Buy the best speakers you can afford. Speakers will sound better over the years. Plus when buying speakers look at them as items you will take with you when you move houses or go through life.
I think you have misunderstood his question. I'm pretty sure by big speakers vs small ones he meant big speakers with big transducers - high cone surface area vs small speakers with small transducers.
@@googoo-gjoob well going by the words in questionl, I'd have to say he miss-understood. I don't think a video is required to explain the same transducers sound the same regardless of cabinet/box size (with exception of tuning) because the surface area hasn't changed. The question Brice asked even included sub-woofers with shelf speakers in the same room vs big speakers.
I have flloor standing speakers in a small room. Both the amp and the speakers(NVA + JPW) have good controlled bass. The System sounds amazing. I always prefer floorstanding speakers,more solid than stands or shelfs.
Many acoustic snobs about lol ,Jus turn the bass down a bit an dont have em blaring. I love sitting nxt to Triangle Borea BR09 Floorstanding Speakers in my small room (my only room) an going through the weekly searches with fantastic quality sound. Jus get the volume an bass right with some green an a cuppa tea rrrr , buzzing like a kid at the age of 50, love these speakers
A total myth! So long as you have your speaker placement, room acoustics and EQ under control, larger drivers will generally deliver more "scale and presence". Once you've physically experienced it… you get it.
Small rooms have the same inherent problem regardless of speaker size, and that's room modes in the upper bass/midbass region due to their dimensions. Larger rooms tend to have primary resonances at quite low frequencies, so they tend to not be as much of an issue.
This is why you can often have more luck with a pair of bookshelves and a subwoofer in a small room. You can position the sub anywhere you want to avoid shitty resonances as much as possible and you are physically taking up less space.
@@drongojonkins8945 "Bookshelves" are usually standmount and take the same space as floorstanders. Maybe the best way is to combine them with sub dedicated that you can place correctly...
@@ity1311 They take the same amount of room, but not the same volume of space. Stands are usually very open compared to a box. The stands won't reflect sound like a cabinet would.
The main issue I've found with large speakers in a small(ish) room is being able to sit far enough away for the drivers' outputs to integrate at the listening position. Two smaller stand mount 2-way speakers and a subwoofer (or 2) will have fewer problems in this area since the stand mounts carry so much of the musical info. Of lesser issue is bass nodes that get pretty wonky and annoying in smaller rooms, but which can be reduced with bass trapping.
I had Klipsch La Scalas in a small bedroom with some acoustic panels and bass traps and they sounded amazing, and reached comfortable listening levels so effortlessly. There is no problem with the size of speakers and the size of the room. I get tired of people telling me that too. I actually hate 2ch listening in my large high ceiling open living room as does my friend. We both prefer the large living rooms for movies only. Subs do help, but you end up with more of a party music feel when you crank it and no one is paying attention. I'm not willing to go all out on ugly room treatments in the large living room either and multichannel stereo isn't for me. That's the only difference with small room vs big room. You can go much louder in a big room vs the small room, but you HAVE TO go much louder with more power in the big room and a small room doesn't need to.
Thank you. Ive always loved sitting next to my speakers in a small room an going through my end of week music searches. (been saving for Triangle Borea BR09's,)(for my small room hehe)
@@stoinge It's a more intimate experience. I had the big Klipschorns after the La Scalas, long wall, sitting against the back wall(another no-no) with 4" thick absorption all around behind me. Rugs everywhere. Loved it. Incredible pin point center image but with some flaws of course. Ideal rooms are hard enough to come by, but privacy to fully engage is even harder. Living rooms are still just party rooms imo and you never really connect.
I feel like the main issue is cancellation. Tiny rooms dont have much space for the sound to get out and bounce around before it starts to cancel out. I struggled with this issue for awhile where i had 2 very powerful 15s in a small 12x8 room. No matter what position i put the speakers in i always had an issue of no bass in the center unless i laid them firing upwards in the center of the room. I even tried some different boxes with the same outcome. No bass unless the speaker is sitting in the center of the room firing upwards. It wasnt until i got a small 8 inch home theater subwoofer that completely filled the room no matter what position i had it in. The 2 15s sound great in my garage though. No dead spots or nothing.
You're on the right track. I've got a small listening room with largish dual 8 inch 3 way speakers. I only get good bass in the one spot I can sit down and listen. If I move to one side, the bass losses it's impact and sounds almost gone.
@@grizzly6699 I have a pair of 3-way ADS L810's on this desktop. Dual-8" woofs and a powered sub in a bedroom. Just like the commenter being replied to, the sub has a very hard time reproducing the lower bass freq. due to the small room. However, I was able to double the gain via the preamp and that was sufficient for my seating area. The 8" drivers in the L810's complement the sub quite well, though again, the bass is weak everywhere else in the room. Since this is a near-field system I'm not concerned with overall sound, so it works well for me.
AS PART OF MY 5.1 4KUHD SET UP I WENT FROM AN 100WHATT 8 INCH DOWN FIRER TO A 240 WHAT FRONT FIRER SUBB,AND BOY THE BASS IS JUST PHENOMENAL.THE VOLUME ON THE SUBBS AT HALF WAY.MY SUBBS A MONITOR AUDIO BRONZE SUBBWOOFER BUEATIFULL BASS,AND YES IM THINKING OF GETTING ANOTHER ONE.😉✌👌👌
I think the main reason given has been a question is because speakers get rated on their optimum loudness. Bigger speakers usually have higher optimums as in the case with say Kali LP6 vs LP8. Therefore in certain cases, a smaller speaker may be better if you have a tiny room.
Thank you Paul. That was the most refreshingly clear and easy to understand explanation I have heard. I know there are many determining factors in choosing speakers for a particular room, but we need some basis to start. It would be great to get guidance on driver size for room volume/area.
Reverse role-playing , Assume the box as a room & the room as box. I changed my speaker box volume by thrice & results were great - I could hear subtle sounds in recordings & good bass extension
2 RF7 III in a 3m x 3.5m room ( 9ft x 10 ft ) with acoustics panels ( first reflection points ) and the sound is awesome !!! really good. the only problem is that the speakers are close to the front wall, I would have preferred to move them further away
I have a couple of thoughts to add based on recent experience integrating large tower loudspeakers and, subsequently, stand-mounted bookshelf speakers in a relatively small room (15.5 ft x 10.1 ft). The towers are Legacy Audio FOCUS SE, which is a complex six-driver 4-way with two 12 in. woofers per cabinet. The primary challenge with integration was that the positions for speakers and listening chair that minimized room modes required the distance between ears and speaker to be rather short...like 6-7 ft. The manufacturer suggests that ~12 ft is optimal for best driver integration/blend. The other problem is visual--your field of view is filled by these huge towers standing before you. What we see does affect how our brains process what we hear, and the imposing towers tended to make listening sessions less relaxed being so close. The same position worked much better for the stand-mounted bookshelf speakers (SVS Ultra Bookshelf). No issues with driver blend or negative visual impact. Adding a pair of subs (SVS SB-2000) enabled me to put them in the best location for bass while keeping the bookshelf speakers in the best location for tone and soundstage. Both speaker systems sound delightful in this room, but the bookshelf + subs system makes a lot more sense visually and offered more flexible set up options.
