its in their terms and conditions... Before any scheduled delivery, you will receive an email or other notice from the Company with instructions on how to complete the remaining payment for the Product (and we will attempt to send such email to you at least 2 weeks before any scheduled delivery). If payment is not provided within 48 hours of receiving such email, your order will be cancelled unless we consent otherwise.
Payment on delivery? Don’t most dealerships operate on a consignment like process? Like they pay a monthly fee to have the bike on the floor than once it sells they pay the remaining price?
It's a dealership preference. You can have the bike sent through another dealer that will collect payment on arrival/pickup. If you're having it delivered to your house, you can pay in advance or pay through the dealer when it goes through them.
Bs? Ok go online right now and order a TV . See if they’ll ship it to you without you paying …. Let me know how you go . These bikes are being customised for customers then shipped directly to them . Why would they send them without being paid for ? 🤷♂️
@@Ozfreerider_adventures most people leave all of the initial shipping and buying to a dealer. as soon as you hand that dealer your money, you get the bike you pay for. if you are giving your money to a website that promises to ship you a dirt bike overseas and is constantly delaying your product, i would not want to pay an upfront cost of 13k for a bike that isnt even build yet let alone in the same country as you. there are a lot more things that can go wrong. (insert murphy's law)
Well here's the deal! Its up to the dealers to get these in stock and if they aren't willing to take the risk why should the consumer? With that being said I rode one and WOW WOW WOW WOW is an understatement. That 5min ride still brings a smile and I didn't ever get to mess around with it. I have several KTM's and Enduro bikes and this is the very definition on a game changer!!!!
How is it a ponzi scheme when there are almost 2000 bikes delivered to customers worldwide already? Its a brand new company going through growing pains of manufacturing their first product in mass scale.
@@bwhaskell it looks.like its about not reading the terms and conditions, nothing else... Before any scheduled delivery, you will receive an email or other notice from the Company with instructions on how to complete the remaining payment for the Product (and we will attempt to send such email to you at least 2 weeks before any scheduled delivery). If payment is not provided within 48 hours of receiving such email, your order will be cancelled unless we consent otherwise.
I have zero interest in an electric dirtbike. Only way I could see buying one is if you own some acreage and you don't want to piss off your neighbors riding. Outside of that, I don't care how much faster it is. The noise and smell is a big part of why we like dirtbikes it's part of the riding and viewing experience.
My guess is many who pre-ordered are cancelling (myself included) so they want to lock in orders by demanding payment in full before they start assembly.
That is a really good point! So many TH-camrs (not bashing Kyle, you know the type I’m talking about) paid their $100 to make a video about it with no intention of buying. Same thing with cyber truck, every jackass claimed they were buying a cyber truck day 1 just for they hype. Stark May be covering their ass and trying to get a real count on how many of these things actually need to be built and how many parts to order.
This is exactly what it is - they are a new company that has very narrow margins. They can build smaller queues and move forward. But Stark over-promised and allowed the hype to build and didn’t try to control expectations. Anyone buying a version 1 for that much money is more adventurous with their money than I am.
Probably, but this is also said in their terms and conditions. So all of us that never read any terms and conditions, contract and stuff at all, are the ones who are getting angry and pissed when something like.this shows up, I am the same and ive done that a lot of times..Before the delivery date (not stated period for delivery date so it could be 1 day, 1 year..) they will contact you and send you instructions for full payment...If the payment is not processed they will cancel the order...
Every company would want to lock in and get payment for the exact amount presold, but that’s not feasible. You make projections. They build the amount that were ordered, and if some back out, the worst that happens is they actually have bikes for dealers to put on the showroom floor.
yeah I agree. as a hobbyist in electrical engineering and hands on electronics all the time, my concern is the fact that the math doesn't add up, like not even close. their bike is advertised as 80 hp which it might actually be able to do, but anything beyond 25 hp power output is severely damaging the batteries in those bikes since not even the highest quality batteries ever produced, like lab batteries, not even purchasable, cannot output even close to wat they advertise their battery to output. notice how NO other ev bikes are really anything above 30 hp peak? it because I think stark varg is going to sell a lot of this one bike and then in the future when everyone realizes that it needs a new battery not even every summer of racing then they just apologize, transfer to a parent company, or disappear with all the money.
😂😂😂Yeah that’s why they have almost 20,000 sold or on order 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂Of course people are asking for them. Do you live under a rock or something? The Government has absolutely nothing to do with it and are forcing absolutely nothing 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂You are very uninformed on the topic.
easy answer... decide if you want the Stark or not, and just buy it. or don't. there is nothing wrong with them asking for pre payment. it's business when things are in a pinch. Covid killed profit margins world wide. investors can only be milked so much. just because they need the money does not mean they are going bankrupt. buying the bike now will help them. but if you don't Kyle, someone else will soon enough.
Electric bike has no soul we ride because we love the whole atmosphere of listening to the engine the vibration the feeling of a heartbeat which is the motor have a nice day
You’d change that tune when you ride one. My dude was the same then he did a run in sport mode with my bike in unrestricted.let’s just say he has the same bike now and his pit bike collects dust. For daily fun you can’t beat it. It won’t fill replace a gas bike but in addition too. You’ll find yourself on it more than you think. Like there is noise with them it’s not silent for you just for the other people. Nothing like the smell of fumes. A burnout smells the same whether electric or gas
The bike is worth it. Just pay up if you really want it. It'll likely arrive well before April 2024 at this point. This video is in bad taste imo. Its your dealer passing the buck onto you because they don't want to pay in full up front. Keep in mind this is a brand new dirt bike company and you're comparing it to experiences you've had with manufacturers who have been in business for decades.
Definitely not showing up before April! My delivery date was Aug 30th and then got pushed to Dec 15th. It's Dec 10th today and I haven't been contacted for shit! When asked where it was I got told I'd be contacted by a dealer. 2 more e mails since then have been met with crickets! 3 people in my area got bikes 2 months ago because they paid ahead of time, after I found this out and tried to do the same but the option was disabled! I understand they rolled out the red carpet for you so your very biased but a lot of us normal buyers haven't had a great experience!
The only instance in which upfront full payment is appropriate is with a highly custom, highly expensive product. Even in industries with highly custom equipment, payment is generally in the range of 30-50% upfront and an additional 30ish% upon whatever triggers purchase of materials for the project, and finally the remaining percentage generally due within 30-60 days of shipment. I have only ever seen full upfront payment one time, and it was on a 5+ million dollar project. You are very right that this is unacceptable, especially for a standard, non-custom product.
I'm with you, Kyle. I pay when I receive the product, not before. I have no problem giving a deposit, as I have with several vehicles I've ordered. But I'm not paying full price up front. No way, no how. In this situation I could see, maybe, paying $1500-2000 deposit to confirm your intent to purchase. But full price? Fuuuuuuuuudge that.
Same for everyone. I paid, and wait about 2 weeks before the bike came to me in sweden. And its super. Why do u cry? Delete your order and by a gas bike if u are so worried.
It amazes me that anyone still asks for 100% payment up front for anything. This reminds me of watching the stories we all see on our local news stations - multiple times a year - of a person who paid a contractor 100% up front for a swimming pool to be installed, and a year later all they have is a gigantic hole in their back yard and a contractor who won't answer their calls anymore.
Maybe in the USA, in europe.everything is paid upfront, only time that you pay on delivery is like the official dealer dont have a car model at the time with the color you want, or something from the additional equipment, and you pay that on delivery because you dont know the final cost...meaning the additional equpment may be only available in a model along with other equpments, so in that case that model may cost more....
if you dont have the money you pay with bank credit which the official dealer will apply for it in your name which you will pay the loan fully in 3 years for a car....
