Is the QS 165 a Worthy SurRon Upgrade? | Testing and Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ก.ค. 2024
- Hey everyone. In today's video we are going to be doing some more indepth testing on the QS motor. Everything is fairly anecdotal , but we do our best to present the way we test things so flaws can be found. Enjoy!
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Great video guys. I just finally got a battery and my controller from you installed. Couldn't be happier with it :)
I've been waiting for this video. Thank you.
Thanks for the info, great video guys, keep up the good work .
What would I do without my favorite youtube channel? Superb content as always
Nice... been waiting for this one!
Hi need help my qs motor goes back wards instead of foreword
Are you guys stocking bac4000 brackets soon ? I have one but no brackets??
Hey Boys, love your work👍
I'd be interested what amps you pull on a smaller sprocket obviously being lower KV lower gearing should make that QS at least in line with the stock motor👍
We've been running the KO RS for some time and it's a game changer over the standard motor for sure. I wouldn't recommend a 64Tooth sprocket, 60 is considered the max from our testing.
The MX motor you really need a 42 Tooth to get it to pull over 150Amps
The original MX
Thanks! Seen a couple videos of your and like em🤘🏽
Yeah I really wanted to try a smaller sprocket and see if I could get some more out of it. 64T is for sure way too much. I had no problems getting. It to pull 150A on a 64T so maybe dropping down quite a bit will do better with that low KV.
What kind of amperage are you pulling on the KO RS with a 60T? I’ve gotten a customer up to 300A on a BAC8000 but haven’t got ours yet. To test in house.
We had a similar 150 amps or so on the MX version of the KO.
@@emotobros 60Tooth on the RS I can pull 300Amps but I'm BMS limited so I've got it set at 275Amps. I'm not actually sure how much more I can pull over 300amps as I just hit cut off.
The sprocket size really matters on the KO motor where the Surron it has such a small effect.
@@progressive_e Gotcha. Definitely in line with what I've seen. Super interesting that the sprocket size matters so much for these others motors but not stock. Something I had realized but not put all the way together until reading your response.
The common cutting issue on the ASI setup and stock motor is also exacerbated by smaller sprockets so I assume there is some effect - be it marginal.
Seems like we are definitely approaching the point where most every BMS isn't rated for what these high power setups can pull. Not to mention all the wiring is typically 6GA at best 😅
@@emotobros 100% fast approaching BMS limitations. I think anything that's not 400amp plus in the future is probably not ideal.
Yeah mate the sprocket thing is interesting when you compare it to the Surron motor. My back ground is large AC motor tuning so I've got some know how around this, just usually not in a DC application. I guess something that's easily over looked is the saliency / reluctance effect on IPM design. You obviously get increased postive torque with the collapsing emf field in the direction you want it. Put a larger sprocket on that and you feel something that is not nice to ride, put a smaller sprocket on that can over come that effect mechanically and you get this nice smooth motor doing everything you want.
I would love to see your BAC8K tune on this motor. 👍
Keep up the good works boys🤙
@@progressive_e quick question, coming from my current XX controller/XX battery & stock 48T from Luna to a KO controller/KO RS motor combo & Chi72V Compact: should I just stay at 48T? I hear you saying the KO RS likes lower tooth sprockets, correct? Lastly, would you recommend upgrading to an aftermarket throttle of some kind. After practicing wheelies today, it seemed like the stock throttle was a bit unpredictable...especially after getting the bike to balance point, slight drop, and trying to throttle it back up...seemed to momentarily die for a sec. That might just be me being a noob wheelier, but was wondering. I love both yours and E Moto Bros channels!
@ e- Motos, can you guys review the K.O motor ? i really feel like this would be an actual upgrade to the stock motor on the Sur Ron as well as their controllers, they are coming out with a new nano version too!.
We are going to as mentioned in the video! Just waiting for one.
@@emotobros as for a ko swing arm for review while youre at it
Can I push at 20kw
Great video I've been debating on this set up. One thing I'd recommend trying/comparing and correct me if I'm wrong but of course do you have exact gearing set up ratio? If so my main concern as I instantly noticed the wheels.... If you want the BEST scientific approach to truly see I'd make sure both rim AND tire dimensions are the same as you mentioned his "mid pull" on the drag could come from a slightly higher top end due to a higher ratio roll out on wheels/tires alone 1/8 inch can easily Make that pull happen providing higher top speed. Rotational weight as well (weight lbs x 3 it adds up on rotational force of outter rim/tire weight)
Shoot chain ring and heavier chain can make small differences but when you have 3 or 4 things that are different it can certainly add up (check psi too so rolling resistance is equal as can be) one of you may be lighter toss a backpack on with weight 😂 hey who knows?!
But overall great video for half the price I'd say its a steal value wise you tighten up these things and I guarantee apples to apples would be very minor considering stock motor was MADE for that frame specifically. For someone who doesn't have the $ to drop on new bike it could be a great build for sure.
