I pad around 70 dollars in piping for the mild steel. And 550-600dollars in brass. But thats without the cusi3 welding wire and it needs pure argon as well. Its not ideal to do it this way but i cant go out and buy a tig and learn a new skill “like that” when im trying go be a husband, father of small kids, and go to work But one day i will try again. Using a tig
I have a recommendation for you. Take the brass pipes to an exhaust shop and ask them to make you a full catback brass system with an x pipe. I think it will sound very good like that
Exhaust/muffler shops don't really exist outside of north america, usually you buy an exhaust from a garage that does everything, or specialist motorsports fabricators will build you one
@@groeacht8525Brazil does have too. We have some artists down here, doing everything you want in matter of exhaust. From econoboxes turned into racing machines, and exotics supercars even (if you wanna see/hear, please search for "Secret Weapon Exhaust")
I remember in my town there was an old man that used to ride a Honda CBX 1050 6-cylinder with a brass exhaust, that thing was ridiculously loud, cops would always show up. The pipes looked awful but the sound was just incredible
ever came down my road with that shit wouldn't go out for sure! no one wants to be subjected to some one else's stupidity. like these idiots with the stereos... if i can be in my house and hear it then you are wrong, no ifs or buts. this takes stupid to new heights is all im saying... go to the track for that shit!
While the sound of brass would still be superior to stainless, back then they had neither the metallurgy nor the tooling necessary to fabricate stainless pipe organs anyhow.
This is amazing man! It sounds like pure music to my ears. This is the best straight pipes I've ever heard in my entire life, big ups on the new invention and i really hope this reaches the entire car community! 🙏🏻👌🏻
Would be really cool to see a part 3 to this endeavor….adding a brass x pipe to the system 😅. I do appreciate your time you spent and the effort put into carrying this test out, because like you, I often wonder about things like this and wish I had the skill to carry them out haha.
If i can do it so can you. Its mostly a question of the equipment. Im just fortunate to have been gathering tools/equipment for a long time. And i dont do the jobs perfectly. Look at the welds lol
Y pipe does even better, both for flow/scavenging AND sound. If you want no restrictions, use the 7/5 rule to go from 2 pipes to one pipe (or vice versa for no velocity loss). If your duals are already slightly big and you want a slight bump in velocity, use the 4/3 rule instead. For sound, just make sure everything is equal length or it won't blend right. Same goes for the other crossover types, too.
Damn! You really did it! :D I can tell the sound difference, not as drony and sounds better, but still really loud. Really cool to see! Keep up the great job man! And hope your health is good!
You asked what we wanted to see next. I think the success of your last two videos says it all: you should become the weird-material exhaust on TH-cam. Try bronze next time 😅 And try different thicknesses!
Thank you. Thats why im gonna put it on hold though😅 i want to make videos i like doing, and not only what others would like. I like experimenting. And will return to exhausts again as part of that. But i also want to do other stuff. Ideas is the only thing i wont run out of. Hope you have great day sir
I have to say, that is the best exhaust video editing I have seen, like showing how it sounds inside and outside / at idle and driving and how you went back and forth a few times, good job, new subscriber now 👍
I would think the steel would smooth the pipe resonation before the sound waves even hit the brass, for the 100% experience, you need brass headers all the way back, the the tone would be more loud, than flair out the ends like two little trumpets to look cool. Good vid.!
You can tig weld brass very nicely, I believe as it’s a copper alloy you would also use helium gas as shielding. If you’re getting sheets of it also you could make a fully resonated and X piped system and tigged so it’s aesthetic as well as doesn’t effect the resonance like the mig welded with steel wire.
Another great video and I am actually surprised about the disclaimer about more power with straight pipes!! Appreciate your hard work and information!! Already looking forward to your next video 😍
Much like a two stroke, a four stroke engine has a power band, and much like a two stroke, adjusting the pipes alters the powerband. However unlike a two stroke, the effect isn't so dramatic that not having back pressure or pulse will do damage to a four like it will a two. But like a two stroke, open pipes are really only good for one throttle setting, WOT.... Drag race style high revving, clutch dumping, transmission blowing levels of high revving take off and racing. While having a proper back pressure, and properly timed exhaust pulse, will greatly increase the power seen at lower RPM for the exact same setup. Too much restriction, it chokes the engine, too little restriction and it "hyperventilates" the engine which causes losses of power in the low RPM ranges, while increasing the power in the high RPM ranges. Mind you that's all based on a properly tuned ECU, or a really good mechanic tuning a carb for it.
back in the 80s down here it was used to have a bronze "tip" on diesel trucks (mercedes 1114, ford700, dodge 800 and so on). those suckers screamed high and loud
I don't know if I'm just a crazy person.. but I wonder what would happen if you had about a dozen or so 10mm brass tubes inside a larger tube as the tailpipes. Might be a dumb idea, but it would have an affect on the sound waves, creating more organized and shorter waves. Then i wonder about 100 or so 1mm tubes also stuffed into a larger pipe. Titanium also has a noticable influence over the audible tone in exhaust... I really appreciate you taking the time to do these tests because I wondered the same thing about brass after seeing some clowns connect a brass instrument to an exhaust and it sounded badass, like a trumpet. So i was looking for other videos that would educate me and discovered your channel just a week ago. On your last video i was left wondering what it would sound like doing the whole system in Brass so i was delighted when i saw your video today. And excellent job on editing the back and forth clips. That really made it easy to notice the differences between the systems. Well done, keep up the good work my guy!