Excellent response. May I add this? In my 25 yrs of experience or more, recording music, studio playback sessions, and home theater systems as well.... it's been my finding that, surround speakers especially, need distance in order to reproduce the sounds in a realistic fashion. Stereo pair up front may also require such acomadation. That being said, many Home Theater owners go overboard when buying surround speakers. How so? In film sound the side surrounds (5.1 setups) & rears (7.1 setups) only receive data in the form of ambiance. Rarely, the engineers put actual prominent, in your face, sound effects, in the surround or fill channels. This means: A small speaker, with a 3" woofer and a 1/2 inch tweeter will do the job accurately. In fact. most commercial Cinemas use surround speakers by JBL for example, that utilize only one 8' woofer and a 1 inch,horn driven tweeter, to deliver surround effects to the listener. Now, of course there are many of those 2 way speakers arrayed by Dolby Labs specs along the side and rear walls to ensure proper coverage, aka immersion. As I said earlier, there are many Home Theater owners who go way beyond what commercial "Theaters" use and they buy bulky, bookshelf speakers or full fledged, tower speakers, with 6.5" woofers and a 3" midrange cone plus a 1" compression horn driven tweeter. This is "overkill" and a waste of money! Klipsch for example sells a 2 way, horn driven. satellite speaker, meant for the dedicated, surround channel use and it will do the same job of reproducing the spacial, surround sound effects as the big, bulky, 3 way speaker, I mentioned before. In closing: Speaker size in a room does matter. In the surround channels especially. Just make sure you push a "hot" amount of signal to watts ratio, to the surround speakers and calibrate calibrate calibrate! By the way? I practice what I preach. I've a full range, large, speaker array for my 3 front L-C-R channels, while employing 4, small, full range satellite speakers for the sides and rear of the room in my 7.1 sound system. All driven by a 105 wpc, Yamaha, 7.1 AV Receiver. Thanks to trial & error, I've learned these valuable lessons and share them with folks when I can so they won't be repeating my expensive mistakes. ~ peace
And then there were THX specifications requiring all speakers and all channels of amplification to be matched. I never really wrapped my head around that from a practicality standpoint unless you're ok with little boxes all over and a sub that reaches into the upper bass. I never liked that. The compromise for me was a full set of old Celestian 3's which do great bass for their size in my experience when properly implemented and a modest sub.
I think the question means big speakers with bigger drivers, same drivers different box sizes doesn't make sense. I've auditioned the Edifier A100 vs A300 at the store in the same controlled room with the same decibel measurements.. The A300 with bigger driver sounds bigger than the smaller A100, infact if you listen to them side by side, A100 sounds honky. I'm not talking loudness here, they are set the same loudness levels and the A300 sounds wider and more airy. As per store owner, nobody picks up an A100 if they don't mind the box size and base only on the sound quality.
Having big boxes compared to smal ones might mean you will have to move the speakers closer to the front or side walls because of space limitations. So now there is wall instead of empty space around the speaker. I can imagine this effects soundstage and imaging as well. Or am I wrong?
That was very interesting, Paul. Thank you! One small thing to consider is that small bookshelf speakers are often a little bit easier to place "correctly" than big fat towers... which often end up in the corners, and that's not so good. By the way, why are you working on a Sunday? :)
you can have speakers with big drivers/transducers in a small room.... but you need to take very special care to get the sound right.(treatment , furniture ,placement , ect ect..)
Biggest problem is in a small room you are sat close to the speakers and you need distance for the drivers to blend. A two driver speaker is easier than a four. The only large speaker speakers that work close up use a driver design like Tannoy or KEF
Big speakers you can here everything better gaves out wider sound some you didn't here before sounds more clear if go for big speakers that's why also headphones beat earbuds you also here stereo affect more better with big speakers
I have an adjacent question? there's speak of speaker Db Sweet spot. thus having a speaker of the "right" size for the room is advised. i want a pair of kef r300's but people say they produce enough room to fill a large room, for instance, my room is 13x9 feet & is fairly sound neutral luckily. which means id have to run them at significantly lower Db for near field listening in a small room and perhaps that would alter there sound. and maby it would be better to pair smaller speakers with a smaller room than turning biger ones down but i dont realy understand this sweet spot thing.
Isn't there a limitation to how much bass a small room can support based on the length of the wavelength of low bass? I realize Bryce was talking about equivalent speakers. I have a pair of Legacy Audio Focus SE speakers in a somewhat small room and they do deliver good bass. They are physically imposing, but seem to work. Is the space you video in your office? What do you use the reel to reel for? It seems tight in there. I love your videos, your goal of educating people, and your company's philosophy.
Haha, exactly what I'm doing. Two pairs of JBL 4320 two way speakers stacked up at each side, in a living room measuring 12 by 24 feet. It won't matter if my room only has 12 ft of depth along the long side.
I often hear about bigger speakers needing more room to breathe, I can see that being an issue if you put big towers in a small bedroom and expect them to sound as good as in a living room that has 2-3x the cubic volume. Will your Infinity set sound as good in a room with half as much volume? I doubt it.
Turn the bass down a bit an dont have em blaring. I love sitting nxt to Triangle Borea BR09 Floorstanding Speakers in my small room (my only room) an going through the weekly searches with fantastic quality sound. Jus get the volume an bass right with some green an a cuppa tea rrrr , buzzing like a kid at the age of 50, love these speakers
As a bass player and audiophile, I would say that a lot depends upon how close you will be sitting from the speakers. Also important is balance from top to bottom. Most recorded bass doesn't go much below 40Hz --if you want to hear the lower octaves of a pipe organ then you need not only speakers that go that low but a seating position far enough away to hear the waves. Balance is important. Back in the 70's there was a trend toward "boom and sizzle" speakers. These regardless of size emphasized tizzy highs and prodigious bass with really poor or reticent mid range. They sounded impressive for maybe a half hour of listening but soon became tiring. They produced a "lot of bass" but really didn't go below 40 or higher Hz's. They were in essence creating the illusion of a lot of bass. As a professional bass player reflex cabinets were popular. Example-the Acoustic 360. This monster had a massive 18" downward firing speaker in a folded cabinet. (these were used in Led Zeppelin by John Paul Jones). If you stood three feet in front of them you heard very little bass. However walk out into the audience some thirty feet away you heard a prodigious amount of bass. What's this have to do with speaker size? I firmly believe it is quality of sound and tonal balance that are important. Then how far away from the speaker you will sit and how loud you will play the speaker. Some large box speakers sound very nice at lower volumes and others need to be played at a minimal level. Then there's the amplification...another story.
this is because the lower the frequency, the lower the longer the wavelenght is. Example 20 Hz => 17 m. I don't know if i said it correctly in english as i'm not native english speaker. The board of the wavelenght can be found there www.studionyima.com/downloads/tables/TABLE_%20Frequency-Wavelength.pdf
The room is really an extension of the speaker. Big speakers are fine in smaller rooms, say 15'X12'X10' (my living room, for example) as long as you don't try and play them too loud. Just keep the output reasonable and if ya gotta listen to loud music, try a good pair of headphones. I like my Koss Pro4X phones.
It seems that my speakers sound the best at a relatively loud listening volume. When playing at a low volume it seems that I loose detail. Is this due to the design of the speaker or is there too many variables to determine the issue? I may be shopping for new speakers and I don't know if the issue will improve or get worse.
I'd wager your speakers have low sensitivity. The lower their sensitivity > the less efficient they are > the more power you have to supply to them to get a decent volume out of them. When shopping for new speakers, look for 90+ db sensitivity. This is strictly regarding the volume.. not sound quality. A badly designed speaker won't sound good just because it has high sensitivity and vica versa.
I’ve been a headphone user and recently thought of getting a pair of speakers. I have study room with my work desk on one end and 2 rows of bookshelves. The room measurement is 4.25 meter(Length) by 3.15 (Width) x 2.48 (ceiling height) or 13’11” x 10’4” x 8’1”. After deducting the rows of bookshelves, the open space I have is 3.65 x 2.15 x 2.48 meters or 11’11” x 8’2” x 8’1”. I am thinking of something like the Polk R700 floor standing speakers😂. Please advise if this will work or I am better off getting “bookshelves speakers” like the Polk R200 and perhaps with a sub?