Yes, I was frustrated at first. I am a first day order. I was not willing to loan Stark money as well. My bike is now April. I am insisting on financing my order through my dealer. Several states including mine can not take deliveries as a distribution license required- in process. As a Tesla owner just keep in mind the product you get will be better then the ones already delivered. This new product is having bugs worked out and improvements. My dealer so far has been upfront about the process. I re ordered a bike at my same lower price(1,000$ cheaper) via the dealer- he had no problem honoring my early order price. The dealer has access to your order via order number. He said he will make some money on a new order vs no money on an order “ transfer”. It is winter- I am happy to wait for an improved bike in the spring/summer.
Hey Kyle, first let me begin with I love the channel. Nonetheless, specifically talking about this video. 100% understand your comments/remarks about this situation. However, just putting it out there some things are done like this. One case I know about is Corvettes. Every one that comes off the assembly line is bought and paid for. This is either done by the dealer or an individual that orders them. It has been like that for several years. Please don’t get it wrong - I do agree with you on buying this bike, especially which is one that is a totally new (newish market) EV. Awesome work, continue on brother! Lastly - KTM is the only real company for me. 🇦🇹
I am with there mate. I was one of the earlier order here in Australia. Put my $100 down and the date has been pushed back well over a year. Now they want my money to assemble the bike an ship it to me. We have some in the country on display at dealer that were not even dealers at the time of my order. Why was my order an so many others not fullfilled before the dealers and their orders. I have zero faith or trust is stark at this point and will no longer have anything to do with the brand and their misleading sales campaign and wrong doing by their customer's.
When have you purchased something online and not paid full price up front? You have to pay up front for bike parts from RMATV. They give you a general idea of when something is going to be delivered but that all goes out the door if an item is out of stock. They still keep your money but keep dragging you along for the delivery date, sometimes for months. You are buying one large item from one manufacturer in Europe. The logistics for that in today's business climate are ridiculous. You can complain but it seems in poor taste.
You should buy the 24 beta 300race edition with a dual spark plugs and do a review on it. Lord knows we’ve all gotten the memo on KTMs cause you’ve reviewed so many of them every year.
I'm 52.i agree with you.ill buy one when a dealer near me has them available for me to buy on spot like the rest.yes.i still ride even though I don't have a bike currently because of a divorce.i want a varg badly.but I'll wait.hopefully getting a used 4 stroke first.thanks
Tell the “assigned” dealer to call you when yours is on the showroom floor, charged and ready to rock. Till them they can pound sand until they are fully capitalized.
I got crazy idea, just don’t buy one. No one is twisting anyone’s arm. But from what I’ve heard reading peoples reviews it’s been well worth the money and the wait.
Junk bond, no interest. This company likely did not do their homework correctly early on and is in trouble. Thanks for doing this video. Keeps people from getting hurt by a company that is at high risk of bankruptcy.
To me, this is clearly a company having cash flow issues. It does not instill a lot of confidence that they will be around to support the product. I would steer way clear!
Thought you were gonna say because they are death machines with no clutch (whiskey throttle). Or battery life .One woods model that raced locally did not finish the harescramble the other weekend on lowest power setting. 2hrs long
i got my call and they said its being assembled and put on a shipping container they never asked me to pay for it until i receive it it must be your dealer trying to get the money early somthing is diffrent about your dealer mine never asked for any money and said i pay for it when i pick it up
was on their FB page and they had a post that said something like "Best MX bike?" told them to win a few races before they try to make that claim and my comment was deleted ...
To be fair to Stark, they're a startup company so they are probably having cashflow issues and therefore can't cover the cost of all the bikes for a few months before they get paid. Making the battery structural was a huge mistake IMO. The cells in the battery are nothing special, a spare battery should be $2k (i've heard they want $7k...half the price of a battery for my Tesla and the battery is 1/12 the size) and they should be swappable in seconds for us woods/enduro guys. It was a fundamental error in design, will be sticking with gas bikes for the foreseeable future even though i'm excited to see the future of E bikes.
Not true about what it costs to build, bulk pricing for the cells alone (suspect P45b cells now instead of p42a when they updated the battery from 6 to 6.5kwh) would total over $3000, plus bms, cases and cost of assembly pieces such as bus bars. My best guess is actual materials cost is pushing $4.5-5k. Ive built surron batteries and people think just bc they can get the cells for $900(which reality is its closer to $1200-1300) they should be able to buy the battery for for under $1200 when it requires bus bar material(if using proper copper bars can be about $100) and 8-12 welds on every cell(about 200 cells) so its very labor intensive(at best I can manually do full build in about 10-12hrs). Stark battery is 2x that size fyi
Congrats on your best performing video to date. Good catch on jumping on the bandwagon of catering to the whiney community of people who fail to see the bigger picture of builidng a company such as Stark Future. The Varg is new and proprietary technology from a new company. You and everyone knew it while putting the deposite down. You also knew (or 100% should have) that changes might happen along the way. That is why you have the opportunity to back out. The business model is in no way unheard of in high end, innovative, reaching for the stars product companies. As, get this, it freakin' hard to innovate niche narkets. I have an espresso machine that actually cost slightly more and required payment before manufacturing - not even assembly. It was my choice to accept and support that business. Now I have a unique and wonderful machine that puts a smile on my face every morning at the very least. Furthermore, the Stark has a creater cost to the company than it sales price. They are holding the price until pre-orders are done. I estimate an increase of 3-5k in the next few years. I have no information to back this claim other than an engineering degree, life in entrepreneurship, 10y in custom bikes and the ability to calculate. I can not fault you for making a great performing video, you have a business to run and that's increasing it. But I do not aplaude any narrow minded narratives or the populistic approach it holds. Yes, my Varg has reached me and I paid for it. And no, I do not have any agenda other than wanting to ride the best motorcycle ever reaching production and seeing nore and more companies taking on this difficult journey of bringing amazing products to life.
Do they accept credit card final payment, which would provide protection? I ordered yesterday and thought the bike would be delivered to my home, with no additional dealer related costs. Am I wrong about that? The Stark website said 0% sales tax.
I’m with ya, I was contacted by my dealer last week saying the same thing. I’m going to pass and possibly get one when they have them in stock. But I was locked in at the early prices when I put my deposit down and now they are $1000 more?
My local dealer Mosites Motorsports in North Versailles, PA has them on the showroom floor. I'm not a fan because i love the sound of a motor But, they have been riding one at Mosites and they said it has some incredible power as in way more than a 450.
But it's worth it. I got mine in October and it's the best MX bike I've every had. And I have more than 80 dirtbikes. Maico, every version of Husky Auto, Rokon and on and on.
Come on Kyle, you’re self employed too. You know they can’t deliver a bike to every person who put down a $100 deposit and then ask for $13k upon arrival. What percentage put the $100 down and now don’t have the money to follow through? It’s not always the business that needs to stick it’s neck out.
Come on Dane, a business shouldn’t ask for 100 dollar deposit and then ask for full price before the product is delivered, let alone built! What world do you live in? To me, the business made a poor decision to only ask for 100 dollars to gage genuine interest in the product and now they are crapping themselves because they don’t have the money to actually put the dang things together!
If I buy a spec house, I pay nothing until its done. That is what a Stark is, a spec motorcycle. Its not a custom. No other motorcycle manufacturer does this. Stark obviously is struggling with cash flow and trying to sucker prospective buyers into helping them.
@@lbever454Bad analogy... A spec house is built by a developer who is "speculating" he'll find an unknown buyer. If you found a house in construction you wanted, I promise you, the builder would require a significant deposit, or he'd just keep the house on the market. No builder in his right mind would say OK lbever, you say you want my house..I won't sell it to anyone else because I trust you REALLY want my house...right. This case is more like having custom home built for you. The builder requires a down payment & then progress payments; which probably would have been a better way for Stark to have done this. There are motorcycle builders (mostly chopper builders) who work with the same deposit/progress payments/final payment system. I suspect, this pay-in-advance model may be more common in Europe.
fuk it! I wanted one so I paid for one. It worked out to be $2000 nzd cheaper for the 80hp model by paying upfront, the due date is the end of December. no one is forcing anyone to pay upfront but if you don't want to wait another year then you have to cough up the cash.
