Tommy, i just want to say a huge "Thanks" for your video and your help. i was blind when i started this project and i am dropping off my daughters prius to her today. It was a learning curve and i knew nothing about these chargers when i started. Your video explained it all. thanks again.
Tommy, new at this. You showing the record sheet of cycles was very good in showing how far i need to continue doing this monotonous action and to still expect some reasonable reconditioning results. Thanks.
Tommy, I can't thank you enough for all the information and insight you have provided to me. I'm thinking like the information you have gotten from S Keith I have gotten from you. I appreciate both of you guys!!!I have a 2010 Prius with 220K on it and started this project in May and have had some luck. I have bought used modules on eBay and it would be fine for a couple of months but then another module would go out. I have pulled the pack out 3 or 4 times since May.When I first started in May and up until last week I was doing it like a cave man, LOL. I was using light bulbs to check individual modules for capacity and to discharge the entire pack. I had bought a prolong battery charger that charges the whole pack and charged and discharged per their instructions 3 times.But in early December I saw Tommy's video and bought a Hobby King Quattro 4x6. I have been going though the modules now for 10 days. I found another bad one that dropped like a rock to 4 volts on a 1 mah discharge. That's the one that probable gave me the triangle of death again. Most of my modules using Tommy method are between 3 to 4 mah on discharge and 5 to 6 mah on charge, see below. Sorry its fragmented, it wouldn't copy and past well from excel doc. and I could only copy so many columns from docI have better fans now so swelling modules are not such a issue, initially I was using a box fan too.Tommy I did 3 cycles as you had mentioned to access. Now I'm in the process of doing 5 cycles with no change, in fact the capacity reading are going down, that why I'm saying 3 to 4 and 5 to 6 now. I'm letting the modules rest between discharge and charge and spreading out the charges and discharging.Tommy with using your method what would you consider a good module,? I know in the video above ( which I've watched now at least 30 times) module #21 seemed to have good capacity on paper but yet you were still charging and discharging.I guess I'm looking for yall's opinion, should I continue and run 15 cycles? If so and if some modules don't come back can you recommend a good supplier of quality modules at good prices?If the entire pack doesn't really come back at all I might get a good used pack from Falcon Hybrid for $ 2000 or so. Do you have anyone you recommend for good used packs?Any recommendation you guys have I would be most grateful!!!!I appreciate your help!!! I'm married with 4 kids and don't have money for nothing, LOL.
Do you leave your hobbyking on overnight? How much time do you stand by the charger (if at all) its like watching paint dry lol. Where are your batteries? I am trying to find a good place to leave them and run the charger and take up minimal space. Thanks Tommy! Because of your video I am now reguvenating up a 2004 battery I pulled from a junkyard for $250 (drove 3 hours to get it though:) regardless of the time issue, its exciting
1) So if I set up my chargers the same way you set them up exactly, all id have to do is connect a cell, and press start and id be on my way? Im a total newbie with these chargers. 2) Can this process save a cell that is between 6.2 and 7.2volts? 3) Do you have anything else connected to the modules such as temp probes? 4) Are theyre any other chargers out there for a cheaper price than these that you would recommend? Such as another less powerful turnigy charger? Thanks Tommy priceless info you have given in the video!
Also last two questions 5) Is the goal ultimately to get as close to 6-6.5 amp discharge? When you say, "If the cell is giving you a hard time." or "If it isn't performing well enough" you are refferring to it not getting to 5.5-6amp discharge correct? And if its giving you a tough time you suggest to adjust the discharge to 6.0v as opposed to 6.3v and adjusting the cutoff charge amps from 7.5 to 7.8amps just to give it a little extra "kick"? 6) what is the delta peak?
Let's Do It Correct on everything, and I know of no other less expensive charger that will do this. The B6 can be flashed with non-factory firmware, which is something that I have been working on. sometimes a module showing a lesser voltage can be brought back, but often one cell in the module is dead. I am not running any temperature probes yet, but I do run a box fan across the pack. S. Keith has suggested using the factory fan to cool the pack, and I think I will take his advice on the next one. Google delta peak, it will explain it better than I can, but the simple answer is the peak voltage the pack reaches during charging, before it starts dropping off.
I need some advice using Reaktor chargers. I bought 4x 300w AC/DC 20a chargers similar to what you are using in this video. My settings for NiMH are 2a charge auto, 2a charge manual, 5a discharge down to 6.2V with DCHG/CHG set to 3, 5 minute wait time, all annoying alarms off, safety time set to NONE as it disrupts any cycle it's in and erases mah data if the time is met. I learned that the system won't cycle at all and only performs one half of a cycle (charge OR discharge only) unless you push the start button while showing the screen "DCHG/CHG - 3" I wasted an entire day recording data that started and only performed a manual charge OR discharge as a half cycle. When you do push start on the correct screen the data erases immediately when the half cycle completes and is in "wait/waste time" it will change instantly from for example: 3479mah to 0000 and just holds at 0000 until the 5 minutes is up and the next half cycle begins to count. So really only get the final result of 3 cycles if you walk away and come back hours or half a day later. I can't find a way to see any other mah data to complete a meaningful chart. Also every module so far has increased in stored ampacity with the data I happened to have seen before it auto erased but i'm only seeing increases from about 1200mah to 4500mah. Is there a better way to set these chargers up? Am I missing something?
I am experiencing the same problem I have the model you have and I can not see the charge and discharge capacity using the increase and decrease buttons like Tommy does on this video ..... if you have figured it out please share me your experience. thanks
Can you please explain how one can tell if the charging or discharging is complete for a cycle. I am using the imax B6AC v2 and just following your settings. it just keeps changing from discharge to charge or charge to discharge. But how can I tell if cycle 1,2 or 3 is completed. I have my setting on discharge/charge 3 cycle. After over 6 hours, I press on stop and I only see the reading CH1 5866mAH, DISC 1- 4366 mAH, CH2 6975 mAH, DISC 2- 4645 mAH, CH3 0000 mAH, DISC 3 - 417 mAH Working on a prius hv battery
These things need a hard kick in the butt once in a while. I tried being gentle with these cells, 1A C/D. It did help me isolate cells under 4aHr but still had poor performance until I forced them hard. Dr.prius app (not affiliated) has a battery life test function that will hard charge the pack in about a minute and then do a discharge test(AC,lights, heaters etc) over a 15 minute period. At the end it will give you a life capacity percentage. good luck......
Excellent work and excellent video. When you recondition in this way, typically how long more will the cells last before needing another shot or replacing?
Please do a video on how to use the menus on the Reaktor. I have the exact same charger, yet it will not show the charge capacities like it did when you hit INC at 6:50 in the video. Instead, it kept cycling through the settings menus instead. I was 3 cycle charge/discharging just like you were here at the time. Please show how to get it to show that capacity information (written instructions that came with the charger are pretty terrible as well). Thanks.
My charge completed with 8.86v and only 01516 mAh in 23 minutes. Charge rate auto 5.0A, disharge rate 2.0A, dchg/chg 3 cycles, repeak 2 78000mAh cutoff. Why am I only getting 1516mAh?
I'm getting ready to dive into this project of removal of the Prius Battery and Recondition the cells/replace. Do you happen to have a step by step guide of materials or links you could recommend. I see many videos here on youtube, however, none really showing every step- Example-when removing the individual nuts on the orange bus bar-I'm assuming there is still a danger of shorting since the cells are still in series. I assume wear proper gloves, but is there still sparking when all the bolts are removed and the orange bar slid off? I am about to buy a how to from PriusKings on amazon but I haven't heard back about if they show how to recondition the battery not just replace a bad module (cell). So do you power the HobbyKing charger w/ a 12V car battery? & just keep charging that up? Thanks for any help you can provide.
Hi Tommy, thanks for the video. While I was reading thru the comments, you mentioned about knowing the battery capacity. How do we find out about the battery capacity? Also I want to know how to fix a module if the bolt is broken on one end? Thanks in advance.
Hey Tommy can I email you? I have some simple questions. When you are charging with Quattro what is too high for the voltage, sometimes I see on the Quattro screen it goes up to 9.3 charging volts. Is that right? I have it set to default and on automatic charging.
you are numbering them backwards, #1 is on the passenger side away from the computer.. it will make a huge difference when reading the tech stream info
I'm using a tenergy t180 on my 07 camry hybrid, i let it sit overnight but it cut off at 240 minutes for safety timer, and my capacity cutoff was set at 6500 but when i checked the screen, it went above that but it didnt shut off the charger, is that normal? or am i doing something wrong?
