You and hop have influenced a tremendous amount of my thoughts on gun things. Perfect balance of ‘tism, nuance, and humor. Thanks for the free information and entertainment.
Dear Primary Arms, As a desert dweller like Mr. Facts here, “SPR” scopes are a staple for me. I have a 1-8x PLX-C which is amazing. I also have a GLX 2.5-10 which I like but I’m still left wanting more mag. I’d love to see you expand on this genre of scopes. If you made a lightweight 2-12x PLx (preferably but I’d take a GLX too), I’d buy 3 of them yesterday.
I'm hoping these scopes don't just fog up and die like most scopes do when it's-20 celcius like here in Canada. Anyone from North or South Dakota here in the comments here to comment on durability is cold weather? Cause vortex although durable they fog like crazy all the damn time up here
I own the PA 2.5-10x44. It's quite lovely and I have it assigned to a "Mock" 12 build. It is an existential threat to Prairie Dogs everywhere. Frankly, I think there are only a few use-case scenarios where a higher cost scope would be necessary: 1. You're a competition/professional long range shooter 2. You're an actual sniper (which is basically the same as point #1) 3. You got it for free 4. You have lots of money to burn and a lighter in your pocket. Otherwise, if a 2-10x-ish scope is on your shopping list, you really can't get a better combo of performance/value. There you go, my "professional opinion" that's worth 2 pennies!
@@triggerbarPhD I find it to be no different than any other 2.5-10x44 (or similar). I personally think PA undersells the eye relief numbers. I was trained to shoot nose-to-charging handle. But I don't do that anymore. It's ergonomically un-sound and creates even more issues if you wear body armor. I like my head/neck to be as comfortable/vertical as possible. So, when I set up the scope, I keep my head in nice, natural position (it's an A2 length stock). Doing so will place the ocular lens almost right in-line with the rear of the upper receiver.
I'm making this comment because of the PA scope in your video. Great video, and I'm a new subscriber as of about two weeks ago. Great channel and have enjoyed it thus far! A couple things here and why I chose the New Vortex 3-18 over the New PA 3-18 GLX. Both of these are currently selling for around $750. Though I was able to get the Vortex for about 670 from OP. My personal experience with PA in the past, as far as their scopes go is, I had one 8 years ago that worked fine for my use at the time. I like what they're doing with their reticles. Now I've just built a DMR and I bought two scopes. One was the new Vortex 3-18 x 44, and PA's new 3-18 x 44 in GLX. I had them both for two weeks playing with them, setting them side by side looking through them in different light, sun and clouds, and at the same objects of course. One object at 496 yards and the other at 284 yards. Over the two weeks of deciding which one to send back, my findings where as follows. GLASS... The Vortex had a definite brighter view by at least 1.5 shades I'd say. Now there's no way for me to say exactly, however, it was immediately obvious there was a slight difference. PA's glass is from Japan, and Vortex from China. I'd expect a slightly better brightness. But after talking to a rep from PA he said maybe Vortex is using a different HD coating, IDK. FIELD OF VIEW... At 18 power the Vortex still had a wider field of view at the 496 yard mark by say, 6ft. Though you can look on the websites to confirm each, the FOV difference was noticeable, not just by a foot. THE EYE BOX Both were about the same. TIGHT. Not much wiggle room from either. But felt like the PA scope should have had some wiggle since lets face it, it's a reticle designed for battle and the last thing you want to have to do in a hurry is have to get perfectly aligned before you can see the reticle. A more forgiving eye box on both of these scopes should be designed. PARALLAX. The Vortex was stiff but smooth. Stiff enough I wasn't worried about accidental movement. But smooth enough not to struggle with fine adjustment. The PA however was a different story. Extremely stiff. Stiff enough that It was hard to tell WHEN it was perfect because there wasn't enough smoothness to find that exact point, like you can when it's a little smoother. Some of you might know what I'm talking about if you'd played with parallax long enough. So again, the Vortex to me was better. TURRETS. Here is where PA won, sort of. They definitely feel a little more tactile. The clicks are ever so slightly louder but not to the point of OH WOW. The one thing I didn't like about PA's turrets are that you have to push that triangle where as with the Vortex you lift up and spin. It just seemed to me like that was easier to do, and I knew when I pulled up it was ready to turn. RETICLE. I liked PA's reticle better on the GLX 3-18. I like the design and it's well thought out. We all know Demetri has done and excellent job there. There's a dot every 2.5 mils all the way down the tree and out each side, so it's easy to adjust quickly if you can spot your impact on time to make the correct adjustment. Vortex's reticle is great too, but it has sub tensions horizontally all the way out, where as PA has dots. Also the Vortex dots on down the tree are only provided at 1 mil increments. So you're left guessing if using the tree for a say 3.4 mils down, and 1.7 mil right. But you can extrapelate I guess. Also the PA has wind holds out to I think 6 which is perfect. The Vortex has them out to 10! Who holds ten mils of wind unless you're shooting a mile or in 45 mph wind? This is just being lazy in the design. Vortex could do a lot better. Here's the issue I found. And I have several FFP scopes so I know about reticle size. Although both scopes are 3-18 and FFP, I couldn't use the reticle on the PA scope outside of the chevron, until I got to about 11 power. That's when I could start to see the dots off to the side of the chevron well enough to actually use them, or the ones below. With the Vortex 3-18 I could actually see the lines and read the numbers on the horizontal plane even down to 6! So for me this meant that I could use a much wide band of the zoom than on the PA scope. CONCLUSION So because of the better brightness, the smoother parallax adj., and the ability to actually use a FFP reticle down at 6x, I chose to keep the Vortex and send the PA back. I can't tell you how much I tried to like the PA scope. I really wanted to! But having my evaluations in front of me, I had to make the better choice for me and my intended use. -
I like the openness of the Athlon reticle. I don't need something that can range or hold to a gnats ass, those kinds of reticles tend to distract from the target (for me). It's an example of just enough being better than too much (again, for me).