I wouldn't pay full in advance for any motorcycle, let alone an electric form an unestablished company.... and Screw you Kyle, if you're not looking at the comments 🤣
Got to be your Dealer, I got a call from my dealer and they asked for $500.00 down, verifying my order. I'm suppose to pick my bike up end of this month with the a check. It was a local dealer one of two from my state.
My local dealer at kissel motorsports has a few in stock and even had a demo day. I'm going down this Sat. I'll let you know if thier in stock. This is pa tho.
Agree, but I think they have money issues because of the pandemic. They have to respect the price and for 2 years, Inflation rates are high, the currencies and the material prices went up. So if they do another way, they may go bankrupt. Also they had to pay the factory and the employees all that time.
When I was in the military Harley did that but backwards. You could get an interest free loan to buy a Harley and pay for it when you’re overseas and when you get back to America, you just tell them what date and what dealership in America they would deliver it.
Ok so order one at or local dealer then, and not directly at the factory. Just whait untill you ride yours :) ...... looking forward to that video, cheers!
I mean... Technically Maico requests 50% up front before they even start your bike build for one of their bikes. If they are true to their word and offer a refund if needed, I don't see anything wrong with this.
They already have the capital to build the bikes, as you mentioned they already have the parts. I think part of the reason they may be doing this is alot of people have been cancelling orders so what do they do to insure you can actually pay for the bike if they get it to you when youve only invested $100? Make sure you can pay upfront is their solution. I think its not ideal and maybe in the future it will be closer between payment and receipt but tbh from a sustainable business it makes more sense as you wont have companies folding due lack of sales and having blow out sales on old inventory. Sure its better for the company but it makes it more sustainable business which hasnt been electric bikes like Alta(had funding from harley who backed out so they collapsed where Stark is far less likely to fail in similar situation). Just playing devils advocate as to why they may be doing it this way and to me it actually doesnt bother me thing being this way as you arent getting scalped by a dealer here like every other mfg has been doing.
Dude, this is seriously why you're cancelling?? Hundreds of people in the US have already gotten theirs this way. Also: this is up to the dealer, not Stark Future. You can have them ship your bike through a dealer that will accept payment on pickup or delivery. They're doing it this way to avoid $500+ dealership fees to make it cheaper for the consumer. They made agreements with dealerships and agreed to throw them some money on the company's expense so that you can still get a certificate of origin and some other paperwork (has to go through the dealer for that apparently). The dealer can either have it shipped straight to your door or you can pick it up from them - they give you the option. If you had bothered to look into it (obviously you didn't), you would have seen that hundreds of people have gotten theirs this way with no issues and the bikes have been arriving before the stated delivery dates on the website. Them asking for payment, from what I have seen in the communities, means that your bike is likely arriving at your door within the next few weeks. What dramatic video over such a tiny "inconvenience". And to cancel your bike over it... You didn't even bother looking into it. Other dirt bike TH-camrs are just going to be way ahead of you on this now.
So I placed my order 2 years ago, had a delivery date of Aug 30th and then got pushed back to December 15th. It's only about a week out and I haven't been contacted for money or anything! Not to mention someone here in my area got his 2 months ago and he placed his order after I did! When I email to ask what's going on I get ghosted! Not very confident inspiring!
@@JasonHolloway-p3n that's really odd. Maybe check your spam folder? I ordered well after the announcement and mine was ready to ship last month but I actually told them to postpone it until spring (didn't want to get the bike during winter, when I can't ride around where I live because of the snow and winter trail closures). I would try contacting them again. They've been known to have great customer service and always respond. Maybe your email slipped through the cracks somehow. I've never heard of them ghosting anyone, people would have been mentioning that in the communities. A lot of friends that ordered early on got their bikes already. Definitely just try reaching out to them again and make sure to check your spam folder. I caught one of their emails in my spam folder before.
Thought you might want to own stock in the company ! 😂 I had the same problem buying a Effen BBQ ! Paid upfront and waited and Waited and waited some more . Customer service assured me that I would receive it ! I was like I needed it about 3 weeks ago . You will have it in the next two weeks . I know what they did . They called China and had them assemble one and ship it out in the next shipping container and got sent to a warehouse in Chino , California then they trucked it to Los Angeles and had UPS bring it to my house . Royally Sucks ! Just trying to save a couple of bucks . Yes I ordered a custom color . Then I told them to send me whatever you have in stock . The unit I received was the right one . But damn ! They should have them in stock before trying to sell them . Never again !!! Thank you for the video and information . It is BS ! Tell them , Send me all the parts and I will assemble it myself . 😂
I have watched a few reviews, they all seem like they are paid to make outrageous claims about range and magical handling, some thing is fishy about the company.
Its their terma and conditions, nothing to do with anything else, looks like more to do with we dont read anything at all... Before any scheduled delivery, you will receive an email or other notice from the Company with instructions on how to complete the remaining payment for the Product (and we will attempt to send such email to you at least 2 weeks before any scheduled delivery). If payment is not provided within 48 hours of receiving such email, your order will be cancelled unless we consent otherwise.
@@TheTonyBeaunorth macedonia, if you buy brand new car or motorcycle you wait up to 3 months for homologation documents approved, than you get your bike and you are able to register it if street legal get licence for it... :) ...this is buying a bike available immediately...if you order some model not available its up to 1 year delivery, it may happen 1 or 2 months more :))
I got news for you. Manufacturers are going that route. They are saying no more dealers. Like online shoppers ride motorcycles or something. Manufacturers need to monitor dealers to keep them from marking up the prices to where people are going used now
You should have asked... I paid $12k up front in March for an e-moto that never got built. My CC co. told me (before I sent the $$) as long as I made a claim in less than a year, I'd get a FULL refund. I waited 10 months & got credited in 2 weeks. Yes, this sounds like an interest-free loan...but what about the ppl who gave Tesla $50k deposit for the Roadster two years ago with absolutely no realistic chance of getting a car within their lifetime & do you think Tesla needs the money to prevent bankruptcy? This is just how some "modern" business work...don't like it..guaranteed, your spot has already been taken..you loose!
I am toying with the idea of building an overland 05 Lexus GX470 tow vehicle. Many of those expensive components are in limited supply and have to be ordered and paid in full before they will build more. I see the Stark Varg as something with a very new and limited demand. Plus it's almost like a custom build the supplier being so small. I see no problem with their current business model while they recover their initial investment and financial comittment to their investors. But I live in CA where access to good offroad bikes and riding areas is complicated. Also since others want to beat up on EVs. We have owned them since they became widely available and they're just simply awesome. Nothing to be afraid of.
Well you are about the first one that I have heard say that. If you had a clue on why Alta went out of business you would also know it had absolutely nothing to do with the quality or performance of the bike 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂
If they have emailed you to pay for the build then your bike will be with you in like 2 weeks, not months. That’s what mine took to the U.K from payment, maybe it’ll be slightly more to the U.S. Speak to them. These things aren’t off the shelf bikes like every other bike on the market, they put springs in to your weight, you chose the rear wheel size, hand brake/foot brake, 60 or 80hp and colour. A business needs assurances that bike is going out the door once built and not being pulled apart again to build up for someone else because you e changed your mind, it’s just too many configurations. Yes, this could be done by a non refundable deposit but they’d still have the hassle of selling or stripping the bike back. It’s just not worth it. I get the fear, I had it too but the logic is there somewhere and the bike is pretty special man!
Kyle.. no need to get upset.. a cash poor company always asks for up front money from investors or consumers…. Watch Alex Martin’s softball review…. Stark should change the name from Varq to “2 Pump Chump”…. 30 minutes ride time and @70% of your battery life is gone…limp mode follows shortly thereafter… and lest we forget, no $7k battery swap while in the pits… and 3-4 hours on a pollution spewing generator gets you to @50%… Stark Farse…
Stark wants its dealers to buy a two bike display that costs $6500usd. This means that the dealer will have to "buy" two Starks to put them on display in the display. The local dealer has two Starks in stock and they can't sell them because they are display/test ride bikes. And yes, Stark now wants the dealer to collect the money for the bike. No more direct sales from Stark to the customer. Dude, 10/10 for the rant!