Does the charge reaching 9.0 volts have to hold for a specific time to be considered charged up or can we manually hit discharge as soon as it reaches the 9.0 volts?
Good day to you, I would like to start disassembly of my battery; however, I have a few questions. When removing the battery what points is the multimeter touching to make sure there is no current? I know it’s the Hybrid Main Relay but what is Positive & Negative? I haven’t removed yet but if there is a RED wire do I assume it’s the RED ‘hot’ side and the black the Negative? When removing the actual battery contact nuts is there a safe order to do so or just start from one end and move to the other? Is there sparking involved? Is there 100 V still live and active while removing the nuts? Or is there only a smaller amount if I stay carefully on each one. I noticed in one video I saw a spark when a tool touched between 2 of the battery contacts when the harness was being removed. I think they were removing a Gen 1 battery where it had the sticky glue and they were just using a flat head screw driver. When or if it sparks is it the size of a typical 12V car battery when reinstalling and there is a small load on the battery and there is about ¼” spark that’s no big deal? I am told use LineMan gloves..I’m assuming there is a difference between those and just ARC welder leather gloves? When putting the nut back on..are you using gloves or just using bare hands..no one seems to film that in there videos. Is that just liability issue so if someone got hurt and that is the most dangerous point one wouldn’t accuse you of showing something that was too dangerous? Also, I read somewhere that most torque wrenches are too strong for the actual torque for the battery contacts for the orange strip. They mentioned something about a being torque wrench or something that has smaller measurements of torque..I have since lost where I found that Prius thred. Any feedback is greatly appreciated. Have a terrific day! Also, I wanted to get a HobbyKing Quartto x4 NiMh Charger and a dedicated 12v battery to run it to balance the batteries with ofcouse a fan cooling the battery and the charger during the process. Do you happen to know the discharge and charge value to enter rate of charge amps etc?
Doing my gen1 now for a p3030. I got by without linesman gloves. Used electricians nut drivers and screw drivers Followed wisdom that said wait 15 min after pulling the plug to allow inverter to discharge And followed wisdom that said to open the high voltage cable part way down to split the pack. Sometimes did use the electrical screw driver to pry at the gluey busbars, but mostly relief on wiggling. Was cognizant of that video with a spark.
Hi, Tommy, I have 2007 Camry already repair 1 time (no new batteries) about 4 years ago I bought a new Reaktor Quatro 300w 20A and starting the process according to the video but at the moment the first 5 batteries after the 3 first cycle the charge average is 1090 to 1500 and another 2 batteries the average is 4000. Which is your opinion? Thanks!
I let them self-balance for a couple days, by tying them all together in parallel, with small gauge lashing wire. It will look like a sine wave, skipping every other battery.
bugger this charger appears to be discontinued. In this boat now needing to try get some prius modules back in action, or at least diagnose the bad ones.
Hi Tommy. Perfect video ! I use the same reactor with 240 W. But one question: Some modules blow up a bit, and other like a balllon. When are bloating modules not okay for you?
Hi. Which charger do You currently recommend? HobbyKing Quattro or Turnigy Reaktor are no longer available. New Reaktor T240 or Skyr IMAX v.2 will be good?
@Lukas Usc honestly, I haven’t messed with any Prius packs in several years, and haven’t kept up with the new chargers either. I’m sure someone here has some suggestions.
@@tommyjohnson5354 thanks for the info. I keep searching :) But, it's interesting that almost all topics about cell to hybrids break off 2-3 years ago 🙄
I am getting a about 6000 discharge and 7200 recharge. My charger will cut off at 7200 and then begin a discharge cycle. I have don't each at least ten times. Is this bad or good?
Hi Tommy. Thanks for share this information. I have a question, how many amp needs each cell to be charger? I can see a lot of chargers, but I don't have idea of your DC power supply. Thanks.
I run a Mastech 3020, for 3 chargers, and an old 15 amp bench power supply from Radio Shack. Each charger will pull around 8a max, if you run them at 18v input. while some are charging, some are discharging, so it seldom overloads.
hi Tommy, can i hook up my 28 modules in the prius pack in parallel, leave them over night, then hook the pack up with JUST 1 charger to discharge/charge cycles? thank
Hi, can you please explain what does this mentioned term "1 - 6s" mean? Does it mean that one charging unit from Reactor can able to charge maximum 6 Prius cells simultaneously?
Hi Tommy, i purchased a Hobby King Quattro to try to make better time. I dont know if i have had trouble in the setup or what. i can not get the dchg/chg to run in Auto. i have it set to 3 cycles and it just runs once and stops. Also it will only discharge at 1.0 amp? is that right or do i need to update its firmware? do you know? Thanks for any help.
thanks for the reply. it was because i was an idiot. i got it straightened out now. other than the 1 amp thing. i am real happy with them. afraid i am going to have to just buy another battery but i will know this week.
+Jerry Smallwood Glad you got it sorted out. I am on my 5th Prius now, picked up one for $500 last week, bad battery, and I am going through the modules now.
Hi Tommy Johnson! Thanks for you videos, are awsome! I have some hobby chargers like yours, and my batterys are getting around 5000mA disharging after 3 cycles. Im charging 3A and discharging to 6.3V With your experience, what would you do? do you think they can get more amperage after more cycles? many many thanks!
Tommy Johnson Thanks you Tommy J ! =) Before put it again in the car, Whats you do? Give a full individual charge to them all or give an parallel charge on them? What ypu recomend? =)
Magichand get full charge individually, then tie all the + together, and all the - sides together. The weaker modules will pull the stronger ones down to their voltage level. Leave it overnight, and by morning, the pack will be balanced. Put all your bus bars back on, reassemble the pack, and reinstall. Be very careful though, one short and you’re gonna have a bad day!
I guess if you have good capacity reading, and good voltage under load. On the last cycle you read how much capacity is get inside, and then drain it under load (not sure how much amperage😐), to see if is gets below 7v - 7.5v. I'm not professional, but I think is correct
LOL... "guy named Steve"... Hmmm... I think I know that guy... BTW... you need to cool that bugger. You can use the EXIT duct and shove it into the bottom of the case where it normally goes and then just aim the 12V blower from the car into it. It will blow air up through the pack.
S Keith Yep, you really helped me alot man, thanks! Just off screen in this video, is a large box fan. It blows across the pack, and I am now starting to use the regen capabilities in the chargers, using a 12v car battery, and a Schumacher charger.
You're welcome. Happy to help. I used to use a box fan too, until I found out that you're basically trying to cool a solid block. I saw some bad things happen. Unless you're driving air through the cooling passages, you're doing almost nothing. Try it for yourself... You can power the fan with your battery or get an adjustable 30A/12V power supply from amazon. You will be amazed at how much air can move up through the pack even without any effort to seal up the blower/duct interface (you can "seal" it by stuffing a rag into the gaps). You'll be able to charge @ 6.5A and rely on deltaV cut-off without worrying about swelling. Since you're exploring the regenerative features, you're only going to be making more heat. Allow 30 minutes between cycles. Regenerative is only 42% efficient based on my multiple tests, i.e., when you regen 1000mAh out of a module, you can only put in 420mAh using that same energy, so you still have to supply quite a bit. You can also "march" through the pack using the prior "block" as your regen source, i.e., discharge modules 1 & 2 into a 12V battery or with the internal discharge and then power the charger with modules 1&2 as a 12 cell battery (single copper bus bar joining them at one end) and discharge 2&3 into 1+2, rinse and repeat "marching" through the pack. The nice thing is you're discharging and partially charging, again saving time. Watch out for the bad modules as they throw a wrench into it. Easy to wear out a 12V. Make sure your regen settings are at 14.7V for 12V. When using two prius modules, that can go to 18.4V. Oh, and your wiring is a bit messy. Try to keep the Reaktor leads as short as possible. Now that you're moving into high current territory, your voltage drop is going to start getting noticeable. You can see for yourself by watching the voltage difference reported by the Reaktor during discharge and measuring with the separately attached voltmeter. You can compensate by lowering your target voltage, i.e., if you show 6.2V when the charger terminates at 6.0V, you can just terminate at 5.8V. Also, go to 6.0V. If going to 6.0V takes a module out, you don't want it in the car. Good luck! Steve
Tommy, I have some questions. I have some modules that cycled, but when I went back to top them off later they did not cycle. I reset capacity cut off at 7900. What happend?
