Pete Rock had the nerve to say Jamaicans are responsible for 90% of Hip Hop....this is why I'm serious on making a real documentary on Hip Hop .The truth needs to be told......asap
It’s really not a debate!! Black American history is recorded/documented HEAVILY going all the way to the cotton club!! I’m just puzzled how people can lie about black American history
Busta said Jamaica was rapping over Reggae in the 60s & 70s but New Orleanian Louis Armstrong was rapping over Jazz in the 30s and 40s and its documented. People really like to leave New Orleanians and their Jazz creation out of it!!!
Hip Hop lingo was greatly influenced by the Jazz era. Jazz terms such as Funky, Fresh, fly, Dope, Hip, The Bomb, Boogie, Cool, Chill, Crib, Down by law, Jam, etc were adopted by Hip Hop. Moreover, the break beats and soundscape of Hip Hop were greatly influenced by James Brown.
Those words came long before James Baldwin. The amazing Baldwin was recorded using those words but they were organically created by the youth of those times.
It’s many from North Carolina and South Carolina. Disco King Mario Born Edenton North Carolina. DJ Jazzy Jay from South Carolina,DJ Kool Dee from N.C. and even Fat Mike from the 1st Division of the Black Spades from North or South Carolina. Just to name a few
I am of Jamaican descent and i knew about this topic from the Mid 1990's biggup Foundational Americans i fight all truth with pure truth...One Love🇺🇸🇯🇲..
Thanks bro. We love yall and this sh17 is really troublesome, hurtful, disrespectful and revealing. We need more like yourself because what happens is... next they'll erase Jamaicans. This is how we got conquered in the first place. Being sold out by our own and now this next phase is not about slavery... its about EXTINCTION. Buster knew better than to say stuff like he did when CERTAIN FOLKS WERE ALIVE. DMX would push back for real. TUPAC wasn't having it. BIGGIE is Jamaican and he wouldn't allow this either. This propaganda IS COMING FROM THE TOP... by top I mean from WHITES. This is deep brother. An extermination is coming and the targets are the people who fight white supremacy the most... AMERICAN BLACKS WHO DESCEND FROM AMERICAN SLAVES.
I agree with mostly everything but there is no such thing as being over confident. We are supposed to be confident in our country and Black Americans have always been some of the most welcoming inclusive people hence why other people feel comfortable jacking our culture.
@New Negroid breed Dominant Genetic Parent Why does your DNA match with West Africans if you and your people are not African? Why is the only language you and your people know is English? Why the only religion you and your people know is Christianity?
So he came to america, was assimilated into american culture, used the two turn tables and a mic setup already here from disco, used the speaker system we already were using for block parties, he watched the american dancers who been break dancing since the early 1900s at least, to see which part of the american music he was mixing got the strongest response from the american crowd to know which part of the american music to isolate and repeat. This is not creating this is participating and contributing.
Dude, what we were building bass horn speakers in Jamaica since the sixties. In fact, I was building and still build bass horn today. I learned that from rainbow sound owner, my uncle Desmond Patterson who started doing it in the South Bronx in the mid seventies, then moved to Lauderhill in eighties. if you doubt what I'm saying, then go see him over at Rainbow Variety store in Lauderhill, FL. On 21st and 441. He is in his seventies now, but he is still there. Let him educate you on what was going on in his South Bronx.
@@natural876 "Dude", I'm not sure what any of that has to do with my comment. Are you arguing that Jamaicans created hip hop and against my stance that Jamaicans participated and contributed to it? That's like trying to claim the entire cookout because you brought a slammin potato salad. Yall contributed, and also took a lot of to-go plates home with you, it was our cookout though.
@@hunibuni that is your mischaracterization. Jamaicans aren't claiming that we created Hip-hop, instead we are advancing is that major elements of what is now hip-hop is influenced by Jamaican culture. We built the sound systems from the early sixties, because during that time transitor radios weren't wildly available during the time. Herc's father had a sound system in Jamaica in the sixties. Furthermore, Jamaicans who know their history will readily tell you that Reggae, Rocksteady, Ska are children of the delta Blues. However, when we look at hip-hop, we see our culture and influence in it. Hip-hop has five elements, and we see the toasting elements and the selector elements that been around from early sixties. No one complained when Herc hid his Jamaican heritage in the seventies, eighties, and ninties. Now, that he has been open about it, now it a whole problem. indeed, Hip-hop is an American genre, no question, however she has Jamaican parents, and her parents themselves had American parents; the blues. At the end of the day, that is an all American story. My suggestion for you is that you should do a deep dive and familiarize your with the Harlem Renaissance, so you understand that in a big way, Harlem was the mecca of the African diaspora. With African-Americans leading the diaspora, It is these cultural exchanges with varying Africoid nationalities, that brought fourth Reggae, R&B, Ska, Rocksteady, and mostly certainly My beloved Hip-hop. I challenge you to go to the south Bronx, then listen to all the languages being spoken there. I think that will go far to inform your misunderstanding of the situation. Hip-hop wasn't created in a bubble. It even has German influences, such as a group way ahead of their time called Krafwerk. th-cam.com/video/n4z5VmOIYu8/w-d-xo.html
@@natural876 No group of people is a monolith, so of course not all Jamaicans are making false claims. But the claim was made, and it was co-signed enough to be problematic. You're also making a lot of problematic statements as well. You know how martial arts such as taekwando, kung fu, karate, etc are part of Asian culture though they have participants and modern contributors of various races and nationalities, yet no one tries to remove these things from being acknowledged as Asian culture. But when it comes to the cultural contributions of melanated americans, there is a double standard and an unspoken understanding that it's ok to turn participation and even emulation into ownership when it comes to melanated american culture. In light of this disrespect, melanated americans have collected evidence that the elements that make up hip hop have been apart of melanated american culture in various forms all over the US colony long before hiphop was coined as a genre in NYC. Remember that the majority of the melanated american people living in NY (and many other northern states) migrated there from the south and they brought the culture they already had there where it continued to evolve and be condensed into a specific genre. Other ethnic groups began to join in and participate and assimilate themselves into the melanated american culture that was already happening. There are so many quotes from them both Jamaicans and Latino early participants in hiphop that admit this. They admit it was already a thing and they joined in. You can't own something that you joined in or emulated. When it comes to the electronic aspect. It's like saying that music genre's belong to the people who create or first popularize the instruments, So by your logic, jazz can't be a melanated american cultural creation because some other group invented and popularized saxophones, trumpets, etc first. Almost all genre's went electronic around the early 70's, and new genres were created. The inventors of those instruments and the people who popularized them have an influence but can't take ownership of genres that already existed and simply modernized with the technology that became available. Nor can those people claim every new genre that get's created with those same instruments. I don't identify as "africoid" either, We are americans here. And there is at least one quote from colonial explorers that described our people here as lyrically talented (rapping) when the Europeans first got here. A lot of these melanated american tribes were sent to islands like Jamaica as prisoners of war, so deep down a lot of mainland folks and people in the Caribbean are distant relatives and would share a cultural root However we have evidence through quotes from Jamaican artists themselves that they took inspiration and even directly emulated what was going on, on the mainland, from our indigenous american musical arts like spirituals, work songs, jazz, blues, rock and roll, country, funk, soul, r&b and hip hop, you get most of the Jamaican genres and even Afrobeat whose parents are both american and jamaican genres. Krautrock is a derivative of funk. The earliest work of Kraftwerk didn't sound anything like hip hop. The later work that melanated americans gravitated to sounds like funk played completely on synths and that's why it was described as funky. They clearly were inspired by funk first. We can prove the source of inspiration and are not going to give credit away that is not due. We're coming with receipts.
A whole playlist of receipts which address the mainland american origins of most of the aspects of hip hop that Jamaicans try to claim they originated or contributed to hip hop when it was mostly assimilation and participation. th-cam.com/play/PLIMTq-a_p6qJ4gOGiPoNC31x46qqy1TWO.html We give yall your flowers for the genuine, quality participation and also the fresh derivative flavors yall came up with by taking what we were doing and changing it up into your own thing. We like how yall spice things up in your own way, but it's our cookout. You brought some seasonings and some potato salad you made with our recipe to begin with. If you love our culture just say that. I can say that I love Jamaican culture without any issue and without needing to take ownership of it that isn't backed up by any evidence. Yall should be able to do the same. A lot of Jamaican people contribute to american culture but they are mostly assimilating while doing it. They aren't bringing in culture that is unique to Jamaica. If you listen to Busta Rymes early music it was all NE boom bap style. We don't have a problem with any one expressing their heritage, but most Jamaicans assimilated to american culture so those contributions don't make it some kind of fusion. If I go to Japan and train to play koto and I become a master at playing traditional Japanese koto it doesn't become american influence, it's just american participation and assimilation and Koto doesn't magically morph into something that is both Japanese and American, it's still just Japanese. Billy Blanks made Tae Bo, which is influenced by Asian martial arts, guess what he didn't do? He didn't try to claim any ownership, or influence on martial arts, he gracefully borrowed elements from it without trying to claim what he borrowed for himself. That's the difference between cultural appreciation and cultural appropriation. We also have appreciation for when Jamaicans did bring their unique culture to the picture, through collaborations and dances. All through the 90's there were Jamaican features in patois on songs and dancehall tracks played on our radio stations. (those individual songs are fusions not the entire genre) Yet Busta Rymes still had the nerve to say it was Latinos that made him proud enough to come out and show his heritage. It's ridiculous honestly. If I were Jamaican I would have taken offense to the fact that he said he needed a Latino to make him feel proud of his culture. He totally dogged us out and bit the hand that has fed him. I wanted to write him and Fat Joe's stupid statements off as divide and conquer propaganda but then the internet revealed how many actual Jamaicans and Latinos actually believed they had some ownership claim to our culture. It was shocking really. But digging into the actual receipts has been quite refreshing and we still turned around and told Jamaicans to gate keep their culture as well because a lot of Africans were trying to claim Afrobeats as the parent of dancehall when it's the other way around. There is a push to replace the collabs we saw in the 90's with Jamaican and American artists with Afrobeats and personally I don't think that's a good thing. At the end of the day mainland and caribbean people are all continental americans by virtue of being of the americas. We should certainly reach an understanding, respect and unification.
No one objected to Herc claim until they found out that he was Jamaican. During his time, Jamaicans like my brother, Melton Bowen, who actually invented the gloves used in MMA were ashamed to claim Jamaican parentage. As his younger ruder brother, I was unapologetic about my Jamaican culture. I wore mess shirt and Rasta belts, because my culture had value.Herc, was a person more of my brother's time unfortunately, denied being Jamaican and ashamed. Americans didn't start discrediting him until the day that he met up with Daddy Uroy, one of the first toasters in B side music, to which Hip-hop is a member
I disagree its wasn't a problem til Busta Rhymes sounded off on FBA Talking and saying with arrogance to the new generation that" Hip Hop started From a Jamaican Nigga" and Americans don't have Culture. That was some divided bs he was talking.I no longer respect him in Hip Hop but as a Hebrew brother I Love Him.@@natural876
Why is it so important to say that Jamaican created it, why you won't say a black man made. That's why now on fba going to say they made it, they going for now on we going say FBA now on , how you like that.¹
sadatkb... thats that OVERCONFIDENCE/ARROGANCE i spoke about brother... even if we feel like that... instead of just saying it... lets put that feeling to some greatest ever ACTION!! let our actions show how great we are!!
I don't get this whole debate. Herc denied outrightly in the early 80s the link between the birth of Hip Hop and Jamaican music and especially Toasting being the inspiration for Rap. I don't know if any of you guys know what actual Toasting from the early 70s and late 60s sounded like. Nothing like Rap or spoken word or rhymes. Something that was already done by African-Americans in the the same timeframe. That's why Herc said that the inspiration for Rap were James Brown and Jalal from the Last Poets especially his album Hustlers Convention.
I am Jamaican 58 born June 1964 Kingston Jamaica but let me educate you on something you have no idea about and want to make an input into it without knowledge.... This song that you are about to listen was done in Jamaica at Joe Gibbs recording studio 5 Retirement road Kingston 5 in July of 1979 the engineer was Errol Thompson.. i was in the fucking studio that day at the age of 15 then... Here is the song...th-cam.com/video/uHplHw-IG8s/w-d-xo.html.. This could actually be the first rap song ever done by and human being male or female on vinyl and it was done in Jamaica... Rappers delight by the sugar hill gang i don't know when it was actually recorded but it was released in September of 1979 one week before Xanadu and sweet lady rappers delight was released... why Joe Gibbs held back the song so long i have no idea. Engineer and producers are not with us anymore may their soul rest in peace...everybody can talk all the chit they want but these are raw facts and i bear witness...now this is were the debate can start... who and where exactly was the first rap song was ever done.. If sugar hill gang song was recorded before July of 1979 then they were first but if its after July 1979 that it was recorded then Xanadu and sweet lady was the first rap song ever make a note of it.....now take that and ride with it...i have the proof look at the label. and start your own research. get back to me.. By the way this rap hip hop song was done in April of 1979 on a reggae beat before recording it on a disco beat in July the same year the genre was actually called Reggae Disco Name of the song was rockers choice done by rap artist xanadu th-cam.com/video/FrJpw9Hs_DM/w-d-xo.html
Jamaican Sound systems rarely had two decks. They rocked with one. They had the Selecta who chose the tunes, the Soundman who kept the frequencies in check and sometimes ( not always ) the ' DJ ' who would shout out his Sound. Hip- Hop is an African American invention.
That’s what they want…just like the Tulsa massacre. If everyone is dead then they can create what ever historical fact they want. FBA started hip hop culture!!! Everyone else copied and eventually added their own flavor. Give props where it’s due
Now if these were dudes from Kansas or New Mexico saying that Bam and Herc were lying i wouldn't take them seriously. But these are Black Spade OGs saying these things. These guys know Herc, and, Bam personally. Bam was a member of the same Black Spades gang as these guys in the video this is straight from people who were apart of the foundation of Hip-Hop Culture and I believe them.
My brothers are saying the copy, cut, paste, and edit Hip Hop music/culture. My brother and I are from the Hip Hop era; we lived in South Bronx. We lived Hip Hop before it was called Hip Hop.
@@headcougarincharge9027 Because you stereotype other groups on this thread and act like that unlike every group in the world the FBA doesn't share of jerks who can go against their own people The point that I'm making is he us an FBA knows FBA music and culture too but that doesn't make him a good person just because he's an FBA.