Never once heard of brass used in exhaust but the tone is noticeably different, I think it’s pretty cool that you attempted this! Super entertaining! Great execution and also the 50-110km times and decibel readings were cool to see
Truly wonderful how clean the bottom of your E46 is! As someone from Chicago, our cars rust so awfully because of road salt, I can't imagine seeing one in that condition!
Awesome idea man, thanks for fronting the cost for this for us lol. I hadnt considered the effect of other metals on sound in exhaust. Of course, theres a reason for brass instruments, and different softness and resonance, etc. nice shop by the way!
I find it interesting how the brass seems to mute the higher frequencies and maybe also accentuate the lows as well. It does look like the brass has thicker walls than the steel, so that's probably a factor, but brass also has different properties that could be doing that anyway.
Oh trust me the metal does make a difference, it's all i nthe acustics of the metal. There is a reason why we don't make steel trumpets, trombones and Tuba
@@SilvaDreams Imagine paying 3000$ for a steel trumpet for it to sound like a hawk having a stroke. Steel is good on many points but acoustic nowhere near it.
i'm with you on the resonators + brass idea. I kinda preferred the tone of the brass as well even though the rasp was too much. This was a great experiment!
Found you randomly thru the youtube algorithm, Thank you for the contribution, hope this vid gets tons of views. Sure, I'll subscribe, this was an interesting video to watch. Well done.
it's the collector quality that dictates a lot of the sound, the exhaust manifold and a high quality material on the manifold / collector is how to achieve the best sound. but this does prove that a good resonance material like brass can make a cool sound too. love it :)
I clicked this video expecting some American car or something, only to find a beautiful 330ci! I have a 330i as well so I was quite surprised. Great video
@@OEMplusRESTO Personally I like wrenching videos or people doing unorthodox/less conventional mods, like this video. But honestly man, just keep doing what you're doing. Make the videos YOU want to make!
If you have the room for it, I think an equal length header from each cylinder into 2 collectors, alternating cylinder firing, each into its own brass straight pipe would sound awesome
The title of the vid sold me. My thought was you were attaching pipe organ flutes to your car which tbh you're not far off from it. It sounds so interesting it could almost replace the entire brass section of the Vienna Philharmonic. 😁
The brass definitely gives it a more exotic sound, wonder how it would sound going into a single pipe, or through an x pipe setup. Another one that would be interesting to hear is carbon fibre or carbon kevlar pipes.
@@OEMplusRESTO i know you can "cure" or anneal(?) 3d printed filiments to make them stronger and more temp resistant. How hot does exhaust get? Im sure it can handle 200degrees as ppl have used it in intake,under hood applications such as ITBs and other parts
Subbed after last "brass video" so worth it. Great work 👍👍👌👌 Love the full Brass exhaust. P.S. Cheap Upgrade next. But maybe the Full Detailing clean might get more views
Love your channel!!! Super cool to see a part 2 of the brass experiment! As you know, exhaust testing is totally a "rabbit hole". We may need a part 3. 👍 Your quest for a heavenly brass sound might be just around the corner. Like you mentioned, the true duals are losing some scavenging effect of a cross over. An x-pipe would serve this porpose as well as additional change in tone/ drone reduction. Hook this up to your schmeidmann headers. The stock catalyzed manifolds just don't give you much anything good to work with in terms of quality sound unfortunately. As you know, the first few feet of an exhaust is critical in terms of sound alone, especially in a stright pipe configuration. Headers make such a big difference. I am amazed at how much the brass changes the tone. I would say the resonance is even more dramatic than titanium. Might be worth going down the "rabbit hole" just a bit further, ya know, for science...😂 Send me your contact info. / email.
Great video , I’d never seen or heard of brass exhaust pipe. There was a guy in Troon Ayrshire GB that worked with E-type jags old 1930s RollsRoyce etc and although I didn’t actually see 1 I was reliably informed he had full copper systems on some of his vehicles for better sound. Hope that interests someone
I noticed less rasp in heavier gauge stainless steel exhausts ages and ages ago, as a kid watching muscle car videos (our market is huge! so finding same brand and design with different quality metal was not hard) so i love that you did this but the end result of it being raspier was what i expected, to be blunt. Not personally a huge fan of excess rasp but there are easier ways to achieve this if its something someone desired, namely you just need a large section of pipe that starts resonating (aka, blank pipe uninhibited by extra supports, muffling, or anything that would weight it down.) Similar but slightly different effect a enlarged diameter exhaust tip can do similar, doesn't have to be a muffler literally just a tip. If you want less rasp and just to try brass you could fit resonators mid-way up after largest connecting point near headers, thats cheapest easiest anti-rasp method i know but rare to find since it requires more fab then just sticking resonators at butt end of exhaust when it comes to DiY builds. I like "Bullet" style mufflers for this approach, but all that would have to be made out of steel unless you fabbed brass ones, drilled all the holes and packed the matting to replicate one yourself.
