The truth about 35's (and 34's) on your GX460 or 5th Gen 4Runner. What problems will they cause? Pt1
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 ต.ค. 2022
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I am not sponsored or affiliated with anyone. Below is a list of the products I use or recommend from this video:
Rims: Black Rhino Reno Beadlocks
Tires: Coopers STT Pro & Cooper ST MAXX
Suspension: Elka
Cheap suspension option I've tested: Send It Suspension
UCA: SPA
Rear control arms: MetalTech 4x4 (will give you option for mid-travel in future)
Panhard relocation: Dr.KDSS
KDSS Fixes: Dr. KDSS & Treaty Off-road
Transmission sensor: Scangauge 2
Tie Rod Sleeve: WarFabArmor
Gusseted Spindle: Send It Suspension
Coil Spacers: Cornfed Suspension - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
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This needs to be listened to by many people who are upsizing tires with many vehicles.
I'm watching it, again, to convince myself to not go past 33's. :(
@@tire26 for me it was logistics. I’m currently in a Chevy Trail Boss that pulls a camper across America, cattle and hay and is 85% on road, pastures and an occasional ORV trail but I don’t do obstacles. The 33s get me out there to see the sights but keep me from tearing up the vehicle I got there in. They tackle snow, sand and mud just fine. It keeps my gas mileage reasonable and braking better which is more important to me. If I had a dedicated jeep or a bogger pickup I’d think differently for sure.
I just bought my linked snow chains too which helps keep me from changing my mind.
I was thinking about using 32" tires in winter and 34's in einer for when I can go camping and wheeling. They don't look too bad on stock tires with a 3" lift
Wow very thorough and useful video on this topic. And thanks for the shout out!
Thank you for actual, verified testing and sharing your learnings. So many people need to watch this.
🙏 🙏 🙏
"I tried to keep these rigs cost-effective." Hahahahahaha Great video, mate.
The most to the point video I've seen so far. Straight to the point and genuine. Hella informative. Subbed. So much valuable info here
Excellent video. Now every time i see post about 35’s, imma post to link to this vid. Well done sir 👏
Honestly 285/75r17 is the best big tire to fit on Toyotas. It’s a “big” 33 at 33.8” yet isn’t super wide like a 12.50.
Agreed, I haven't felt a need to re-gear yet on my 11' GX 460 but I don't do to hard of off-roading. I have a scan gauge and temps haven't been above 195°. Needs more trimming and BMC though.
😂😂 little tire gang
Really, really well done video. This is one of the better videos I’ve seen about this topic. I think I’ve made the decision to get 33s for my GX for now!
Thank you for sharing this. It is rare to find realistic explanations of the issues associated with modifications.
Great information as always! Looking forward to part two to see all the work involved 👀
This is a great video. Definitely gave me a lot to think about on my 470 build.
Great video. Very useful for the GX460 group’s
Currently running Method 703's on Maxxis Razr At811's (285/70/r17) with a 0 offset on a 2015 Kakadu Prado with Kdss. Just upgraded to Iron Man Foam Cell Pro, with Kdss spacers and adjustable panhard. Absolutely stoked with the setup so far. Minimal scrubbing and cutting. Looking at going to 34-35's with my next set of tyres. Great video man, super informative. Got yourself a subscriber from Australia. Happy wheeling. 🤙
🙌🙌🙌. Sounds like your doing it right!
The one inch body lift looks nice on the GX and gives nice spacing with rock sliders while keeping the OEM suspension feel.
Love your videos there always super informative
I agree transmission Coolers are a must
You naming some amazing channels love tinkerer adventure
Pro tip: the optimal tire size on a GX460, LC 150 Prado or 4Runner is 255/80/R17. The Cooper S/T MAXX in this size rule! Thank me later!
I agree. I run the 255/80r17 Ridge Grapplers on the Trd wheels. I run 265/70r17 Duratracs on OEM wheels for winter. The weight difference is 9.9 lbs. Everybody wants to run 285's but that extra weight is not good uness you regear.
I'm trying to decide between a 4Runner and GX. These videos have been incredibly helpful.
11:00 exactly. Do not go on social media or even randomly ask what type of lift you should get or what suspension you should get. Most people have absolutely not idea what equipment to buy for off-roading/overlanding. They will most likely tell you to get a leveling kit or a body lift for no other reason than the fact they like the looks and think you will too. And the only thing their advice will be good for is mall-crawling. Because if you run most of the components they suggest off-road, you will pay for it in damage sooner or later because there is a HUGE confusion about what is 4x4 capable components.