@@headcougarincharge9027 Also Jimmy Walker is an FBA who occasionally rhymed on Good Times. His family is from Alabama which I know you all love. He grew up in the South Bronx and occasionally rhymed on Good Times and some would rather give credit to him fir playing a role in starting Rap I stead of just being more nuanced in admitting that Kool Herc is not responsible for the existence of hip hop but he played a role in contributing to it's development because he's not an FBA
Thanks for jumping on this. I commented on the original video. As soon as Chuck said his parents moved to Long Island in 1969, that disqualified anything he has to say about Hip Hop history. In my observation/ opinion , this is what happened- The false Herc, Bam and Flash Trinity story was spearheaded and carried around the world by 1-3 early KRS One records and KRS One’s 30 year college lecture career. That’s what created the issue. It kinda became the agreed upon lie because KRS is a top Ten MC and that was the first time the world heard a story of actual Hip Hop history. Then to further the lie, Bam had a global army ( Zulu Nation) that enforced that false Trinity also.
Here is a TRUE history lesson of the origin of hip hop. "Kool Herc went on Maury Polvich show to take a lie detector test' and the test results came back "YOU ARE NOT THE FATHER" it is very clear hip hop and rap music is African Americans culture and music created and originated by African Americans not carribeans or kool herc. he moved to america at age 12 in 1967. around the time hip hop was bubbling up. you telling me he brought hip hop culture or music with him. Herc didn't create or originate nothing in hip hop including extending / juggling, looping break beats or the merry go round the made up name he created for it. he leaarned all of that from african american DJ's. he just wants to be in the history books. he used to tell the truth early on. He said he used to attend disco parties and the djs were playing break beats while the people there were breakin and yes that was the term used in 1970 for break dancing. being done before herc. he wasnt the first to do anything in hip hop including his merry go round technique. Disco DJ's at disco clubs and parties would extend the breakdown of records for as long as 20 minutes at times to get the kids to get funky or break dance. That is what break dance means to dance on the breakdowns, DJ's would loop the break from turntable to turntable while the kids got funky on the dance floor break dancing. soul train was started in the late 60s in chicago as traveling record hops by Don Cornelius, where he traveled around to different venues putting on his dance record hops. the show went live on tv in 1970 were young kids dance to the latest funk soul rnb music. the soul train line literally was the DJ playing extended beats of records while the soul train dancers would do the latest dance crazes like poppin pop lockin robot breakin and hundreds more dance crazes. that was watched by millions. this was the early foundation of hip hop which included james brown who used to dance to extended breakdowns of the beat for as long as 30 minutes in his shows. Some may say pigmeat markums here comes the judge, is not a hip hop record but it has every element and the black spades and others around those neighborhoods who are the real founders of pretty much every element of hip hop culture said that is who they were copying when they would battle snap (rap) to music at block parties and just on the street corners in the neighborhood. block parties, toasting, sound systems, rapping, breakin, graffiti, and every other element of hip hop was created and influenced here in America by African American's. Not the Caribbeans. U-roy and other Jamaican Artists and toasters said they got their music culture from our music and DJ's so how could they have originated it. in fact, ska, rocksteady, and reggae music was directly inspired by African American music and culture. Many of the early pioneers of ska and rock steady which became reggae music said they were copying and inspired by African American music, and culture. FBA (Foundational Black Americans) originated and created hip hop period. not kool herc or carribeans. Herc did not create the extended breakbeat. So that is out. he didnt create the merry go round technique, he just put a name to what he was copying. African Americans created most of the worlds most popular music genras and subcultures. that is a fact. so stop with the ambiguity and if you are trying to truly get to the truth, then tell the truth and stop leaving it open for interpretation. African Americans created hip hop and rap period. Rap literally goes all the way back to slavery in the usa. kool herc and other carribeans here contributed and participated like the rest of the early pioneers. but they didnt start nothing accept maybe grandmaster flash with some of his techinlogical inventions and theories around turntabalism, but that is not the creation of turntabalism, deejaying or hip hop, but an elevation. a contribution of one element of the art form. if Jamaicans were listening to African Americans DJ's (Deejays) and were inspired to copy it, they couldn't have done it first, thus they didn't create it. dancehall which started in the late 70s was a speed up more rhythmic reggae inspired music form which was inspired by ska, which was literally inspired by African American music and DJs. see how the ball goes around. you people at this point ( And I'm talking to some of the people in your comments and just in general about these debates and responding to some of the statements you made in your videos), are down right disrespecting African Americans and their long and arduous creation of the culture. let me again explain it to yah, in my fake Jamaican accent. i love my Jamaica seestas and brudas but this gotta stop. The rhythmic rhyming of vocals of African American toasting (Jive Talking) influenced the development of toasting in Jamaica and development of the dancehall style In the late 1950s deejay toasting (In Jamaica) was developed by Count Matchuki. He conceived the idea from listening to disc jockeys on American radio stations. He would do African American jive over the music while selecting and playing R&B music. Deejays like Count Machuki working for producers would play the latest hits on traveling sound systems (African American inspired mobile Dj systems) at parties and add their toasts or vocals to the music. These toasts consisted of comedy, boastful commentaries, half-sung rhymes, rhythmic chants, squeals, screams and rhymed storytelling, which was inspired by African American minstral shows and stage shows (Of course they added their own flare making it their own style) but that's my point. Creativity comes from inspiration. They were inspired by African American Deejaying and Music Culture but they then made it their own. That's like how everything else is created Later in the 1960s toasting deejays included U-Roy and Dennis Alcapone, the latter known for mixing gangster talk with humor in his toasting. In the early 1970s, toasting deejays included I-Roy (his nickname is in homage to U-Roy) and Dillinger, the latter known for his humorous toasting style. In the early 1970s Big Youth became popular. In the late 1970s, Trinity followed and they all said they were inspired by and emulating African American music and culture with their own flair. This all comes back around full circle to African American Culture and music. Not saying we created everything but out of shear necessity we created our own cultures and music, as well as many other American traditions. sometimes we get credit for it but in the broader scheme of things it is hidden from American society and thus hidden from the world as a form of deliberate oppression and deliberate cultural appropriation. This goes on a lot. We don't get the credit for a lot of our contributions to the world. and really it's by design. These historians know the truth about it but African Americans are discredited in place of other people. This has to stop. Go read a book on the inventions and innovations that African Americans have contributed to the world and you will literally be shocked beyond belief. how can you be the root of hip hop music when hip hop music is literally African American music. disco, r&b ,funk ,jazz, and anything else you wanna mix in there that we created. Herc already said it was alread bubbling up and he was inspired by other DJ's and what he was hearing and seeing. if he wasnt the first to juggle break beats, didnt create or the music that was inspiring it, he wasnt the first throwing parties in the park. wasnt the first throwing house partys, how could he have invented it. This is a stupid argument. he came over here and seen African Americans are lit. and got inspired like everyone else in the world. hes not the creator. one of the early pioneers yes. creator no. Herc literally does not even know how to dj. Look at what he is doing in his video explaining the merry go round technique which is just beat juggling and looping or extending the beat. It literally does not match up to how cross fading works. He is a huge fraud and liar. That is why you see no video of him dj'ing and your telling me this guy created extended break beat juggling and looping and hip hop. This is blasphemy in its highest form and literally the text book definition of cultural appropriation, and it is being deliberately and blindly spread around the world, stealing the real credit from the real African American pioneers and creators. Pete DJ Jones and DJ Flowers were some of the first to isolate the instrument break beat and extend and loop it, The get down. And that was influenced by James Brown shouting out get down and him dancing to the breakdowns and getting funky. That was the first DJ'S doing what Kool Herc named his merry go round technique. He didnt create it. Rappers Delight literally copied that song by the Jubilaires' in this video Go Listen To Rappers Delight' it Sounds Just Like the jubilairs rapping in the 40s. They just changed the words' it is the same exact cadence' That cadence is the exact cadence and rapping flow of all hip hop in the 70s and 80s the foundation of hip hop' the black spades the true founders of hip hop culture said they were mimicking them and Pigmeat Markum during their snap battles which is basically battle rapping or cracking on each other over a beat and sometimes without a beat' So No! Kool Herc or Caribbeans did not create or inspire hip hop. It was actually the other way around. African American culture and music inspired Carribean culture. Was he and other Caribbeans early contributors and pioneers, yes. They contributed, but founding fathers no.
I must say I am very impressed with your breakdown of the topic, and your ability to support your argument using historical reference points. I have watched several of Mr. Michael Wayne's videos on TH-cam and your views appear to correlate with a litany of interviews he conducted.
Foundational black ⚫ Americans. When you say African Americans you open the door for every race including white. 🙄 Knowledge shared from brother Tariq Nasheed Aka Flex.
@@MichaelJordan-gj1uo thats convienient...you get to say you are foundational, but show no evidence that you are in actual fact at the foundations...now you claiming to be some fckin red indians...
@@MichaelJordan-gj1uoF him. He ain't nobody's teacher. He lust after non black women. I saw of him somewhere makin googly eyes at them foreign women, telling black men to come to where he was at. F ttariq Tyrone the frayd
2022...and still relishing in the truth. FBA are the creators of hip hop music and culture. Anybody who was a coherent child ANYWHERE ON EARTH in the 70s of 80s knows this.
@Derik Hillman Such a spicy “retort”. Why it have to be a 🍆 reference... I’m choosing peace so I’ll reserve the fk you for the enemy. I admire your passion on this topic and we share the same view. I would challenge you to a dance or rap battle but the world and these joints ain’t ready sun.
Chuck D. Was just mixing truth with fantasy And he still believes this cause he just put up a post last month putting people down who doesn’t agree hip hop came from West Indians It kills me how they just put all West Indians into the category of what Jamaicans did. The other islands didn’t have a dj culture
There are some other Caribbean people saying that Caribbean people started Hip Hop which is a lie but yes there are so many different people from the Caribbeans.
herc the Jamaican and other DJs copy from the The True Fathers of Hip Hop which are Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco, Pete DJ Jones, Kool DJ Dee, and Plummer so of these African American DJs were making the beginning of Hip Hop in 1960s.
As a born Jamerican i came to the Bronx in 1972 at the age of 8 1/2 yrs old. I first became familiar with the history of hip hop via breakdancing in 1976. Graffiti was all around us before that so that was the first element of hip hop, but we didn't have elements or even the name hip hop back then. Then I became familiar with the DJ in 1977 and " Dance To The Drummer's Beat " and " Jam On The Groove" were two of the first breaks i can remember. DJ Breakout was one of the first DJs I knew about, because he was from my area and his boy Richie Tee used to live on my block ( 216th near Laconia).But by word of mouth we heard about Kool Herc and Flash. No real MCs were out then, they were more like crowd motivators, not rappers. Soon after in my area of the Bronx "rappers " like Timmy Hall and Eddie Cheeba were the known names. Besides H.S jams and park jams at P.S 78 or Haffen Park aka Valley Park, there was the Stardust Ballroom on Boston Rd. ( which i couldn't afford although they were like $7.00-$10.00 to get in sometimes you'll get a discount if you brought the flyer or get there before 10pm.). As a young man from Jamaican culture ( actually born in England to Jamaican parents, lived in Jamaica from 5 1/2 to 8 1/2 then grew up in the Bronx ) I can 100% tell you. This whole hip hop culture was created and invented by BLACK AMERICANS POINT BLANK. NOW....West Indians and Puerto Ricans immersed themselves into the culture. The area of the Bronx I grew up in was populated with Jamaicans and some Puerto Ricans. We all grew up doing the same things. Playing street games, sports and of course when breaking and DJing came in some got involved in that. But JAMAICANS and PUERTO RICANS did not invent or create hip hop as we know it to be. And to keep it SUPER 100....Jamaicans immersed in the culture didn't even want ppl to know you were Jamaican, you tried to camouflage your accent and you dressed and carried yourself like a " yankee" aka American. Now you had Jamaicans who had NO INTEREST in this culture and proudly wore their " highwater" pants with their Clark " boots", diamond socks, rag hanging out their back pocket, long belts mostly the red yellow and green type, kangol or " tams," headwear and natty hair ( uncombed afro). But you can be sure 90% of these dudes had a ratchet ( knife) on them. Some of them were rude bwoys and others just didn't, couldn't or wouldn't assimilate to the American culture. One thing i always remembered as a child is when an American hit song was made, a Jamaican ALWAYS copied that song. My sister and I HATED that. " Why Jamaicans always copying songs?" we used to say. Somebody told me it was because Jamaicans like the song , but you cant dance to the American rhythm so we have to put a Jamaican beat to dance to it. To me it was still thievery and I used to say " just dance the American way to the original" 😂. But that's MY personal history growing up a Jamerican in the Bronx. Just wanted to add to this very good documentary. We need all elders to speak the truth about this history which is true AMERICAN HISTORY. No shame in the truth.
Thanks for speaking the truth....I'm an elder also and everything you said is true......we never had a problem with Jamaicans back then making a Jamaican version of our songs,I was a DJ and played some of those songs.once again thanks for speaking the truth
Rap is music, Hip-Hop is a subculture. Rap started in the South, Hip-Hop started in New York. Rap is sometimes called Hip-Hop because it's the music of Hip-Hop. Both are EXCLUSIVELY Foundational Black American creations. 🇺🇸✊🏾🇺🇸✊🏽🇺🇸✊🏿
@@awesomeasever8370 you should be ashamed of yourself ... ADOS romance in your brain. The world is bigger than America we come from the same place.Wake up from your pity party 🎉
you are full of sh't..hiphop is based on hijacking and sampling music from everywhere...you sample reggea rock funk disco indian ragas aqnd pop music from england..stop this bullsh't...
All you gotta do is look at Black tv shows (Good Times) and Black movies from the 70s. NOTHING was Caribbean or Latin in Black Music or culture. EVERYTHING was Black Music (Disco, Funk). No Black Americans were listening or partying to Caribbean or Latin Music
I admit that I thought that Jamaicans started hip hop. Watched Tariq, Dwann B and other videos and did my own research, found out that Black people started hip hop. I'm 56 and I wished I've learned this earlier. Also, on the Jamaican side, learned about how Ska started out, Jamaican sound systems and other stuff. And that was amazing. Lately I've been learning more about Black music, I just found out about Ragtime music being Black. That was shocking. Looks like I got some "Catching up to do."
It's sad that Chuck D who many people give him credit for being an intellectual and a leader, doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. He's talking like he has fact behind what's he saying but he's speaking only from misguided thoughts or stories from people he believed knew facts. He and those people were wrong lol. Chuck stop being so quick to give away the credit for Hip Hop origins to people who don't know shit about Hip Hop. Jamaican culture is their's alone so let the real NYC kids who started Hip Hop have their credit for what they started by themselves ! Black American kids from NYC started HIP HOP not Caribbeans
Dang this video aged very well with what's going on now. I'm sick of us having to defend our culture to others. Especially being that they already have their own culture. Make that make sense
Kool Herc, Grandmaster Flash, and Bambatta need to be made to set the record straight so that liars like Pete Rock, Busta Rhymes, DJ Evil Dee, and other bs Jamaican artist are made to recant every lie that has been told by them to give credit to the black American.
