Just to be clear, Cheesestraws made the patcher - I just put joevt's script into it. I just used ResEdit, Cheesestraws and joevt did all the difficult bits!
Also, heads up, FW doesn't show in System Profiler. Plug in a FW disk and it will work, but not show up in System Profiler still. If you have the drivers in of course!
At some point in the near future, I do intend to make my own version of this card. The PCI-PCI bridge used actually supports up to 4 devices, so if I have enough board space, I may be able to squeeze 4 different controllers on one board.
Maybe if you added another bridge chip (if that's even possible) you could potentially add even more. At a certain point you'd run into the limits of PCI, if you didn't run out of space first. Makes me wonder how many different things can be integrated into a single card. It could be a fun experiment, I personally don't have the knowledge or resources to try it though.
Sign me up! Definitely would like one for my Molar for starters. Already have an ATI 9200 and Sonnet USB + FW400 combo card (it also looks like it supports IDE but the headers are not installed). SATA would be nice without a 3rd card.
@@dcfuksurmom Actually you could, in theory you can daisychain and infinite number of PCI-PCI bridges LOL. But that's definitely not practical, and no way I'd have enough board space to implement more than 4 devices.
The USB 1.4.6 driver for expansion cards is actually from the OS 9.1 retail installer, so no need to use that German installer again when you set up 9.1. Also, don't forget you can also upgrade to 9.2.2 via OS 9 Helper! You may need to reinstall the 1.4.6 drivers at that point but I can confirm that they do work on 9.2.2.
Okay. You've done it. This has to be, hands down, my favorite Mac of all time. Now that the CD drive is sorted, and USB and SATA and ethernet are all working, well, what can I say? The sound, the looks, the G4! I swoon. Just please, please don't take the BeOS partition off this thing. It was born to dual boot UNIXy stuff. That was... its destiny.
I think the best thing would be, in fact, to make a copy of the BeOS partitions, and save them somewhere, to be able to go back if you want, but, instead of leaving BeOS permanently on the Hard Disk, install Linux Debian Moderno. It would be survival, wouldn't it?
That is awesome! Glad it worked out so well in the TAM. I do want to give a huge thanks to joevt on 68kmla, who actually devised that NVRAMRC patch... Which essentially only serves to ensure the onboard video FCode is evaluated last, as it is what causes the PCI bridge probing issue.
Sean, FireWire won't show up in the System Profiler even if it works (which it should). The Sonnet Tempo Trio (USB, FireWire, ATA-133) exhibits the same behavior. System Profiler just doesn't seem capable of showing the FireWire bus when it's coming over pci-bridge.
A very successful experiment, but man I beg you please get these raisers and cards properly supported. Such beautiful thing deserves a proper printed cover and mount supports. For sake of health of this beautiful piece of history.
Re: Installing OS X on difficult machines. 1. Image your harddrive. 2. Install OS X in QEMU onto the image. 3. Write the image to your harddrive. This has helped me a couple of times with my G3 Desktop that doesn't have a working Apple CD ROM anymore.
You know... Maybe instead of a _whole_ clear back case, maybe it would make sense to get a translucent "bronze" tinted thick dual slot cover or the thin cover for the rear. Not too over the top, and would show off the heart of the machine, without the extreme work of swapping an entire case, which honestly, was _part_ of the selling point of the machine.
I remember that card, I never really thought it was great at the time due to the slots available but it was convenient for sure. I know I bought at least one. I've tossed so much awesome stuff over the years :(
If there were ever a card to need a modern clone, it would be this one. (Or the IDE added variant) There are so many Macs that could benefit from such a cool combo card.
In older drives when you burn disks, it usually helps to burn them on the slowest speed possible that should give the best contrast in the burned dye, since the faster you burn typically the laser spends less time on each section of the disk and the dye gets burned more lightly which will work fine in newer drives with better lasers and better FEC but on older drives disks burnt at higher speeds usually don't work as well.
Using older media (combined with low speeds) makes a big difference. I've had pretty good luck with Sony discs, but I think I had one older spindle that worked and a newer that didn't. Usually a darker dye will work better.
