Remember, i didn't restore this, im not sure who did most of it, i know lucien did the pipes from what i have heard, i merely reassembled it. It is leaking. Lucien did say it needed work. Solution? Add a vacuum pump. 😅Don't mistake this video for me getting it to work! it already worked, it was just in pieces :D DONT DO IT LIKE THAT.... honestly. i have likely done something wrong. comment below what it is, but don't be a grumpy git about it thats all i ask :D a note. the midi mod will involve zero modification, it will basically be an overlay to the machine. got the concept down, but not all of the parts have arrived yet.
22:18 definitely wont be taken out of context xD .. also an alternative idea would be a device, that stamps these rolls? Could be too big of a project tho.
With today's technology, you would be tempted to say that such a project is impossible without a microcontroller. And here is the thing, just pumps and pipes and a roll of paper. Look mum no computer, indeed. 😁
You could have argued that MIDI was an innovation that would have happened eventually due to its sheer necessity, but the piano roll system is definitely inspired by these rolls of paper
These "rolls of paper" *are* piano rolls. The originals. I wouldn't say MIDI piano rolls are "inspired by" them as much as they are a direct digital implementation of them, right down to the name.
Before the computers the paper tape mechanism was the way to automate complex machinery such Jacquard looms to weave complex patterns. Punch card technology used in computers to store programs and store data until the mid 1980s was directly inspired by this technology. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacquard_machine
It's actually very similar to the way the laser diode tracks the data spiral in a CD. There are four sensors in a diamond formation. The top and bottom form the feedback mechanism for lens focus: The spot will expand or contract, from a circle to an oval, when out of focus. The two sides are the servo for keeping the beam centered on the track -- exactly like the roll sensors here.
Sam, quite a number of tunes were composed for the pianola in a lot of cases by little or unknown composers and quite a number of these tunes can be considered lost media so I hope you record them and archive them.
I've always wondered what the red line is on the rolls, and i just looked it up "Young invented a wavy red line, printed on the roll, to be followed with a pointer attached to the tempo lever, so that the ebb and flow of musical phrasing could be measured and reproduced. The new device was called the Metrostyle,"
@@morbidmanmusic Before everything turned into computer accessories, people actually had to do some *real* engineering to solve challenges. Look up how the first satellite pictures from the Moon were taken and sent back to Earth. It's mind blowing.
Hmm…I grew up (1970’s, US) with a player piano in the house, and never saw a roll with those lines until today’s video. I expect it’d make the roll-authoring process more difficult, since my understanding is that they typically start out with a human pianist playing the song into a recording machine. That person making the roll would normally put the phrasing and rubato into the music as they played it - it was already in the rolls that I’ve experienced. To make Metrostyle, they’d need to play to a strict metronome beat while recording the roll.
These pre-electromechanical designs always stun me with their ingenuity. It wasn't even made that long ago yet it feels like some kind of lost technology, that steampunk appeal. Speed control and roll error correction implemented with completely analog feedback, I can't imagine the time taken to get that just right.
@@knightrider691 Might need to find some way to multiplex more MIDI channels than the 16 it allows normally haha. Although orchestra-scale MIDI was probably a thing and likely had some solution to having more than 16 channels.
@@backacheache MIDI orchestra yeah! next project street organ!, like with drums, strings, trumpets and stuff... Those also use punch paper rolls (or is it cardboard stacks? whatever it has holes and it plays stuff like a piano roll but on more mechanically linked instruments and pipe organ.
For the vacuum motor, it’s more like a 5-cylinder 2-stroke engine, so there’s a power pulse every 72 degrees - close enough that it doesn’t need a flywheel.
Right in the feels. There’s something poetic about finishing somebody else’s dream like this. I hope it will stay in the museum for a long time and delight many.
My uncle restored and collected player pianos. The are incredible machines. His house was full of them and he had no other furnature. Anyway thanx for this.
Amazing!!!! Somewhere I heard that there are 'test' rolls that test each key and function -- handy to have. And I think that there are a few companies still producing the rolls -- maybe even with modern songs! But yes -- MIDI would be awesome, as well as a vacuum pump and no more pedaling!!!!
