Line 6 Helix or Kemper Stage? A LOT has changed in 3 years!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 ก.ค. 2024
- Hi everyone!
Today we're taking a look at two of my favorite digital units and comparing them side by side. The Helix and the Kemper. I think both have come a really long ways and it's amazing how much good firmware can change a unit for the better.
Love the tones you hear on this channel? Check out my presets here: www.tonecraftcreations.com/
You all are awesome and I appreciate all the love and support this channel has received.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Affiliates:
Link - jenningsguitars.com/
Use coupon code "zachbrobst2023" to get a FREE Mono Case with your order.
Here is a link to Lambertones website: lambertones.store/zachbrobst
(discount will be applied automatically at discount but if not, use the coupon code below)
Use Promo Code: ZBROBST for an additional 10% off!
Stringjoy Strings (my favorite strings) - stringjoy.com/partner/brobst/
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
01:41 The Elephant in the Room
06:23 The Original Problem
08:58 It's All in the Effects
10:46 It's All About the Editor
12:42 Which is Easiest to Use?
13:26 Which One Should I Buy? - เพลง
Best comparison I've seen. Showing the best facets of each unit. Concise and informative. Good job man 👏
Thank you so much!
Great video production, editing, sound, lighting. Major props! The Helix sounds like a unit I should look in to more.
Thank you! Definitely worth checking out!
I have had a Helix for 6 years now and it is absolutely amazing. You have to learn about signal chain and pedals, but it gives you so much control. You have to learn how to dial it in like a real signal chain, so there’s a lot of room for user error. But when you nail it, it sounds amazing. It’s so good I use one patch for like 90% of my work.
Excellent video! Bullet points of actually useful info without any filler. Super helpful.
Thank you so much!
Hey Zach, really appreciate your videos on Kemper. I had a "Toaster" before, soon I will be getting a Stage. Thanks, Bob
Thank you sir for demoing these and not noodling the whole time.
Thank YOU for watching!
Great video, thanks!
It should always come down to how cool the backpack is
Agreed
Good video, thanks for putting it out here. Having owned the Helix now for 7 years, it’s time for me to be thinking about what I would buy should it die, which it isn’t showing any signs that it will. As far as “feel” is concerned, I found that many Helix users (me too) build presets without any line level device to determine correct levels. Interestingly, Helix Native (for DAWs) provides the necessary meters, but their hard devices don’t. As such it’s very easy to misbuild presets which send low or clipped signals to the house, FRFR, etc.. a few years ago, when I started building presets using my Mackie mixer channel strip’s peak meter as a guide, I was able to set the amps, cabs, and FXs properly to feed the preset to the mixer at unity gain. Once this is correct, if you want more “feel” then all you have to do is push the volume via the mixer, FRFR, etc (not the Helix). A lot of the dynamics of “feel” to me, is having headroom (fullness) with a strong core tone in the preset.
Oh nice man! That makes a ton of sense. I normally rely on the presets built by others since I can dive too much into a rabbit hole if I build my own!
I use presets from others all the time and I typically have to make slight tweaks in the preset ‘amp’s channel volume’ - for use with my Mackie & QSC monitor and mains. Same concept.
It's fascinating how different each player's ears can be. I'm a Strat-focused, vaguely-John-Mayer-wannabe. Bought a Kemper Stage. Bought some presets from the big names you mentioned. Bought some IRs from York Audio. Could not for the life of me get the Kemper to feel right. Sent it back, picked up a Helix and immediately fell in love with the sound. To each their own, but I had exactly the opposite experience you did. The Kemper always felt very off and the Helix very organic.
That the UI is light years better on the Helix was just an added bonus that makes exploring new sounds easier for me.
I would agree with the UI on the Helix being much better on the Helix!
I really like my Line 6 helix, it sounds great and is fairly easy to use.
I have a Helix floor which i absolutely love, and was considering swapping out for a Tonex with a handfull of pedals (already have the pedals), or maybe a Kemper poweramp hmm what to do? by the way when i say swapping out thats what i tell my wife the Helix will be kept.
I love The Helix since 3.50 and Jason Sadites' guidance.
That means what?
@@SHREDTILLDEADThe 3.50 software update.
Jason Sadites has a TH-cam channel and dials in the Helix sounds
Never have tried a kemper, but sure do love my helix floor
Fantastic video.
Thank you!
