You and hop have influenced a tremendous amount of my thoughts on gun things. Perfect balance of ‘tism, nuance, and humor. Thanks for the free information and entertainment.
Dear Primary Arms, As a desert dweller like Mr. Facts here, “SPR” scopes are a staple for me. I have a 1-8x PLX-C which is amazing. I also have a GLX 2.5-10 which I like but I’m still left wanting more mag. I’d love to see you expand on this genre of scopes. If you made a lightweight 2-12x PLx (preferably but I’d take a GLX too), I’d buy 3 of them yesterday.
I'm hoping these scopes don't just fog up and die like most scopes do when it's-20 celcius like here in Canada. Anyone from North or South Dakota here in the comments here to comment on durability is cold weather? Cause vortex although durable they fog like crazy all the damn time up here
I own the PA 2.5-10x44. It's quite lovely and I have it assigned to a "Mock" 12 build. It is an existential threat to Prairie Dogs everywhere. Frankly, I think there are only a few use-case scenarios where a higher cost scope would be necessary: 1. You're a competition/professional long range shooter 2. You're an actual sniper (which is basically the same as point #1) 3. You got it for free 4. You have lots of money to burn and a lighter in your pocket. Otherwise, if a 2-10x-ish scope is on your shopping list, you really can't get a better combo of performance/value. There you go, my "professional opinion" that's worth 2 pennies!
@@triggerbarPhD I find it to be no different than any other 2.5-10x44 (or similar). I personally think PA undersells the eye relief numbers. I was trained to shoot nose-to-charging handle. But I don't do that anymore. It's ergonomically un-sound and creates even more issues if you wear body armor. I like my head/neck to be as comfortable/vertical as possible. So, when I set up the scope, I keep my head in nice, natural position (it's an A2 length stock). Doing so will place the ocular lens almost right in-line with the rear of the upper receiver.
I'm making this comment because of the PA scope in your video. Great video, and I'm a new subscriber as of about two weeks ago. Great channel and have enjoyed it thus far! A couple things here and why I chose the New Vortex 3-18 over the New PA 3-18 GLX. Both of these are currently selling for around $750. Though I was able to get the Vortex for about 670 from OP. My personal experience with PA in the past, as far as their scopes go is, I had one 8 years ago that worked fine for my use at the time. I like what they're doing with their reticles. Now I've just built a DMR and I bought two scopes. One was the new Vortex 3-18 x 44, and PA's new 3-18 x 44 in GLX. I had them both for two weeks playing with them, setting them side by side looking through them in different light, sun and clouds, and at the same objects of course. One object at 496 yards and the other at 284 yards. Over the two weeks of deciding which one to send back, my findings where as follows. GLASS... The Vortex had a definite brighter view by at least 1.5 shades I'd say. Now there's no way for me to say exactly, however, it was immediately obvious there was a slight difference. PA's glass is from Japan, and Vortex from China. I'd expect a slightly better brightness. But after talking to a rep from PA he said maybe Vortex is using a different HD coating, IDK. FIELD OF VIEW... At 18 power the Vortex still had a wider field of view at the 496 yard mark by say, 6ft. Though you can look on the websites to confirm each, the FOV difference was noticeable, not just by a foot. THE EYE BOX Both were about the same. TIGHT. Not much wiggle room from either. But felt like the PA scope should have had some wiggle since lets face it, it's a reticle designed for battle and the last thing you want to have to do in a hurry is have to get perfectly aligned before you can see the reticle. A more forgiving eye box on both of these scopes should be designed. PARALLAX. The Vortex was stiff but smooth. Stiff enough I wasn't worried about accidental movement. But smooth enough not to struggle with fine adjustment. The PA however was a different story. Extremely stiff. Stiff enough that It was hard to tell WHEN it was perfect because there wasn't enough smoothness to find that exact point, like you can when it's a little smoother. Some of you might know what I'm talking about if you'd played with parallax long enough. So again, the Vortex to me was better. TURRETS. Here is where PA won, sort of. They definitely feel a little more tactile. The clicks are ever so slightly louder but not to the point of OH WOW. The one thing I didn't like about PA's turrets are that you have to push that triangle where as with the Vortex you lift up and spin. It just seemed to me like that was easier to do, and I knew when I pulled up it was ready to turn. RETICLE. I liked PA's reticle better on the GLX 3-18. I like the design and it's well thought out. We all know Demetri has done and excellent job there. There's a dot every 2.5 mils all the way down the tree and out each side, so it's easy to adjust quickly if you can spot your impact on time to make the correct adjustment. Vortex's reticle is great too, but it has sub tensions horizontally all the way out, where as PA has dots. Also the Vortex dots on down the tree are only provided at 1 mil increments. So you're left guessing if using the tree for a say 3.4 mils down, and 1.7 mil right. But you can extrapelate I guess. Also the PA has wind holds out to I think 6 which is perfect. The Vortex has them out to 10! Who holds ten mils of wind unless you're shooting a mile or in 45 mph wind? This is just being lazy in the design. Vortex could do a lot better. Here's the issue I found. And I have several FFP scopes so I know about reticle size. Although both scopes are 3-18 and FFP, I couldn't use the reticle on the PA scope outside of the chevron, until I got to about 11 power. That's when I could start to see the dots off to the side of the chevron well enough to actually use them, or the ones below. With the Vortex 3-18 I could actually see the lines and read the numbers on the horizontal plane even down to 6! So for me this meant that I could use a much wide band of the zoom than on the PA scope. CONCLUSION So because of the better brightness, the smoother parallax adj., and the ability to actually use a FFP reticle down at 6x, I chose to keep the Vortex and send the PA back. I can't tell you how much I tried to like the PA scope. I really wanted to! But having my evaluations in front of me, I had to make the better choice for me and my intended use. -
I would like to vouch for the PA SLx 3-18x HUD DMR. It’s absolutely amazing IMO. Great zoom range, awesome reticle, and fairly light at about 24 ounces, and in the weight range of some heavier LPVOs.