I would like to vouch for the PA SLx 3-18x HUD DMR. It’s absolutely amazing IMO. Great zoom range, awesome reticle, and fairly light at about 24 ounces, and in the weight range of some heavier LPVOs.
@@BrassFacts I love the reticle. Perfect for beginners like me. Is great for unknown ranges. The circles are good if you figure what you're looking at is a head-sized target.
Just took my Mk12 Mod0 equipped with a GLX 2.5-10x out to 900 with 15mph gusts. I thought I’d want more magnification but went with that scope at your recommendation and absolutely loved it.
I did pick up one of their GLx 4-16 with HUD/DMR though and that’s a good one. The chevron is tiny enough to be unobtrusive when trying for those precise 200ish yard shots with a little wind.
The Helos 2-12 does have a zero stop. Perhaps it's a gen 2 thing, though I don't know when those rolled out. Both of mine from the last year have the zero stop, but they don't have the little sharkfin.
Great content, as usual. This has quickly become one of my favorite YT channels over the past six months due to the honesty, humor, and focus on actual products that 99.9% of us will be interested in and use. Been meaning to ask: what is that cover on your weapon light and (more importantly) where did you get it?
Thanks for another great comparison. Looking forward to the C_Does review and comparison of the Primary Arms GLx 2-10x to the MEOPTA Optika6 3-18x50 prior to making a purchase.
As always one of my favorite gun channels to come to for zero bs solutions for poor people. I would love to see you review or just hear your opinions on the Athlon Ares 2.5-15x scope. At a street price similar to the PA 2-10 glx and good stats on paper it seems like potentially the ultimate SPR scope. I've built a 308 in tye spr spirit and now I need glass. Nobody and I mean nobody has a legit field review of it
I should let Swampfox Kentucky buyers know that the MOA version does not have the "turret numbers not lining up" issue. MOA is king once again, we landed on the moon! 👌👌
Figured I'd throw my two cents in since I have two of these scopes. I had the GLx 2.5-10 with the Raptor Reticle on mine, but recently bought the Athlon Helos BTR 2-12 to try it out. After handling the two and looking through them both, I'm keeping the Helos and selling the GLx. For me, the glass clarity on the GLx is only marginally better and at range, my Helos is actually slightly crisper. However, the Helos is very finnicky about where you are behind the scope. If you're off by a fraction, you see the shadow. The GLx is a little more forgiving in that regard. Otherwise, they're pretty equal with certain things the Helos does better and certain things the GLx does better. At 2x, the Helos reticle is hard to see against certain backgrounds but is amazing at 12x. The GLx is great at 2.5x, but at 10x, like BF said, it takes up damn near the entire lens. It's nuts. TL;DR - Both of them are excellent scopes and at the end of the day, I think Reticle matters the most between the two. Then, comes down to cost.
Got an L3 Unfilmed WP from Nightline, tube is super clean, thanks for mentioning them, used your code of course. Got here the day after paying, crazy fast devilvery (but I'm on east coast). Same setup from TNVC, 12 weeks back order lol.
1:39 A reticle is the fine lines or fibers in the eyepiece of an optical device but a reticule is archaic for a small hand bag or purse. Sample usage: EOTech's have great a reticle but buying one will lighten your reticule.
This is a really good idea for a video idea! I’ve got more money than a college student but I’m still a father, so seeing the same thing in the under $2k would be awesome.
I have the same PA on my M1A Scout Squad using a SADLAK Airborne mount and it’s been great. It’s a 2 MOA rifle on a good day with match ammo so I didn’t feel it necessary to use a premium optic. But I’ve never felt that the scope itself was limiting its accuracy capability. Before everyone starts hating, that rifle is mostly just a fun gun that I’ll occasionally use for deer hunting and not in my top 5 I’d grab for “serious” use for all the reasons.
I get you don’t like Vortex, but the 3-15 Pst gen 2 is superb and comes in under $600 on sale with the EBR2C reticle. Got one during holiday sales and it’s a steal at that price.
A 'reticle', or also known as a graticule, is a pattern of fine lines or markings built into the eyepiece of an optical device such as a telescopic sight, spotting scope, theodolite, optical microscope or the screen of an oscilloscope, to provide measurement references during visual inspections ...... A 'reticule', also known as a ridicule or indispensable, was a type of small handbag or purse, similar to a modern evening bag, used mainly from 1795 to 1820.
I bought a swampfox arrowhead and its been solid. Not really a go to for an SPR build but it's been solid and has survived some pretty rough experiences unscathed. it's setup in a roughly SPR esque build but is my hunting rifle in 6.5 grendel and due to living on the Appalachian im not really shooting further than more than 200 yards in a field.
brownells mpo 3-18, got mine for $799. it doesnt have a locking elevation turret but the turrets are stiff enough that you will not bump it. I personally think a zero stop is more mandatory than locking turrets. reticle is a good middle ground for all magnification ranges, i actually sold my Pa platinum 1-8 (I didnt like the chevron, and i wanted more magnification) and am way happier with the MPO.
I would love a video on the GLx 2-10 vs the PLx 1-8 for a 16" GPR with something resembling a useful option for passive night vision. I would also be happy if you just had some comments you were willing to drop in here on that. For reference, I'm not and never will live in the city.
