A lot of suspect info here. He is actually talking about custom match-style chambers and rifles vs SAAMI spec. First of all, he case diameters are actually slightly different diameters, WSM is 0.555" and the SAUM is 0.550". Most commercial load data is made with SAAMI-spec V&P (Velocity and Pressure) barrels, with the chamber and rifling having tightly specified tolerances. They also test with ammo that does not exceed the SAAMI COAL of 2.86" for the WSM and 2.825 for the SAUM. Many custom target barrels use different rifling profiles and custom chambers. The SAAMI WSM chamber, for example, has no freebore at all; just a tapered throat starting at 0.2783" diameter. They pushed the shoulder foreward and shortened the neck to gain more powder capacity. Most match chambers, though have significant runs of tight freebore and permit the bullet to be loaded long. All of these tend to increase the amount of propellant that can be used and to increase velocity. Any velocity results without pressure-test equipment is unreliable. Both of these cartridges have a SAAMI-max chamber pressure of 65, 000psi. With precisely machined chambers and bolt, it is not uncommon to be able get to near proof load pressure (25-40% over SAAMI max) before seeing "pressure signs". For example, you don't get "cratered primers" if the firing pin is precisely bushed. On a recent Hornady podcast, one of the people admitted discovering that some of his "pet" loads a cartridge were far over the SAAMI max. He had never seen "pressure signs", though.
Love my 7WSM in the Browning X-Bolt! Its a great balance between the short action size and light recoil of a 7mm-08 and Better medium to long range ballistics than the 7mm Rem. Mag. The 7WSM is also a great multi-purpose round capable of hunting anything in North America from hunting hogs and southern whitetails with a 140 gr to Moose and Brown Bear with a 180gr. As far as popularity goes with these rounds in the hunting world, I think Winchester won the marketing game because of the guns they were available in.
Thanks for the comparison! Fast forward to 2023, I'm considering either the 7 WSM, 7 SAUM or 7 China for my first big boy Magnum Target rifle in long action. This video was perfect. Scrapped my 28 Nosler idea lol.
There is a reason why I’ve been shooting the 7mm wsm for hunting for years out of my browning a-bolt medallion. Shoots flat as hell, high velocity, and simply knocks the snot out of big game. 7mm has higher ballistic coefficients than let’s say a .30 caliber bullet that you would throw out of a 300wsm therefore the 7mm wsm actually has more ft lbs of energy at long range than it’s bigger 300wsm brother when using similar weight bullets. 160 grain nosler accubond long range is a great bullet
The 7mm wsm is not a necked Down 300 wsm. The case is longer and has more case capacity. It was done to keep from clambering the 7mm into either of the other two cartridges.
Looking for 7MM WSM shooter perspective on the new 6.8 Westerner. Do you feel the 6.8 popularity would have been greater had it been released as a 7MM capable of shooting higher BC bullets due to longer neck shorter case capacity. Thoughts????
That's awesome man. I definitely know a couple people I can reach out to for good info on the Shehane. It seems to be the new go to cartridge for guys chambering there next f class barrel with good reason. That was the cartridge used to shoot the f open record of 200-22x. I know its slightly lower velocity than the SAUM but it's an extremely inherently accurate cartridge from all available info. It's crazy buy I do believe it's not a saami spec cartridge yet. With all the success its had its surprising to me that has not been done yet.
@@gunfather83 AWESOME! I am building a new stick as we speak. I have been diligent about collecting components before I have the barrel spun up. I wasn't seeing brass and finally got 400pc from Bertram as they were the first to supply it. I wasn't going to order the SAUM if I couldn't get brass. The 284 brass is/was available so that put the Shehane in the crosshairs. I now have about 1100 bullets from Berger, Hornady, and Sierra. But, I'm still not sure if I will choose the .284 Shehane or SAUM. I've been wanting to do a SAUM for a decade. But I can't ignore that .284 Shehane. Finding 7SAUM shooters is tough but I can't find anybody who shoots or knows what the Shehane is. I will be looking forward to seeing something on this before I get the barrel ordered. I am digging your channel.
Have you ever chambered a barrel or shot a 284 winchester? I would like to see a review on that caliber. I think if you "throat it out" you could duplicate or surpass the performance of the short magnums. your thoughts pls.