Outstanding video …. Few people get this type of straight talk. I’m certain you have saved many from certain disappointment.
🙌🙌🙌
Awesome video, you just earned a subscriber!
I used to take my trucks to shops but after a while i just saw how easy most work was and the money i was losing by taking my trucks to a shop. Its better to do it yourself anyway that way you know your vehicle and you will be thankful for that in the long run.
Tie rod sleeves nice idea
Very informative video…
great video. I had a 5th gen 4runner ltd 4x4 a few years back. this is why I stick with 33 AT. cheaper, don't need any mods. currently have a titan and armada with 33 ATs and skid plates. only do mild trails and overlanding. if i want to do something gnarly I switch to my ADV bike or dirt bike. cheaper and more fun. Raptor and TRX are way more than a lift kit to fit 35s. those vehicles are ENGINEERED for 35s. can do small jumps and ride fast on rough trails without breaking. Alot of work has to be done for a stock 4x4 to get a proper suspension upgrade. based on your explanation and your video footage you've done that work. most people use spacers or stilts/long spindles to fit bigger tires. thats a bad way to do it.
The 4th gen 4runners also apply to this video as well since there the same as the 5th gen
I feel like if somebody was trying to talk somebody into getting a Bronco or a Jeep, this would be a terrific video to show them, haha. Definitely a labor of love to fit a big tire on these vehicles. Hopefully Toyota gets more aggressive with them for the next generation, but I have low hopes of that.
😂 doubt it for future. But hearing similar steering component breakage issues with non raptor broncos. Hard to argue with a solid axle though… give up ride quality for off-road performance.
Subbed, you aint lying about tranny temps either. Im regeared to 488 and run a derale hyper cool fan assist andstill watch my scanguage 3 go up to 198 when climbing at 72-75
Thanks! That means a lot coming from you… I’ve been watching your vids for a few years!
@@SandyCats Dude honor is all mine, I cant do an in depth video on rubbing cutting etc like you did, and I also always refer to tinkerers channel for real info. lol
SPC UCA allows you to gain more clearance between tire and the cab by maxing out caster on the LCA and then going negative caster on the SPC UCA. This will move everything forward.
💯 (love the username btw)
SPC’s suck for people who actually go off-road. Alignment gets thrown off easily and the ball joints suck.
Also, had one nitpick on the video. I believe the stock GX offset is +25mm so a -30mm offset is an 55mm difference or 2.165"
Just did some research (hard to find). Your absolutely correct!
Biggest body lift I have seen is a 3 inch body lift for 3rd gen 4th gen and 5th gen 4runners same with 460 and 470
At the very least lot of necessarh info for those who need to put in bigger off road tires, also need to modifh suspension, and steering parts
I run 33s on my GX, I feel like anything more and a re-gear would be mandatory.
Exactly! Unless you have the money to spend on regearing then 33s are more than enough
On the GX460, I assume there is a thermostat on the transmission that allows the transmission fluid to warm up to ~180-190F before it pass fluid to the transmission cooler. Did you pin it to bypass it (aka allow fluid to go to the transmission cooler at ATF temp below 180F)? Previously I have fitted a Tru-Cool LPD47391 on an older GX470 but the A750F 5 speed transmission does not have a thermostat. It kept the ATF temp at 160F most of the time, only once did it pop to 220F while towing uphill at 5000ft. I have since moved the LPD47391 to the LX570 and pinned (bypass) the transmission thermostat. This kept the ATF at 150-160F during normal drives and 180-190F on hills. The LC200/LX570 transmission cooler was retrofitted to the GX470 (being twice the size of the stock one). I would only bypass the transmission thermostat if you don't live somewhere cold since it does allow the ATF to warm up. I don't live in freezing conditions most of the year so I opted to bypass the transmission thermostat.
That was my next step. I got a hunch it’s not activating until 200ish… which doesn’t make sense to me. Thanks for the real world feedback! I am a bit worried about colder temps if I do it but it’s worth a shot. Gotta keep experimenting!
I really appreciated this video. I'm interested in where you sourced the tie rod sleeves. Can you provide the vendor and website. Many thanks!
Warfabarmor .com
My 94 got a SAS, 3in lift and fender trimming to clear 38s. 😉
That’s not cutting… that mutilation. Doing similar on my other 4R. Trying to offset rear axle coils to not have to cut into my rear door!