Love the content. Per some of your other SPR videos thought you were going to try little higher magnification. Have you got your hands on the GLX 3-18 for comparison? Trying to decide between the 2.5-10 and the 3-18.
Good vid! I've been seriously considering the Swampfox Kentucky Long 2-12X44 and somewhat considering the Bushnell Engage 2.5-10X44, but I've never really delved into Athlon scopes. After watching this, I think I'm going to have to look into the Helos 2-12X42. Is the Kentucky Long's reticle really that hard to see at 2x? The Helos' reticle looks more useable at 2x, yes? Regarding the Swampfox's issue with the indexing points not lining up with the turrets...supposedly they fixed that issue in newer production models...but who knows which one you'll get?
I saw the video and was like, damn I guess I need to consider a different scope now because- Brass facts - "the Athlon Helios.." OH SHIT THATS MY SCOPE Lol guess I didn't do TOO bad
Love the footage of another south paw operating rifles. I would like to know how you deal with butt too low to ground as I find myself in while hunting. Height of milk crate or less. Do you find some safety switches too long on left side? I run my ambi selector 180 out on right side.
@@J.Young808 it came in a week…I paid a little extra for 5 day shipping I have it mounted might try and site it in today depending on the wind It might be a bit over kill but the price point vs what you get is hard to beat from what I’ve seen….great eye relief… Any questions ask….
I've got two of them (a 4-16 and a 6-24) and they are absolute tanks. I would rather get beaten with a police baton than an Arken SH. For the price, I don't think you can beat them if you hit a sale.
I just had to come back to this and comment. I just picked up the Vortex Strike Eagle 3-18 and it’s a piece of glass! It has a locking elevation turret and a capped windage turret. It killed it all the way out to 1400 yards on my Mk12.
Since you’ve already convinced me why lpvo’s suck I went ahead and ordered the brownells mpo 3-18, which some say is a great deal at its normal price of $999 but I just got it on sale for under $700
Sidebar: scopes today which target the Civilian market typically have reticles which have ranging and bullet drop compensation features which obscure an understanding for where the rifle is pointed so the buyer who has no interest in learning how to range or apply BDC from such a reticle will not get the desired results from the scope, which is to hit where aimed. So, what to do? Get an ACOG, which is good to mid range. For LR get a NF NXS 3.5-15 x 50 with MOA reticle and dials. Learn MOA and MOA wind constant formula and your set.
I’m rocking a Burris fullfield IV 2.5-10 with an offset romio 5. More of a hunting rig but it does a good job reaching out. Damn near spent more money on my mounts
The tac tailor 3dap is pretty dope. The talk of margins is applicable but it never once failed me based on my needs in the service and I use it to this day. Pricey but worth it.
Huge fan of your down to earth content. I hope one day I will be able to own such fantastic rifles as you 👌(although I am a bullpup fan so I’d want a Tavor or MDR not AR-15)
@@cbbees1468 I know they do, in CQB. They’re also typically heavier, have more felt recoil, and have more gas in your face. An AR is just better in most use cases
@@BrassFacts A lot of people who get the LE/MIL/FR discount love the Vortex and talk it up, the rest of us are less excited about vortex because of the cost and they don't get it.
Trijicon has so many lightweight options but they have no locking turrets. Some Credos can go for under $1K but they are missing a few things that make them real winners and it hurts.
You need a scope that has a "Christmas tree" reticle. I prefer my BUSHNELL LRTS 4.5 - 18 x 44 with illuminated G# small Xmas tree reticle. It's on a 6.5 PRC Browning X- Bolt for longer range hunting here in Nevada. So G3 reticle with illumination have become my must-haves for hunting. This is because I'm used to an H59 reticle for long range competition.
Juuuust toeing the line, on eurooptic anyway, the trijicon credo 2-10x FFP and 2.5-15x SFP come at just under a grand. Worth looking into, I only ever had the 1-6x but was very satisfied I with it.
I guess the question is: how do you feel about dial-able elevation but capped windage on a 5.56 rifle? Second question: 3-18x offerings when? 😊 so far i think its Vortex and Primary Arms.
that's fine. I rarely dial wind unless im doing stupid shit at like 800+ yards. I have the 3-18x GLx, review in progress. Overall the 2-10x makes more sense for 556.
Haven't watched this yet and already commenting 2-10 Viper, 2-10 GLX and 2-10 Credo are 👑 for $1,000 or less. Edit: Swampfox and Bushnell surprised me. I would've thought the Warhorse would've won out on Kentucky Long.
Hello from October 2024, zad to report that all of the GLX 2 and 1/2 to 10s are gone and no longer in production. Everyone is upselling them like crazy which sucks.
I will say in the Kentucky Long I "MUCH" prefer the MOA reticle. The top 1/3 of the christmas tree illuminates, not just the crosshairs. Making a big pyramid, just throw the tip on target.
I have the primary arms SLX 4x14 DMR hud on my mock 12 mod h and then a a primary arms GLX 4x16 DMR hud on my 18in SPR..the GLX is enough scope and clarity I will ever need. At least on a 556 platform. Both rifles use piggy back red dots.
What I think knocks this out of the running in this case is the requirement for locking turrets. I also run the SLX 4-14 ARC2, but the turrets don't lock. Another good one is the Arken 4-16x, zero stop, but no locking turrets.
Yes but the GLX 4x16 has a zero lock, so when your zeroed it won't move, but when you dial yes it has the possibility of being bumped. But if you get the hud DMR reticle it is designed to be preferred to not dial and use the bdc and wind calls.
