To make things worse: it was all for nothing! Later Leslie Tompkins returned, Robin returned, Spoiler, Oracle, Jim Gordon etc. etc. Establishing Black Mask as a mob boss was a good idea, but he disappeared later anyway. Not to mention the Infinite Crisis shortly after that. All for nothing 🤷♂️
@@shawnanderson466but they're not shaking up stairs quo. They do things like this. And then the reset it all. This person is arguing about how they reset to status quo
War Games is one of many exemples of comic book being change just bc of editors obsession in wanting to make the comics similar to adaptations when they should realize that source material and adaptations are two separate things. Their difference is what allows them to stand on their own as unique versions of the characters.
Modern Marvel comics is a particularly grave case of this phenomenon I feel. Think about what they did to Ms. Marvel, to Quicksilver and the Scarlet Which, to 616 Nick Fury, what they keep doing to the X-Men just to name a few
@@LorenzoSederini Exactly, there's also that weird time Spider Man had organic web shooters bc of the Raimi films and when he went back at wearing the black suit during Civil War/Secret Invasion bc of Spider Man 3. Marvel needs to stop treating the comics as just commercial for the films. This is something adaptations like Avengers EMH and Spectacular Spider Man did better. They have elements from the movies, but also mix with things from the comics, allowing to be unique versions with their own stories.
@@LorenzoSederini In the case of Nick Fury I give a pass since, unlike cases like Pietro and Wanda, Marvel didn't retcon Fury past stories. They introduce a new character, Nick Fury Jr and have taking his father place.
The comic books advertising for the movies is just backwards. Which is based on which and which has more viewers? The movies are seen by more people and generate more money, both up front and in merchandise. The movies should be advertising the comic books, which clearly need more help! Really, all the toys, video games and what not should be making an effort to draw people back to reprints of the source material, which should in turn be jumping off points to the on going issues. Good thing important subjects don't operate under that logic. We're going to change the way policing and courts work because fewer people go into such fields than watch Law and Order on television! We're going to increase the horsepower of and decrease the safety standards of go karts because fewer people drive them than play Mario Kart! We're going to start teaching people how to punch, flip and do the splits because more people watch action movies than actually take self defense classes!
As an obsessive Batman fan, I finally understand why someone would absolutely hate Batman. If this was the only story that they've read of Batman, then yeah, this is not a good look. Great video, I can't believe how much your channel has grown.
Eh I mean in hindsight that´s a good majority of Batman crossovers and storylines though, plus it´s really not important anymore since it´s been collected in trade ages ago thankfully.
ngl one of my favorite humanizing Batman stories, because seeing him lose makes him winning even better. If Batman can't make mistakes then he is not human. But I also love when these stories make me question the mythos of Batman, and make my own consensus of a great Batman. I love your videos Knight!
War Games to me will always be a reminder that you shouldn't always borrow influence from live action superhero films or television and incorporate them into the comics because you might do more harm than good to the characters and lore, like Batman.
I like the basis of the story. Bruce fails to live up to the idea of Batman. He acts irrationally, he fails to trust his allies with important information and his overcomplicated planning still leaves oversights that causes things to go bad. There's no mind control or mastermind pulling the strings, just a ruthless oportunist taking advantage of the chaos to carve his way to the top. No one man, no matter how obssessive or driven, can account for everything. Bruce tries to hold the entire city by himself, so when he fails the consecuences are massive. But things are a little but TOO inconvenient for Batman. Bruce is too much of an asshole. The GCPD prioritizes the heroes over the gangs. Barbara decides that blowing the Clocktower is a good idea. There's no elegance to it. The intentions of the writers, to break up the Batfamily and have Batman fail, is to transparent, so it doesn't feel genuine. So it gets rejected as a story.
14:57 I don't see this as big deal. Batman being a urban legend only works if it takes place in Year one or two. After the creation of the bat-family, Gordon and the GCPD working with Batman (even having a bat-signal to call him) and he joinning the JL, most the population should already know him as public figure like the other heroes.
There is a difference. Superman, Wonder Woman, and Flash are all very open and public with their deeds. Even with the Bat Signal, only a very few criminals truly believe in his existence, and that mainly if they or an acquaintance have had personal experience with him and his rogues gallery. You can generally see Superman flying above Metropolis, but Batman lingers in the shadows of Gotham.
@@jayt9608 That only work in the first two years. After Batman begin to have sidekicks like Robin and Batgirl and being part of the Justice League, one the most popular super hero teams of all time (one that Batman himself as the leader), there's no way that he was ableto keep himself in the shadows.
@@shanksmare8 Yeah and when Tim Drake learned about Batman and Robin (Dick Grayson) identities, he did by watching them in action on TV, meaning, everybody watching probably knew that Batman was real and not a urban legend.
The narrative tries to pin all of the blame on Steph. But really, Bruce crossed the line when he used Steph as a pawn in a scheme to lure Tim back into being Robin again. Dont get me wrong, what Steph did feels very out of character, but Bruce was also very out of character
The reason Batman is so divisive, the reason you’ll see heated discussions about his personality, is because there are really two Batman. The fans know the hero from the Gold, Silver, Bronze Age and the 90’s. The haters only know the paranoid schemer that replaced him in the 2000’s, who ruined his reputation forever. All characters need and deserve flaws but Batman’s contingency plans and stone heart didn’t make him more compelling. It’s all character assassination
Actually, the paranoia, contingency plans, and "stone heart" did make Batman more compelling and made me want to read more. I love the fact that Batman is failable, capable of making mistakes and causing things to go so sideways it puts a whole city in jeopardy. I also love the campy, swashbuckling, silly, over the top, perfect hero Batman. A man without flaws, who always does the right thing, and is the best human of all time. Both are great depictions of the same character, both are valid depictions of Batman.
@@bryanc7094 I think I wrote less then the guy I was responding to? Maybe? Either way, if you need a tldr Batman can be a broody edgy loner, a paranoid master strategist, and a happy swashbuckling campy force of righteous justice. All those interpretations are valid. And I'm tired of pretending they all can't co-exist in the same character.