Star Master Tech 2 years later, still driving the car daily. Mileage has started to decline slightly, currently around 40mpg, so will likely have to go through the pack again before the end of the year.
There is nothing much wrong with an IMaxB6 clone as long as you dont expect much from it. It works fine for charging AS LONG AS YOU WATCH THE END OF THE CYCLE CAREFULLY. Also I NEVER use autocycling anymore, too slow and annoying. Instead, know that NiMh cells always get a bit above room temp when they reach full charge. It doesnt matter what car they come out of either. Charge them with whatever you got for NiMh and Discharge them fast with a Carbon Pile. I Dis at 40 amps most of the time and sometimes 50 amps if I am in a hurry. Some use 20 or 10 amps, dont much matter though as LONG AS YOU do the SAME thing to all the modules. The modules can handle it easily since they live in the car humping back and forth at 60-80 amps all day long! This way you will get done in a couple days if you never leave the room. But if you like spending more money on fancy chargers go ahead. Keep a fan blowing on everything too. I dont recall seeing any fans in your setup. Also your pack will probably need redone in a few months time. Since you did NOT load test the modules at all. The little 1 or 2 amps those chargers do for Dis is NOT enough to test for load endurance. A Carbon Pile load tester works much better for this CRITICAL step. Eg hook up each module to the carbon pile and burn it down for 3 minutes (maybe more), watching the voltmeter and your stopwatch carefully. I usually stop the "burn" when the V hits 6 under load. Note the time. If your pack is to work well, ALL of the modules will have to show the exact same results, or damn close to it. A side benefit of doing it this way is you weed out the good modules quickly, they dont need to be cycled more. Saves time. Concentrate on the weaker ones instead. DO the exact same procedure to ALL the modules. Do not fudge any for time. Replace any modules that are not up to snuff. Be ruthless! Modules dont cost that much. I see them used and tested for $25 each and sometimes less than that. eg, Like-new modules are about $35 at Bumblebee Batteries. Put the better performing modules in the center of the pack where it gets warmest. The pack will stay balanced a bit longer that way. Also get yourself a copy of Dr. Prius and a bluetooth adapter that will work with it so you can check on the pack from time to time easily.
@@c217z It really depends on how bad off the cells are to start with. Most refurbished packs will work ok for a year or two at most. Even packs refurbished by the factory may only last a couple years. The reason is that the chemistry inside is aging and oxidizing the nickle plates in there, causing resistance to build up. Deep cycling like in the video helps to remove some of the oxidation, but never all of it. The quality of the chemistry inside the cells varies a good deal as well. In general though you can count on a years time if you do the work really well yourself, no short cuts. Also in order to be sure you get as much time as possible be sure you load test each module one at a time. Be sure to do the exact same test to each of them too. I usually "burn" a refurbished module at 40 amps for at least 3 minutes before I declare it "good enough." A good one will stay above 6.5V during this testing too.
@@@michael47lamb Thanks! It seems to be a labor of love. Would you say the $1600 - $2000 new packs will generally outperform gas mileage wise? I haven't pulled my gen 3 pack yet so I don't know how bad individual modules are. Torque shows voltages within .3v.
@@c217z LoL Labor of Love is one way to look at it. I do it mainly because I am cheap as the day is long and dont mind the work very much. It is also sort of interesting in a geeky sort of way to me. As far as making the plunge of 1600-2000 goes, I see nothing wrong with that as long as you understand it may or may not stay "fixed." Be sure to get a pack with a strong warranty by a reputable company (not some garage clown selling on Ebay or Craigslist!) MPG wise: either method will work about the same. It is mostly a question of investing money in one or the other. 2K in money and a days work (warranty too maybe), or $70 -$100 and a few days work. Your choice. I usually find that 2 to 6 modules need replacing, the rest are fine. Although the last Prius I worked on needed 14 module, but that cost me all of $350 in cells and a bunch of time tinkering. Ask yourself this: How long have you been seeing the Red Triangle of Doom? If it hasnt shown up yet dont worry about it. But when it does show up, fix the pack right away before more cells get damaged. 0.30V diff is not too great just yet. Although 0.20V is what I shoot for in real life. The car has a wide degree of tolerance it seems.
@@michael47lamb No red triangle, don't think I get one with gen 3. I have "Check Hybrid System" on dash and P0A80. I ordered Techstream. Should be here this week. I like the cheapskate approach. Guess its time to start ordering battery chargers. Sounds like you have done a slew of these.
Hi Tommy J. i have bought two of these chargers and a Hobby king power supply to rejuvenate a Prius Battery. i have ran this on two different cells for a total of four. one runs fine. the other has resulted in an error that looks something like this. termination capacity overload 7501. was there a setting that i missed along the way? i am pretty sure that this has come from the same charger both times. thanks in advance.
i had one that did that and it would swell up. i discarded and replaced it. i had another one that gave me the same problem but didn't swell up. so i tried charging it on a quattro 4x6 and it went through with no problem. i ended up buying two quattros and had two Reaktor 250's because the singles were taking too long.
this cells are very different to consumer NIMH , try to charge till 8.4V only per module , that voltage is calculated full by hybrid computer , after that the cells will build pressure , and charge the module in the pack also very importaht
U can buy these Hybrid batteries at Green Bean installed for $1500.00 they will send a tech to remove your old one and put a new one in. 5 year warranty comes with it. Changing these cells is like pissing in the wind, could last 3 months or 30 days. Just call Green bean and get a new one
Tommy, we designed way more efficient way to analyze / charge all modules simulataneously on the individual module level. Please visit our site: www.hybrids.co.nz/ and youtube channel: www.hybrids.co.nz/. Our tools are logical choice for those who tried hobby RC toy chargers but found that to be extremely time consuming, not providing sustainable results and not coping with the work load. It took us just couple of days many years ago to realise that. So we invented our own tools which we are now selling to other busy garages and battery rebuilders.
Hey Kiwi, you big cutie. The Reaktors are capable of more current than your battery analyzer. I've worked on batteries that were "reconditioned" by stateside equipment comparable to your battery analyzer in terms of capabilities, and I was extremely unimpressed with the results.
Mate, your lack of attention to details worries me. We already had that conversation. I mentioned before on the forum where you are bragging about your acheivements and you had an opportunity to read that in plain English: "Our Analysers are tailor made and capable of testing modules at up to 100 Amps". And that is excactly what few of our clients are doing - testing at high amps. Special design was made (not shown on site as it was built to order) with 100A connectors & fuses. It is your choice what load you use - 100A, 50A, or 20A, or 6A. It is summer time in NZ - you are welcome to come to NZ and see for yourself. Instead of promoting "made in china RC toys" - you could've been our agent years ago. HV cables and plugs are made in USA (you could be proud of that), the rest is made in Japan and Korea and is high quality components. We pay comission B2B to right people who know what they are doing. You still need to demonstrate that your skills are up to the task, but your passion for batteries is a good beginning :-) P.S. - our Battery Manufacture Date Scanner is now working in few states. One is used by one of your biggest Battery Specialists. Cheers. I am available via Skype daily - watch time difference.
You expect me to remember your blatherings on PC? Seriously? I'm not a client, but I'm testing at high current. You shouldn't think you know what I'm doing based on what I put on a forum months ago. I have lots of happy customers running very strong packs. Being your agent would have only slowed me down and killed my profitability. Your battery date scanner can be had on ebay for about $30. Any simple QR Code scanner works. No software required. I already have one. Good job suckering one of our "biggest Battery Specialists". Tommy, sorry for polluting your comments. I won't engage with Kiwi anymore.
You again making untrue statements and making assumptions . Our Manufacture Date Scanner is a software product, it is not available on eBay. QR scanners they can convert QR code into number. Our software does much more - it automatically decodes numbers into manufacture dates and highlights with color whether there were swapped modules in the Prius. Camry, Lexus hybrid battery pack, it produces sound if you've made a mistake while scanning the pack. It adds smarts and efficiency. Your judgement about our products shows lack of understanding.