Bad sign that the company is most likely bankrupt. If they want payment in full that far ahead it’s only because they don’t have enough capital or credit to keep the lights on and doors open. That or you’re talking to a scammer (not stark) trying to con you. Don’t do it. Stark might be a failed startup and those with them may end up with an unserviceable bike…
FINALLY, someone who gets it. EV bikes are a fad just like EV vehicles. Unrealistic ride times, long charge times, and no ability to work on them yourselves when it boils down to it. Long live gas bikes.
@@CatholicFitnessthis is short sighted. I know it’s been said for years but solid state batteries are so close and will change everything. I can’t wait for the reduced maintenance, quiet operation that silences the noise complainers that shut down our trails and tracks, and the tune ability that will allow my kids to ride at low power and work their way up to full power. Toyota has announced the just released 2024 Tacoma will have a tiny solid state battery in the sound system and full size EV solid state batteries for some 2026 models (900 mile range, 10 minute charge time). I don’t love that the government has been pushing this stuff but I don’t allow politics to blind me to the advantages. I can’t wait to dump our family’s four 2 stroke bikes for electric.
@@davidawaters Advantages? Traditional gas combustion engines still hold countless advantages over EV vehicles and will for many years to come. If you live in an area where tracks and trails are shut down due to noise or "pollution", you need to vote for better politicians. No such thing is happening in my conservative state. Oh, and the several hundred-mile range EV's have been talked about for years and they are still YEARS away from being able to do that. I'm not against EVs, just against the push and force when impracticable. Oh, and some of us enjoy the noise and smell of a nice two-stroke or torque of a 4-stroke. I don't deny the performance of an EV, but they're not the same as a traditional bike.
I listed the advantages-two you didn’t address. Maintenance is a big one for me. I have a ton of hobbies and would like the low maintenance of an electric bike as I may go months without riding. I don’t have time for much maintenance, esp with so many bikes. My electric lawnmower and weed eater have been so nice-for 4 years now. Also, the ability to run an 80hp bike at any power level down to 10 hp (10x better tuning ability than any combustion engine bike) is great for kids and new riders. I live in a conservative state as well (and am mostly conservative myself) and your comment confirms my suspicion that you’ve let politics cloud your judgment. Noise for me is more about riding in those areas that might not be all that legal 😉 I couldn’t care less about noise or pollution of bikes. The needed battery tech will be here soon. We are finally seeing it after years of promises-your feed and searches may be full of conservative anti EV💩 so you wouldn’t ever see it. I love my 2 strokes, but can’t wait for electric bikes that are better. The Stark Varg seems to be close to what I’m looking for. It’s too heavy and battery range is not there yet. I’m thankful for the early adopters that buy these bikes though, which will help drive advancement. I can easily see the future on this, and we won’t get there unless we have the bikes like the Varg between now and then. You are basically against the present state of EV’s, without looking into the future. You can be against the government pushing this stuff without being against the vehicles themselves. We don’t get to the better future without compromised, imperfect bikes like this. I’m not buying in yet with my money, but am definitely for progress on this. You don’t need to be some kind of an automotive engineer to see this (although I happen to be one). This reminds me of people being against cordless power tools-until they weren’t. And somehow they never saw it coming.
@@davidawaters there is a reason why every major manufacturer is losing billions on the EV market right now. The proof is in the pudding, and the EV market in general (even major manufacturers such as Tesla), completely sucks. They are abhorrently expensive to maintain, build, buy, and repair, and have significantly more problems that only automotive engineers as yourself can only fix. We will see in 10, 20, and 30 years which products will still be around. These products are only being pushed for political reasons, and your comment about your senses being confirmed is ignorant. I only mentioned it because it is the left pushing for this market in a time when it is light years, not years, away from being ready. I am only using common sense to dictate we don't need to buy into this crap until it's ready. And I doubt this will be in my lifetime. Until then, I will enjoy ripping my gas bikes which will last forever, and you can stick to swapping your battery out every hour for minimal range and noise-free 'fun"
@@brockashsfrund I have multiple bikes so the range is less important to me, but yes. That is something to consider if the stark was your one and only bike. 30 to 40 miles or a couple of hours track time depending on how hard you ride. I almost backed out when the first range tests started coming out, but now that I’ve got my bike, the range is better than I expected.
Your dealer is the one asking for full payment. Stark is now accepting Payment On Delivery from their dealers as of a month or so ago.
Same, my dealer said wait until it arrives
Oh god this guys here
its in their terms and conditions...
Before any scheduled delivery, you will receive an email or other notice from the Company with instructions on how to complete the remaining payment for the Product (and we will attempt to send such email to you at least 2 weeks before any scheduled delivery). If payment is not provided within 48 hours of receiving such email, your order will be cancelled unless we consent otherwise.
Payment on delivery? Don’t most dealerships operate on a consignment like process? Like they pay a monthly fee to have the bike on the floor than once it sells they pay the remaining price?
@ivangalovski4190 those terms and conditions have not been relevant for months, because Stark is not completing the transaction. Dealers are.
No Kyle….you are 100 percent right in calling their bs…I would take a hard pass on this.
It's a dealership preference. You can have the bike sent through another dealer that will collect payment on arrival/pickup. If you're having it delivered to your house, you can pay in advance or pay through the dealer when it goes through them.
Bs? Ok go online right now and order a TV . See if they’ll ship it to you without you paying …. Let me know how you go . These bikes are being customised for customers then shipped directly to them . Why would they send them without being paid for ? 🤷♂️
@@Ozfreerider_adventures you arnt paying 13,000 for your tv.
@@davidjdunham same concept , a company won’t ship something to you that you havnt paid for I don’t know how this is a confusing issue for some people
@@Ozfreerider_adventures most people leave all of the initial shipping and buying to a dealer. as soon as you hand that dealer your money, you get the bike you pay for. if you are giving your money to a website that promises to ship you a dirt bike overseas and is constantly delaying your product, i would not want to pay an upfront cost of 13k for a bike that isnt even build yet let alone in the same country as you. there are a lot more things that can go wrong. (insert murphy's law)
Well here's the deal! Its up to the dealers to get these in stock and if they aren't willing to take the risk why should the consumer? With that being said I rode one and WOW WOW WOW WOW is an understatement. That 5min ride still brings a smile and I didn't ever get to mess around with it. I have several KTM's and Enduro bikes and this is the very definition on a game changer!!!!
So invest your life savings to be a dealer im sure you'll sell them all at the miniscule mark up they want
You mean the Stark "2 Pump Chump " smile..the one that lasts for 30 minutes then your back in the pits...and heading home..
Get on board, the pioneers need your support to advance, No need to hate@@BERZERKERSV4
Yeah, it's insane to pay full price for a bike that's not going to be delivered until next year. Feels like a ponzi scheme.
How is it a ponzi scheme when there are almost 2000 bikes delivered to customers worldwide already? Its a brand new company going through growing pains of manufacturing their first product in mass scale.
@@bwhaskell He clearly doesn't know what a ponzi scheme is.
It's not reading the terms and conditions before agreeing and proceeding.
@@OtisFlintdefinitely doesn't know, i guess that's why he is surprised that Stark asked for full payment...
@@bwhaskell it looks.like its about not reading the terms and conditions, nothing else...
Before any scheduled delivery, you will receive an email or other notice from the Company with instructions on how to complete the remaining payment for the Product (and we will attempt to send such email to you at least 2 weeks before any scheduled delivery). If payment is not provided within 48 hours of receiving such email, your order will be cancelled unless we consent otherwise.
I have zero interest in an electric dirtbike. Only way I could see buying one is if you own some acreage and you don't want to piss off your neighbors riding. Outside of that, I don't care how much faster it is. The noise and smell is a big part of why we like dirtbikes it's part of the riding and viewing experience.