@@rc-pm1fe I run the 4-14 ARC-2, I have a drop chart taped to my stock. I pretty much never dial except maybe windage, but I have exposed turrets. At some level every optic is conglomeration of features from previous iterations that may or may not be in vogue now. This is part of the reason some optics families live longer than others, and the PA 4-14x is at least 8 years old at this point.
@@highdesertdrew1844 yeah, it's a good scope as I said I still run that on my 16 in mock 12, I just upgraded recently for a bit better glass a bit more magnification and an 18in SPR. I think you and I are in the same boat in regards to usage.
The glx is missing a center dot based reticle like the swamp fix with mil stadia around it. Yea it's cool you can dial and have locking turrets but there is no stadia for wind holds when dialing.
Is it just me or is there really just a big gap in the lineup when it comes to a lightweight-ish 3-9 that ALSO has side focus AND locking turrets AND a good BDC reticle with illuminated center. Makes me wonder if I’m the only person that wants such a thing.
I'm curious why a 4-16 scope with piggyback red dot wouldn't make a good spr set up, but an acog (4x)with piggyback red dot is functional enough for a gpr
4x on scopes like these don't really behave like 4x on a acog. It depends if you're cool with using the 1x RDS exclusive to about 100 yards. Then the 4-16 is compelling. If you're like me and still would like to use the main scope for as much as possible. Then meh. You also have to consider weight. These scopes are light, and the 4-16x and 3-18x are heavy (VCOG weight)
Fits the criteria/a little much but...my son's going to try out the new FFP Strike Eagle in 3-18, a bit heavy but killer deal Mil discount during Memorial Day sale. Got the MOA, reticle is a little less busy. Trijicon 2.5-15x42 Credo (no lock turret, simpler reticle) but glass is unbelievable, 23 oz is probably a good bit better than those reviewed, love the 1-6 HX. $$$ compared to the Vortex so he went that way.
Have you tried the Maven Rs. 2? It seems quality and for the price and extreme weight savings and it being made with Japanese glass, idk man it seems tempting.
@@BrassFacts True, the reticle does suck. honestly i wish theyd drop something that was in the 2-10 range and had a better reticle, they have a 2.5-15 that has a better reticle but it is obviously much more expensive and outa this vids price range.
You and hop have influenced a tremendous amount of my thoughts on gun things. Perfect balance of ‘tism, nuance, and humor.
Thanks for the free information and entertainment.
This combined with the gentle guitar chords at the end of the video.... I almost shed a tear
This guy gets it
As always, thank you when you consider content for us poors.
I hate arizona
No no no it’s us “working poor” lol.
Dear Primary Arms,
As a desert dweller like Mr. Facts here, “SPR” scopes are a staple for me. I have a 1-8x PLX-C which is amazing. I also have a GLX 2.5-10 which I like but I’m still left wanting more mag.
I’d love to see you expand on this genre of scopes. If you made a lightweight 2-12x PLx (preferably but I’d take a GLX too), I’d buy 3 of them yesterday.
You you mind if you lose some magnification on the low end? Pretty sure PA makes a 4-14x.
brownells MPO 3-18 is like 800 bucks and i love it
@@DevDog67 they also make a 3-18x...
I'm hoping these scopes don't just fog up and die like most scopes do when it's-20 celcius like here in Canada. Anyone from North or South Dakota here in the comments here to comment on durability is cold weather?
Cause vortex although durable they fog like crazy all the damn time up here
I own the PA 2.5-10x44. It's quite lovely and I have it assigned to a "Mock" 12 build. It is an existential threat to Prairie Dogs everywhere.
Frankly, I think there are only a few use-case scenarios where a higher cost scope would be necessary:
1. You're a competition/professional long range shooter
2. You're an actual sniper (which is basically the same as point #1)
3. You got it for free
4. You have lots of money to burn and a lighter in your pocket.
Otherwise, if a 2-10x-ish scope is on your shopping list, you really can't get a better combo of performance/value. There you go, my "professional opinion" that's worth 2 pennies!
What is the model or designation?
@@J.Young808 Primary Arms GLx 2.5-10x44
Is the eye box bad? It claims 2.7-2.8" eye relief. Most are good at 3.6-4". Seems like you are going to be right in there or you see nothing...
@@triggerbarPhD I find it to be no different than any other 2.5-10x44 (or similar). I personally think PA undersells the eye relief numbers. I was trained to shoot nose-to-charging handle. But I don't do that anymore. It's ergonomically un-sound and creates even more issues if you wear body armor. I like my head/neck to be as comfortable/vertical as possible. So, when I set up the scope, I keep my head in nice, natural position (it's an A2 length stock). Doing so will place the ocular lens almost right in-line with the rear of the upper receiver.
@@charlesm.2756 thanks a bunch on for this!!
I know it doesn’t fall within this list, but the Leupold Mark5HD 3.6-18 has been really solid for me for the last few years
So... You're saying the best "SPR" (debatable #1 vs NF offering) scope has been solid for you? 😂
@@rphash49bros like “I know it doesn’t fall within this list of sub 1000 ar’s but the knights armament sr15 has been incredibly reliable for me”
@@rphash49budget has entered the chat
For Under $1000
I'm making this comment because of the PA scope in your video. Great video, and I'm a new subscriber as of about two weeks ago. Great channel and have enjoyed it thus far!
A couple things here and why I chose the New Vortex 3-18 over the New PA 3-18 GLX. Both of these are currently selling for around $750. Though I was able to get the Vortex for about 670 from OP. My personal experience with PA in the past, as far as their scopes go is, I had one 8 years ago that worked fine for my use at the time. I like what they're doing with their reticles. Now I've just built a DMR and I bought two scopes. One was the new Vortex 3-18 x 44, and PA's new 3-18 x 44 in GLX. I had them both for two weeks playing with them, setting them side by side looking through them in different light, sun and clouds, and at the same objects of course. One object at 496 yards and the other at 284 yards. Over the two weeks of deciding which one to send back, my findings where as follows.