@@dn22pkkdd476 There is kind of a point where these flaws end up overtaking what ideals and values the character is meant to represent, which, as the OP said, can lead to people stereotyping and ultimately dismissing the character based on this. If all you've been exposed to about Batman is that he's a cold, emotionally stunted, paranoid control freak who lies to, keeps secrets from and even abuses his closest friends and family, and choose to dismiss his character on these grounds since "why would a person like this ever be considered a hero?", then that's a problem, since that's not what Batman is meant to stand for and it can overshadow the moments of Batman being genuinely compassionate, trusting and altruistic. It also feeds into the ever so tired perception of Batman just being "an emotionally unstable rich kid who beats up the poor to deal with his problems". Not to mention that whilst it's one thing to give a character flaws, it's another to have these flaws exist in circular limbo without them leading to any long term transformative change or reckoning. War Games is not the first time Batman has made a contingency plan that gets conveniently stolen and goes wrong, and it won't be the last either (Infinite Crisis, Failsafe). War Games is not the first time Batman recruited someone who was clearly not cut out to be a sidekick and paid a heavy price for it. War Games is not the first time Batman acts like a dick to the whole Batfamily resulting in them being alienated and drifting away from him, nor will it be the last. It's not that these flaws exist, it's that he constantly has them and never works to overcome them decisively, to the point where he can seem more flawed than good.
For anyone curious about the scarecrow monster: Back in the 2000’s Penguin forced Scarecrow to go through a weird experiment that made him into the fear beast
I really confess that I hate a lot the comicbook, being honest as a Stephanie Brown fan I really feel uncomfortable and I hate how it was a short aand wasted chance for a different Robin, it's sad that Steph don't get the spotlight, don't get me wrong, the idea of seing Batman lose and elevate Black Mask as a big treat is good, but like it recently happening with Marvel with the MCU synergyless, comicbooks should remain their identity and the other too, after all are different media. It's always great seen your videos and your opinions, you're my favorite CMB youtuber
You never miss with this, one of the best comic book youtubers there. I wish there was a channel like yours for other characters like Superman or Captain America
Great video as always, SK! You spoke about War Games imitating Batman Begins, and it made me think how in modern comics it seems like they've made imitating movies their number one priority. The publishers have tried to cut out as much of the "cartoon language" they could, language that used to be ubiquitous in comics. It's like comics are embarrassed to be comics, and instead are attempting to be photo montages of Hollywood movies that never were. Sad.
@@SalazarKnight I still find it wild that comics have such a relatively small fan base, whereas super-hero movies are seen by everyone. I don't know how comic companies have managed NOT to capitalize on the success of the movies. It'd be equivalent to no one reading Harry Potter, Twilight, or 50 Shades of Grey even though the movies were blockbusters. I think comics are copying the wrong parts of movies. I think they should make brand new graphic novels that come out once or twice a year, hyped to hell, and are stand-alone stories. But what do I know? Do you think comics as a medium have a chance for a wide readership? I love the medium myself, but even I get tempted just to veg out to quick youtube vids rather than investing myself in reading.
DC really did not like Batman in the early to mid 2000's. I also think back on that time because none of the writers were talking to each other. So Batman would be doing stuff over in JLA, but it would be completely ignored in the Batman books. And vice versa. Stuff like War Games was going on in the Batman books, but Batman would still be a main character in JLA as if nothing was happening. I also hate how badly they treated Stephanie Brown during that period too. I've been a fan of hers since my mom bought me Robin #5 back in 1994 and I was thrilled when she became Batgirl, but then was tossed aside yet again because of The New 52.
Inching ever so closer to two of the most notable moments in Batman’s history during the 2000s The resurrection of Jason Todd And Grant Morrison’s seven year run on Batman And I just can’t wait😁
@@donaldallen9804 I haven’t read even half of Morrison’s run yet. So I can’t fully give my opinion on it besides saying there’s some stuff I like, and some stuff I don’t. He’s usually a pretty hit or miss writer for me. I still adore his run of JLA and Final Crisis. And things like Batman & Robin have some of my favorite Batman moments from Bats’ 2000s era. But I do more than understand a lot of peoples’ issues with his stories Jason….im not a big fan of. I absolutely love his time as Robin. But I’m not really a fan of the comic version of the Under The Red Hood. And his many stories after his resurrection are something I’m not a fan of. Didn’t like him in Battle For The Cowl. His attempt at being Nightwing. His time in Morrison’s run. Any of his New 52 adventures. And his more modern stories don’t do it for me. I just feel that the status quo makes him feel pointless, as he can’t ever do anything effective even after all his talk and grandstanding.
@@joeker5208 I think DC did not know what to do with Jason once he was brought back, once the initial story under the Red Hood with Judd Winick was done DC had no clue what to do with the character and it shows. So that is why you've seen him stuck in every kind of situation.. in every kind of scenario and it never pans well for Jason.
@@donaldallen9804 it’s a real shame, cause ofc I think the premise of Under The Red Hood is great. But yeah. Ofc Jason is never gonna kill The Joker, despite it not making sense. He’s never gonna fully reform or go fully bad cause they want to keep his marketing as the edgy anti-hero who will either fight or team-up with Batman. It’s just a shame that an incredible story concept is utterly destroyed the perpetual status quo of cape comics
I can understand not wanting Batman to be wholly perfect and untouchable like some comics that have him up against gods with just his utility belt, but this is just too much in the other direction. If they wanted Batman doing solo cases they could have just told those stories, like how Legends of the Dark Knight did originally, they didn’t need to touch the Batfamily at all to get them out of the picture.
Honestly, I feel like there's a blueprint for a good storyline somewhere around here, the idea of pitting all the gangs against each other only to unify them all under a "puppet" is interesting, feel like that could be better explored in a animated movie adaptation or even in a game
Except he didn't go solo. Under The Hood, the story sandwiched within this and Infinite Crisis, had Batman team up with Nightwing for the first several issues.
@ I agree. It’s more that they attempted to make Batman solo with War Games (killing Steph, cutting off ties with Leslie, Alfred leaving, Tim and Cass moving to Bludhaven, Oracle and Batman fighting and Oracle leaving Gotham, Nightwing injured and almost killed by editorial in Infinite Crisis) to match the Batman movie coming out. Under the Red Hood was interrupted by War Games multiple times. So it would be after Under the Red Hood and Infinite Crisis (One Year Later) that they planned to make Batman solo. But they ended up not doing it. They brought Tim back to Gotham and Damian was introduced not long after, among others.
Black Mask proved he wasn’t a C-Lister. He conquered The Criminal Underworld which no villain had ever successfully done. He became so notorious that even Lex Luthor offered him to join The Secret Society
Soooo if the 00's taught anything with their take on Batman, it's that Bruce is too busy making plans taking down his JLA pals and wrecking the city he swore to protect... BUT can't be assed to proactively defeat the Dick Tracy rejects that make his rogues gallery... Yeah, that checks out.
