Fun fact about Sam Houston and Texas State. They share the same board of regents and we're football rivals for almost 100 years before Texas State moved to the FBS level. Adding both could generate a lot of interest between the fan bases.
I dont know if there is a very good shot of landing both. I think if the MWC can land one of Texas St/Sam Houston St and one of UTEP/NM State, it would be a home run. Like he said, UTEP/NM State both essentially share the same market so adding both instead of one adds nothing monetarily. Only way I see them adding both is if its a last effort to get an FBS team as a “warm body” to fill out the conference. I was all for adding both but the MWC needs to be strategic with who they add. They are in very good shape as a conference $ wise so Im glad they are putting out aggressive feelers. Really like the NIU angle as a Wyoming fan. Wyoming recruits really well in Illinois, which adding NIU would probably help.
Northern Illinois's athlete program revenue is on par with fcs schools at $22M. UC Davis (fcs) has double the revenue at $44M. Cal Poly (fcs) has revenue of $37M. UTEP's revenue is $33M. Sacramento State (fcs) is $36M.
Although Sac state is a FCS school, with the hype and new stadium announcement and funding is a no brainer for the MWC. Not being naïve that they want current FBS schools, you cannot deny the media market and proximities to UNR and SJSU.
Why would anyone want NMSU? They don't even have an airport, hotels for fans, ESPN coverage, or a real news station. El Paso doesn't watch them. Their game against Fresno was one of the least watched games on TV that week. I know El Paso like the back of my hand and it's rare you see anyone with NMSU gear.
Sacramento State wants the Pac. Of course, they have to hope that a Texas State would be stupid enough to join the Mountain West, or smart enough to stay in the Sun Belt etc.
If anything legitimate materializes from the MWC's pursuit of Northern Illinois and Toledo, then for sure I will comment more in-depth about this, but for now here's what I'll say: If enough time passes without any developments, then I think MWC being interested in NIU and Toledo was only a smoke screen to cover other moves they're considering. I can't prove that, but that's just a gut feeling of mine. I do believe that making NIU and Toledo Football-Only members would not work out well enough for these schools. Keep in mind that the MAC has somewhat strict preferences about their membership. If they have any schools that aren't full-time members, there's a good chance those schools won't be in the MAC at all after a while. That means NIU and Toledo would have to seek membership in other conferences for the rest of their sports programs, and that could be a headache. Would they want that? The safest plays for the MWC to make for immediate expansion would have to be New Mexico State, UTEP and Texas State. They're both safe and logical choices.
UC Davis makes more money because of good Accounting, not because they have a larger fan base. I think they’d be a lot better pick up for the MW than the PAC. However, I think there are other FCS programs that would be a better grab for media market reasons. There’s just a lot of overstep without grabbing a big name school.
I going to assume you know this, but you know Washington state is just a few miles away right? I don’t think there’s enough people in the panhandle not rooting for BSU or WSU to justify bringing them on from FCS. I think it would be smarter to grab one or both of the Montana schools if they want to grab them viewers up that way.
Several years ago, EWU AD began a fundraising drive for improvements to their quite small stadium, wanting to make $25 million in renovations. No increase in capacity, just more revenue generators. There was a $5 million donation right at the start, 5 years ago. $1 million more has been raised since then. That’s not reassuring at all. They’re not going FBS.
UTEP captures a majority of the market (El Paso). UTEP just doesnt come with as much recent athletic success as NMSU. Both are pretty awful football schools. El Paso is much larger than Las Cruces and there are way more UTEP fans than NMSU fans. So if you want the market, you get UTEP.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast It may be surprising to talk about UC Davis as a possibility for PAC until you look at their research spending. UC Davis approximately $845 million per year!!! Cal Berkeley approximately $981 million per year. UC Davis could be a sleeper if they got into PAC 12.
@@Joe-m2d One would think that, with all the money floating around down there and a certain reputation the school has that, given they’re competing against the Montana schools and a handful of others with stadiums > 15,000 capacity, that the stadium they built not too many years ago would have more than 10,000 capacity. But that’s not what Davis did. And concerning the comments of none other than Dan Hawkins (when he was Boise State coach), you “Davis guys” are “different cats” or something like that. Nothing wrong with that, and I know it’s an expandable stadium… but when are you announcing? Theoretically underfunded Sac State just beat you to the punch. Lay that money down and we’ll talk.
I find the moves that the MWC is making to be fascinating. I question the long-term viability of its unequal distribution model and going after the MAC schools football-only. I long questioned the moves or lack of moves by their former commissioner, but the new commissioner thinks outside the box and is dramatically bolder and is not risk-averse.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast She’s taking a page out of the Brett Yormark playbook. That’s good and bad in this case. Funny thing is she found ways to keep Gonzaga in the WCC not so many years ago, and that included letting Gonzaga keep more credits. Well, that didn’t happen with five MWC schools. I think NIU and Toledo is an empty promise, but a good study of Yormark. Keeping UNLV and AFA was obviously easier than the 5 others, and Nevarez is definitely pugnacious at the moment. Probably even forced a mistake from the Pac. Both sides overplayed their hands. But the Mountain West is not in a better position.
@@PCSPounderThe Mountain West is absolutely in a better position currently. They have 8 full time members and can add more for stability. The new Pac is volitile because OSU and Wazzu would bolt that conference in a heartbeat if the ACC or Big12 come calling which would leave the Mountain West schools ass’d out. I don’t see how any of the Mountain schools didn’t think that through because none of them are getting an invite to a Power 4 conference anytime soon.
@@thedonmega91 Number of members does not outweigh value of each member. The Pac gets higher priority for 2026 TV negotiations because they have the better brands. By then, the firm they just hired will help resolve the last remaining question about who to add and the media value involved and the Mountain West will get a streaming contract at best. Now the truth about Oregon State and Washington State… the b12 has basically indicated they’d wait 12 years for the currently scheduled end of the ACC contract before they’d consider those two schools. That’s why they poached the MWC.