I was gonna whine about it not being perfect with the broken disc drive before I got to that part. Very nice to see even if it might not be all that useful.
Lol, "if this breaks, you get to keep both pieces" I'm getting bamboozled by the boot chime because the TAM boot chime is also my notification sound, haha
If a CD-Drive dont read burned CD's ... you need clean the lens. if the cleaning isnt enough -> laser power a little bit higher and the drive work with burned cd's too.
How about recreating a batch of these cards with sponsor PCBWay? Sounds like it would be a great small batch hardware run that many here would want to purchase.
Really nice! BUT: Could you 3D-print a new big back for this pritty TAM (that keeps the figure of the non-extended Mac)? I also hated the original extension-box, Apple delivered with this machines. A complete back - with a cap for the cables of additional cards - would have looked much better.
Make or get a STL model file for the backing. Send it to your sponsor, PCBWay! They do a great job of clear resin prints, and it would cost orders of magnitude less than an injection mold like your old Mac Classic. Probably still not cheap at that size, but who knows... Maybe PCBWay is super affordable?
That would be incredible for a system im making actually lol, the ideal mix of modern and legacy i/o. Only thing its lacking would be serial and parallel.
Not much flex but I think I have the worlds most decked out Performa 6300CD. It has the Apple TV/Video system, fax modem, Farallon ethermac PDS card, Apple external video connector, 64mb RAM (with 128mb virtual memory), 128GB sata ssd divided into 4 equal partitions booting OS 7.6.1 and 9.1. Seems like this is 1 of the only models that's can't take a CPU upgrade... even in the cache slot (6360 CPU can be upgraded apparently). For a future video you should service the cooling loop on your G5 quad (think your G5 is a quad) and perform the new blood mod. Will have to do that to mine soon... it runs too hot with no sign of leakage (yet). The dexcool is probably decomposing at this point.
I just started watching your video's. I used your G3 upgrade on my mini tower. I put a 350 Mhz G3 processor in it. Original was 266/33. Now it's stable at 433/78 or 416/83. The 433 is just a bit faster. I had a G5 but when turned on the power light just flashes. It's just sitting now.
Can verify that my TAM refuses to load burned disks as well. Can also verify that my TAM bricked (temporarily) when attempting an OS X install. I had to remove the PRAM battery for a few days and it eventually came back to life.
Legitimately just curious, I'm not aware of any particular reason one might install 9.1 instead of 9.2.2. Is 9.1 significantly lighter or is it just a matter of personal preference? As far as I was aware iIt's not like Windows where 98 sometimes has legitimate benefits over stuff that came after.
@@ActionRetro That's an interesting point and not one I was expecting -- I've never had anything older than a snow white G3 iBook so it's not something I would have run into, actually I'm more familiar with machines being unable to run classic MacOS whatsoever.
I use a triple PCI riser for my 20th and leave the back off for heat venting, since nobody goes around the back (who does) .... hmmm this looks interesting... Poland eh?
Kinda stupid question, but do anyone know what regulation it is that says that one of the languages in these cd drives. The yellow label that says "class 1 laser product" (luokan 1 laser laite) that one of those languages has to be Finnish. Originally i thought it was some weird North European thing or even just European thing. But i have seen it on devices that for 100% certainty were sold on North America. I have been wondering this this ever since I noticed it on my Playstation 1 console, but back then i just thought it was just an European thing.
I watched Dosdude build an IDE SSD a few weeks ago😄👍 9:15 This is about as janky as my Dell Optiplex 9010 AIO rigged up to a Titan Black on a Beast mpci GPU dock with external power supply and another monitor, since the external GPU won't power the built in screen.🤣 WHY? when I have a perfectly fine 6850k/1070 desktop? I Just had to scratch that random tinker ich🤣
If that PCI card could also work on Windows 9x, I can think of at least a couple of builds, including one of my own, that would want one of these, as well ⁉️❕
The SATA controller has a driver for 98SE and ME and it works in real mode with the option ROM. I don't know if there is a driver for USB 2.0, but USB 1.1 and Firewire should work out of the box.