IMO The Helix is the only one that keep the all-in-one soul of a Multieffect (and that's why I am a user of the Helix Floor) and vs the other brands, some may have better amps simulations, but that's just a opinion, and not necessarily "better sound" overall. If you know how to work with every modeler/profiler you will have an excellent preset. And with my helix floor, I have everything I want and need
I could not agree more. I feel like this is the exact comment I would have made lol
I just got the Helix floor on Black Friday. First new guitar toy I am just barely starting to get a handle on what this thing is capable of doing.
I had the HX Stomp but sold it as I found myself tweaking the sounds more and creating new tones everytime than actually playing. I've got the Kempe rStage recently and totally get what you mean about the feel. It feels just so much better to play it than the HX Stomp, just like playing am miced up amp. There something to the realism that you just cant get with the Helix. It makes playing my guitar so much more fun.
the line6 orignal amp update was another world, totaly cosmos now.
Hey there guys! Great video! I’ve had 3 times a Line 6 HX Stomp and it is a great unit! However, I recently got a Kemper Stage, and it delivers a sound and quality I never got with my HX Stomps (one of the reasons why sold them 3 times…) The Kemper is pretty simple to use IMO, and there are TONS of awesome presets out there! (MBritt, ToneJunkies, StuG, Worship Tutorials, Choptones, etc) Both units will give you an amazing experience! And it is essential to mention that the Helix LT is a great solution and you can get it for around $600 less than a Kemper and that is crucial if you are on a low budget but you are looking for a great quality!
Been using the Kemper for 5 years now and absolutely love it!
I had a Digitech RP-1 which was awful even then. lol, I was just captivated with the concept which is (imho) at full fruition in my Helix Floor! :)
Agreed! Those old units were terrible sounding but having everything in a floor unit was so cool at the time. Now they actually sound good!
Greta vid @zach brobst. How do you run your inears? How is your chain? I find any modeler/profiler always sounds quite „digital“ compared to the FOH/monitor-sound that’s coming out of a frfr
Hey! I typically will run my Spire Six drivers directly into the unit. They sound pretty great but don't give an entirely flat mix. I like with the Kemper how there is a "room" setting to increase the "in the room" feel of the profile. Not entirely sure if the Helix has something like this
Which one we should buy
If you want the immediate best amp tone: Kemper. For everything else: Helix.
no troll. sold both. use tonex, axefx 3 and headrush mx5
$650 Helix lt. $600 Jtv69. $900 pair of Power cab+. (All used) Can't beat it.
I'm new to this and as a drum tech, interested on learning so much more.
How do people feel about the line 6 pod?
With good IRs the Pod is actually still usable.
if you mean the Pod Go - it's awesome. less options than the Helix but still enough to work with.
I have a helix but tend to use my kemper or fm9 the most. If I had to keep just one I would keep the kemper. I don't care for the helix's integrated pedal. I prefer to have the option of replacing my pedal should it break or I want a different brand.
I want both of them.
That’s what I have! It’s great!
The answer is the Quad cortex 😉. Best of both worlds with great sound and feel! Have owned all three and the QC is far out in front plus it’s tiny.
I'd love to get a QC next!
I have no idea what any of these words mean, but I'm here cause you're cool.
I had the RP700 for a minute.
Im so stuck on the kemper, helix b3c6it comes in purple now and it looks awesome or the Neural dsp Quad Cortex. Thats what im leaning towards but ive seen a lot of people having issues with them breaking but it seems to be the best on the market for amp and cab sounds. So im leaning away from it not.
Great job thanks for your work. They all sound good but Line 6 sounds best to my ears. Question: Have you ever tried the ISP Technologies - Theta Pro DSP guitar effects processor? I have been using guitar effects processors for 17 years. Owned many but my go to for Pure Tone for me since 2018 is the Theta Pro DSP. This unit has a Pre & Post EQ which allows fine tuning to acheive desired tone. My setup is stereo XLR out to FOH, 2 mission engineering pedals (Volume & Wah), Parker Fly Deluxe guitar (rewired front pickup to single coil). I have received many compliments during live gigs being I don't use an amp on stage. ISP - Theta Pro has their signature decimator circuit in this unit as well to transparently eliminate any 60hz hum from a single coil. I play Rock, Pop, Funk, Disco, Ballads, etc in a weekend working band and the Theta Pro covers it all. Very interested in your thoughts on the Theta Pro DSP.
Hey John! I’ve not had the chance to try any of the ISP stuff yet. I’ve heard and seen fantastic things from them and I’m not surprised they are so versatile!
