Happens every time I watch smash videos. Except Hbox. I always play a better Puff after seeing his movement. But Puff has a pretty low tech skill requirement.
Pounce Baratheon It's true that puff has a lower tech skill floor than other characters. But, I feel that many people think tech skill and skill are the same in this game. I think puff is one of the hardest characters to play of the top 6-8. Maybe even the hardest, considering the current meta. Tech skill simply means input frequency required to play the character. So in that sense, of the top 8, the order is probably something like: Fox Falco C. Falcon Marth Sheik/Peach Sheik/Peach Ice Climbers Puff But actual skill includes things like spacing and option select; overall application of tech. When this is considered I think Puff spikes to be one of the most difficult characters to use at top level due to how early she can die. Spacing in particular is most important for puff as she completely relies on it. This list is much more debatable but at top level (where its basically implied that tech skill is not much of an issue for the players anymore) I think the list of difficulty in succeeding with a character is something like: Puff Peach C. Falcon Marth/Falco Marth/Falco Ice Climbers Fox Sheik Again super debatable and tbh i even question this list because its so hard to really know. But tldr; puff is tough to play. I hope you dont think tech skill directly relates to actual skill (btw I main Falco and Peach so no bias here)
Urameshi Sama I don't use much tech.That's why I learn more from watching Hbox. I'll never have Westballz' hand speed or Mango's reaction time. But I can almost mimic what Hbox does with the constant floating left and right to stay the right distance from a player and bair/fair when they get too close, or maintain an off stage puff combo or gimp. I'm still better with marth, though. But many weak players like me are best with marth/shiek.
Pounce Baratheon tldr at the end Unless low level means low enough that spam f smash works well, Marth isn't actually that easy to play at low level. He's definitely on the easier side of the spectrum but in my oppinion Ice Climbers, sheik and to a lesser degree peach can destroy at low to mid level with not very much effort compared to the rest of top 8. Marth is really good at any level but i feel that the reason there are so many marth mains is mostly because of how they displayed M2K in the documentary. Marth is probably 4th easiest at low level. The spacies don't really start to show how amazing they are until around mid level due to tech flubs. Jiggs and C. Falcon are always tough in my oppinion. I think its sorta like this (from easiest to hardest to succeed with and no, tech skill does not mean harder or easier for any pleb whom thinks so) also my previous list was depicting overall difficulty through all levels these are different because they are now split up: Low Level Sheik, IC's. Peach, Marth,Falco, Fox, C. Falcon, Jiggs Mid Level IC's, Sheik, Falco, Marth. Fox, Peach, Jiggs, C. Falcon High Level Fox, Sheik, Marth, Falco, C. Falcon, Peach, Jiggs, IC's It's a very rough list and its really hard to make it accurate at high level because the player's ability is much more of a deciding factor than the character they play but looking at the cast from an effort:results ratio perspective, I think this is not far from the truth. And for the idiots out there, I am aware that Armada plays Peach but he wins because of how good he is not because peach is good. Peach is actually ridiculously hard to use well at top level for a number of reasons. A lot of the things that make her succeed in the levels of play below top level become almost completely obsolete. It's one of the things that makes Armada look extra amazing. At mid level and high level Falco and Marth are basically even in my oppinion. I think falco is a little easier in mid generally because people, mostly, either arent fully comfortable with power-shielding laser or they arent really good at DI to get out of Falco combos. At Top level, Marth becomes seriously rewarding if you can make it to top level with him but gets notably tougher to use due to the consistency requirement. And falco becomes MUCH tougher to use properly which i think some people are starting to realize now due to their being only 2 notable falco mains (and one whom hasnt been at top level ability for a long time... rip), Falco also has very little movement ability compared to the rest of top 8 which becomes very apparent at high level play. I personally think that Marth is easily 2nd best character in the game and COULD potentially join Fox in their own tier, though fox is still the best character. And sheik overall gets away with the most bullshit on average, by far, of any character throughout all levels of play. It's tough to say for sure but this is what I think. And I swear to god if I hear how the Ice Climbers wobble so they cant be hardest to play at top level well just know how wrong you are because wobbling is so hard to pull off at top level that the IC's become easily the least likely (if not basically impossible) to win a major with. tldr; marth is not easy at any level imo but also not the hardest. And sheik privilege is rampant at low - mid level and it needs to be addressed. There are cool sheik mains below top level but 90% of sheiks are braindead cheesers at low-mid
+Timothy S. That literally does not make grammatical sense with respect to Omni's sentence. Do you mean to say,"It's 100% correct, unlike you"? I suspect you're missing the irony.
1. Roll as often as possibly 2. Use smash attacks almost exclusively: they do the most damage 3. Don't grab, most grabs only like 8% damage and push the opponent away, you want them super close always, especially with Marth 4. Projectile also suck and are weak
Grabs are actually very useful in certain situations. For example: Marths grab-and-throw-upwards works great for sending the opponent into the air if the opponent's HP % is above 60. Grab throws send your opponent further the more damage they take, like any other attack in the game.
Finally a video that actually explains this type of psychological depth behind Smash. Thank you! I've always tried explaining this concept of adaptation and mindgames to people; for example, my mum because she absolutely hates the hell out of Smash and thinks that the game is just about mindless button mashing and nothing more ugh
+H A Z Y Yeah but implementing the psychology is excruciatingly hard. I've been playing for over a year and my only improvement is my reflexes. I can do stuff, like...faster so I can make combos, but that's about all. I come from StarCraft, so the psychology isn't new, but I wasn't good at StarCraft, so implementing still is.
+H A Z Y Some people get it, some people don't. Generally males are far more likely to grasp the concept of adaptation and mind games in video games than females, so I would not blame your mom.
+Andrew Wager NO, please don't that's a little bit ridiculous. Do the research yourselves people... there's a place called smash boards where matchups have been hammered out for like 10 years now, plus there's something called playing the game. For Kira to try and TEACH you the matchup... that's just silly
+sketch nin you cant teach a matchup in a short video. But it could go well in his new quick tips series. For example, he could have a video on marth vs falco and say something like dash dancing makes it easier to powershield the lasers. Researching the basic matchup on your own should be encouraged but maybe Kira could just give more high level tips?
I actually just recently delved a lot deeper into this games decision making, while still polishing my tech skill and I've improved so much. It's like I'm just starting to see the game in slow motion and I can react to things I never was able to before. I also catch on to the little nuances of what works and what doesn't which makes it easier to read my opponent. This video really hits the nail on the head.