Right on the money. I remember reading this in college and thinking what trash. It's actually a huge dumpster fire. Kinda makes you think Batman's real enemy is DC.
What a miserable time for DC. So much misery and torture porn, so much seeming hatred for sidekicks and younger heroes. Makes me thankful for the status quo now.
They are? Ugh! I got the sense that this wasn’t even well-received . It seemed unnecessary, quite frankly. Although I liked the Anderson G run quite a bit. I thought that he had a REALLY underrated run! The crossovers sort of killed it for me .
11:00 - The story tries to put all the blame on Spoiler, when in reality this disaster is all the writers and DC editorials fault. 11:11 - "Without any logical reason" is what DC should have titled this cross-over.
It doesn't really get any better afterwards, either. The sad reality of superhero comics is that it's kind of a dead industry where they do nonsensical shock storylines in the hope of getting headline buzz somewhere in a desperate hope of shocking life back in to the readership, but all it amounts to is just zapping a dead toad and making the legs twitch.
"a dead industry" Superhero Comics are not dead, they're still going strong and will continue to do so, you guys been saying this for a year or two now and guess what? They still have a massive fanbase that's not going anywhere. Superhero as a genra is so Ingraved to pop culture that it isn't going to one day fade away, outside media has made Superheroes, with comics super popular more then ever. You should try reading actual good super hero comics instead of watching TH-cam about some bad ones.
@@kaine8911 Superheroes are never going to go away, even if people are starting to get tired of the constant superhero movies at the moment. But no, the comics industry specifically has been on a decline since the 90s since comics have become a niche boutique industry that doesn't really generate new fans at a high enough of a rate to replace the old ones that drop out.
There is still plenty of really good stories being made lol. Batman white knight is good and there's ton more if you look around instead of being a cynic.
@@cellularlamp I didn't say that there haven't been any good superhero comics made in the past 20 years, it's more that I think there are certain trend-chasing tendencies the industry engages in that only hurts it in the longterm
Every five years or so I catch up on a lot of my old DC and Marvel favorites, and I remember back around 2010 hearing positive things about War Games in the communities I hung out in, but I never bothered to go read them, but it'd always been on my to-do list someday. This video was an eye opener. I always liked Black Mask though, so it's cool he got to do something eventually...
Gulacy was past him prime when he became the Catwoman artist and as soon as that happened the quality of the series started to go south really fast. But hey, thanks for writing! it's really nice to read you in the comments!!
I think that season 3 and 4 of Harley Quinn did the whole defeat of the Bat Family a lot better. During the Season 3 finale, Bruce Wayne gets sent to jail for tax evasion. Normally, Bruce and his team would find a way to break out of prison, but he chose to serve his time since he wanted the people of Gotham to know that there are consequences for this city, even for him. Plus he had a lot of trauma and believes that time in prison would help him deal with that. In Season 4, things get bad for the Bat Family. First of all, Talia AL Ghul takes over Wayne Enterprises and takes all of the Bat Family's funding and equipment, leaving them with little means of fighting crime. This was when Harley Quinn joins the Bat Family, but the rest of the sidekicks weren't buying it since she did have a long and complicated history with the team. Alfred was arrested and thrown in jail for robbing a bank, which was sort of a test to see if Harley is worthy of being a part of the Bat Family. But things go from bad to worse as Harley kills Nightwing in a crazed state. After Nightwing's funeral, the League of Shadows start coming after Damian and they take him back to his mother. Harley was slowly beginning to realize that she wasn't cut out to be a hero since the only reason why she joined was to help out the Bat Family after Bat Man is in imprison. But all that did was cause a rift between her and Ivy and it caused the Bat Family to fall apart. When Harley tells Bat Girl that she's quitting, Bat Girls tries to talk her out of it, but that only went south when the Joker shot her in the back, leaving her paralyzed from the waist down. This is what caused Harley to not only quit the Bat Family, but to quit being a hero all together. And so after Harley and Ivy sort out their relationship problems by destroying the Legion of Doom's Moon Base and ruining Lex's 40th birthday, they decided to form the Gotham Sirens, with Catwoman and Oracle a part of their team. Oh and Talia Al Ghul resurrected Nightwing by bathing him in the Lazarus Pit. Drive insane by the Lazarus Pits and thoughts of revenge, Nightwing's new goal is to hunt down Harley and make her pay for killing him.
Well this story didn’t age well due to Stephanie Brown’s victimization and torture. Plus a lot of characters acted like complete idiotic assholes like Batman for firing Spoiler for very selfish and petty reasons, the GCPD for making Batman into a criminal for the 100th time which is tiring at this point, Stephanie Brown’s mom for being a complete hypocrite and the citizens of Gotham for believing that Batman killed that girl whose father was a known crime lord whose been terrorizing this city for years. Oh and this story is also infamous for completely ruining Leslie Thompkins character by letting Spoiler die from her injuries just to prove a point to Batman. Thankfully Stephanie Brown’s death was retconned 4 years later thanks to a lot of negative backlash.
It always pissed me off they made Steph Robin as a gimmick, because i think it's such a nice addition, at least interesting to see her interacting with the bat... I wished it was a genuine experiment that respect the characters and not a piece of a plan to kill her off...... It leaves a bad taste in my mouth how mean spirited it is
Between this Storyline & Hush is where i was not reading Batman regularly... I watched Batman begins in 05 and got back into the comics later on during the grant Morrison run is where i got excited about the character again. But War Ganes is one i might read out of morbid curiosity
Great channel, I love the batman content! Any chance for a video on Watchmen in the future? The only graphic novels I ever read were that and The Dark Knight Returns, but both were amazing
Batman never calls the League in for help on his cases, and they seldom do the same with very few exceptions. It's kind of baked into the superhero code.
Great video as always. It's no surprise to me that a hater of spoiler is the one in charge of this story. Second time it happened. When you with hate, you get hate. Anyways have you watched the new batman caped crusader
love all your videos gracias !! and i would love for you to make a video about Batman and the Outsiders by Aparo and Barr thats the best batman of my childhood
Great work! Absolutely love your videos. It`s a little odd, but it looks like almost all of the story arcs you`ve covered lately portray Batman in a... less than flattering light. In almost all of them he acts like a self-absorbed, selfish and abusive jerk (and constantly loses too). I get it that he`s supposed to be a dark and gritty superhero, but it`s as if the DC *really* wanted him (and everyone in Gotham) to suffer during this period.