I built a pair of fairly good size box speakers (years ago) with 2 12" poly woofers in each enclosure & was disappointed with the bass response. I was using a Kenwood 125 wpc RMS amplifier just for those. (Mid 80's). The deep bass response I was hoping for never developed in the room they were in. When I left it running, I realized that when I left the room, I could hear & feel what I was hoping for 2 rooms away. What was going on with that? I'm at a loss!
If the room is too small, the bass frequencies do not have place to bounce around but instead get cancelled out almost instantaneously, leaving a dip in lower frequency region Positioning a subwoofer in a small room is critical. More so than in a big room
A minor point but I think you should also like the aesthetics of your speakers as they make such a statement in a room..Primary concern is the sound of course, but if you have incredibly ugly speakers they will always be an eyesore and will 'fit in' to any room...Personally i couldnt like with a set of Wilson Watt Puppy's..In fact, anything Wilson make...
what about sound clarity big speaker vs little?. 2 also do you miss any sounds besides bass, big speaker vs little speaker? like a 12 inch full range vs a 3-1/2 inch. 3 also which is louder?
First you said that the box size doesn't make any difference 4:02 and then you said a small box yields less bass 4:18. And with your small box example you said "amplified" and said with the same "amplified" input with you big box example. Obviously you mean the amplified bit (I suppose bass) would apply to the small box but not with the big box (but you didn't say that). What I would imagine you are trying to say is that it's only with small boxes (amplified)...since you said the reason for the boost is the lack of bass in a small box.
Every audiophile should have a calibration microphone. This is an invaluable tool. Measure your speakers in your room at your listening position. At worst a big speaker in a small room might produce boomy bass. If it does, take a measurement to verify this fact. Then apply DSP to correct this boominess. Not that hard if you use the right tools for the job. Simply using your ears and speaker placement will not suffice if you want truly great levels of performance, unless your room and speaker placement is perfect which in most cases is not.
yeah, but that doesn't tackle the even more important problem of frequency dependent reverbration time. if you want clean bass, you need to treat the room. then maybe throw in a bit of eq for your listening position.
Problem is that microphone often time measure different each time even at relatively the same position. Better way is to play sine wave and sweep manually from low to mid frequency and eq manually. High frequency is not going to be very difference with simple acoustic treatment.
That's absolutely not true that big speakers don't sound well in small rooms. Now a huge 3 way or 4 way, sure depending on the listening distance could be an issue. But a large two way there's should be absolutely no issue. I could see a giant 3 way horn speaker causing issues at short distances or perfectly square small rooms. But honestly you'd be surprised how small a room you can do with a giant 2 way
It's more a case a large floorstander needs to be brought out from the wall more than a small bookshelf speaker. Well at least the rear ported floorstanders need more space from the front wall to perform well. I've got identical sealed on wall speakers for my centre channel and surrounds in a 5.1 setup. Front left & right are bookshelfs. The on wall speakers each have 4 mid/bass ballistic grade Kevlar extra long throw woofers and two silk dome tweeters. Very powerful for on wall speakers. They sound awesome in my small room with my hybrid 2.1/5.1 system for music and movies 🎶🎬 I have a separate power stereo amplifier for the front left & right right speakers, a separate amplifier for the centre channel speaker. And a separate amplifier for the two surround speakers. So can control the volume separately for the front left & right, centre, surrounds.
I've often wondered why a speaker designer doesn't couple a nice bookshelf speaker on top of a big powered subwoofer. (Think of a favorite powered subwoofer, then bolt some bookshelf speakers to the top.) The only reason I can assume is that subwoofer position is frequently different than speaker position (hence the "sub crawl") but even then with dual subwoofers the need for a "sub crawl" seems to be much less. Otherwise this would allow a "small" bookshelf speaker to fit nicely into a small room but still give huge sound.
A tip when you place the speakers they need a proper distance to walls and corners and a proper separation between. In my room big speaker with a 2 mts between... the speaker is just at 1cm to the wall and the corners = a massive bass and no clarity. I tried only 2 different speakers pair. I have now a bookshelf with a nice balanced sound
The physical size of the speaker is not the issue unless they are just stupidly huge,,, the issue is energy imparted to the space. Some people spout fear over driving the room in to compression. This "feature" can be a plus or minus to the sound. It is about the matching of the imparted energy, the cubic volume, the reflective abilities of the room,,, it is a cake bake. It takes the right ingredients (components). My theater system is arguably "over sized" for the space, but the mix and match of the total combination in wonderful.
Speakers have optimal excursion dynamics.. if the speaker driver is huge, it won't get enough energy in a small room to be loud enough to perform at the optimal loudness it wants. Forget the box size.
Except, the larger box will likely be heavier, and the mass of the box will effect the sound. And if it’s not heavier, then it’s made of thinner flimsier material, which seems like another problem.
█ █ Actually, a large piece of furniture, whether it's a speaker enclosure or not, will most likely improve the sound. I'll leave it to you to figure out why that's true. No need to thank me. █ █
It depends on the type of furniture you bring into the room. A big glass table will will degrade the sound 👍🏾 Whereas a fabric sofa on the side wall would help with some of the reflections 👌🏾
I didn't understand exactly what Paul tried to explain. Is big speakers in a small room does provide bad sound ? Yes ? Why ? No why ? There are so many things to consider to give a good answer to that question. For me, the question remains. Yes or no and why ?
Paul kept on about enclosure size.... this is only true in part. What DOES matter is the bass driver size..!! In a 10' by 10' room ( OMG !!) an 18" driver would sound terrible compared with a smaller driver like an 8" driver...
I had a major issue when I upgraded from a pair of standmounts to a pair of floorstanding speakers, as the WAF specification for the latter was very poor (WAF being "Wife Acceptance Factor"). So, with us being "empty nesters", moved my system down to the family room and created a "man cave", where a low "WAF" was not a problem.
I have the no doubt very wrong theory that big speakers are not really made for playing all the time at very low volume. At that level they (I guess) miss presence and the bass is too relaxed then So people with thin walls and grumpy neighbors do perhaps better with a system with less power and smaller speakers and then it will have presence at the level required to not disturb the neighbors. But my theory is perhaps only true if that small system is indeed tweaked for that purpose and not made flat.
can someone help me out? i got a 12x11 room dedicated for stereo listening and cannot decide between the Canton 9k (bookshelfs) and the Canton 5k (full size) the price does not matter but i just wanna know if ill "overload" the room with the big one
Is there any chance miniature speakers like the Elac BS-312 can sound as good as normal sized bookshelf speakers? I like small speakers that I can take everywhere with me, but without compromise in sound quality.
Short answer is no 👍🏾 Miniature speakers and small portable Bluetooth speakers don't sound anywhere as good as normal sized bookshelf speakers. It's simple physics 👌🏾
good info Mr. Paul! Wish i could show you my peasant setup involving (2) 18" PA subs and 8 sony speakers all in 2 channel glory! I got really big speakers in a really small room! Its an absolute riot =D
well, speaker placement is the free option. Anything after that and you're gonna have to spend some money. If your budget isnt that large (like mine) go with 2 of whatever you can afford. 2 cheap subs will almost always out gun a single expensive sub.