Then just go in the garage and rev your bike. Why even ride it?
My guess is many who pre-ordered are cancelling (myself included) so they want to lock in orders by demanding payment in full before they start assembly.
That is a really good point! So many TH-camrs (not bashing Kyle, you know the type I’m talking about) paid their $100 to make a video about it with no intention of buying. Same thing with cyber truck, every jackass claimed they were buying a cyber truck day 1 just for they hype.
Stark May be covering their ass and trying to get a real count on how many of these things actually need to be built and how many parts to order.
@@tylerzesiger7648 100% agree!
This is exactly what it is - they are a new company that has very narrow margins. They can build smaller queues and move forward. But Stark over-promised and allowed the hype to build and didn’t try to control expectations. Anyone buying a version 1 for that much money is more adventurous with their money than I am.
Probably, but this is also said in their terms and conditions. So all of us that never read any terms and conditions, contract and stuff at all, are the ones who are getting angry and pissed when something like.this shows up, I am the same and ive done that a lot of times..Before the delivery date (not stated period for delivery date so it could be 1 day, 1 year..) they will contact you and send you instructions for full payment...If the payment is not processed they will cancel the order...
Every company would want to lock in and get payment for the exact amount presold, but that’s not feasible. You make projections. They build the amount that were ordered, and if some back out, the worst that happens is they actually have bikes for dealers to put on the showroom floor.
Definitely wait for them to be more established. Who knows, they might not survive all this. Glad you did the video. Keep 'em coming!
They doing very well bro. I own a stark. I paid early too
What if thay :Claim BankRuptcy.???? You will be OUT OF YOUR DOWN PAYMENT>!!! NO Resource TO Recover any of YOUR MONEY.!!!
Survive all what ?
yeah I agree. as a hobbyist in electrical engineering and hands on electronics all the time, my concern is the fact that the math doesn't add up, like not even close. their bike is advertised as 80 hp which it might actually be able to do, but anything beyond 25 hp power output is severely damaging the batteries in those bikes since not even the highest quality batteries ever produced, like lab batteries, not even purchasable, cannot output even close to wat they advertise their battery to output. notice how NO other ev bikes are really anything above 30 hp peak? it because I think stark varg is going to sell a lot of this one bike and then in the future when everyone realizes that it needs a new battery not even every summer of racing then they just apologize, transfer to a parent company, or disappear with all the money.
You must never rode the bike then because 25hp is childs play on this bike. It handles the power very well@garbageman3992
Nobody is asking for EVs. The government needs to stop forcing these on us.
Exactly. Dont buy it.
the market says otherwise
Plenty of us are, hence why they're breaking sales records every quarter.
😂😂😂Yeah that’s why they have almost 20,000 sold or on order 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂Of course people are asking for them. Do you live under a rock or something? The Government has absolutely nothing to do with it and are forcing absolutely nothing 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂You are very uninformed on the topic.
@@OtisFlintBBC watchers that's all. The chicken will come home to roost.
easy answer... decide if you want the Stark or not, and just buy it. or don't.
there is nothing wrong with them asking for pre payment. it's business when things are in a pinch. Covid killed profit margins world wide. investors can only be milked so much. just because they need the money does not mean they are going bankrupt. buying the bike now will help them. but if you don't Kyle, someone else will soon enough.
Electric bike has no soul we ride because we love the whole atmosphere of listening to the engine the vibration the feeling of a heartbeat which is the motor have a nice day
🎯 Not saying I'm not impressed by what they can do but it does 100% leave out a lot of what made us love em in the first place.
You’d change that tune when you ride one. My dude was the same then he did a run in sport mode with my bike in unrestricted.let’s just say he has the same bike now and his pit bike collects dust. For daily fun you can’t beat it. It won’t fill replace a gas bike but in addition too. You’ll find yourself on it more than you think. Like there is noise with them it’s not silent for you just for the other people. Nothing like the smell of fumes. A burnout smells the same whether electric or gas
I havent had this issue im picking up my stark on saturday and that is when i pay for it!
Amen. Sounds like they have a lack of working capital. They should be getting the financing from a bank, not from their consumers.
I’m with you, what if the company goes bankrupt, You’re lose the $13,000
If?… it’s a matter of when… within 3 years… bet me?
The bike is worth it. Just pay up if you really want it. It'll likely arrive well before April 2024 at this point. This video is in bad taste imo. Its your dealer passing the buck onto you because they don't want to pay in full up front.
Keep in mind this is a brand new dirt bike company and you're comparing it to experiences you've had with manufacturers who have been in business for decades.
This guys a schmuck, let him cry. He'll miss out on the best bike ever made.
Definitely not showing up before April! My delivery date was Aug 30th and then got pushed to Dec 15th. It's Dec 10th today and I haven't been contacted for shit! When asked where it was I got told I'd be contacted by a dealer. 2 more e mails since then have been met with crickets! 3 people in my area got bikes 2 months ago because they paid ahead of time, after I found this out and tried to do the same but the option was disabled! I understand they rolled out the red carpet for you so your very biased but a lot of us normal buyers haven't had a great experience!
The only instance in which upfront full payment is appropriate is with a highly custom, highly expensive product. Even in industries with highly custom equipment, payment is generally in the range of 30-50% upfront and an additional 30ish% upon whatever triggers purchase of materials for the project, and finally the remaining percentage generally due within 30-60 days of shipment. I have only ever seen full upfront payment one time, and it was on a 5+ million dollar project. You are very right that this is unacceptable, especially for a standard, non-custom product.
So a company should ship a TV to you without you paying a cent till it arrives at your doorstep ? Omg you people are stupid 🤦♂️
I would not prepay. Stay strong and don’t fold!!!!
I'm with you, Kyle. I pay when I receive the product, not before. I have no problem giving a deposit, as I have with several vehicles I've ordered. But I'm not paying full price up front. No way, no how. In this situation I could see, maybe, paying $1500-2000 deposit to confirm your intent to purchase. But full price? Fuuuuuuuuudge that.
I paid in full and got my bike. You missed out brother
I can just imagine what back end support will be like.
It’s awesome. Just look at their maintenance alone
Same for everyone. I paid, and wait about 2 weeks before the bike came to me in sweden. And its super. Why do u cry? Delete your order and by a gas bike if u are so worried.
Sounds like they are in financial trouble. I say "Red Flag Warning".
Kyle can you send me a few shirt and tie down straps for the sweepstakes? I’ll pay for them after I’ve won the giveaway bike. Trust me!
It amazes me that anyone still asks for 100% payment up front for anything. This reminds me of watching the stories we all see on our local news stations - multiple times a year - of a person who paid a contractor 100% up front for a swimming pool to be installed, and a year later all they have is a gigantic hole in their back yard and a contractor who won't answer their calls anymore.
Maybe in the USA, in europe.everything is paid upfront, only time that you pay on delivery is like the official dealer dont have a car model at the time with the color you want, or something from the additional equipment, and you pay that on delivery because you dont know the final cost...meaning the additional equpment may be only available in a model along with other equpments, so in that case that model may cost more....
if you dont have the money you pay with bank credit which the official dealer will apply for it in your name which you will pay the loan fully in 3 years for a car....
I paid up front. I own a stark now. Yall are tripping
I’m not financing a 15k purchase.
Yes, I was frustrated at first. I am a first day order. I was not willing to loan Stark money as well. My bike is now April. I am insisting on financing my order through my dealer. Several states including mine can not take deliveries as a distribution license required- in process. As a Tesla owner just keep in mind the product you get will be better then the ones already delivered. This new product is having bugs worked out and improvements. My dealer so far has been upfront about the process. I re ordered a bike at my same lower price(1,000$ cheaper) via the dealer- he had no problem honoring my early order price. The dealer has access to your order via order number. He said he will make some money on a new order vs no money on an order “ transfer”. It is winter- I am happy to wait for an improved bike in the spring/summer.
not heard of any bugs,,,,have you?