He talked about it in one of his videos the long time Batman editor Dennis O Neil, who actually cared about the character was fired and DC used that opportunity to ruin the character
So we had the good (Knightfall), the middling (No Man's Land) and the godawful (this and most of what follows)... Also, BatBale, for his Marlboro voice, was genuinely likable unlike the Batprick they crapped here...
I have always questioned something about an identity crisis. First of all, the story seems to deal with Batman being quite close to the League and at the same time the story tries to punish him for it. For example, apparently Bruce revealed a lot of sensitive information about himself and his friends. allies to members as low as atom who in turn revealed it to his wife since I honestly don't know where she could have gotten that information from and as a curious fact they send her to arcana cylon which sounds strange because there is no well If she already knows all that information and it had already been shown that the league was trying to prevent that information from being released to the public, it wouldn't make any more sense for them to withhold it or for being so kind to erase the memory to prevent it from revealing more secret identities, I mean she apparently knew. about who Superman really is and taking into account that it seems like he knew who team Drake was so nothing stops him from knowing who Batman really is but instead all he does is say she's crazy and leave her in an asylum I can imagine how that ended, fire back, to the heroic community there are other problems but that is honestly one of the ones that I have questioned the most, well that and apparently Barry got consequences free.
Spoilers for the comic! Fun fact: I read War Games because I saw a meme of Steph/Spoiler saying “Tee hee, I’m gonna start a gang war!”😂and I HAD to know what on earth she was talking about. I was somewhat new to older Batman comics, so I was working my way through random interesting storylines rather than trying any chronological order or anything like that. As a result, my first serious impression of Black Mask was a very, very dark one. He’s actually so scary in war games; whereas sometimes more recently they treat Black Mask like a fringe power trying to work his way up, which was confusing for me after reading war games. Also, I liked the show Gotham’s take on Black Mask.
Do you take requests? Can you do a video on Ed Brubaker’s Catwoman? Or the Dini run on Detective ? I thought that was better than Morrison’s (But I felt that editorial dictated a lot of it .).
Oh, yes. There were too many events and crossovers. The worst is when Batman had a nervous breakdown during Infinite Crisis. Him being mindwiped by the Justice League was also a low point . Just really weird and melodramatically overdone stuff .
@matthewschwartz6607 so we have the 2000s editors to thank for this current decline. It's easy to blame it on the current editorial, but the fact is, the work done by Dennis O'Neil during the 80s and 90s was turned to ash
@@jaredgarcia8638 It's funny because Yu believed that the 2000 spinoff was much better in writing and was also in good shape, it had like 7 issues derived from Batman, Catwoman, Robin, Batgirl, Birds of Prey, the Sinister Six, the Huntress mini-series, Dick all in good time and its quality was superior to many Batman stories
my pc seems to not like this video first time i tried to watch this it crashed second time it fails to find the page third time it takes half an hour to load before adds start but finally i am getting to watch it o hopefully it was worth it
![[MV] A leap of faith...ความเชื่อใจครั้งสุดท้าย (From "Petrichor the series")](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/U1piZH2CNXA/mqdefault.jpg)
"If you don't like spoilers you'll gonna love war games"
Stephanhie Brown: hey!
😅
That “if you don’t like spoilers” line was incredible
I didnt even start the video and I just had to see if someone got that reference instantly
I didn’t start the video, and I just got it . 😂Cute ,
To make things worse: it was all for nothing! Later Leslie Tompkins returned, Robin returned, Spoiler, Oracle, Jim Gordon etc. etc. Establishing Black Mask as a mob boss was a good idea, but he disappeared later anyway. Not to mention the Infinite Crisis shortly after that. All for nothing 🤷♂️
I would say being shot in the head by Catwoman is a bit more than just "disappearing" lol.
@@seanhall6317 well, he disappeared from the comics back then. But still: He was established and cut again
All of that couldn't last forever...I'm actually glad when they shake up the status quo...instead of keeping it the same all the time...
@@shawnanderson466but they're not shaking up stairs quo. They do things like this. And then the reset it all. This person is arguing about how they reset to status quo
The Bat - computer gag was GENIUS!
War Games is one of many exemples of comic book being change just bc of editors obsession in wanting to make the comics similar to adaptations when they should realize that source material and adaptations are two separate things. Their difference is what allows them to stand on their own as unique versions of the characters.
Modern Marvel comics is a particularly grave case of this phenomenon I feel. Think about what they did to Ms. Marvel, to Quicksilver and the Scarlet Which, to 616 Nick Fury, what they keep doing to the X-Men just to name a few
@@LorenzoSederini Exactly, there's also that weird time Spider Man had organic web shooters bc of the Raimi films and when he went back at wearing the black suit during Civil War/Secret Invasion bc of Spider Man 3. Marvel needs to stop treating the comics as just commercial for the films.
This is something adaptations like Avengers EMH and Spectacular Spider Man did better. They have elements from the movies, but also mix with things from the comics, allowing to be unique versions with their own stories.
@@LorenzoSederini In the case of Nick Fury I give a pass since, unlike cases like Pietro and Wanda, Marvel didn't retcon Fury past stories. They introduce a new character, Nick Fury Jr and have taking his father place.
The comic books advertising for the movies is just backwards. Which is based on which and which has more viewers? The movies are seen by more people and generate more money, both up front and in merchandise. The movies should be advertising the comic books, which clearly need more help! Really, all the toys, video games and what not should be making an effort to draw people back to reprints of the source material, which should in turn be jumping off points to the on going issues.
Good thing important subjects don't operate under that logic. We're going to change the way policing and courts work because fewer people go into such fields than watch Law and Order on television! We're going to increase the horsepower of and decrease the safety standards of go karts because fewer people drive them than play Mario Kart! We're going to start teaching people how to punch, flip and do the splits because more people watch action movies than actually take self defense classes!
As an obsessive Batman fan, I finally understand why someone would absolutely hate Batman. If this was the only story that they've read of Batman, then yeah, this is not a good look.
Great video, I can't believe how much your channel has grown.
It wouldn't have been possible without your support and trust. I'm forever grateful for that!
@@SalazarKnightIs there any chance you would do one-shots like Ego, Death of the Innocent, War on Crime, and Ultimate Evil.