@@Drucklufttroete The commonly seen "nusb36e" driver adds USB 2 and mass storage device support to 98SE by backporting appropriate files from newer versions of Windows.
If you ever get a second one of these (because I don’t want you to mess this up) I think it’d be cool to gut it and put in m1 innards - especially if you can find a 12.1 screen in the retina dpi range with the right aspect ratio. The I/O could be a thunderbolt dock extricated from its case with a custom backplate that conforms to the TAM’s dimensions but modern port layout.
Just to be clear, Cheesestraws made the patcher - I just put joevt's script into it. I just used ResEdit, Cheesestraws and joevt did all the difficult bits!
Also, heads up, FW doesn't show in System Profiler. Plug in a FW disk and it will work, but not show up in System Profiler still. If you have the drivers in of course!
Stop letting the mad man torture these poor things . But if you dont we will have entertainment
Don't pin comments
At some point in the near future, I do intend to make my own version of this card. The PCI-PCI bridge used actually supports up to 4 devices, so if I have enough board space, I may be able to squeeze 4 different controllers on one board.
Maybe if you added another bridge chip (if that's even possible) you could potentially add even more. At a certain point you'd run into the limits of PCI, if you didn't run out of space first. Makes me wonder how many different things can be integrated into a single card. It could be a fun experiment, I personally don't have the knowledge or resources to try it though.
Any ideas for what the 4th controller could be?
Sign me up! Definitely would like one for my Molar for starters. Already have an ATI 9200 and Sonnet USB + FW400 combo card (it also looks like it supports IDE but the headers are not installed). SATA would be nice without a 3rd card.
@@Fhwgads11 probably ...
a retro nintendo gamepad controll ...err
@@dcfuksurmom Actually you could, in theory you can daisychain and infinite number of PCI-PCI bridges LOL. But that's definitely not practical, and no way I'd have enough board space to implement more than 4 devices.
I love this build now. Initially I wasn't happy with how the darker coverings on the speakers looked, but I'm growing to love this unicorn TAM.
Same
The USB 1.4.6 driver for expansion cards is actually from the OS 9.1 retail installer, so no need to use that German installer again when you set up 9.1. Also, don't forget you can also upgrade to 9.2.2 via OS 9 Helper! You may need to reinstall the 1.4.6 drivers at that point but I can confirm that they do work on 9.2.2.
Okay. You've done it. This has to be, hands down, my favorite Mac of all time. Now that the CD drive is sorted, and USB and SATA and ethernet are all working, well, what can I say? The sound, the looks, the G4! I swoon. Just please, please don't take the BeOS partition off this thing. It was born to dual boot UNIXy stuff. That was... its destiny.
I think the best thing would be, in fact, to make a copy of the BeOS partitions, and save them somewhere, to be able to go back if you want, but, instead of leaving BeOS permanently on the Hard Disk, install Linux Debian Moderno. It would be survival, wouldn't it?
That is awesome! Glad it worked out so well in the TAM. I do want to give a huge thanks to joevt on 68kmla, who actually devised that NVRAMRC patch... Which essentially only serves to ensure the onboard video FCode is evaluated last, as it is what causes the PCI bridge probing issue.
Can you help me? I need to develop a miniPCI EHCI (NEC chip) board for a router.
Absolutely love the patcher application at 8:33
Sean, FireWire won't show up in the System Profiler even if it works (which it should). The Sonnet Tempo Trio (USB, FireWire, ATA-133) exhibits the same behavior. System Profiler just doesn't seem capable of showing the FireWire bus when it's coming over pci-bridge.
P.S. Count me in for two clear back covers if MacEffects makes 'em!
I love seeing combo cards in their specific use cases! Even better when you get them mostly working.
A very successful experiment, but man I beg you please get these raisers and cards properly supported. Such beautiful thing deserves a proper printed cover and mount supports. For sake of health of this beautiful piece of history.