I have run a couple, as many as 5 times (15 cycles total) to get them back. in retrospect, I should have just replaced them, because they were on their last leg. If you don't see results after the 4th cycle, I would suggest replacing it.
U can buy these complete and installed for $1500.00 @ Green bean... They will send a tech with the complete Hybrid battery to your location. 5 year warranty with it too.
I would like to use turnigy reaktor qaudkore 1200w 80a charger in my house. Do I need a 100a breaker? Or would it work on a 20a just allocate 5a per charger while not tripping it? Would it increase speeds if on a 100a breaker?
Amps x volts = watts. 1200 / 80 = 15v. A standard wall plug is rated at either 15 or 20a, let’s use 20a. 110v x 20a = 2200w. You do not need a 100a circuit to run your Reaktor. What you do need, is a strong power supply, that can deliver enough current and voltage to charge all 4 ports simultaneously. Modern computer power supplies, rated at 1500w, are what I would be looking for. You might get away with a 1200w or 1300w, but see if you can find a server power supply and modify it for your charging needs. A quick Google search shows an HP 1300w server power supply for $35, might even order one myself..
Hi. I've been working on my camry hybrid bat very with the reaktor set up as you have it. Can you help me understand the charge rates you're writing down and if there is a target charge rate? you're showing like 06348 in this example on battery 21? before taking it off. My recorded rates are showing up more like 2500 to 3500. What do this numbers represent? How do i understand them better?
Donald, You need to cycle each module until you get 5700 on a discharge. Your higher number is the Delta Peak on the charge. usually that peaks at about 7300 average. If you see extreme swelling of a module during charging, it is probably in need of replacing. Im still learning though. Be carefull
Okay. Just because i'm starting with low numbers doesn't mean I won't be able to get the batteries back up to 5700 on discharge. Is that correct? Or does that mean they are ready to give out? All of my batteries started with a charge above 7.5V on the meter but i had the red light on my dashboard. I'm trying to do preventative. I have two chargers running different batteries at the same time. Do I run ALL of the cycles consecutively until I hit 5700 discharge? Or will it work to do a three cycle, then move on to another battery even though i'm not reaching 5700 yet, let the battery settle, then come back and do it again? Or should I keep on the batteries until they are reaching 5700 discharge? Non of the batteries are showing extreme swelling, they all seems pretty normal to me in regards the swell. AND I have only run one cycle on each so far. Suggestions? (and thanks for your input, it's been an interesting process)
I have some modules that took 27 cycles to get them back to 5700. I stayed on a module until I got it done, so yes consecutively. I would run 3 cycles, evaluate then set for 5 or more, or what I thought it would need to finish. This is a very time consuming process, up to a month with two chargers. You may need to reset your Capacity cut off to 9000mAH, 7800 was not enough for some of my modules. After I got through all the modules, I went back and ran one cycle on each to top them off before installing the pack back in the car. Extreme swelling is what determines replacement. This is what I have learned and experienced.
Hi again. Update. Yes two chargers is a slow process. And i'm patient I have another car thank god. My car is a 2007 Camry at 200k I assume the batteries and approach is the same with the prius batteries, just slightly different pack. The reason i ask, is what i'm finding is that my batteries seem to top out in the same range, after running three cycles of three. They are all getting to just in the high 2000 low 3000 range then drop then return then drop. This is when the batteries seem to swell. Maybe i'm just too afraid to keep pushing it, or that what i'm seeing is a swelling battery that really isn't that bad yet and I should do another four or five cycles (cycles of three that is) Is it possible that the whole of the battery pack is ALL stuck at the same level?. From what i am reading on the forums is that you generally find one or two that don't respond well, but not 25 in a row. I feel i'm doing something wrong. I did watch some of your other videos---one in particular of the hobby king four charger. I reset my turnigys to the levels you suggested on the Hobby king and I got a bit quicker response (5amp charge, 7800, 6 on the low end for example) I just feel I'm missing something because not one of the batteries has moved any where near the 4000 range. Possibly I'm doing it right and that the discharge levels are actually what i should be seeing because I've set it up wrong or I'm attempting to achieve levels that I shouldn't be, it's a different style of battery or I just don't know. I can push the batteries harder, and see if they start jumping up--yet i'm concerned about the swelling. Is it possible that all the batteries are just near done with 200k on the car? They all showed a good 7.7 or so charge when i first pulled the pack out. They almost all start in a very low discharge rate too ---for example--00453 to 02562---00426 to 02590. This battery in particular (battery 32) i've run 11 cycles on. Its had movement but the last four cycles are stuck in the 2500 range. Does it defeat the purpose if the battery swells and I stop and return to it at end of the day or another day? You said in an earlier reply do it all at once. i'm not sure if that's possible, and since i don't understand the process, If i need to run 25 to 30 cycles a battery to see the starting levels I will do that. Or if I can just keep rotating up and down the pack i can do that. Do I push it harder or just be resigned that this is the state of my batteries after 200k? Advice? On approach, or testing or changing settings on the chargers. Thanks in advance. donald
Hey tommy, I'm on Prius chat and need some help with my charge configuration. All the wires and sources are confusing. Will you message me your setup how you powered your balance chargers? name is "Spenser"
Nobody cares about all what you paid for the chargers and how many miles the car had. How did you hook all this up. I see you have 15 and 25 volt versions. Are they for 2 and 3 module packs? No clue what you're doing.
Tommy, i just want to say a huge "Thanks" for your video and your help. i was blind when i started this project and i am dropping off my daughters prius to her today. It was a learning curve and i knew nothing about these chargers when i started. Your video explained it all. thanks again.
Glad to be of help, Jerry! My next video will show how to fix the cheap B6 chargers to use on the Prius modules. Yes, it can be done!
did this video come out yet? awesome
Not yet, having some issues flashing firmware on B6 clones.
Tommy, new at this. You showing the record sheet of cycles was very good in showing how far i need to continue doing this monotonous action and to still expect some reasonable reconditioning results. Thanks.
Tommy, I can't thank you enough for all the information and insight you have provided to me. I'm thinking like the information you have gotten from S Keith I have gotten from you. I appreciate both of you guys!!!I have a 2010 Prius with 220K on it and started this project in May and have had some luck. I have bought used modules on eBay and it would be fine for a couple of months but then another module would go out. I have pulled the pack out 3 or 4 times since May.When I first started in May and up until last week I was doing it like a cave man, LOL. I was using light bulbs to check individual modules for capacity and to discharge the entire pack. I had bought a prolong battery charger that charges the whole pack and charged and discharged per their instructions 3 times.But in early December I saw Tommy's video and bought a Hobby King Quattro 4x6. I have been going though the modules now for 10 days. I found another bad one that dropped like a rock to 4 volts on a 1 mah discharge. That's the one that probable gave me the triangle of death again. Most of my modules using Tommy method are between 3 to 4 mah on discharge and 5 to 6 mah on charge, see below. Sorry its fragmented, it wouldn't copy and past well from excel doc. and I could only copy so many columns from docI have better fans now so swelling modules are not such a issue, initially I was using a box fan too.Tommy I did 3 cycles as you had mentioned to access. Now I'm in the process of doing 5 cycles with no change, in fact the capacity reading are going down, that why I'm saying 3 to 4 and 5 to 6 now. I'm letting the modules rest between discharge and charge and spreading out the charges and discharging.Tommy with using your method what would you consider a good module,? I know in the video above ( which I've watched now at least 30 times) module #21 seemed to have good capacity on paper but yet you were still charging and discharging.I guess I'm looking for yall's opinion, should I continue and run 15 cycles? If so and if some modules don't come back can you recommend a good supplier of quality modules at good prices?If the entire pack doesn't really come back at all I might get a good used pack from Falcon Hybrid for $ 2000 or so. Do you have anyone you recommend for good used packs?Any recommendation you guys have I would be most grateful!!!!I appreciate your help!!! I'm married with 4 kids and don't have money for nothing, LOL.
discharge
charge
discharge
charge
5.444
7.253 swelling
5.736
7.691
5.727
7.143 swelling
5.684
? Erra message
4.543
6.289
4.643
6.564
5.528
7.536 swelling
5.607
? Erra message
5.507
4.681
6.121
4.611
6.225
New Mod. -
2.931
7.801
3.717
5.217
3.643
5.117
2.885
4.474
2.884
4.346
3.994
5.339
3.934
5.581
3.171
5.215
3.118
4.941
3.181
5.317
3.193
4.927
3.424
4.749
3.407
5.082
5.705
7500
4.839
7.106
4.851
6.861
3.483
5.576
3.686
5.568
3.925
6.243
4.403
6.881
3.976
6.057
3.942
5.977
3.481
5.377
3.564
5.223
3.771
5.786
3.661
5.528
4.027
6.282
4.696
7.013
4.722
7.191
3.275
5.229
3.395
5.221
4.742
6.826
4.763
6.654
4.116
6.303
4000
7275
3.483
5.085
3.354
5.046
2.811
4.521
2.786
2.648
Thanks! S. Keith is the man, I would have never started this project without him!
