e2321 He's right though.
Fascism has no inherent substance outside of esthethics. It can cover any and all policy positions, its core remains violent enforcement of an esthethic. It's why fascism is different different places and at different times.
@@Taeerom Fascist movements, no matter where have always been: nationalist, anti-capitalist and anti-communist, proposed a "new man" and as an alternative to both communism and capitalism. But yes, there are large variations
Finnaly what I was waiting for! Thanks You!
Great episode. The Allies keep provoking much mayhem yet again.
Can we all just appreciate that Britain and France were so tired of all of this they just said to Yugoslavia look m8 if u don’t stop we won’t stop Italy from taking the land we promised Italy.... wait I know that makes us look bad cuz we admitted to lying but shh
Very interesting as I’m constantly intrigued by the history of my last name. Thank you
10:26 ... Šušak is to Rijeka like Brooklyn is to Manhattan. Šušak was majority Croatian and administered by Hungary pre-1915. Rijeka proper was administered by Austria and thus a bit more liberal with regards to freedom of the press. It is important to note that today, you can not visually separate Šušak from Rijeka, they are both integral parts of the metropolitan center, and you can draw same parallels with Bda and Pest becoming Budapest.
During D’Annunzio occupation of Rijeka (Fiume ), he & his gang heard that on Krk island, where some medieval nobles were buried, they could find some treasure in their graves. While digging & desecrating the graves, two local women tried to chase them away & they were both killed. Some locals did shoot back on D’ Annunzio & his men, and those shots were noted in European history as first shots against fascists.
And then in 1945-47 it was all over again, only this Trieste time was the problem and again the Wilson line came into discussion...
Trst je naš!
Gorica pa še bo.
@@stanebezjak4485 LoL, no.
@@stanebezjak4485 Istria, Trieste, Fiume e Dalmazia, nè Slovenia nè Croazia!
D'Annuzio would have done a lot better if he copyrighted his style so Mussolini wouldn't have come to power by stealing his.
Gramsci looks like there where no barbers open because of a lockdown.
Very interesting topic. Keep it up Great War channel!
How are you everywhere
@@mbathroom1 Read my description. "I comment on anything I find interesting"
You and me share similar interests. 🙂
@@luxembourgishempire2826 were subbed to so many of the same channels
I'm so glad you're expanding this topic and making it known to this community.
Ps. Love you so much for quoting Antonio Gramsci!
Sup fellow commie
@@pmcshow44 tutto bene, compagno
D'Annunzio will be inimitable
A fair enough presentation encapsulated in the minutes. Thank you. Our family was burdened, through marriage to a brother by the Albanian nomenclature in 1998 from Boston, and like a lunar shadow nest living through that has paralleled to viewing these 25 min histories.
Has he considered delving into A. Goebbel and the effects of The Ursulines at that time ? Or, how DeValera of Ireland not only copped out, he comped the remainders from War Crime Trials in Ireland ?
Great photographs and videos of my city very rare in that quality
Im a bit critical to how you guys are starting to portray ethnic conflict in this series. It might seem semantic, and keep in mind im still a big fan, but is reducing things to "Italian/Croat/German speaker" etc not a bit reductive?
How would you even source that? Many slavs and italians near the italian border were bilingual. Whats the issue with saying for example in 10:55 that the city was half people who identified as italian and half people who identified as Croatian.
If there is a deeper reason behind it and im making a fool of myself i would appreciate to be enlightened lol
It's quite simple: even with 25 minute episodes we need to reduce the complexity of these conflicts somewhat. And we're already doing our best to also include ideological and social factors (for which we already get heavily critized by the nationalists on TH-cam).
On top of that we need to work with the numbers we get from the secondary sources.
Great thought!
Actually in Rijeka (Fiume) there were different pools about that.
Italian minority in the city had a pool about language rather then about nationality. Many Croats and Slovenes in the city stated that they are Italian speaking, it helped them a lot to get better paying jobs. As Rijeka (Fiume) was regarded as Austro-Hungarian, Austrian, Hungarian, French... territory in 19th century alone.. it is not so easy to put it in simple boundaries.