Alright alright where did you start? i’ve been playing melee for a little while now and i feel like this barrier, something that i’m just not understanding and i would really like to change that. so how did you get to this point? what kind of mindset did you have? how long did it take? and how exactly did you accomplish this?
Honestly I mostly grinded tech skill like crazy. The more tools you have and the faster you are at executing them, the slower the game becomes and the more the decisions and micro-situations become apparent. I just beat up computers over and over again, taking note of what followups work and what doesn't, and I stuck to using only one character (Falco). For me it was when I asked myself, if I d-air my opponent's shield, but land behind them, what's the next best thing I can do? Maybe short hop b-air, maybe wavedash back and shine, maybe turn around and grab. Just find those situations you have trouble with and try to simulate it and try options to see which works the most often. If you can get the 20XX tournament edition, you can turn on random DI (aerial DI and tech rolls) so the computers are really unpredictable. I found that was the easiest way to train my reaction time. Combine grinding tech skill with knowledge of follow ups + good reaction times = you'll be decent at Melee and it all snowballs from there. Once I did that my results VS other humans skyrocketed and I could actually stand a chance. That was my experience so far. Hope it helps!
Shadoninja In all seriousness explaining things can go a looong way! I played 18+ hours with some 2 "casual" friends...and near the end of it, they were catching on. 1 person was dabbling a bit with spacing, while the other seemed to learn the basics of sheilding and grabbing...*sigh* I should probably mention I did very little to explain anything to them, rather, I was more suprised they wanted to play for 18+ hours to begin with! :O
I am no smash professional by any means, but in my years of experience I found that to be good at this game you need to be decent at these things. 1.) Game knowledge, know the stages, characters, match ups, tech skills, and understand how they can help you in matches. 2.) Tech Chase, following up attacks and punishing predictable recoveries and rolls. 3.) Move fast, be comfortable with your character, stay loose, and be prepared to punish bad reads and attacks. 4.) DON'T BE PREDICTABLE! Good smash opponents pick up bad habits very easily and will punish you hard. Mix ups with approches, attacks and DI is your best bet. 5.) Relax, opponents can tell if your nervous and will take advantage of that fact, make sure to have fun, it is a game after all.
To anyone who would say "how could anyone think that fast," or "fox moves for me to adapt that fast," I would respond don't worry. Once you have seen a situation once, and have thought about how to cover it, even if it is outside of the match or in friendlies, you will naturally develop a series of options that work for you to cover different scenarios. This video isn't so much about training yourself to make split second reactions and adaptations mid match, its about developing a conscious awareness that a series of options exists that cover what you opponent is doing such that you can learn what those options yourself over time.
This video is one of greatest things to ever come from the FGC. It elegantly sums up fighting games, and even competition as a whole, with sage-like precision and attention to detail. It's simple enough for a new player to grasp, yet deep enough to teach a vet like me something new. To quote Portal, "This was a triumph. I'm making a note here: HUGE SUCCESS. It's hard to overstate my satisfaction."
ive actually just started to grasp this concept. like i always sorta knew that adaptation existed, but i would always think "how am i supposed to focus hard enough to be collecting data and adapting the entire match?" but once you develop better fundamentals, learning more and more ways to deal with your opponents' options, you realize you were always collecting data, it just turns into "its so annoying that you keep doing this and i dont know what to do about it" or "they're playing super predictable but i still can't beat it" to just being able to cover their options more and more frequently.
Finally, a video that highlights what's important in this game. My girlfriend wanted to learn Melee and she stumbled across this channel, but this channel has always been more for people who are, at the very least, aware of the competitive scene. She was so convinced that she needed to master short hopping, when she didn't even know how to properly recover. I know it might seem silly, but I really think there ought to be more videos going over what might seem to be more trivial topics. Sure, there are other channels out there, but the delivery of information on this channel is very polished.
I just played my first game of Melee today at my school's Super Smash Brothers club. I got bodied - but my goal was to take at least 1 stock of my opponent. I finally did around 200% :P then I got his next stock to around 60%. It was really fun to try out the game for the first time.
Great video Kira, honestly playing melee for almost 1 year and it's kind of insane how it went from me not even being able to short hop with fox to now consistently waveshining. Glad that I had ssbm tutorials to help me learn pretty much everything from Smash DI to moonwalking to even ledge options. My goal this year is to attend tournaments and hopefully get to a level that I feel I can play decent at a major. Anyway thank you Kira and everyone who watches ssbm tutorials looking forward to this year
I've been playing for about 5 years and I still can't figure out how to analyze my opponent in a match. The game plays at such a high speed that all I can really do is play on instinct.
I'm not an expert nor have I been playing that long (maybe a year by now) but I can say that the thing about analyzing your opponent is relatively difficult to explain. Essentially what you want to do is constantly pay attention to every detail about your opponent to avoid going into an autopilot state where your just playing without thinking. This is essentially it, just focus on them and think what they might do and there habits. Hope I helped you ^_^
You can think about it in between matches. Why did I get grabbed so many times? Why aren't my setups working? Why couldn't I return to the stage? If the game is too fast paced to adapt on the fly, its always useful to start with analysing your opponent in between matches first
+Lloyf Irvind (Loyf) also have an idea of what to do in a match before it starts. Like Falco vs falcon you want to shoot a lot of lasers and put falcon in shield.
+Lloyf Irvind (Loyf) I've learned the best way for me to figure out my opponent's habits is to break up the match into chunks. Looking at the whole match makes it overwhelming. For example, considering you've played the game for so long, you know the opponent's options in a given recovery situation. Which option does he choose? Does he choose it again? What's he doing differently? Having the prior knowledge and experience to know the possible answers to these questions then answering them while you play helps soooo much to adapt. Another chunk of a match might be the neutral game. More specifically, how does your opponent respond to a move you make in the neutral? Again, your experience should help you narrow down your opponent's options and dissect their play style. tl;dr: Play the game a lot and break down the match into chunks.
Still impressive. Was this a local tournament? How many times have you played tournaments prior to then? I'm asking because I have yet to do one myself, and am curious about your relative skill level.
Thanks for the tutorials, Kira. My Samus has much improved in one year just from knowing my options, knowing my opponents, and knowing the game in general. I owe that partly to you and your videos. I look forward to seeing another video featuring Hugs (or maybe even Plup). Happy New Year, and may the Smash be with you!