@@SandyCats I'm a pickup, so no rear doors to worry about.
This channel has been amazing, seriously. Been running 33s on my 4Runner and really want to go to 34/35s. First thing I’ve been looking into is re gearing, spindles, cam tabs. Curious what made you choose the 4.56 gears over the 4.88. Also, have you ever thought about removing the front sway bar? Been toying with that idea as well.
Thanks!!! I made a mistake in the video! My supercharged 4R is on 4.56. The white one on 34s is on 4.88 (will fix). Specifically for a 4R I would do 4.56 with supercharger and 4.88 without. For a GX…. 4.56 all day long. I didn’t want to remove the front sway bar yet because I want to show this rig is upgraded “plug and play” for 35s. Once you remove the front, your going to want longer shocks, then the lower control arms…. Then I start going crazy with my builds (as usual). I am in the middle of installing longer sway bar links right now…. Hopefully to be able to get max downtravel from the stock LCA and Elkas. Will post about it in my stories on IG.
@@SandyCats gotcha that makes perfect sense on the sway bar with lca’s. Why not 4.88 with a SC on the 4Runner. I live in Ca and unfortunately cant get a SC yet (stupid CA) but have been looking into that figured I’d just re gear first seems like most ppl go with 4.88s.
@@JonnieF14 there is an excellent article here: trail4runner.com/2019/03/09/supercharger-or-regear-4runner/
With a SC and 4.56 I ran about 3300 rpm at 70. I feel that it was a bit high already to be honest. If I wouldn’t be at 4.88 I’m going to guess I’d be closer to 3500-3600 rpm… too high for my liking (gas mileage). Now that I’m on 37s with SC and 4.56… it feels perfect for my driving style. So…. If you go 4.88…. I’d plan on 36 or 37s when you throw in the SC ;)
@@SandyCats thanks for the reply. Will give this a look!
@@JonnieF14 why can you get a blower for your 4R? Hundreds of 4runners here in CA with 350hp 50 state legal Magnussen blowers. Mine was installed by dealer in Long Beach. 4.56 is correct ratio for 35's on 4R to keep speedo correct. Also supercharger doesnt need the shorter ratio to get moving...4:88s on 35's or less your speedo/odomoter will be slow. Maybee the new 380hp Procharger is difficult to get unless you bend some rules? L👀L
Make more vids on GX460😊
One thing to note for people watching the video and also reading the comments is that he is talking about optimal components for his specific vehicles. For instance he mentions SPC 15:42 as being the best option for his rig. However, that is not universal. What that means is, look around because what is not available as the best option for his rigs may be available for your own. I run a 2010 Toyota Tundra. SPC is a good option, but not the absolute best for my rig. I have multiple option better than SPC. For instance I am running an Icon Dynamics billet upper. You could run with that or Total Chaos, or Dirt King etc. You have just have to look at what is available in the after-market for what you drive and how you plan to use it off-road.
Agreed re best option for my rig. I personally thought I needed the strength of a Total chaos UCA but ended up replacing my TC UCA for an SPC because of two reasons: less maintenance… but more importantly…. Way more adjustability.
@@SandyCats I can agree with that.
You really don’t need a billet UCA, it’s not incredibly load bearing.
@@4runr thank you for your input on my needs. The UCA just happens to be billet. However, it offers me benefits I didn't include in my original comment.
Brother, thank you SO MUCH. This is the single most informative video I have watched (and I've watched a lot) regarding setting up a GX460 properly.
I bought my 14 GX 2 years ago with 35s and an Old Man Emu lift already on it. The more research I did, the more I realized that the guy before had no idea what he was doing. I've downsized to 33" KO2s, added rear drop spacers, Panhard Correction, KDSS Adapter Plates & Brackets.
She now rides way better, even though I've still got lots more work to do on her.
Question: Any idea if it's possible to hit a bump hard enough to bend the sway bar? Installation of my KDSS Adapter Plates and Brackets was REALLY difficult because I would get the sway bar and bushing aligned on one side and attach it loosely, but then the other side was extremely difficult to align the bushing and bracket. I've been to multiple shops, and they haven't been able to find anything bent. Because of how the sway bar is made, it's super difficult to eyeball if it's out of whack at one end, or if it's instead one of the LCAs.
Any suggestions?
I would say it’s impossible to bend the KDSS sway bar. That thing is super thick. Something else will bend/break first. The thinner links that hold the sway bar can be bent. I’d check that… I’ve actually bent one before in my rear.