Re: Installing OS X on difficult machines. 1. Image your harddrive. 2. Install OS X in QEMU onto the image. 3. Write the image to your harddrive. This has helped me a couple of times with my G3 Desktop that doesn't have a working Apple CD ROM anymore.
Woah that enactment of your fall was savage!.... I hope you had adequate safety standards for a stunt like that.
1:52 Best reenactment ever, bravo!
You know... Maybe instead of a _whole_ clear back case, maybe it would make sense to get a translucent "bronze" tinted thick dual slot cover or the thin cover for the rear. Not too over the top, and would show off the heart of the machine, without the extreme work of swapping an entire case, which honestly, was _part_ of the selling point of the machine.
who knew that by making a TAM fully functional, one gets a magical haircut? steve jobs really had life figured out for us all, huh
PPA makes a similar card with an included IDE port and is compatible with MacOS 10.x (I used one with a DP mirror mac back in the day)
Try OS 9.2.1. My Sonnos pci usb/firewire card works great with it.
I remember that card, I never really thought it was great at the time due to the slots available but it was convenient for sure. I know I bought at least one. I've tossed so much awesome stuff over the years :(
If there were ever a card to need a modern clone, it would be this one. (Or the IDE added variant)
There are so many Macs that could benefit from such a cool combo card.
In older drives when you burn disks, it usually helps to burn them on the slowest speed possible that should give the best contrast in the burned dye, since the faster you burn typically the laser spends less time on each section of the disk and the dye gets burned more lightly which will work fine in newer drives with better lasers and better FEC but on older drives disks burnt at higher speeds usually don't work as well.
Using older media (combined with low speeds) makes a big difference. I've had pretty good luck with Sony discs, but I think I had one older spindle that worked and a newer that didn't. Usually a darker dye will work better.
The best would be either disc with Azo dye or the archival grade discs with a gold reflective layer the use Phthalocyanine dye.
I was gonna whine about it not being perfect with the broken disc drive before I got to that part. Very nice to see even if it might not be all that useful.
I'm happy you got that good working cd drive. This thing needed it so bad!
Lol, "if this breaks, you get to keep both pieces"
I'm getting bamboozled by the boot chime because the TAM boot chime is also my notification sound, haha
OMG! You missed a cheap pun! It's not the "All Ten of us are super grateful" but "All TAM of us are super grateful" 😁
Sweet! Also good to know I'm not the only one who uses an internal HTTP server to send things to my Macs!
Me likey the black speaker grills on gray case. Beautiful!
How long until the 20th Anniversary Macintosh wants a divorce because of all the shenanigans?
"if it breaks, you get to keep both pieces" HAHAHAHAHAHA that had me rolling!!!
🎁INBOX ME✍️
If a CD-Drive dont read burned CD's ... you need clean the lens. if the cleaning isnt enough -> laser power a little bit higher and the drive work with burned cd's too.
How about recreating a batch of these cards with sponsor PCBWay?
Sounds like it would be a great small batch hardware run that many here would want to purchase.
Very cool! Hope you are enjoying your ULTIMATE TAM. :D
Fellow TAM owner here, I don't have experience with hardware shenanigans but I'd buy a clear back TAM plate too 😄
now the real question, does the back panel fit?
not just "burned CD" but notice that the +R and -R are DIFFERENT, so it's possible that it e.g. doesn't like CD+R but works with CD-R, or something
CDs didn't have plus R and minus R, that was DVDs.
@@brandonupchurch7628 you're right
Really nice! BUT: Could you 3D-print a new big back for this pritty TAM (that keeps the figure of the non-extended Mac)? I also hated the original extension-box, Apple delivered with this machines.
A complete back - with a cap for the cables of additional cards - would have looked much better.
That was suspiciously successful! Are you sure you haven't been replaced by an impostor?
Plot twist, it's actually the Whiteboard Guy and the real Action Retro is imprisoned in the basement
Oof! Savage.
😂😅
You really need a custom back panel for that thing that can hold everything in nice
I bet you could 3D print a shroud for the back of this machine with a fan bracket, SSD slot, and and all the slots you need.