284 win is an extremely popular caliber in long range f class and I know many people who run that caliber. It's a fantastic cartridge and a very accurate cartridge. Its biggest attraction is the fact that you can create fairly high velocities "not quite as much as the short mags" and it has a much longer barrel life than a lot of the other 7mm that are used in high power with a very low recoil impulse
No. The 6.8w might be able to be fire formed into 270wsm if it will chamber because they are extremely similar but the saum case has drastically different dimensions
Love your videos, and cartridge comparisons.. Do you have any plans to venture in to the 6.8/.277 realm? They seem to be getting some new things out recently.
That I honestly cant say. That's something I didn't ask about when I was talking to my buddy about it. By its much shorter neck though I could see that being the case
I was with you until you argued the barrel life. The shoulder angle is NOT going to get you 800-1000 rounds of barrel life. Close capacity, close velocity, close shoulder angles,will get you CLOSE BARREL LIFE. it's a matter of heat and velocity/friction. The 7wsm will last approximately 1600-1800 rds while the same will be LUCKY to reach 2000 if you really baby it. Especially with the large bullets with slow and COOL burning powders like H1000. Also if you aren't running these with 180+ class bullets in a LONG action. You are wrong. To say that a cartridge is better for hunting because it has 100fps (MAX) more velocity is laughable as well. An animal isn't going to fall over dead quicker with a 100fps difference inside practical hunting ranges. A deer shot at 700 yards with a saum will have the same effect as a WSM and vice versa. Good video otherwise
I know my 7 saum feeds great from long action as long as I don't push the rounds all the way to the back of the mag. I do know someone running a 280 ai long action and as far as I'm aware they have no feeding issues either. I will say I'm obviously biased to the saum and from I believe the saum is capable of higher velocities
@@gunfather83 thanks! I’ve got a 6.5 CM & 300 PRC for now. But want another chambering for my Origin LA that feeds well. It’s a SwithLug so can easily change calibers & bolt faces. Feeding probably also less of an issue with controlled found feed. You think the SAUM is more efficient overall and capable of higher velocities?
@@drummachinejoe1451 i believe the saum gets slightly higher velocity for the similar charge weight. Its the most efficient 7mm I am aware of. It has that short fat shape which seems to be a more efficient shape than the long skinnier shape.
The 300 is capable of slightly lower velocity than the 300win mag and has significantly less than the 7mm SAUM but the 300 SAUM getting considerably longer barrel life than both 300wm and 7SAUM. The short mags are extremely efficient cartridges
@@ramsaycountry1177 that's awesome. Yeah all the short mags are great cartridges. I hope it didn't come off as I was trying to beat up on the wsm cartridges because that's not the case. The only place I see a big disadvantage really is barrel life compared to the SAUM cartridges. But they always seem to produce more velocities.
@@gunfather83 no man, In all honesty this rifle was going to be a 7mm something but brass was the hold back in the 7mm. For the 7wsm id have to go with nosler to get "good" brass and at over $3each. For the 7saum id have to go with atlas and i shoot it in my 22crdm. So that's why I'm now going with a 284 shehane.
Part of me wants to tell him to lay off the caffeine, the other part wants to tell him to just keep going. 💪🏼 thanks for the info brother. 🤜🏼🤛🏼
7mm wsm is awesome....
A lot of suspect info here. He is actually talking about custom match-style chambers and rifles vs SAAMI spec. First of all, he case diameters are actually slightly different diameters, WSM is 0.555" and the SAUM is 0.550". Most commercial load data is made with SAAMI-spec V&P (Velocity and Pressure) barrels, with the chamber and rifling having tightly specified tolerances. They also test with ammo that does not exceed the SAAMI COAL of 2.86" for the WSM and 2.825 for the SAUM. Many custom target barrels use different rifling profiles and custom chambers. The SAAMI WSM chamber, for example, has no freebore at all; just a tapered throat starting at 0.2783" diameter. They pushed the shoulder foreward and shortened the neck to gain more powder capacity. Most match chambers, though have significant runs of tight freebore and permit the bullet to be loaded long. All of these tend to increase the amount of propellant that can be used and to increase velocity.
Any velocity results without pressure-test equipment is unreliable. Both of these cartridges have a SAAMI-max chamber pressure of 65, 000psi. With precisely machined chambers and bolt, it is not uncommon to be able get to near proof load pressure (25-40% over SAAMI max) before seeing "pressure signs". For example, you don't get "cratered primers" if the firing pin is precisely bushed. On a recent Hornady podcast, one of the people admitted discovering that some of his "pet" loads a cartridge were far over the SAAMI max. He had never seen "pressure signs", though.