@@BrassFacts I love the reticle. Perfect for beginners like me. Is great for unknown ranges. The circles are good if you figure what you're looking at is a head-sized target.
I like the openness of the Athlon reticle. I don't need something that can range or hold to a gnats ass, those kinds of reticles tend to distract from the target (for me). It's an example of just enough being better than too much (again, for me).
I did pick up one of their GLx 4-16 with HUD/DMR though and that’s a good one. The chevron is tiny enough to be unobtrusive when trying for those precise 200ish yard shots with a little wind.
The Helos 2-12 does have a zero stop. Perhaps it's a gen 2 thing, though I don't know when those rolled out. Both of mine from the last year have the zero stop, but they don't have the little sharkfin.
Just took my Mk12 Mod0 equipped with a GLX 2.5-10x out to 900 with 15mph gusts. I thought I’d want more magnification but went with that scope at your recommendation and absolutely loved it.
Thanks for another great comparison. Looking forward to the C_Does review and comparison of the Primary Arms GLx 2-10x to the MEOPTA Optika6 3-18x50 prior to making a purchase.
Figured I'd throw my two cents in since I have two of these scopes. I had the GLx 2.5-10 with the Raptor Reticle on mine, but recently bought the Athlon Helos BTR 2-12 to try it out. After handling the two and looking through them both, I'm keeping the Helos and selling the GLx. For me, the glass clarity on the GLx is only marginally better and at range, my Helos is actually slightly crisper. However, the Helos is very finnicky about where you are behind the scope. If you're off by a fraction, you see the shadow. The GLx is a little more forgiving in that regard. Otherwise, they're pretty equal with certain things the Helos does better and certain things the GLx does better. At 2x, the Helos reticle is hard to see against certain backgrounds but is amazing at 12x. The GLx is great at 2.5x, but at 10x, like BF said, it takes up damn near the entire lens. It's nuts. TL;DR - Both of them are excellent scopes and at the end of the day, I think Reticle matters the most between the two. Then, comes down to cost.
I should let Swampfox Kentucky buyers know that the MOA version does not have the "turret numbers not lining up" issue. MOA is king once again, we landed on the moon! 👌👌
Got an L3 Unfilmed WP from Nightline, tube is super clean, thanks for mentioning them, used your code of course. Got here the day after paying, crazy fast devilvery (but I'm on east coast). Same setup from TNVC, 12 weeks back order lol.
Great content, as usual. This has quickly become one of my favorite YT channels over the past six months due to the honesty, humor, and focus on actual products that 99.9% of us will be interested in and use. Been meaning to ask: what is that cover on your weapon light and (more importantly) where did you get it?
1:39 A reticle is the fine lines or fibers in the eyepiece of an optical device but a reticule is archaic for a small hand bag or purse. Sample usage: EOTech's have great a reticle but buying one will lighten your reticule.
As always one of my favorite gun channels to come to for zero bs solutions for poor people. I would love to see you review or just hear your opinions on the Athlon Ares 2.5-15x scope. At a street price similar to the PA 2-10 glx and good stats on paper it seems like potentially the ultimate SPR scope. I've built a 308 in tye spr spirit and now I need glass. Nobody and I mean nobody has a legit field review of it
I bought a swampfox arrowhead and its been solid. Not really a go to for an SPR build but it's been solid and has survived some pretty rough experiences unscathed. it's setup in a roughly SPR esque build but is my hunting rifle in 6.5 grendel and due to living on the Appalachian im not really shooting further than more than 200 yards in a field.
Love the content. Per some of your other SPR videos thought you were going to try little higher magnification. Have you got your hands on the GLX 3-18 for comparison? Trying to decide between the 2.5-10 and the 3-18.
I have the same PA on my M1A Scout Squad using a SADLAK Airborne mount and it’s been great. It’s a 2 MOA rifle on a good day with match ammo so I didn’t feel it necessary to use a premium optic. But I’ve never felt that the scope itself was limiting its accuracy capability. Before everyone starts hating, that rifle is mostly just a fun gun that I’ll occasionally use for deer hunting and not in my top 5 I’d grab for “serious” use for all the reasons.
brownells mpo 3-18, got mine for $799. it doesnt have a locking elevation turret but the turrets are stiff enough that you will not bump it. I personally think a zero stop is more mandatory than locking turrets. reticle is a good middle ground for all magnification ranges, i actually sold my Pa platinum 1-8 (I didnt like the chevron, and i wanted more magnification) and am way happier with the MPO.
I just had to come back to this and comment. I just picked up the Vortex Strike Eagle 3-18 and it’s a piece of glass! It has a locking elevation turret and a capped windage turret. It killed it all the way out to 1400 yards on my Mk12.
A 'reticle', or also known as a graticule, is a pattern of fine lines or markings built into the eyepiece of an optical device such as a telescopic sight, spotting scope, theodolite, optical microscope or the screen of an oscilloscope, to provide measurement references during visual inspections ...... A 'reticule', also known as a ridicule or indispensable, was a type of small handbag or purse, similar to a modern evening bag, used mainly from 1795 to 1820.
I would love a video on the GLx 2-10 vs the PLx 1-8 for a 16" GPR with something resembling a useful option for passive night vision. I would also be happy if you just had some comments you were willing to drop in here on that. For reference, I'm not and never will live in the city.
I get you don’t like Vortex, but the 3-15 Pst gen 2 is superb and comes in under $600 on sale with the EBR2C reticle. Got one during holiday sales and it’s a steal at that price.
I guess the question is: how do you feel about dial-able elevation but capped windage on a 5.56 rifle? Second question: 3-18x offerings when? 😊 so far i think its Vortex and Primary Arms.
that's fine. I rarely dial wind unless im doing stupid shit at like 800+ yards. I have the 3-18x GLx, review in progress. Overall the 2-10x makes more sense for 556.