@@FBA_God_Emperor_Doom FACTS, there's a clip on this very channel where Herc states he came and "added on to what was already being done". There's no clip of Herc saying "I invented Hip Hop and here's how I do it" yet the lie continues to be told.
The key word is the fact that Kool herc was "catering" to a culture that already existed not the other way around. Kook herc did not invent the fire, he just used a match to lite up one.
Well Kool Herc needs to come out and say it so these Caribbean’s can stop lying but I doubt he will because he now has this big ego boost on his shoulder for being the so-called godfather of hip hop 💯
That’ll nevertheless happen careers have been built off this lots of money been made and I think it will get deeper into the Buisness of music if people start to open up the books. Don’t hold ya breath on it
Even your FBA fairy godmother. F/inessed B/lack American founder admitted himself before the FBA grift that Hip hop was started by Kool Herc! This FBA's only contribution to hiphop th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
I looked it up, and it's true that Herc wants to build a Hip Hop museum in Jamaica. Wow 🤯 "Herc said it was time for Jamaica to take Hip Hop back while condemning the continuing trend of mainstream music stealing from Jamaican culture." 🤯
Why is that wrong? Mainstream media DOEs so that. Are you trying to say mainstream media is soley black America? What about white America? You know...the majority of the country.
Toasting comes from 'toast-telling' in Black American folkloric tradition and dates back to the 30s. Toast-telling was a widespread practice for Black Americans from New York, to Philadelphia, Texas, to LA. It's documented in a book called 'Get Your Ass in the Water and Swim Like Me' originally published in 1974.
I don’t totally believe we were so arrogant that others want revenge. I think they don’t want us to be confident because they’re working for WS because everybody know ADOS is the strongest blacks in the diaspora who can change the world.
I'm a born Jamaican/American citizen. I'm glad you made this a conversation. Because growing up in New York in the early 70's. Watching the Black Americans on Soul Train and then hearing how hip hop music was formed and getting popular. I grew up watching this music take its shape. I even started a Dance group in the early 80s. I worked with Chuck D. back in the day when he was with Spectrum. I saw his talent big time. Facts or Facts. My Dad would always play back then a lot of Motown and then a lot of the reggae that was coming up. He was really into his music. Inspired me completely. I've become a recording artist myself.
@Garfield Harrison My Man!!!! This topic has me trippin'!!! What you said reminds me that there is nothing but LOVE between us ( FBA and Jamaicans ) and we are Family Period. The enemy always tries TO DIVIDE US!!!Fat Joe, I mean the Devil's job is to keep a riff between us. I will not be poisoned by an outsider whose family wiggled their way into this country thinking that light skin would help them move up and be readily accepted by White America. Since Joe nem see that whites ain't stuttin them, they're trying to fake unite with us and trying to separate us from our Jamaican cousins. NO WEAPON FORMED AGAINST US SHALL PROSPER. We're too Black / too Strong
I'm confused because before rap existed it was called "The Dozens." Dolemite was rapping in his movies and Black-Americans we're using The Dozen in TV shows like the Jeffersons when Helen and George would snap on each other.
Good piece of history here. American Freedmen lead the Diaspora. Too many of us don't know it and we keep spreading love and giving credit to flat blackness. Thanks to those of us who know we are unique in the struggle.
It seems everybody wants to claim Hip-hop. That includes the house and techno ( read: dance music people)....they claim that Kraftwerk "invented" hip-hop. We all know better than that. Lol The Latinos claim they " invented" hip-hop. Sure there some Latinos involved in hip-hop's genesis such as DJ Tex- Hollywood and Disco Wiz and DJ Junebug and of course the Jamaican's None of these people invented hip-hop. Kool Herc, Kool Dee, Grandmaster Flowers and Disco King Mario invented hip-hop. Point Blank! Hip-hop won out over all other forms of culture because it had that very powerful core of African- Americans pushing it. House and techno used to have that backing but they decided to go European and they lost.
Nobody was involved in the beginning, fog it was all us, them others cane in the mid 70's when the block parties were starting all over NYC, so no johnny come lately ass ppl had no part of the origins of rap
Which is typical Jamaican style. 1 deck, echo chamber, analog beep box and a mic. i don't know why they say 2 turntables comes from Jamaica as radio stations, mobile jocks and clubs had 2 turntables for years before Hip Hop came along. ....and i'm with you on the "No one mentions Coke La Rock" thing. They hardly ever do yet he's on a ton of the O.G flyers right there in black n white. >shrugs< All i can think is he got quickly over shadowed by younger rappers and forgotten. i don't remember anyone ever tellin me about him battlin anyone. Maybe that wasn't his thing, rather jus the O.G toasting rap style, again a la Jamaica. A things developed around him, he didn't move with it.... ...at least, that's what i think.
@@mossadon That's how almost all DJs start that way. Two turntables was an American thing to keep the beat going. Flowers expanded to three turntables. That's where Larry Levan and Frankie Knuckles got it from.
@@mossadon Hollywood and KC Prince of Soul overshadowed him. KC because he was Flowers MC, Hollywood because he was just that good. Keep in mind Hollywood is a great DJ as well. These two were all over NYC.
Kool DJ Dee said he was playing the break beat, extending the break beat, playing the same copy of the same record on two turntables chopping. Cueing, Mixing, and Blending.
Don't understand why some peeps have a problem acknowledging Blk Americans pretty much the pioneers of ALL popular music genres, as much as everything else, ignorance I call it, nothing pops-off unless Blk Americans get hold of it or creates it. Big-ups to FBA.
Hurk was 12 years old in 1972 he was a kid fresh from Jamaica coming out side in goofy shit. FBA told him how to dress fly, what to play, what was going on outside and how to fit in. Jamaicans left their culture in the house, left the creo in the house. They were trying to figure out how to fit in and be fly in a new environment for him and the culture that allowed him to be excepted in that invironment. Anything else is Backward Bullshit. He had studied us enough by 76 and began to have jams and develop his shit. By 78 he had a following and thus his legacy. He was young and popular.
@@abrahambowen8332 Go listen to Herk goofy. He came here when he was 12. He started getting down in 72 thats 5 years afterche got here. Did he learn from us or did we learn from him. Same with toasting they learned all this from us. Foundational Blacks invented all American forms of music and influenced the world. Not the other way around period goofy!!
@@abrahambowen8332 You can call it whatever you want just have the facts straight! I mean what are we talkig about here? Get the facts straight period.
Thank you for this. Being from the BX, I first heard rap came from the islands and ska in a PWI class about 20 yrs ago. Completely confused by that back then. As I've learned over the yrs the only thing I seem to truly hear that came from the islands were the artists and their family lineage. Like you note I heard an interview prior where Herc said it was an experiment for the merry go round. If the starting elements of hip hop are the break beats/the dj, the breakers, and the mc--are they saying the system set up started from the islands? Black Americans of all people have to be very careful how we tell our history.
Rapping in the 1950 was a common thing African American hey man le me Rap to you. Asked older African American just like give me Five started I 1950s give me five it was away of live for African Americans.
Grandmaster Flowers and Disco King Marion was already Using 2 Turntables and a Mic 🎤 before The World knew of Kool Herc.By The Time The Whole U.S. Nation learned about Herc.Hip-Hop was beginning to become a Documented Thing.
hip hop is a creation of Black Americans the rest of us people of color just added our little two cents to it. The slang, the image, the music, the style of speech (emulating radio voice personalities) ALL BLACK AMERICAN with Caribbean sprinkles (PR, Jamaica, Bahamas, Babados, DR ect.) Im almost as old as hip hop, I was born in DR, raised in the states, lived in NY for a little bit, used to be a DJ as a teen and I’ve been a bilingual rapper ever since I can remember and in my opinion anyone who says that hip hop’s creation is only 50% black American ether doesn’t know what they’re talking about or has an agenda.
Hip Hop is based in call and response! this shit comes from the fields! It was used to ease the stress of the work. The military took this and made it into marching cadences! "can i get a amen" "say hiddy hiddy hoe" "The roof is on fire" "aaaaaa Yo" all of black music connects! Hip Hop goes back to the 40's! look it up! Cab Callaway would ryhme on the brake beats played by big bands! look it up! The Bronx popularized what we know as Hip Hop! But they didn't start it!
Sound to me American had a sound in its initial stages and Jamaicans came here and added a twist to it and together they both created hiphop. Lets celebrate our collaboration to strengthen our black race. ✌✌✌🇯🇲
@lovelinkmusicbratta8610... yes but it has to be understood worldwide... that the small amount of Caribbeans involved in early hiphop became totally AMERICANIZED FIRST!! After they became like us, then they made their contributions... in other words ..their contributions to early hiphop 1971 - 1977 had absolutely NOTHING to do with Jamaican culture or Caribbean culture
@@TheCulture..Starts1971 yes but it will be inaccurate to underscored Jamaican and Caribbean contribution because it's part of the history and it's facts. We are all from Africa first then we descend on different locations only to make different contributions in music. You don't hear the white man arguing about European taking credit for what they started, we as a people have to collaborate or else we could be enslave once again. Facts
@lovelinksmusicbratta8610... kool herc grandmaster flash made contributions to the beginning stages of hiphop ONLY AFTER THEY BECAME AMERICANIZED..they WAS NOT reppin their Caribbean style....1971 - 1977 there was no Jamaican/caribbean presence in hiphop in The Bronx jams/parties... all the pioneers will agree to that.... again..there WAS NO Jamaican/Caribbean contribution to the START of hiphop...however, the Jamaican/caribbean influences in hiphop came much later... the Jamaican/Caribbean contributions/influence came in hiphop thru krs one 1986 and others later
Even your FBA fairy godmother. F/inessed B/lack American founder admitted himself before the FBA grift that Hip hop was started by Kool Herc! This FBA's only contribution to hiphop th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
I'm FBA/ ADOS/Freedman on both sides of my family, but I have to say alot of that Jamaican music that the Jamaicans made from our music is amazing, I wouldn't try to say their music is stolen or some kind of rip off. It's their own thing and I respect it. The Jamaicans should respect us and our music and culture the same.
A white supremacist troll pretending to be black? That outdated tactic is so grey of beard livestock. Find your rotten mayo ass back to stormfront so quarrels between blacks will be determined between blacks.
@New Negroid breed Dominant Genetic Parent So its answer to minimal division in certain parts of a continent is to create even more division? Further proof that this is a trailer trash white supremacist troll that merely studied up on Tariq's xenophobic grift as no black American is this less learned coming with such a pathetic easily debunked whataboutism.
"African Americans" created the Hip Hop Culture point blank. Let's stop with this silly debate already. Yes those from the Caribbeans had a role in making it bigger.
DAMN BRUH .. AS A FBA FROM BROOKLYN … I BEEN HEARIN SHIT LIEK THAT FOREVER .. MOST PF MY FRIENDS ARE SPANISH OR FROM SOME TYPE OF CARIBBEAN ISLAND … ITS CRAZY TO FINALLY HEAR WHAT I BEEN SUSPECTING FOR YEARS …AUTOMATIC SUB
God Sun, THANK U!!!! I been seen the renditions of American music done over in all Caribbean music, from Calypso to Ska since I was a child back in 76, 77. Caribbean music had nothing and I do mean nothing to do with the formulation of hip-hop music or culture. I wasn’t even there When it started but it’s evident distinguishing the truth from bullsh@t. 2-GRANDIZA
I am Jamaican 58 born June 1964 Kingston Jamaica but let me educate you on something you have no idea about and want to make an input into it without knowledge.... This song that you are about to listen was done in Jamaica at Joe Gibbs recording studio 5 Retirement road Kingston 5 in July of 1979 the engineer was Errol Thompson.. i was in the fucking studio that day at the age of 15 then... Here is the song...th-cam.com/video/uHplHw-IG8s/w-d-xo.html.. This could actually be the first rap song ever done by and human being male or female on vinyl and it was done in Jamaica... Rappers delight by the sugar hill gang i don't know when it was actually recorded but it was released in September of 1979 one week before Xanadu and sweet lady rappers delight was released... why Joe Gibbs held back the song so long i have no idea. Engineer and producers are not with us anymore may their soul rest in peace...everybody can talk all the chit they want but these are raw facts and i bear witness...now this is were the debate can start... who and where exactly was the first rap song was ever done.. If sugar hill gang song was recorded before July of 1979 then they were first but if its after July 1979 that it was recorded then Xanadu and sweet lady was the first rap song ever make a note of it.....now take that and ride with it...i have the proof look at the label. and start your own research. get back to me.. By the way this rap hip hop song was done in April of 1979 on a reggae beat before recording it on a disco beat in July the same year the genre was actually called Reggae Disco Name of the song was rockers choice done by rap artist xanadu th-cam.com/video/FrJpw9Hs_DM/w-d-xo.html
I can guarantee you that before Herc came to "Foreign" in 1973 - he did not see any Selector or Sound systems in Jamaica using two turntables and a mic. The Concept of "toasting" by count matchuki - King Stitch and mostly Daddy U-Roy was to fill-up the space between when the "selector" either flipped over the vocal chune to play the instrumental - or to play another chune - because there was ONE TURNTABLE being used -so the "Toasters" would jump in to full up the dead space -so to speak. I came to "foreign" IN 1976 and selectors in BK/NY playing reggae were actually still using one turntable. What the yute said about Jamaican "toasters" being influenced by American disc Jocks is entirely true - but Jamaican "toasters" stylized the form and made it an art form - and IMHO inspired what eventually became rapping in Foreign - AKA Uncle Sam AKA USA
Peace. The first half of your comment is correct. The second half is incorrect. The culture exchange that did exist was much later 80s 90s - but “rap” was fully formed in US by the 1930s and earlier
I proved that 2 turn tables started in the 1950s in America...The problem is they were on radio not television...2 turn tables is older than people think...
There are evidence that African American DJs who made, started, and invented Hip Hop before herc the Jamaican. herc the Jamaican said he started Hip Hop in 1973. Hip Hop was started in the late 1960, 1970 by African Americans DJs like Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones, Kool DJ Dee, and Plummer.
Yes, Kool DJ Dee said he had his system which are two turntables before herc the fake Jamaican that said he started Hip Hop. herc copy Kool DJ Dee Two turntables system brand model.