ADD Texas St, Sam Houston St and UTEP. Also add Grand Canyon for BB only. Make 2 Div with a conference champ game. MW West New Mexico Nevada UNLV San Jose St Hawaii FB / Grand Canyon BB MW East Wyoming Air Force Texas St UTEP Sam Houston St
I think TXST wants to be in the AAC to be be in same conference with UTSA, Rice, UNT & Tulane. If they leave it would probably be PAC-12 but it would have to be with Sam Houston St and UTEP. PAC-12 made a huge mistake not inviting UNLV. MWC IMO should also invite Sam Houston, UTEP and possibly NMST. Genetics has no credibility and blocks you if you disagree with him. Not sure you should refer to him if you elegant to grow your channel.
MWC should look at Tarleton! They are flushed with money, they are building a new arena for basketball. Their goals since moving up from D2 has been FBS. Until I see a shovel in the ground, I won’t believe that Sacramento will accomplish anything they are talking about!
Great video JY! I was wondering that myself if they were trying to procure Max schools like Northern Illinois & Toledo in order to convince NDSU & SDSU to join the conference. Would they want more MAC schools? I highly doubt this is even possible but it's an interesting possibility. I agree with you that this is a good faith effort the show the NCAA that they're exhausting all regional possibilities in a few outside of regionality in order to calm them that they did everything that they could do and their due diligence to expand their conference within FBS. Then they can go after the FCS schools that they have been targeting all along. I have said that they need to get to 12 full-time members and possibly 14-16 total members to be viable. That all depends on which schools CBS and FOX told Gloria Nevarez to go after. Because I'm quite sure they told her something. I just have no clue what it is. I have raised the possibility that perhaps they should go after a basketball or Olympic sports member to compensate for Hawaii. Getting someone from the WCC is a wish and not real. I suggested perhaps going into the Big West and getting a California school for the Olympic sports. Cal State Fullerton, Long Beach State, UCSB....there are a lot of options there. Just not Hawaii. Grab a basketball school from there that consistently makes the NCAA tournament so that way you have more teams that generate tournament shares to help the value of the conference. Just some ideas.
Great comments. They will go for FBS first and see what happens. I think all schools in phase 2 are great. But adding both NMST & UTEP could be problematic. It might be one or the other. NMST just seems to being more to the table, especially with BB as you have said on your show.
Nothing against Sam Houston, but its very much an after thought in the Houston area. Most people (unless they went there) may not know they moved up to FBS. Tex st has made a lot more noise and is a much more well known school across the state. People from all of Texas would go there because of its location and being a "party" school. Outside of Houston, many regular people may not even know about Sam Houston the college.
You make a good point about people not knowing Sam Houston moved up. But you saying people may not know Sam Houston University in the state of Texas is probably the funniest thing I've read in a week. Do you know who that school is named after? You don't learn Texas history without learning that name. Texas State has been in a higher division longer. But Sam Houston University is well known in the state of Texas. Please believe me. Being from Texas, though, I'm not a fan of so many conferences being in this state. If the MWC does add. I hope they're the last ones. And the other Texas school options go replace ones that left. We don't really need any new conferences after that in the state. Also, if the AAC is interested in Texas State. That's probably where they'd end up. There or the MWC. The travel for the Pac is egregious for them.
Your right Sam Houston is an after thought in the Houston area, but so is Texas State in Austin and San Antonio. I don't agree that TxSt is more well known. We are at the bottom of the barrel here, we are talking about who is the 8th or 9th strongest brand in the state.
@lorenzohaynes3886 the Sun Belt would be perfect Culturally and Regionally for Sam Houston State, they love playing Southern based schools . Especially a likes of Louisiana Lafayette, Louisiana Monroe, Appalachian State, Georgia Southern, Arkansas State, Southern Miss, James Madison,Southern Alabama, Troy and Georgia State. SFA would be great to Especially whenever they move up ( Tarleton State could replace Texas State when they leave in having presence in Austin/San Antonio area Especially they fit more Culturally in the Sunbelt).
Can we Add Richmond Spiders? I know NCAA frowns upon FCS school coming up but i like Richmond Spiders (big on Basketball) Villanova (Football) Portland State, maybe Syracuse for Both Basketball and Football. I dont know, theres soo many FCS programs in Football and Basketball that MWC can benefit bringing on to the conference, expanding geologically and some of those programs bring in LOTS OF MONEY, in sports they are big on. Richmond Spiders is my favorite team to add. I love their Basketball program and started to enjoy their nitty gritty football team.
MW or PAC 12 needs to grab as many Texas FBS schools as possible. Football in Texas survives no matter what. If a Texas school plays well known schools, people will come to watch. Even little Baylor and TCU have made a name for themselves . 20 years ago no one cared about Baylor or TCU for football. Over time they grew into great programs due to playing against well known schools.
Neither will be paid for just any old Texas schools. The MWC won’t be paid much at all. Both conferences will get paid for late time slots. They’re not going to simply add time slots currently deeded to other conferences because a bunch of Texas schools join. If y’all are kicking off at 9:30 pm local, maybe?
The main challenge with the MW going forward is that the schools either don’t have or don’t pull the local market. But if you can get the Montana and Dakota schools to elevate to FBS you’ll have a geographically cohesive league that can command decent national attention, though that would probably be weeknight games.
i think that sailed with the aggressive pac lawsuit vs mw over poaching fees. as the reality of losing unlv forever sinks in, the original 4 exiting schools will be reconsidering why they left in the first place.
@@Joe-m2d They are all mid major schools in G5 conferences. There is no difference between the PACX and the MW. Only the perception that the PAC12 logo is somehow more prestigious. The MW is taking a vast majority of their money in exit fees, etc. The new PAC is kidding themselves, they continue to mismanage themselves and are not going to be a P4 conference. Gloria Navarez is cleaning them out.
@@liljoe31 The PACX has not lost anything if they were to just do a reverse merger. I am guessing it could still happen and it would be a great G5 conference. Nobody in either conference has said it still cant happen. Its a stare down with lots of money at stake. The PACX has mismanaged the whole thing in the past and now again in 2024.