Get a microhpone and get some DSP. That is the best and cheapest way to improve bass. MiniDSP 2x4 or 2x4HD are your best bets with a UMIK-1 mic. DIY subs give you amazing performance for a relatively cheap price. I have an 18" Dayton Ultimax sealed. You can build two of them for $1300 total which performs with subs costing $1500-2000 each. Or build a single 15" for less than $500. Or buy a Rythmik, HSU or SVS sub. You can go lower than $500 but you will be missing depth and accuracy. Any sub is still better than no sub. Setting it up is the most important part which is where the mic and DSP will help you greatly.
To me, it is a lot like amplifier power -- it is better to have more than is need than less. Less will always distort and will clip the speaker; thereby, damaging the speaker. It is always good to have some reserve to draw from when you need it. If the speaker is large, sure, it can be overpowering, just like too little of a speaker in a very large room can be inadequate, but with too much, you can through control, adjust the speaker to match the room's acoustic properties and get a very full and balanced sound, while the speakers have little trouble in producing your requirements instead of overstressing to try and get there. Of course, you can overkill and not getting your dollar value, but the principle being, if there is truly “common sense” based upon good foundational truth -- you can make better choices and not be taken in by charlatans trying to take advantage of you and your wallet or leading you down the wrong choice.
I found a picture of the aDs L810s, sitting on their original stands and I had to have a pair. Got a pair the next month ( sans stands; darned things are like hen's teeth; seems no one bothered with them at purchase. ) I put them up on my desktop to test a theory and they sounded incredible, though it proved that larger bookshelf speakers need to be isolated from the desktop. Anyway, a year later I got incredibly lucky and a pair of immaculate aDs 910s fell into my lap and they're playing in this small bedroom, and they sound even better than the l810s. Hard-hitting bass and sublime mids/tweets. ( 130lbs on their stands/each. ) I'd move them into a larger room but I don't see the need right now.
I can tell you this your infinity system is way too big for that small room you have them inArnie built his speakers to play at very high levels very cleanly,and those speakers are being stifled in that room of yours,I have a 50 by 42 foot room with 12 foot ceilings and I could see them sounding a hole lot better in my room than yours
I have my Cerwin Vega DX 9's hook up two a KENWOOD 130 watt amp also I have two definitive technology towers, Advent towers, Polk towers nd two Cerwin Vega 12 inch sube run by my Onkyo 7.2 channel receiver. sounds astonishing.
big speakers all have a dull ass sound. Teeny tiny speakers have a toy piano sound, but all bookshelfs are perfect. It is a mistake to buy a big speaker. bookshelfs have plenty of bass. But you need a bassy bookshelf. You dont need a lot of real deep bass because instruments dont have deep bass. The lower part of the piano, the keys way on the left side have too deep a bass that is seldom used. The left keys on a piano are distorted. You dont need a sub, but if you have one, buy a cheap one, because a sub is not clear in sound.
I am sorry you feel this way, but I couldn't disagree more. I'd invite you to someday hear a big set of speakers here that aren't dull. Also, your assessment of deep bass is interesting but far from accurate.
@@Paulmcgowanpsaudio You dont have to answer back,but I hope you mention about some of the below topics on your videos. I cant argue with you, you must be correct in audio advice. It is good that you take your hard time to talk about audio. I believe that you will improve interest in audio & your business tremendously. It is hard to understand why more people are not involved in stereo. You love your job, that is great. I love your products. Some big speakers have a sealed off chamber from the rest of the speakers, some speakers have separate ports for each woofer. I like this idea. And the idea of 2 and a half way speakers. I like the idea of first order crossovers of how great they sound, but I dont understand crossovers completely. I have a pair of B & W speakers, this brand is over rated. I like subs that do not lose much volume at low frequencies. I have a Nakamichi stasis amp that has a circuit designed by Nelson pass, I wish I understood more of this circuit. he designed this circuit in a threshold amp, too. The beryllium tweeters and woofers have me interested. I wonder if hybrid pre amps or hybrid amps have advantages.
You dont have to answer back, but could talk about this on future videos. Thanks. Most people think that speakers have to be in a big room, so to keep music distorting vibrations to hit your ears. Speakers needing to be 4 foot from a wall, in a rectangle room. This is wrong. Rectangle rooms are not needed. Speakers can be 66 inches apart. 2 to 3 feet off the ground for bookshelfs. Bookshelfs can be placed the width of you fist from a brick wall. Speakers can be close to a brick wall because the brick are deffractors. You can buy deffractors. Google deffractors. Speakers close to a brick wall has more bass, making subwoofers uneccessary. A sub will sound muddy in this situation. The bass will be clearer than a subwoofer. The hard brick will give bigger dynamics and bass. material on walls is no goo
Bigger speakers sound better at lower volume. Most small speakers have a bad frequency response at lower volumes and have to be played quite loud to sound good, which is not always convenient.
The only problem is the more efficient a speaker is you lose some low end bass frequency. You would have to buy massive 6ft+ speakers with duel 12 inch drivers or more, with 3inch voice coils to get both high efficiency (over 97db) and deep low frequency 20hz. Most people don't have the space for that in their living room. Or even in their music, home theatre room. You would need a gigantic room and lot's of money for that 👍🏾
One advantage in having large speakers in small rooms is better sound at low volumes when they're adjusted correctly of course.
Bingo
Enough headroom.
What would it be to "adjust them correctly" for that purpose?
@@Zeitstill_music curious about that too
@@Zeitstill_music Placement. Look up new record day L.O.T.S
Buy the best speakers you can afford. Speakers will sound better over the years. Plus when buying speakers look at them as items you will take with you when you move houses or go through life.
I think you have misunderstood his question. I'm pretty sure by big speakers vs small ones he meant big speakers with big transducers - high cone surface area vs small speakers with small transducers.
i thought he understood exactly & answered the question as asked.....
@@googoo-gjoob well going by the words in questionl, I'd have to say he miss-understood. I don't think a video is required to explain the same transducers sound the same regardless of cabinet/box size (with exception of tuning) because the surface area hasn't changed.
The question Brice asked even included sub-woofers with shelf speakers in the same room vs big speakers.
No , his answer was irrelevant ... The question was a small Vs a large speaker ...ie standmount or floorstander
Exactly
no no no , it was can a floor speaker speak when spoken to after a floor grain oakwood finish in 3rd place at the olympics, Carl Lewis.
I have flloor standing speakers in a small room. Both the amp and the speakers(NVA + JPW) have good controlled bass. The System sounds amazing. I always prefer floorstanding speakers,more solid than stands or shelfs.
Many acoustic snobs about lol ,Jus turn the bass down a bit an dont have em blaring. I love sitting nxt to Triangle Borea BR09 Floorstanding Speakers in my small room (my only room) an going through the weekly searches with fantastic quality sound. Jus get the volume an bass right with some green an a cuppa tea rrrr , buzzing like a kid at the age of 50, love these speakers
A total myth! So long as you have your speaker placement, room acoustics and EQ under control, larger drivers will generally deliver more "scale and presence". Once you've physically experienced it… you get it.
Correct, but always you need small drivers as well with large drivers for better highs
Yes thank you,I love sitting nxt to Triangle Borea BR09 Floorstanding Speakers in my small room (my only room) going through the weekly searches
@@stoingemay I know the place of your room please?
Small rooms have the same inherent problem regardless of speaker size, and that's room modes in the upper bass/midbass region due to their dimensions. Larger rooms tend to have primary resonances at quite low frequencies, so they tend to not be as much of an issue.
This is why you can often have more luck with a pair of bookshelves and a subwoofer in a small room. You can position the sub anywhere you want to avoid shitty resonances as much as possible and you are physically taking up less space.
@@drongojonkins8945
"Bookshelves" are usually standmount and take the same space as floorstanders.