@@ZachBrobstMusic Hi Zach, thanks for the prompt reply. If you ever do please post your thoughts. The Theta Pro DSP doesn't have the variety of each type of effect but enough for any gig. It also has there decimator proprietary circuit that eliminates any 60hz frequency/hum/noise from single pickups. It is truly amazing. There tone is PURE. I run direct stereo to FOH all wireless guitar and in-ears for my own mix. I wish they would upgrage to include Midi control to change presets from an external Midi device, add a a true intelligent harmonizer and drop tuning. If they did they would take the market by storm. Also, their sound systems FOH are very high end and again PURE sound.
SAG control on Helix and HX stomp is your friend when wanting it to 'feel' like Kemper.
Do you raise the sag or lower it to feel like kemper
@@dinoparton6598 Raise the SAG generally, for most non metal amps.
I have both. I am afraid to use kemper stage live because the switches are poorly built. I only record with it. That’s why I use Helix on stage. Anyone has the same problem? Any experience with long term stage usage?
That's surprising to hear. I've used my stage almost every week multiple times a week in gigs and never had any issues
I haven’t used modelers in years do they still have latency?
For recording or for playing? Depending on how you record you could get some latency but typically through direct USB there is no latency. For playing, not at all.
I tried to like the Helix (LT model) but I could just never get the basic amp sounds to sound as good as the Kemper. I don't really use a lot of effects. I just want as close to the real amp sounds as possible and there's just endless profiles for the Kemper.
Are we hearing the sound through DI or an amp?
Helix is recorded through USB to my DAW and the Kemper is to my Scarlett 2i2 into my DAW
I usually tell people if they want the absolute best tone go Kemper, but ease of use and good enough go Helix. Personally I use a Helix Rack and a HX Stomp as a backup, also using a pedal baby as a poweramp if I need / want a cab. Kemper has the best overall tones no doubt, but its kinda complicated to get there....ofc this is just my personal opinion.
As a metal user from
The helix and the kemper and still to this day im
Having issues deciding on sound vs flexibility
Find one works better than another for metal?
@@ZachBrobstMusic i find both sound great in content of a full band !
As for in solo the kemper really shines !
But the helix has a better fx option
@@Tinyrick90 that would be my assumption as well. A lot of metal bands love the Kemper (or fractal)!
@@ZachBrobstMusic I’ve tried the fractal stuff ! Really cool product but kept going back to my helix haha
How about fractal fm series?
HELIX is nice! Guitar processors can make a big difference in sound depending on the CAB IR you use.
actually there are many IR products on the market, but I think DYNAX IR has the best sound. As stated in their product description, DYNAX IR is really fast. When using IRs, the pick attack is sometimes delayed, and it is difficult to add picking nuances, but their IR prevents all of that. It's revolutionary!
So a little of my background.
FIRST OFF I LOVE LINE 6 AND THE HELIX..
For over 35 years I have been a guitar luthier, build and fix guitars and amplifiers, know how to take any two amp and make it sound like any amplifier by modifications with capacitors and resistors just by looking at other schematics for a fraction of the price of wasting your money on these boutique amplifiers
Never satisfied with other people sound in the store or guitars I learn to build my own at a very young age.
ENGINEER, PRODUCER ALL THAT STUFF YOU KNOW.
I play all the instruments and sing lead but my preferred thing to do is ripping the guitar and I am a tone crazed person.
That being said
I CAN BARELY TELL THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MY TWO AMPS AND THE HELIX..
Especially if you plug it into the same cabinet using a tube amplifier or just as a preamp solid state.
The sounds are remarkably close..
Even the feel is very very close and I really can't tell much difference.
I think people's experience between the Kemper and the Helix will all depend on the person's type of guitar playing, their skill level and a bunch of things in between.
I love my custom amplifiers that I've built they unique to me nothing really quite sounds like them but playing other boutique amplifiers and vintage amplifiers the Helix is amazing.
You see one of the most important things about setting up these Helix and modeling amplifiers is knowing how it all works together in the real world when you put things together.
Knowing what drive pedal to put in front of an amplifier to make it sound a certain way what pedals go with what amplifiers a host of things.
That's where my experience comes in of getting the sounds that I want with the Helix
I don't miss carrying my amplifiers around at all I do use them in the studio sometimes but man it's hard to use them because the Helix does so well, especially when you're listening to something in a mix much hotter to hear the differences between this stuff..
So that's my opinion I just don't understand why line six seems to be so disconnected with their products never in a hurry to update the hardware For instance the Helix has been around for God knows how long they never seem to want to upgrade or do anything different giving you more processing power.
Maybe they just think it's good enough I have no idea.
They're very quiet about everything..