We are as appreciative for you as you are for us, not only making us better players but helping the less skilled players learn to adapt to their situation with different combos and scenarios keep at it and your fan base will go larger and larger with all the love you show us!!!
I always compare smash, or even fighting games as a whole, as a game of chess, its about being a few steps ahead, while thinking about how will the other person react if I do choice A instead of choice B, and its about learning a person, and how to mold yourself in the spur of the moment or how to counter another person's tactics. The chess grand master is always being decided because people adapt to each other and make predictions on past experiences. they are thinking if I open with a Hungarian pursuit, how will he open? or if I open with a pawn to E4, will they mirror me? if so, how will I counter act this? and it mostly the same idea with almost every top chess player, and that mindset can be applied to smash as in the video. For another example, I'm on the chess team and on a underground smash "team" , more like a group, for my school, and the ideas intertwine, so I learned how to quickly gain some skill in smash when I was a preteen from my days of chess when I was a child, (even when I played smash as a child).My friends and I are always playing matches, figuring stuff about each other. we would see that someone would have a habit of air dodging or that one person loves pivot grabs, or that some one will always open with a laser or a full on dash grab, or that I would recover low almost always. Smash is Chess people It proves that to many people who think fighting games are "mindless" and that story narratives are the only truly "mindful" games that fighting games are probably more mentally intensive then some realize.
Single handedly one of the best videos on TH-cam as far as explaining something goes for. Good examples followed up with intelligent opinions. Super good job Kira and SSBM tutorial team!!
Most people on FG either suck or just want to troll people. I get so annoyed whenever I see someone move from one end of the stage to another using rolls only. Whenever I encounter someone who's actually good at the game I stay with them as long as I can, unless they're a dick.
Eli M I always stay unless I have to leave. I'm finding people who are actually good and can beat me, but I usually adapt and win, but when I can't win it's probably because the bad players are the majority and it's hard to learn when all you find are for For Glorists (what I call for Glory skrubs).
+Tao Blade yeah i usually stay in a match too unless they're dicks. there was a guy who played who beat me every time (im honestly not that good so i usually lose) who was using luigi (against my jigglypuff) who when i missed a rest instead of punishing me he did his down taught. i was at kill percent so i suicided and left
Congratulations. I've wanted to get into Melee competitively for a while now, but I haven't known where to start. I had the game, I had controllers, I had stuff unlocked, but I couldn't figure out how to use that. Thanks to you, I'm entering my first tournament tomorrow. I signed up after I found this channel.
This video is great, excellent work. Could you make some little intro videos on how-to-play popular characters in the future? Like the basic stuff you gotta learn first and what moves are good, etc. I want to get more people at my school into melee, but most people don't know how to get started with it, and when they ask who I should play I just can't answer that question for them, nor get them started on the character they pick because I don't play them.
good shit kira! I complemented you about how much I loved your channel at big house 5 and and you are definitely taking the right steps to grow this channel even further
Thanks for the amazing video. I knew this was key to being a great player, but it was nice to hear it in words. Especially the part about how it's how you can be a top player even if you don't know all the tech behind a character. Getting tech down (especially for Sheik) has been one of the hardest parts for me so I've started practicing solely on adapting and reaction timing before going into hard tech training. Unfortunately, I don't have many people to play against so how I practice is I put a restriction on myself (maybe I can't use shield or roll or f-tilt) and I try to adapt to this new style of play and see if I can adapt in a way to still counter my opponent. While it isn't perfect, it lets me practice flexibility in my play style and that's what I need to work on.
Great video, reminded me of the Spacing and Reading Comprehension videos up on HMW's channel (which are also a must-watch). Although Westballz has improved vastly in his neutral game and reading in the past year, the point that one can be a button pressing extraordinare, yet get outplayed, still stands. After browsing a lot of tutorials telling me to get my tech skill down first and foremost, I would spend more time labbing stuff above my practical needs at the time and draw oohs and aahs while still getting three stocked by my buddies. Now I'm trying to teach myself to slow down, focus on my opponent, and read habits. Reading the opponent is the best skill to pick up, period.
+LukeMM95 Sounds like your problem there man. If there's a facebook group or something for your local scene you could try organizing meetups? Or download Anther's ladder or something
Intu I check the facebook groups all the time but the Smash scene in my home town is completely dead and the nearest tournaments I go to require me to catch the train. I would try playing netplay but my laptop lags.
+LukeMM95 of course it helps. assuming you get past round 1 and 2, you're going to be meeting the same people higher in bracket every time at that tourney. you're going to need to analyze them
The year is 20AA. Everyone takes adderall and plays perfectly. As a result, the first to take Adderall wins. The meta is now based on who gets in line at the pharmacy first.
Being good at competitive video games comes down to playing the game a lot and understanding every aspect/option in the game. This is a really good video because it really is a game of habits. I was expecting a simple "practice" as the answer, but I am glad he broke it down a tad more into basically there is no one true answer. Top players understand the game to the point of knowing every option their opponent can do at that instance, and just figuring out which one will they do, which comes from years of experience.
+Syntax It's true, though. As much respect that I have for Westballz, which I really do; PPMD and Mang0 have a better gamesense. Westballz is one of my favorite smashers of all time (falco mains unite!), he has superior techskill to almost any other player, but he still gets beat. That, because of what this video just discussed.
+XXXawzome minekraft bleze it erryday XXX I agree, nba player can be the best at the dunk contest but it's all about that basketball IQ. I'd rather be D-Wade than Vince Carter lol
just try your best to stay calm and focused on the match. think about what your opponent will do next or where they will go next, not anything else outside of the game
great job guys, these videos got me into playing marth and check my options and combos better as a luigi and peach player. Continue to inspire and assist the melee community
Great video. Adapting is definitely a huge part of all of the Smash games, and it is hard to explain to some people. I definitely will show this video to some people I know haha.
This was an awesome video man! I've always been playing smash since I was little, but now I want to get really good and actually learn the tech and such. I've been competitively speedrunning F-Zero GX for a few years now and I want to get to a similar level I am on that game with smash. I really look forward to watching more of your videos man!