Majority of population were south Slavs all the time (Croats and some Slovenes) but Fiume (Rijeka) was industrially more developed than neighboring regions.
Therefore citizens were often searching for compromises which will benefit them most.
For example even during Austro-Hungarian era, Rijeka (Fiume) had special status = citizens were abolished from army service.
Strong British industrial influence was presented in the city. Torpedo was invented in Rijeka & first torpedos in the world were produced in Rijeka.
Interesting fact: British navy bombarded outposts in Rijeka, because it was assumed that Rijeka is supporting Napoleon’s provinces.
The Great War Rijeka’s pools and consensuses were not that simple. Italians preferred to present pools where question was about language people are using opposed to nationality per se.
Many citizens stated that they are Italian speaking as that helped them to get better jobs.
Even today in Rijeka there is many “Fiumans” or “Fiumani”. It is mostly based on unique language used, which is adapted Italian language.
@@vladob3 who was the inventor of the torpedos? Giovanni Lupis, an Italian engineer from Fiume.. Lupis doesn't sound Croatian, in addition It is one of the most diffused family name in Northern Italy
@@davidetoffoletto9981 inventor of modern torpedo is (was) Ivan Vukić. This is his birth and christening name. As many in Rijeka, he was also using Italian name, because it was beneficial in business.
Exact reason why it is important that 1910 census was not about nationality. It was about language.
Such a great episode! Thank you!
I love your channel keep up the great stuff!!!
Great War - Great Channel!
Do you have any information on how the color photos were done. At least one looks a a 3 plate color filter overlay, but they are all using color processes that went out of use in the 1930's. My Grandparents had a color Photo from the 20's in Paris which was a Black and whiite photo painted over to provide color.
"Minority rights were to be guaranteed"
*your mileage may vary
Riiiiiight... Totally...
Yes! And that still stands! Rijeka may be great example for it!
Schools, radio stations, churches, cultural centers... for even smallest (by number of inhabitants) minorities.
@@vladob3 Italians have been ethnic cleansed, wat are u talking about!?!
@@vladob3 Would you care telling us why are Italians the smallest of minorities in Fiume/Rijeka? Oh right, Tito had them all thrown down the foibe or expelled, and this holds true for the rest of Istria as well.
Do you have in plan to do an episode about Albona Republic someday ?
🥰🥰🥰
Jesse what happened to you on your beard? Did you cut yourself during shaving or something?
D'Annunzio did that
Thank you for subs. Great episode.
Their border was as perfect as the Roman Empire?? Maybe they should check and see what happened to Rome.
Not Rome. The Roman empire. Rome was just a city state and the capital.
Rome was the most successful empire in history and has remained the ideal of all (clasissicalist, so not socialist) western civilization for a thousand years. It was the ideal of all the combatant nations of World War II except for Japan and the Soviet Union, though the communist regime had replaced an empire that had a direct Roman legacy. The Germans named their empire after Rome, even after losing the city itself. The Greeks continued the Roman Empire another thousand years and Greeks continued to be alternately called Romans into the 1920s, in fact Turkic speakers still call them Romans today. Everything about Rome is idealized, especially its borders, creating a Roman lake out of the Mediterranean. This was the goal of Italian nationalists at that time; this politician who said the post WWI borders were as perfect as Rome was just bullshitting to cover himself
@@joshuacondell1686 it wasn't even the capital at the end, the western half of the empire was ruled at Ravenna (and Milan before that) Rome wasn't the capital since 286AD
edit: (and Ravenna remained the capital of the Ostrogothic kingdom until captured by the eastern Romans, who made it the capital of their Italian administration)
@@matthiuskoenig3378 wasn't the overall capital Constantinople if I'm not mistaken? It was the capital until 1453. The western half was conquered by the Germans (who were essentially mercenaries of the Romans anyway) and the eastern half remained for another 1000 years. People often think the Roman empire was primarily Italian, but it wasn't. It was a multi national empire which included Italy as a province. Rome itself was just the city state. To the point where when the capital was moved to Constantinople no one battered an eyelash as it was all one state.