They could go out of business . don't do it shady
Hey Kyle, first let me begin with I love the channel. Nonetheless, specifically talking about this video. 100% understand your comments/remarks about this situation. However, just putting it out there some things are done like this. One case I know about is Corvettes. Every one that comes off the assembly line is bought and paid for. This is either done by the dealer or an individual that orders them. It has been like that for several years. Please don’t get it wrong - I do agree with you on buying this bike, especially which is one that is a totally new (newish market) EV. Awesome work, continue on brother! Lastly - KTM is the only real company for me. 🇦🇹
Corvettes are not paid for by the end user, until delivered.
I am with there mate. I was one of the earlier order here in Australia. Put my $100 down and the date has been pushed back well over a year. Now they want my money to assemble the bike an ship it to me. We have some in the country on display at dealer that were not even dealers at the time of my order. Why was my order an so many others not fullfilled before the dealers and their orders. I have zero faith or trust is stark at this point and will no longer have anything to do with the brand and their misleading sales campaign and wrong doing by their customer's.
When have you purchased something online and not paid full price up front? You have to pay up front for bike parts from RMATV. They give you a general idea of when something is going to be delivered but that all goes out the door if an item is out of stock. They still keep your money but keep dragging you along for the delivery date, sometimes for months. You are buying one large item from one manufacturer in Europe. The logistics for that in today's business climate are ridiculous. You can complain but it seems in poor taste.
You should buy the 24 beta 300race edition with a dual spark plugs and do a review on it. Lord knows we’ve all gotten the memo on KTMs cause you’ve reviewed so many of them every year.
If they went we need a $1500 deposit to confirm your order that be fair
RUN, i respect you more now for posting the video….. this world has too many quite people, thats the whole issue
I'm 52.i agree with you.ill buy one when a dealer near me has them available for me to buy on spot like the rest.yes.i still ride even though I don't have a bike currently because of a divorce.i want a varg badly.but I'll wait.hopefully getting a used 4 stroke first.thanks
Tell the “assigned” dealer to call you when yours is on the showroom floor, charged and ready to rock. Till them they can pound sand until they are fully capitalized.
I got crazy idea, just don’t buy one. No one is twisting anyone’s arm. But from what I’ve heard reading peoples reviews it’s been well worth the money and the wait.
Junk bond, no interest. This company likely did not do their homework correctly early on and is in trouble. Thanks for doing this video. Keeps people from getting hurt by a company that is at high risk of bankruptcy.
To me, this is clearly a company having cash flow issues. It does not instill a lot of confidence that they will be around to support the product. I would steer way clear!
agreed.
There were two of them on the showroom floor up in Richfield last week, maybe you could pick up one of those? Assuming they arent already spoken for.
We need to see this custom guitar!
I remember when I worked at an arctic cat dealership. Guys would pay for their snowmobiles before we ever even got them. Special snopro sleds
Thought you were gonna say because they are death machines with no clutch (whiskey throttle). Or battery life .One woods model that raced locally did not finish the harescramble the other weekend on lowest power setting. 2hrs long
i got my call and they said its being assembled and put on a shipping container they never asked me to pay for it until i receive it it must be your dealer trying to get the money early somthing is diffrent about your dealer mine never asked for any money and said i pay for it when i pick it up
I wont spend 13k on an electric bike until new battery tech hits the market and the battery must be removable.
was on their FB page and they had a post that said something like "Best MX bike?" told them to win a few races before they try to make that claim and my comment was deleted ...
To be fair to Stark, they're a startup company so they are probably having cashflow issues and therefore can't cover the cost of all the bikes for a few months before they get paid. Making the battery structural was a huge mistake IMO. The cells in the battery are nothing special, a spare battery should be $2k (i've heard they want $7k...half the price of a battery for my Tesla and the battery is 1/12 the size) and they should be swappable in seconds for us woods/enduro guys. It was a fundamental error in design, will be sticking with gas bikes for the foreseeable future even though i'm excited to see the future of E bikes.
Not true about what it costs to build, bulk pricing for the cells alone (suspect P45b cells now instead of p42a when they updated the battery from 6 to 6.5kwh) would total over $3000, plus bms, cases and cost of assembly pieces such as bus bars. My best guess is actual materials cost is pushing $4.5-5k. Ive built surron batteries and people think just bc they can get the cells for $900(which reality is its closer to $1200-1300) they should be able to buy the battery for for under $1200 when it requires bus bar material(if using proper copper bars can be about $100) and 8-12 welds on every cell(about 200 cells) so its very labor intensive(at best I can manually do full build in about 10-12hrs). Stark battery is 2x that size fyi
@@mrskywalker115 I don't believe for a second that Starks cost is $4.5-5K. That's your cost as an end user, not their cost ordering 20k units.
Congrats on your best performing video to date. Good catch on jumping on the bandwagon of catering to the whiney community of people who fail to see the bigger picture of builidng a company such as Stark Future.
The Varg is new and proprietary technology from a new company. You and everyone knew it while putting the deposite down. You also knew (or 100% should have) that changes might happen along the way. That is why you have the opportunity to back out.
The business model is in no way unheard of in high end, innovative, reaching for the stars product companies. As, get this, it freakin' hard to innovate niche narkets. I have an espresso machine that actually cost slightly more and required payment before manufacturing - not even assembly. It was my choice to accept and support that business. Now I have a unique and wonderful machine that puts a smile on my face every morning at the very least.
Furthermore, the Stark has a creater cost to the company than it sales price. They are holding the price until pre-orders are done. I estimate an increase of 3-5k in the next few years. I have no information to back this claim other than an engineering degree, life in entrepreneurship, 10y in custom bikes and the ability to calculate.
I can not fault you for making a great performing video, you have a business to run and that's increasing it. But I do not aplaude any narrow minded narratives or the populistic approach it holds.
Yes, my Varg has reached me and I paid for it. And no, I do not have any agenda other than wanting to ride the best motorcycle ever reaching production and seeing nore and more companies taking on this difficult journey of bringing amazing products to life.
Mine is on the way no payment upfront this is the guys dealer not stark
Do they accept credit card final payment, which would provide protection? I ordered yesterday and thought the bike would be delivered to my home, with no additional dealer related costs. Am I wrong about that? The Stark website said 0% sales tax.
I’m with ya, I was contacted by my dealer last week saying the same thing. I’m going to pass and possibly get one when they have them in stock. But I was locked in at the early prices when I put my deposit down and now they are $1000 more?
Who’s to say you even get the bike in the next year or something happens to stark and then go under and you lose your money
My local dealer Mosites Motorsports in North Versailles, PA has them on the showroom floor. I'm not a fan because i love the sound of a motor But, they have been riding one at Mosites and they said it has some incredible power as in way more than a 450.
Great call
But it's worth it. I got mine in October and it's the best MX bike I've every had. And I have more than 80 dirtbikes. Maico, every version of Husky Auto, Rokon and on and on.
Come on Kyle, you’re self employed too. You know they can’t deliver a bike to every person who put down a $100 deposit and then ask for $13k upon arrival. What percentage put the $100 down and now don’t have the money to follow through? It’s not always the business that needs to stick it’s neck out.
Come on Dane, a business shouldn’t ask for 100 dollar deposit and then ask for full price before the product is delivered, let alone built! What world do you live in? To me, the business made a poor decision to only ask for 100 dollars to gage genuine interest in the product and now they are crapping themselves because they don’t have the money to actually put the dang things together!
Umm, no. The business owners and investors must accept all the risk to produce and sell the product. That's what the profit is for.
@@jas4696 Nonsense. Try to get a house built without paying a penny until they hand you the keys and let me know how it works out.
If I buy a spec house, I pay nothing until its done. That is what a Stark is, a spec motorcycle. Its not a custom. No other motorcycle manufacturer does this. Stark obviously is struggling with cash flow and trying to sucker prospective buyers into helping them.