Central time zone is important for TV. North Dakota St. fills one of the central time zone needs. Fan following is great. Lots of oil money. Great football program. On the border with Minnesota so adding Minnesota.
I think Genetics has some flawed thinking when it comes to his analysis. Sam Houston is far and away the worst pick of the four for a simple reason. It has the smallest fanbase and the lowest ceiling of the four for growth in a larger league. Sam Houston athletic facilities are by far the worst of the four. It's DMA is also the smallest of the four. Texas State straddles two of the fastest growing cities in the country, and has very good athletic facilities for a G5 program. While UTEP and NMST do share the same DMA, the DMA is actually much larger than the numbers say because El Paso is on the U.S.-Mexico border with the decently large city of Ciudad Juarez, which will have some spillover of viewership and fan support. I get it if you just look at certain numbers it may look like Sam Houston belongs above these others, but when you understand the university's athletic infrastructure, the DMA's potential for growth, fanbase support, and football history, the analysis Genetics presents doesn't really make sense.
The distance from Huntsville to Houston is about the same as San Marcos to Austin and San Antonio, and Houston is equal in population to both SA and Austin combined. The two are a lot more similar than you give them credit for.
@@dgart7434 Huntsville to Downtown Houston is 68 minutes. San Marcos to Downtown Austin is 38 minutes. I’d say that’s a noticeable difference in distance. Huntsville is more isolated than San Marcos is my point.
The MWC-5 schools are going to regret their move, especially the last foolish defector USU, which was the proverbial last lemming to sleepwalk over the cliff, and into the lap of the stillborn PAC-X...yeah, good luck with that! The irony is that besides the outrageous exit fees -- and legally-binding penalty fees -- the foolish defector schools and the PAC-X must pay penalty fees to the MWC (thank you very much!)... ...and to add insult to injury, the MWC used these funds owed by the PAC-X to not only retain the residual MWC members (6 full-time members plus Hawai'i), but also strengthen them financially -- especially UNLV and AF -- while also granting the latter two a NO PENALTY future exit to an AQ4 conferece! Hahaha! In contrast, BSU, SDSU, FSU, CSU, and USU are trapped into a deal with the stillborn PAC-X in which they would have to fork over $30M to exit to an AQ4 conference and $40M to exit towards another conference! Hahaha - - good luck with that! UNLV and AF got the proverbial bag and a free/no penalty exit clause to the big-time conferences. Of course, the ACC isn't going to fall apart so no one is going to be going anywhere anytime soon -- FSU and Clemson will have the performance-based payments they sought from the ACC, as will other conferences soon enough, so the ACC isn't going to fall apart anytime soon. But back to the PAC-X, if I were any of the defector schools, especially USU, I would be sweating bullets about the mess of a conference that I have joined, wondering why the AD and staff didn't conduct proper due dilligence prior to jumping the gun because the grass seemed greener on the other side. The MWC-5 are going to waste so much money on a lateral move into a conference that doesn't have the administrative leadership nor funding to make it a truly "best of the rest" G-5 conference. Yeah, good luck with that! As a fan and alumnus of two MWC schools, I'm enjoying seeing that the PAC-X is stuck in its organizational development because it certainly doesn't have the funds to acquire the desired AAC f-ball schools alongside the preferred b-ball ones -- it can't even acquire the AAC schools just by themselves. Meanwhile, the MWC is more workman-like an practical, seeking to add new, emerging schools that are more easily acquireable and organizationally suitable. And I greatly thank and appreciate Gloria's efforts in keeping the MWC together and protecting the interests of it's least visible and most vulnerable members, which all have immensely loyal fanbases in often remote and distant parts of the country. It's truly refreshing to see her run circles around Teresa at the PAC-X while standing up for the interests of the "little guy." At this point, I'd be happy with any or all of Texas State, NMSU, UTEP, SFA, Arkansas St, Toledo, NIU, and any other school joining the MWC because part of the fun is not just adding rising programs to the conference but also foreclosing the number of schools that the PAC-X could acquire to get an 8th full member, particularly because the PAC office and school leadership would undoubtedly look down upon any of the minnow(s) added as merely being cupcake(s)/filler(s) to meet the minimum conference creation requirements. Conversely, any new members would be more highly regarded and respected by the MWC office and its member schools' leaderships. The MWC has the PAC-X by the proverbial balls with that phony lawsuit that was filed. The PAC-X can't get out of its legal obligation, especially since the MWC will counter that the PAC-X sought control of the PAC-12 monies left behind to rebuild its own conference, thus making the residual monies left by the departing 10 schools into an effective penalty for their departure that allows the PAC-X to rebuild. Furthermore, the PAC-X has imposed its own $30M/$40M exit penalties upon its new members, so these are some of the many reasons why the PAC-X lawsuit is doomed. The AAC schools aren't going to join the PAC-X due to 1) travel distance, time, and difficulty of reaching the rather remote locations of some PAC-X schools, especially for all their sports teams, 2) the atmospheric and weather differences between the relatively mild southeastern climate and the rather frigid northwestern one, and 3) PAC-X's lack of money to buy them out and subsifize their exit costs and travel costs, and 4) the organizational mess that the PAC-X has shown itself to be, including the public relations disasters it faces from its behaviors and the ongoing litigation that it has foolishly launched against the MWC -- no one wants to partner with such ac lousy organization like the PAC-X that launches frivolous lawsuits and can't be trusted because it renegged on a contractual arrangement to poach upon it's business partner's assets! Have I made the case sufficiently for why the MWC is going to come out far ahead of the PAC-X, and why the departing MWC schools must be regretting the stupidity and short-sightedness of their ADs?
That’s some nice fan fiction. The MWC is looking at a 50% reduction at minimum in TV revenue. El Paso and the Dakotas can’t save you from that. The Pac definitely won’t be the Pac of old, but the schools that departed will get a pay raise. It helps to be with what would otherwise be >$10M/year schools in OSU and WSU. Might even have consistent OTA coverage, even if that’s the CW. In any event, have a nice day.