I hate to say it, but I would love to hear one more comparison of your brass system, and that would be with an X-pipe added as close as possible to the engine. I have a feeling that it might actually improve the tone even more, and reduce the decibels some.. But I really would be so happy to find out! Lol
I reckon the decreased time is negligible but might be because the stock exhaust isnt that restrictive and probably engineered so well that even less restriction reduces the back pressure which is common with getting too big of an exhaust
You found out how to make it sound like a Honda! I kid, mostly, I think some the other commenters are right though. If you did some sound engineering with a shop that was capable, like just running a brass X-Pipe or a resonator as you mentioned in the video it could be epic! Also epically loud...
Look up megaphones. Exhaust megaphones. Just seent a video the other day talking about a gradual increase in diameter (megaphone shape) as part of the piping back. Even showed how placing the megaphone pipe in different locations, or distances from heads, offered different sounds. Or really it was pitch. Check the video out.
You should try a crack at making a brass resonator to fit in the mid pipe. Even if it be as simple as a bigger size pipe with reducers to create a chamber. It might help tone some of the raspiness
Used to have a 2 inc in strigh copper tube on one of my old minis still never knew who firrted it or why it was on whe i got it back in 98 oh the sound and fumes !!
I love your scientific approach to the experiment exactly how it should be done with a mean/median to compare figures and parts very well fitted! I think the brass sounded very good, "but" is it worth all the effort? maybe a different story if brass exhausts were mass produced...
The reason it wasn't faster is due to it not being tuned for the flow if you change anything engine wise you'll need to tune it for the change then stock tune is made for the perimeters created from the standard parts so take the standard exhaust with create back pressure removing the resistance from the exhaust will reduce back pressure changing engine perimeters but interestingly there's been tests done with air flow throw exhausts and some engines need at least a resonator otherwise the exhaust gases become turbulent reducing the flow losing power
I really liked the brass with inserts, sounded like a race car! 😂 Another video experimenting with H X or resonators to dial in the sound would be very interesting.
This is a great experiment. Thanks for doing it. I wonder if the way the brass was fabricated had an influence on it. Like how ever people fabricate brass horns, would that make a difference vs welding. Awesome video!
Thanks for doing the inserts in the brass: my pick if not stock ;) The resonances ("drone") in the steel system won't be replicated in the brass purely because of the diameter difference. You can see this in your warm idle dB measurement and your performance measurement: the larger diameter of the brass pipes gives lower gas velocity at low (/no) throttle openings by the time the exhaust pulses reach the tips, which translates to lower sound pressure level in the low audible frequencies and slightly poorer torque before the VANOS is fully advanced. If you did a top speed run or some time attack laps all above 5000rpm the brass would probably be faster. The lower gas velocity overall gives the pulses more time to smear out and exit in a less coherent "pop", and unlike the steel (or a 4" fully hektik JDM hero exhaust in steel AKA drone box), the brass doesn't naturally reinforce the low frequencies. By my calculations at 2000rpm each of your twin pipes is delivering 2000/2/60*3=50 pulses of pferdestaerke per second. That's a bit too low frequency for most people to hear, but the second harmonic at 100Hz is right there in that annoying drone zone most people can. Hit your steel system with a spanner while using an audio spectrum analyser app on your phone and I'll bet you can get some peaks around 1-200Hz. Try it again with the brass and i bet the spikes are all higher up, and thus will move more on a running engine as the pipes find and lose natural resonances with the higher exhaust harmonics which change more as the ecu varies rpm and timing to hold idle setpoint/while driving => more "musical" exhaust tone. Even in your intro, the brass muffler delete is obviously brighter (despite it actually being both a longer and wider pipe: should be lower tone if same material). For future experiments do like instrument manufacturers (or at least repairers) do: solder/braze the brass with a blowtorch and plumber's silver solder: less fumes, better seal, wouldn't last a sprint race perhaps but that's not relevant for your tests. For reference the decibel formula is Power Ratio [dB] = 10*log10(PowerOUT/PowerREF) (in whatever power units are most convenient) so a sound that is +3dB vs some reference is twice as powerful (~"loud"). This means a 12dB difference is telling you one sound is 2^4=16 times as loud as the other. Brass pipes give a warm idle half as loud as mild steel. That's impressive.
My suggestion it to progressively make the exhaust larger so it’s roughly shaped like a horn. Maybe weld sections of pipe together increasing the diameter.
I ran an audio spectrum analyzer in a Chrome extension- Brass- the second and third harmonic seem to be more pronounced in relation to the fundamental frequency, compared to steel . The higher frequencies are slightly attenuated compared to steel. This gives it a "warmer" midrange character, while eliminating some of the high frequency "rasp" present in the steel exhaust. Brass w/ brass inserts- the fundamental frequency is notably attenuated, while upper harmonics are even more dominant than brass w/o inserts. The fundamental frequency changes slightly, most likely as a result of the exhaust constriction, lowering the fundamental by 5-10hz at idle. That's just a rough hypothesis, though. Lengthening or shortening the tubing will change the resonant frequencies independent of exhaust pipe material. I'd assume that the "midbass" quality (more pronounced 2nd and 3rd harmonics in relation to attenuated high freq content and attenuated fundamental) is a result of the material. Therefore the brass piping is acting as a low Q bandpass filter, leaving the midbass-midrange region intact, while reducing the highest highs and lowest lows.