GLASS... The Vortex had a definite brighter view by at least 1.5 shades I'd say. Now there's no way for me to say exactly, however, it was immediately obvious there was a slight difference. PA's glass is from Japan, and Vortex from China. I'd expect a slightly better brightness. But after talking to a rep from PA he said maybe Vortex is using a different HD coating, IDK.
FIELD OF VIEW... At 18 power the Vortex still had a wider field of view at the 496 yard mark by say, 6ft. Though you can look on the websites to confirm each, the FOV difference was noticeable, not just by a foot.
THE EYE BOX
Both were about the same. TIGHT. Not much wiggle room from either. But felt like the PA scope should have had some wiggle since lets face it, it's a reticle designed for battle and the last thing you want to have to do in a hurry is have to get perfectly aligned before you can see the reticle. A more forgiving eye box on both of these scopes should be designed.
PARALLAX. The Vortex was stiff but smooth. Stiff enough I wasn't worried about accidental movement. But smooth enough not to struggle with fine adjustment. The PA however was a different story. Extremely stiff. Stiff enough that It was hard to tell WHEN it was perfect because there wasn't enough smoothness to find that exact point, like you can when it's a little smoother. Some of you might know what I'm talking about if you'd played with parallax long enough. So again, the Vortex to me was better.
TURRETS. Here is where PA won, sort of. They definitely feel a little more tactile. The clicks are ever so slightly louder but not to the point of OH WOW. The one thing I didn't like about PA's turrets are that you have to push that triangle where as with the Vortex you lift up and spin. It just seemed to me like that was easier to do, and I knew when I pulled up it was ready to turn.
RETICLE.
I liked PA's reticle better on the GLX 3-18. I like the design and it's well thought out. We all know Demetri has done and excellent job there. There's a dot every 2.5 mils all the way down the tree and out each side, so it's easy to adjust quickly if you can spot your impact on time to make the correct adjustment. Vortex's reticle is great too, but it has sub tensions horizontally all the way out, where as PA has dots. Also the Vortex dots on down the tree are only provided at 1 mil increments. So you're left guessing if using the tree for a say 3.4 mils down, and 1.7 mil right. But you can extrapelate I guess. Also the PA has wind holds out to I think 6 which is perfect. The Vortex has them out to 10! Who holds ten mils of wind unless you're shooting a mile or in 45 mph wind? This is just being lazy in the design. Vortex could do a lot better.
Here's the issue I found. And I have several FFP scopes so I know about reticle size. Although both scopes are 3-18 and FFP, I couldn't use the reticle on the PA scope outside of the chevron, until I got to about 11 power. That's when I could start to see the dots off to the side of the chevron well enough to actually use them, or the ones below. With the Vortex 3-18 I could actually see the lines and read the numbers on the horizontal plane even down to 6! So for me this meant that I could use a much wide band of the zoom than on the PA scope.
CONCLUSION
So because of the better brightness, the smoother parallax adj., and the ability to actually use a FFP reticle down at 6x, I chose to keep the Vortex and send the PA back. I can't tell you how much I tried to like the PA scope. I really wanted to! But having my evaluations in front of me, I had to make the better choice for me and my intended use.
-
I like the openness of the Athlon reticle. I don't need something that can range or hold to a gnats ass, those kinds of reticles tend to distract from the target (for me). It's an example of just enough being better than too much (again, for me).
I would like to vouch for the PA SLx 3-18x HUD DMR. It’s absolutely amazing IMO. Great zoom range, awesome reticle, and fairly light at about 24 ounces, and in the weight range of some heavier LPVOs.
it's a weird reticle, but I think it's good.
I actually have one.
@@BrassFacts I love the reticle. Perfect for beginners like me. Is great for unknown ranges. The circles are good if you figure what you're looking at is a head-sized target.
Shit looked like alien hieroglyphics to me.
Walked into the store and got a blem 2.5-10x GLX for $450 after tax. Hella worth. Hard to beat even at full price.
Just took my Mk12 Mod0 equipped with a GLX 2.5-10x out to 900 with 15mph gusts. I thought I’d want more magnification but went with that scope at your recommendation and absolutely loved it.
But can you take out 3 drones in under 30 seconds with it?
I did pick up one of their GLx 4-16 with HUD/DMR though and that’s a good one. The chevron is tiny enough to be unobtrusive when trying for those precise 200ish yard shots with a little wind.
The Helos 2-12 does have a zero stop. Perhaps it's a gen 2 thing, though I don't know when those rolled out. Both of mine from the last year have the zero stop, but they don't have the little sharkfin.
The slight stumble under NV at 12:58 cracked me up haha
Brass facts is the bees knees, keep it up bud.
Great content, as usual. This has quickly become one of my favorite YT channels over the past six months due to the honesty, humor, and focus on actual products that 99.9% of us will be interested in and use.
Been meaning to ask: what is that cover on your weapon light and (more importantly) where did you get it?
Might be the onehundered concepts light cap. And thanks man
Thanks for another great comparison. Looking forward to the C_Does review and comparison of the Primary Arms GLx 2-10x to the MEOPTA Optika6 3-18x50 prior to making a purchase.
NM - The MEOPTA Optika6 3-18x50 weights 29.9 oz. Looks like the PA GLx is a better choice.
"reticle" - a series of fine lines or fibers in the eyepiece of an optical device.