@@BrassFacts A lot of people who get the LE/MIL/FR discount love the Vortex and talk it up, the rest of us are less excited about vortex because of the cost and they don't get it.
@@J.Young808 it came in a week…I paid a little extra for 5 day shipping I have it mounted might try and site it in today depending on the wind It might be a bit over kill but the price point vs what you get is hard to beat from what I’ve seen….great eye relief… Any questions ask….
Since you’ve already convinced me why lpvo’s suck I went ahead and ordered the brownells mpo 3-18, which some say is a great deal at its normal price of $999 but I just got it on sale for under $700
I've got two of them (a 4-16 and a 6-24) and they are absolute tanks. I would rather get beaten with a police baton than an Arken SH. For the price, I don't think you can beat them if you hit a sale.
This is a really good idea for a video idea! I’ve got more money than a college student but I’m still a father, so seeing the same thing in the under $2k would be awesome.
I'm curious why a 4-16 scope with piggyback red dot wouldn't make a good spr set up, but an acog (4x)with piggyback red dot is functional enough for a gpr
4x on scopes like these don't really behave like 4x on a acog. It depends if you're cool with using the 1x RDS exclusive to about 100 yards. Then the 4-16 is compelling. If you're like me and still would like to use the main scope for as much as possible. Then meh. You also have to consider weight. These scopes are light, and the 4-16x and 3-18x are heavy (VCOG weight)
Love the footage of another south paw operating rifles. I would like to know how you deal with butt too low to ground as I find myself in while hunting. Height of milk crate or less. Do you find some safety switches too long on left side? I run my ambi selector 180 out on right side.
Juuuust toeing the line, on eurooptic anyway, the trijicon credo 2-10x FFP and 2.5-15x SFP come at just under a grand. Worth looking into, I only ever had the 1-6x but was very satisfied I with it.
You need a scope that has a "Christmas tree" reticle. I prefer my BUSHNELL LRTS 4.5 - 18 x 44 with illuminated G# small Xmas tree reticle. It's on a 6.5 PRC Browning X- Bolt for longer range hunting here in Nevada. So G3 reticle with illumination have become my must-haves for hunting. This is because I'm used to an H59 reticle for long range competition.
I’m rocking a Burris fullfield IV 2.5-10 with an offset romio 5. More of a hunting rig but it does a good job reaching out. Damn near spent more money on my mounts
Sidebar: scopes today which target the Civilian market typically have reticles which have ranging and bullet drop compensation features which obscure an understanding for where the rifle is pointed so the buyer who has no interest in learning how to range or apply BDC from such a reticle will not get the desired results from the scope, which is to hit where aimed. So, what to do? Get an ACOG, which is good to mid range. For LR get a NF NXS 3.5-15 x 50 with MOA reticle and dials. Learn MOA and MOA wind constant formula and your set.
Good vid! I've been seriously considering the Swampfox Kentucky Long 2-12X44 and somewhat considering the Bushnell Engage 2.5-10X44, but I've never really delved into Athlon scopes. After watching this, I think I'm going to have to look into the Helos 2-12X42. Is the Kentucky Long's reticle really that hard to see at 2x? The Helos' reticle looks more useable at 2x, yes? Regarding the Swampfox's issue with the indexing points not lining up with the turrets...supposedly they fixed that issue in newer production models...but who knows which one you'll get?
I have the primary arms SLX 4x14 DMR hud on my mock 12 mod h and then a a primary arms GLX 4x16 DMR hud on my 18in SPR..the GLX is enough scope and clarity I will ever need. At least on a 556 platform. Both rifles use piggy back red dots.
What I think knocks this out of the running in this case is the requirement for locking turrets. I also run the SLX 4-14 ARC2, but the turrets don't lock. Another good one is the Arken 4-16x, zero stop, but no locking turrets.
Yes but the GLX 4x16 has a zero lock, so when your zeroed it won't move, but when you dial yes it has the possibility of being bumped. But if you get the hud DMR reticle it is designed to be preferred to not dial and use the bdc and wind calls.
@@rc-pm1fe I run the 4-14 ARC-2, I have a drop chart taped to my stock. I pretty much never dial except maybe windage, but I have exposed turrets. At some level every optic is conglomeration of features from previous iterations that may or may not be in vogue now. This is part of the reason some optics families live longer than others, and the PA 4-14x is at least 8 years old at this point.
@@highdesertdrew1844 yeah, it's a good scope as I said I still run that on my 16 in mock 12, I just upgraded recently for a bit better glass a bit more magnification and an 18in SPR. I think you and I are in the same boat in regards to usage.
I would add that the PA GLX has an obnoxiously large illum knob next to the parallax. I bought one and when I was running drills with gloves on, I constantly switched the illum when I was trying to get at the parallax. Just something to note. Be nice if they had the knob smaller, since most the time people aren't messing with it anyways, but I"m constantly changing parallax.
The glx is missing a center dot based reticle like the swamp fix with mil stadia around it. Yea it's cool you can dial and have locking turrets but there is no stadia for wind holds when dialing.
Thoughts on the 4-16s and 3-18s in this category? Any experience with Primary arms new 3-18 glx. I feel like 3x wouldn’t be that much worse within 100 especially with a 12oclock rds and 18 or 15 would be awesome if at the very least for PID.
Are you done pursuing 2-10x (MPVO) scopes or are there more that are on your list? I’d love to hear your opinions on the new Leupold as well as the SwampFox 2-10 Warhawk (it’s a tier above the Kentucky Long from what I’ve read)
nah I still dabble with them. Some of those are really pricey so it's much harder to justify especially when the interests and utility of these are limited.
The tac tailor 3dap is pretty dope. The talk of margins is applicable but it never once failed me based on my needs in the service and I use it to this day. Pricey but worth it.
Trijicon has so many lightweight options but they have no locking turrets. Some Credos can go for under $1K but they are missing a few things that make them real winners and it hurts.