Do you leave your hobbyking on overnight? How much time do you stand by the charger (if at all) its like watching paint dry lol. Where are your batteries? I am trying to find a good place to leave them and run the charger and take up minimal space. Thanks Tommy! Because of your video I am now reguvenating up a 2004 battery I pulled from a junkyard for $250 (drove 3 hours to get it though:) regardless of the time issue, its exciting
Hi, what is the max and min voltage settings that you use for each cell?
1) So if I set up my chargers the same way you set them up exactly, all id have to do is connect a cell, and press start and id be on my way? Im a total newbie with these chargers. 2) Can this process save a cell that is between 6.2 and 7.2volts? 3) Do you have anything else connected to the modules such as temp probes? 4) Are theyre any other chargers out there for a cheaper price than these that you would recommend? Such as another less powerful turnigy charger?
Thanks Tommy priceless info you have given in the video!
Also last two questions 5) Is the goal ultimately to get as close to 6-6.5 amp discharge? When you say, "If the cell is giving you a hard time." or "If it isn't performing well enough" you are refferring to it not getting to 5.5-6amp discharge correct? And if its giving you a tough time you suggest to adjust the discharge to 6.0v as opposed to 6.3v and adjusting the cutoff charge amps from 7.5 to 7.8amps just to give it a little extra "kick"?
6) what is the delta peak?
Let's Do It Correct on everything, and I know of no other less expensive charger that will do this. The B6 can be flashed with non-factory firmware, which is something that I have been working on. sometimes a module showing a lesser voltage can be brought back, but often one cell in the module is dead. I am not running any temperature probes yet, but I do run a box fan across the pack. S. Keith has suggested using the factory fan to cool the pack, and I think I will take his advice on the next one. Google delta peak, it will explain it better than I can, but the simple answer is the peak voltage the pack reaches during charging, before it starts dropping off.
awesome thank you!
I guess the HobbyKing Quattro is the best bang for your buck then in terms of how many you can do at a time?
I need some advice using Reaktor chargers. I bought 4x 300w AC/DC 20a chargers similar to what you are using in this video. My settings for NiMH are 2a charge auto, 2a charge manual, 5a discharge down to 6.2V with DCHG/CHG set to 3, 5 minute wait time, all annoying alarms off, safety time set to NONE as it disrupts any cycle it's in and erases mah data if the time is met. I learned that the system won't cycle at all and only performs one half of a cycle (charge OR discharge only) unless you push the start button while showing the screen "DCHG/CHG - 3" I wasted an entire day recording data that started and only performed a manual charge OR discharge as a half cycle. When you do push start on the correct screen the data erases immediately when the half cycle completes and is in "wait/waste time" it will change instantly from for example: 3479mah to 0000 and just holds at 0000 until the 5 minutes is up and the next half cycle begins to count. So really only get the final result of 3 cycles if you walk away and come back hours or half a day later. I can't find a way to see any other mah data to complete a meaningful chart. Also every module so far has increased in stored ampacity with the data I happened to have seen before it auto erased but i'm only seeing increases from about 1200mah to 4500mah. Is there a better way to set these chargers up? Am I missing something?
I am experiencing the same problem I have the model you have and I can not see the charge and discharge capacity using the increase and decrease buttons like Tommy does on this video ..... if you have figured it out please share me your experience. thanks
Can you please explain how one can tell if the charging or discharging is complete for a cycle. I am using the imax B6AC v2 and just following your settings. it just keeps changing from discharge to charge or charge to discharge. But how can I tell if cycle 1,2 or 3 is completed. I have my setting on discharge/charge 3 cycle. After over 6 hours, I press on stop and I only see the reading CH1 5866mAH, DISC 1- 4366 mAH, CH2 6975 mAH, DISC 2- 4645 mAH, CH3 0000 mAH, DISC 3 - 417 mAH Working on a prius hv battery
These things need a hard kick in the butt once in a while. I tried being gentle with these cells, 1A C/D. It did help me isolate cells under 4aHr but still had poor performance until I forced them hard. Dr.prius app (not affiliated) has a battery life test function that will hard charge the pack in about a minute and then do a discharge test(AC,lights, heaters etc) over a 15 minute period. At the end it will give you a life capacity percentage. good luck......
Excellent work and excellent video. When you recondition in this way, typically how long more will the cells last before needing another shot or replacing?
Please do a video on how to use the menus on the Reaktor. I have the exact same charger, yet it will not show the charge capacities like it did when you hit INC at 6:50 in the video. Instead, it kept cycling through the settings menus instead. I was 3 cycle charge/discharging just like you were here at the time. Please show how to get it to show that capacity information (written instructions that came with the charger are pretty terrible as well). Thanks.
My charge completed with 8.86v and only 01516 mAh in 23 minutes. Charge rate auto 5.0A, disharge rate 2.0A, dchg/chg 3 cycles, repeak 2 78000mAh cutoff. Why am I only getting 1516mAh?
I'm getting ready to dive into this project of removal of the Prius Battery and Recondition the cells/replace. Do you happen to have a step by step guide of materials or links you could recommend. I see many videos here on youtube, however, none really showing every step- Example-when removing the individual nuts on the orange bus bar-I'm assuming there is still a danger of shorting since the cells are still in series. I assume wear proper gloves, but is there still sparking when all the bolts are removed and the orange bar slid off? I am about to buy a how to from PriusKings on amazon but I haven't heard back about if they show how to recondition the battery not just replace a bad module (cell). So do you power the HobbyKing charger w/ a 12V car battery? & just keep charging that up? Thanks for any help you can provide.
I bought those chargers but how do you plug them into the wall
Hi Tommy, thanks for the video. While I was reading thru the comments, you mentioned about knowing the battery capacity. How do we find out about the battery capacity? Also I want to know how to fix a module if the bolt is broken on one end? Thanks in advance.
also the cell numbers are backwards, actual number 28 is next to the electronics.
Hey Tommy can I email you? I have some simple questions. When you are charging with Quattro what is too high for the voltage, sometimes I see on the Quattro screen it goes up to 9.3 charging volts. Is that right? I have it set to default and on automatic charging.
hey, when cgarging do you set a cut off capacity ? or you let it run until it is full and whatever is the capacity it the one you write ?
He set to 7500..
On very bad modules he used 7800
you are numbering them backwards, #1 is on the passenger side away from the computer.. it will make a huge difference when reading the tech stream info
haha happen to me
Yep.
I'm using a tenergy t180 on my 07 camry hybrid, i let it sit overnight but it cut off at 240 minutes for safety timer, and my capacity cutoff was set at 6500 but when i checked the screen, it went above that but it didnt shut off the charger, is that normal? or am i doing something wrong?
The cells are counted from right to left.
What's the maximum voltage to charge and minimum to discharge this battery? What's capacity to set too?
Does the charge reaching 9.0 volts have to hold for a specific time to be considered charged up or can we manually hit discharge as soon as it reaches the 9.0 volts?
Tommy I can’t get my chargers to cycle they just full charge and stop and say full. They don’t discharge???
Good day to you,
I would like to start disassembly of my battery; however, I
have a few questions.
When removing the battery what points is the multimeter
touching to make sure there is no current? I know it’s the Hybrid Main Relay
but what is Positive & Negative? I haven’t removed yet but if there is a
RED wire do I assume it’s the RED ‘hot’ side and the black the Negative?