Batman fans in the 2000s:
I wish we had a crossover even that is actually organised well between all the books
Monkey's Paw: *curls*
Eh I mean in hindsight that´s a good majority of Batman crossovers and storylines though, plus it´s really not important anymore since it´s been collected in trade ages ago thankfully.
ngl one of my favorite humanizing Batman stories, because seeing him lose makes him winning even better. If Batman can't make mistakes then he is not human. But I also love when these stories make me question the mythos of Batman, and make my own consensus of a great Batman. I love your videos Knight!
THANK YOU! Glad see someone else feels similarly regarding humanizing/losses!
Humanizing Batman is good, but this story went about it all wrong.
War Games to me will always be a reminder that you shouldn't always borrow influence from live action superhero films or television and incorporate them into the comics because you might do more harm than good to the characters and lore, like Batman.
I like the basis of the story. Bruce fails to live up to the idea of Batman. He acts irrationally, he fails to trust his allies with important information and his overcomplicated planning still leaves oversights that causes things to go bad. There's no mind control or mastermind pulling the strings, just a ruthless oportunist taking advantage of the chaos to carve his way to the top. No one man, no matter how obssessive or driven, can account for everything. Bruce tries to hold the entire city by himself, so when he fails the consecuences are massive.
But things are a little but TOO inconvenient for Batman. Bruce is too much of an asshole. The GCPD prioritizes the heroes over the gangs. Barbara decides that blowing the Clocktower is a good idea. There's no elegance to it. The intentions of the writers, to break up the Batfamily and have Batman fail, is to transparent, so it doesn't feel genuine. So it gets rejected as a story.
14:57 I don't see this as big deal. Batman being a urban legend only works if it takes place in Year one or two. After the creation of the bat-family, Gordon and the GCPD working with Batman (even having a bat-signal to call him) and he joinning the JL, most the population should already know him as public figure like the other heroes.
There is a difference. Superman, Wonder Woman, and Flash are all very open and public with their deeds. Even with the Bat Signal, only a very few criminals truly believe in his existence, and that mainly if they or an acquaintance have had personal experience with him and his rogues gallery. You can generally see Superman flying above Metropolis, but Batman lingers in the shadows of Gotham.
He could still be mysterious and deadly, kinda like the illuminati
Agreed, Batman was previously the leader of the post-crisis Justice League in 1987
@@jayt9608 That only work in the first two years. After Batman begin to have sidekicks like Robin and Batgirl and being part of the Justice League, one the most popular super hero teams of all time (one that Batman himself as the leader), there's no way that he was ableto keep himself in the shadows.
@@shanksmare8 Yeah and when Tim Drake learned about Batman and Robin (Dick Grayson) identities, he did by watching them in action on TV, meaning, everybody watching probably knew that Batman was real and not a urban legend.
And I believed that after the “tower of Babel” it couldn't get any worse
The narrative tries to pin all of the blame on Steph. But really, Bruce crossed the line when he used Steph as a pawn in a scheme to lure Tim back into being Robin again.
Dont get me wrong, what Steph did feels very out of character, but Bruce was also very out of character
The reason Batman is so divisive, the reason you’ll see heated discussions about his personality, is because there are really two Batman. The fans know the hero from the Gold, Silver, Bronze Age and the 90’s. The haters only know the paranoid schemer that replaced him in the 2000’s, who ruined his reputation forever.
All characters need and deserve flaws but Batman’s contingency plans and stone heart didn’t make him more compelling. It’s all character assassination
Actually, the paranoia, contingency plans, and "stone heart" did make Batman more compelling and made me want to read more. I love the fact that Batman is failable, capable of making mistakes and causing things to go so sideways it puts a whole city in jeopardy. I also love the campy, swashbuckling, silly, over the top, perfect hero Batman. A man without flaws, who always does the right thing, and is the best human of all time. Both are great depictions of the same character, both are valid depictions of Batman.
@@dn22pkkdd476you wrote much and said nothing of importance
@@bryanc7094 I think I wrote less then the guy I was responding to? Maybe? Either way, if you need a tldr
Batman can be a broody edgy loner, a paranoid master strategist, and a happy swashbuckling campy force of righteous justice. All those interpretations are valid. And I'm tired of pretending they all can't co-exist in the same character.
Mark Waid was a pioneer in turning Batman a "paranoid schemer" back in JLA
@@dn22pkkdd476 There is kind of a point where these flaws end up overtaking what ideals and values the character is meant to represent, which, as the OP said, can lead to people stereotyping and ultimately dismissing the character based on this. If all you've been exposed to about Batman is that he's a cold, emotionally stunted, paranoid control freak who lies to, keeps secrets from and even abuses his closest friends and family, and choose to dismiss his character on these grounds since "why would a person like this ever be considered a hero?", then that's a problem, since that's not what Batman is meant to stand for and it can overshadow the moments of Batman being genuinely compassionate, trusting and altruistic. It also feeds into the ever so tired perception of Batman just being "an emotionally unstable rich kid who beats up the poor to deal with his problems".
Not to mention that whilst it's one thing to give a character flaws, it's another to have these flaws exist in circular limbo without them leading to any long term transformative change or reckoning. War Games is not the first time Batman has made a contingency plan that gets conveniently stolen and goes wrong, and it won't be the last either (Infinite Crisis, Failsafe). War Games is not the first time Batman recruited someone who was clearly not cut out to be a sidekick and paid a heavy price for it. War Games is not the first time Batman acts like a dick to the whole Batfamily resulting in them being alienated and drifting away from him, nor will it be the last. It's not that these flaws exist, it's that he constantly has them and never works to overcome them decisively, to the point where he can seem more flawed than good.
I was having a very shitty day due to my anxiety struggles but your upload just made it a bit brighter.
Black Mask even takes Scarface out? Holy crap, they really did want to trash the status quo...
For anyone curious about the scarecrow monster:
Back in the 2000’s Penguin forced Scarecrow to go through a weird experiment that made him into the fear beast
Thanks, dude! I read this story about five years ago, and I could never understand why Crane would do that to himself. I suppose he didn’t.
I really confess that I hate a lot the comicbook, being honest as a Stephanie Brown fan I really feel uncomfortable and I hate how it was a short aand wasted chance for a different Robin, it's sad that Steph don't get the spotlight, don't get me wrong, the idea of seing Batman lose and elevate Black Mask as a big treat is good, but like it recently happening with Marvel with the MCU synergyless, comicbooks should remain their identity and the other too, after all are different media. It's always great seen your videos and your opinions, you're my favorite CMB youtuber
I've been binging this channel the last few weeks and it's totally reawakened my love of Batman. It's a joy to hear you talk about it.