@@lbever454Bad analogy... A spec house is built by a developer who is "speculating" he'll find an unknown buyer. If you found a house in construction you wanted, I promise you, the builder would require a significant deposit, or he'd just keep the house on the market. No builder in his right mind would say OK lbever, you say you want my house..I won't sell it to anyone else because I trust you REALLY want my house...right.
This case is more like having custom home built for you. The builder requires a down payment & then progress payments; which probably would have been a better way for Stark to have done this.
There are motorcycle builders (mostly chopper builders) who work with the same deposit/progress payments/final payment system. I suspect, this pay-in-advance model may be more common in Europe.
Signs of a struggling company
*new* company
fuk it! I wanted one so I paid for one. It worked out to be $2000 nzd cheaper for the 80hp model by paying upfront, the due date is the end of December. no one is forcing anyone to pay upfront but if you don't want to wait another year then you have to cough up the cash.
I wouldn't pay full in advance for any motorcycle, let alone an electric form an unestablished company.... and Screw you Kyle, if you're not looking at the comments 🤣
Kyle I 100% agree with you!
Got to be your Dealer, I got a call from my dealer and they asked for $500.00 down, verifying my order. I'm suppose to pick my bike up end of this month with the a check. It was a local dealer one of two from my state.
The absolute most I would do is put the money in an escrow account... but then again, I wouldn't buy an electric vehicle ever.
You're 100% correct. A bird in hand is worth two in the bush. 🤷♂️
My local dealer at kissel motorsports has a few in stock and even had a demo day. I'm going down this Sat. I'll let you know if thier in stock. This is pa tho.
Agree, but I think they have money issues because of the pandemic. They have to respect the price and for 2 years, Inflation rates are high, the currencies and the material prices went up. So if they do another way, they may go bankrupt. Also they had to pay the factory and the employees all that time.
When I was in the military Harley did that but backwards. You could get an interest free loan to buy a Harley and pay for it when you’re overseas and when you get back to America, you just tell them what date and what dealership in America they would deliver it.
Ok so order one at or local dealer then, and not directly at the factory. Just whait untill you ride yours :) ...... looking forward to that video, cheers!
Counted 35 E Mustangs sitting on the front lot of the ford dealership. Who knows what's in the back? However, any color you want.
Companies in trouble if they cant front the cost 🚩
You should have absolutely made this video. I agree 100% on what you are feeling about this purchase.
I wonder if this video will make them re-think this because there's more than a few dirt bikers that watch this channel.
Lol
the dealer should buy it. when dealer has it dealer can get paid for it.
Don’t know where your at but they have them at DHY MOTORSPORTS IN SOUTH NEW JERSEY
Yes, they are transferring them to dealers. Yes, you can still work it out to where you don’t have to pay for it.
I mean... Technically Maico requests 50% up front before they even start your bike build for one of their bikes. If they are true to their word and offer a refund if needed, I don't see anything wrong with this.
They already have the capital to build the bikes, as you mentioned they already have the parts. I think part of the reason they may be doing this is alot of people have been cancelling orders so what do they do to insure you can actually pay for the bike if they get it to you when youve only invested $100? Make sure you can pay upfront is their solution. I think its not ideal and maybe in the future it will be closer between payment and receipt but tbh from a sustainable business it makes more sense as you wont have companies folding due lack of sales and having blow out sales on old inventory. Sure its better for the company but it makes it more sustainable business which hasnt been electric bikes like Alta(had funding from harley who backed out so they collapsed where Stark is far less likely to fail in similar situation). Just playing devils advocate as to why they may be doing it this way and to me it actually doesnt bother me thing being this way as you arent getting scalped by a dealer here like every other mfg has been doing.
I am so glad you said this.
You're 100 percent right.
Dude, this is seriously why you're cancelling?? Hundreds of people in the US have already gotten theirs this way.
Also: this is up to the dealer, not Stark Future. You can have them ship your bike through a dealer that will accept payment on pickup or delivery.
They're doing it this way to avoid $500+ dealership fees to make it cheaper for the consumer. They made agreements with dealerships and agreed to throw them some money on the company's expense so that you can still get a certificate of origin and some other paperwork (has to go through the dealer for that apparently). The dealer can either have it shipped straight to your door or you can pick it up from them - they give you the option.
If you had bothered to look into it (obviously you didn't), you would have seen that hundreds of people have gotten theirs this way with no issues and the bikes have been arriving before the stated delivery dates on the website.
Them asking for payment, from what I have seen in the communities, means that your bike is likely arriving at your door within the next few weeks.
What dramatic video over such a tiny "inconvenience". And to cancel your bike over it... You didn't even bother looking into it. Other dirt bike TH-camrs are just going to be way ahead of you on this now.
So I placed my order 2 years ago, had a delivery date of Aug 30th and then got pushed back to December 15th. It's only about a week out and I haven't been contacted for money or anything! Not to mention someone here in my area got his 2 months ago and he placed his order after I did! When I email to ask what's going on I get ghosted! Not very confident inspiring!
@@JasonHolloway-p3n that's really odd. Maybe check your spam folder? I ordered well after the announcement and mine was ready to ship last month but I actually told them to postpone it until spring (didn't want to get the bike during winter, when I can't ride around where I live because of the snow and winter trail closures).
I would try contacting them again. They've been known to have great customer service and always respond. Maybe your email slipped through the cracks somehow. I've never heard of them ghosting anyone, people would have been mentioning that in the communities.
A lot of friends that ordered early on got their bikes already. Definitely just try reaching out to them again and make sure to check your spam folder. I caught one of their emails in my spam folder before.
Stark absolutely has railed it’s customers.
I currently own a stark and paid in full early. Idk what ur talking about
@@tintin6291 you obviously didn’t watch the video 😂
@@sarahdell4042 You're obviously not capable of critical thought. I like Kyle but this is a BS drama queen video.
Thought you might want to own stock in the company ! 😂 I had the same problem buying a Effen BBQ ! Paid upfront and waited and Waited and waited some more . Customer service assured me that I would receive it ! I was like I needed it about 3 weeks ago . You will have it in the next two weeks . I know what they did . They called China and had them assemble one and ship it out in the next shipping container and got sent to a warehouse in Chino , California then they trucked it to Los Angeles and had UPS bring it to my house . Royally Sucks ! Just trying to save a couple of bucks . Yes I ordered a custom color . Then I told them to send me whatever you have in stock . The unit I received was the right one . But damn ! They should have them in stock before trying to sell them . Never again !!! Thank you for the video and information . It is BS ! Tell them , Send me all the parts and I will assemble it myself . 😂
I have watched a few reviews, they all seem like they are paid to make outrageous claims about range and magical handling, some thing is fishy about the company.
Its their terma and conditions, nothing to do with anything else, looks like more to do with we dont read anything at all...
Before any scheduled delivery, you will receive an email or other notice from the Company with instructions on how to complete the remaining payment for the Product (and we will attempt to send such email to you at least 2 weeks before any scheduled delivery). If payment is not provided within 48 hours of receiving such email, your order will be cancelled unless we consent otherwise.
But it’s 5 months
@@TheTonyBeaunorth macedonia, if you buy brand new car or motorcycle you wait up to 3 months for homologation documents approved, than you get your bike and you are able to register it if street legal get licence for it... :)
...this is buying a bike available immediately...if you order some model not available its up to 1 year delivery, it may happen 1 or 2 months more :))
I got news for you. Manufacturers are going that route. They are saying no more dealers. Like online shoppers ride motorcycles or something. Manufacturers need to monitor dealers to keep them from marking up the prices to where people are going used now
If a company can’t deliver a machine in a timely manner, how can they be expected to provide parts when needed.
Ok, if we accept that the dealer cannot have the bike in stock, which is common, then they should ask for a deposit. Not whole amount.
CAN YOU DO A REVIEW ATLEAST RIDE THE THING thanks.........
You should have asked...