Yeah I can see the opponents patterns i just don't have enough knowledge of a character to know what the right thing to do is to react to their patterns. Guess I've gotta practice more lol
What a great way to explain all that! yes, it is always a trade of habits, so the best habit is no habit. I also love how in top level play the wrong option can become the right one. This video helps why I play as Ness too, his pk thunder II allows for so many options such as throwing out a pk thunder and putting it into the ground, after bringing it to them or hitting them with it every time before that. Read the air-dodge or sheild and punish :) Shared thanks man I'm happy to have subbed.
That is exactly hat I have been telling myself lately, to adapt more and to think more about how to beat my opponnent. A lot of people at tournaments have told me that I have the tech skill to be good but I just don't take the good decisions. I'm still working on that tho :). Good video man, keep it up :)
tbh this is one key to being better at any fighting game it all comes down (and this for any subject) to having good basics and knowledge to apply and get better through gaining experience and expertise at it eventually gaining skill
Something to add to this is the concept of thinking and being active in your play; not automatic. If you think and analyze the opponent while playing you notice this stuff much more easily and can adapt to this and read what they will do and punish. For exampl, if Im marth and I mindlessly dtilt fox on a ledge and he always ledge jumps after the whiff, I probably wont notice this. But if I stop and think about my actions I can punish with a wait to fmash. In fact Im pretty sure Marth in general requires you to always think about what and why you are doing something, moreso then other characters.
I think another concept is training your eyes to look for something and paying very close attention to your opponent, which can only be achieved when you're inputs are second nature so you can use all of your "mental energy" on rationalizing and internalizing your opponent's decisions, your options in certain scenarios, etc
the best way to getting better at smash (besides melee and smash 64) is by saving replays of your matches constantly, especially the ones you lose and look at all the things you do. Now base on those things you do, you can think of other ways that situation could have gone out and try implementing them in your future matches.
man, i cant wait to add this to my playstyle and finally be able to improve, maybe even win some tournaments!
*plays the exact same*
dis nigguh spits da truth
Happens every time I watch smash videos.
Except Hbox. I always play a better Puff after seeing his movement. But Puff has a pretty low tech skill requirement.
Pounce Baratheon It's true that puff has a lower tech skill floor than other characters. But, I feel that many people think tech skill and skill are the same in this game. I think puff is one of the hardest characters to play of the top 6-8. Maybe even the hardest, considering the current meta. Tech skill simply means input frequency required to play the character. So in that sense, of the top 8, the order is probably something like:
Fox
Falco
C. Falcon
Marth
Sheik/Peach
Sheik/Peach
Ice Climbers
Puff
But actual skill includes things like spacing and option select; overall application of tech. When this is considered I think Puff spikes to be one of the most difficult characters to use at top level due to how early she can die. Spacing in particular is most important for puff as she completely relies on it. This list is much more debatable but at top level (where its basically implied that tech skill is not much of an issue for the players anymore) I think the list of difficulty in succeeding with a character is something like:
Puff
Peach
C. Falcon
Marth/Falco
Marth/Falco
Ice Climbers
Fox
Sheik
Again super debatable and tbh i even question this list because its so hard to really know. But
tldr; puff is tough to play. I hope you dont think tech skill directly relates to actual skill (btw I main Falco and Peach so no bias here)
Urameshi Sama I don't use much tech.That's why I learn more from watching Hbox. I'll never have Westballz' hand speed or Mango's reaction time. But I can almost mimic what Hbox does with the constant floating left and right to stay the right distance from a player and bair/fair when they get too close, or maintain an off stage puff combo or gimp.
I'm still better with marth, though. But many weak players like me are best with marth/shiek.
Pounce Baratheon
tldr at the end
Unless low level means low enough that spam f smash works well, Marth isn't actually that easy to play at low level. He's definitely on the easier side of the spectrum but in my oppinion Ice Climbers, sheik and to a lesser degree peach can destroy at low to mid level with not very much effort compared to the rest of top 8. Marth is really good at any level but i feel that the reason there are so many marth mains is mostly because of how they displayed M2K in the documentary. Marth is probably 4th easiest at low level. The spacies don't really start to show how amazing they are until around mid level due to tech flubs. Jiggs and C. Falcon are always tough in my oppinion.
I think its sorta like this (from easiest to hardest to succeed with and no, tech skill does not mean harder or easier for any pleb whom thinks so) also my previous list was depicting overall difficulty through all levels these are different because they are now split up:
Low Level
Sheik, IC's. Peach, Marth,Falco, Fox, C. Falcon, Jiggs
Mid Level
IC's, Sheik, Falco, Marth. Fox, Peach, Jiggs, C. Falcon
High Level
Fox, Sheik, Marth, Falco, C. Falcon, Peach, Jiggs, IC's
It's a very rough list and its really hard to make it accurate at high level because the player's ability is much more of a deciding factor than the character they play but looking at the cast from an effort:results ratio perspective, I think this is not far from the truth. And for the idiots out there, I am aware that Armada plays Peach but he wins because of how good he is not because peach is good. Peach is actually ridiculously hard to use well at top level for a number of reasons. A lot of the things that make her succeed in the levels of play below top level become almost completely obsolete. It's one of the things that makes Armada look extra amazing. At mid level and high level Falco and Marth are basically even in my oppinion. I think falco is a little easier in mid generally because people, mostly, either arent fully comfortable with power-shielding laser or they arent really good at DI to get out of Falco combos.
At Top level, Marth becomes seriously rewarding if you can make it to top level with him but gets notably tougher to use due to the consistency requirement. And falco becomes MUCH tougher to use properly which i think some people are starting to realize now due to their being only 2 notable falco mains (and one whom hasnt been at top level ability for a long time... rip), Falco also has very little movement ability compared to the rest of top 8 which becomes very apparent at high level play. I personally think that Marth is easily 2nd best character in the game and COULD potentially join Fox in their own tier, though fox is still the best character. And sheik overall gets away with the most bullshit on average, by far, of any character throughout all levels of play. It's tough to say for sure but this is what I think.
And I swear to god if I hear how the Ice Climbers wobble so they cant be hardest to play at top level well just know how wrong you are because wobbling is so hard to pull off at top level that the IC's become easily the least likely (if not basically impossible) to win a major with.
tldr; marth is not easy at any level imo but also not the hardest. And sheik privilege is rampant at low - mid level and it needs to be addressed. There are cool sheik mains below top level but 90% of sheiks are braindead cheesers at low-mid
This is 100% correct and super well-explained.
Awesome job.