Would a PA GLX 4-16 be too much? I had the 2-10, just didn’t seem like a lot of magnification. To my eyes I couldn’t see my hits at 100 yards. At least on paper.
I have both. I use the 2.5-10x44 for a 556 rifle - which should be plenty for realistic 556 engagement ranges. I use the 4-16x for a 308. However, if your eyes prefer more magnification, then go for it...there's only a moderate difference in size and weight. Also, the DMR reticle on 4-16 is much better.
You need to review the Marsh 1.5 215. Dual plane scope it may be redo everything on an AR rifle. Yes it is three grand. It’s probably worth it because it’s all of the problems. I might be willing to help you do that review.
You mentioned before that you like the glass on the Burris scopes but you think that the reticle is too thick. They have a few different reticle choices and the RT series has the parallax adjust and also the fin on the zoom.
Have you tried the Maven Rs. 2? It seems quality and for the price and extreme weight savings and it being made with Japanese glass, idk man it seems tempting.
@@BrassFacts True, the reticle does suck. honestly i wish theyd drop something that was in the 2-10 range and had a better reticle, they have a 2.5-15 that has a better reticle but it is obviously much more expensive and outa this vids price range.
id love to see a bit less focus on the 2-10 theres a lot of good options with 3-(12/15/18) or light weight 4-12 / 4-16 scopes that would work awesome in this role or better imo than a 2-10. personally id pick a 3-18 or 4-16
I will say in the Kentucky Long I "MUCH" prefer the MOA reticle. The top 1/3 of the christmas tree illuminates, not just the crosshairs. Making a big pyramid, just throw the tip on target.
So 2.5-10 vs 2-12 is a non issue, or was it not evaluated to that detail. I want to make quick pop-up shots at 30 yards in dark woods and flex to 600y when I pop into a clearing.
Ditto - I have the PLXc as well. Arguably the best LPVO currently on the market. My only complaint is that the eyebox is mercilessly unforgiving. Nonetheless, it trounces other premium scopes that often cost $1k more.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 89 | คู่เอก "ยอดไอคิว vs คิริลล์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Z3vYkHJ_5Ig/mqdefault.jpg)
You and hop have influenced a tremendous amount of my thoughts on gun things. Perfect balance of ‘tism, nuance, and humor.
Thanks for the free information and entertainment.
This combined with the gentle guitar chords at the end of the video.... I almost shed a tear
This guy gets it
Dear Primary Arms,
As a desert dweller like Mr. Facts here, “SPR” scopes are a staple for me. I have a 1-8x PLX-C which is amazing. I also have a GLX 2.5-10 which I like but I’m still left wanting more mag.
I’d love to see you expand on this genre of scopes. If you made a lightweight 2-12x PLx (preferably but I’d take a GLX too), I’d buy 3 of them yesterday.
You you mind if you lose some magnification on the low end? Pretty sure PA makes a 4-14x.
brownells MPO 3-18 is like 800 bucks and i love it
@@DevDog67 they also make a 3-18x...
I'm hoping these scopes don't just fog up and die like most scopes do when it's-20 celcius like here in Canada. Anyone from North or South Dakota here in the comments here to comment on durability is cold weather?
Cause vortex although durable they fog like crazy all the damn time up here
As always, thank you when you consider content for us poors.
I hate arizona
No no no it’s us “working poor” lol.
I know it doesn’t fall within this list, but the Leupold Mark5HD 3.6-18 has been really solid for me for the last few years
So... You're saying the best "SPR" (debatable #1 vs NF offering) scope has been solid for you? 😂
@@rphash49bros like “I know it doesn’t fall within this list of sub 1000 ar’s but the knights armament sr15 has been incredibly reliable for me”
@@rphash49budget has entered the chat
For Under $1000
I own the PA 2.5-10x44. It's quite lovely and I have it assigned to a "Mock" 12 build. It is an existential threat to Prairie Dogs everywhere.
Frankly, I think there are only a few use-case scenarios where a higher cost scope would be necessary:
1. You're a competition/professional long range shooter
2. You're an actual sniper (which is basically the same as point #1)
3. You got it for free
4. You have lots of money to burn and a lighter in your pocket.
Otherwise, if a 2-10x-ish scope is on your shopping list, you really can't get a better combo of performance/value. There you go, my "professional opinion" that's worth 2 pennies!
What is the model or designation?
@@J.Young808 Primary Arms GLx 2.5-10x44
Is the eye box bad? It claims 2.7-2.8" eye relief. Most are good at 3.6-4". Seems like you are going to be right in there or you see nothing...
@@triggerbarPhD I find it to be no different than any other 2.5-10x44 (or similar). I personally think PA undersells the eye relief numbers. I was trained to shoot nose-to-charging handle. But I don't do that anymore. It's ergonomically un-sound and creates even more issues if you wear body armor. I like my head/neck to be as comfortable/vertical as possible. So, when I set up the scope, I keep my head in nice, natural position (it's an A2 length stock). Doing so will place the ocular lens almost right in-line with the rear of the upper receiver.
@@charlesm.2756 thanks a bunch on for this!!
I'm making this comment because of the PA scope in your video. Great video, and I'm a new subscriber as of about two weeks ago. Great channel and have enjoyed it thus far!
A couple things here and why I chose the New Vortex 3-18 over the New PA 3-18 GLX. Both of these are currently selling for around $750. Though I was able to get the Vortex for about 670 from OP. My personal experience with PA in the past, as far as their scopes go is, I had one 8 years ago that worked fine for my use at the time. I like what they're doing with their reticles. Now I've just built a DMR and I bought two scopes. One was the new Vortex 3-18 x 44, and PA's new 3-18 x 44 in GLX. I had them both for two weeks playing with them, setting them side by side looking through them in different light, sun and clouds, and at the same objects of course. One object at 496 yards and the other at 284 yards. Over the two weeks of deciding which one to send back, my findings where as follows.