Jamaicans did not do break dancing but we sure started toasting over the Mike at the dances and we did not use two turn tables ,we use to dance to American rhythm and blues and that's where our own music began
Since I got into this debate about the Hip Hop Origins. It's really made me start to listen to more Old School Reggae. ( I never listened To much JA music ) I let alot of great Reggae music pass me By. Especially the Dub It's way ahead of it's time. I can never listen to one genre of music. Sometimes it's Jazz sometimes Blues, sometimes the Funk sometimes Dance hall esp the Battles. Music Artist always listen to different sounds and you can hear those influences. This is what expands the music soundscapes
..... I have Two (2) Questions, 1.) how old was Kool Herc when he came to America? 2.) is There ANY video of Jamaicans in 1969 - 1975, in Jamaica, or Puerto Ricians, in P.R. Break Dancing, Playing with Two Turntables, or sporting any HIp Hop Gear? or show me a Bass Guitar in either location.....Please show it, and clear all this......or drop the B.S.
@@kwekuoboasi9352 He probably did. Our buddy Don McCall didn't believe that a lot of what Kool Dee is came from The Plummer as well as Pete DJ and Flowers. Hehehehe. The joke is on him!
DJ Grandmaster Flowers & Pete DJ Jones gets the credit for the beginning of Hip Hop. Enough said.... They both were using 2,3 or sometimes 4 turntables while Jamaican DJ's were using 1 turntable. Kool Herc was only using 1 turntable at the so called party that birthed hip hop. You can't extend the break with 1 turntable. When it comes to mathematics DJ Grandmaster Flowers is the Father of Hip Hop he was djing mid 60's blending and extending breaks. Pete DJ Jones came in 1970 doing the same. These are the 2 Brothers that all the djs were trying to be like. Rest In Power 2 both of them. If James Brown is Hip Hop which he is so is Flowers and Pete.
The name of every "Grandmaster" in Hip Hop was taken from Grandmaster Flowers. GM Flowers was before my time, but old head DJ's from my neighborhood said GM Flowers was the best DJ in NYC in the mid to late 60's and early 70's, possibly the whole country. As you said GM Flowers, Maboya, Pete DJ Jones set the tone for what Hip Hop eventually became. Let the elders speak and set the record straight once and for all.
@@Bronxbred Peace Brother nothing but the Truth. Much respect to Maboya too. Ive done gigs my self where I only played mainly late 50's, 60's and 70 music. Does that make me a Disco DJ lol no im a Hip Hop DJ. Its 2022 and the future generation like myself dont get mixed up in words We know what Hip Hop is regardless of what people want to call it. My Dads favorite group was Kool & The Gang. Is Kool & The Gang Hip Hop? Most definitely!
@@djbornpeaceallah7544 that was later, when they saw how big hip-hop was coming along. Watch the videos with Cholly Rock, one of the black spades. He talks about how Brooklyn was initially into hip-hop, they were on the club scene.
It’s not so strange all this confusion came about. Things weren’t properly documented by most. I remember having a conversation/ discussion about this with the Jungle Brothers. The things I said that day made Mike G upset, while Africa baby Bam agreed with me when I said that it’s important to know the history of Hip Hop. I’m from overseas and yes a Black man, but we were always aware this was and is fundamentally Black American (ADOS) culture. The impact ADOS had on the Black world, worldwide is vanguard!
Beautiful reporting. We are the Kings and Queens of Hip Hop. These code-switching jokers need to stop playing. There will be no brainwashing going on here. We got Receipts!
I think we need to start identifying all our contributions to our communities. Like skating movies in J.B. Skating or Chicago style Stepping, Dressing and tailor made suits . Etc
Interesting arguments. This stuff existed going back to KC Prince of Soul, among others. Grandmaster Flowers was using triple turntables. Thorens TD-125s and KC Rapped over his music.
The True Fathers of Hip Hop are Grandmaster DJ, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones, Kool DJ Dee these African American DJs Started, Invented the MERRY Go Round which is using two turntables playing the break beat, the GETDOWN PART, extending the break beat, playing the same copy of the same record on two turntables, Cueing, Mixing, blending, Scratching, Dropping the record needle on the record, choppinglike in the 1960s before DJ herc said he started in 1973.
dj herc the Jamaican is lying when he says he invented Hip Hop like playing the break beat, extending the break beat, playing the same record on two turntables. African American DJs such as Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones had Already Started, and Invented Hip Hop such as playing the break beat, extending the break beat, playing the same copy of the same record on two turntables, Cueing. Mixing Blending, Scratching, cutting, chopping, Dropping the record needle on the record, playing James Brown, the Bongo song, playing Funk Music, and playing Disco. These African American DJs were playing Hip Hop in the 1960s before DJ herc the Jamaican. DJ herc said he started Hip Hop in 1973 he was a Fifth Cent late of A Dollar Because Hip Hop was Started in 1960s.
I heard one of dj herc crew member on TH-cam said that he had to help DJ herc, the Jamaican figure out how to play the break beat, extend the break beat, play the same copy of the same record on two turntables so herc is lying when he says he started Hip Hop by himself inky, and nobody else.
yup, KC Prince Soul who was the MC for Grandmaster Flowers before he got with Pete Dj JOnes was rapping (syncopated to the beat) on the mic but his delivery/syncopation wasn't all the way locked in like we get with Dj Hollywood is the foundation that all the early hiphop MC's that considered themselves "bboys" got it from...this has been confirmed by both melle mel and caz, who cosider themselves as the first true "bboy" mc's
They too proud to say they were influenced by black americans. Jamaicans was not dressing like us either. Like i said show us what puerto ricans and jamaicans were partying like around the time we had soul train. That will give us a clear picture of where everybody was at around that time.
@@marshascott6107 Seeing Sugar Dap Willie as Lootin Lenny on Good Times rhyme was similar but doesn't count as witnessing the early days of hip hop You saw Muhammad Ali do something similar he was influential in Rap but he didn't create it.
Herc said himself he started DJ because he was a dancer first. And never went to a sound system in JA. Flash modified his cue system to work like more expensive ones at the time. He invented other things but NOT the cross fader - impossible. Jamaica got it from US radio. Herc, didn’t say he *extended* breaks. He skipped to the break, and brought on the next break before the end of the record. Disco wasn’t doing that either. It was Flash that extended breaks with two copies. But breaks- that type of records was being played before Herc. Some of the breaks were Latin records tho (if that matters) BBoying came out of the Black Spades “burning” competitive dance - but not down to the floor yet. (at least partly or mostly)
The Black radio djs that were playing with two turntable by rapping jive talking and ryhmaing, like Jack The Rapper Gibson give the brith of radio personality Jacko Henderson were rapping in rhythm and blues Daddy O rapping in jazz.
#BlackAmericans are the Original Creators of Hip~Hop & Break Dancing PeriodT❗️Other Cultures Are always trying to Claim #Black Americans creations! #Black Peoples are the Original #Black American Dawn Dadda’s😂!Black Americans Pioneered that *ish Respectfully! That’s not take Away from #Jamaica Beautiful Music or anyone else’s,We are all Family & welcome & accept everyone .Only if Some #African & #Jamacan’s also #Spanish people,would Accept us Black Americans! Truth be told it’s Not a well kept Secret anymore .The Jealousy & Envy towards BlackAmerica is unfair Biased & Racist based because of their Potential & being the Trend setters and Blue Print of the world ❗️Big Ups 👍The Culture channel #1✊🏽Thankyou 🥰 #One Love ✌🏽
Chuck D I can't believe you said that damn you had me fooled for years bozo am glad that some of these brothers are still around to tell the story other than these 1980s clowns that I thought was real shame on the ones that knows better but refused to speak up chuck D you lost my respect.
We should have maintained the historical knowledge of Hip Hop before the culture got exploited, corporatized and diluted! Now we are playing catch within our culture.
![CAMPปลิ้น | EP.83[2/2] ประสบการณ์ขนหัวลุกจากตำนานวงการผี!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/T_kFecQw7Ds/mqdefault.jpg)
Pete Rock had the nerve to say Jamaicans are responsible for 90% of Hip Hop....this is why I'm serious on making a real documentary on Hip Hop .The truth needs to be told......asap
2nd EZRA ..Word.. your right
It’s really not a debate!! Black American history is recorded/documented HEAVILY going all the way to the cotton club!! I’m just puzzled how people can lie about black American history
Do it 💪🏾
Pete Rock was right...doesn't matter Americans are the best at it...Its like basketball was invented by Canadians but Americans are the best...its ok
@@Rio-uv1gs Jamaicans didn't invent hip hop coconut
Busta said Jamaica was rapping over Reggae in the 60s & 70s but New Orleanian Louis Armstrong was rapping over Jazz in the 30s and 40s and its documented. People really like to leave New Orleanians and their Jazz creation out of it!!!
Facts
FACT! #StopTheSteal
When I grew up it was always said New Orleans was the root of Black music.
There was no reggae in the 60s.
Hip Hop lingo was greatly influenced by the Jazz era. Jazz terms such as Funky, Fresh, fly, Dope, Hip, The Bomb, Boogie, Cool, Chill, Crib, Down by law, Jam, etc were adopted by Hip Hop. Moreover, the break beats and soundscape of Hip Hop were greatly influenced by James Brown.
Those words came long before James Baldwin. The amazing Baldwin was recorded using those words but they were organically created by the youth of those times.
This is why we should have never let other cultures in our genre. The artist sold us out.
Yep, the artist did it
They pretended to be FBA in the beginning.
YES SER!!!!
@@lenaprice6239 💯💯💯
If you want the truth it's hip hop forgot itself and didn't keep the history and forgot during 90's early 2000
Nobody ever mention Coke La Rock the mc who started with Kool Herc. Coke La Rock is Black American who parents are from North Carolina
It’s many from North Carolina and South Carolina. Disco King Mario Born Edenton North Carolina. DJ Jazzy Jay from South Carolina,DJ Kool Dee from N.C. and even Fat Mike from the 1st Division of the Black Spades from North or South Carolina. Just to name a few
@@kwekuoboasi9352 I agree. Dj Hollywood and Melle Mel parents are from North Carolina. Pete Dj Jones is from North Carolina
@@bigolbabyhuey DJ Pete Jones
say down home is what they say if you from N.C.
@@kwekuoboasi9352 Yes when I heard Pete Jones speak, he had southern access when he speaks.
disco king mario was also from North Carolina
I am of Jamaican descent and i knew about this topic from the Mid 1990's biggup Foundational Americans i fight all truth with pure truth...One Love🇺🇸🇯🇲..
Robert Foster .. word thats whats up salute one love
One love
Thanks bro. We love yall and this sh17 is really troublesome, hurtful, disrespectful and revealing. We need more like yourself because what happens is... next they'll erase Jamaicans. This is how we got conquered in the first place. Being sold out by our own and now this next phase is not about slavery... its about EXTINCTION.
Buster knew better than to say stuff like he did when CERTAIN FOLKS WERE ALIVE. DMX would push back for real. TUPAC wasn't having it. BIGGIE is Jamaican and he wouldn't allow this either. This propaganda IS COMING FROM THE TOP... by top I mean from WHITES. This is deep brother. An extermination is coming and the targets are the people who fight white supremacy the most... AMERICAN BLACKS WHO DESCEND FROM AMERICAN SLAVES.
Peace
What are you actually confirming or denying?
You real for this one. Black Americans also started country 🎶 music
Charley Pride and Aaron Neville were few of the country greatest!
...and created square dancing 💃🏾
We started EVERY American 🇺🇸 music genre! Even “Punk Rock(black lady from Seattle💯).
@@magnumopus6742bullshit
This is why elders are so important.
This totally debunks what Busta Rhymes was saying ❤️🖤💚
@skyeyemedia5299He out here saying Latinos put him on
@skyeyemedia5299 Yep
I am african and we even know that RAP, Hip hop, funk , soul, jazz, blues, country, R&B music was created by blk americans FBA.
Much respect
Don't forget Salsa too
FBAs 100% created HIP-HIP - Period! All the POCs and minorities are liars and copycats!!!
We literally birthed Jamaicans musically and they have the nerve to say they created hip hop. What a joke!!!
word!! true
Literally its bananas
Well the joke continues as Herc wants to open a Hip Hop museum in Jamaica. Mind blown. 🤯
@@perfectbeat ITS literally A MUSEUM IN THE BRONX RIGHT NOW AND THEY ARE BUILDING A BIGGER ONE. CLOWN
Kool herc did make his contribution. You gotta give him his props
I agree with mostly everything but there is no such thing as being over confident. We are supposed to be confident in our country and Black Americans have always been some of the most welcoming inclusive people hence why other people feel comfortable jacking our culture.
That confidence is diminishing right before our eyes.
Ms Battle.. when i say overconfidence i mean arrogance... and arrogance and pride hasn't worked for us
True
I totally agree
Nope
African Americans were using two, and Three turntables in 1960 too.
We are not African
@@lurelover7065 Are you guys Chinese?
@New Negroid breed Dominant Genetic Parent Why does your DNA match with West Africans if you and your people are not African? Why is the only language you and your people know is English? Why the only religion you and your people know is Christianity?
Grand Master Flowers of Brooklyn, NYC used three turntables and opened up a show for James Brown.
@New Negroid breed Dominant Genetic Parent th-cam.com/video/_RyMz5gl-T8/w-d-xo.html
So he came to america, was assimilated into american culture, used the two turn tables and a mic setup already here from disco, used the speaker system we already were using for block parties, he watched the american dancers who been break dancing since the early 1900s at least, to see which part of the american music he was mixing got the strongest response from the american crowd to know which part of the american music to isolate and repeat. This is not creating this is participating and contributing.
Dude, what we were building bass horn speakers in Jamaica since the sixties. In fact, I was building and still build bass horn today. I learned that from rainbow sound owner, my uncle Desmond Patterson who started doing it in the South Bronx in the mid seventies, then moved to Lauderhill in eighties. if you doubt what I'm saying, then go see him over at Rainbow Variety store in Lauderhill, FL. On 21st and 441. He is in his seventies now, but he is still there. Let him educate you on what was going on in his South Bronx.
@@natural876 "Dude", I'm not sure what any of that has to do with my comment. Are you arguing that Jamaicans created hip hop and against my stance that Jamaicans participated and contributed to it?
That's like trying to claim the entire cookout because you brought a slammin potato salad. Yall contributed, and also took a lot of to-go plates home with you, it was our cookout though.
@@hunibuni that is your mischaracterization. Jamaicans aren't claiming that we created Hip-hop, instead we are advancing is that major elements of what is now hip-hop is influenced by Jamaican culture. We built the sound systems from the early sixties, because during that time transitor radios weren't wildly available during the time. Herc's father had a sound system in Jamaica in the sixties.
Furthermore, Jamaicans who know their history will readily tell you that Reggae, Rocksteady, Ska are children of the delta Blues. However, when we look at hip-hop, we see our culture and influence in it.