Maybe the best way is to combine them with sub dedicated that you can place correctly...
@@ity1311 They take the same amount of room, but not the same volume of space. Stands are usually very open compared to a box. The stands won't reflect sound like a cabinet would.
The main issue I've found with large speakers in a small(ish) room is being able to sit far enough away for the drivers' outputs to integrate at the listening position. Two smaller stand mount 2-way speakers and a subwoofer (or 2) will have fewer problems in this area since the stand mounts carry so much of the musical info. Of lesser issue is bass nodes that get pretty wonky and annoying in smaller rooms, but which can be reduced with bass trapping.
I had Klipsch La Scalas in a small bedroom with some acoustic panels and bass traps and they sounded amazing, and reached comfortable listening levels so effortlessly. There is no problem with the size of speakers and the size of the room. I get tired of people telling me that too. I actually hate 2ch listening in my large high ceiling open living room as does my friend. We both prefer the large living rooms for movies only. Subs do help, but you end up with more of a party music feel when you crank it and no one is paying attention. I'm not willing to go all out on ugly room treatments in the large living room either and multichannel stereo isn't for me.
That's the only difference with small room vs big room. You can go much louder in a big room vs the small room, but you HAVE TO go much louder with more power in the big room and a small room doesn't need to.
Thank you. Ive always loved sitting next to my speakers in a small room an going through my end of week music searches. (been saving for Triangle Borea BR09's,)(for my small room hehe)
@@stoinge It's a more intimate experience. I had the big Klipschorns after the La Scalas, long wall, sitting against the back wall(another no-no) with 4" thick absorption all around behind me. Rugs everywhere. Loved it. Incredible pin point center image but with some flaws of course. Ideal rooms are hard enough to come by, but privacy to fully engage is even harder. Living rooms are still just party rooms imo and you never really connect.
I feel like the main issue is cancellation. Tiny rooms dont have much space for the sound to get out and bounce around before it starts to cancel out. I struggled with this issue for awhile where i had 2 very powerful 15s in a small 12x8 room. No matter what position i put the speakers in i always had an issue of no bass in the center unless i laid them firing upwards in the center of the room. I even tried some different boxes with the same outcome. No bass unless the speaker is sitting in the center of the room firing upwards.
It wasnt until i got a small 8 inch home theater subwoofer that completely filled the room no matter what position i had it in.
The 2 15s sound great in my garage though. No dead spots or nothing.
You're on the right track. I've got a small listening room with largish dual 8 inch 3 way speakers. I only get good bass in the one spot I can sit down and listen. If I move to one side, the bass losses it's impact and sounds almost gone.
@@grizzly6699 I have a pair of 3-way ADS L810's on this desktop. Dual-8" woofs and a powered sub in a bedroom. Just like the commenter being replied to, the sub has a very hard time reproducing the lower bass freq. due to the small room. However, I was able to double the gain via the preamp and that was sufficient for my seating area. The 8" drivers in the L810's complement the sub quite well, though again, the bass is weak everywhere else in the room. Since this is a near-field system I'm not concerned with overall sound, so it works well for me.
AS PART OF MY 5.1 4KUHD SET UP I WENT FROM AN 100WHATT 8 INCH DOWN FIRER TO A 240 WHAT FRONT FIRER SUBB,AND BOY THE BASS IS JUST PHENOMENAL.THE VOLUME ON THE SUBBS AT HALF WAY.MY SUBBS A MONITOR AUDIO BRONZE SUBBWOOFER BUEATIFULL BASS,AND YES IM THINKING OF GETTING ANOTHER ONE.😉✌👌👌
I think the main reason given has been a question is because speakers get rated on their optimum loudness.
Bigger speakers usually have higher optimums as in the case with say Kali LP6 vs LP8. Therefore in certain cases, a smaller speaker may be better if you have a tiny room.
Thank you Paul. That was the most refreshingly clear and easy to understand explanation I have heard. I know there are many determining factors in choosing speakers for a particular room, but we need some basis to start. It would be great to get guidance on driver size for room volume/area.
Reverse role-playing , Assume the box as a room & the room as box. I changed my speaker box volume by thrice & results were great - I could hear subtle sounds in recordings & good bass extension
2 RF7 III in a 3m x 3.5m room ( 9ft x 10 ft ) with acoustics panels ( first reflection points ) and the sound is awesome !!! really good. the only problem is that the speakers are close to the front wall, I would have preferred to move them further away
I have a couple of thoughts to add based on recent experience integrating large tower loudspeakers and, subsequently, stand-mounted bookshelf speakers in a relatively small room (15.5 ft x 10.1 ft). The towers are Legacy Audio FOCUS SE, which is a complex six-driver 4-way with two 12 in. woofers per cabinet. The primary challenge with integration was that the positions for speakers and listening chair that minimized room modes required the distance between ears and speaker to be rather short...like 6-7 ft. The manufacturer suggests that ~12 ft is optimal for best driver integration/blend. The other problem is visual--your field of view is filled by these huge towers standing before you. What we see does affect how our brains process what we hear, and the imposing towers tended to make listening sessions less relaxed being so close.
The same position worked much better for the stand-mounted bookshelf speakers (SVS Ultra Bookshelf). No issues with driver blend or negative visual impact. Adding a pair of subs (SVS SB-2000) enabled me to put them in the best location for bass while keeping the bookshelf speakers in the best location for tone and soundstage. Both speaker systems sound delightful in this room, but the bookshelf + subs system makes a lot more sense visually and offered more flexible set up options.
So what became of your Legacy Focus speakers?
I like this one. I've even heard this from acoustitions. Maybe the myth or assumption is big speakers play louder and hence override the room.
Excellent response.
May I add this?
In my 25 yrs of experience or more, recording music, studio playback sessions,
and home theater systems as well....
it's been my finding that, surround speakers especially, need distance in order
to reproduce the sounds in a realistic fashion.
Stereo pair up front may also require such acomadation.
That being said, many Home Theater owners go overboard
when buying surround speakers.
How so?
In film sound the side surrounds (5.1 setups) & rears (7.1 setups)
only receive data in the form of ambiance.
Rarely, the engineers put actual prominent, in your face, sound effects,
in the surround or fill channels.
This means:
A small speaker, with a 3" woofer and a 1/2 inch tweeter will do the job accurately.
In fact. most commercial Cinemas use surround speakers by JBL for example,
that utilize only one 8' woofer and a 1 inch,horn driven tweeter,
to deliver surround effects to the listener.
Now, of course there are many of those 2 way speakers arrayed by Dolby Labs specs
along the side and rear walls to ensure proper coverage, aka immersion.
As I said earlier, there are many Home Theater owners who go way beyond
what commercial "Theaters" use and they buy bulky, bookshelf speakers or full fledged,
tower speakers, with 6.5" woofers
and a 3" midrange cone plus a 1" compression horn driven tweeter.
This is "overkill" and a waste of money!
Klipsch for example sells a 2 way, horn driven. satellite speaker, meant for
the dedicated, surround channel use and it will do the same job of reproducing
the spacial, surround sound effects as the big, bulky, 3 way speaker, I mentioned before.
In closing:
Speaker size in a room does matter.
In the surround channels especially.
Just make sure you push a "hot" amount of signal to watts ratio,
to the surround speakers
and
calibrate calibrate calibrate!
By the way?
I practice what I preach.
I've a full range, large, speaker array for my 3 front L-C-R channels,
while employing 4, small, full range satellite speakers for the sides
and rear of the room in my 7.1 sound system.
All driven by a 105 wpc, Yamaha, 7.1 AV Receiver.
Thanks to trial & error, I've learned these valuable lessons and share them with
folks when I can so they won't be repeating my expensive mistakes.