You never miss with this, one of the best comic book youtubers there. I wish there was a channel like yours for other characters like Superman or Captain America
The #1 Batman channel on the WEB!!! Cant wait to dive in (and lament the 100 ways DC ruined the Dark Knight)!!
Thanks for traveling to the Stephanie Brown wiki in your quest for War Games! :)
Great video as always, SK!
You spoke about War Games imitating Batman Begins, and it made me think how in modern comics it seems like they've made imitating movies their number one priority. The publishers have tried to cut out as much of the "cartoon language" they could, language that used to be ubiquitous in comics. It's like comics are embarrassed to be comics, and instead are attempting to be photo montages of Hollywood movies that never were. Sad.
I get why comics companies get the urge to capitalize on a movie's mainstream success, but sometimes it goes really south like here.
just like with video games
@@SalazarKnight I still find it wild that comics have such a relatively small fan base, whereas super-hero movies are seen by everyone. I don't know how comic companies have managed NOT to capitalize on the success of the movies. It'd be equivalent to no one reading Harry Potter, Twilight, or 50 Shades of Grey even though the movies were blockbusters.
I think comics are copying the wrong parts of movies. I think they should make brand new graphic novels that come out once or twice a year, hyped to hell, and are stand-alone stories. But what do I know?
Do you think comics as a medium have a chance for a wide readership? I love the medium myself, but even I get tempted just to veg out to quick youtube vids rather than investing myself in reading.
It’s insane that I’m watching this video on August 16th. Happy Birthday Bro & Happy Birthday Jason.
Staring to call him “Brickman” halfway through the video.. 😂😂😂
DC really did not like Batman in the early to mid 2000's. I also think back on that time because none of the writers were talking to each other. So Batman would be doing stuff over in JLA, but it would be completely ignored in the Batman books. And vice versa. Stuff like War Games was going on in the Batman books, but Batman would still be a main character in JLA as if nothing was happening. I also hate how badly they treated Stephanie Brown during that period too. I've been a fan of hers since my mom bought me Robin #5 back in 1994 and I was thrilled when she became Batgirl, but then was tossed aside yet again because of The New 52.
Great video 📹
Thanks for informing us about these stories and some obscure characters.
Tarantula isn't just a cheap huntress, but a completely *VILE* cheap version of the Huntress
Disgustingly* Vile cheap version
Inching ever so closer to two of the most notable moments in Batman’s history during the 2000s
The resurrection of Jason Todd
And Grant Morrison’s seven year run on Batman
And I just can’t wait😁
Jason yes but Grant bored me to tears, he is just not my cup of tea. Jason coming back to life was a great moment for me
@@donaldallen9804 I haven’t read even half of Morrison’s run yet. So I can’t fully give my opinion on it besides saying there’s some stuff I like, and some stuff I don’t. He’s usually a pretty hit or miss writer for me. I still adore his run of JLA and Final Crisis. And things like Batman & Robin have some of my favorite Batman moments from Bats’ 2000s era. But I do more than understand a lot of peoples’ issues with his stories
Jason….im not a big fan of. I absolutely love his time as Robin. But I’m not really a fan of the comic version of the Under The Red Hood. And his many stories after his resurrection are something I’m not a fan of. Didn’t like him in Battle For The Cowl. His attempt at being Nightwing. His time in Morrison’s run. Any of his New 52 adventures. And his more modern stories don’t do it for me. I just feel that the status quo makes him feel pointless, as he can’t ever do anything effective even after all his talk and grandstanding.
@@donaldallen9804opposite for me. I found Jason Todd return tedious with how involved it was and Grant Morrison work great
@@joeker5208 I think DC did not know what to do with Jason once he was brought back, once the initial story under the Red Hood with Judd Winick was done DC had no clue what to do with the character and it shows. So that is why you've seen him stuck in every kind of situation.. in every kind of scenario and it never pans well for Jason.
@@donaldallen9804 it’s a real shame, cause ofc I think the premise of Under The Red Hood is great. But yeah. Ofc Jason is never gonna kill The Joker, despite it not making sense. He’s never gonna fully reform or go fully bad cause they want to keep his marketing as the edgy anti-hero who will either fight or team-up with Batman. It’s just a shame that an incredible story concept is utterly destroyed the perpetual status quo of cape comics
I can understand not wanting Batman to be wholly perfect and untouchable like some comics that have him up against gods with just his utility belt, but this is just too much in the other direction. If they wanted Batman doing solo cases they could have just told those stories, like how Legends of the Dark Knight did originally, they didn’t need to touch the Batfamily at all to get them out of the picture.
Honestly, I feel like there's a blueprint for a good storyline somewhere around here, the idea of pitting all the gangs against each other only to unify them all under a "puppet" is interesting, feel like that could be better explored in a animated movie adaptation or even in a game
Good to see another video of yours out!
Too bad I can't watch it yet, I still need to read this arc 😢
Great video. The explanation of why they wanted Batman to go solo was very insightful.
Except he didn't go solo. Under The Hood, the story sandwiched within this and Infinite Crisis, had Batman team up with Nightwing for the first several issues.
@ I agree. It’s more that they attempted to make Batman solo with War Games (killing Steph, cutting off ties with Leslie, Alfred leaving, Tim and Cass moving to Bludhaven, Oracle and Batman fighting and Oracle leaving Gotham, Nightwing injured and almost killed by editorial in Infinite Crisis) to match the Batman movie coming out. Under the Red Hood was interrupted by War Games multiple times. So it would be after Under the Red Hood and Infinite Crisis (One Year Later) that they planned to make Batman solo.
But they ended up not doing it. They brought Tim back to Gotham and Damian was introduced not long after, among others.
@@HuntingImagination No doubt they didn't go through with it because of the backlash towards this direction, and Batman's better for it.
Not me watching your videos like a movie in cinemas
Finished first season of batman caped crusader a few minutes ago then this pops up
Any good?
@@matthewschwartz6607 i loved it. Highly recommend
Black Mask proved he wasn’t a C-Lister. He conquered The Criminal Underworld which no villain had ever successfully done. He became so notorious that even Lex Luthor offered him to join The Secret Society
This should have been an awesome story in concept but it just collapsed under its own pretence
Soooo if the 00's taught anything with their take on Batman, it's that Bruce is too busy making plans taking down his JLA pals and wrecking the city he swore to protect... BUT can't be assed to proactively defeat the Dick Tracy rejects that make his rogues gallery... Yeah, that checks out.
Just found this channel. Instantly subbed and became a patron member!