Thank you so much for doing this. Very interesting read. Im definitely not done experimenting with exhausts(headers, xpipe hpipe mufflers and resonators)
i wonder if it has anything to do with the volumetric differences of the straight pipes, vs having the large open area in the muffler adding volume to the system.
The cost of brass piping for this mod... I salute you for contribution.
Thank you
I used 6.2m for those interested. 5.2 meter of 50mm outside diameter and 1m of 64mm outside diameter tubing
@@OEMplusRESTO how much more expensive the brass pipe is compared to steel pipe? I have no clue about brass prices
@@Taikauskoguesstimate 5x the price of mild steel
I pad around 70 dollars in piping for the mild steel. And 550-600dollars in brass. But thats without the cusi3 welding wire and it needs pure argon as well. Its not ideal to do it this way but i cant go out and buy a tig and learn a new skill “like that” when im trying go be a husband, father of small kids, and go to work
But one day i will try again. Using a tig
I have a recommendation for you. Take the brass pipes to an exhaust shop and ask them to make you a full catback brass system with an x pipe. I think it will sound very good like that
Id probably diy it but thank you for the great suggestion:)
@@OEMplusRESTOplease, i would love to fit one myself
Exhaust/muffler shops don't really exist outside of north america, usually you buy an exhaust from a garage that does everything, or specialist motorsports fabricators will build you one
@@groeacht8525Brazil does have too. We have some artists down here, doing everything you want in matter of exhaust. From econoboxes turned into racing machines, and exotics supercars even (if you wanna see/hear, please search for "Secret Weapon Exhaust")
theyre 100% not going to be able to braize brass at an exhaust shop
I have never once asked what brass pipes would sound like.... But i thank you for this video. Very informative and satisfying my tism
I remember in my town there was an old man that used to ride a Honda CBX 1050 6-cylinder with a brass exhaust, that thing was ridiculously loud, cops would always show up. The pipes looked awful but the sound was just incredible
I can only imagine how the greatest sounding engine ever would sound with brass exhaust!
ever came down my road with that shit wouldn't go out for sure! no one wants to be subjected to some one else's stupidity. like these idiots with the stereos... if i can be in my house and hear it then you are wrong, no ifs or buts. this takes stupid to new heights is all im saying... go to the track for that shit!
@@t16205that is nowhere near the best sounding engine lmao
@avaubanprime6972 they are one of my favorites actually when they have a proper exhaust system on them.
@@avaubanprime6972 "nowhere near the best sounding Lmao"
Ok dude. I guess you never actually heard one then
3:00 love the way u flipped back and forth btwn the 2 comparing noises
first slowly then faster
perfect
thank u
never seen it done so well !!
i’ve literally been wondering what brass exhaust would sound like for the past few days so thanks for sharing this fun little exploration !!
Thank you for the aupport bro. And me too. Thats why i had to make a video of it. Been wondering for wayyy to long lol
indeed, best sound comparison mechanism.
@@OEMplusRESTOagreed, very well done video. Subbed!
the first 3 seconds immediately sold me.
Great work on the multiple sound clips. Different settings, scenarios - impressed with your thorough approach.
This is criminally an underrated channel.
This brass exhaust must be what all those 350z guys are running
35 ounce guys
😂😂 how'd you know
I got a Z and I’m now looking into this 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
@@ninjazombie6660 I have a Cr-Z and I'm now looking into this.
@@zeniey send it I’m a Toyota mechanic
No wonder the brass sounds better... Why do you think they used brass pipes for those huge organs in churches. SOUND QUALITY!
Those used lead 😅
@@drzandlcplead/tin alloy pipes and copper pipes also btw
While the sound of brass would still be superior to stainless, back then they had neither the metallurgy nor the tooling necessary to fabricate stainless pipe organs anyhow.
This is amazing man! It sounds like pure music to my ears. This is the best straight pipes I've ever heard in my entire life, big ups on the new invention and i really hope this reaches the entire car community! 🙏🏻👌🏻
Thank you. That was very kind of you to say🙏
@@OEMplusRESTO no problem man , that exhaust is amazing! Keep up the awesome work you are doing! 🙏🏻
I don't know why but your accent makes this 100 times better.
We call it Danglish around here. Oddly i get this comment alot🤣
@@OEMplusRESTOMy guy you sound like Arnold Schwarzenegger I watched your entire video it was great Yeah😊
😊
@@Dillionmcfry im taking all of it as an accomplishment. Maybe one day i get to live my childhood fav movie and fend off a predator lol
You'd definitely pick up a lot of lady viewers if you were covered in mud in a tree for the next video lol @@OEMplusRESTO
@@OEMplusRESTO Yeah 😄😄😄😀😁😁
Would be really cool to see a part 3 to this endeavor….adding a brass x pipe to the system 😅. I do appreciate your time you spent and the effort put into carrying this test out, because like you, I often wonder about things like this and wish I had the skill to carry them out haha.