~ peace
8 inch woofer for 3x4 is too big?
And then there were THX specifications requiring all speakers and all channels of amplification to be matched. I never really wrapped my head around that from a practicality standpoint unless you're ok with little boxes all over and a sub that reaches into the upper bass. I never liked that. The compromise for me was a full set of old Celestian 3's which do great bass for their size in my experience when properly implemented and a modest sub.
@Mykal Fury
May I add this ?
In my 40yrs experience....
You're exactly right !!
😆😂😂🤣
I think the question means big speakers with bigger drivers, same drivers different box sizes doesn't make sense.
I've auditioned the Edifier A100 vs A300 at the store in the same controlled room with the same decibel measurements.. The A300 with bigger driver sounds bigger than the smaller A100, infact if you listen to them side by side, A100 sounds honky. I'm not talking loudness here, they are set the same loudness levels and the A300 sounds wider and more airy. As per store owner, nobody picks up an A100 if they don't mind the box size and base only on the sound quality.
Having big boxes compared to smal ones might mean you will have to move the speakers closer to the front or side walls because of space limitations. So now there is wall instead of empty space around the speaker. I can imagine this effects soundstage and imaging as well. Or am I wrong?
Plus unnecessary room gain
That was very interesting, Paul. Thank you!
One small thing to consider is that small bookshelf speakers are often a little bit easier to place "correctly" than big fat towers... which often end up in the corners, and that's not so good.
By the way, why are you working on a Sunday? :)
you can have speakers with big drivers/transducers in a small room....
but you need to take very special care to get the sound right.(treatment , furniture ,placement , ect ect..)
True. Unless you have a room that just perfectly matches it. It does happen
@@el34glo59 Also true .
But this is very rare , unless the room is
special built to do that .
Biggest problem is in a small room you are sat close to the speakers and you need distance for the drivers to blend. A two driver speaker is easier than a four. The only large speaker speakers that work close up use a driver design like Tannoy or KEF
Another important aspect you touched upon here, mostly overlooked
Big speakers you can here everything better gaves out wider sound some you didn't here before sounds more clear if go for big speakers that's why also headphones beat earbuds you also here stereo affect more better with big speakers
I have an adjacent question? there's speak of speaker Db Sweet spot. thus having a speaker of the "right" size for the room is advised. i want a pair of kef r300's but people say they produce enough room to fill a large room, for instance, my room is 13x9 feet & is fairly sound neutral luckily. which means id have to run them at significantly lower Db for near field listening in a small room and perhaps that would alter there sound. and maby it would be better to pair smaller speakers with a smaller room than turning biger ones down but i dont realy understand this sweet spot thing.
Isn't there a limitation to how much bass a small room can support based on the length of the wavelength of low bass? I realize Bryce was talking about equivalent speakers. I have a pair of Legacy Audio Focus SE speakers in a somewhat small room and they do deliver good bass. They are physically imposing, but seem to work.
Is the space you video in your office? What do you use the reel to reel for? It seems tight in there.
I love your videos, your goal of educating people, and your company's philosophy.
A narrow box the width of the speakers is best, as a wide box will have more reflections coming off the front.
Haha, exactly what I'm doing. Two pairs of JBL 4320 two way speakers stacked up at each side, in a living room measuring 12 by 24 feet. It won't matter if my room only has 12 ft of depth along the long side.
I often hear about bigger speakers needing more room to breathe, I can see that being an issue if you put big towers in a small bedroom and expect them to sound as good as in a living room that has 2-3x the cubic volume.
Will your Infinity set sound as good in a room with half as much volume? I doubt it.
Turn the bass down a bit an dont have em blaring. I love sitting nxt to Triangle Borea BR09 Floorstanding Speakers in my small room (my only room) an going through the weekly searches with fantastic quality sound. Jus get the volume an bass right with some green an a cuppa tea rrrr , buzzing like a kid at the age of 50, love these speakers
As a bass player and audiophile, I would say that a lot depends upon how close you will be sitting from the speakers. Also important is balance from top to bottom. Most recorded bass doesn't go much below 40Hz --if you want to hear the lower octaves of a pipe organ then you need not only speakers that go that low but a seating position far enough away to hear the waves.
Balance is important. Back in the 70's there was a trend toward "boom and sizzle" speakers. These regardless of size emphasized tizzy highs and prodigious bass with really poor or reticent mid range. They sounded impressive for maybe a half hour of listening but soon became tiring. They produced a "lot of bass" but really didn't go below 40 or higher Hz's. They were in essence creating the illusion of a lot of bass.
As a professional bass player reflex cabinets were popular.
Example-the Acoustic 360. This monster had a massive 18" downward firing speaker in a folded cabinet. (these were used in Led Zeppelin by John Paul Jones). If you stood three feet in front of them you heard very little bass. However walk out into the audience some thirty feet away you heard a prodigious amount of bass.
What's this have to do with speaker size? I firmly believe it is quality of sound and tonal balance that are important. Then how far away from the speaker you will sit and how loud you will play the speaker. Some large box speakers sound very nice at lower volumes and others need to be played at a minimal level. Then there's the amplification...another story.
this is because the lower the frequency, the lower the longer the wavelenght is. Example 20 Hz => 17 m. I don't know if i said it correctly in english as i'm not native english speaker. The board of the wavelenght can be found there www.studionyima.com/downloads/tables/TABLE_%20Frequency-Wavelength.pdf
the real problem is the wife no the speaker :-D
if the wife is a problem then you have chosen an unpleasant wife.
I don't have wife but i have a lot of hifi systems
What wife?
I only have place for equipment!
and a dog,for real friendship,very safe option!
He (my labrado) never complains,about nothing!
If the wife is not happy with your audio hobby then get a new wife.
Omg, yeah
The room is really an extension of the speaker. Big speakers are fine in smaller rooms, say 15'X12'X10' (my living room, for example) as long as you don't try and play them too loud. Just keep the output reasonable and if ya gotta listen to loud music, try a good pair of headphones. I like my Koss Pro4X phones.
its more about the quality of speakers and listening volume levels than the size in most cases
It seems that my speakers sound the best at a relatively loud listening volume. When playing at a low volume it seems that I loose detail. Is this due to the design of the speaker or is there too many variables to determine the issue? I may be shopping for new speakers and I don't know if the issue will improve or get worse.
I'd wager your speakers have low sensitivity. The lower their sensitivity > the less efficient they are > the more power you have to supply to them to get a decent volume out of them.
When shopping for new speakers, look for 90+ db sensitivity.
This is strictly regarding the volume.. not sound quality. A badly designed speaker won't sound good just because it has high sensitivity and vica versa.
@@boburrides
Just saying that some low sensitivity speakers, (86+-db) can sound amazing with the right amplification.
I’ve been a headphone user and recently thought of getting a pair of speakers. I have study room with my work desk on one end and 2 rows of bookshelves. The room measurement is 4.25 meter(Length) by 3.15 (Width) x 2.48 (ceiling height) or 13’11” x 10’4” x 8’1”. After deducting the rows of bookshelves, the open space I have is 3.65 x 2.15 x 2.48 meters or 11’11” x 8’2” x 8’1”. I am thinking of something like the Polk R700 floor standing speakers😂. Please advise if this will work or I am better off getting “bookshelves speakers” like the Polk R200 and perhaps with a sub?
Can we use commercial cinema speakers in home cinema in a 250 sq feet room?
Sure you can. But see above...
I built a pair of fairly good size box speakers (years ago) with 2 12" poly woofers in each enclosure & was disappointed with the bass response. I was using a Kenwood 125 wpc RMS amplifier just for those. (Mid 80's).