Fyi- if his wheels are slightly heavier and taller and if he weighs slightly more it could be why his amp draw is higher giving him that extra pull. Resistance ultimately will force more amps to be drawn allowing that power to pull away with ratio.
But anyways great job 1/2 price and that close of a comparison I think I made my choice thank you!
One last thing...
Tachometer to measure rpm on motor while on a stand then divide the count by voltage now you got yourself KV 😊
You can compensate for kV with smaller sprocket, it would be interesting to see the results
Tried this as well and although it was slightly better in the midrange, it was still worse than stock.
love surron geekism
The QS has 7 poles and the stock 6 poles does that change settings much?
Stock has 5 I believe. Regardless this doesn't change anything too much. Only changes how the controller sees the RPM of the controller which we've accounted for.
Qs came out with the v2 I think it would be cool to do a side by side comparison to see if they fixed any of the problems mentioned in the video
I had a V1 and came to the same conclusions as E-Moto Bros. I am testing V2 and it is completely different from V1. I managed to send it 240A line and go over 100 km/h. The torque is present over the entire curve. They really improved the engine and I'm very happy with it
@@yodi5257 Ah j'ai ma réponse lol, c'est largement assez rapide pour moi, merci Yodi
Any thoughts on the 2.0 leaks? Looks to be a larger chassis etc.
Shoot us an email with the leaks! Would love to check them out.
@@emotobros th-cam.com/video/zVEs_4IMfBI/w-d-xo.html
So there is a 10kw version of the qs 165 out recently. Think you guys would ever review it?
We definitely plan to! Got any videos where someone has done some high power testing on it? We could only manage 12kW or so through the V1.
@E-Moto Bros nothing yet but I'm looking!
@@emotobros the v2 much better motor I wouldn't be surprised if ko rebranded like they did their fardriver controllera
if the qs165 is more similar to the KO motor, would regearing allow you to pull more amps?
We did attempt this off camera and pulled more amperage (155A->192A @60V) but the torque output at the wheel was notably decreased unfortunately.
@@emotobros you think this motor would be better suited to mild street builds then?
Probably the best motor I’ve seen for the money. But yes, wouldn’t use it for any application where you need more than the stock SurRon motor can provide.
How about swapping a x160 motor- would it be worth a qs-motor swap
QS is definitely better than the x160 in our opinion.
What your light
Ebay Chinese motorcycle light
For the perfect e-bike for the best price woud be :
An improve motor than the one of sur-ron
With 72v 50 ah battery 20s 10p using LG M50LT.
With 140 amps controlor so 12 kw peak power.
Rockshox boxxer select fork
Rockshox vivid r2c Spring
Magura MT5ePro brake
17 inch wheels with Shinko sr241
48T sprocket
220 mm floating disc
60 MM rise handle bar
Fisher Fabhouse headlight
frame with x 1,25 bigger so you don't need seat extender for tall people.
And a price around 7 k.
If someone can pull out a e-bike like this would be amazing, and I think the price tag of 7 k would be possible with great volume !
I have qs165 v2 hall engine with nd96680 and 87v molicel p45b battery and it flying 😂😂👋
I run a 165 with a FarDriver ND72600 and i run 13.5 kw on a 60v battery with a 56t sprocket. The FarDriver allows me to set its max power and max rpm so its running that at 12k rpm. Its silly fast
What size sprocket you running? Also, is it the 165 encoder version or hall version?
@@emotobros 56t and its the v2 hall
Oh nice! Ours is the V1. Wonder what they changed.
@@emotobros hoping to get a v3 when they release em.
Got an ETA on that?
you're using ASI. you can easily see the KV rating in your settings
Detected kV vs. Design kV. Detected was like 3700ish. There can be some variance there.
@@emotobros the detected one by the controller is the correct one
Common guys, what do you mean "motor dont want to take more power"? Really? Tune settings on controller. You can push any ammout of current to the motor.. we push in our motor 32kw..
Our understanding is that’s not how it works on a torque based control scheme. Maybe if you run speed control you can force more current in. We worked closely with some guys at ASI on trying to get more through it and no one could figure it out
Are you pushing 32kW into a QS165 Hall Version? If so what controller?
@@emotobros On our RC quads we use a higher cell count with lower kV motors to get them in their performance window.. Assuming you are running 72v maybe if/when 84v or 96v batterys become a reality this motor will find a place to work in its optimal range. Iirc the K.O. controller can theoretically handle 100v.
Yeah I think at least 72V would be a must for this low of a KV. KO may be the better option for controlling this motor if that’s required. It’s tough because off road, we have no use for anything over like 45-50mph. But to get the mid range power with low kv and low voltage is tricky.
I’ve tried big 60v, 72v and hopefully try my mates 96v when he’s made it