GLASS... The Vortex had a definite brighter view by at least 1.5 shades I'd say. Now there's no way for me to say exactly, however, it was immediately obvious there was a slight difference. PA's glass is from Japan, and Vortex from China. I'd expect a slightly better brightness. But after talking to a rep from PA he said maybe Vortex is using a different HD coating, IDK.
FIELD OF VIEW... At 18 power the Vortex still had a wider field of view at the 496 yard mark by say, 6ft. Though you can look on the websites to confirm each, the FOV difference was noticeable, not just by a foot.
THE EYE BOX
Both were about the same. TIGHT. Not much wiggle room from either. But felt like the PA scope should have had some wiggle since lets face it, it's a reticle designed for battle and the last thing you want to have to do in a hurry is have to get perfectly aligned before you can see the reticle. A more forgiving eye box on both of these scopes should be designed.
PARALLAX. The Vortex was stiff but smooth. Stiff enough I wasn't worried about accidental movement. But smooth enough not to struggle with fine adjustment. The PA however was a different story. Extremely stiff. Stiff enough that It was hard to tell WHEN it was perfect because there wasn't enough smoothness to find that exact point, like you can when it's a little smoother. Some of you might know what I'm talking about if you'd played with parallax long enough. So again, the Vortex to me was better.
TURRETS. Here is where PA won, sort of. They definitely feel a little more tactile. The clicks are ever so slightly louder but not to the point of OH WOW. The one thing I didn't like about PA's turrets are that you have to push that triangle where as with the Vortex you lift up and spin. It just seemed to me like that was easier to do, and I knew when I pulled up it was ready to turn.
RETICLE.
I liked PA's reticle better on the GLX 3-18. I like the design and it's well thought out. We all know Demetri has done and excellent job there. There's a dot every 2.5 mils all the way down the tree and out each side, so it's easy to adjust quickly if you can spot your impact on time to make the correct adjustment. Vortex's reticle is great too, but it has sub tensions horizontally all the way out, where as PA has dots. Also the Vortex dots on down the tree are only provided at 1 mil increments. So you're left guessing if using the tree for a say 3.4 mils down, and 1.7 mil right. But you can extrapelate I guess. Also the PA has wind holds out to I think 6 which is perfect. The Vortex has them out to 10! Who holds ten mils of wind unless you're shooting a mile or in 45 mph wind? This is just being lazy in the design. Vortex could do a lot better.
Here's the issue I found. And I have several FFP scopes so I know about reticle size. Although both scopes are 3-18 and FFP, I couldn't use the reticle on the PA scope outside of the chevron, until I got to about 11 power. That's when I could start to see the dots off to the side of the chevron well enough to actually use them, or the ones below. With the Vortex 3-18 I could actually see the lines and read the numbers on the horizontal plane even down to 6! So for me this meant that I could use a much wide band of the zoom than on the PA scope.
CONCLUSION
So because of the better brightness, the smoother parallax adj., and the ability to actually use a FFP reticle down at 6x, I chose to keep the Vortex and send the PA back. I can't tell you how much I tried to like the PA scope. I really wanted to! But having my evaluations in front of me, I had to make the better choice for me and my intended use.
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The slight stumble under NV at 12:58 cracked me up haha
I would like to vouch for the PA SLx 3-18x HUD DMR. It’s absolutely amazing IMO. Great zoom range, awesome reticle, and fairly light at about 24 ounces, and in the weight range of some heavier LPVOs.
it's a weird reticle, but I think it's good.
I actually have one.
@@BrassFacts I love the reticle. Perfect for beginners like me. Is great for unknown ranges. The circles are good if you figure what you're looking at is a head-sized target.
Shit looked like alien hieroglyphics to me.
Shit says 32 oz on the website?
@@mynamejef7963 They have a new one that’s much heavier now. I guess the one I have is no longer in production.
Walked into the store and got a blem 2.5-10x GLX for $450 after tax. Hella worth. Hard to beat even at full price.
I like the openness of the Athlon reticle. I don't need something that can range or hold to a gnats ass, those kinds of reticles tend to distract from the target (for me). It's an example of just enough being better than too much (again, for me).
I did pick up one of their GLx 4-16 with HUD/DMR though and that’s a good one. The chevron is tiny enough to be unobtrusive when trying for those precise 200ish yard shots with a little wind.
Brass facts is the bees knees, keep it up bud.
The Helos 2-12 does have a zero stop. Perhaps it's a gen 2 thing, though I don't know when those rolled out. Both of mine from the last year have the zero stop, but they don't have the little sharkfin.
Just took my Mk12 Mod0 equipped with a GLX 2.5-10x out to 900 with 15mph gusts. I thought I’d want more magnification but went with that scope at your recommendation and absolutely loved it.
But can you take out 3 drones in under 30 seconds with it?
Thanks for another great comparison. Looking forward to the C_Does review and comparison of the Primary Arms GLx 2-10x to the MEOPTA Optika6 3-18x50 prior to making a purchase.
NM - The MEOPTA Optika6 3-18x50 weights 29.9 oz. Looks like the PA GLx is a better choice.
"reticle" - a series of fine lines or fibers in the eyepiece of an optical device.
"reticule" - a woman's small handbag
U make all the difference ❤
Recently ordered a Athlon helos. Came with a throw lever for magnification, and two dust covers plus a 3 inch tube extension.
Figured I'd throw my two cents in since I have two of these scopes. I had the GLx 2.5-10 with the Raptor Reticle on mine, but recently bought the Athlon Helos BTR 2-12 to try it out.
After handling the two and looking through them both, I'm keeping the Helos and selling the GLx. For me, the glass clarity on the GLx is only marginally better and at range, my Helos is actually slightly crisper. However, the Helos is very finnicky about where you are behind the scope. If you're off by a fraction, you see the shadow. The GLx is a little more forgiving in that regard. Otherwise, they're pretty equal with certain things the Helos does better and certain things the GLx does better. At 2x, the Helos reticle is hard to see against certain backgrounds but is amazing at 12x. The GLx is great at 2.5x, but at 10x, like BF said, it takes up damn near the entire lens. It's nuts.