If i can do it so can you. Its mostly a question of the equipment. Im just fortunate to have been gathering tools/equipment for a long time. And i dont do the jobs perfectly. Look at the welds lol
Y pipe does even better, both for flow/scavenging AND sound. If you want no restrictions, use the 7/5 rule to go from 2 pipes to one pipe (or vice versa for no velocity loss).
If your duals are already slightly big and you want a slight bump in velocity, use the 4/3 rule instead. For sound, just make sure everything is equal length or it won't blend right. Same goes for the other crossover types, too.
Bro you had me at the thumbnail 🤣🤣🤣
Im worried its a bit too offensive but i’ll see where it takes me lol
@@OEMplusRESTO No mate! It's definitely a keeper 😁😂
😂 got me wondering first why would you use that in thumbnail, then i got... nice comparison and tests! Can't wait for more tests to come.
brassers 💀
@@OEMplusRESTOI thought it was clever😅😂
Wow, I can't believe how clean your car is underneath - it looks new! Wish my 330Ci was that clean underneath. Keep up the good work👍
That's because he recently restored the underside of his car
Fr looks very clean i need to bring my coupe back to glory too
Stumbled upon this channel randomly. But agreeing to several comments here, this indeed is an underrated channel🔥
Damn! You really did it! :D I can tell the sound difference, not as drony and sounds better, but still really loud. Really cool to see! Keep up the great job man! And hope your health is good!
You too
You asked what we wanted to see next. I think the success of your last two videos says it all: you should become the weird-material exhaust on TH-cam. Try bronze next time 😅
And try different thicknesses!
Thank you. Thats why im gonna put it on hold though😅 i want to make videos i like doing, and not only what others would like. I like experimenting. And will return to exhausts again as part of that. But i also want to do other stuff. Ideas is the only thing i wont run out of. Hope you have great day sir
Mate your channel is underrated.. hope it picks up steam. Thank you for all the hard work.
Thank you for the kind words. Me too
I knew it was a bmw the second you turned it on. Sounds is unmistakable
I have to say, that is the best exhaust video editing I have seen, like showing how it sounds inside and outside / at idle and driving and how you went back and forth a few times, good job, new subscriber now 👍
I really shouldn´t give you a like... You know Janteloven and all...
But since there is less than 6 million of us, I will support you... God vid...
I would think the steel would smooth the pipe resonation before the sound waves even hit the brass, for the 100% experience, you need brass headers all the way back, the the tone would be more loud, than flair out the ends like two little trumpets to look cool. Good vid.!
You can tig weld brass very nicely, I believe as it’s a copper alloy you would also use helium gas as shielding. If you’re getting sheets of it also you could make a fully resonated and X piped system and tigged so it’s aesthetic as well as doesn’t effect the resonance like the mig welded with steel wire.
Another great video and I am actually surprised about the disclaimer about more power with straight pipes!! Appreciate your hard work and information!! Already looking forward to your next video 😍
Much like a two stroke, a four stroke engine has a power band, and much like a two stroke, adjusting the pipes alters the powerband.
However unlike a two stroke, the effect isn't so dramatic that not having back pressure or pulse will do damage to a four like it will a two.
But like a two stroke, open pipes are really only good for one throttle setting, WOT.... Drag race style high revving, clutch dumping, transmission blowing levels of high revving take off and racing.
While having a proper back pressure, and properly timed exhaust pulse, will greatly increase the power seen at lower RPM for the exact same setup.
Too much restriction, it chokes the engine, too little restriction and it "hyperventilates" the engine which causes losses of power in the low RPM ranges, while increasing the power in the high RPM ranges. Mind you that's all based on a properly tuned ECU, or a really good mechanic tuning a carb for it.
back in the 80s down here it was used to have a bronze "tip" on diesel trucks (mercedes 1114, ford700, dodge 800 and so on). those suckers screamed high and loud
I'm sure you'll never stop trying improve this car! Never change!
I don't know if I'm just a crazy person.. but I wonder what would happen if you had about a dozen or so 10mm brass tubes inside a larger tube as the tailpipes.
Might be a dumb idea, but it would have an affect on the sound waves, creating more organized and shorter waves. Then i wonder about 100 or so 1mm tubes also stuffed into a larger pipe.
Titanium also has a noticable influence over the audible tone in exhaust...
I really appreciate you taking the time to do these tests because I wondered the same thing about brass after seeing some clowns connect a brass instrument to an exhaust and it sounded badass, like a trumpet. So i was looking for other videos that would educate me and discovered your channel just a week ago. On your last video i was left wondering what it would sound like doing the whole system in Brass so i was delighted when i saw your video today.
And excellent job on editing the back and forth clips. That really made it easy to notice the differences between the systems. Well done, keep up the good work my guy!
Great ideas!!!!! Sounds like it could make an exotic sounding tone.
Never once heard of brass used in exhaust but the tone is noticeably different, I think it’s pretty cool that you attempted this! Super entertaining! Great execution and also the 50-110km times and decibel readings were cool to see
Truly wonderful how clean the bottom of your E46 is! As someone from Chicago, our cars rust so awfully because of road salt, I can't imagine seeing one in that condition!