"reticule" - a woman's small handbag
U make all the difference ❤
As always one of my favorite gun channels to come to for zero bs solutions for poor people. I would love to see you review or just hear your opinions on the Athlon Ares 2.5-15x scope. At a street price similar to the PA 2-10 glx and good stats on paper it seems like potentially the ultimate SPR scope. I've built a 308 in tye spr spirit and now I need glass. Nobody and I mean nobody has a legit field review of it
I should let Swampfox Kentucky buyers know that the MOA version does not have the "turret numbers not lining up" issue. MOA is king once again, we landed on the moon! 👌👌
MOA GANG GANG
Supposedly Swampfox corrected the turret issue on the newer production models.
Figured I'd throw my two cents in since I have two of these scopes. I had the GLx 2.5-10 with the Raptor Reticle on mine, but recently bought the Athlon Helos BTR 2-12 to try it out.
After handling the two and looking through them both, I'm keeping the Helos and selling the GLx. For me, the glass clarity on the GLx is only marginally better and at range, my Helos is actually slightly crisper. However, the Helos is very finnicky about where you are behind the scope. If you're off by a fraction, you see the shadow. The GLx is a little more forgiving in that regard. Otherwise, they're pretty equal with certain things the Helos does better and certain things the GLx does better. At 2x, the Helos reticle is hard to see against certain backgrounds but is amazing at 12x. The GLx is great at 2.5x, but at 10x, like BF said, it takes up damn near the entire lens. It's nuts.
TL;DR - Both of them are excellent scopes and at the end of the day, I think Reticle matters the most between the two. Then, comes down to cost.
How much you selling for?
athlon's site says the helos has a zero stop, does yours? was it added in the 2nd gen? curious to know as I'll be getting mine next week
Got an L3 Unfilmed WP from Nightline, tube is super clean, thanks for mentioning them, used your code of course. Got here the day after paying, crazy fast devilvery (but I'm on east coast). Same setup from TNVC, 12 weeks back order lol.
Picked up a PST viper 2.5-10 for $400 used on my “SPR” build. Things nice, but that Kentucky long is *chefs kiss
1:39 A reticle is the fine lines or fibers in the eyepiece of an optical device but a reticule is archaic for a small hand bag or purse.
Sample usage: EOTech's have great a reticle but buying one will lighten your reticule.
This is why I get up on Friday’s because brasshop is my favorite thing in the world
Recently ordered a Athlon helos. Came with a throw lever for magnification, and two dust covers plus a 3 inch tube extension.
This is a really good idea for a video idea! I’ve got more money than a college student but I’m still a father, so seeing the same thing in the under $2k would be awesome.
I have the same PA on my M1A Scout Squad using a SADLAK Airborne mount and it’s been great. It’s a 2 MOA rifle on a good day with match ammo so I didn’t feel it necessary to use a premium optic. But I’ve never felt that the scope itself was limiting its accuracy capability. Before everyone starts hating, that rifle is mostly just a fun gun that I’ll occasionally use for deer hunting and not in my top 5 I’d grab for “serious” use for all the reasons.
Happy to see a swamp fox talked about a never hear anyone really review their stuff and I think their staff is great.
PSR sent me over here. I look forward to your content!
I get you don’t like Vortex, but the 3-15 Pst gen 2 is superb and comes in under $600 on sale with the EBR2C reticle. Got one during holiday sales and it’s a steal at that price.
Thanks for your candid review, guess I’ll be stepping up my glass
A 'reticle', or also known as a graticule, is a pattern of fine lines or markings built into the eyepiece of an optical device such as a telescopic sight, spotting scope, theodolite, optical microscope or the screen of an oscilloscope, to provide measurement references during visual inspections ...... A 'reticule', also known as a ridicule or indispensable, was a type of small handbag or purse, similar to a modern evening bag, used mainly from 1795 to 1820.
I bought a swampfox arrowhead and its been solid. Not really a go to for an SPR build but it's been solid and has survived some pretty rough experiences unscathed. it's setup in a roughly SPR esque build but is my hunting rifle in 6.5 grendel and due to living on the Appalachian im not really shooting further than more than 200 yards in a field.
brownells mpo 3-18, got mine for $799. it doesnt have a locking elevation turret but the turrets are stiff enough that you will not bump it. I personally think a zero stop is more mandatory than locking turrets. reticle is a good middle ground for all magnification ranges, i actually sold my Pa platinum 1-8 (I didnt like the chevron, and i wanted more magnification) and am way happier with the MPO.
If you or Hop could review the new 2-10x Mark 5 that’d be great, mkay.
I feel like monstrum tactical should be a part of this conversation
I would love a video on the GLx 2-10 vs the PLx 1-8 for a 16" GPR with something resembling a useful option for passive night vision. I would also be happy if you just had some comments you were willing to drop in here on that. For reference, I'm not and never will live in the city.
Picked up the Kentucky Long 2-12 (MIL) for $350 on their site. Nothing beats it at that price point.
Did you get the Sharpshooter MIL or the RECCE MIL reticle? How do you like the scope?
Love the content. Per some of your other SPR videos thought you were going to try little higher magnification. Have you got your hands on the GLX 3-18 for comparison? Trying to decide between the 2.5-10 and the 3-18.
yep im working on the review for it right now
It's nice, but man is it heavy.
Good vid! I've been seriously considering the Swampfox Kentucky Long 2-12X44 and somewhat considering the Bushnell Engage 2.5-10X44, but I've never really delved into Athlon scopes. After watching this, I think I'm going to have to look into the Helos 2-12X42. Is the Kentucky Long's reticle really that hard to see at 2x? The Helos' reticle looks more useable at 2x, yes? Regarding the Swampfox's issue with the indexing points not lining up with the turrets...supposedly they fixed that issue in newer production models...but who knows which one you'll get?