Love my 7WSM in the Browning X-Bolt! Its a great balance between the short action size and light recoil of a 7mm-08 and Better medium to long range ballistics than the 7mm Rem. Mag. The 7WSM is also a great multi-purpose round capable of hunting anything in North America from hunting hogs and southern whitetails with a 140 gr to Moose and Brown Bear with a 180gr. As far as popularity goes with these rounds in the hunting world, I think Winchester won the marketing game because of the guns they were available in.
Thanks for the comparison! Fast forward to 2023, I'm considering either the 7 WSM, 7 SAUM or 7 China for my first big boy Magnum Target rifle in long action. This video was perfect. Scrapped my 28 Nosler idea lol.
There is a reason why I’ve been shooting the 7mm wsm for hunting for years out of my browning a-bolt medallion. Shoots flat as hell, high velocity, and simply knocks the snot out of big game. 7mm has higher ballistic coefficients than let’s say a .30 caliber bullet that you would throw out of a 300wsm therefore the 7mm wsm actually has more ft lbs of energy at long range than it’s bigger 300wsm brother when using similar weight bullets. 160 grain nosler accubond long range is a great bullet
Oh yeah and it doesn’t recoil as bad as my 300wsm
I can tell you ruger used to make a rifle in 7 SAUM because I own one. A ruger m77 mark ll stainless barrel. It’s extremely rare but they’re out there
I totally geek out on everything long range too !!
No detail too small !!!
💥
Agreed
The 7mm wsm is not a necked Down 300 wsm. The case is longer and has more case capacity.
It was done to keep from clambering the 7mm into either of the other two cartridges.
Looking for 7MM WSM shooter perspective on the new 6.8 Westerner. Do you feel the 6.8 popularity would have been greater had it been released as a 7MM capable of shooting higher BC bullets due to longer neck shorter case capacity. Thoughts????
I'd like to see the 7saum and 284 shehane head to head. I just bought 2 33" full blank barrels and a reamer for 284 shehane.
That's awesome man. I definitely know a couple people I can reach out to for good info on the Shehane. It seems to be the new go to cartridge for guys chambering there next f class barrel with good reason. That was the cartridge used to shoot the f open record of 200-22x. I know its slightly lower velocity than the SAUM but it's an extremely inherently accurate cartridge from all available info. It's crazy buy I do believe it's not a saami spec cartridge yet. With all the success its had its surprising to me that has not been done yet.
@@gunfather83 AWESOME! I am building a new stick as we speak. I have been diligent about collecting components before I have the barrel spun up. I wasn't seeing brass and finally got 400pc from Bertram as they were the first to supply it. I wasn't going to order the SAUM if I couldn't get brass. The 284 brass is/was available so that put the Shehane in the crosshairs. I now have about 1100 bullets from Berger, Hornady, and Sierra. But, I'm still not sure if I will choose the .284 Shehane or SAUM. I've been wanting to do a SAUM for a decade. But I can't ignore that .284 Shehane. Finding 7SAUM shooters is tough but I can't find anybody who shoots or knows what the Shehane is. I will be looking forward to seeing something on this before I get the barrel ordered. I am digging your channel.
GOOD comparison video of the 7mm cartridges.
Thank you
Winchester model 70 come in 7wsm?
Love your videos. Keep on rocking.
Thank you
Can you do a video about the 300wsm vs 7mm saum ?
The next rifle that I think is super cool is a lever action Browning blr and what I've researched 7 mm short mag
Have you ever chambered a barrel or shot a 284 winchester? I would like to see a review on that caliber. I think if you "throat it out" you could duplicate or surpass the performance of the short magnums. your thoughts pls.
284 win is an extremely popular caliber in long range f class and I know many people who run that caliber. It's a fantastic cartridge and a very accurate cartridge. Its biggest attraction is the fact that you can create fairly high velocities "not quite as much as the short mags" and it has a much longer barrel life than a lot of the other 7mm that are used in high power with a very low recoil impulse
Would like to hear you’re thoughts on the new 7mm prc
Turns out 7mmWSM shoots heavy bullets just as well and sometimes faster than the 7mm PRC
Will the new 6.8 Western brass work for a 7aaum. The cases look very close in size.