Thank you
this video is so well done. I was surprised you don't have a mil subscribers yet. Perfect side by side comparisons!
Thank you.
I used to run copper pipe on my mini bike Briggs & Stratton. It produced green flames. Only visible after dark but cool looking.
Sounds extremely cool honestly
Love how the brass exhaust makes it sound like it is revving higher.
Awesome idea man, thanks for fronting the cost for this for us lol. I hadnt considered the effect of other metals on sound in exhaust. Of course, theres a reason for brass instruments, and different softness and resonance, etc. nice shop by the way!
Thank you
I find it interesting how the brass seems to mute the higher frequencies and maybe also accentuate the lows as well. It does look like the brass has thicker walls than the steel, so that's probably a factor, but brass also has different properties that could be doing that anyway.
Lenght of pipe plays a factor as seen with organ pipes.
Oh trust me the metal does make a difference, it's all i nthe acustics of the metal. There is a reason why we don't make steel trumpets, trombones and Tuba
@@SilvaDreams Imagine paying 3000$ for a steel trumpet for it to sound like a hawk having a stroke. Steel is good on many points but acoustic nowhere near it.
i'm with you on the resonators + brass idea. I kinda preferred the tone of the brass as well even though the rasp was too much. This was a great experiment!
Can you put on sunglasses and say "I'll be back"?
Hahahaha. Maybe
Do it! 😂
😂😂😂😂
Bro. You sound like a villain, love your accent in the manliest way possible... Awesome video, good job.
Most people tell me i should yell “get to the chopper”.. i prefer your take on it🤣
Found you randomly thru the youtube algorithm,
Thank you for the contribution, hope this vid gets tons of views.
Sure, I'll subscribe, this was an interesting video to watch.
Well done.
Thank you for the sub and kind words
Brass admittedly sounds amazing in the exhaust.
it's the collector quality that dictates a lot of the sound, the exhaust manifold and a high quality material on the manifold / collector is how to achieve the best sound. but this does prove that a good resonance material like brass can make a cool sound too. love it :)
I clicked this video expecting some American car or something, only to find a beautiful 330ci! I have a 330i as well so I was quite surprised. Great video
Great engine, great chassis. So much so i have built an entire yt channel around it. Hope yours is treating you well
11:45 Good to see you enjoying the process. I sure did. Cool project. Thanks for posting it. Have a good season 🤘🏼
Thanl you. Im happy you did. And a good season to you too sir
Sometimes we don't know we need the answer to things and I'm glad others ask for me. Loved it. Xpipe!!! Brass
the steps...the KEY is the steps for that f1 sound !
Yes, stepped tubes in the header & cone after collector or in mid pipe!
Best up and coming BMW TH-camr. I've binged a lot of your content and I love your work. Very good stuff here. Keep it up man!
Thats extremely kind of you to say. Thank you. Would you prefer a super service, cheap mods, or full detailing video?
@@OEMplusRESTO Personally I like wrenching videos or people doing unorthodox/less conventional mods, like this video. But honestly man, just keep doing what you're doing. Make the videos YOU want to make!
Massive work to get this video done! Good job!
love your vids man, so glad i discovered your chanel !
Thank you. Im happy you did
I would love to see it clay bar and detailed. Thanks for taking the time to try the experimental exhaust.
This was awesome and I’m cracking up at your welds lol good honesty!
Looks like a blind man welded them lol. Who cares. We still sent it
If you have the room for it, I think an equal length header from each cylinder into 2 collectors, alternating cylinder firing, each into its own brass straight pipe would sound awesome
bro the brass sounded the best for me i like the burbles and remember me when you are famous
Lol. Thank you:)
You my good sir earmed a sub with the quality and delivery of this video.
Thank you Sir. Much appreciated
I'm liking this before I get past the intro, what a interesting idea!
The title of the vid sold me. My thought was you were attaching pipe organ flutes to your car which tbh you're not far off from it. It sounds so interesting it could almost replace the entire brass section of the Vienna Philharmonic. 😁
Turning the straight six into an organ:)
That brass exhaust sounds really nice actually :P
Transfers more lifter noise and is the same otherwise. I salute you.
Sweet informative video with a TON of sound clips. Thanks
Thank you for the kind words:)
This sounds AMAZING
The brass definitely gives it a more exotic sound, wonder how it would sound going into a single pipe, or through an x pipe setup.
Another one that would be interesting to hear is carbon fibre or carbon kevlar pipes.
Oh.. hadnt thought of carbon. But what temp does it handle?
@@OEMplusRESTO i know you can "cure" or anneal(?) 3d printed filiments to make them stronger and more temp resistant. How hot does exhaust get? Im sure it can handle 200degrees as ppl have used it in intake,under hood applications such as ITBs and other parts
Its not cf and it cant@@TexTheMaster
@@mudargamer yes it can and you can get cf filiment. I use it on a 6.8l v10 in engine bay
@@TexTheMaster exhaust gas is like 1000 celsius, much higher than the engine bay. The filament would not survive
i was going to do this in the summer!! Kudos! great idea!!!!! sitting here excited for the test xx
The thickness of the material would be an interesting addition along with some acoustic tuning similar to a wind instrument.