When removing the actual battery contact nuts is there a
safe order to do so or just start from one end and move to the other? Is there
sparking involved? Is there 100 V still live and active while removing the
nuts? Or is there only a smaller amount if I stay carefully on each one. I noticed
in one video I saw a spark when a tool touched between 2 of the battery
contacts when the harness was being removed. I think they were removing a Gen 1
battery where it had the sticky glue and they were just using a flat head screw
driver.
When or if it sparks is it the size of a typical 12V car
battery when reinstalling and there is a small load on the battery and there is
about ¼” spark that’s no big deal?
I am told use LineMan gloves..I’m assuming there is a
difference between those and just ARC welder leather gloves?
When putting the nut back on..are you using gloves or just
using bare hands..no one seems to film that in there videos.
Is that just liability issue so if someone got hurt and that
is the most dangerous point one wouldn’t accuse you of showing something that
was too dangerous?
Also, I read somewhere that most torque wrenches are too
strong for the actual torque for the battery contacts for the orange strip.
They mentioned something about a being torque wrench or something that has
smaller measurements of torque..I have since lost where I found that Prius thred.
Any feedback is greatly appreciated. Have a terrific day!
Also, I wanted to get a HobbyKing Quartto x4 NiMh Charger
and a dedicated 12v battery to run it to balance the batteries with ofcouse a
fan cooling the battery and the charger during the process. Do you happen to know the discharge and charge
value to enter rate of charge amps etc?
Doing my gen1 now for a p3030. I got by without linesman gloves. Used electricians nut drivers and screw drivers
Followed wisdom that said wait 15 min after pulling the plug to allow inverter to discharge
And followed wisdom that said to open the high voltage cable part way down to split the pack.
Sometimes did use the electrical screw driver to pry at the gluey busbars, but mostly relief on wiggling. Was cognizant of that video with a spark.
Hi where do I get a module for a 2011 Chevy Silverado 1500 hybrid from Panasonic?
Hi, Tommy, I have 2007 Camry already repair 1 time (no new batteries) about 4 years ago
I bought a new Reaktor Quatro 300w 20A and starting the process according to the video but at the moment the first 5 batteries after the 3 first cycle the charge average is 1090 to 1500 and another 2 batteries the average is 4000. Which is your opinion? Thanks!
Hey tommy how did you balance them and with what settings? I have a T180 turnegy
I let them self-balance for a couple days, by tying them all together in parallel, with small gauge lashing wire. It will look like a sine wave, skipping every other battery.
bugger this charger appears to be discontinued. In this boat now needing to try get some prius modules back in action, or at least diagnose the bad ones.
Hi Tommy. Perfect video ! I use the same reactor with 240 W. But one question: Some modules blow up a bit, and other like a balllon. When are bloating modules not okay for you?
Hi. Which charger do You currently recommend? HobbyKing Quattro or Turnigy Reaktor are no longer available.
New Reaktor T240 or Skyr IMAX v.2 will be good?
@Lukas Usc honestly, I haven’t messed with any Prius packs in several years, and haven’t kept up with the new chargers either. I’m sure someone here has some suggestions.
@@tommyjohnson5354 thanks for the info. I keep searching :)
But, it's interesting that almost all topics about cell to hybrids break off 2-3 years ago 🙄
Tommy. How are you powering the reactor chargers? Are you running them off of a 12v car charger?Thanks
Can you tell me what's the discharge minimum v.
I am getting a about 6000 discharge and 7200 recharge. My charger will cut off at 7200 and then begin a discharge cycle. I have don't each at least ten times. Is this bad or good?
The pack you bought for a few hundred was not compressed if you look at the bolts on the bar lol
You said when you did a capacity test on 14 it checked out at 1.2 amps. How did you do the capacity test?
Hi Tommy. Thanks for share this information. I have a question, how many amp needs each cell to be charger? I can see a lot of chargers, but I don't have idea of your DC power supply. Thanks.
I run a Mastech 3020, for 3 chargers, and an old 15 amp bench power supply from Radio Shack. Each charger will pull around 8a max, if you run them at 18v input. while some are charging, some are discharging, so it seldom overloads.
hi Tommy, can i hook up my 28 modules in the prius pack in parallel, leave them over night, then hook the pack up with JUST 1 charger to discharge/charge cycles? thank
Hi Mike, did you try that?
Hi, can you please explain what does this mentioned term "1 - 6s" mean? Does it mean that one charging unit from Reactor can able to charge maximum 6 Prius cells simultaneously?
@thghho it means 1 cell in series.
@@tommyjohnson5354 Hi Tommy, that means that when it says 15s you can have 2 prius cells?
Is there an alternative charger to the Hobbyking Quattro (as They are out of stock and have been for some time now)
great work! what do you use as a power supply for your reaktor chargers?
Cool
Hi Tommy, i purchased a Hobby King Quattro to try to make better time. I dont know if i have had trouble in the setup or what. i can not get the dchg/chg to run in Auto. i have it set to 3 cycles and it just runs once and stops. Also it will only discharge at 1.0 amp? is that right or do i need to update its firmware? do you know? Thanks for any help.
Sorry for the delay, but yes, it discharges at 1 amp (slow as molasses). When your charger stops, what does the display say?
thanks for the reply. it was because i was an idiot. i got it straightened out now. other than the 1 amp thing. i am real happy with them. afraid i am going to have to just buy another battery but i will know this week.
+Jerry Smallwood Glad you got it sorted out. I am on my 5th Prius now, picked up one for $500 last week, bad battery, and I am going through the modules now.
Hi Tommy Johnson!
Thanks for you videos, are awsome!
I have some hobby chargers like yours, and my batterys are getting around 5000mA disharging after 3 cycles.
Im charging 3A and discharging to 6.3V
With your experience, what would you do? do you think they can get more amperage after more cycles?
many many thanks!
5 amps is ok, try to do a couple more cycles on a few, and see if you can get more capacity. If not, it is still useable.
Tommy Johnson
Thanks you Tommy J ! =)
Before put it again in the car, Whats you do? Give a full individual charge to them all or give an parallel charge on them? What ypu recomend? =)
Magichand I would go though them individually, balance overnight, and drop it back in the car if the modules all checked out.
thanks Tommy!
how you balance them?
get "full charge " individually, then put on the car?
Magichand get full charge individually, then tie all the + together, and all the - sides together. The weaker modules will pull the stronger ones down to their voltage level. Leave it overnight, and by morning, the pack will be balanced. Put all your bus bars back on, reassemble the pack, and reinstall. Be very careful though, one short and you’re gonna have a bad day!
How do you know after charging and discharging a cell that is still good or should be thrown away now?
I guess if you have good capacity reading, and good voltage under load.
On the last cycle you read how much capacity is get inside, and then drain it under load (not sure how much amperage😐), to see if is gets below 7v - 7.5v.
I'm not professional, but I think is correct
And one more thing how do you recommend doing a capacity test should I just use a 12 volt / 6 volt tester from Walmart or do you recommend something
LOL... "guy named Steve"... Hmmm... I think I know that guy... BTW... you need to cool that bugger. You can use the EXIT duct and shove it into the bottom of the case where it normally goes and then just aim the 12V blower from the car into it. It will blow air up through the pack.
S Keith Yep, you really helped me alot man, thanks! Just off screen in this video, is a large box fan. It blows across the pack, and I am now starting to use the regen capabilities in the chargers, using a 12v car battery, and a Schumacher charger.
You're welcome. Happy to help.
I used to use a box fan too, until I found out that you're basically trying to cool a solid block. I saw some bad things happen. Unless you're driving air through the cooling passages, you're doing almost nothing. Try it for yourself... You can power the fan with your battery or get an adjustable 30A/12V power supply from amazon. You will be amazed at how much air can move up through the pack even without any effort to seal up the blower/duct interface (you can "seal" it by stuffing a rag into the gaps). You'll be able to charge @ 6.5A and rely on deltaV cut-off without worrying about swelling. Since you're exploring the regenerative features, you're only going to be making more heat. Allow 30 minutes between cycles.
Regenerative is only 42% efficient based on my multiple tests, i.e., when you regen 1000mAh out of a module, you can only put in 420mAh using that same energy, so you still have to supply quite a bit.
You can also "march" through the pack using the prior "block" as your regen source, i.e., discharge modules 1 & 2 into a 12V battery or with the internal discharge and then power the charger with modules 1&2 as a 12 cell battery (single copper bus bar joining them at one end) and discharge 2&3 into 1+2, rinse and repeat "marching" through the pack. The nice thing is you're discharging and partially charging, again saving time. Watch out for the bad modules as they throw a wrench into it.