Hip-hop has five elements, and we see the toasting elements and the selector elements that been around from early sixties.
No one complained when Herc hid his Jamaican heritage in the seventies, eighties, and ninties. Now, that he has been open about it, now it a whole problem. indeed, Hip-hop is an American genre, no question, however she has Jamaican parents, and her parents themselves had American parents; the blues. At the end of the day, that is an all American story.
My suggestion for you is that you should do a deep dive and familiarize your with the Harlem Renaissance, so you understand that in a big way, Harlem was the mecca of the African diaspora. With African-Americans leading the diaspora, It is these cultural exchanges with varying Africoid nationalities, that brought fourth Reggae, R&B, Ska, Rocksteady, and mostly certainly My beloved Hip-hop.
I challenge you to go to the south Bronx, then listen to all the languages being spoken there. I think that will go far to inform your misunderstanding of the situation. Hip-hop wasn't created in a bubble. It even has German influences, such as a group way ahead of their time called Krafwerk.
th-cam.com/video/n4z5VmOIYu8/w-d-xo.html
@@natural876 No group of people is a monolith, so of course not all Jamaicans are making false claims. But the claim was made, and it was co-signed enough to be problematic. You're also making a lot of problematic statements as well.
You know how martial arts such as taekwando, kung fu, karate, etc are part of Asian culture though they have participants and modern contributors of various races and nationalities, yet no one tries to remove these things from being acknowledged as Asian culture.
But when it comes to the cultural contributions of melanated americans, there is a double standard and an unspoken understanding that it's ok to turn participation and even emulation into ownership when it comes to melanated american culture.
In light of this disrespect, melanated americans have collected evidence that the elements that make up hip hop have been apart of melanated american culture in various forms all over the US colony long before hiphop was coined as a genre in NYC.
Remember that the majority of the melanated american people living in NY (and many other northern states) migrated there from the south and they brought the culture they already had there where it continued to evolve and be condensed into a specific genre.
Other ethnic groups began to join in and participate and assimilate themselves into the melanated american culture that was already happening. There are so many quotes from them both Jamaicans and Latino early participants in hiphop that admit this. They admit it was already a thing and they joined in. You can't own something that you joined in or emulated.
When it comes to the electronic aspect. It's like saying that music genre's belong to the people who create or first popularize the instruments, So by your logic, jazz can't be a melanated american cultural creation because some other group invented and popularized saxophones, trumpets, etc first.
Almost all genre's went electronic around the early 70's, and new genres were created. The inventors of those instruments and the people who popularized them have an influence but can't take ownership of genres that already existed and simply modernized with the technology that became available. Nor can those people claim every new genre that get's created with those same instruments.
I don't identify as "africoid" either, We are americans here. And there is at least one quote from colonial explorers that described our people here as lyrically talented (rapping) when the Europeans first got here.
A lot of these melanated american tribes were sent to islands like Jamaica as prisoners of war, so deep down a lot of mainland folks and people in the Caribbean are distant relatives and would share a cultural root
However we have evidence through quotes from Jamaican artists themselves that they took inspiration and even directly emulated what was going on, on the mainland, from our indigenous american musical arts like spirituals, work songs, jazz, blues, rock and roll, country, funk, soul, r&b and hip hop, you get most of the Jamaican genres and even Afrobeat whose parents are both american and jamaican genres. Krautrock is a derivative of funk. The earliest work of Kraftwerk didn't sound anything like hip hop. The later work that melanated americans gravitated to sounds like funk played completely on synths and that's why it was described as funky. They clearly were inspired by funk first.
We can prove the source of inspiration and are not going to give credit away that is not due. We're coming with receipts.
A whole playlist of receipts which address the mainland american origins of most of the aspects of hip hop that Jamaicans try to claim they originated or contributed to hip hop when it was mostly assimilation and participation.
th-cam.com/play/PLIMTq-a_p6qJ4gOGiPoNC31x46qqy1TWO.html
We give yall your flowers for the genuine, quality participation and also the fresh derivative flavors yall came up with by taking what we were doing and changing it up into your own thing. We like how yall spice things up in your own way, but it's our cookout. You brought some seasonings and some potato salad you made with our recipe to begin with.
If you love our culture just say that. I can say that I love Jamaican culture without any issue and without needing to take ownership of it that isn't backed up by any evidence. Yall should be able to do the same.
A lot of Jamaican people contribute to american culture but they are mostly assimilating while doing it. They aren't bringing in culture that is unique to Jamaica.
If you listen to Busta Rymes early music it was all NE boom bap style. We don't have a problem with any one expressing their heritage, but most Jamaicans assimilated to american culture so those contributions don't make it some kind of fusion.
If I go to Japan and train to play koto and I become a master at playing traditional Japanese koto it doesn't become american influence, it's just american participation and assimilation and Koto doesn't magically morph into something that is both Japanese and American, it's still just Japanese.
Billy Blanks made Tae Bo, which is influenced by Asian martial arts, guess what he didn't do? He didn't try to claim any ownership, or influence on martial arts, he gracefully borrowed elements from it without trying to claim what he borrowed for himself. That's the difference between cultural appreciation and cultural appropriation.
We also have appreciation for when Jamaicans did bring their unique culture to the picture, through collaborations and dances. All through the 90's there were Jamaican features in patois on songs and dancehall tracks played on our radio stations. (those individual songs are fusions not the entire genre)
Yet Busta Rymes still had the nerve to say it was Latinos that made him proud enough to come out and show his heritage. It's ridiculous honestly. If I were Jamaican I would have taken offense to the fact that he said he needed a Latino to make him feel proud of his culture. He totally dogged us out and bit the hand that has fed him.
I wanted to write him and Fat Joe's stupid statements off as divide and conquer propaganda but then the internet revealed how many actual Jamaicans and Latinos actually believed they had some ownership claim to our culture. It was shocking really.
But digging into the actual receipts has been quite refreshing and we still turned around and told Jamaicans to gate keep their culture as well because a lot of Africans were trying to claim Afrobeats as the parent of dancehall when it's the other way around. There is a push to replace the collabs we saw in the 90's with Jamaican and American artists with Afrobeats and personally I don't think that's a good thing.
At the end of the day mainland and caribbean people are all continental americans by virtue of being of the americas. We should certainly reach an understanding, respect and unification.
We create genre’s of music n culture and this was “Made in America” from black kids give them their props!!!!!!!!!
Blacks, Puerto Ricans and Caribbean Americans. Yes give us our props out here in the Bronx NY.
@@JoseBXNY they weren't needed.
@@jayjones251 it's not a case of needing, without either of those 3, hip hop would never be. It's a Bronx NY street culture
It's sad we have to fight for stuff we invented.
Herc owes it to the culture to set the record straight. He won't lose his place in the culture or the history in doing so.
No one objected to Herc claim until they found out that he was Jamaican. During his time, Jamaicans like my brother, Melton Bowen, who actually invented the gloves used in MMA were ashamed to claim Jamaican parentage. As his younger ruder brother, I was unapologetic about my Jamaican culture. I wore mess shirt and Rasta belts, because my culture had value.Herc, was a person more of my brother's time unfortunately, denied being Jamaican and ashamed. Americans didn't start discrediting him until the day that he met up with Daddy Uroy, one of the first toasters in B side music, to which Hip-hop is a member
I disagree its wasn't a problem til Busta Rhymes sounded off on FBA Talking and saying with arrogance to the new generation that" Hip Hop started From a Jamaican Nigga" and Americans don't have Culture. That was some divided bs he was talking.I no longer respect him in Hip Hop but as a Hebrew brother I Love Him.@@natural876
He's already on documented footage with him saying it, but I do agree he needs to come out now and confirm what he already stated
Why is it so important to say that Jamaican created it, why you won't say a black man made. That's why now on fba going to say they made it, they going for now on we going say FBA now on , how you like that.¹
He ran with the lies too long. He will be exposed
We are the greatest black ethnic group ever
sadatkb... thats that OVERCONFIDENCE/ARROGANCE i spoke about brother... even if we feel like that... instead of just saying it... lets put that feeling to some greatest ever ACTION!! let our actions show how great we are!!
Please Believe It!!!!
@@TheCulture..Starts1971 but the Jamaican say that all the time do you tell them the same thing
@@Loveamericasave lol Zulus too!
@@Loveamericasave exactly every group look down on us anyway why not be extra confident
I don't get this whole debate. Herc denied outrightly in the early 80s the link between the birth of Hip Hop and Jamaican music and especially Toasting being the inspiration for Rap. I don't know if any of you guys know what actual Toasting from the early 70s and late 60s sounded like. Nothing like Rap or spoken word or rhymes. Something that was already done by African-Americans in the the same timeframe. That's why Herc said that the inspiration for Rap were James Brown and Jalal from the Last Poets especially his album Hustlers Convention.
I am Jamaican 58 born June 1964 Kingston Jamaica but let me educate you on something you have no idea about and want to make an input into it without knowledge.... This song that you are about to listen was done in Jamaica at Joe Gibbs recording studio 5 Retirement road Kingston 5 in July of 1979 the engineer was Errol Thompson.. i was in the fucking studio that day at the age of 15 then... Here is the song...th-cam.com/video/uHplHw-IG8s/w-d-xo.html.. This could actually be the first rap song ever done by and human being male or female on vinyl and it was done in Jamaica... Rappers delight by the sugar hill gang i don't know when it was actually recorded but it was released in September of 1979 one week before Xanadu and sweet lady rappers delight was released... why Joe Gibbs held back the song so long i have no idea. Engineer and producers are not with us anymore may their soul rest in peace...everybody can talk all the chit they want but these are raw facts and i bear witness...now this is were the debate can start... who and where exactly was the first rap song was ever done.. If sugar hill gang song was recorded before July of 1979 then they were first but if its after July 1979 that it was recorded then Xanadu and sweet lady was the first rap song ever make a note of it.....now take that and ride with it...i have the proof look at the label. and start your own research. get back to me.. By the way this rap hip hop song was done in April of 1979 on a reggae beat before recording it on a disco beat in July the same year the genre was actually called Reggae Disco Name of the song was rockers choice done by rap artist xanadu th-cam.com/video/FrJpw9Hs_DM/w-d-xo.html
FBAs were doing break dancing in the 1880s, 1920s (Rap/Hip-Hop) - to the present.
Jamaican Sound systems rarely had two decks. They rocked with one. They had the Selecta who chose the tunes, the Soundman who kept the frequencies in check and sometimes ( not always ) the ' DJ ' who would shout out his Sound. Hip- Hop is an African American invention.
FACT!!!
We're not Africans though.
@@hunibuni
Who's not African ?
@@wnnfrhrw4452 we aren’t African.. we are black Americans
@@charleeshaw7423
Your person may not be Afrikan. Yet my person's Ancestors definitely are Afrikan.
BRING THE PEOPLE WHO WERE THERE TOGETHER SO THE TURTH CAN BE TOLD !!!! BEFORE THEY ARE NO LONGER HERE TO GET THE TRUTH OUT .
Joe Goodson word!! true!!
That’s what they want…just like the Tulsa massacre. If everyone is dead then they can create what ever historical fact they want. FBA started hip hop culture!!! Everyone else copied and eventually added their own flavor. Give props where it’s due
TRUUUUUUTH!!..THAT'S WHERE ALL THE QUESTIONS WILL BE ANSWERED!🧢
💥👊😠👍💯
Now if these were dudes from Kansas or New Mexico saying that Bam and Herc were lying i wouldn't take them seriously. But these are Black Spade OGs saying these things. These guys know Herc, and, Bam personally. Bam was a member of the same Black Spades gang as these guys in the video this is straight from people who were apart of the foundation of Hip-Hop Culture and I believe them.
Bam was in the Jr baby black spades, third generation
My brothers are saying the copy, cut, paste, and edit Hip Hop music/culture. My brother and I are from the Hip Hop era; we lived in South Bronx. We lived Hip Hop before it was called Hip Hop.
It’s a black thang family, I love my Jamaican family just as much as I love my American family. I just love being unapologetically black family ✊🏿✊🏿✊🏿
IM AM SO PROUD OF YOU FOR PUTTING THE TRUTH OUT...FBA ALL DAY
This is when FBA hiphop started th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
Even Clarence Thomas too
@@abrahambowen8332 What does Clarence Thomas have to do with this?
@@headcougarincharge9027 Because you stereotype other groups on this thread and act like that unlike every group in the world the FBA doesn't share of jerks who can go against their own people
The point that I'm making is he us an FBA knows FBA music and culture too but that doesn't make him a good person just because he's an FBA.
@@headcougarincharge9027 Also Jimmy Walker is an FBA who occasionally rhymed on Good Times.
His family is from Alabama which I know you all love.
He grew up in the South Bronx and occasionally rhymed on Good Times and some would rather give credit to him fir playing a role in starting Rap I stead of just being more nuanced in admitting that Kool Herc is not responsible for the existence of hip hop but he played a role in contributing to it's development because he's not an FBA
Thanks for jumping on this. I commented on the original video. As soon as Chuck said his parents moved to Long Island in 1969, that disqualified anything he has to say about Hip Hop history. In my observation/ opinion , this is what happened- The false Herc, Bam and Flash Trinity story was spearheaded and carried around the world by 1-3 early KRS One records and KRS One’s 30 year college lecture career. That’s what created the issue. It kinda became the agreed upon lie because KRS is a top Ten MC and that was the first time the world heard a story of actual Hip Hop history. Then to further the lie, Bam had a global army ( Zulu Nation) that enforced that false Trinity also.
KRS tried that at Ohio State back in 93. We booed that nigga so loud he knew to retract that shit quick! Even before there was an FBA talking point.
PIN THIS COMMENT
Follow the money, because they are getting the bag!
Here is a TRUE history lesson of the origin of hip hop.