I mean, there's a reason why brass is used in musical instruments.
Sound in part. But durability, aesthetics, and anti-microbial properties all lead to brass as a great option for musical instruments.
I have a brass catback on my 2jz and it sounds amazing. great detailed comparison testing!
Best straight 6 with best exhaust.. i can imagine
love the accent and the commentary, keep up the good work bro 👍
just what everyones been waiting for
Subbed after last "brass video" so worth it. Great work 👍👍👌👌
Love the full Brass exhaust.
P.S. Cheap Upgrade next. But maybe the Full Detailing clean might get more views
Love your channel!!! Super cool to see a part 2 of the brass experiment! As you know, exhaust testing is totally a "rabbit hole". We may need a part 3. 👍 Your quest for a heavenly brass sound might be just around the corner. Like you mentioned, the true duals are losing some scavenging effect of a cross over. An x-pipe would serve this porpose as well as additional change in tone/ drone reduction. Hook this up to your schmeidmann headers. The stock catalyzed manifolds just don't give you much anything good to work with in terms of quality sound unfortunately. As you know, the first few feet of an exhaust is critical in terms of sound alone, especially in a stright pipe configuration. Headers make such a big difference. I am amazed at how much the brass changes the tone. I would say the resonance is even more dramatic than titanium. Might be worth going down the "rabbit hole" just a bit further, ya know, for science...😂 Send me your contact info. / email.
Thank you for the tips. You can dm menat instagram. Link is in the channel description:)
The brass almost seems to muffle it a bit and raise the pitch. It also seems to remove the peaks at 3000 and 6000 that the steel had
This was great, thank you! Subscribed!
Thank you
Great video , I’d never seen or heard of brass exhaust pipe.
There was a guy in Troon Ayrshire GB that worked with E-type jags old 1930s RollsRoyce etc and although I didn’t actually see 1 I was reliably informed he had full copper systems on some of his vehicles for better sound.
Hope that interests someone
Thank you. It interests me😎
I noticed less rasp in heavier gauge stainless steel exhausts ages and ages ago, as a kid watching muscle car videos (our market is huge! so finding same brand and design with different quality metal was not hard) so i love that you did this but the end result of it being raspier was what i expected, to be blunt. Not personally a huge fan of excess rasp but there are easier ways to achieve this if its something someone desired, namely you just need a large section of pipe that starts resonating (aka, blank pipe uninhibited by extra supports, muffling, or anything that would weight it down.) Similar but slightly different effect a enlarged diameter exhaust tip can do similar, doesn't have to be a muffler literally just a tip.
If you want less rasp and just to try brass you could fit resonators mid-way up after largest connecting point near headers, thats cheapest easiest anti-rasp method i know but rare to find since it requires more fab then just sticking resonators at butt end of exhaust when it comes to DiY builds. I like "Bullet" style mufflers for this approach, but all that would have to be made out of steel unless you fabbed brass ones, drilled all the holes and packed the matting to replicate one yourself.
Thanks for the input. Will try out resonators one day😃
I hate to say it, but I would love to hear one more comparison of your brass system, and that would be with an X-pipe added as close as possible to the engine. I have a feeling that it might actually improve the tone even more, and reduce the decibels some.. But I really would be so happy to find out! Lol
X h and y pipe will be next. Maybe resonators and mufflers. Just have several other videos i need to make first!
@@OEMplusRESTO I wish I was close enough to do some welding for you so you could do more of these tests, faster. Such great stuff!
@tptrsn thank you. Would be nice lol. Just wear proper welding gear so you dont get sick
I reckon the decreased time is negligible but might be because the stock exhaust isnt that restrictive and probably engineered so well that even less restriction reduces the back pressure which is common with getting too big of an exhaust
i think the brass pipe and insert sounded the best
You found out how to make it sound like a Honda!
I kid, mostly, I think some the other commenters are right though. If you did some sound engineering with a shop that was capable, like just running a brass X-Pipe or a resonator as you mentioned in the video it could be epic! Also epically loud...
Look up megaphones. Exhaust megaphones. Just seent a video the other day talking about a gradual increase in diameter (megaphone shape) as part of the piping back. Even showed how placing the megaphone pipe in different locations, or distances from heads, offered different sounds. Or really it was pitch. Check the video out.
You should try a crack at making a brass resonator to fit in the mid pipe. Even if it be as simple as a bigger size pipe with reducers to create a chamber. It might help tone some of the raspiness
props for following up on the last video, esp considering the tubing isn't cheap. big kudos and a subscribe from me!
Used to have a 2 inc in strigh copper tube on one of my old minis still never knew who firrted it or why it was on whe i got it back in 98 oh the sound and fumes !!
I love your scientific approach to the experiment exactly how it should be done with a mean/median to compare figures and parts very well fitted! I think the brass sounded very good, "but" is it worth all the effort? maybe a different story if brass exhausts were mass produced...
Thank you. Thats very kind of you. Imo not worth it as i got nauseous even when using the face mask:)
Super service and acceleration numbers after
Exactly🙏
I love the Brass exhaust and I will look at the Cost between Titanium VS Brass. Thanks so Much
Thank you for the input
Absolutely phenomenal!