Right on the money. I remember reading this in college and thinking what trash. It's actually a huge dumpster fire. Kinda makes you think Batman's real enemy is DC.
What a miserable time for DC. So much misery and torture porn, so much seeming hatred for sidekicks and younger heroes. Makes me thankful for the status quo now.
Amazing video as always. You are the best batman youtube channel! Yeahh! i said it!!
Never hire creators who hate the source material and its fans. That is the moral of the story here.
This video is released the day DC announced they're going to do an Omnibus of this event.
They are? Ugh! I got the sense that this wasn’t even well-received . It seemed unnecessary, quite frankly. Although I liked the Anderson G run quite a bit. I thought that he had a REALLY underrated run! The crossovers sort of killed it for me .
@@matthewschwartz6607 War Games is not a good story, but I can respect DC for collecting it for preservation's sake.
How is this channel not bigger?
I rememeber liking these books a lot back then but i must admit, I haven't thought about them in years
i was thinking about this story arc today and suddenly this epic upload hits
11:00 - The story tries to put all the blame on Spoiler, when in reality this disaster is all the writers and DC editorials fault.
11:11 - "Without any logical reason" is what DC should have titled this cross-over.
It doesn't really get any better afterwards, either. The sad reality of superhero comics is that it's kind of a dead industry where they do nonsensical shock storylines in the hope of getting headline buzz somewhere in a desperate hope of shocking life back in to the readership, but all it amounts to is just zapping a dead toad and making the legs twitch.
"a dead industry" Superhero Comics are not dead, they're still going strong and will continue to do so, you guys been saying this for a year or two now and guess what? They still have a massive fanbase that's not going anywhere.
Superhero as a genra is so Ingraved to pop culture that it isn't going to one day fade away, outside media has made Superheroes, with comics super popular more then ever. You should try reading actual good super hero comics instead of watching TH-cam about some bad ones.
@@kaine8911 Superheroes are never going to go away, even if people are starting to get tired of the constant superhero movies at the moment. But no, the comics industry specifically has been on a decline since the 90s since comics have become a niche boutique industry that doesn't really generate new fans at a high enough of a rate to replace the old ones that drop out.
There is still plenty of really good stories being made lol. Batman white knight is good and there's ton more if you look around instead of being a cynic.
@@cellularlamp I didn't say that there haven't been any good superhero comics made in the past 20 years, it's more that I think there are certain trend-chasing tendencies the industry engages in that only hurts it in the longterm
@@cellularlamp yeah but the main story Events are just kinda worse
Great work, as always, Sal.
Every five years or so I catch up on a lot of my old DC and Marvel favorites, and I remember back around 2010 hearing positive things about War Games in the communities I hung out in, but I never bothered to go read them, but it'd always been on my to-do list someday. This video was an eye opener. I always liked Black Mask though, so it's cool he got to do something eventually...
21:20 this is my face trying to make sense of Batman's plan
Best Channel on Batman Comics. Ever. Change my mind , if you dare.
Another Excellent video! Thanks for pointing out Gulacy Terrible covers for Catwoman haha
Gulacy was past him prime when he became the Catwoman artist and as soon as that happened the quality of the series started to go south really fast. But hey, thanks for writing! it's really nice to read you in the comments!!
@@SalazarKnightI'm so excited for your next video about the dark knight trilog.
I think in the future Linkara will tear this event a new one and rightfully so.
He did touch on the batgirl tie-in in his cassandra caintrospective
@@abiodunsulaiman2297 I mean the whole thing.
Thank you for voicing the collective rejection of the story, and doing it so well!
I think that season 3 and 4 of Harley Quinn did the whole defeat of the Bat Family a lot better. During the Season 3 finale, Bruce Wayne gets sent to jail for tax evasion. Normally, Bruce and his team would find a way to break out of prison, but he chose to serve his time since he wanted the people of Gotham to know that there are consequences for this city, even for him. Plus he had a lot of trauma and believes that time in prison would help him deal with that. In Season 4, things get bad for the Bat Family. First of all, Talia AL Ghul takes over Wayne Enterprises and takes all of the Bat Family's funding and equipment, leaving them with little means of fighting crime. This was when Harley Quinn joins the Bat Family, but the rest of the sidekicks weren't buying it since she did have a long and complicated history with the team. Alfred was arrested and thrown in jail for robbing a bank, which was sort of a test to see if Harley is worthy of being a part of the Bat Family. But things go from bad to worse as Harley kills Nightwing in a crazed state. After Nightwing's funeral, the League of Shadows start coming after Damian and they take him back to his mother. Harley was slowly beginning to realize that she wasn't cut out to be a hero since the only reason why she joined was to help out the Bat Family after Bat Man is in imprison. But all that did was cause a rift between her and Ivy and it caused the Bat Family to fall apart. When Harley tells Bat Girl that she's quitting, Bat Girls tries to talk her out of it, but that only went south when the Joker shot her in the back, leaving her paralyzed from the waist down. This is what caused Harley to not only quit the Bat Family, but to quit being a hero all together. And so after Harley and Ivy sort out their relationship problems by destroying the Legion of Doom's Moon Base and ruining Lex's 40th birthday, they decided to form the Gotham Sirens, with Catwoman and Oracle a part of their team. Oh and Talia Al Ghul resurrected Nightwing by bathing him in the Lazarus Pit. Drive insane by the Lazarus Pits and thoughts of revenge, Nightwing's new goal is to hunt down Harley and make her pay for killing him.
Meh, that show is a joke. This is better.
Well this story didn’t age well due to Stephanie Brown’s victimization and torture. Plus a lot of characters acted like complete idiotic assholes like Batman for firing Spoiler for very selfish and petty reasons, the GCPD for making Batman into a criminal for the 100th time which is tiring at this point, Stephanie Brown’s mom for being a complete hypocrite and the citizens of Gotham for believing that Batman killed that girl whose father was a known crime lord whose been terrorizing this city for years. Oh and this story is also infamous for completely ruining Leslie Thompkins character by letting Spoiler die from her injuries just to prove a point to Batman. Thankfully Stephanie Brown’s death was retconned 4 years later thanks to a lot of negative backlash.
It always pissed me off they made Steph Robin as a gimmick, because i think it's such a nice addition, at least interesting to see her interacting with the bat...
I wished it was a genuine experiment that respect the characters and not a piece of a plan to kill her off......