"Kool Herc went on Maury Polvich show to take a lie detector test' and the test results came back "YOU ARE NOT THE FATHER"
it is very clear hip hop and rap music is African Americans culture and music created and originated by African Americans not carribeans or kool herc. he moved to america at age 12 in 1967. around the time hip hop was bubbling up. you telling me he brought hip hop culture or music with him. Herc didn't create or originate nothing in hip hop including extending / juggling, looping break beats or the merry go round the made up name he created for it. he leaarned all of that from african american DJ's. he just wants to be in the history books. he used to tell the truth early on. He said he used to attend disco parties and the djs were playing break beats while the people there were breakin and yes that was the term used in 1970 for break dancing. being done before herc. he wasnt the first to do anything in hip hop including his merry go round technique. Disco DJ's at disco clubs and parties would extend the breakdown of records for as long as 20 minutes at times to get the kids to get funky or break dance. That is what break dance means to dance on the breakdowns, DJ's would loop the break from turntable to turntable while the kids got funky on the dance floor break dancing. soul train was started in the late 60s in chicago as traveling record hops by Don Cornelius, where he traveled around to different venues putting on his dance record hops. the show went live on tv in 1970 were young kids dance to the latest funk soul rnb music. the soul train line literally was the DJ playing extended beats of records while the soul train dancers would do the latest dance crazes like poppin pop lockin robot breakin and hundreds more dance crazes. that was watched by millions. this was the early foundation of hip hop which included james brown who used to dance to extended breakdowns of the beat for as long as 30 minutes in his shows. Some may say pigmeat markums here comes the judge, is not a hip hop record but it has every element and the black spades and others around those neighborhoods who are the real founders of pretty much every element of hip hop culture said that is who they were copying when they would battle snap (rap) to music at block parties and just on the street corners in the neighborhood. block parties, toasting, sound systems, rapping, breakin, graffiti, and every other element of hip hop was created and influenced here in America by African American's. Not the Caribbeans. U-roy and other Jamaican Artists and toasters said they got their music culture from our music and DJ's so how could they have originated it. in fact, ska, rocksteady, and reggae music was directly inspired by African American music and culture. Many of the early pioneers of ska and rock steady which became reggae music said they were copying and inspired by African American music, and culture. FBA (Foundational Black Americans) originated and created hip hop period. not kool herc or carribeans. Herc did not create the extended breakbeat. So that is out. he didnt create the merry go round technique, he just put a name to what he was copying. African Americans created most of the worlds most popular music genras and subcultures. that is a fact. so stop with the ambiguity and if you are trying to truly get to the truth, then tell the truth and stop leaving it open for interpretation. African Americans created hip hop and rap period. Rap literally goes all the way back to slavery in the usa. kool herc and other carribeans here contributed and participated like the rest of the early pioneers. but they didnt start nothing accept maybe grandmaster flash with some of his techinlogical inventions and theories around turntabalism, but that is not the creation of turntabalism, deejaying or hip hop, but an elevation. a contribution of one element of the art form.
if Jamaicans were listening to African Americans DJ's (Deejays) and were inspired to copy it, they couldn't have done it first, thus they didn't create it. dancehall which started in the late 70s was a speed up more rhythmic reggae inspired music form which was inspired by ska, which was literally inspired by African American music and DJs. see how the ball goes around. you people at this point ( And I'm talking to some of the people in your comments and just in general about these debates and responding to some of the statements you made in your videos), are down right disrespecting African Americans and their long and arduous creation of the culture. let me again explain it to yah, in my fake Jamaican accent. i love my Jamaica seestas and brudas but this gotta stop.
The rhythmic rhyming of vocals of African American toasting (Jive Talking) influenced the development of toasting in Jamaica and development of the dancehall style
In the late 1950s deejay toasting (In Jamaica) was developed by Count Matchuki. He conceived the idea from listening to disc jockeys on American radio stations. He would do African American jive over the music while selecting and playing R&B music. Deejays like Count Machuki working for producers would play the latest hits on traveling sound systems (African American inspired mobile Dj systems) at parties and add their toasts or vocals to the music. These toasts consisted of comedy, boastful commentaries, half-sung rhymes, rhythmic chants, squeals, screams and rhymed storytelling, which was inspired by African American minstral shows and stage shows (Of course they added their own flare making it their own style) but that's my point. Creativity comes from inspiration. They were inspired by African American Deejaying and Music Culture but they then made it their own. That's like how everything else is created
Later in the 1960s toasting deejays included U-Roy and Dennis Alcapone, the latter known for mixing gangster talk with humor in his toasting. In the early 1970s, toasting deejays included I-Roy (his nickname is in homage to U-Roy) and Dillinger, the latter known for his humorous toasting style. In the early 1970s Big Youth became popular. In the late 1970s, Trinity followed and they all said they were inspired by and emulating African American music and culture with their own flair.
This all comes back around full circle to African American Culture and music. Not saying we created everything but out of shear necessity we created our own cultures and music, as well as many other American traditions. sometimes we get credit for it but in the broader scheme of things it is hidden from American society and thus hidden from the world as a form of deliberate oppression and deliberate cultural appropriation. This goes on a lot. We don't get the credit for a lot of our contributions to the world. and really it's by design. These historians know the truth about it but African Americans are discredited in place of other people.
This has to stop. Go read a book on the inventions and innovations that African Americans have contributed to the world and you will literally be shocked beyond belief.
how can you be the root of hip hop music when hip hop music is literally African American music. disco, r&b ,funk ,jazz, and anything else you wanna mix in there that we created. Herc already said it was alread bubbling up and he was inspired by other DJ's and what he was hearing and seeing. if he wasnt the first to juggle break beats, didnt create or the music that was inspiring it, he wasnt the first throwing parties in the park. wasnt the first throwing house partys, how could he have invented it. This is a stupid argument. he came over here and seen African Americans are lit. and got inspired like everyone else in the world. hes not the creator. one of the early pioneers yes. creator no.
Herc literally does not even know how to dj. Look at what he is doing in his video explaining the merry go round technique which is just beat juggling and looping or extending the beat. It literally does not match up to how cross fading works. He is a huge fraud and liar. That is why you see no video of him dj'ing and your telling me this guy created extended break beat juggling and looping and hip hop. This is blasphemy in its highest form and literally the text book definition of cultural appropriation, and it is being deliberately and blindly spread around the world, stealing the real credit from the real African American pioneers and creators.
Pete DJ Jones and DJ Flowers were some of the first to isolate the instrument break beat and extend and loop it, The get down. And that was influenced by James Brown shouting out get down and him dancing to the breakdowns and getting funky. That was the first DJ'S doing what Kool Herc named his merry go round technique. He didnt create it.
Rappers Delight literally copied that song by the Jubilaires' in this video Go Listen To Rappers Delight' it Sounds Just Like the jubilairs rapping in the 40s. They just changed the words' it is the same exact cadence' That cadence is the exact cadence and rapping flow of all hip hop in the 70s and 80s the foundation of hip hop' the black spades the true founders of hip hop culture said they were mimicking them and Pigmeat Markum during their snap battles which is basically battle rapping or cracking on each other over a beat and sometimes without a beat' So No! Kool Herc or Caribbeans did not create or inspire hip hop. It was actually the other way around. African American culture and music inspired Carribean culture. Was he and other Caribbeans early contributors and pioneers, yes. They contributed, but founding fathers no.
This is when FBA hiphop started th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
Fam. You dropped a book.
@@MrManZ same thing I was thinking,lol
I must say I am very impressed with your breakdown of the topic, and your ability to support your argument using historical reference points.
I have watched several of Mr. Michael Wayne's videos on TH-cam and your views appear to correlate with a litany of interviews he conducted.
Bullshit.
African American started HIP hop! Period!
Foundational black ⚫ Americans. When you say African Americans you open the door for every race including white. 🙄 Knowledge shared from brother Tariq Nasheed Aka Flex.
@@MichaelJordan-gj1uo thats convienient...you get to say you are foundational, but show no evidence that you are in actual fact at the foundations...now you claiming to be some fckin red indians...
@@MichaelJordan-gj1uoF him.
He ain't nobody's teacher. He lust after non black women. I saw of him somewhere makin googly eyes at them foreign women, telling black men to come to where he was at.
F ttariq Tyrone the frayd
2022...and still relishing in the truth. FBA are the creators of hip hop music and culture. Anybody who was a coherent child ANYWHERE ON EARTH in the 70s of 80s knows this.
Might be time to do a Documentary on Hip Hop to set the record straight....I'm willing to help.
TARIQ ALREADY ON IT!!
Tariq Nasheed is about to kick it off
@Derik Hillman Such a spicy “retort”. Why it have to be a 🍆 reference... I’m choosing peace so I’ll reserve the fk you for the enemy. I admire your passion on this topic and we share the same view. I would challenge you to a dance or rap battle but the world and these joints ain’t ready sun.
@@evisceratorxxx7961 oh....that grifter..why he call himself tariq if he is so foundational? he a clown
Chuck D. Was just mixing truth with fantasy
And he still believes this cause he just put up a post last month putting people down who doesn’t agree hip hop came from West Indians
It kills me how they just put all West Indians into the category of what Jamaicans did. The other islands didn’t have a dj culture
There are some other Caribbean people saying that Caribbean people started Hip Hop which is a lie but yes there are so many different people from the Caribbeans.
The True Fathers of Hip Hop are Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones, and Kool DJ Dee herc copy from these African American DJs.
An African American DJ WIZZARD THEODORE INVENTED SCRATCHING THATIs a big, Large part of Hop.
herc the Jamaican and other DJs copy from the The True Fathers of Hip Hop which are Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco, Pete DJ Jones, Kool DJ Dee, and Plummer so of these African American DJs were making the beginning of Hip Hop in 1960s.
Yes, he does NOT know everything about HIP HOP.
As a born Jamerican i came to the Bronx in 1972 at the age of 8 1/2 yrs old. I first became familiar with the history of hip hop via breakdancing in 1976. Graffiti was all around us before that so that was the first element of hip hop, but we didn't have elements or even the name hip hop back then. Then I became familiar with the DJ in 1977 and " Dance To The Drummer's Beat " and " Jam On The Groove" were two of the first breaks i can remember. DJ Breakout was one of the first DJs I knew about, because he was from my area and his boy Richie Tee used to live on my block ( 216th near Laconia).But by word of mouth we heard about Kool Herc and Flash. No real MCs were out then, they were more like crowd motivators, not rappers. Soon after in my area of the Bronx "rappers " like Timmy Hall and Eddie Cheeba were the known names. Besides H.S jams and park jams at P.S 78 or Haffen Park aka Valley Park, there was the Stardust Ballroom on Boston Rd. ( which i couldn't afford although they were like $7.00-$10.00 to get in sometimes you'll get a discount if you brought the flyer or get there before 10pm.). As a young man from Jamaican culture ( actually born in England to Jamaican parents, lived in Jamaica from 5 1/2 to 8 1/2 then grew up in the Bronx ) I can 100% tell you. This whole hip hop culture was created and invented by BLACK AMERICANS POINT BLANK. NOW....West Indians and Puerto Ricans immersed themselves into the culture. The area of the Bronx I grew up in was populated with Jamaicans and some Puerto Ricans. We all grew up doing the same things. Playing street games, sports and of course when breaking and DJing came in some got involved in that. But JAMAICANS and PUERTO RICANS did not invent or create hip hop as we know it to be. And to keep it SUPER 100....Jamaicans immersed in the culture didn't even want ppl to know you were Jamaican, you tried to camouflage your accent and you dressed and carried yourself like a " yankee" aka American. Now you had Jamaicans who had NO INTEREST in this culture and proudly wore their " highwater" pants with their Clark " boots", diamond socks, rag hanging out their back pocket, long belts mostly the red yellow and green type, kangol or " tams," headwear and natty hair ( uncombed afro). But you can be sure 90% of these dudes had a ratchet ( knife) on them. Some of them were rude bwoys and others just didn't, couldn't or wouldn't assimilate to the American culture. One thing i always remembered as a child is when an American hit song was made, a Jamaican ALWAYS copied that song. My sister and I HATED that. " Why Jamaicans always copying songs?" we used to say. Somebody told me it was because Jamaicans like the song , but you cant dance to the American rhythm so we have to put a Jamaican beat to dance to it. To me it was still thievery and I used to say " just dance the American way to the original" 😂. But that's MY personal history growing up a Jamerican in the Bronx. Just wanted to add to this very good documentary. We need all elders to speak the truth about this history which is true AMERICAN HISTORY. No shame in the truth.
Thanks for speaking the truth....I'm an elder also and everything you said is true......we never had a problem with Jamaicans back then making a Jamaican version of our songs,I was a DJ and played some of those songs.once again thanks for speaking the truth
@@lflash204 No doubt. We need to share our history and let the story be told from those of us who were there. The truth never lied.
🤦🏾♂️ Chuck D. is giving away culture, he's lost several points with me because of this interview.
I've written him off completely.
He’s from Long Island. What does he know
Homie dropped knowledge on this video.
Very well put together. Keep ‘em coming
Chuck D co-signed a White woman being in charge of the Hip Hop museum.
Rap is music, Hip-Hop is a subculture. Rap started in the South, Hip-Hop started in New York. Rap is sometimes called Hip-Hop because it's the music of Hip-Hop.
Both are EXCLUSIVELY Foundational Black American creations. 🇺🇸✊🏾🇺🇸✊🏽🇺🇸✊🏿
Really smh
Stop watching hustle and flow
@@ujimmamorgan4313 Obvious immigrant babble, if you had roots generations deep in American soil you'd know that.
@@awesomeasever8370 you should be ashamed of yourself ... ADOS romance in your brain. The world is bigger than America we come from the same place.Wake up from your pity party 🎉
@@ujimmamorgan4313 You don't know or understand Black American culture because you aren't Black American.
I cannot believe they are hijacking our ancestor's culture and music.
you are full of sh't..hiphop is based on hijacking and sampling music from everywhere...you sample reggea rock funk disco indian ragas aqnd pop music from england..stop this bullsh't...
Chuck D. You are right African Americans started Hip Hop not caribbean people.
All you gotta do is look at Black tv shows (Good Times) and Black movies from the 70s. NOTHING was Caribbean or Latin in Black Music or culture. EVERYTHING was Black Music (Disco, Funk). No Black Americans were listening or partying to Caribbean or Latin Music
I admit that I thought that Jamaicans started hip hop. Watched Tariq, Dwann B and other videos and did my own research, found out that Black people started hip hop. I'm 56 and I wished I've learned this earlier. Also, on the Jamaican side, learned about how Ska started out, Jamaican sound systems and other stuff. And that was amazing. Lately I've been learning more about Black music, I just found out about Ragtime music being Black. That was shocking. Looks like I got some "Catching up to do."
Ska came from rhythm and blues
keep studying, it's never too late. what you learn, you will be able to teach others.
Ragtime (early jazz) was invented in New Orleans by Black Americans.
You too old not to know this smh
@@sleepyccs Was it by Scott Joplin in Sedalia, Missouri somewhere in 1898.
It's sad that Chuck D who many people give him credit for being an intellectual and a leader, doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. He's talking like he has fact behind what's he saying but he's speaking only from misguided thoughts or stories from people he believed knew facts. He and those people were wrong lol. Chuck stop being so quick to give away the credit for Hip Hop origins to people who don't know shit about Hip Hop. Jamaican culture is their's alone so let the real NYC kids who started Hip Hop have their credit for what they started by themselves ! Black American kids from NYC started HIP HOP not Caribbeans
FACT! #StopTheSteal
They are all on code with the same bullshit. Its an agenda to steal the legacy of hip hop from black americans.