That brass sounds great
The reason it wasn't faster is due to it not being tuned for the flow if you change anything engine wise you'll need to tune it for the change then stock tune is made for the perimeters created from the standard parts so take the standard exhaust with create back pressure removing the resistance from the exhaust will reduce back pressure changing engine perimeters but interestingly there's been tests done with air flow throw exhausts and some engines need at least a resonator otherwise the exhaust gases become turbulent reducing the flow losing power
I really liked the brass with inserts, sounded like a race car! 😂 Another video experimenting with H X or resonators to dial in the sound would be very interesting.
Id love to do that:)
A super service would good next for now, love your e46 content👌🏻
Sounds like it revs higher with the brass which is always a plus
how could channel of this quality have this little subs, well atleast I did my part and subscribed :)
Thank you. Im grateful for the 4600 or so that i have. Just a half year ago it was 1000 so to me this is extreme. So thank you for being one of them💪
This is a great experiment. Thanks for doing it.
I wonder if the way the brass was fabricated had an influence on it. Like how ever people fabricate brass horns, would that make a difference vs welding.
Awesome video!
Thats a good question. I didnt mention it in the video, but the brass was done in angles, wheres the mild steel were mandrel bends. And faster.
i like the way brass changes the tone. now i want a brass exhaust on my non existent car.
Thanks for doing the inserts in the brass: my pick if not stock ;)
The resonances ("drone") in the steel system won't be replicated in the brass purely because of the diameter difference. You can see this in your warm idle dB measurement and your performance measurement: the larger diameter of the brass pipes gives lower gas velocity at low (/no) throttle openings by the time the exhaust pulses reach the tips, which translates to lower sound pressure level in the low audible frequencies and slightly poorer torque before the VANOS is fully advanced. If you did a top speed run or some time attack laps all above 5000rpm the brass would probably be faster. The lower gas velocity overall gives the pulses more time to smear out and exit in a less coherent "pop", and unlike the steel (or a 4" fully hektik JDM hero exhaust in steel AKA drone box), the brass doesn't naturally reinforce the low frequencies.
By my calculations at 2000rpm each of your twin pipes is delivering 2000/2/60*3=50 pulses of pferdestaerke per second. That's a bit too low frequency for most people to hear, but the second harmonic at 100Hz is right there in that annoying drone zone most people can. Hit your steel system with a spanner while using an audio spectrum analyser app on your phone and I'll bet you can get some peaks around 1-200Hz. Try it again with the brass and i bet the spikes are all higher up, and thus will move more on a running engine as the pipes find and lose natural resonances with the higher exhaust harmonics which change more as the ecu varies rpm and timing to hold idle setpoint/while driving => more "musical" exhaust tone. Even in your intro, the brass muffler delete is obviously brighter (despite it actually being both a longer and wider pipe: should be lower tone if same material).
For future experiments do like instrument manufacturers (or at least repairers) do: solder/braze the brass with a blowtorch and plumber's silver solder: less fumes, better seal, wouldn't last a sprint race perhaps but that's not relevant for your tests.
For reference the decibel formula is Power Ratio [dB] = 10*log10(PowerOUT/PowerREF) (in whatever power units are most convenient) so a sound that is +3dB vs some reference is twice as powerful (~"loud"). This means a 12dB difference is telling you one sound is 2^4=16 times as loud as the other. Brass pipes give a warm idle half as loud as mild steel. That's impressive.
I like your tool storage management
Its not only cheap and effective, its extremely modular. Need a new holder? Just a new screw
My suggestion it to progressively make the exhaust larger so it’s roughly shaped like a horn. Maybe weld sections of pipe together increasing the diameter.
I would think the rubber pipe hangers would also contribute by dampening the resonance of the materials used.
I ran an audio spectrum analyzer in a Chrome extension-
Brass- the second and third harmonic seem to be more pronounced in relation to the fundamental frequency, compared to steel . The higher frequencies are slightly attenuated compared to steel. This gives it a "warmer" midrange character, while eliminating some of the high frequency "rasp" present in the steel exhaust.
Brass w/ brass inserts- the fundamental frequency is notably attenuated, while upper harmonics are even more dominant than brass w/o inserts. The fundamental frequency changes slightly, most likely as a result of the exhaust constriction, lowering the fundamental by 5-10hz at idle.
That's just a rough hypothesis, though. Lengthening or shortening the tubing will change the resonant frequencies independent of exhaust pipe material. I'd assume that the "midbass" quality (more pronounced 2nd and 3rd harmonics in relation to attenuated high freq content and attenuated fundamental) is a result of the material. Therefore the brass piping is acting as a low Q bandpass filter, leaving the midbass-midrange region intact, while reducing the highest highs and lowest lows.
Thank you so much for doing this. Very interesting read. Im definitely not done experimenting with exhausts(headers, xpipe hpipe mufflers and resonators)
For the brass it looks like that your heat on the mig welder should be turned up by a couple notches
i wonder if it has anything to do with the volumetric differences of the straight pipes, vs having the large open area in the muffler adding volume to the system.
(as to why the stock system made better times)