4:10 I think the card to the referenced video may be missing
"If this breaks, you get to keep both pieces." lol
Exciting! Always a good day is Action Retro upload day
Make or get a STL model file for the backing. Send it to your sponsor, PCBWay!
They do a great job of clear resin prints, and it would cost orders of magnitude less than an injection mold like your old Mac Classic.
Probably still not cheap at that size, but who knows... Maybe PCBWay is super affordable?
Oh good idea hah
That is A great upgrade card killer price to. Collin is the man yes you need mark to make you A clear fat back cover for the Tam
Would have been cool to see if the back with the case cover looks any cleaner now with the new card.
Glad you know Collin dos dude and chad.
That would be incredible for a system im making actually lol, the ideal mix of modern and legacy i/o. Only thing its lacking would be serial and parallel.
There's a good chance your USB Ethernet adapter is faster than that Comm Slot 2 Ethernet card...
oh course the german driver worked they had no other option
I don't know if anyone has noticed, but the mac looks like an oversized floppy disk from afara ahahaha
Great video.
Not much flex but I think I have the worlds most decked out Performa 6300CD. It has the Apple TV/Video system, fax modem, Farallon ethermac PDS card, Apple external video connector, 64mb RAM (with 128mb virtual memory), 128GB sata ssd divided into 4 equal partitions booting OS 7.6.1 and 9.1. Seems like this is 1 of the only models that's can't take a CPU upgrade... even in the cache slot (6360 CPU can be upgraded apparently).
For a future video you should service the cooling loop on your G5 quad (think your G5 is a quad) and perform the new blood mod. Will have to do that to mine soon... it runs too hot with no sign of leakage (yet). The dexcool is probably decomposing at this point.
Anyone here remember the games Brickle and Amaze on Mac Classic?
"My friend Greg sent me an iMessage"
I guess technically it was a PCIMessage
I got an ad for … paper, that isn’t even sold in my country 😂
"it's not hard once you get the hang of it" - sounds like my uncle the surgeon
Honestly a card like this just makes me think how this would be the perfect thing for syncing old iPods lol.
this made me very happy. thank you. =)
I can boot my g4 in os9 off a sata ssd, using a sata/ide bridge. Its a 1999 machine and the drive size is limited to 128gb
What next a custom ATi Radeon 9200 with 128 MB video card with a PLX Bridge chip and LAN card? Also a 3d printed case the back of the system?
I just started watching your video's. I used your G3 upgrade on my mini tower. I put a 350 Mhz G3 processor in it. Original was 266/33. Now it's stable at 433/78 or 416/83. The 433 is just a bit faster. I had a G5 but when turned on the power light just flashes. It's just sitting now.
What is the madel name of this card ? I would love to get it for my G4 Mac.
Can verify that my TAM refuses to load burned disks as well. Can also verify that my TAM bricked (temporarily) when attempting an OS X install. I had to remove the PRAM battery for a few days and it eventually came back to life.
it will play burned audio discs though. you can turn on with the remote and it will play the audio cd automatically after booting
@@bad_collector I never knew that. I appreciate the heads up.
Can we see it with the extended back on it to cleanly house and enclose all the cards?
Legitimately just curious, I'm not aware of any particular reason one might install 9.1 instead of 9.2.2. Is 9.1 significantly lighter or is it just a matter of personal preference? As far as I was aware iIt's not like Windows where 98 sometimes has legitimate benefits over stuff that came after.
On a lot of older PowerMacs, 9.1 is the last supported version, and you can't install 9.2 without some hacks
@@ActionRetro That's an interesting point and not one I was expecting -- I've never had anything older than a snow white G3 iBook so it's not something I would have run into, actually I'm more familiar with machines being unable to run classic MacOS whatsoever.
Wiggle jiggle wiggle jiggle wiggle jiggle. Your animated speech is too cute
great shenanigans t-shirt!
Video idea: watching a bluray on an old mac, or more likely just burning a disk :D.
Speaking of FireWire you need an external VST FireWire drive. One of the little orange and yellow ones.