Hi Omni
+Omni Unlike you
+Timothy S. That literally does not make grammatical sense with respect to Omni's sentence. Do you mean to say,"It's 100% correct, unlike you"? I suspect you're missing the irony.
+Omni It's pronounced "correct"
+Omni Thank you Omni!
1. Roll as often as possibly
2. Use smash attacks almost exclusively: they do the most damage
3. Don't grab, most grabs only like 8% damage and push the opponent away, you want them super close always, especially with Marth
4. Projectile also suck and are weak
This was me I'm 2015 other than the rolling
*in
how a braindead plays
Grabs are actually very useful in certain situations. For example: Marths grab-and-throw-upwards works great for sending the opponent into the air if the opponent's HP % is above 60. Grab throws send your opponent further the more damage they take, like any other attack in the game.
The only thing that doesn't fit is 4. lol
Thanks for making the Melee community not suck.
+lacoot
lmao beautiful way of saying it, my friend
+lacoot Tr4sh community is worse. FUckBOY
< imply that all melee players are the same
< implying that 'imply' implies the same implications as 'implying'
+blooflazh7 stop making the smash community go to hell. every game in the series is great
Finally a video that actually explains this type of psychological depth behind Smash. Thank you!
I've always tried explaining this concept of adaptation and mindgames to people; for example, my mum because she absolutely hates the hell out of Smash and thinks that the game is just about mindless button mashing and nothing more ugh
+H A Z Y Did...did she ever play it? and beat you? I'm sure that will show her SOMETHING?!
lol my brother in law saw me playing this the other day and was said this looks lame cuz there is no stategey. I told him you have wow no idea
+H A Z Y Yeah but implementing the psychology is excruciatingly hard. I've been playing for over a year and my only improvement is my reflexes. I can do stuff, like...faster so I can make combos, but that's about all. I come from StarCraft, so the psychology isn't new, but I wasn't good at StarCraft, so implementing still is.
+H A Z Y Some people get it, some people don't. Generally males are far more likely to grasp the concept of adaptation and mind games in video games than females, so I would not blame your mom.
***** It would make a lot more sense if his mom were a pro...
10 Ways To Be Good At Melee! (You Won't Believe #6!)
lmao
Pro players *hate* him!
Number 3 will make you shoot your father in disbelief!
This is amazing
@@jsg5612 hahahahaha
This is a brilliant video.
You should start doing basic matchup guides.
Yes please
+Andrew Wager NO, please don't that's a little bit ridiculous. Do the research yourselves people... there's a place called smash boards where matchups have been hammered out for like 10 years now, plus there's something called playing the game. For Kira to try and TEACH you the matchup... that's just silly
+sketch nin you cant teach a matchup in a short video. But it could go well in his new quick tips series. For example, he could have a video on marth vs falco and say something like dash dancing makes it easier to powershield the lasers. Researching the basic matchup on your own should be encouraged but maybe Kira could just give more high level tips?
+PurpleDolphin Honestly it's just so easy to find matchup information that making videos about it would be a waste of time.
PurpleDolphin I guess I agree with you on that... little unusual tips (like the short little marth techchase down smash o shiek vid) would be nice
major key to success, bless up
they dont want you to win, vibe wit me
+Choice Scarf Ebola, sweeping the nation LION
+Choice Scarf Ebola, sweeping the nation Eliptical talk come soon
I guess we need you to make the "How to be GOOD at ORAS OU series", because god knows blunder isn't cutting it
didnt you see his spl game vs tesung, scarf rachi = major key to success in oras ou
I actually just recently delved a lot deeper into this games decision making, while still polishing my tech skill and I've improved so much. It's like I'm just starting to see the game in slow motion and I can react to things I never was able to before. I also catch on to the little nuances of what works and what doesn't which makes it easier to read my opponent. This video really hits the nail on the head.
Alright alright where did you start? i’ve been playing melee for a little while now and i feel like this barrier, something that i’m just not understanding and i would really like to change that. so how did you get to this point? what kind of mindset did you have? how long did it take? and how exactly did you accomplish this?
Honestly I mostly grinded tech skill like crazy. The more tools you have and the faster you are at executing them, the slower the game becomes and the more the decisions and micro-situations become apparent. I just beat up computers over and over again, taking note of what followups work and what doesn't, and I stuck to using only one character (Falco). For me it was when I asked myself, if I d-air my opponent's shield, but land behind them, what's the next best thing I can do? Maybe short hop b-air, maybe wavedash back and shine, maybe turn around and grab. Just find those situations you have trouble with and try to simulate it and try options to see which works the most often. If you can get the 20XX tournament edition, you can turn on random DI (aerial DI and tech rolls) so the computers are really unpredictable. I found that was the easiest way to train my reaction time. Combine grinding tech skill with knowledge of follow ups + good reaction times = you'll be decent at Melee and it all snowballs from there. Once I did that my results VS other humans skyrocketed and I could actually stand a chance.
That was my experience so far. Hope it helps!
You have put to words what most people can't even come close to.
+Shadoninja Adapt is only 1 word buddy!
+Alienrun Go tell a player to "adapt" and tell me what he says, buddy!
Shadoninja If he doesn't get it, I'll just keep reapeating "adapt" until he adapts to what I'm saying and gets it!
+Alienrun Thought so.
Shadoninja In all seriousness explaining things can go a looong way! I played 18+ hours with some 2 "casual" friends...and near the end of it, they were catching on. 1 person was dabbling a bit with spacing, while the other seemed to learn the basics of sheilding and grabbing...*sigh* I should probably mention I did very little to explain anything to them, rather, I was more suprised they wanted to play for 18+ hours to begin with! :O
I want that nerf, buff, patch, adapt shirt
+Antony Di Placido Its from BrokenTier
+Antony Di Placido IKR
+Antony Di Placido I wan't that KH shirt.
+Antony Di Placido Me too
UuuUugly
I am no smash professional by any means, but in my years of experience I found that to be good at this game you need to be decent at these things.
1.) Game knowledge, know the stages, characters, match ups, tech skills, and understand how they can help you in matches.
2.) Tech Chase, following up attacks and punishing predictable recoveries and rolls.
3.) Move fast, be comfortable with your character, stay loose, and be prepared to punish bad reads and attacks.
4.) DON'T BE PREDICTABLE! Good smash opponents pick up bad habits very easily and will punish you hard. Mix ups with approches, attacks and DI is your best bet.