@@PCSPounder You and the PAC-X groupies are dreaming, as TV execs have indicated (via radio and media personalities) that the PAC-X isn't of significantly better value for TV deals than whatever the reconstituted MWC will look like. The W/OSU fans are daydreaming that they are still P-5 caliber schools -- they were the welfare queens of the P-5 and original PAC-12. W/OSU were able to secure better athletes because they played big brothers UO and UW, as well as USC and UCLA, but those days are over and top-caliber athletes won't be coming to Pulman or Beaverton from now on. Unfortunately, it seems like W/OSU have refused to lower their financial figures on their future revenue expectation excel worksheets to account for not only the large drop-off in the brand names of the partner schools that they will be playing from now on, but also the diminished "national/regional" caliber of players that will be playing at W/OSU from now on...with Cam Ward being example #1. Given the delusional visions of W/OSU, alongside the similarly unfounded dreams of the ADs/organizational leaders at the MWC-5 who departed, the entire exercise of creating a PAC-X was strategically misguided, prior to the poor execution in expansion that Teresa farcically implemented. As it stands now, the MWC is poised to secure TX State, UTEP, and some other schools. It was a bad and rushed decision by the MWC-5 to abandon ship for a conference that had no TV guarantees and little strategic vision in its expansion efforts.
50 per cent reduction....says no one, especially if they add texas. already done. pac is the one w weak tv markets,except sdsu, and they are no LA or Orange county. have a good one...
What exactly does TX state offer? The little bit of skin between the Long Horn and the nUTSAck? UTEP would be a better pick they have history with both MWC and the PAC
@@ReisterJP Compared to UTEP State offers more of everything--size, academics, money, and a large alumni base in the Texas Triangle. And don't forget their brief stint in the WAC before it dissolved.
@@ReisterJP oh I don’t know what they offer - maybe the giant media market between San Antonio through Austin and up through Dallas/Fort Worth? I’m not gonna bother to look up the numbers, but I’m gonna guess that’s a little bit bigger of a media market than all of East Texas combined. This isn’t about tradition or rivalries, it’s not about who has the coolest looking mascots or colors, it is about medium markets, plain and simple. If Texas State keeps winning then central Texas will broadcast the games and people will buy the merch.
@@ReisterJP Do you not get how this works? The media market is what it is. When the conference looks at the school, they see a giant Metro area around the school. And by the way, their athletics revenue would beg to differ-plenty of people care about them. I don’t happen to be one of them, I couldn’t care less about the state of Texas in general, so if you think you’re trashing my team you’re not. I don’t care at all.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast thanks for the response! Let's compare Toledo, a city I know fairly well, compared to El Paso and Las Cruces: 1. The Toledo Rockets deliver a well established record of winning in DI play, neither UTEP or NM State can claim that. 2. Ohio is a critical recruiting ground to every program in DI football; west Texas AKA for Eastern NM is not high value recruiting area. 3. Games in the Eastern TZ are important for additional brand exposure, Toledo provides it. Media markets related to El Paso and Lac Cruces are for the most part meaningless. I totally agree that Sam Houston State should be a top priority, Houston market, one of the best recruiting grounds in the nation.
@@michaelsimler7218 - You are a Food-Under-Car-Keys-Tiny-Austin-Robert-Dayton if you think MAC universities are leaving for the Food-Under-Car-Keys-Ice-Nathan-Gone Mountain West!
You are a Food-Under-Car-Keys-Tiny-Austin-Robert-Dayton if you think MAC universities are leaving for the Food-Under-Car-Keys-Ice-Nathan-Gone Mountain West!
Fun fact about Sam Houston and Texas State. They share the same board of regents and we're football rivals for almost 100 years before Texas State moved to the FBS level. Adding both could generate a lot of interest between the fan bases.
UTEP & NMSU are better for the MWC they have better basketball and closer geographic footprint
I dont know if there is a very good shot of landing both. I think if the MWC can land one of Texas St/Sam Houston St and one of UTEP/NM State, it would be a home run. Like he said, UTEP/NM State both essentially share the same market so adding both instead of one adds nothing monetarily. Only way I see them adding both is if its a last effort to get an FBS team as a “warm body” to fill out the conference. I was all for adding both but the MWC needs to be strategic with who they add. They are in very good shape as a conference $ wise so Im glad they are putting out aggressive feelers. Really like the NIU angle as a Wyoming fan. Wyoming recruits really well in Illinois, which adding NIU would probably help.
Sam Houston and Texas State always did well in football even in the FCS. Both are very consistent having great football teams.
SFA is just being left.
@@lorenzohaynes3886 hopefully not they should be right next to SHS
Northern Illinois's athlete program revenue is on par with fcs schools at $22M. UC Davis (fcs) has double the revenue at $44M. Cal Poly (fcs) has revenue of $37M. UTEP's revenue is $33M. Sacramento State (fcs) is $36M.
Although Sac state is a FCS school, with the hype and new stadium announcement and funding is a no brainer for the MWC. Not being naïve that they want current FBS schools, you cannot deny the media market and proximities to UNR and SJSU.
Fully agree
Why would anyone want NMSU? They don't even have an airport, hotels for fans, ESPN coverage, or a real news station. El Paso doesn't watch them. Their game against Fresno was one of the least watched games on TV that week. I know El Paso like the back of my hand and it's rare you see anyone with NMSU gear.
Sacramento State wants the Pac. Of course, they have to hope that a Texas State would be stupid enough to join the Mountain West, or smart enough to stay in the Sun Belt etc.
@@jaketxazbasketball
If anything legitimate materializes from the MWC's pursuit of Northern Illinois and Toledo, then for sure I will comment more in-depth about this, but for now here's what I'll say:
If enough time passes without any developments, then I think MWC being interested in NIU and Toledo was only a smoke screen to cover other moves they're considering. I can't prove that, but that's just a gut feeling of mine. I do believe that making NIU and Toledo Football-Only members would not work out well enough for these schools. Keep in mind that the MAC has somewhat strict preferences about their membership. If they have any schools that aren't full-time members, there's a good chance those schools won't be in the MAC at all after a while. That means NIU and Toledo would have to seek membership in other conferences for the rest of their sports programs, and that could be a headache. Would they want that?