You have "not see" the German driver comming xD
I saw the Data controller name and almost fell of my chair! And that's not good... I'm in a busy train ..
Sata rather.. stupid autocorrect
1:57 I wish we had Wawa's where I'm at. :(
I know that combo card! I had one in a souped up 8500 for years!
I use a triple PCI riser for my 20th and leave the back off for heat venting, since nobody goes around the back (who does) .... hmmm this looks interesting... Poland eh?
Neat! What's the triple riser from?
Thonked the ground in the dramatic reenactment.
Oh, I saw this on eBay a few weeks ago. I thought it was pretty novel!
multiplexers are such a genius hack. i dont understand why people dont use it more often smhh
Is the Collin that you are referring to the same one that has the "This Does Not Compute" channel?
Why is the TAM so finicky?
With firewire not working... is it a fluke of the dosdude video or is there a solder blob shorting some pins between 70 - 80 of the VIA VT6306 chip?
Oh man, I have that exact PCI USB / FireWire card. Mine also has IDE, I think.
EDIT: Fixed spelling mistakes lol
Nice wawa bag brother
Wow! DosDude1 is legendary!
Ah yes, the Jerry Mac
Now waiting for the action retro / this does not compute crossover episode
Power PC overlock shoot-out
Kinda stupid question, but do anyone know what regulation it is that says that one of the languages in these cd drives. The yellow label that says "class 1 laser product" (luokan 1 laser laite) that one of those languages has to be Finnish.
Originally i thought it was some weird North European thing or even just European thing.
But i have seen it on devices that for 100% certainty were sold on North America.
I have been wondering this this ever since I noticed it on my Playstation 1 console, but back then i just thought it was just an European thing.
Too funny, is that tam still a TAM??
god damned i seen that card on allegro (equivalent of amazon in poland) but i cant find it now
update 2 : full name : KALEA-INFORMATIQUE PCI FIREWIRE 400 Controller Card (Ieee1394a) + USB 2.0 + SATA - 9 Ports
Does Windows NT for PowerPC work on this? If yes, please quadrupleboot
4:10 you forgot the video card.
I have a name for your TAM, Tammy and why not
I love this project
you forgot the card at 4:10!
Thanks for the multiple shout outs bro it was freaking hilarious 🤣 and you’re welcome brother ❤️
It said neuf on label. Neuf = 9 in French.
Wonder if dosdude can upgrade the soldered ram on my ol Acer Zg5. Not a mac but it'd be sweet
If you pay him enough, probably.
@@s8wc3 not much in the world is free
I watched Dosdude build an IDE SSD a few weeks ago😄👍
9:15 This is about as janky as my Dell Optiplex 9010 AIO rigged up to a Titan Black on a Beast mpci GPU dock with external power supply and another monitor, since the external GPU won't power the built in screen.🤣
WHY? when I have a perfectly fine 6850k/1070 desktop? I Just had to scratch that random tinker ich🤣
If that PCI card could also work on Windows 9x, I can think of at least a couple of builds, including one of my own, that would want one of these, as well ⁉️❕
I suspect they might. I haven't checked how far they go back OS wise, but mac users spend our time flashing them /from/ PC versions.
The SATA controller has a driver for 98SE and ME and it works in real mode with the option ROM. I don't know if there is a driver for USB 2.0, but USB 1.1 and Firewire should work out of the box.
@@Drucklufttroete The commonly seen "nusb36e" driver adds USB 2 and mass storage device support to 98SE by backporting appropriate files from newer versions of Windows.
Then I suppose my only question is... what is the model of this card, so I can look it up and see if anywhere is selling it? because DUDE!
@Jorge Ramos Technically it is a "ST-200"
Oh hey, that's almost my name
If you ever get a second one of these (because I don’t want you to mess this up) I think it’d be cool to gut it and put in m1 innards - especially if you can find a 12.1 screen in the retina dpi range with the right aspect ratio.
The I/O could be a thunderbolt dock extricated from its case with a custom backplate that conforms to the TAM’s dimensions but modern port layout.
My old amd had a similar card.