TL;DR - Both of them are excellent scopes and at the end of the day, I think Reticle matters the most between the two. Then, comes down to cost.
How much you selling for?
athlon's site says the helos has a zero stop, does yours? was it added in the 2nd gen? curious to know as I'll be getting mine next week
I should let Swampfox Kentucky buyers know that the MOA version does not have the "turret numbers not lining up" issue. MOA is king once again, we landed on the moon! 👌👌
MOA GANG GANG
Supposedly Swampfox corrected the turret issue on the newer production models.
Got an L3 Unfilmed WP from Nightline, tube is super clean, thanks for mentioning them, used your code of course. Got here the day after paying, crazy fast devilvery (but I'm on east coast). Same setup from TNVC, 12 weeks back order lol.
Great content, as usual. This has quickly become one of my favorite YT channels over the past six months due to the honesty, humor, and focus on actual products that 99.9% of us will be interested in and use.
Been meaning to ask: what is that cover on your weapon light and (more importantly) where did you get it?
Might be the onehundered concepts light cap. And thanks man
This is why I get up on Friday’s because brasshop is my favorite thing in the world
1:39 A reticle is the fine lines or fibers in the eyepiece of an optical device but a reticule is archaic for a small hand bag or purse.
Sample usage: EOTech's have great a reticle but buying one will lighten your reticule.
As always one of my favorite gun channels to come to for zero bs solutions for poor people. I would love to see you review or just hear your opinions on the Athlon Ares 2.5-15x scope. At a street price similar to the PA 2-10 glx and good stats on paper it seems like potentially the ultimate SPR scope. I've built a 308 in tye spr spirit and now I need glass. Nobody and I mean nobody has a legit field review of it
Picked up a PST viper 2.5-10 for $400 used on my “SPR” build. Things nice, but that Kentucky long is *chefs kiss
I bought a swampfox arrowhead and its been solid. Not really a go to for an SPR build but it's been solid and has survived some pretty rough experiences unscathed. it's setup in a roughly SPR esque build but is my hunting rifle in 6.5 grendel and due to living on the Appalachian im not really shooting further than more than 200 yards in a field.
Thanks for your candid review, guess I’ll be stepping up my glass
Thank you for this video! I’ve been wanting a video like this
Love the content. Per some of your other SPR videos thought you were going to try little higher magnification. Have you got your hands on the GLX 3-18 for comparison? Trying to decide between the 2.5-10 and the 3-18.
yep im working on the review for it right now
It's nice, but man is it heavy.
I have the same PA on my M1A Scout Squad using a SADLAK Airborne mount and it’s been great. It’s a 2 MOA rifle on a good day with match ammo so I didn’t feel it necessary to use a premium optic. But I’ve never felt that the scope itself was limiting its accuracy capability. Before everyone starts hating, that rifle is mostly just a fun gun that I’ll occasionally use for deer hunting and not in my top 5 I’d grab for “serious” use for all the reasons.
Picked up the Kentucky Long 2-12 (MIL) for $350 on their site. Nothing beats it at that price point.
Did you get the Sharpshooter MIL or the RECCE MIL reticle? How do you like the scope?
Happy to see a swamp fox talked about a never hear anyone really review their stuff and I think their staff is great.
brownells mpo 3-18, got mine for $799. it doesnt have a locking elevation turret but the turrets are stiff enough that you will not bump it. I personally think a zero stop is more mandatory than locking turrets. reticle is a good middle ground for all magnification ranges, i actually sold my Pa platinum 1-8 (I didnt like the chevron, and i wanted more magnification) and am way happier with the MPO.
PSR sent me over here. I look forward to your content!
I just had to come back to this and comment. I just picked up the Vortex Strike Eagle 3-18 and it’s a piece of glass! It has a locking elevation turret and a capped windage turret. It killed it all the way out to 1400 yards on my Mk12.
Oh and it’s $700
A 'reticle', or also known as a graticule, is a pattern of fine lines or markings built into the eyepiece of an optical device such as a telescopic sight, spotting scope, theodolite, optical microscope or the screen of an oscilloscope, to provide measurement references during visual inspections ...... A 'reticule', also known as a ridicule or indispensable, was a type of small handbag or purse, similar to a modern evening bag, used mainly from 1795 to 1820.
I would love a video on the GLx 2-10 vs the PLx 1-8 for a 16" GPR with something resembling a useful option for passive night vision. I would also be happy if you just had some comments you were willing to drop in here on that. For reference, I'm not and never will live in the city.
I get you don’t like Vortex, but the 3-15 Pst gen 2 is superb and comes in under $600 on sale with the EBR2C reticle. Got one during holiday sales and it’s a steal at that price.
I guess the question is: how do you feel about dial-able elevation but capped windage on a 5.56 rifle?
Second question: 3-18x offerings when? 😊 so far i think its Vortex and Primary Arms.
that's fine. I rarely dial wind unless im doing stupid shit at like 800+ yards.
I have the 3-18x GLx, review in progress. Overall the 2-10x makes more sense for 556.
@@BrassFacts What about for a Grendal?
@@Jazz3006 I was excited for the 3-18 but it is a decent bit heavier than both the 2.5-10 and the 4-16 which is off putting
@@zubysaboss1062 which means it's WAY heavier than the PLXc. But, for me, the grendel was always going to be a mid-range setup anyway
vortex is best bang for buck imho. thanks for these videos! Love your channel
none of the vortex's in this cost range have locked turrets.
@@BrassFacts exactly why I don't like mine!
@@BrassFacts A lot of people who get the LE/MIL/FR discount love the Vortex and talk it up, the rest of us are less excited about vortex because of the cost and they don't get it.