@@SandyCats What thinner links are you referring to?
After thinking more about your video, and what you said about gussetted spindles, I slid under the GX last night to have a look. I'm wondering if I slightly bent the passenger spindle. Specifically, the tie rod connection is about half the distance from the brake shield as the driver's side. Small I know, but it's the only real difference I could find.
Unfortunately, it's too late for me to fix before this trip to Big Bend (this Thursday), so it'll be soon after that I'll be installing new gussetted spindles with Koyo Bearings already installed on them.
Lastly, my steering seems to have some sway in it. Is that the steering rack damage you were referring to? If so, how hard is that thing to replace? Sucks going down the highway with my GX drifting back and forth. 😮💨
Good info. Practical and realistic. Many people should hear this. Not sure what's up with the microphone situation, but it is hard to hear some of the words here. Perhaps you've already addressed this. I am commenting one year after you posted this. The mic setup is my only complaint.
I wish!!!! Unfortunately I’m still paying full price for everything
@@SandyCats Sound quality aside, your content is really good. It's fascinating, and I ended up subscribing. You do see to know your stuff, and I love your 4Runner build!
True is gas prices and ripping cutting off the edge
question, what else did you to do move the rear axle back 0.35in other than the upper and lower link? what's the adjusted number on the link? how long are they?
Just need to adjust the 4 links. I can’t measure exact length as I did it on the vehicle. I started with stock length and I would do 2 turns on bottom and one turn on top. Lift up tire (without springs installed). Check for rubbing and continue to do that. If I remember correctly I only had to do it twice or so
Which tie rod sleeves? the tacoma or the 4 runner? neither of the part numbers match for a GX.
The one that ends in 70 worked for my 22 GX.
I am seriously considering a RCLTHD IFS for my V8 4th gen 4Runner.
Will you please make a video reviewing your experience, cost and drivability of this suspension? should I consider a rear axle swap for more wider rear as well?
Lastly, what is it really like to highway drive the RCLTHD?
thank you, - subscribed
I can’t make a vid for another 6-8 months simply because I want to get in a LOT of testing before I put a vid out there. I’ll answer a few Q’s though. Install was way harder than expected (seems most RCLT owners say the same). Cost… your looking at over 10K + close to 60-80 hours of shop time if they do it right. It drives on road (including highway) as good as stock. But I know of a few that don’t because they didn’t notch the frame enough for the steering. I didn’t plan to do a rear 60… just planned to run spacers to get a close match to front width…. However right after install of the RCLT we test drove it on the streets for 2 weeks and took it off-road. On the first off-road trail my 4.56 gears blew on my rear stock axle. To date I have no idea why but I put the 4R on hold while I waited for a D60 from ECGS for a few months. I haven’t driven it since as I’m only getting back to finishing the rebuild now. Should be done in a month or so and then need to test for 6 months. If you have an more Q’s… you can DM on on Instagram (easier) @OffKamber_. I’m an open book.
@@SandyCats first, thanks for your reply. Nice to see someone with real experience willing to post their findings.
Understandable on the test phase, I will monitor your channel, I'm really interested in the RCLTHD for an expedition vehicle, not just a dedicated rock crawler.
10K isn't to unreasonable for what you receive in the kit, but I am concerned with how much maintenance it will need, and its highway manners.
With a DD / adventure truck it is necessary to have reliability over capability. Thanks again!!
if you remove the coilover/spring and bumpstop when tubbing for clearance shouldnt there not be any reason you go offroad and find that you need more?
Body mount bushings have some give flexing the body….
The big problem you have with transmission temperatures and the reason you have to run so many coolers is because you’re running the wrong coolers. You’re running a tube and fin when you should be running a plate and fin as a professional mechanic. I wanted to pass that on to you because one cooler alone could do more than all three or four coolers you running, O’Reillys even has them in stock or Amazon even Hayden part number 699 is what you want. Think of it like air-conditioning condensers. The old ones were tube and fin and the new ones are plate and fin. There’s so much more efficient. I just finished building a 4Runner for a customer and with one of the 699 coolers on 34s when towing a 3k trailer over the pass here in Washington the trans ran 190 with around town temps of 160. You want the transmission to be 160-190 for best lifespan
For the send it gusseted spindles are the the ones for the 2010+ 4Runner? Those are the only ones I could find. Also did you get the 17mm bolt or 19mm?