The safest plays for the MWC to make for immediate expansion would have to be New Mexico State, UTEP and Texas State. They're both safe and logical choices.
Did you know UC Davis, a FCS program makes more athletic revenue revenue than Utah State, San Jose State? Grab them.
UC Davis plays a sport or 2 in the Big 12. So..... the Pac needs to leave them alone. 😂😂😂
UC Davis makes more money because of good Accounting, not because they have a larger fan base. I think they’d be a lot better pick up for the MW than the PAC. However, I think there are other FCS programs that would be a better grab for media market reasons. There’s just a lot of overstep without grabbing a big name school.
FCS consideration: University of Idaho
I going to assume you know this, but you know Washington state is just a few miles away right? I don’t think there’s enough people in the panhandle not rooting for BSU or WSU to justify bringing them on from FCS. I think it would be smarter to grab one or both of the Montana schools if they want to grab them viewers up that way.
MW should consider Eastern Washington University too
Several years ago, EWU AD began a fundraising drive for improvements to their quite small stadium, wanting to make $25 million in renovations. No increase in capacity, just more revenue generators. There was a $5 million donation right at the start, 5 years ago. $1 million more has been raised since then. That’s not reassuring at all.
They’re not going FBS.
UTEP captures a majority of the market (El Paso). UTEP just doesnt come with as much recent athletic success as NMSU. Both are pretty awful football schools. El Paso is much larger than Las Cruces and there are way more UTEP fans than NMSU fans. So if you want the market, you get UTEP.
if UTEP could recruit west Texas they would be amazing I wish they had a better AD
Good stuff as always! I would say all fair points
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Sac State has indicated they are interested in the PAC 12.
Being interested in and being considered by are 2 very different things.
Sac St. is firmly in Plan C territory for the PAC.
UC Davis is a better fit for PAC 12 given its research dollars
We will be shocked if the PAC added any FCS schools.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast It may be surprising to talk about UC Davis as a possibility for PAC until you look at their research spending. UC Davis approximately $845 million per year!!! Cal Berkeley approximately $981 million per year. UC Davis could be a sleeper if they got into PAC 12.
@@Joe-m2d One would think that, with all the money floating around down there and a certain reputation the school has that, given they’re competing against the Montana schools and a handful of others with stadiums > 15,000 capacity, that the stadium they built not too many years ago would have more than 10,000 capacity.
But that’s not what Davis did. And concerning the comments of none other than Dan Hawkins (when he was Boise State coach), you “Davis guys” are “different cats” or something like that. Nothing wrong with that, and I know it’s an expandable stadium… but when are you announcing? Theoretically underfunded Sac State just beat you to the punch.
Lay that money down and we’ll talk.
North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Montana and Montana State, along with Sacramento State make the most sense for the MWC.
Adding that many FCS at one time would be a huge problem.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast Any of them could be a candidate.
Agree.
NDSU is at the top of that list of 4 for us.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast But I heard UTEP is joining the conference.
I find the moves that the MWC is making to be fascinating. I question the long-term viability of its unequal distribution model and going after the MAC schools football-only. I long questioned the moves or lack of moves by their former commissioner, but the new commissioner thinks outside the box and is dramatically bolder and is not risk-averse.
The exact model they have isn't going to work long-term.
Gloria is fantastic.
She will make things happen.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast She’s taking a page out of the Brett Yormark playbook. That’s good and bad in this case.
Funny thing is she found ways to keep Gonzaga in the WCC not so many years ago, and that included letting Gonzaga keep more credits. Well, that didn’t happen with five MWC schools.
I think NIU and Toledo is an empty promise, but a good study of Yormark. Keeping UNLV and AFA was obviously easier than the 5 others, and Nevarez is definitely pugnacious at the moment. Probably even forced a mistake from the Pac. Both sides overplayed their hands.
But the Mountain West is not in a better position.
@@PCSPounderThe Mountain West is absolutely in a better position currently. They have 8 full time members and can add more for stability. The new Pac is volitile because OSU and Wazzu would bolt that conference in a heartbeat if the ACC or Big12 come calling which would leave the Mountain West schools ass’d out. I don’t see how any of the Mountain schools didn’t think that through because none of them are getting an invite to a Power 4 conference anytime soon.
@@thedonmega91 Number of members does not outweigh value of each member. The Pac gets higher priority for 2026 TV negotiations because they have the better brands. By then, the firm they just hired will help resolve the last remaining question about who to add and the media value involved and the Mountain West will get a streaming contract at best.
Now the truth about Oregon State and Washington State… the b12 has basically indicated they’d wait 12 years for the currently scheduled end of the ACC contract before they’d consider those two schools. That’s why they poached the MWC.
Moving from washington to Florida a lot of games start at 10 pm to get visibility having schools on the East Coast would make a huge difference
Mountain West after dark baby!
It’s our Jam!!!
The Mountain West Conference should & ought to get New Mexico State, Northern Arizona, Idaho & Montana whi h will give them 11 schools total.
I never thought UNM wanted to be in a conference with State be funny if UTEP and NMSU went to Pac
@@ReisterJPI always heard that too, but damn the lobos need to realize that they need them moving forward.
This is a great idea.
UNM can’t hold things up for the betterment of the conference.
ADD Texas St, Sam Houston St and UTEP. Also add Grand Canyon for BB only.
Make 2 Div with a conference champ game.
MW West
New Mexico
Nevada
UNLV
San Jose St
Hawaii FB / Grand Canyon BB
MW East
Wyoming
Air Force
Texas St
UTEP
Sam Houston St
GCU is joining WCC in 2025 along with Seattle Univ.
@@dinog3052thanks for the info. I did not know that.
This makes a lot of sense but no GCU.