The deep bass response I was hoping for never developed in the room they were in.
When I left it running, I realized that when I left the room, I could hear & feel what I was hoping for 2 rooms away.
What was going on with that?
I'm at a loss!
If the room is too small, the bass frequencies do not have place to bounce around but instead get cancelled out almost instantaneously, leaving a dip in lower frequency region
Positioning a subwoofer in a small room is critical. More so than in a big room
A minor point but I think you should also like the aesthetics of your speakers as they make such a statement in a room..Primary concern is the sound of course, but if you have incredibly ugly speakers they will always be an eyesore and will 'fit in' to any room...Personally i couldnt like with a set of Wilson Watt Puppy's..In fact, anything Wilson make...
meh I don't care how they look like, when they SOUND...
what about sound clarity big speaker vs little?. 2 also do you miss any sounds besides bass, big speaker vs little speaker? like a 12 inch full range vs a 3-1/2 inch. 3 also which is louder?
I think bigger speakers will always be louder, but I cannot speak definitively in regards to your other questions, although I do have my opinions.
First you said that the box size doesn't make any difference 4:02 and then you said a small box yields less bass 4:18.
And with your small box example you said "amplified" and said with the same "amplified" input with you big box example. Obviously you mean the amplified bit (I suppose bass) would apply to the small box but not with the big box (but you didn't say that). What I would imagine you are trying to say is that it's only with small boxes (amplified)...since you said the reason for the boost is the lack of bass in a small box.
Every audiophile should have a calibration microphone. This is an invaluable tool. Measure your speakers in your room at your listening position. At worst a big speaker in a small room might produce boomy bass. If it does, take a measurement to verify this fact. Then apply DSP to correct this boominess. Not that hard if you use the right tools for the job. Simply using your ears and speaker placement will not suffice if you want truly great levels of performance, unless your room and speaker placement is perfect which in most cases is not.
yeah, but that doesn't tackle the even more important problem of frequency dependent reverbration time.
if you want clean bass, you need to treat the room. then maybe throw in a bit of eq for your listening position.
Problem is that microphone often time measure different each time even at relatively the same position. Better way is to play sine wave and sweep manually from low to mid frequency and eq manually. High frequency is not going to be very difference with simple acoustic treatment.
Can you get good sound from every sized room? That is the question. Is there rooms that is impossible to get a good sound in/from?
a square room is most troublesome. the worst of the worst? 12x12x9
@@googoo-gjoob Round one is worse. Especially if its a sphere
That's absolutely not true that big speakers don't sound well in small rooms. Now a huge 3 way or 4 way, sure depending on the listening distance could be an issue. But a large two way there's should be absolutely no issue. I could see a giant 3 way horn speaker causing issues at short distances or perfectly square small rooms. But honestly you'd be surprised how small a room you can do with a giant 2 way
It's more a case a large floorstander needs to be brought out from the wall more than a small bookshelf speaker. Well at least the rear ported floorstanders need more space from the front wall to perform well.
I've got identical sealed on wall speakers for my centre channel and surrounds in a 5.1 setup. Front left & right are bookshelfs. The on wall speakers each have 4 mid/bass ballistic grade Kevlar extra long throw woofers and two silk dome tweeters. Very powerful for on wall speakers. They sound awesome in my small room with my hybrid 2.1/5.1 system for music and movies 🎶🎬
I have a separate power stereo amplifier for the front left & right right speakers, a separate amplifier for the centre channel speaker. And a separate amplifier for the two surround speakers. So can control the volume separately for the front left & right, centre, surrounds.
I've often wondered why a speaker designer doesn't couple a nice bookshelf speaker on top of a big powered subwoofer. (Think of a favorite powered subwoofer, then bolt some bookshelf speakers to the top.) The only reason I can assume is that subwoofer position is frequently different than speaker position (hence the "sub crawl") but even then with dual subwoofers the need for a "sub crawl" seems to be much less. Otherwise this would allow a "small" bookshelf speaker to fit nicely into a small room but still give huge sound.
You've basically just described the Wilson Audio design philosophy.
A tip when you place the speakers they need a proper distance to walls and corners and a proper separation between. In my room big speaker with a 2 mts between... the speaker is just at 1cm to the wall and the corners = a massive bass and no clarity. I tried only 2 different speakers pair. I have now a bookshelf with a nice balanced sound
FEGTTTSDH it really depends on design on speakers some are designed to go into corners some designed to sit up against the wall and work very nicely
@@LIHPIT Yes in my case with my LS50 they need space...
The physical size of the speaker is not the issue unless they are just stupidly huge,,, the issue is energy imparted to the space. Some people spout fear over driving the room in to compression. This "feature" can be a plus or minus to the sound. It is about the matching of the imparted energy, the cubic volume, the reflective abilities of the room,,, it is a cake bake. It takes the right ingredients (components). My theater system is arguably "over sized" for the space, but the mix and match of the total combination in wonderful.
Speakers have optimal excursion dynamics.. if the speaker driver is huge, it won't get enough energy in a small room to be loud enough to perform at the optimal loudness it wants. Forget the box size.
Except, the larger box will likely be heavier, and the mass of the box will effect the sound. And if it’s not heavier, then it’s made of thinner flimsier material, which seems like another problem.
█ █ Actually, a large piece of furniture, whether it's a speaker enclosure or not, will most likely improve the sound. I'll leave it to you to figure out why that's true. No need to thank me. █ █
It depends on the type of furniture you bring into the room. A big glass table will will degrade the sound 👍🏾
Whereas a fabric sofa on the side wall would help with some of the reflections 👌🏾
box size doesn't matter to the sound? That's the STUPIDEST thing I've heard. Frequency response will wary depending on the box.
I didn't understand exactly what Paul tried to explain. Is big speakers in a small room does provide bad sound ? Yes ? Why ? No why ? There are so many things to consider to give a good answer to that question. For me, the question remains. Yes or no and why ?
What about big amplifiers in small rooms?
Very interesting and very helpful.
I am surprised the video quality of this older clip is better than the new ones'
Paul kept on about enclosure size.... this is only true in part. What DOES matter is the bass driver size..!! In a 10' by 10' room ( OMG !!) an 18" driver would sound terrible compared with a smaller driver like an 8" driver...
I've been in recording studio sitting in front of 2x15 per side sounded incredible, I think they were JBL
I had a major issue when I upgraded from a pair of standmounts to a pair of floorstanding speakers, as the WAF specification for the latter was very poor (WAF being "Wife Acceptance Factor"). So, with us being "empty nesters", moved my system down to the family room and created a "man cave", where a low "WAF" was not a problem.
The solution is called: Divorce
Evan Rosenberg My wife bought me my big tower speakers, so no WAF problem.
Please look up mgtow
I have the no doubt very wrong theory that big speakers are not really made for playing all the time at very low volume. At that level they (I guess) miss presence and the bass is too relaxed then
So people with thin walls and grumpy neighbors do perhaps better with a system with less power and smaller speakers and then it will have presence at the level required to not disturb the neighbors.
But my theory is perhaps only true if that small system is indeed tweaked for that purpose and not made flat.
can someone help me out?
i got a 12x11 room dedicated for stereo listening and cannot decide between the Canton 9k (bookshelfs) and the Canton 5k (full size) the price does not matter but i just wanna know if ill "overload" the room with the big one
Those Cantons are optically beautiful, but sound-wise you can do so much better for that money. I had once Ventos 896...
You need to ensure each driver is time-aligned to the listening position. I have massive horns in a small room. They sound great!
You are correct sir !!