Easy to wear out a 12V. Make sure your regen settings are at 14.7V for 12V. When using two prius modules, that can go to 18.4V.
Oh, and your wiring is a bit messy. Try to keep the Reaktor leads as short as possible. Now that you're moving into high current territory, your voltage drop is going to start getting noticeable. You can see for yourself by watching the voltage difference reported by the Reaktor during discharge and measuring with the separately attached voltmeter. You can compensate by lowering your target voltage, i.e., if you show 6.2V when the charger terminates at 6.0V, you can just terminate at 5.8V.
Also, go to 6.0V. If going to 6.0V takes a module out, you don't want it in the car.
Good luck!
Steve
Tommy, I have some questions. I have some modules that cycled, but when I went back to top them off later they did not cycle. I reset capacity cut off at 7900. What happend?
@@snoobler Very informative discussion, please keep it up!
Jerry, increase your capacity in the charger settings, to 7800
Hey what is the maximum voltage I can charge these batteries to or is that where the Delta Peak comes into play
Hi I got a prius and check light was on while the engine is running.i checked the hv battery cells.each cell reading 8.1.is the cells ok
So how did the battery cell modules workout after the charge? Is it in the vehicle?
Star Master Tech 2 years later, still driving the car daily. Mileage has started to decline slightly, currently around 40mpg, so will likely have to go through the pack again before the end of the year.
Is there a link for the charger you have specifically the Quattro one
Tommy, do you have a step by step instructions for the hobbyking quattro charger?
No sir, but I can put something together this weekend if you want.
That would be great. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
+John Cardoza th-cam.com/video/2Z9PDH_2awk/w-d-xo.html
There is nothing much wrong with an IMaxB6 clone as long as you dont expect much from it. It works fine for charging AS LONG AS YOU WATCH THE END OF THE CYCLE CAREFULLY. Also I NEVER use autocycling anymore, too slow and annoying. Instead, know that NiMh cells always get a bit above room temp when they reach full charge. It doesnt matter what car they come out of either. Charge them with whatever you got for NiMh and Discharge them fast with a Carbon Pile. I Dis at 40 amps most of the time and sometimes 50 amps if I am in a hurry. Some use 20 or 10 amps, dont much matter though as LONG AS YOU do the SAME thing to all the modules. The modules can handle it easily since they live in the car humping back and forth at 60-80 amps all day long! This way you will get done in a couple days if you never leave the room. But if you like spending more money on fancy chargers go ahead. Keep a fan blowing on everything too. I dont recall seeing any fans in your setup.
Also your pack will probably need redone in a few months time. Since you did NOT load test the modules at all. The little 1 or 2 amps those chargers do for Dis is NOT enough to test for load endurance. A Carbon Pile load tester works much better for this CRITICAL step. Eg hook up each module to the carbon pile and burn it down for 3 minutes (maybe more), watching the voltmeter and your stopwatch carefully. I usually stop the "burn" when the V hits 6 under load. Note the time. If your pack is to work well, ALL of the modules will have to show the exact same results, or damn close to it.
A side benefit of doing it this way is you weed out the good modules quickly, they dont need to be cycled more. Saves time. Concentrate on the weaker ones instead.
DO the exact same procedure to ALL the modules. Do not fudge any for time. Replace any modules that are not up to snuff. Be ruthless! Modules dont cost that much. I see them used and tested for $25 each and sometimes less than that. eg, Like-new modules are about $35 at Bumblebee Batteries.
Put the better performing modules in the center of the pack where it gets warmest. The pack will stay balanced a bit longer that way.
Also get yourself a copy of Dr. Prius and a bluetooth adapter that will work with it so you can check on the pack from time to time easily.
Mike Lamb - what is a realistic life expectancy on a restored/balanced pack?
@@c217z It really depends on how bad off the cells are to start with. Most refurbished packs will work ok for a year or two at most. Even packs refurbished by the factory may only last a couple years. The reason is that the chemistry inside is aging and oxidizing the nickle plates in there, causing resistance to build up. Deep cycling like in the video helps to remove some of the oxidation, but never all of it.
The quality of the chemistry inside the cells varies a good deal as well. In general though you can count on a years time if you do the work really well yourself, no short cuts. Also in order to be sure you get as much time as possible be sure you load test each module one at a time. Be sure to do the exact same test to each of them too. I usually "burn" a refurbished module at 40 amps for at least 3 minutes before I declare it "good enough." A good one will stay above 6.5V during this testing too.
@@@michael47lamb Thanks! It seems to be a labor of love. Would you say the $1600 - $2000 new packs will generally outperform gas mileage wise? I haven't pulled my gen 3 pack yet so I don't know how bad individual modules are. Torque shows voltages within .3v.
@@c217z LoL Labor of Love is one way to look at it. I do it mainly because I am cheap as the day is long and dont mind the work very much. It is also sort of interesting in a geeky sort of way to me.
As far as making the plunge of 1600-2000 goes, I see nothing wrong with that as long as you understand it may or may not stay "fixed." Be sure to get a pack with a strong warranty by a reputable company (not some garage clown selling on Ebay or Craigslist!) MPG wise: either method will work about the same. It is mostly a question of investing money in one or the other. 2K in money and a days work (warranty too maybe), or $70 -$100 and a few days work. Your choice. I usually find that 2 to 6 modules need replacing, the rest are fine. Although the last Prius I worked on needed 14 module, but that cost me all of $350 in cells and a bunch of time tinkering.
Ask yourself this: How long have you been seeing the Red Triangle of Doom? If it hasnt shown up yet dont worry about it. But when it does show up, fix the pack right away before more cells get damaged. 0.30V diff is not too great just yet. Although 0.20V is what I shoot for in real life. The car has a wide degree of tolerance it seems.
@@michael47lamb No red triangle, don't think I get one with gen 3. I have "Check Hybrid System" on dash and P0A80. I ordered Techstream. Should be here this week. I like the cheapskate approach. Guess its time to start ordering battery chargers. Sounds like you have done a slew of these.
When charging the batteries do you need to have a cooling fan hooked up or blowing on them?
gflyers7 yes, and you can use the factory battery cooling fan from the car, it works great.
Hi Have you used a tenergy TB6 balance charger yet? Thanks
Was the b6 calibrated before charging ( another video said that was needed) ?
Yes sir!
Hi Tommy J. i have bought two of these chargers and a Hobby king power supply to rejuvenate a Prius Battery. i have ran this on two different cells for a total of four. one runs fine. the other has resulted in an error that looks something like this. termination capacity overload 7501. was there a setting that i missed along the way? i am pretty sure that this has come from the same charger both times. thanks in advance.
Jerry, did you ever figure out the "capacity overload 7501" issue? I'm having same error. help please
What charger are you using?
Turnigy Reaktor 250W 10A
I have the capacity cut-off set on at 7500mAh
i had one that did that and it would swell up. i discarded and replaced it. i had another one that gave me the same problem but didn't swell up. so i tried charging it on a quattro 4x6 and it went through with no problem. i ended up buying two quattros and had two Reaktor 250's because the singles were taking too long.
Hii
Can you recommend me where can i get this type of chargers
Hi I think the hobbyking website still sells Turnigy chargers
this cells are very different to consumer NIMH , try to charge till 8.4V only per module , that voltage is calculated full by hybrid computer , after that the cells will build pressure , and charge the module in the pack also very importaht
My charsoon only charges at 8.4...or 7.2. Which was really confusing at first, but its been working
What power supply are you using, I need to do this
Could you please tell me where I can buy charger.
Thank you.
U can buy these Hybrid batteries at Green Bean installed for $1500.00 they will send a tech to remove your old one and put a new one in. 5 year warranty comes with it. Changing these cells is like pissing in the wind, could last 3 months or 30 days. Just call Green bean and get a new one
@@scraplifetrashtocash4551 Please answer to the question or shut up. Probably you own Green Bean and you want some profits from this chat.
Tommy, we designed way more efficient way to analyze / charge all modules simulataneously on the individual module level. Please visit our site: www.hybrids.co.nz/ and youtube channel: www.hybrids.co.nz/. Our tools are logical choice for those who tried hobby RC toy chargers but found that to be extremely time consuming, not providing sustainable results and not coping with the work load. It took us just couple of days many years ago to realise that. So we invented our own tools which we are now selling to other busy garages and battery rebuilders.