And the UTEP is either UTEP or NMST. We have been giving the slight edge to NMST.
I think TXST wants to be in the AAC to be be in same conference with UTSA, Rice, UNT & Tulane. If they leave it would probably be PAC-12 but it would have to be with Sam Houston St and UTEP. PAC-12 made a huge mistake not inviting UNLV. MWC IMO should also invite Sam Houston, UTEP and possibly NMST. Genetics has no credibility and blocks you if you disagree with him. Not sure you should refer to him if you elegant to grow your channel.
MWC should look at Tarleton! They are flushed with money, they are building a new arena for basketball. Their goals since moving up from D2 has been FBS. Until I see a shovel in the ground, I won’t believe that Sacramento will accomplish anything they are talking about!
We have mentioned Tarleton before.
A solid look, if they want to go FCS.
I would add Tarleton State and Abilene Christian to your list
We have mentioned Tarleton before.
It’s a great school if they choose to go to the FCS route.
Great video JY! I was wondering that myself if they were trying to procure Max schools like Northern Illinois & Toledo in order to convince NDSU & SDSU to join the conference. Would they want more MAC schools? I highly doubt this is even possible but it's an interesting possibility.
I agree with you that this is a good faith effort the show the NCAA that they're exhausting all regional possibilities in a few outside of regionality in order to calm them that they did everything that they could do and their due diligence to expand their conference within FBS. Then they can go after the FCS schools that they have been targeting all along. I have said that they need to get to 12 full-time members and possibly 14-16 total members to be viable. That all depends on which schools CBS and FOX told Gloria Nevarez to go after. Because I'm quite sure they told her something. I just have no clue what it is.
I have raised the possibility that perhaps they should go after a basketball or Olympic sports member to compensate for Hawaii. Getting someone from the WCC is a wish and not real. I suggested perhaps going into the Big West and getting a California school for the Olympic sports. Cal State Fullerton, Long Beach State, UCSB....there are a lot of options there. Just not Hawaii. Grab a basketball school from there that consistently makes the NCAA tournament so that way you have more teams that generate tournament shares to help the value of the conference.
Just some ideas.
Great comments. They will go for FBS first and see what happens.
I think all schools in phase 2 are great. But adding both NMST & UTEP could be problematic. It might be one or the other. NMST just seems to being more to the table, especially with BB as you have said on your show.
I believe the FCS schools are the MWC best option.
They will go hard after FBS prior to going to the FCS level.
Likely only 1 or 2 would be given the chance. And that is after several FBS invites.
Nothing against Sam Houston, but its very much an after thought in the Houston area. Most people (unless they went there) may not know they moved up to FBS. Tex st has made a lot more noise and is a much more well known school across the state. People from all of Texas would go there because of its location and being a "party" school. Outside of Houston, many regular people may not even know about Sam Houston the college.
You make a good point about people not knowing Sam Houston moved up. But you saying people may not know Sam Houston University in the state of Texas is probably the funniest thing I've read in a week. Do you know who that school is named after? You don't learn Texas history without learning that name. Texas State has been in a higher division longer. But Sam Houston University is well known in the state of Texas. Please believe me. Being from Texas, though, I'm not a fan of so many conferences being in this state. If the MWC does add. I hope they're the last ones. And the other Texas school options go replace ones that left. We don't really need any new conferences after that in the state. Also, if the AAC is interested in Texas State. That's probably where they'd end up. There or the MWC. The travel for the Pac is egregious for them.
Your right Sam Houston is an after thought in the Houston area, but so is Texas State in Austin and San Antonio. I don't agree that TxSt is more well known. We are at the bottom of the barrel here, we are talking about who is the 8th or 9th strongest brand in the state.
@lorenzohaynes3886 the Sun Belt would be perfect Culturally and Regionally for Sam Houston State, they love playing Southern based schools . Especially a likes of Louisiana Lafayette, Louisiana Monroe, Appalachian State, Georgia Southern, Arkansas State, Southern Miss, James Madison,Southern Alabama, Troy and Georgia State. SFA would be great to Especially whenever they move up ( Tarleton State could replace Texas State when they leave in having presence in Austin/San Antonio area Especially they fit more Culturally in the Sunbelt).
Im more excited for the Basketball aspect of MWC realigning, without Utah and Boise. UNLV might run the MWC in Basketball
Can we Add Richmond Spiders? I know NCAA frowns upon FCS school coming up but i like Richmond Spiders (big on Basketball) Villanova (Football) Portland State, maybe Syracuse for Both Basketball and Football. I dont know, theres soo many FCS programs in Football and Basketball that MWC can benefit bringing on to the conference, expanding geologically and some of those programs bring in LOTS OF MONEY, in sports they are big on. Richmond Spiders is my favorite team to add. I love their Basketball program and started to enjoy their nitty gritty football team.
MW or PAC 12 needs to grab as many Texas FBS schools as possible. Football in Texas survives no matter what. If a Texas school plays well known schools, people will come to watch. Even little Baylor and TCU have made a name for themselves . 20 years ago no one cared about Baylor or TCU for football. Over time they grew into great programs due to playing against well known schools.
2 Texas schools is highly possible.
News that TXST may be joining.
Neither will be paid for just any old Texas schools. The MWC won’t be paid much at all.
Both conferences will get paid for late time slots. They’re not going to simply add time slots currently deeded to other conferences because a bunch of Texas schools join. If y’all are kicking off at 9:30 pm local, maybe?
Toledo gets them into the Ohio media and recruiting markets.
MWC better hurry b4 PAC attacks again.
The MWC better hurry and attack the MAC, Big Sky and Sun Belt before the PAC attacks them. You see the hypocrisy, no?
The main challenge with the MW going forward is that the schools either don’t have or don’t pull the local market. But if you can get the Montana and Dakota schools to elevate to FBS you’ll have a geographically cohesive league that can command decent national attention, though that would probably be weeknight games.
My vote ~ my hope ~ is that the MWC adds New Mexico State!
It would be a strong add. No doubt.