Dang this video aged very well with what's going on now. I'm sick of us having to defend our culture to others. Especially being that they already have their own culture. Make that make sense
#EXACTLY
I’m from that era and the Jamaican and Latins really just followed us in everything.
We always find some sh💩t to argue about. I'm from Jamaica. Let's get on code...🤒
Where were you in the 70s
@@abrahambowen8332 Brooklyn
@@t.r.stephens7547 Yeah your soundtrack in the early 70s was probably the music on the Crooklyn soundtrack good music but still not hip hop
@@t.r.stephens7547 Yep but still not old enough to remember the Brooklyn Dodgers or Little Anthony' and the Imperials lol.
Kool Herc, Grandmaster Flash, and Bambatta need to be made to set the record straight so that liars like Pete Rock, Busta Rhymes, DJ Evil Dee, and other bs Jamaican artist are made to recant every lie that has been told by them to give credit to the black American.
Herc has told the truth but the rest don't want to hear it!
@@FBA_God_Emperor_Doom Explain Bruv ....How you mean ?
And most of all KRS One who started these lies off 1-3 of his early songs and his 30 year college lecture career. Smdh
Obviously Herc said before he letf Jaminca he hear scat singing before reggae was popping off...
@@FBA_God_Emperor_Doom FACTS, there's a clip on this very channel where Herc states he came and "added on to what was already being done". There's no clip of Herc saying "I invented Hip Hop and here's how I do it" yet the lie continues to be told.
The key word is the fact that Kool herc was "catering" to a culture that already existed not the other way around. Kook herc did not invent the fire, he just used a match to lite up one.
The so-called character name "Kool Herc" was a copycat like the PRs and Jamaicans!
Well Kool Herc needs to come out and say it so these Caribbean’s can stop lying but I doubt he will because he now has this big ego boost on his shoulder for being the so-called godfather of hip hop 💯
That’ll nevertheless happen careers have been built off this lots of money been made and I think it will get deeper into the Buisness of music if people start to open up the books. Don’t hold ya breath on it
Even your FBA fairy godmother. F/inessed B/lack American founder admitted himself before the FBA grift that Hip hop was started by Kool Herc! This FBA's only contribution to hiphop th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
FBA greatness😍😍. So many wanna be's.
Delusional here though 🇯🇲 got its world wide vibration not by imitation
Jamaicans have always tailored their music from black American culture just like everybody else!
I looked it up, and it's true that Herc wants to build a Hip Hop museum in Jamaica. Wow 🤯
"Herc said it was time for Jamaica to take Hip Hop back while condemning
the continuing trend of mainstream music stealing from Jamaican culture." 🤯
Good luck, he's just looking for a cash grab. Meanwhile they giving a White group a Grammy for REGGAE
Why is that wrong? Mainstream media DOEs so that. Are you trying to say mainstream media is soley black America? What about white America? You know...the majority of the country.
Hip hop didn't come from Jamaica, so Jamaica can't take back what isn't theirs.
He got straightened out real quick. He is not building one because he claims it too controversial all of a sudden. We made his ass back down
@@Jtve737 Yeah but you can't take away his contributions to hip hop.
The break started from a experiment from viewing Disco DJs extend the break before the 12in single was created.
Toasting comes from 'toast-telling' in Black American folkloric tradition and dates back to the 30s. Toast-telling was a widespread practice for Black Americans from New York, to Philadelphia, Texas, to LA. It's documented in a book called 'Get Your Ass in the Water and Swim Like Me' originally published in 1974.
NO Jamaicans or Latin people were acting like Black Americans. Rap is NOT in Jamaican or Latin culture from the 70s
I don’t totally believe we were so arrogant that others want revenge. I think they don’t want us to be confident because they’re working for WS because everybody know ADOS is the strongest blacks in the diaspora who can change the world.
Who is "we"? You have foreign blood.
@@walteralexander689
Huh?
@@ray1411 FBAs don't have Panamanian fathers.
Very Well Stated
I'm a born Jamaican/American citizen. I'm glad you made this a conversation. Because growing up in New York in the early 70's. Watching the Black Americans on Soul Train and then hearing how hip hop music was formed and getting popular. I grew up watching this music take its shape. I even started a Dance group in the early 80s. I worked with Chuck D. back in the day when he was with Spectrum. I saw his talent big time. Facts or Facts. My Dad would always play back then a lot of Motown and then a lot of the reggae that was coming up. He was really into his music. Inspired me completely. I've become a recording artist myself.
Lock In rude boy..
#GarfieldGunner #PARADISE
@Garfield Harrison My Man!!!! This topic has me trippin'!!!
What you said reminds me that there is nothing but LOVE between us ( FBA and Jamaicans ) and we are Family Period.
The enemy always tries TO DIVIDE US!!!Fat Joe, I mean the Devil's job is to keep a riff between us. I will not be poisoned by an outsider whose family wiggled their way into this country thinking that light skin would help them move up and be readily accepted by White America. Since Joe nem see that whites ain't stuttin them, they're trying to fake unite with us and trying to separate us from our Jamaican cousins. NO WEAPON FORMED AGAINST US SHALL PROSPER. We're too Black / too Strong
I'm confused because before rap existed it was called "The Dozens." Dolemite was rapping in his movies and Black-Americans we're using The Dozen in TV shows like the Jeffersons when Helen and George would snap on each other.
Good piece of history here.
American Freedmen lead the Diaspora. Too many of us don't know it and we keep spreading love and giving credit to flat blackness. Thanks to those of us who know we are unique in the struggle.
It seems everybody wants to claim Hip-hop. That includes the house and techno ( read: dance music people)....they claim that Kraftwerk "invented" hip-hop. We all know better than that. Lol
The Latinos claim they " invented" hip-hop. Sure there some Latinos involved in hip-hop's genesis such as DJ Tex- Hollywood and Disco Wiz and DJ Junebug and of course the Jamaican's
None of these people invented hip-hop. Kool Herc, Kool Dee, Grandmaster Flowers and Disco King Mario invented hip-hop. Point Blank!
Hip-hop won out over all other forms of culture because it had that very powerful core of African- Americans pushing it. House and techno used to have that backing but they decided to go European and they lost.
Latinos created nothing in hip hop.
Nobody was involved in the beginning, fog it was all us, them others cane in the mid 70's when the block parties were starting all over NYC, so no johnny come lately ass ppl had no part of the origins of rap
never let them humble you ever!!! our ancestors preserved the culture but that culture evolved to aa culture we know.
Chuck D was supporting Bernie Sanders, he's automatically disqualified.
Exactly! He's a democratic shill.
We Jamaicans never said we created hip hop. It's a Black American culture and art form.
Its a lot of young heads who are gassed up trying to make false claims. All the Jamaican OGs cool. They admit the truth.
@@Jtve737 We Jamaicans love hip hop and FBAs and we're not trying to take credit for their music.
Bronx Rapper/producer Ced-Gee said in a DjVlad interview, when Kool Herc started he only had one turntable
Which is typical Jamaican style. 1 deck, echo chamber, analog beep box and a mic.
i don't know why they say 2 turntables comes from Jamaica as radio stations, mobile jocks and clubs had 2 turntables for years before Hip Hop came along.
....and i'm with you on the "No one mentions Coke La Rock" thing. They hardly ever do yet he's on a ton of the O.G flyers right there in black n white.
>shrugs<
All i can think is he got quickly over shadowed by younger rappers and forgotten. i don't remember anyone ever tellin me about him battlin anyone. Maybe that wasn't his thing, rather jus the O.G toasting rap style, again a la Jamaica. A things developed around him, he didn't move with it....
...at least, that's what i think.
@@mossadon That's how almost all DJs start that way. Two turntables was an American thing to keep the beat going. Flowers expanded to three turntables. That's where Larry Levan and Frankie Knuckles got it from.
@@mossadon Hollywood and KC Prince of Soul overshadowed him. KC because he was Flowers MC, Hollywood because he was just that good. Keep in mind Hollywood is a great DJ as well. These two were all over NYC.
Kool DJ Dee said he had his system before herc then herc bought a system just like Kool DJ Dee. Kool DJ Dee is an African American DJ.
Kool DJ Dee said he was playing the break beat, extending the break beat, playing the same copy of the same record on two turntables chopping. Cueing, Mixing, and Blending.
Don't understand why some peeps have a problem acknowledging Blk Americans pretty much the pioneers of ALL popular music genres, as much as everything else, ignorance I call it, nothing pops-off unless Blk Americans get hold of it or creates it. Big-ups to FBA.
Self hate nigga up north was indoctrinated with pan African logic
Hurk was 12 years old in 1972 he was a kid fresh from Jamaica coming out side in goofy shit. FBA told him how to dress fly, what to play, what was going on outside and how to fit in. Jamaicans left their culture in the house, left the creo in the house. They were trying to figure out how to fit in and be fly in a new environment for him and the culture that allowed him to be excepted in that invironment. Anything else is Backward Bullshit. He had studied us enough by 76 and began to have jams and develop his shit. By 78 he had a following and thus his legacy. He was young and popular.
With your half truths no wonder your name is Malcolm Little Not Malcolm X
@@abrahambowen8332 Go listen to Herk goofy. He came here when he was 12. He started getting down in 72 thats 5 years afterche got here. Did he learn from us or did we learn from him. Same with toasting they learned all this from us. Foundational Blacks invented all American forms of music and influenced the world. Not the other way around period goofy!!
Yeah and you can credit Jimmie Walker for pioneering hip hop too because he sometimes rhymed on Good Times and was born and raised in the South Bronx.
@@abrahambowen8332 You can call it whatever you want just have the facts straight! I mean what are we talkig about here? Get the facts straight period.
@@bigmalcolmlittle If you don't want to give credit for the Jamaican contribution to hip hop it's your choice.
Thank you for this. Being from the BX, I first heard rap came from the islands and ska in a PWI class about 20 yrs ago. Completely confused by that back then. As I've learned over the yrs the only thing I seem to truly hear that came from the islands were the artists and their family lineage. Like you note I heard an interview prior where Herc said it was an experiment for the merry go round. If the starting elements of hip hop are the break beats/the dj, the breakers, and the mc--are they saying the system set up started from the islands? Black Americans of all people have to be very careful how we tell our history.
African being Rapping, and Jive talking since African American slavery time.
Rapping in the 1950 was a common thing African American hey man le me Rap to you. Asked older African American just like give me Five started I 1950s give me five it was away of live for African Americans.
African Americans were using Two turntables before two turntables were sold in Stores. Turntables were in6in American in the late 1700 in America.
African had turntables since the 1920s.
African Americans had Turntables since the 1920s.
Grandmaster Flowers and Disco King Marion was already Using 2 Turntables and a Mic 🎤 before The World knew of Kool Herc.By The Time The Whole U.S. Nation learned about Herc.Hip-Hop was beginning to become a Documented Thing.
hip hop is a creation of Black Americans the rest of us people of color just added our little two cents to it. The slang, the image, the music, the style of speech (emulating radio voice personalities) ALL BLACK AMERICAN with Caribbean sprinkles (PR, Jamaica, Bahamas, Babados, DR ect.) Im almost as old as hip hop, I was born in DR, raised in the states, lived in NY for a little bit, used to be a DJ as a teen and I’ve been a bilingual rapper ever since I can remember and in my opinion anyone who says that hip hop’s creation is only 50% black American ether doesn’t know what they’re talking about or has an agenda.
FBAs 100% created HIP-HIP - Period! All the POCs and minorities are liars and copycats!!!
Hip Hop is based in call and response! this shit comes from the fields! It was used to ease the stress of the work. The military took this and made it into marching cadences!
"can i get a amen"
"say hiddy hiddy hoe"
"The roof is on fire"
"aaaaaa Yo"
all of black music connects!
Hip Hop goes back to the 40's!
look it up! Cab Callaway would ryhme on the brake beats played by big bands!
look it up! The Bronx popularized what we know as Hip Hop!
But they didn't start it!
Sound to me American had a sound in its initial stages and Jamaicans came here and added a twist to it and together they both created hiphop. Lets celebrate our collaboration to strengthen our black race. ✌✌✌🇯🇲
@lovelinkmusicbratta8610... yes but it has to be understood worldwide... that the small amount of Caribbeans involved in early hiphop became totally AMERICANIZED FIRST!! After they became like us, then they made their contributions... in other words ..their contributions to early hiphop 1971 - 1977 had absolutely NOTHING to do with Jamaican culture or Caribbean culture
@@TheCulture..Starts1971 yes but it will be inaccurate to underscored Jamaican and Caribbean contribution because it's part of the history and it's facts. We are all from Africa first then we descend on different locations only to make different contributions in music. You don't hear the white man arguing about European taking credit for what they started, we as a people have to collaborate or else we could be enslave once again. Facts
@lovelinksmusicbratta8610... kool herc grandmaster flash made contributions to the beginning stages of hiphop ONLY AFTER THEY BECAME AMERICANIZED..they WAS NOT reppin their Caribbean style....1971 - 1977 there was no Jamaican/caribbean presence in hiphop in The Bronx jams/parties... all the pioneers will agree to that.... again..there WAS NO Jamaican/Caribbean contribution to the START of hiphop...however, the Jamaican/caribbean influences in hiphop came much later... the Jamaican/Caribbean contributions/influence came in hiphop thru krs one 1986 and others later
This is what happens when we let other people tell our stories!! FBA people stay on CODE and keep our culture before they hijack it!!!
Even your FBA fairy godmother. F/inessed B/lack American founder admitted himself before the FBA grift that Hip hop was started by Kool Herc! This FBA's only contribution to hiphop th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
Like Puerto Ricans hijacked Salsa & Freestyle music.
I'm FBA/ ADOS/Freedman on both sides of my family, but I have to say alot of that Jamaican music that the Jamaicans made from our music is amazing, I wouldn't try to say their music is stolen or some kind of rip off. It's their own thing and I respect it. The Jamaicans should respect us and our music and culture the same.
This is when FBA hiphop started th-cam.com/video/zPR5iB3fo2A/w-d-xo.html
A white supremacist troll pretending to be black? That outdated tactic is so grey of beard livestock. Find your rotten mayo ass back to stormfront so quarrels between blacks will be determined between blacks.
@New Negroid breed Dominant Genetic Parent So its answer to minimal division in certain parts of a continent is to create even more division? Further proof that this is a trailer trash white supremacist troll that merely studied up on Tariq's xenophobic grift as no black American is this less learned coming with such a pathetic easily debunked whataboutism.