For my 21 I used 19mm. Depending on your year, I would verify. You can also send your spindles to RC Fabrication (instagram) and they can weld up the gussets for you.
Sick thanks!
There are far more pros to a skinny tire. Military uses them for a reason.
I can't think of any pros to a wide tire. And the flotation argument is bunk. If you want flotation you have to go absolutely massive, and most of that is do to the length of the tread do to the height of the tire anyway.
@@ericchandler90 But instagram bro. Gotta have some wide tires!
Look how skinny the original Willys jeep tires were, and those things went everywhere.
🔥🔥
I have come across wildly varying numbers on the internet; curious to get your opinion on transmission temperature range (High --> High High limits)?
220 not great. 250 bad. 270…. Burned. Short version. If I hit 250… I’ll change it out at next oil change
Thanks for the response, I will set my 'caution' temp @200 and see where that takes me. Just started monitoring with the new aftermarket headunit. @@SandyCats
Can u build my 2014 lexus gx460 for me? U have the experience
I can’t afford to work on other rigs… I take too much time… I’ll go broke 😂
Ahaha yah seems very time consuming
Which tie rod sleeves did you use on the GX?
Did you use the warfab armor for a Tacoma or 4Runner?
Damn. Going this hard off-road might as well get a jeep. Loosing the point of a GX with all these mods.
I don't believe that dr.kdss & blackgate should be mentioned in the same video...
I have the treaty off-road spacers but just blanked and remembered black gate during the recording!
Supercharge the GX460!!!
Ha. Maybe one day
"kinda adds up..." 😂
Good presentation. Confirms all I suspected.
32s on a 3rd gen FTW
good video. but disagree w your body lift comments. it most certainly improves entry/exit angles.
Thats an excellent point (only if your bumpers are adjusted for a body lift - which is hard to find).
Wider tire performing better off-road or snow? False.
Off-road - wider tires will grip more rock crawling… That’s also why you air down. Snow - will help you float in deep powder.
@@SandyCats It's more about tread LENGTH than width dude
@@kcw9313 A wide tire will float in powder. Skinny tires grip better in hard pack
Meh, I’m just going to run 255/70r18s on stock 18s and call it good.
You should rename this channel overland 4x4 professor.
🙏
I have never needed 35s and use 33 inch KO2s and KM3s (love them both) on my 4Runner TRD Off Road and it goes wherever I point it. All these guys hacking up their rigs just to look "cool". You guys enjoy that lol
Have you ever even rock crawled?
@@Bananahammock88 Yup, when it is required to get to where I am going, but nobody buys a brand new 4Runner to "rock crawl". I go camping in remote places, and a versatile tire is the best option, and majority of overlanders and off road motor sports prefer the Ko2.
@@lunamaria1048 so you have no clue the differences a viper cut bumper and 35’s can give you over 33’s when needing clearances. I have 33’s and I can’t do things that 35’s can do. I have also not cut my bumper. Which makes it difficult to get up some rocks because my bumper hits the rock face before my tire does. If I did a viper cut, it exposes my tire to where I’d be able to crawl. Next time, since you just drive on fire roads, keep your mouth and keyboard shut.
@@Bananahammock88 This video is NOT even about rock crawling builds, at all. It is an overlander (touring build). I learned off-road driving at a course in Australia to prep for an expedition, and every rig had 33s, but one 70 Series that was was not a touring build. They told us we do not need to use bigger than 33 inch tires for touring (overland) builds, and were right. Only Americans use 35 plus on touring builds, and us Asians, the Europeans and the Australians that visit the US are always surprised by the oversized tires on Americans overland builds lol
Cool
I don’t get it how tf do you guys have money for all this shit
Simple: work!… than work some more
20 hours of cutting and grinding, lololol, meanwhile jeep and ford fitting 35s from the factory and now 37s, Toyota is behind times.
I feel like if one's at the point where they need 35s or bigger, they should probably be in a Wrangler anyway.
@@trailrunnah8886 great point. That’s what led me to a jeep.
@@Jeepingshort Yeah. I like my 4Runner as a daily driver that can do mild off-roading, but it just doesn't make sense to me to build Toyotas. If one wants to build a vehicle for really difficult terrain, it just makes so much more sense to build a Wrangler. If I lived where there was a lot of wheeling nearby, I would have went with a Wrangler over the 4Runner.
Ford and jeep going right from factory to mechanic too “lol”