Portland State might be an option.
Mwc please just take nmsu and utep 🙏😭
that would be great for basketball
Every one needs to come to their senses and do the reverse merger but add Gonzaga in basketball. Distribute media money to programs based on success.
i think that sailed with the aggressive pac lawsuit vs mw over poaching fees. as the reality of losing unlv forever sinks in, the original 4 exiting schools will be reconsidering why they left in the first place.
Reverse Merger does not make sense where schools have such different goals.
Bingo
@@Joe-m2d They are all mid major schools in G5 conferences. There is no difference between the PACX and the MW. Only the perception that the PAC12 logo is somehow more prestigious. The MW is taking a vast majority of their money in exit fees, etc. The new PAC is kidding themselves, they continue to mismanage themselves and are not going to be a P4 conference. Gloria Navarez is cleaning them out.
@@liljoe31 The PACX has not lost anything if they were to just do a reverse merger. I am guessing it could still happen and it would be a great G5 conference. Nobody in either conference has said it still cant happen. Its a stare down with lots of money at stake. The PACX has mismanaged the whole thing in the past and now again in 2024.
There's no reason for the MWC and Pac to be so stubborn and not merge.
Honestly adding SDSU & NDSU will be better for the central time zone. Add Texas state and let NIU & Toledo stay where they are.
Yes there is. $$$
No one made them leave in the first place.
Central time zone is important for TV. North Dakota St. fills one of the central time zone needs. Fan following is great. Lots of oil money. Great football program. On the border with Minnesota so adding Minnesota.
Not if it means JETLAG and travel hell for certain universities!
I think Genetics has some flawed thinking when it comes to his analysis. Sam Houston is far and away the worst pick of the four for a simple reason. It has the smallest fanbase and the lowest ceiling of the four for growth in a larger league. Sam Houston athletic facilities are by far the worst of the four. It's DMA is also the smallest of the four. Texas State straddles two of the fastest growing cities in the country, and has very good athletic facilities for a G5 program. While UTEP and NMST do share the same DMA, the DMA is actually much larger than the numbers say because El Paso is on the U.S.-Mexico border with the decently large city of Ciudad Juarez, which will have some spillover of viewership and fan support. I get it if you just look at certain numbers it may look like Sam Houston belongs above these others, but when you understand the university's athletic infrastructure, the DMA's potential for growth, fanbase support, and football history, the analysis Genetics presents doesn't really make sense.
The Mountain West Conference should add New M
Juarez does not care about UTEP sports at all. Maybe they would care about UTEP mens soccer, but UTEP doesn't have mens soccer.
The distance from Huntsville to Houston is about the same as San Marcos to Austin and San Antonio, and Houston is equal in population to both SA and Austin combined. The two are a lot more similar than you give them credit for.
@@dgart7434 Huntsville to Downtown Houston is 68 minutes. San Marcos to Downtown Austin is 38 minutes. I’d say that’s a noticeable difference in distance. Huntsville is more isolated than San Marcos is my point.
Understood.
It’s data worth digesting. It Wasn’t meant to be the end all, be all.
The MWC-5 schools are going to regret their move, especially the last foolish defector USU, which was the proverbial last lemming to sleepwalk over the cliff, and into the lap of the stillborn PAC-X...yeah, good luck with that! The irony is that besides the outrageous exit fees -- and legally-binding penalty fees -- the foolish defector schools and the PAC-X must pay penalty fees to the MWC (thank you very much!)...
...and to add insult to injury, the MWC used these funds owed by the PAC-X to not only retain the residual MWC members (6 full-time members plus Hawai'i), but also strengthen them financially -- especially UNLV and AF -- while also granting the latter two a NO PENALTY future exit to an AQ4 conferece! Hahaha!
In contrast, BSU, SDSU, FSU, CSU, and USU are trapped into a deal with the stillborn PAC-X in which they would have to fork over $30M to exit to an AQ4 conference and $40M to exit towards another conference! Hahaha - - good luck with that! UNLV and AF got the proverbial bag and a free/no penalty exit clause to the big-time conferences. Of course, the ACC isn't going to fall apart so no one is going to be going anywhere anytime soon -- FSU and Clemson will have the performance-based payments they sought from the ACC, as will other conferences soon enough, so the ACC isn't going to fall apart anytime soon.
But back to the PAC-X, if I were any of the defector schools, especially USU, I would be sweating bullets about the mess of a conference that I have joined, wondering why the AD and staff didn't conduct proper due dilligence prior to jumping the gun because the grass seemed greener on the other side. The MWC-5 are going to waste so much money on a lateral move into a conference that doesn't have the administrative leadership nor funding to make it a truly "best of the rest" G-5 conference. Yeah, good luck with that!
As a fan and alumnus of two MWC schools, I'm enjoying seeing that the PAC-X is stuck in its organizational development because it certainly doesn't have the funds to acquire the desired AAC f-ball schools alongside the preferred b-ball ones -- it can't even acquire the AAC schools just by themselves. Meanwhile, the MWC is more workman-like an practical, seeking to add new, emerging schools that are more easily acquireable and organizationally suitable.
And I greatly thank and appreciate Gloria's efforts in keeping the MWC together and protecting the interests of it's least visible and most vulnerable members, which all have immensely loyal fanbases in often remote and distant parts of the country. It's truly refreshing to see her run circles around Teresa at the PAC-X while standing up for the interests of the "little guy."
At this point, I'd be happy with any or all of Texas State, NMSU, UTEP, SFA, Arkansas St, Toledo, NIU, and any other school joining the MWC because part of the fun is not just adding rising programs to the conference but also foreclosing the number of schools that the PAC-X could acquire to get an 8th full member, particularly because the PAC office and school leadership would undoubtedly look down upon any of the minnow(s) added as merely being cupcake(s)/filler(s) to meet the minimum conference creation requirements. Conversely, any new members would be more highly regarded and respected by the MWC office and its member schools' leaderships.