@@joshuacondell1686 yes but the exarchate of ravenna, was ruled, well from ravenna! the peninsula would later be almost entirely be conquered by the longobards
Just read up on this event recently, so coincidental! Thank all of you guys at the Great War for the hard work and research. I mean it!💜
Did Woodrow Wilson had a stroke by this time?
Well he was already out by this time basically, after november 1918, while they won the war, Wilson's democratic party lost the midterm elections of 1918, in which the republican party, led by Senator Henry Cabot Lodge took power. Lodge was a constitutionalist, anti federalist and isolationist by policy, and started an arm wrestle with the president. As even Wilson's own VP, Thomas Marshall, disagreed with him on what to do in Europe and with Germany and the other losers of the Great War, including their Russian policy.
Wilson had to juggle between Paris and Washington to try to affirm his party and the opposing party and rally support for the Fourteen Points and the Versailles Peace Treaty as well as the League of Nations. Lodge's Senate Majority refused to compromise, and thus the US never *ratified* the Versailles Treaty or joined the League of Nations, of course there is a difference between signing a treaty and ratifying it, but still, it kept the US isolationist because Cabot Lodge argued over on the basis of the Monroe Doctrine(US foreign policy guidance/doctrine set by President James Monroe, which attempted to deterr further European colonialists from the Americas, while also not engaging in European political or military affairs).
Yes, Wilson did have a stroke or several ones in late 1919, which basically made him not available to campaign for the democratic nominees or his party(Radio wasn't also widely available yet) and his wife, Edith, did many of the daily tasks of the President while they "entrenched" themselves into the White House, not doing press conferences or meetings for months.
Why did I write this? I don't know
Sources: Risto Volanen - Nuori Suomi (Finnish book)
It makes me very happy that Germany is called German Reich (okay, Empire would be better) instead of Weimar Republic. Because the official name of the first German republic was still Deutsches Reich (German Empire). But the first article of the Weimarer Reichsverfassung ((imperial)constitution of Weimar) explained: Das Deutsche Reich ist eine Republik (the German Empire/Reich is a republic).
Can you imagine a world without woodrow wilson?
Sure. We're living in one right now.
Woodrow Wilson was a bigot, regardless of his tentative to ensure other nations autonomy
@@charliespurr7325 WW has already ruined the world beyond repair
Wilson was a
racist and globalist
Everybody dancing happily under a rainbow.
I wonder if Yevgeny Prigozhin is inspired by d'Annunzio. The Wagner Group march on Moscow had the same style.
So, you're saying his speech style made him a "proto-fascist"?
at 00:51 what kind of dog is that
I completely understand why creating historical content is such a pain on YT (you explained it well in other videos), but do you really need to repeat the same speech over and over again during the last 3 minutes at the end of the recent videos (this one is the 5th one, if I counted correctly) ?
Yugoslavia didn't exactly work out well.
So Wilson admitted that his new world order wasn't possible EVERYWHERE
only possible in his Klan universe
Anyone who tries to dabble with the Balkans and their borders, won't end up well
Sincerely, a Balkan.
Well the Romans and the Ottomans seemed to end up quite well
define "their borders" because Istria was in vast majority Italian...
Live by a sword, die by a sword 💪🏼
@@nino71 Istria was only 38% Italian in the 1910 census
@@matthiuskoenig3378 I don't want to start an argument but the 1910 census can not ne considered reliable. Indeniably the costal part of Istria (up to and including Fiume) has always been in vast majority inhabited by Italians, built by Italians for their own people.
"Wilson will agree to no arrangement which gives any people to Italy without their consent";
and at the same time Italy gets one third of Slovenia (populated by you guessed it, Slovenes)...
Last time I was this early, Fiume belonged to the Austrian Empire
Does curiosity stream and nebula cost?