No. The 6.8w might be able to be fire formed into 270wsm if it will chamber because they are extremely similar but the saum case has drastically different dimensions
@@gunfather83 thank you.
@@gunfather83 6.8 western vs. the 7saum orr a 7mmRM.
Will love to see 7 Saum vs 7 prcw
Love your videos, and cartridge comparisons.. Do you have any plans to venture in to the 6.8/.277 realm? They seem to be getting some new things out recently.
Thank You Sir! This was a good comparison👍🇺🇸
Thank you
This guy is really a short mag expert without being a nerd at all but he would wear a lab coat white
Does the saami spec chamber on the wsm require the bullet be seated deeper in the case?
That I honestly cant say. That's something I didn't ask about when I was talking to my buddy about it. By its much shorter neck though I could see that being the case
Who Came up with the 7mm bullet ?
I was with you until you argued the barrel life. The shoulder angle is NOT going to get you 800-1000 rounds of barrel life. Close capacity, close velocity, close shoulder angles,will get you CLOSE BARREL LIFE. it's a matter of heat and velocity/friction. The 7wsm will last approximately 1600-1800 rds while the same will be LUCKY to reach 2000 if you really baby it. Especially with the large bullets with slow and COOL burning powders like H1000.
Also if you aren't running these with 180+ class bullets in a LONG action. You are wrong. To say that a cartridge is better for hunting because it has 100fps (MAX) more velocity is laughable as well. An animal isn't going to fall over dead quicker with a 100fps difference inside practical hunting ranges. A deer shot at 700 yards with a saum will have the same effect as a WSM and vice versa.
Good video otherwise
Yessss 🙏🏾 this one too! Lol. You’re on a roll!
Thank you. This was a video I have been meaning to make for a while now
I don’t know why manufacturers don’t just start from scratch with a new case
Good luck finding anything in 7 wsm as far as brass. I don't think they make it anymore.
Does it matter that 7mm WSM is a 277 or 7mm while the 7mm saumis a 284 or 7.2mm?
7 wsm is not a .277; it is a .284
This guy is a brainiac short mag nerd without being a nerd
22-250 and .257 Robert's had bad rap for losing accuracy after 3k rounds.plus or minus few hundred rounds. Accelerated with 3900 fps rounds
If thats a left handed saum i definitely want it whos your dealer
Geez I wish john moses browning was alive today
Which would you pick between 280 AI & 7 SAUM? LR steel shooting and feeding from a LA.
I know my 7 saum feeds great from long action as long as I don't push the rounds all the way to the back of the mag. I do know someone running a 280 ai long action and as far as I'm aware they have no feeding issues either. I will say I'm obviously biased to the saum and from I believe the saum is capable of higher velocities
@@gunfather83 thanks!
I’ve got a 6.5 CM & 300 PRC for now. But want another chambering for my Origin LA that feeds well. It’s a SwithLug so can easily change calibers & bolt faces. Feeding probably also less of an issue with controlled found feed.
You think the SAUM is more efficient overall and capable of higher velocities?
@@drummachinejoe1451 i believe the saum gets slightly higher velocity for the similar charge weight. Its the most efficient 7mm I am aware of. It has that short fat shape which seems to be a more efficient shape than the long skinnier shape.
Ok I have a 300saum. How do the 7saum compare ?
The 300 is capable of slightly lower velocity than the 300win mag and has significantly less than the 7mm SAUM but the 300 SAUM getting considerably longer barrel life than both 300wm and 7SAUM. The short mags are extremely efficient cartridges
@@gunfather83 I know it's a little different but i have a 300wsm I've only put 300 rounds on but it normaly shoots 1.5" groups at 400 yards.
@@ramsaycountry1177 that's awesome. Yeah all the short mags are great cartridges. I hope it didn't come off as I was trying to beat up on the wsm cartridges because that's not the case. The only place I see a big disadvantage really is barrel life compared to the SAUM cartridges. But they always seem to produce more velocities.
@@gunfather83 no man, In all honesty this rifle was going to be a 7mm something but brass was the hold back in the 7mm. For the 7wsm id have to go with nosler to get "good" brass and at over $3each. For the 7saum id have to go with atlas and i shoot it in my 22crdm. So that's why I'm now going with a 284 shehane.
Add 7mm Sherman ss
7 saum vs 7 pRC
7 sherman max blows both out of water.
300 Norma vs 300prc
7mm prc , 7 saum is obsolete 🤣🤣🤣