It leaves a bad taste in my mouth how mean spirited it is
not gonna lie but I'm excited for you to cover grant morrison's and new 52 batman runs fr
Between this Storyline & Hush is where i was not reading Batman regularly... I watched Batman begins in 05 and got back into the comics later on during the grant Morrison run is where i got excited about the character again.
But War Ganes is one i might read out of morbid curiosity
Great channel, I love the batman content! Any chance for a video on Watchmen in the future? The only graphic novels I ever read were that and The Dark Knight Returns, but both were amazing
I’ve been inundated with comjc book youtubers lately so I didnt realize this channel is just Batman
No worries and welcome!
Is there a lore reason Batman didn't just call the Justice League? Is he stupid?
Batman never calls the League in for help on his cases, and they seldom do the same with very few exceptions. It's kind of baked into the superhero code.
Spot on, Mr. Knight. The lowest point of Batman until Tom King.
Great video as always. It's no surprise to me that a hater of spoiler is the one in charge of this story. Second time it happened. When you with hate, you get hate.
Anyways have you watched the new batman caped crusader
love all your videos gracias !!
and i would love for you to
make a video about
Batman and the Outsiders by Aparo and Barr
thats the best batman of my childhood
Nice, keep up with the batman content. ❤
Great work! Absolutely love your videos.
It`s a little odd, but it looks like almost all of the story arcs you`ve covered lately portray Batman in a... less than flattering light. In almost all of them he acts like a self-absorbed, selfish and abusive jerk (and constantly loses too). I get it that he`s supposed to be a dark and gritty superhero, but it`s as if the DC *really* wanted him (and everyone in Gotham) to suffer during this period.
He talked about it in one of his videos the long time Batman editor Dennis O Neil, who actually cared about the character was fired and DC used that opportunity to ruin the character
The art mostly looks... Terrible! As an artist myself I feel DC didn't know what to do then... And sadly, now.
It’s honestly like Batman art in the 2000s was just terrible with a few assumptions like Cooke, Lee, and Michael Turner
Perfect timing with the omnibus being announced lol
Ah, so it's the Zeb Wells run of Batman. Got it.
wooo great vid
Okay now I want to see Linkara rip the piss out of this story.
It's not bad to humble the bat god every once and a while.
This is the second video that I want to see the most
Wait, what's the first one?
@@SalazarKnight no man’s land
I cant wait for you to talk about the grant morrison Batman run !!
Orpheus straight up looks like a Destiny character.
This was my first introduction to mainstream continuity Batman. Introduced me to Cassandra Cain, Stephanie Brown and Black Mask
I'm laughing so hard at the bat desktop rn 😂😂😂
So we had the good (Knightfall), the middling (No Man's Land) and the godawful (this and most of what follows)... Also, BatBale, for his Marlboro voice, was genuinely likable unlike the Batprick they crapped here...
“Matches Malone” is a hilarious undercover alias.
The warning signs were already showing back in Batman/Punisher: Deadly Knights.
I have always questioned something about an identity crisis. First of all, the story seems to deal with Batman being quite close to the League and at the same time the story tries to punish him for it. For example, apparently Bruce revealed a lot of sensitive information about himself and his friends. allies to members as low as atom who in turn revealed it to his wife since I honestly don't know where she could have gotten that information from and as a curious fact they send her to arcana cylon which sounds strange because there is no well If she already knows all that information and it had already been shown that the league was trying to prevent that information from being released to the public, it wouldn't make any more sense for them to withhold it or for being so kind to erase the memory to prevent it from revealing more secret identities, I mean she apparently knew. about who Superman really is and taking into account that it seems like he knew who team Drake was so nothing stops him from knowing who Batman really is but instead all he does is say she's crazy and leave her in an asylum I can imagine how that ended, fire back, to the heroic community there are other problems but that is honestly one of the ones that I have questioned the most, well that and apparently Barry got consequences free.
Batman making decisions like the meth addict in my apartment building that tells me sheogorath is coming for my toaster
Another Salazar Knight classic
People say this is unrealistic but forget it’s what happened in Portland during covid
Spoilers for the comic!
Fun fact: I read War Games because I saw a meme of Steph/Spoiler saying “Tee hee, I’m gonna start a gang war!”😂and I HAD to know what on earth she was talking about. I was somewhat new to older Batman comics, so I was working my way through random interesting storylines rather than trying any chronological order or anything like that. As a result, my first serious impression of Black Mask was a very, very dark one. He’s actually so scary in war games; whereas sometimes more recently they treat Black Mask like a fringe power trying to work his way up, which was confusing for me after reading war games.
Also, I liked the show Gotham’s take on Black Mask.
I love hearing stories like this one!
Do you take requests? Can you do a video on Ed Brubaker’s Catwoman? Or the Dini run on Detective ? I thought that was better than Morrison’s (But I felt that editorial dictated a lot of it .).
I will definitely talk about Dini's Batman at some point. I can't make any promises about Catwoman, tho.
Im starting to think Batman comics dipped in quality during the 2000s, way before Tom King came in the picture
Oh, yes. There were too many events and crossovers. The worst is when Batman had a nervous breakdown during Infinite Crisis. Him being mindwiped by the Justice League was also a low point . Just really weird and melodramatically overdone stuff .
@matthewschwartz6607 so we have the 2000s editors to thank for this current decline. It's easy to blame it on the current editorial, but the fact is, the work done by Dennis O'Neil during the 80s and 90s was turned to ash
@@jaredgarcia8638
It's funny because Yu believed that the 2000 spinoff was much better in writing and was also in good shape, it had like 7 issues derived from Batman, Catwoman, Robin, Batgirl, Birds of Prey, the Sinister Six, the Huntress mini-series, Dick all in good time and its quality was superior to many Batman stories
War Games Batman is a constant dumbass, getting owned by Black Mask of all people.
Fast forward a few years and Morrison basically makes him Batgod
LOVE THIS STORY
EdgeLords ruin EVERYTHING
One of the worst stories ever. A Tom King caliber failure.
What a messy comic, as always great work!
my pc seems to not like this video first time i tried to watch this it crashed second time it fails to find the page third time it takes half an hour to load before adds start but finally i am getting to watch it o hopefully it was worth it
Batman sometimes is his own worst enemy
Ahh war games, "The Last Jedi" of the Batman series
With a touch of Marvel's Ultimatum
Or more like Kill the Justice League due to Spoiler’s victimization and torture.
we also share a birthday!
Lore of War Games: Batman's Most Humiliating Defeat momentum 100
Jason todd the goat
Yes, YES!
Aug 16 is my bday as well