Anoter outstanding Video
Ironic Wilson didn't do the same for Germans and austrians who didn't have say or vote where they ended up after Denmark only got 1/3 of Holstien by vote allies never again allowed vote by german people . As Italian this why and with Japan we left allies . and for the record since roman times Istra has always been Identified as Italian as it was part of Italia Province Of Roman Empire .
u even edited ur sentence, how can u write something that is so Spazzy
The Italians betrayed their former allies to grab territory in 1915 because they wanted votes for Austrians and Germans?
@@johnpoole3871 Betrayed? The austrians broke their promise you swine
Cause the fall of the government... AGAIN...
I got to start meeting people from city-states :)
What strikes me is how greedy these European states still were after the War. Eager to snatch what they could. Its inevitable that a bigger greedier foe should prevail.
D'Annuncio had the Kavorka.
The big war stopped , little ones continued.
"Based on proto-fascist, anarchist, and republican ideals" I will give you a million dollars if you can invite me to a dinner with those heavy thinkers.
Thank you so much for this great episode!!!
Historical speeches, raised right hand, armed cue... it all started in Rijeka (Fiume) and was later copied by Duce and later on by Führer.
That is why Rijeka is and forever will be strongly Antifascist!
I would love to see additional episodes marking
1. “Krvavi Božić” = Bloody Christmas = events in Rijeka at December 1920
2. First armed Fascist cue & commemorating first ever victims of Fascism = in Rijeka at March 3rd 1922
This!
How doses if feel like living on stolen land, that you grabbed after a genocide?
@@vaxcucksbelongintheovens7991 Mi hai tolto le parole di bocca!
@@davidfiorini6416 E se vantano pure
@@vaxcucksbelongintheovens7991 l'unica soluzione sarebbe attaccarli... noi Veneti che avevamo a che fare con questi popoli sotto sviluppati li chiamavamo "s'ciavi" con l'assonanza slavo-schiavo
If a land is inhabited in half by Italians, another half by Germans and yet another half by Croats, should it be given to the Serbs by the French and the British?
identifyng Fascism in it's early phase (1919 to 1922) as "the Nationalist right" (03:56) it's a big mistake and an
inadmissible simplification
could you elaborate on the differences between nationalist right and fascism?
@@slimsh8dy the "right" has to do with being conservative. (Italian) Fascism has been something else, something new particularly in the early and very late (1943-1945) stages. To simplify you might say that (Italian) Fascism has been "right" for what matters moral values and "left" for what matters walfare and labour. This said Fiume (Reggenza del Carnaro) was even more diverse and different from all that was seen before (and after). It has been a very unique experience with a very advanced Constitution (Carta del Carnaro).
@@nino71 I believe your definition of fascism is flawed. fascism is on the right on cultural and 'moral' issues (if you can call it that) but it has nothing in the way for welfare or labour. this is not to say that it is capitalistic or business friendly, it is a blend of the two viewpoints all in order to serve the stae. Hence i think nationalist right is not an inadmissble simplification. Simplifcation yes, but not a bad label ultimately
@@slimsh8dy I am not sure what you mean but Fascism in Italy has built the walfare state (social security, social housing, severance pay, 5 days working week, 8 hours working day, child labour law, massive public investments etc.etc.etc.) In the late stages (Repubblica Sociale Italiana) Fascism even tried the socialization of all productive assets. Have you ever heard of Nicola Bombacci? He was the first leader of the Italian Comunist Party and ended up being shot with Mussolini.
@@nino71 I suppose Italian Facsism had bits and pieces of a socialist economy but by and large they practised Corporatism, a doctrine which doesn't really subscribe to capitalism or socialism. In fact, it was proposed as an alternative against classical liberalism and marxism
Muy interesante el documental. Gracias
Great intro music
Wow, many of these territorial issues after WWI are quite tense. I can imagine the diplomats of all the countries constantly ordering coffee and spending many nights without sleep while trying to find rough compromises to uneasy issues.
Onion actually had a great joke article about it in Our Dumb Century. Think it was map makers going insane.
5:05 Important is that there was no prewar Serbia & Montenegro, they were separate independent states and allies. After the war, Montenegro was absorbed by the new state in unclear circumstances.
It is quite clear in this context that it was not meant that Serbia and Montenegro formed a single state.