5.) Relax, opponents can tell if your nervous and will take advantage of that fact, make sure to have fun, it is a game after all.
lame ass, east coast oppinion
I agree with all of that B1ue Hawk!
Thank you. You're Cool 😎😎😎👍👍
I can't seem to figure out number 5. Lol
" tech skills"
borp: ima pretend i didnt see that
To anyone who would say "how could anyone think that fast," or "fox moves for me to adapt that fast," I would respond don't worry. Once you have seen a situation once, and have thought about how to cover it, even if it is outside of the match or in friendlies, you will naturally develop a series of options that work for you to cover different scenarios. This video isn't so much about training yourself to make split second reactions and adaptations mid match, its about developing a conscious awareness that a series of options exists that cover what you opponent is doing such that you can learn what those options yourself over time.
well done kira you are improving the video quality with every single one you are uploading! Congrats you are awesome!
This video is one of greatest things to ever come from the FGC. It elegantly sums up fighting games, and even competition as a whole, with sage-like precision and attention to detail. It's simple enough for a new player to grasp, yet deep enough to teach a vet like me something new. To quote Portal, "This was a triumph. I'm making a note here: HUGE SUCCESS. It's hard to overstate my satisfaction."
This is EXACTLY the channel I was looking for. Thank you so much for existing
ive actually just started to grasp this concept. like i always sorta knew that adaptation existed, but i would always think "how am i supposed to focus hard enough to be collecting data and adapting the entire match?"
but once you develop better fundamentals, learning more and more ways to deal with your opponents' options, you realize you were always collecting data, it just turns into "its so annoying that you keep doing this and i dont know what to do about it" or "they're playing super predictable but i still can't beat it" to just being able to cover their options more and more frequently.
Finally, a video that highlights what's important in this game. My girlfriend wanted to learn Melee and she stumbled across this channel, but this channel has always been more for people who are, at the very least, aware of the competitive scene. She was so convinced that she needed to master short hopping, when she didn't even know how to properly recover. I know it might seem silly, but I really think there ought to be more videos going over what might seem to be more trivial topics. Sure, there are other channels out there, but the delivery of information on this channel is very polished.
are you still dating
I just played my first game of Melee today at my school's Super Smash Brothers club. I got bodied - but my goal was to take at least 1 stock of my opponent. I finally did around 200% :P then I got his next stock to around 60%. It was really fun to try out the game for the first time.
Cjdubs !?!?!?!!?!!!!????!!!!!
Great video Kira, honestly playing melee for almost 1 year and it's kind of insane how it went from me not even being able to short hop with fox to now consistently waveshining. Glad that I had ssbm tutorials to help me learn pretty much everything from Smash DI to moonwalking to even ledge options. My goal this year is to attend tournaments and hopefully get to a level that I feel I can play decent at a major. Anyway thank you Kira and everyone who watches ssbm tutorials looking forward to this year
I've been playing for about 5 years and I still can't figure out how to analyze my opponent in a match. The game plays at such a high speed that all I can really do is play on instinct.
I'm not an expert nor have I been playing that long (maybe a year by now) but I can say that the thing about analyzing your opponent is relatively difficult to explain. Essentially what you want to do is constantly pay attention to every detail about your opponent to avoid going into an autopilot state where your just playing without thinking. This is essentially it, just focus on them and think what they might do and there habits. Hope I helped you ^_^
You can think about it in between matches. Why did I get grabbed so many times? Why aren't my setups working? Why couldn't I return to the stage? If the game is too fast paced to adapt on the fly, its always useful to start with analysing your opponent in between matches first
Char 11 thanks for the responses guys. I'll try what you said (happy face)
+Lloyf Irvind (Loyf) also have an idea of what to do in a match before it starts. Like Falco vs falcon you want to shoot a lot of lasers and put falcon in shield.
+Lloyf Irvind (Loyf) I've learned the best way for me to figure out my opponent's habits is to break up the match into chunks. Looking at the whole match makes it overwhelming.
For example, considering you've played the game for so long, you know the opponent's options in a given recovery situation. Which option does he choose? Does he choose it again? What's he doing differently? Having the prior knowledge and experience to know the possible answers to these questions then answering them while you play helps soooo much to adapt.
Another chunk of a match might be the neutral game. More specifically, how does your opponent respond to a move you make in the neutral? Again, your experience should help you narrow down your opponent's options and dissect their play style.
tl;dr: Play the game a lot and break down the match into chunks.
Simply fantastic. You are such a positive force for Melee, Kira.
Holy fuck i never looked at the views of these videos, and they have skyrocketed since way back when it first started, congrats.
its been a year and this video still makes me smile watching how you break down the adaptation to melee.
As a falco main i approve.
I lost to a Marth in winners, i asked for tips and he sent me this video. I beat him in the loser's finals runback.
Did you win in grand finals?
Christopher Ziko Nope, I got 2nd place.
Still impressive. Was this a local tournament? How many times have you played tournaments prior to then? I'm asking because I have yet to do one myself, and am curious about your relative skill level.
It was an online tournament, and it was my 3rd.
What netplay tournament was it? link the bracket?
What a great year! I hope this channel continues to grow even more into 2016 along with the smash scene.
That's why Mango can beat S2J in Falcon Dittos
Thanks for the tutorials, Kira. My Samus has much improved in one year just from knowing my options, knowing my opponents, and knowing the game in general. I owe that partly to you and your videos. I look forward to seeing another video featuring Hugs (or maybe even Plup). Happy New Year, and may the Smash be with you!
That sudden realization that you'll never git gud
Bull. Shit. Keep practicing.
The fact this is coming from ash. ehhhhhhhhh
We are as appreciative for you as you are for us, not only making us better players but helping the less skilled players learn to adapt to their situation with different combos and scenarios keep at it and your fan base will go larger and larger with all the love you show us!!!
dang dave this is so important. gj putting it into words. it took me like 3 years to figure this out LOL
Absolutely perfect. Adaptation is key, and knowing how to adapt and analyze your opponents play comes with experience.
I always compare smash, or even fighting games as a whole, as a game of chess, its about being a few steps ahead, while thinking about how will the other person react if I do choice A instead of choice B, and its about learning a person, and how to mold yourself in the spur of the moment or how to counter another person's tactics.
The chess grand master is always being decided because people adapt to each other and make predictions on past experiences. they are thinking if I open with a Hungarian pursuit, how will he open? or if I open with a pawn to E4, will they mirror me? if so, how will I counter act this? and it mostly the same idea with almost every top chess player, and that mindset can be applied to smash as in the video.