Helix4LIFE
dig your play style man. make some tunes
I see quads and Kempers for sale all the time, rarely ever see Helixs for sale.
KEM per❤❤❤❤
What camera you use man ?
Hey dude! I use a Sony A7IV!
Thanks man great staff
thank you! @@ariskoskinas
Great video, very helpful, thanks! People forget that Kemper is "Made in Germany", made in smaller batches, oppose to competitors which are mostly made in Asia, massive products, which means Kemper is more reliable and components inside are better quality. Doesn't mean that all Asian product are not quality made.. That was one of the factors that pointed me towards kemper.
Good ole' German Engineering!
I have a Kemper and Helix as well as a few friends too. There have been quality issues on both units over the years. Still overall good choices.
It’s funny that this gets brought up a lot. I own both the helix and Kemper and the Kemper has either bugged out or given me anxiety about it’s reliability plenty of times. The helix has never once glitched or given me weird problems. Both feel super solid but for some reason I feel more comfortable taking the helix on the road. I’ve even dropped it off my cab a few times onto concrete and it didn’t even dent. As much as the “made in Germany” gives me some comfort. I don’t think my Kemper would survive a fall like that. Also I purchased the advanced extended warranty for the helix and hopefully never have to use it but it gives me a lot of comfort when gigging. Love both units but my Kemper stays home
How about Digital Pianos ?😂
Yamaha Roland Kawai and ….Gewa?
Asian -- BOSS products are very reliable, probably more reliable than most. And it is made in Asia. (Remember Apple products are also made in Asia, this is more about the company than being made in Asia).
I heard "rain came, wind blew, but my house was built on You"....
firm foundation!
Tonex pedal providing the Amp mosule for HX stomp, and you have the best of both worlds, and cheaper than both. You missed the biggest drawback of the Kemper, and Profilers in general. They capture a snapshot of an amp at particular settings. Adjust the EQ, or gain, volume etc, and it no longer reacts like the original amp. It's not to say it sounds bad, but it doesn't recreate what happens if you did the same on the original amp. Liquid Profiling helps, but still doesn't rectify it completely. In theory, Modellers model the amp, and twisting the model's 'knobs' it reacts like the actual amp it is modelling.
I have both the Kemper and the ToneX and had and sold a Quad Cortex (no editor at the time and I got tired of waiting) ... if you already have all the pedals you use for an amp the ToneX is "cheaper" and a great choice. If someone was starting from scratch it's possibly not cheaper depending on what pedals you want / need to buy to get your sound. But the ToneX for sure sounds excellent and is all the "amp" you need. I use my Kemper more only because I spent a lot of time dialing everything in and it's all in one box but I do like them both.
@@checkitout611 Yep. But that's why I mentioned HX Stomp +Tonex, $650+$400, i.e. $1050, vs cheapest Kemper option $1449. Stomp provides all those pedals the person might need. Could go $50 less with the HX FX as well.
Helix for me all day long.
It's helix LT. That is bit significant.
PS.: okay, okay. but still
The Kemper is as good as your profiles.
Helix = simpler, Kemper = better amps, Fractal = best.
I have yet to try a fractal! I want to though!
Had these 3. Keep the fractal and sold the other 2.
@@SteveRayMorse Only concern I have with the Fractal is that it's seemingly more complicated than the other units I've used.
@@ZachBrobstMusic It is more complicated then Helix, for example. But when get the workflow it gets easy, really. But yeah, Helix have a better UI.
@@ZachBrobstMusic the Fractal is absolutely more complicated, but once you start getting around, either the unit itself or the software that you get with it, or both, you start to realize how powerful it is. It can get you bogged down with choices. There's a ton of amps it comes with and many many more cabinets. The F/X in the Fractal units are simply second to none. I have tried all of them as I have several friends that own music stores in my area and carry the stuff and they're ALL great but I think the Fractal units are the top dog here. Obviously though, it's not an exact science. Several of my friends in this area use the Kemper stuff and say it's the best stuff they've ever owned.
I remember when I first discovered Impulse Responses in Cubase about 10 years ago, I thought my head was gonna explode. And with hundreds of FREE VSTs available online, it was an exciting time to have an at-home recording setup.
But now, after first seeing the Kemper and to see everything else players have available at their fingertips, and feet, is mindblowing! It's all come together.
I shudder at what we had to play with in the 70's and 80's as low income metalheads. My poor neighbors had to listen to me learn to play on a Series A and a Backstage Plus.
(I put my foot through my Backstage Plus and it sounded better!)