"African Americans" created the Hip Hop Culture point blank. Let's stop with this silly debate already. Yes those from the Caribbeans had a role in making it bigger.
DAMN BRUH .. AS A FBA FROM BROOKLYN … I BEEN HEARIN SHIT LIEK THAT FOREVER .. MOST PF MY FRIENDS ARE SPANISH OR FROM SOME TYPE OF CARIBBEAN ISLAND … ITS CRAZY TO FINALLY HEAR WHAT I BEEN SUSPECTING FOR YEARS …AUTOMATIC SUB
God Sun, THANK U!!!!
I been seen the renditions of American music done over in all Caribbean music, from Calypso to Ska since I was a child back in 76, 77. Caribbean music had nothing and I do mean nothing to do with the formulation of hip-hop music or culture. I wasn’t even there When it started but it’s evident distinguishing the truth from bullsh@t.
2-GRANDIZA
I am Jamaican 58 born June 1964 Kingston Jamaica but let me educate you on something you have no idea about and want to make an input into it without knowledge.... This song that you are about to listen was done in Jamaica at Joe Gibbs recording studio 5 Retirement road Kingston 5 in July of 1979 the engineer was Errol Thompson.. i was in the fucking studio that day at the age of 15 then... Here is the song...th-cam.com/video/uHplHw-IG8s/w-d-xo.html.. This could actually be the first rap song ever done by and human being male or female on vinyl and it was done in Jamaica... Rappers delight by the sugar hill gang i don't know when it was actually recorded but it was released in September of 1979 one week before Xanadu and sweet lady rappers delight was released... why Joe Gibbs held back the song so long i have no idea. Engineer and producers are not with us anymore may their soul rest in peace...everybody can talk all the chit they want but these are raw facts and i bear witness...now this is were the debate can start... who and where exactly was the first rap song was ever done.. If sugar hill gang song was recorded before July of 1979 then they were first but if its after July 1979 that it was recorded then Xanadu and sweet lady was the first rap song ever make a note of it.....now take that and ride with it...i have the proof look at the label. and start your own research. get back to me.. By the way this rap hip hop song was done in April of 1979 on a reggae beat before recording it on a disco beat in July the same year the genre was actually called Reggae Disco Name of the song was rockers choice done by rap artist xanadu th-cam.com/video/FrJpw9Hs_DM/w-d-xo.html
FACT! #StopTheSteal
HIPHOP CAME FROM FBA YOUTH
I can guarantee you that before Herc came to "Foreign" in 1973 - he did not see any Selector or Sound systems in Jamaica using two turntables and a mic. The Concept of "toasting" by count matchuki - King Stitch and mostly Daddy U-Roy was to fill-up the space between when the "selector" either flipped over the vocal chune to play the instrumental - or to play another chune - because there was ONE TURNTABLE being used -so the "Toasters" would jump in to full up the dead space -so to speak. I came to "foreign" IN 1976 and selectors in BK/NY playing reggae were actually still using one turntable. What the yute said about Jamaican "toasters" being influenced by American disc Jocks is entirely true - but Jamaican "toasters" stylized the form and made it an art form - and IMHO inspired what eventually became rapping in Foreign - AKA Uncle Sam AKA USA
Peace. The first half of your comment is correct. The second half is incorrect. The culture exchange that did exist was much later 80s 90s - but “rap” was fully formed in US by the 1930s and earlier
I proved that 2 turn tables started in the 1950s in America...The problem is they were on radio not television...2 turn tables is older than people think...
Kool DJ Dee had his system two turntables before herc, then herc bought a system just like Kool DJ Dee.
There are evidence that African American DJs who made, started, and invented Hip Hop before herc the Jamaican. herc the Jamaican said he started Hip Hop in 1973. Hip Hop was started in the late 1960, 1970 by African Americans DJs like Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones, Kool DJ Dee, and Plummer.
Yes, Kool DJ Dee said he had his system which are two turntables before herc the fake Jamaican that said he started Hip Hop. herc copy Kool DJ Dee Two turntables system brand model.
I found this documentary after looking for Microphone Check. Thank you for doing this work years before
Jamaicans did not do break dancing but we sure started toasting over the Mike at the dances and we did not use two turn tables ,we use to dance to American rhythm and blues and that's where our own music began
DJ Flowers used 3 turntables and he was years before Herc
The first break dancers were not known because people who didn't like it was not interested and there was no camera footage of this back then
Since I got into this debate about the Hip Hop Origins. It's really made me start to listen to more Old School Reggae. ( I never listened To much JA music ) I let alot of great Reggae music pass me By. Especially the Dub It's way ahead of it's time. I can never listen to one genre of music. Sometimes it's Jazz sometimes Blues, sometimes the Funk sometimes Dance hall esp the Battles. Music Artist always listen to different sounds and you can hear those influences. This is what expands the music soundscapes
..... I have Two (2) Questions, 1.) how old was Kool Herc when he came to America? 2.) is There ANY video of Jamaicans in 1969 - 1975, in Jamaica, or Puerto Ricians, in P.R. Break Dancing, Playing with Two Turntables, or sporting any HIp Hop Gear? or show me a Bass Guitar in either location.....Please show it, and clear all this......or drop the B.S.
Good video Mike. Kool Dee clarified this on one of your previous videos.
But Kool Dee got that mixer from Plummer
@@kwekuoboasi9352 He probably did. Our buddy Don McCall didn't believe that a lot of what Kool Dee is came from The Plummer as well as Pete DJ and Flowers. Hehehehe. The joke is on him!
@@rickjason1786 Oh! Please Tyrone never invented the cross fader
@@donaldmccall3968 Never said he did. I'm mocking you on that Plummer vs. Kool Dee thing.
@@rickjason1786 How you keep jumping from Jonse to Plummer, he didn't challenge Herc
Damn!!! I wonder what the Jamaicans have to say now this jus bodie them...
Right, they can't say nothing and should'nt have been saying nothing in the first place. that Spice person is ridiculous she needs to see this
DJ Grandmaster Flowers & Pete DJ Jones gets the credit for the beginning of Hip Hop. Enough said.... They both were using 2,3 or sometimes 4 turntables while Jamaican DJ's were using 1 turntable. Kool Herc was only using 1 turntable at the so called party that birthed hip hop. You can't extend the break with 1 turntable. When it comes to mathematics DJ Grandmaster Flowers is the Father of Hip Hop he was djing mid 60's blending and extending breaks. Pete DJ Jones came in 1970 doing the same. These are the 2 Brothers that all the djs were trying to be like. Rest In Power 2 both of them. If James Brown is Hip Hop which he is so is Flowers and Pete.
The name of every "Grandmaster" in Hip Hop was taken from Grandmaster Flowers. GM Flowers was before my time, but old head DJ's from my neighborhood said GM Flowers was the best DJ in NYC in the mid to late 60's and early 70's, possibly the whole country. As you said GM Flowers, Maboya, Pete DJ Jones set the tone for what Hip Hop eventually became. Let the elders speak and set the record straight once and for all.
@@Bronxbred Peace Brother nothing but the Truth. Much respect to Maboya too. Ive done gigs my self where I only played mainly late 50's, 60's and 70 music. Does that make me a Disco DJ lol no im a Hip Hop DJ. Its 2022 and the future generation like myself dont get mixed up in words We know what Hip Hop is regardless of what people want to call it. My Dads favorite group was Kool & The Gang. Is Kool & The Gang Hip Hop? Most definitely!
Grandmaster Flowers played club music.
@@defrocker0569 Brother are you a DJ? Must not be. Flowers and His MC KC The Prince Of Soul definitely represented Hip Hop
@@djbornpeaceallah7544 that was later, when they saw how big hip-hop was coming along. Watch the videos with Cholly Rock, one of the black spades. He talks about how Brooklyn was initially into hip-hop, they were on the club scene.
The first mixers that was used in The Bronx and other places was the Clubman mixers. Disco DJ's in other areas also used the Clubman mixer before GLI
The first mixers were made by Urei. Which is what serious DJs still use. Used by both Grandmaster Flowers and Larry Levan.
It’s not so strange all this confusion came about. Things weren’t properly documented by most. I remember having a conversation/ discussion about this with the Jungle Brothers. The things I said that day made Mike G upset, while Africa baby Bam agreed with me when I said that it’s important to know the history of Hip Hop. I’m from overseas and yes a Black man, but we were always aware this was and is fundamentally Black American (ADOS) culture. The impact ADOS had on the Black world, worldwide is vanguard!
Facts
Beautiful reporting. We are the Kings and Queens of Hip Hop. These code-switching jokers need to stop playing. There will be no brainwashing going on here. We got Receipts!
Great video, great content and the absolute truth and this needed to be explained because so much misinformation has been put out there ✊🏽👏🏽👑🔥🙌🏾💪🏽💯.
I think we need to start identifying all our contributions to our communities. Like skating movies in J.B. Skating or Chicago style Stepping, Dressing and tailor made suits . Etc
Absolutely because these vultures running around saying we have no culture.
Interesting arguments. This stuff existed going back to KC Prince of Soul, among others. Grandmaster Flowers was using triple turntables. Thorens TD-125s and KC Rapped over his music.
The True Fathers of Hip Hop are Grandmaster DJ, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones, Kool DJ Dee these African American DJs Started, Invented the MERRY Go Round which is using two turntables playing the break beat, the GETDOWN PART, extending the break beat, playing the same copy of the same record on two turntables, Cueing, Mixing, blending, Scratching, Dropping the record needle on the record, choppinglike in the 1960s before DJ herc said he started in 1973.
Pete DJ Jones another African American DJ who is a Father of Hip Hop. Pete DJ Jones said he stole the EMCCE, Rapper from Grandmaster DJ Flowers.
dj herc the Jamaican is lying when he says he invented Hip Hop like playing the break beat, extending the break beat, playing the same record on two turntables. African American DJs such as Grandmaster DJ Flowers, King Disco Mario, Pete DJ Jones had Already Started, and Invented Hip Hop such as playing the break beat, extending the break beat, playing the same copy of the same record on two turntables, Cueing. Mixing Blending, Scratching, cutting, chopping, Dropping the record needle on the record, playing James Brown, the Bongo song, playing Funk Music, and playing Disco. These African American DJs were playing Hip Hop in the 1960s before DJ herc the Jamaican. DJ herc said he started Hip Hop in 1973 he was a Fifth Cent late of A Dollar Because Hip Hop was Started in 1960s.
I heard one of dj herc crew member on TH-cam said that he had to help DJ herc, the Jamaican figure out how to play the break beat, extend the break beat, play the same copy of the same record on two turntables so herc is lying when he says he started Hip Hop by himself inky, and nobody else.
yup, KC Prince Soul who was the MC for Grandmaster Flowers before he got with Pete Dj JOnes was rapping (syncopated to the beat) on the mic but his delivery/syncopation wasn't all the way locked in like we get with Dj Hollywood is the foundation that all the early hiphop MC's that considered themselves "bboys" got it from...this has been confirmed by both melle mel and caz, who cosider themselves as the first true "bboy" mc's
Our Confidence was Hiroshima'd in our neighborhood communities in the 80's/90's. We are still Recovering ❗️
Jamaican and African Americans different Terms for same people kidnapped descendants of Ancient Ghana, Mali and Songhay, Ife and Kongo Empires.
That includes Caribbean and Central and South Americans....
We are not the same people.. are you kidding me?… where are we the same … everything about us is different .. and we weren’t kidnapped we were sold
They too proud to say they were influenced by black americans. Jamaicans was not dressing like us either. Like i said show us what puerto ricans and jamaicans were partying like around the time we had soul train. That will give us a clear picture of where everybody was at around that time.
Thank you!! Jamaicans didn’t start jack… 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Right, did'nt start shit. Spice needs to see this, talking this new generation jamaican BS
If that's what you wanted to believe.
@@marshascott6107 Seeing Sugar Dap Willie as Lootin Lenny on Good Times rhyme was similar but doesn't count as witnessing the early days of hip hop
You saw Muhammad Ali do something similar he was influential in Rap but he didn't create it.
Herc said himself he started DJ because he was a dancer first. And never went to a sound system in JA.
Flash modified his cue system to work like more expensive ones at the time. He invented other things but NOT the cross fader - impossible.
Jamaica got it from US radio.
Herc, didn’t say he *extended* breaks. He skipped to the break, and brought on the next break before the end of the record.
Disco wasn’t doing that either. It was Flash that extended breaks with two copies. But breaks- that type of records was being played before Herc.
Some of the breaks were Latin records tho (if that matters)
BBoying came out of the Black Spades “burning” competitive dance - but not down to the floor yet. (at least partly or mostly)
Latin records = Salsa....Which was partly created by FBA, with Afro-Cubans in Harlem.
The Black radio djs that were playing with two turntable by rapping jive talking and ryhmaing, like Jack The Rapper Gibson give the brith of radio personality Jacko Henderson were rapping in rhythm and blues Daddy O rapping in jazz.
#BlackAmericans are the Original Creators of Hip~Hop & Break Dancing PeriodT❗️Other Cultures Are always trying to Claim #Black Americans creations! #Black Peoples are the Original #Black American Dawn Dadda’s😂!Black Americans Pioneered that *ish Respectfully! That’s not take Away from #Jamaica Beautiful Music or anyone else’s,We are all Family & welcome & accept everyone .Only if Some #African & #Jamacan’s also #Spanish people,would Accept us Black Americans! Truth be told it’s Not a well kept Secret anymore .The Jealousy & Envy towards BlackAmerica is unfair Biased & Racist based because of their Potential & being the Trend setters and Blue Print of the world ❗️Big Ups 👍The Culture channel #1✊🏽Thankyou 🥰 #One Love ✌🏽
FUBU...For Us By Us!!........🤴🏾👸🏾💃🏾🕺🏾👈🏾☝🏾👏🏾👊🏾✊🏾💕🇺🇲
I'm so sick of this conversation. 😂. The African Diaspora influences each other. Always has and always will.
We never got influenced musically by nobody else. STOP
Chuck D I can't believe you said that damn you had me fooled for years bozo am glad that some of these brothers are still around to tell the story other than these 1980s clowns that I thought was real shame on the ones that knows better but refused to speak up chuck D you lost my respect.
Right, and he started off with a revolutionary theme, but I see now that was all BS. Muck Chuck D!!!
@@balle733 Chuck D was from Long Island. What does he know?
@@romae6182 am from strong island rakim e.p.m.d prodigy Keith Murray k solo and so many other groups so what you saying don't have no meaning to it .
We should have maintained the historical knowledge of Hip Hop before the culture got exploited, corporatized and diluted! Now we are playing catch within our culture.
Bro, that was some great research work🎯💯💪🏾