For another example, I'm on the chess team and on a underground smash "team" , more like a group, for my school, and the ideas intertwine, so I learned how to quickly gain some skill in smash when I was a preteen from my days of chess when I was a child, (even when I played smash as a child).My friends and I are always playing matches, figuring stuff about each other. we would see that someone would have a habit of air dodging or that one person loves pivot grabs, or that some one will always open with a laser or a full on dash grab, or that I would recover low almost always. Smash is Chess people
It proves that to many people who think fighting games are "mindless" and that story narratives are the only truly "mindful" games that fighting games are probably more mentally intensive then some realize.
Single handedly one of the best videos on TH-cam as far as explaining something goes for. Good examples followed up with intelligent opinions.
Super good job Kira and SSBM tutorial team!!
This is what i love with super smash bros
it becomes a mind game
read his read
Congrats on the 1year! You already know but we love the content!
Whenever I adapt on for Glory, the player quits.
Most people on FG either suck or just want to troll people. I get so annoyed whenever I see someone move from one end of the stage to another using rolls only. Whenever I encounter someone who's actually good at the game I stay with them as long as I can, unless they're a dick.
Eli M I always stay unless I have to leave. I'm finding people who are actually good and can beat me, but I usually adapt and win, but when I can't win it's probably because the bad players are the majority and it's hard to learn when all you find are for For Glorists (what I call for Glory skrubs).
WOW, I ADMIRE YOUR SKILLLL
Top Boss How do you know my skill just from me saying I'm good? If you want to know my skill I made a Marth (my main) highlight video.
+Tao Blade yeah i usually stay in a match too unless they're dicks. there was a guy who played who beat me every time (im honestly not that good so i usually lose) who was using luigi (against my jigglypuff) who when i missed a rest instead of punishing me he did his down taught. i was at kill percent so i suicided and left
This is great. Shared it with my friends already. Fundamental videos like this are so basic on the surface but deep down see so complex.
Learning to adapt is so hard. It sounds easy but when you actually play it's so hard
Sponge Bob: Clear my mind?
Learn all of the opponents moves, then calculate a counterattack for it
doesn't even sound easy i really dont get how this video would be helpful
The key to victory lies within.
This is actually accurate, now combine that with tech skill and you are done.
Also 6:04 LMAO
Thank you Kira. Your videos have done so much to help me get better at this game.
Title of video: "How to be good at Smash Bros"
Video length: 7.5 minutes
Hmmm...
+Pizza Shark And it's worth watching every second of it
You're too lazy to accept 7 minutes of advice?
+Seank7 Considering that I already knew all this...he's got a point. I delayed to watch the video as well.
+Seank7 I think the point of this person's comment was that smash has a lot of depth that it would be hard to "be good at smash" under 7.5 minutes
Josie Spanish It's heartening to see even one person with the mental faculties to grasp such a simple observation. Go ahead and buy yourself a cookie.
Congratulations. I've wanted to get into Melee competitively for a while now, but I haven't known where to start. I had the game, I had controllers, I had stuff unlocked, but I couldn't figure out how to use that. Thanks to you, I'm entering my first tournament tomorrow. I signed up after I found this channel.
Finally, a video for me
This video is great, excellent work.
Could you make some little intro videos on how-to-play popular characters in the future? Like the basic stuff you gotta learn first and what moves are good, etc. I want to get more people at my school into melee, but most people don't know how to get started with it, and when they ask who I should play I just can't answer that question for them, nor get them started on the character they pick because I don't play them.
I’m still bad :(
true
good shit kira! I complemented you about how much I loved your channel at big house 5 and and you are definitely taking the right steps to grow this channel even further
+jonnycastaway thank you man =) I was sad at BH5 because of my performance and being hungover (lol) but I'm glad you enjoyed it
& then Luigi that breaks everything
NEUTRAL AIR
Anyone vs Luigi: Just wait and expect a nair. Then punish accordingly.
+Arc ana it's so fast you can barely punish
Congrats for this video.
That's awesome.
Ok, but how can I adapt?
think about what they're doing, then think about what u can do to beat that, then practice executing it
SSBM Tutorials This was meant to be a joke, I didn't expect you to reply, still, thanks
SSBM Tutorials so you need to counter an attack with another attack that can beat it
Be good
Kira, your videos are always so helpful and your videos' quality is constantly improving! I'm looking forward to more videos from you :>
Kira is DJ Khaled
Thanks for the amazing video. I knew this was key to being a great player, but it was nice to hear it in words. Especially the part about how it's how you can be a top player even if you don't know all the tech behind a character. Getting tech down (especially for Sheik) has been one of the hardest parts for me so I've started practicing solely on adapting and reaction timing before going into hard tech training.
Unfortunately, I don't have many people to play against so how I practice is I put a restriction on myself (maybe I can't use shield or roll or f-tilt) and I try to adapt to this new style of play and see if I can adapt in a way to still counter my opponent. While it isn't perfect, it lets me practice flexibility in my play style and that's what I need to work on.
Hey ssbm tutorials I play good when I'm training and practicing but when I play against someone I'm nervous and mess up a lot please help
thats normal you will pretty much always play worse unless you know 100% everything your opponent will do
The more you play against real people, the less nervous you will be
Great video, reminded me of the Spacing and Reading Comprehension videos up on HMW's channel (which are also a must-watch). Although Westballz has improved vastly in his neutral game and reading in the past year, the point that one can be a button pressing extraordinare, yet get outplayed, still stands. After browsing a lot of tutorials telling me to get my tech skill down first and foremost, I would spend more time labbing stuff above my practical needs at the time and draw oohs and aahs while still getting three stocked by my buddies. Now I'm trying to teach myself to slow down, focus on my opponent, and read habits. Reading the opponent is the best skill to pick up, period.
I kind of already knew this but it doesn't help if you have no one to play against outside of tournaments.
+LukeMM95 Sounds like your problem there man. If there's a facebook group or something for your local scene you could try organizing meetups? Or download Anther's ladder or something
Intu I check the facebook groups all the time but the Smash scene in my home town is completely dead and the nearest tournaments I go to require me to catch the train. I would try playing netplay but my laptop lags.