I just became aware of the SIG Tango MSR 2-12X44 which would fit into the comparison category. I wonder how it would stack up.
I saw the video and was like, damn I guess I need to consider a different scope now because-
Brass facts - "the Athlon Helios.."
OH SHIT THATS MY SCOPE Lol guess I didn't do TOO bad
You absolutely need to review/include the Meopta Optika 6 3-18X. It's incredible!
Love the footage of another south paw operating rifles. I would like to know how you deal with butt too low to ground as I find myself in while hunting. Height of milk crate or less. Do you find some safety switches too long on left side? I run my ambi selector 180 out on right side.
Ultra budget primary arms 4-14 ACSS HUD/DMR 5.56 NATO at optics planets under 210 “blazing hot deal”
Or 189 at Dvor.
I’m well pleased with mine.
Do you have it yet/how king have you been waiting for it?
@@J.Young808 it came in a week…I paid a little extra for 5 day shipping
I have it mounted might try and site it in today depending on the wind
It might be a bit over kill but the price point vs what you get is hard to beat from what I’ve seen….great eye relief…
Any questions ask….
@@J.Young808 its 189 at Dvor currently on their opmod specials …. Might have to make an account
I would love to see a 2-12 or 1.7-10 (ish) PA platinum under 19oz
Always love getting home and watching some brass facts, irregardless of the topic
In my experience the Arken SH 4-16 MIL is pretty good. Great turrets, solid build. Heavy AF but that’s the only real downside.
I've got two of them (a 4-16 and a 6-24) and they are absolute tanks. I would rather get beaten with a police baton than an Arken SH. For the price, I don't think you can beat them if you hit a sale.
I just had to come back to this and comment. I just picked up the Vortex Strike Eagle 3-18 and it’s a piece of glass! It has a locking elevation turret and a capped windage turret. It killed it all the way out to 1400 yards on my Mk12.
Oh and it’s $700
Ngl, this came out at kind of a decent time, I've honestly been wanting to move into a SPR setup due to where I live.
Since you’ve already convinced me why lpvo’s suck I went ahead and ordered the brownells mpo 3-18, which some say is a great deal at its normal price of $999 but I just got it on sale for under $700
You finally got the 360 stick cam like D34! 🙌
Thank you for this video! I’ve been wanting a video like this
Brass had his sugar cereal before filming this intro
Sidebar: scopes today which target the Civilian market typically have reticles which have ranging and bullet drop compensation features which obscure an understanding for where the rifle is pointed so the buyer who has no interest in learning how to range or apply BDC from such a reticle will not get the desired results from the scope, which is to hit where aimed. So, what to do? Get an ACOG, which is good to mid range. For LR get a NF NXS 3.5-15 x 50 with MOA reticle and dials. Learn MOA and MOA wind constant formula and your set.
I hate to be that guy, but if these auto ranging features come off as "obscure" to you. You might have gotten the short straw in life.
I’m rocking a Burris fullfield IV 2.5-10 with an offset romio 5. More of a hunting rig but it does a good job reaching out. Damn near spent more money on my mounts
The tac tailor 3dap is pretty dope. The talk of margins is applicable but it never once failed me based on my needs in the service and I use it to this day. Pricey but worth it.
Huge fan of your down to earth content. I hope one day I will be able to own such fantastic rifles as you 👌(although I am a bullpup fan so I’d want a Tavor or MDR not AR-15)
Bull pups kinda suck but the Tavor and MDR do have the best triggers for the type of firearm
@@edanpino-xt1ph It's debatable but for HD, bullpups have a really good advantage assuming you train with it.
@@cbbees1468
I know they do, in CQB. They’re also typically heavier, have more felt recoil, and have more gas in your face. An AR is just better in most use cases
@@edanpino-xt1phNot to mention cheaper
@@georgewhitworth9742
And probably more reliable
vortex is best bang for buck imho. thanks for these videos! Love your channel
none of the vortex's in this cost range have locked turrets.
@@BrassFacts exactly why I don't like mine!
@@BrassFacts A lot of people who get the LE/MIL/FR discount love the Vortex and talk it up, the rest of us are less excited about vortex because of the cost and they don't get it.
@@highdesertdrew1844 facts
Trijicon has so many lightweight options but they have no locking turrets. Some Credos can go for under $1K but they are missing a few things that make them real winners and it hurts.
New ruck pack breakdown soon ?? Kudos the camo you look like a professional
Gawd I love the glx. Worth its weight in rangoons no doubt.
“What’s up guys it’s the talking gas station shades here”
Vortex 3-18 strike eagle would be a good shout these days.
Sick 90s video game intro music
Strong opening, love it
You and Hop are becoming such bros that you even talk the same.
You need a scope that has a "Christmas tree" reticle. I prefer my BUSHNELL LRTS 4.5 - 18 x 44 with illuminated G# small Xmas tree reticle. It's on a 6.5 PRC Browning X- Bolt for longer range hunting here in Nevada. So G3 reticle with illumination have become my must-haves for hunting. This is because I'm used to an H59 reticle for long range competition.
Loving the 80s montage
Juuuust toeing the line, on eurooptic anyway, the trijicon credo 2-10x FFP and 2.5-15x SFP come at just under a grand. Worth looking into, I only ever had the 1-6x but was very satisfied I with it.
Super Hyper-Caffeinated Intro Brass Facts® is *_BEST_* Brass Facts®
Come for content, stay for doggo
If only the trijicon credo 2.5-10 had side parallax, then it would be a top contender in this comparison.