Is there any chance miniature speakers like the Elac BS-312 can sound as good as normal sized bookshelf speakers? I like small speakers that I can take everywhere with me, but without compromise in sound quality.
Short answer is no 👍🏾
Miniature speakers and small portable Bluetooth speakers don't sound anywhere as good as normal sized bookshelf speakers. It's simple physics 👌🏾
Common sense would say that you wouldn't need as much power to power large speakers to fill a small room.
Big boxes have big drivers
That's the main point. Which he missed! :D
1" bass speakers will the best if take enought of bass!!!
good info Mr. Paul! Wish i could show you my peasant setup involving (2) 18" PA subs and 8 sony speakers all in 2 channel glory! I got really big speakers in a really small room! Its an absolute riot =D
FPS_Machete_[HD] hello Sir. Any cheap idea for improving bass in a room. Or any Subwoofer which is cheap.
well, speaker placement is the free option. Anything after that and you're gonna have to spend some money. If your budget isnt that large (like mine) go with 2 of whatever you can afford. 2 cheap subs will almost always out gun a single expensive sub.
Get a microhpone and get some DSP. That is the best and cheapest way to improve bass. MiniDSP 2x4 or 2x4HD are your best bets with a UMIK-1 mic. DIY subs give you amazing performance for a relatively cheap price. I have an 18" Dayton Ultimax sealed. You can build two of them for $1300 total which performs with subs costing $1500-2000 each. Or build a single 15" for less than $500. Or buy a Rythmik, HSU or SVS sub. You can go lower than $500 but you will be missing depth and accuracy. Any sub is still better than no sub. Setting it up is the most important part which is where the mic and DSP will help you greatly.
"Mount no little speakers; they have no power to charge listening rooms." -- Daniel Burnham, more or less
In my small room my Big speakers sounded 1/3 than my small speakers. Castle knight 5 vs knight 1. Big speaker = Big error
To me, it is a lot like amplifier power -- it is better to have more than is need than less. Less will always distort and will clip the speaker; thereby, damaging the speaker. It is always good to have some reserve to draw from when you need it.
If the speaker is large, sure, it can be overpowering, just like too little of a speaker in a very large room can be inadequate, but with too much, you can through control, adjust the speaker to match the room's acoustic properties and get a very full and balanced sound, while the speakers have little trouble in producing your requirements instead of overstressing to try and get there.
Of course, you can overkill and not getting your dollar value, but the principle being, if there is truly “common sense” based upon good foundational truth -- you can make better choices and not be taken in by charlatans trying to take advantage of you and your wallet or leading you down the wrong choice.
Speakers with large driver size are difficult to get moving at low volumes. They don't work so well nearfield. And yes, room modes with the bass.
I have a small man cave with two Legacy Focus speakers two nht 3 classic speakers for rear channels and a velodyne sub. Go big or go home!!
I think the question refered for example to a 5 inch cone pair of monitors vs 8 inch...
I found a picture of the aDs L810s, sitting on their original stands and I had to have a pair. Got a pair the next month ( sans stands; darned things are like hen's teeth; seems no one bothered with them at purchase. ) I put them up on my desktop to test a theory and they sounded incredible, though it proved that larger bookshelf speakers need to be isolated from the desktop. Anyway, a year later I got incredibly lucky and a pair of immaculate aDs 910s fell into my lap and they're playing in this small bedroom, and they sound even better than the l810s. Hard-hitting bass and sublime mids/tweets. ( 130lbs on their stands/each. ) I'd move them into a larger room but I don't see the need right now.
you didn't answered the question
i disagree
@@googoo-gjoob nobody cares
Hi Paul.I'm a recent subscriber.
He is not an acoustic engineer.
I can tell you this your infinity system is way too big for that small room you have them inArnie built his speakers to play at very high levels very cleanly,and those speakers are being stifled in that room of yours,I have a 50 by 42 foot room with 12 foot ceilings and I could see them sounding a hole lot better in my room than yours
I will tell you from personal experience that I have much better sound from a bookshelf sub combo than a big tower in the same small room.
Me too, if I had both options I would go with bookshelf and sub Rather than big tower speakers
if you buy very big speakers to enhance your stereo of course yes it will certainly have ample bass to impress the girl friend.
I have my Cerwin Vega DX 9's hook up two a KENWOOD 130 watt amp also I have two definitive technology towers, Advent towers, Polk towers nd two Cerwin Vega 12 inch sube run by my Onkyo 7.2 channel receiver. sounds astonishing.
big speakers all have a dull ass sound. Teeny tiny speakers have a toy piano sound, but all bookshelfs are perfect. It is a mistake to buy a big speaker. bookshelfs have plenty of bass. But you need a bassy bookshelf. You dont need a lot of real deep bass because instruments dont have deep bass. The lower part of the piano, the keys way on the left side have too deep a bass that is seldom used. The left keys on a piano are distorted. You dont need a sub, but if you have one, buy a cheap one, because a sub is not clear in sound.
I am sorry you feel this way, but I couldn't disagree more. I'd invite you to someday hear a big set of speakers here that aren't dull. Also, your assessment of deep bass is interesting but far from accurate.
@@Paulmcgowanpsaudio You dont have to answer back,but I hope you mention about some of the below topics on your videos. I cant argue with you, you must be correct in audio advice. It is good that you take your hard time to talk about audio. I believe that you will improve interest in audio & your business tremendously. It is hard to understand why more people are not involved in stereo. You love your job, that is great. I love your products. Some big speakers have a sealed off chamber from the rest of the speakers, some speakers have separate ports for each woofer. I like this idea. And the idea of 2 and a half way speakers. I like the idea of first order crossovers of how great they sound, but I dont understand crossovers completely. I have a pair of B & W speakers, this brand is over rated. I like subs that do not lose much volume at low frequencies. I have a Nakamichi stasis amp that has a circuit designed by Nelson pass, I wish I understood more of this circuit. he designed this circuit in a threshold amp, too. The beryllium tweeters and woofers have me interested. I wonder if hybrid pre amps or hybrid amps have advantages.
You dont have to answer back, but could talk about this on future videos. Thanks. Most people think that speakers have to be in a big room, so to keep music distorting vibrations to hit your ears. Speakers needing to be 4 foot from a wall, in a rectangle room. This is wrong. Rectangle rooms are not needed. Speakers can be 66 inches apart. 2 to 3 feet off the ground for bookshelfs. Bookshelfs can be placed the width of you fist from a brick wall. Speakers can be close to a brick wall because the brick are deffractors. You can buy deffractors. Google deffractors. Speakers close to a brick wall has more bass, making subwoofers uneccessary. A sub will sound muddy in this situation. The bass will be clearer than a subwoofer. The hard brick will give bigger dynamics and bass. material on walls is no goo
@Mario CantaniGot some high price speakers????
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Big speakers do work in small room..
Bigger speakers sound better at lower volume. Most small speakers have a bad frequency response at lower volumes and have to be played quite loud to sound good, which is not always convenient.
Buy bigger, better, and efficient as possible, then upgrade everything else as you go.
The only problem is the more efficient a speaker is you lose some low end bass frequency.
You would have to buy massive 6ft+ speakers with duel 12 inch drivers or more, with 3inch voice coils to get both high efficiency (over 97db) and deep low frequency 20hz.
Most people don't have the space for that in their living room. Or even in their music, home theatre room. You would need a gigantic room and lot's of money for that 👍🏾
@@C--A I have dedicated subs for the extreme low end
A totally nonsensical video
Yeah...waaaay-toooo rambly. Out
BIG of course. Lets not say bookshelves.. oh my god stop with damn tiny boxes. Not my fault you live in Pidgeon houses.