That is fairly grim dude.I hope you find some way to get more melee in your life somehow. A life without smash would be rubbish
+LukeMM95 of course it helps. assuming you get past round 1 and 2, you're going to be meeting the same people higher in bracket every time at that tourney. you're going to need to analyze them
spend 15$ on an adaptor and get on anthers ladder, best thing any beginning player can do short of regularly attending tourneys and meetups
This was awesome, and thank you so much for the wonderful video! Keep it up Bro!
Adderal isn't they key?
The year is 20AA. Everyone takes adderall and plays perfectly. As a result, the first to take Adderall wins. The meta is now based on who gets in line at the pharmacy first.
+PurpleDolphin this made our entire carpool laugh out loud
SSBM Tutorials :D
Being good at competitive video games comes down to playing the game a lot and understanding every aspect/option in the game. This is a really good video because it really is a game of habits. I was expecting a simple "practice" as the answer, but I am glad he broke it down a tad more into basically there is no one true answer. Top players understand the game to the point of knowing every option their opponent can do at that instance, and just figuring out which one will they do, which comes from years of experience.
Great. Fucking. Video.
You guys killed it, this is fantastic!
"mango and ppmd are better falco players than westballz"
W0W
it's true.
+Syntax
It's true, though.
As much respect that I have for Westballz, which I really do; PPMD and Mang0 have a better gamesense. Westballz is one of my favorite smashers of all time (falco mains unite!), he has superior techskill to almost any other player, but he still gets beat. That, because of what this video just discussed.
+XXXawzome minekraft bleze it erryday XXX I agree, nba player can be the best at the dunk contest but it's all about that basketball IQ. I'd rather be D-Wade than Vince Carter lol
lmao, what does that make leffen then
+XXXawzome minekraft bleze it erryday XXX Say that to the 3-0 Mango was given last tournament in falco dittos against West
Woooooooow, I never thought melee videos could apply to smash 4 but I really enjoyed this video. Grest job guys!
Simple. Don't get hit.
Congratulations on making so many subscribers in just one year :) I really like the way you make your videos
It's nice that your not those melee fans who trash on smash 4 thank you
2:17
Best shirt design ever! I need to make this so I can wear it at every Smash Wii U tournament. Especially after the patch release
Tutorial on how not to get in your own head?
just try your best to stay calm and focused on the match. think about what your opponent will do next or where they will go next, not anything else outside of the game
+SSBM Tutorials thank you, you're tutorials, eclectically this one, have really helped me become a better player
Kira, at 0:41 are you the guy on the left or the right?
im on the left
Also, Kira, what do you mean at 2:29 by "despite, what 20XX tells you?"
This will be the pivotal video that will break any beginner mental block. Send some more views this way guys. It deserves it
I have a tip for everyone to be great at smash brothers... get ready for some shocking truth.
play.
Best advice ever 10/10
this video helped me a fuckton
went from always going 0-6 in pools to making it out rather consistently
i always wonder why they play Melee on CRT tv's
+TheNintendochannel64 LCDs lag for gamecube games.
+SSBM Tutorials thanks, so is better play Melee in a old sony triniton from 1997 than my samsung LED
yes
+SSBM Tutorials ok, thanks again for the advice
Would it lag if you played the GameCube game using a wii?
great job guys, these videos got me into playing marth and check my options and combos better as a luigi and peach player. Continue to inspire and assist the melee community
1. Don't be a noob.
Welp! You're not wrong!
Congrats on the one year!
how to git gud
Very intelligent video with great sources and explanation! Keep up the great work!
Be swedish :)
this was amazing, fantastic work man
In summary: don't be predictable, adaptability is key
The video examples are very helpful to watch and explain it well
0:20 or 1:15
This is a great channel, looking forward to another year of learning
Really good advices! I like how you compared ssbm with a puzzle game :)
I actually really needed to hear this. Thank you.
Great video. Adapting is definitely a huge part of all of the Smash games, and it is hard to explain to some people. I definitely will show this video to some people I know haha.
Interesting to see this video be effectively recalled with the latest vid. Buttons are good for better or worse.
I can't wait to start implementing this in my play. Thanks for the explanation.
This was an awesome video man! I've always been playing smash since I was little, but now I want to get really good and actually learn the tech and such. I've been competitively speedrunning F-Zero GX for a few years now and I want to get to a similar level I am on that game with smash. I really look forward to watching more of your videos man!
Yeah I can see the opponents patterns i just don't have enough knowledge of a character to know what the right thing to do is to react to their patterns.
Guess I've gotta practice more lol
What a great way to explain all that! yes, it is always a trade of habits, so the best habit is no habit. I also love how in top level play the wrong option can become the right one. This video helps why I play as Ness too, his pk thunder II allows for so many options such as throwing out a pk thunder and putting it into the ground, after bringing it to them or hitting them with it every time before that. Read the air-dodge or sheild and punish :) Shared thanks man I'm happy to have subbed.
That is exactly hat I have been telling myself lately, to adapt more and to think more about how to beat my opponnent. A lot of people at tournaments have told me that I have the tech skill to be good but I just don't take the good decisions. I'm still working on that tho :). Good video man, keep it up :)
Single best piece of advice ever given for smash.
i started learning melee a few days ago. thank you so much for the tutorial vids lol
Thank you SO MUCH. This video really helped!!
tbh this is one key to being better at any fighting game it all comes down (and this for any subject) to having good basics and knowledge to apply and get better through gaining experience and expertise at it eventually gaining skill
Something to add to this is the concept of thinking and being active in your play; not automatic. If you think and analyze the opponent while playing you notice this stuff much more easily and can adapt to this and read what they will do and punish. For exampl, if Im marth and I mindlessly dtilt fox on a ledge and he always ledge jumps after the whiff, I probably wont notice this. But if I stop and think about my actions I can punish with a wait to fmash. In fact Im pretty sure Marth in general requires you to always think about what and why you are doing something, moreso then other characters.
I feel like you can apply this to any fighting game in general TBH.
I think another concept is training your eyes to look for something and paying very close attention to your opponent, which can only be achieved when you're inputs are second nature so you can use all of your "mental energy" on rationalizing and internalizing your opponent's decisions, your options in certain scenarios, etc
Thanks! I've been striving to become good for a while now, you've given me the tools to become better ^-^.
the best way to getting better at smash (besides melee and smash 64) is by saving replays of your matches constantly, especially the ones you lose and look at all the things you do. Now base on those things you do, you can think of other ways that situation could have gone out and try implementing them in your future matches.