Tube amps will always rule, I compare it to buying a Tesla or buying a 60’s Muscle car , one you can work on the other requires a tech . Software will always glitch but replacing caps is easy 🤷♂️ I have both tube and kemper so there’s that .
Put a tonex pedal in your helix loop and sell your kemper and buy a guitar with the left over money
To me, the Kemper sounded kind of muffled or something. Maybe it's just my ears though.
I've had both. Your right it does sound muffled but it does have a clarity knob which makes a huge difference
@@Rataja77 oh ok!
What did you mean by the term "feel"? I notice a lot of people using this word to describe a guitar sound. Sounds extremely abstract, 95% can't even explain what they mean. Is it dynamic range, latency, hi cut, compression, gain character, transformer voodoo, power amp mumbo jumbo or a preamp special gravyness?
Hey Rost. I find that "feel" can best be described as the realism felt when playing the unit. It's that interpretation of things that organically happen with a tube amp or playing with a unit in the room like tube sag, compression, pick attack, the way an amp responds to digging into the strings a bit, etc.
It's a hard one to explain, for sure, but it's that feeling that if I closed my eyes and didn't know I was playing a modeler, would it feel like a real amp? In this case, the Helix feels a little plastic at times and harsh whereas the Kemper has this organic way about it that feels like playing a mic'd up amp.
@@ZachBrobstMusic In my experience, the harshness in Line 6 Helix Modelers is typically due to the default 8kHz High Cut in the Cab Block. Most guitar real Cab Speakers have a frequency response that has a steep slope at around 5kHz or lower. Changing that setting in the Cab Block will easily get rid of the harshness. I've heard that if you use IR's, then the 8kHz setting makes sense due to the recording procedure.
@@picksalot1 that's good to hear! I'll try making some of those adjustments on my end to see if it helps with the Helix
@@picksalot1 Can you give an example of where you see this in what cab block?
@@bropetersbropeters193 Sure, just go to just about any Cab Block in Line 6 Helix (I use an HX Stomp, and changed all my Cab High Cut Settings when I learned what I describe below). In the Cab Block you'll see the following Parameters listed: Mic, Position, Distance, Angle, Low Cut, High Cut, Level. Prior to Firmware 3.5 Update, the High Cut was set at "8kHz" as the default setting, and as far as I could tell, it remained the default setting.
Take a look at the comments that Brian Wampler left me in his video "Is EQ confusing to you? This may help" - th-cam.com/video/azkCmRGWjuo/w-d-xo.html
This is when I learned about typical Guitar Frequency Reponses being around 5kH, and even lower. I can also post a link to a Five Watt World video where my question about the High Cut setting was posed to Ben Adrian, Helix Sound Designer.
Moral of the story - great guitar players make everything sound great. Sigh.
Moral of the story, part deux - I should stop watching guitar videos and go play...
Tonex pedal !!!!
No. U cannot convince people that a profile of one setting on an amp is more amp like when a modeler can actually aproximate the feel in its entirety. Once u tweak the parameter on a profile its no longer acting like the amp. Modeling is superior.
Fractal FTW
It bothers me that Line 6 used to build their amps and units in California when now they make them in China. That really bothers me.
I used modeling for years and was all about small. I've come full circle and now I much prefer a simple tube amp and 412. To me, nothing sounds or feels better than the real deal.
Too back and forth not helping me make a decision on whether or not I should pull the trigger and go the Line 6 helix
This video is pretty balanced and gives you an insane amount of information to make an informed decision yourself based on your needs, wants, playing styles, etc.
@@ZachBrobstMusic Thank you!
they both sound great i will go with the Kemper profiler Stage so people think I'm the greatest guitar player of all time
How well does a church gig pay? I don't find the god idea compelling, but I would add church gigs if the pay was reasonable. The new style of church bands are complete rock bands. Music is music after all and I dig many music forms. I'm not offended at the idea the lyrics are about Jesus, whatever, it's cool.
It largely depends on the size of the church, some churches pay but a lot of them are just purely on a volunteer basis
@@ZachBrobstMusic I have a funny take on getting paid to perform. I never get paid to perform, or very rarely. I get paid to haul gear, set it up, break it down, transport it and maintain it. I am a gear rental company, essentially. The performance is free. I most often perform as a drummer. As far as renting out gear, for the money, renting the guitar gear is a better deal. Setting up my drum kit is quite a bit of work. I am trying to downsize my guitar rig to as small as possible. With drums, at best I can leave a couple pieces out, but the big stuff is all necessary. Not much room to downsize.