The MWC has the PAC-X by the proverbial balls with that phony lawsuit that was filed. The PAC-X can't get out of its legal obligation, especially since the MWC will counter that the PAC-X sought control of the PAC-12 monies left behind to rebuild its own conference, thus making the residual monies left by the departing 10 schools into an effective penalty for their departure that allows the PAC-X to rebuild. Furthermore, the PAC-X has imposed its own $30M/$40M exit penalties upon its new members, so these are some of the many reasons why the PAC-X lawsuit is doomed.
The AAC schools aren't going to join the PAC-X due to 1) travel distance, time, and difficulty of reaching the rather remote locations of some PAC-X schools, especially for all their sports teams, 2) the atmospheric and weather differences between the relatively mild southeastern climate and the rather frigid northwestern one, and 3) PAC-X's lack of money to buy them out and subsifize their exit costs and travel costs, and 4) the organizational mess that the PAC-X has shown itself to be, including the public relations disasters it faces from its behaviors and the ongoing litigation that it has foolishly launched against the MWC -- no one wants to partner with such ac lousy organization like the PAC-X that launches frivolous lawsuits and can't be trusted because it renegged on a contractual arrangement to poach upon it's business partner's assets!
Have I made the case sufficiently for why the MWC is going to come out far ahead of the PAC-X, and why the departing MWC schools must be regretting the stupidity and short-sightedness of their ADs?
That’s some nice fan fiction.
The MWC is looking at a 50% reduction at minimum in TV revenue. El Paso and the Dakotas can’t save you from that.
The Pac definitely won’t be the Pac of old, but the schools that departed will get a pay raise. It helps to be with what would otherwise be >$10M/year schools in OSU and WSU. Might even have consistent OTA coverage, even if that’s the CW.
In any event, have a nice day.
@@PCSPounder You and the PAC-X groupies are dreaming, as TV execs have indicated (via radio and media personalities) that the PAC-X isn't of significantly better value for TV deals than whatever the reconstituted MWC will look like.
The W/OSU fans are daydreaming that they are still P-5 caliber schools -- they were the welfare queens of the P-5 and original PAC-12. W/OSU were able to secure better athletes because they played big brothers UO and UW, as well as USC and UCLA, but those days are over and top-caliber athletes won't be coming to Pulman or Beaverton from now on.
Unfortunately, it seems like W/OSU have refused to lower their financial figures on their future revenue expectation excel worksheets to account for not only the large drop-off in the brand names of the partner schools that they will be playing from now on, but also the diminished "national/regional" caliber of players that will be playing at W/OSU from now on...with Cam Ward being example #1.
Given the delusional visions of W/OSU, alongside the similarly unfounded dreams of the ADs/organizational leaders at the MWC-5 who departed, the entire exercise of creating a PAC-X was strategically misguided, prior to the poor execution in expansion that Teresa farcically implemented.
As it stands now, the MWC is poised to secure TX State, UTEP, and some other schools. It was a bad and rushed decision by the MWC-5 to abandon ship for a conference that had no TV guarantees and little strategic vision in its expansion efforts.
50 per cent reduction....says no one, especially if they add texas. already done. pac is the one w weak tv markets,except sdsu, and they are no LA or Orange county. have a good one...
Texas State needs to join the PAC 12. PAC has no other options
What exactly does TX state offer? The little bit of skin between the Long Horn and the nUTSAck? UTEP would be a better pick they have history with both MWC and the PAC
@@ReisterJP Compared to UTEP State offers more of everything--size, academics, money, and a large alumni base in the Texas Triangle. And don't forget their brief stint in the WAC before it dissolved.
@@ReisterJP oh I don’t know what they offer - maybe the giant media market between San Antonio through Austin and up through Dallas/Fort Worth? I’m not gonna bother to look up the numbers, but I’m gonna guess that’s a little bit bigger of a media market than all of East Texas combined. This isn’t about tradition or rivalries, it’s not about who has the coolest looking mascots or colors, it is about medium markets, plain and simple. If Texas State keeps winning then central Texas will broadcast the games and people will buy the merch.
@@serrincroft7771 hahaha nobody cares about tx state in Texas
@@ReisterJP Do you not get how this works? The media market is what it is. When the conference looks at the school, they see a giant Metro area around the school. And by the way, their athletics revenue would beg to differ-plenty of people care about them. I don’t happen to be one of them, I couldn’t care less about the state of Texas in general, so if you think you’re trashing my team you’re not. I don’t care at all.
Purdue
Lol.
JY will take that up with Steve.
I definitely would take anything Genetics says with a huge grain of salt. Him and his pal, Tony Altimore, have no credibility.
What exactly is your argument for UTEP and NM Staye in any possible way enhancing the brand value of MWC football?
New media market and attainable programs.
@@TheBigMountainPodcast thanks for the response! Let's compare Toledo, a city I know fairly well, compared to El Paso and Las Cruces: 1. The Toledo Rockets deliver a well established record of winning in DI play, neither UTEP or NM State can claim that. 2. Ohio is a critical recruiting ground to every program in DI football; west Texas AKA for Eastern NM is not high value recruiting area. 3. Games in the Eastern TZ are important for additional brand exposure, Toledo provides it. Media markets related to El Paso and Lac Cruces are for the most part meaningless. I totally agree that Sam Houston State should be a top priority, Houston market, one of the best recruiting grounds in the nation.
@@michaelsimler7218 - You are a
Food-Under-Car-Keys-Tiny-Austin-Robert-Dayton
if you think MAC universities are leaving for the
Food-Under-Car-Keys-Ice-Nathan-Gone
Mountain West!
Just get Texas State & San Antonio
Texas-San Antonio ain't leaving the AAC for the dumpster fire that the Mountain West has become!
MWC should go after Texas State, Northern Illinois and the top FCS schools. UNLV should give the PAC 12 the middle finger.
You are a
Food-Under-Car-Keys-Tiny-Austin-Robert-Dayton
if you think MAC universities are leaving for the
Food-Under-Car-Keys-Ice-Nathan-Gone
Mountain West!
@@psychopathyoutubeemployees280 😂