Hey Kiwi, you big cutie. The Reaktors are capable of more current than your battery analyzer. I've worked on batteries that were "reconditioned" by stateside equipment comparable to your battery analyzer in terms of capabilities, and I was extremely unimpressed with the results.
Mate, your lack of attention to details worries me. We already had that conversation. I mentioned before on the forum where you are bragging about your acheivements and you had an opportunity to read that in plain English: "Our Analysers are tailor made and capable of testing modules at up to 100 Amps". And that is excactly what few of our clients are doing - testing at high amps. Special design was made (not shown on site as it was built to order) with 100A connectors & fuses. It is your choice what load you use - 100A, 50A, or 20A, or 6A. It is summer time in NZ - you are welcome to come to NZ and see for yourself. Instead of promoting "made in china RC toys" - you could've been our agent years ago. HV cables and plugs are made in USA (you could be proud of that), the rest is made in Japan and Korea and is high quality components. We pay comission B2B to right people who know what they are doing. You still need to demonstrate that your skills are up to the task, but your passion for batteries is a good beginning :-) P.S. - our Battery Manufacture Date Scanner is now working in few states. One is used by one of your biggest Battery Specialists. Cheers. I am available via Skype daily - watch time difference.
You expect me to remember your blatherings on PC? Seriously?
I'm not a client, but I'm testing at high current. You shouldn't think you know what I'm doing based on what I put on a forum months ago. I have lots of happy customers running very strong packs. Being your agent would have only slowed me down and killed my profitability. Your battery date scanner can be had on ebay for about $30. Any simple QR Code scanner works. No software required. I already have one. Good job suckering one of our "biggest Battery Specialists".
Tommy, sorry for polluting your comments. I won't engage with Kiwi anymore.
You again making untrue statements and making assumptions . Our Manufacture Date Scanner is a software product, it is not available on eBay. QR scanners they can convert QR code into number. Our software does much more - it automatically decodes numbers into manufacture dates and highlights with color whether there were swapped modules in the Prius. Camry, Lexus hybrid battery pack, it produces sound if you've made a mistake while scanning the pack. It adds smarts and efficiency. Your judgement about our products shows lack of understanding.
Are the modules swelling up to huge size?
Yes, they do swell while charging.
how many 3 cycle runs have you ever did on one cell?
I have run a couple, as many as 5 times (15 cycles total) to get them back. in retrospect, I should have just replaced them, because they were on their last leg. If you don't see results after the 4th cycle, I would suggest replacing it.
U can buy these complete and installed for $1500.00 @ Green bean... They will send a tech with the complete Hybrid battery to your location. 5 year warranty with it too.
The batteries have a factory capacity of 6500 mAh and why are you shocked at 7500 or 7800 mAh?
I would like to use turnigy reaktor qaudkore 1200w 80a charger in my house. Do I need a 100a breaker? Or would it work on a 20a just allocate 5a per charger while not tripping it? Would it increase speeds if on a 100a breaker?
Also what is a good power supply to buy
Amps x volts = watts. 1200 / 80 = 15v. A standard wall plug is rated at either 15 or 20a, let’s use 20a. 110v x 20a = 2200w. You do not need a 100a circuit to run your Reaktor. What you do need, is a strong power supply, that can deliver enough current and voltage to charge all 4 ports simultaneously. Modern computer power supplies, rated at 1500w, are what I would be looking for. You might get away with a 1200w or 1300w, but see if you can find a server power supply and modify it for your charging needs. A quick Google search shows an HP 1300w server power supply for $35, might even order one myself..
how long does it take to do one cell usually?
A couple hours, for 3 cycles, using the Reaktor chargers.
So when I hit comment it did not format well at all. I did space paragraphs and the excel doc got way corrupted. Apologize for the cluster of words.
Print screen and paste works a lot better, see below.
Can you sell me your old reaktor? or can I rent them from you ?
Hi. I've been working on my camry hybrid bat very with the reaktor set up as you have it. Can you help me understand the charge rates you're writing down and if there is a target charge rate? you're showing like 06348 in this example on battery 21? before taking it off. My recorded rates are showing up more like 2500 to 3500. What do this numbers represent? How do i understand them better?
Donald,
You need to cycle each module until you get 5700 on a discharge. Your higher number is the Delta Peak on the charge. usually that peaks at about 7300 average. If you see extreme swelling of a module during charging, it is probably in need of replacing.
Im still learning though. Be carefull
Okay. Just because i'm starting with low numbers doesn't mean I won't be able to get the batteries back up to 5700 on discharge. Is that correct? Or does that mean they are ready to give out? All of my batteries started with a charge above 7.5V on the meter but i had the red light on my dashboard. I'm trying to do preventative. I have two chargers running different batteries at the same time. Do I run ALL of the cycles consecutively until I hit 5700 discharge? Or will it work to do a three cycle, then move on to another battery even though i'm not reaching 5700 yet, let the battery settle, then come back and do it again? Or should I keep on the batteries until they are reaching 5700 discharge? Non of the batteries are showing extreme swelling, they all seems pretty normal to me in regards the swell. AND I have only run one cycle on each so far. Suggestions? (and thanks for your input, it's been an interesting process)
I have some modules that took 27 cycles to get them back to 5700. I stayed on a module until I got it done, so yes consecutively. I would run 3 cycles, evaluate then set for 5 or more, or what I thought it would need to finish. This is a very time consuming process, up to a month with two chargers.
You may need to reset your Capacity cut off to 9000mAH, 7800 was not enough for some of my modules.
After I got through all the modules, I went back and ran one cycle on each to top them off before installing the pack back in the car. Extreme swelling is what determines replacement.
This is what I have learned and experienced.
Hi again. Update. Yes two chargers is a slow process. And i'm patient I have another car thank god. My car is a 2007 Camry at 200k I assume the batteries and approach is the same with the prius batteries, just slightly different pack. The reason i ask, is what i'm finding is that my batteries seem to top out in the same range, after running three cycles of three. They are all getting to just in the high 2000 low 3000 range then drop then return then drop. This is when the batteries seem to swell. Maybe i'm just too afraid to keep pushing it, or that what i'm seeing is a swelling battery that really isn't that bad yet and I should do another four or five cycles (cycles of three that is) Is it possible that the whole of the battery pack is ALL stuck at the same level?. From what i am reading on the forums is that you generally find one or two that don't respond well, but not 25 in a row. I feel i'm doing something wrong. I did watch some of your other videos---one in particular of the hobby king four charger. I reset my turnigys to the levels you suggested on the Hobby king and I got a bit quicker response (5amp charge, 7800, 6 on the low end for example) I just feel I'm missing something because not one of the batteries has moved any where near the 4000 range. Possibly I'm doing it right and that the discharge levels are actually what i should be seeing because I've set it up wrong or I'm attempting to achieve levels that I shouldn't be, it's a different style of battery or I just don't know. I can push the batteries harder, and see if they start jumping up--yet i'm concerned about the swelling. Is it possible that all the batteries are just near done with 200k on the car? They all showed a good 7.7 or so charge when i first pulled the pack out. They almost all start in a very low discharge rate too ---for example--00453 to 02562---00426 to 02590. This battery in particular (battery 32) i've run 11 cycles on. Its had movement but the last four cycles are stuck in the 2500 range. Does it defeat the purpose if the battery swells and I stop and return to it at end of the day or another day? You said in an earlier reply do it all at once. i'm not sure if that's possible, and since i don't understand the process, If i need to run 25 to 30 cycles a battery to see the starting levels I will do that. Or if I can just keep rotating up and down the pack i can do that. Do I push it harder or just be resigned that this is the state of my batteries after 200k? Advice? On approach, or testing or changing settings on the chargers. Thanks in advance. donald
Hey tommy, I'm on Prius chat and need some help with my charge configuration. All the wires and sources are confusing. Will you message me your setup how you powered your balance chargers? name is "Spenser"
Disregard comment below, It did not work. Looked good once again until I hit comment.
Nobody cares about all what you paid for the chargers and how many miles the car had. How did you hook all this up. I see you have 15 and 25 volt versions. Are they for 2 and 3 module packs? No clue what you're doing.