"Eia, eia, eia! Alala!"
Bash the fash!
@@gregorstamejcic2355 if that were the case all former yugoslav countries would loose the majority of their population
@@NovaSoldier might be. And we might be better off for it, once the numbers normalize...
@@gregorstamejcic2355 i mean, better for the world in general, the less south slavs there are the better
@@gregorstamejcic2355 Me ne frego
Is it just me or does Jesse kind of look like the guy on very left of thumbnail ??
What a coincidence! Just learned about this a few days ago.
lmao look at the guy at 11:57 he got startled by the camera
Interesting Video.
You keep all this informations in your mind??😮
La Vittoria mutilata
4:44 wasn't it renamed in 1921?
Dams it was renamed after the death of stjepan radic which was in 1928
And people complain about modern negotiations....
You see that black guy with Mussolini at 26:45?
Contrary to National Socialism (which should more aptly be called Racial Socialism), Italian Fascism was never racist; just nationalist/imperialist.
@@Runenschuppe Didn't help the nationless people one goddamn bit
it's the color of the picture you idiots
Wilson makes me laugh. He is talking a bout the evils of the world that caused wars...ignoring the massacre of American natives and the destruction of the American Natives nations....in his own land. Not only he supported racial segregation to exist in the US. So preach to other countries but do as you want with your own. Hypocrite.
What language was used in those diplomatic talks? Italian? English? Serbo-croat? French? Esperanto?
Probably French.
yes, mostly French, the language of international diplomacy until WW II
Italian nationalists weren't just angry they didn't a Croatian city. They were Fiume-ng.
How do you delete someone elses comment?
Fiume era italiana e ritonerà italiana
@@costante_3196 Sure thing chief right after you give sicily to the arabs,southern italy to the greeks and west to the french. We might have a convo about Croatian land
@@Bebwara Such ignorance.
After the fall of the Western Roman Empire, Istria and the Dalmatian coast were under Venetian (ergo Italian) domination until the treaty of Campo Formio in 1797, that's around 7 centuries of colonization from Italic populations.
Meanwhile Sicily was controlled by the Arabs for about 264 years with not that many attempts of colonization, and as a matter of fact the Arabs or Arab descendants never became the majority in no place in Sicily.
Southern Italy never had such a large Greek presence.
In western Italy only the older Savoy and the Valle d'Aosta have roots that can be traced to France, but those regions mainly Valle d'Aosta have many roots that can be traced back to mainland Italy.
That today Fiume is Croatian is not a problem, but claiming that it always has been is false
@@thecommentaryking Imagine calling someone out with such dreadful knowledge. Dalmatia was part of croatia since petar kresimir the 4th was crowned by the pope as king of croatia and dalmatia. After the collapse of the croatian state the land was occupied but only until the treaty of zadar in 1358 parts were sold to venice in 1409 by ladislav napuljski after losing a war for the croatohungarian crown. The venitian pressence in dalmatia was irrelevant after the treaty of zadar even more so after croatia and hungary joined the habsburg empire in 1516
Creation of Yugoslavia was the biggest mistake Serbs did.
The guy with the pipe at 11:56 looks like: "Shoot, I'm on film! The boss will see me goofing off!"
In all seriousness, I love the work you guys are doing. Absolutely professional and educational. Just one small complaint...PLEASE PLEASE STOP COLORIZING THE PHOTOS. It takes away the sense of age and history that you are trying to convey. The issues dealt with are as fresh as today's headlines...but it's from over a century ago. Seeing a photograph or film footage that looks genuinely old and untouched adds weight to that. Also, some of the colorization just comes out bad. The still of Mussolini in a crowd (26:39) has some of the clothes with off-color blotches, the two faces in the left and right foreground are still black and white (which makes them look cadaverous), and the face of the man just below the man to Mussolini's right looks like he's wearing Halloween makeup.
When Italy got things done.
The trouble is that there are too many ethnicities in that part of the world.
In the Adriatic proposal President Wilson presented was rational and practical, except the recipients WERE/ARE NOT !
D'Annunzio ha rovinato Fiume.