Dude! That intro was sweet!
Brassfacts Friday🎉
15:15 "My two dads: Nova's tale"
Turret click ASMR video when?
I guess the question is: how do you feel about dial-able elevation but capped windage on a 5.56 rifle?
Second question: 3-18x offerings when? 😊 so far i think its Vortex and Primary Arms.
that's fine. I rarely dial wind unless im doing stupid shit at like 800+ yards.
I have the 3-18x GLx, review in progress. Overall the 2-10x makes more sense for 556.
@@BrassFacts What about for a Grendal?
@@Jazz3006 I was excited for the 3-18 but it is a decent bit heavier than both the 2.5-10 and the 4-16 which is off putting
@@zubysaboss1062 which means it's WAY heavier than the PLXc. But, for me, the grendel was always going to be a mid-range setup anyway
@13:35 assfacts was hoofin it 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Brass didn’t you know all you need is irons?
Haven't watched this yet and already commenting 2-10 Viper, 2-10 GLX and 2-10 Credo are 👑 for $1,000 or less.
Edit: Swampfox and Bushnell surprised me. I would've thought the Warhorse would've won out on Kentucky Long.
Hello from October 2024, zad to report that all of the GLX 2 and 1/2 to 10s are gone and no longer in production. Everyone is upselling them like crazy which sucks.
I will say in the Kentucky Long I "MUCH" prefer the MOA reticle. The top 1/3 of the christmas tree illuminates, not just the crosshairs. Making a big pyramid, just throw the tip on target.
“Or use math… which no one will ever use. Fuck math.” 😂
Much power, very optic.
The Meopta optika6 3-18 is my favorite in this category
I have the primary arms SLX 4x14 DMR hud on my mock 12 mod h and then a a primary arms GLX 4x16 DMR hud on my 18in SPR..the GLX is enough scope and clarity I will ever need. At least on a 556 platform. Both rifles use piggy back red dots.
What I think knocks this out of the running in this case is the requirement for locking turrets. I also run the SLX 4-14 ARC2, but the turrets don't lock. Another good one is the Arken 4-16x, zero stop, but no locking turrets.
Yes but the GLX 4x16 has a zero lock, so when your zeroed it won't move, but when you dial yes it has the possibility of being bumped. But if you get the hud DMR reticle it is designed to be preferred to not dial and use the bdc and wind calls.
@@rc-pm1fe I run the 4-14 ARC-2, I have a drop chart taped to my stock. I pretty much never dial except maybe windage, but I have exposed turrets. At some level every optic is conglomeration of features from previous iterations that may or may not be in vogue now. This is part of the reason some optics families live longer than others, and the PA 4-14x is at least 8 years old at this point.
@@highdesertdrew1844 yeah, it's a good scope as I said I still run that on my 16 in mock 12, I just upgraded recently for a bit better glass a bit more magnification and an 18in SPR. I think you and I are in the same boat in regards to usage.
@@rc-pm1fe 100% I'm sticking with the 16in, but looking at the Arken 4-16 I just want something with better illumination than the Arken.
Viper pst g2. Next video
LUNCH BREAK ASS FACTS LESGOOOOO
whatch eating.
@@BrassFacts hamborger from sonic, American fine dining
The glx is missing a center dot based reticle like the swamp fix with mil stadia around it. Yea it's cool you can dial and have locking turrets but there is no stadia for wind holds when dialing.
Sick intro vibes.
Huge fan of the Bushnell Forge for tis category. Shame that they no loner produce a scope of this caliber anywhere near its price range.
Is it just me or is there really just a big gap in the lineup when it comes to a lightweight-ish 3-9 that ALSO has side focus AND locking turrets AND a good BDC reticle with illuminated center. Makes me wonder if I’m the only person that wants such a thing.
Bought my Athlon before it was cool (when you said in your last video about it that it was good)
Swampfox Warhawk 2-10 is an upgrade from KL 2-12. Look into that one.
I'm curious why a 4-16 scope with piggyback red dot wouldn't make a good spr set up, but an acog (4x)with piggyback red dot is functional enough for a gpr
4x on scopes like these don't really behave like 4x on a acog.
It depends if you're cool with using the 1x RDS exclusive to about 100 yards. Then the 4-16 is compelling.
If you're like me and still would like to use the main scope for as much as possible. Then meh.
You also have to consider weight. These scopes are light, and the 4-16x and 3-18x are heavy (VCOG weight)
I think im going to get the PA 2-10 for a spr type rifle im building using a Criterion Core 16" barrel as the base.
Just my personal opinion but I value turret repeatability over everything. It's hard to find a repeatable non locking turret under 1k
Arken if you can stand the weight. Thing is an absolute brick
You somehow missed the ultimate Fudd scope (and actually a good one:) the Leupold VX-3HD.
Fits the criteria/a little much but...my son's going to try out the new FFP Strike Eagle in 3-18, a bit heavy but killer deal Mil discount during Memorial Day sale. Got the MOA, reticle is a little less busy. Trijicon 2.5-15x42 Credo (no lock turret, simpler reticle) but glass is unbelievable, 23 oz is probably a good bit better than those reviewed, love the 1-6 HX. $$$ compared to the Vortex so he went that way.
Have you tried the Maven Rs. 2? It seems quality and for the price and extreme weight savings and it being made with Japanese glass, idk man it seems tempting.
capped turrets? and the reticle doesn't seem to be all that good for holding. Seems like a hunting scope.
@@BrassFacts True, the reticle does suck. honestly i wish theyd drop something that was in the 2-10 range and had a better reticle, they have a 2.5-15 that has a better reticle but it is obviously much more expensive and outa this vids price range.