@@highdesertdrew1844 facts
Ultra budget primary arms 4-14 ACSS HUD/DMR 5.56 NATO at optics planets under 210 “blazing hot deal”
Or 189 at Dvor.
I’m well pleased with mine.
Do you have it yet/how king have you been waiting for it?
@@J.Young808 it came in a week…I paid a little extra for 5 day shipping
I have it mounted might try and site it in today depending on the wind
It might be a bit over kill but the price point vs what you get is hard to beat from what I’ve seen….great eye relief…
Any questions ask….
@@J.Young808 its 189 at Dvor currently on their opmod specials …. Might have to make an account
Since you’ve already convinced me why lpvo’s suck I went ahead and ordered the brownells mpo 3-18, which some say is a great deal at its normal price of $999 but I just got it on sale for under $700
In my experience the Arken SH 4-16 MIL is pretty good. Great turrets, solid build. Heavy AF but that’s the only real downside.
I've got two of them (a 4-16 and a 6-24) and they are absolute tanks. I would rather get beaten with a police baton than an Arken SH. For the price, I don't think you can beat them if you hit a sale.
Gawd I love the glx. Worth its weight in rangoons no doubt.
This is a really good idea for a video idea! I’ve got more money than a college student but I’m still a father, so seeing the same thing in the under $2k would be awesome.
Loving the 80s montage
I'm curious why a 4-16 scope with piggyback red dot wouldn't make a good spr set up, but an acog (4x)with piggyback red dot is functional enough for a gpr
4x on scopes like these don't really behave like 4x on a acog.
It depends if you're cool with using the 1x RDS exclusive to about 100 yards. Then the 4-16 is compelling.
If you're like me and still would like to use the main scope for as much as possible. Then meh.
You also have to consider weight. These scopes are light, and the 4-16x and 3-18x are heavy (VCOG weight)
Love the footage of another south paw operating rifles. I would like to know how you deal with butt too low to ground as I find myself in while hunting. Height of milk crate or less. Do you find some safety switches too long on left side? I run my ambi selector 180 out on right side.
I think im going to get the PA 2-10 for a spr type rifle im building using a Criterion Core 16" barrel as the base.
Juuuust toeing the line, on eurooptic anyway, the trijicon credo 2-10x FFP and 2.5-15x SFP come at just under a grand. Worth looking into, I only ever had the 1-6x but was very satisfied I with it.
You need a scope that has a "Christmas tree" reticle. I prefer my BUSHNELL LRTS 4.5 - 18 x 44 with illuminated G# small Xmas tree reticle. It's on a 6.5 PRC Browning X- Bolt for longer range hunting here in Nevada. So G3 reticle with illumination have become my must-haves for hunting. This is because I'm used to an H59 reticle for long range competition.
I’m rocking a Burris fullfield IV 2.5-10 with an offset romio 5. More of a hunting rig but it does a good job reaching out. Damn near spent more money on my mounts
You absolutely need to review/include the Meopta Optika 6 3-18X. It's incredible!
Sidebar: scopes today which target the Civilian market typically have reticles which have ranging and bullet drop compensation features which obscure an understanding for where the rifle is pointed so the buyer who has no interest in learning how to range or apply BDC from such a reticle will not get the desired results from the scope, which is to hit where aimed. So, what to do? Get an ACOG, which is good to mid range. For LR get a NF NXS 3.5-15 x 50 with MOA reticle and dials. Learn MOA and MOA wind constant formula and your set.
I hate to be that guy, but if these auto ranging features come off as "obscure" to you. You might have gotten the short straw in life.
I would love to see a 2-12 or 1.7-10 (ish) PA platinum under 19oz
New ruck pack breakdown soon ?? Kudos the camo you look like a professional
Good vid! I've been seriously considering the Swampfox Kentucky Long 2-12X44 and somewhat considering the Bushnell Engage 2.5-10X44, but I've never really delved into Athlon scopes. After watching this, I think I'm going to have to look into the Helos 2-12X42. Is the Kentucky Long's reticle really that hard to see at 2x? The Helos' reticle looks more useable at 2x, yes? Regarding the Swampfox's issue with the indexing points not lining up with the turrets...supposedly they fixed that issue in newer production models...but who knows which one you'll get?
I just became aware of the SIG Tango MSR 2-12X44 which would fit into the comparison category. I wonder how it would stack up.
I feel like monstrum tactical should be a part of this conversation
Strong opening, love it
You finally got the 360 stick cam like D34! 🙌
I have the primary arms SLX 4x14 DMR hud on my mock 12 mod h and then a a primary arms GLX 4x16 DMR hud on my 18in SPR..the GLX is enough scope and clarity I will ever need. At least on a 556 platform. Both rifles use piggy back red dots.
What I think knocks this out of the running in this case is the requirement for locking turrets. I also run the SLX 4-14 ARC2, but the turrets don't lock. Another good one is the Arken 4-16x, zero stop, but no locking turrets.
Yes but the GLX 4x16 has a zero lock, so when your zeroed it won't move, but when you dial yes it has the possibility of being bumped. But if you get the hud DMR reticle it is designed to be preferred to not dial and use the bdc and wind calls.
@@rc-pm1fe I run the 4-14 ARC-2, I have a drop chart taped to my stock. I pretty much never dial except maybe windage, but I have exposed turrets. At some level every optic is conglomeration of features from previous iterations that may or may not be in vogue now. This is part of the reason some optics families live longer than others, and the PA 4-14x is at least 8 years old at this point.
@@highdesertdrew1844 yeah, it's a good scope as I said I still run that on my 16 in mock 12, I just upgraded recently for a bit better glass a bit more magnification and an 18in SPR. I think you and I are in the same boat in regards to usage.
@@rc-pm1fe 100% I'm sticking with the 16in, but looking at the Arken 4-16 I just want something with better illumination than the Arken.
Dude! That intro was sweet!