I paid $12k up front in March for an e-moto that never got built. My CC co. told me (before I sent the $$) as long as I made a claim in less than a year, I'd get a FULL refund. I waited 10 months & got credited in 2 weeks.
Yes, this sounds like an interest-free loan...but what about the ppl who gave Tesla $50k deposit for the Roadster two years ago with absolutely no realistic chance of getting a car within their lifetime & do you think Tesla needs the money to prevent bankruptcy? This is just how some "modern" business work...don't like it..guaranteed, your spot has already been taken..you loose!
I am toying with the idea of building an overland 05 Lexus GX470 tow vehicle. Many of those expensive components are in limited supply and have to be ordered and paid in full before they will build more. I see the Stark Varg as something with a very new and limited demand. Plus it's almost like a custom build the supplier being so small. I see no problem with their current business model while they recover their initial investment and financial comittment to their investors. But I live in CA where access to good offroad bikes and riding areas is complicated. Also since others want to beat up on EVs. We have owned them since they became widely available and they're just simply awesome. Nothing to be afraid of.
We have two demos and I'm not a fan. We were also a dealer for Alta and we all know how that turned out. I will keep my 2 strokes!
Well you are about the first one that I have heard say that. If you had a clue on why Alta went out of business you would also know it had absolutely nothing to do with the quality or performance of the bike 🤦🏻♂🤦🏻♂
Even Amazon says if it’s in stock and will ship in a few days.
If they have emailed you to pay for the build then your bike will be with you in like 2 weeks, not months. That’s what mine took to the U.K from payment, maybe it’ll be slightly more to the U.S. Speak to them.
These things aren’t off the shelf bikes like every other bike on the market, they put springs in to your weight, you chose the rear wheel size, hand brake/foot brake, 60 or 80hp and colour. A business needs assurances that bike is going out the door once built and not being pulled apart again to build up for someone else because you e changed your mind, it’s just too many configurations. Yes, this could be done by a non refundable deposit but they’d still have the hassle of selling or stripping the bike back. It’s just not worth it.
I get the fear, I had it too but the logic is there somewhere and the bike is pretty special man!
They lied about their range claims…and not just a little. They were scientifically impossible. I wouldn’t trust them at all.
I'm in the same boat and now I'll buy the 2nd or 3rd Gen if and when they become "established"
there are 8 i found in 1 min on facebook at dealers??????
I have 2 starks but totally understand the hang up on this point. I think its worth it though.
Kyle.. no need to get upset.. a cash poor company always asks for up front money from investors or consumers….
Watch Alex Martin’s softball review…. Stark should change the name from Varq to “2 Pump Chump”…. 30 minutes ride time and @70% of your battery life is gone…limp mode follows shortly thereafter… and lest we forget, no $7k battery swap while in the pits… and 3-4 hours on a pollution spewing generator gets you to @50%… Stark Farse…
Somebody is mad because they have to pay full price for a bike. This video is summed up in the first 4 seconds. Crocodile tears for you brotha.
Stark wants its dealers to buy a two bike display that costs $6500usd.
This means that the dealer will have to "buy" two Starks to put them on display in the display.
The local dealer has two Starks in stock and they can't sell them because they are display/test ride bikes.
And yes, Stark now wants the dealer to collect the money for the bike.
No more direct sales from Stark to the customer.
Dude, 10/10 for the rant!
What are you looking at for your next pair of bikes……maybe a WR250,or a 350 Husky
Not my experience mine is in shipping now. No money up front this is your dealer.
Same it's his dealer
Bad sign that the company is most likely bankrupt. If they want payment in full that far ahead it’s only because they don’t have enough capital or credit to keep the lights on and doors open. That or you’re talking to a scammer (not stark) trying to con you. Don’t do it. Stark might be a failed startup and those with them may end up with an unserviceable bike…
FINALLY, someone who gets it. EV bikes are a fad just like EV vehicles. Unrealistic ride times, long charge times, and no ability to work on them yourselves when it boils down to it. Long live gas bikes.
@@CatholicFitnessthis is short sighted. I know it’s been said for years but solid state batteries are so close and will change everything. I can’t wait for the reduced maintenance, quiet operation that silences the noise complainers that shut down our trails and tracks, and the tune ability that will allow my kids to ride at low power and work their way up to full power.
Toyota has announced the just released 2024 Tacoma will have a tiny solid state battery in the sound system and full size EV solid state batteries for some 2026 models (900 mile range, 10 minute charge time). I don’t love that the government has been pushing this stuff but I don’t allow politics to blind me to the advantages. I can’t wait to dump our family’s four 2 stroke bikes for electric.
@@davidawaters Advantages? Traditional gas combustion engines still hold countless advantages over EV vehicles and will for many years to come. If you live in an area where tracks and trails are shut down due to noise or "pollution", you need to vote for better politicians. No such thing is happening in my conservative state. Oh, and the several hundred-mile range EV's have been talked about for years and they are still YEARS away from being able to do that. I'm not against EVs, just against the push and force when impracticable.
Oh, and some of us enjoy the noise and smell of a nice two-stroke or torque of a 4-stroke. I don't deny the performance of an EV, but they're not the same as a traditional bike.
I listed the advantages-two you didn’t address. Maintenance is a big one for me. I have a ton of hobbies and would like the low maintenance of an electric bike as I may go months without riding. I don’t have time for much maintenance, esp with so many bikes. My electric lawnmower and weed eater have been so nice-for 4 years now. Also, the ability to run an 80hp bike at any power level down to 10 hp (10x better tuning ability than any combustion engine bike) is great for kids and new riders. I live in a conservative state as well (and am mostly conservative myself) and your comment confirms my suspicion that you’ve let politics cloud your judgment. Noise for me is more about riding in those areas that might not be all that legal 😉 I couldn’t care less about noise or pollution of bikes. The needed battery tech will be here soon. We are finally seeing it after years of promises-your feed and searches may be full of conservative anti EV💩 so you wouldn’t ever see it. I love my 2 strokes, but can’t wait for electric bikes that are better. The Stark Varg seems to be close to what I’m looking for. It’s too heavy and battery range is not there yet. I’m thankful for the early adopters that buy these bikes though, which will help drive advancement. I can easily see the future on this, and we won’t get there unless we have the bikes like the Varg between now and then.
You are basically against the present state of EV’s, without looking into the future. You can be against the government pushing this stuff without being against the vehicles themselves. We don’t get to the better future without compromised, imperfect bikes like this. I’m not buying in yet with my money, but am definitely for progress on this. You don’t need to be some kind of an automotive engineer to see this (although I happen to be one).
This reminds me of people being against cordless power tools-until they weren’t. And somehow they never saw it coming.
@@davidawaters there is a reason why every major manufacturer is losing billions on the EV market right now. The proof is in the pudding, and the EV market in general (even major manufacturers such as Tesla), completely sucks. They are abhorrently expensive to maintain, build, buy, and repair, and have significantly more problems that only automotive engineers as yourself can only fix. We will see in 10, 20, and 30 years which products will still be around. These products are only being pushed for political reasons, and your comment about your senses being confirmed is ignorant. I only mentioned it because it is the left pushing for this market in a time when it is light years, not years, away from being ready. I am only using common sense to dictate we don't need to buy into this crap until it's ready. And I doubt this will be in my lifetime. Until then, I will enjoy ripping my gas bikes which will last forever, and you can stick to swapping your battery out every hour for minimal range and noise-free 'fun"
I was upset about all of this as well…until I got my Varg. Kinda forgot about everything else once I rode it 😁
For a whole 30 miles before the battery died
@@brockashsfrund I have multiple bikes so the range is less important to me, but yes. That is something to consider if the stark was your one and only bike. 30 to 40 miles or a couple of hours track time depending on how hard you ride. I almost backed out when the first range tests started coming out, but now that I’ve got my bike, the range is better than I expected.
They should be giving you one for free. You would bring a lot of sales their way. This speaks to a bigger problem obviously.
I’m definitely buying one. The stark varg is sick
I recently bought one, it IS sick.