I would add that the PA GLX has an obnoxiously large illum knob next to the parallax. I bought one and when I was running drills with gloves on, I constantly switched the illum when I was trying to get at the parallax. Just something to note. Be nice if they had the knob smaller, since most the time people aren't messing with it anyways, but I"m constantly changing parallax.
i've also used the illum on the GLx like once.
It honestly could do with out it.
@@BrassFacts Agreed. It wasn't a deal breaker, but could be Gen 2 update, or offer it without illum.
What is the equipment used to mount the 509 at the 12 o’clock in the dumb nail?
Ngl, this came out at kind of a decent time, I've honestly been wanting to move into a SPR setup due to where I live.
The glx is missing a center dot based reticle like the swamp fix with mil stadia around it. Yea it's cool you can dial and have locking turrets but there is no stadia for wind holds when dialing.
Super Hyper-Caffeinated Intro Brass Facts® is *_BEST_* Brass Facts®
Just my personal opinion but I value turret repeatability over everything. It's hard to find a repeatable non locking turret under 1k
Arken if you can stand the weight. Thing is an absolute brick
Can you do best spr scopes over $1000?
If you or Hop could review the new 2-10x Mark 5 that’d be great, mkay.
Thoughts on the 4-16s and 3-18s in this category? Any experience with Primary arms new 3-18 glx. I feel like 3x wouldn’t be that much worse within 100 especially with a 12oclock rds and 18 or 15 would be awesome if at the very least for PID.
the 3-18 is really good for shooting farish.
That 18x is nice.
But it's a lot of weight for a capability im not entirely sold on as needed.
@@BrassFacts gotcha
I wanna know how many mags you leave out there. I finally painted a
hi-vis orange spot on my mags so I can find them after conducting drills.
Are you done pursuing 2-10x (MPVO) scopes or are there more that are on your list? I’d love to hear your opinions on the new Leupold as well as the SwampFox 2-10 Warhawk (it’s a tier above the Kentucky Long from what I’ve read)
nah I still dabble with them. Some of those are really pricey so it's much harder to justify especially when the interests and utility of these are limited.
I managed to find the same Bushnell scope on sale for a good price except it it was in mils and had the tree.... Seems like I hit a home run
The tac tailor 3dap is pretty dope. The talk of margins is applicable but it never once failed me based on my needs in the service and I use it to this day. Pricey but worth it.
Much power, very optic.
Good video as always
The Meopta optika6 3-18 is my favorite in this category
Trijicon has so many lightweight options but they have no locking turrets. Some Credos can go for under $1K but they are missing a few things that make them real winners and it hurts.
Would a PA GLX 4-16 be too much? I had the 2-10, just didn’t seem like a lot of magnification. To my eyes I couldn’t see my hits at 100 yards. At least on paper.
I'm reviewing the 3-18x atm. 16 is right at the cusp. will depend on how much you can rely on the RDS for close/medium range.
I have both. I use the 2.5-10x44 for a 556 rifle - which should be plenty for realistic 556 engagement ranges. I use the 4-16x for a 308. However, if your eyes prefer more magnification, then go for it...there's only a moderate difference in size and weight. Also, the DMR reticle on 4-16 is much better.
@@charlesm.2756 yeah I wasn’t crazy about the 2-10, I have a 6-26 GLX that I’m going to put on a bolt action. Thinking the 4-16 may be a better fit.
You need to review the Marsh 1.5 215. Dual plane scope it may be redo everything on an AR rifle. Yes it is three grand. It’s probably worth it because it’s all of the problems. I might be willing to help you do that review.
Brassfacts Friday🎉
You mentioned before that you like the glass on the Burris scopes but you think that the reticle is too thick. They have a few different reticle choices and the RT series has the parallax adjust and also the fin on the zoom.
Have you tried the Maven Rs. 2? It seems quality and for the price and extreme weight savings and it being made with Japanese glass, idk man it seems tempting.
capped turrets? and the reticle doesn't seem to be all that good for holding. Seems like a hunting scope.
@@BrassFacts True, the reticle does suck. honestly i wish theyd drop something that was in the 2-10 range and had a better reticle, they have a 2.5-15 that has a better reticle but it is obviously much more expensive and outa this vids price range.
Come for content, stay for doggo
How about the US Optics TS-12X?
You and Hop are becoming such bros that you even talk the same.
Swampfox Warhawk 2-10 is an upgrade from KL 2-12. Look into that one.
Vortex 3-18 strike eagle would be a good shout these days.
Brass had his sugar cereal before filming this intro
Sick 90s video game intro music
If only the trijicon credo 2.5-10 had side parallax, then it would be a top contender in this comparison.
Try a Bushnell ar optics 3-9x. Got one for a truck gun... I like it
id love to see a bit less focus on the 2-10 theres a lot of good options with 3-(12/15/18) or light weight 4-12 / 4-16 scopes that would work awesome in this role or better imo than a 2-10. personally id pick a 3-18 or 4-16
Turret click ASMR video when?
any 3/3.5-15's in the same price range you recommend? Looking for just that little extra bit of PID at range
I will say in the Kentucky Long I "MUCH" prefer the MOA reticle. The top 1/3 of the christmas tree illuminates, not just the crosshairs. Making a big pyramid, just throw the tip on target.
I'm saving up for nice glass. Until then my .308 will get by with a 1-6x.
So 2.5-10 vs 2-12 is a non issue, or was it not evaluated to that detail. I want to make quick pop-up shots at 30 yards in dark woods and flex to 600y when I pop into a clearing.
Love the primary arms PLxC 1-8...that is all. Oh also, how awesome would a 2.5-15x44 23 ounce, 13 inch PLX primary arms scope be....
Ditto - I have the PLXc as well. Arguably the best LPVO currently on the market. My only complaint is that the eyebox is mercilessly unforgiving. Nonetheless, it trounces other premium scopes that often cost $1k more.