Very nice! I did notice a couple of notes during that Beethoven roll that weren't working, so it might be worth a quick check once you've got everything together in case there's a blockage or something. Still I'm very impressed and I really liked that demo of the player action before you fitted it into the case. Not seen a demo of a real action working like that before.
It's incredible how you just throw yourself into these things - a player piano, a pipe organ, a telephone exchange... - and apparently in no time, it not only works for you but connects up to other kit too! Re your comment about being criticised for 'not doing it the right way', I don't see any damage being done, and you get results while I'm still scratching my head and working out the theory 🙂
This thing runs on lack of air, the organ runs on a surplus of air, they sound like perfect companions! Have you tried connecting them, maybe they start playing without any outside effort! 🙂
Ahhhh the "fumfa numfa" He knows all the technical blurb 👍 Seriously Sam, great that you can make use of it and hopefully he will be smiling down on your museum.. Wonderful video 🥲
I bet there is enough vacuum generated off the intake of the organs blower, where you could split a portion of it off to power the piano. Organ powered player piano!
Grew up in a house with one, not the same brand of piano but the mechanism looks the same. Really nice to see what was happening behind the scenes. I appreciate the work of the man who restored it for us even more now. Thanks,
Pianoroll puncher would be handy to make new custom pianorolls. You know, paper is a durable medium for information storage. Also, player piano can control other things, make it have not only MIDI IN, but also MIDI OUT :)
These are beautiful, beautiful machines, aren't they? My grandparents had one when i was a kid (1970s-early '90s). I remember how tricky it was to find and maintain the rhythm for songs at the start, especially if you didn't know the song on the roll! I keep meaning to look up when QRS stopped manufacturing new rolls. It must have been during or after at least the 1970s, since one of the rolls my grandparents had was "Tie a Yellow Ribbon Round the Ole Oak Tree" from '73.
We had a Gulbransen player piano when I was a little kid. I always overdid it on the old pumpy pumpy do, which would break the bellows. Still, a magical initiation into the world of making music, and a lifetime of joy…
I think the reason for the weights in the keys is so that you can decide if you want the keys to move on their own or if you want to be able to play along the original tune. Maybe there were even tunes playing the second voice so that one could practice playing.
When I grew up we used to have a piano almost exactly like this, though before we got it the pianola mechanism had been removed. But it still had all the recognizable bits like the "window" where you load the scroll as well as a removable panel around the piano pedals where the pump pedals would've gone. It's awesome to finally see what our piano would've looked like on the inside when it was still a pianola.
I've owned one of these for over 45 years. Very expensive to restore all the bellows, vacuum lines ect. Mine has the foot pedal pump but it also has the electric motor option to drive the pump and the option to slow it down or speed it up. I noticed that many of your keys are not fully dropping. It sounds good so far but you'll need some calibration/tuning, to get it up to par sound wise and performance wise. I'll never get rid of mine. Only wish there was a way to turn the volume down since they play so damn loud :) Cheers
I have a 'Dale Forty' Pianola, had it 28 years and LOVE it ! You certainly need some practice on yours - no need to pump those pedals so furiously unless you have a massive leak somewhere. It always amazes me to think someone worked out all that mechanism to make a Piano play itself, over 100 years ago ! My machine was built in 1927 and started its life on Jersey, in a Rectory, but was brought over to the mainland at the beginning of the war, so it would be safer. I bought it from the original family that owned it, in Canterbury. They really are incredible machines !
Omg we had one of these in my garage as a kid forever and we had about 300 rolls all different sizes… some of the tunes were epic… such fond memories. My dad rubbed the whole thing down and pai ted it black laquer it looked lovely. Ended up giving it away as noone would buy it! It looks the exact model we had.
I had no idea I had any interest in self playing pianos but I was sucked into this video from beginning to end. What a fascinating machine. I have seen these things in person. I am aware they exist. I never stopped to wonder, "Hey. How does that thing work?" It's so elegantly simple. Two things. First, 10:43, why does the tracking mechanism move both cylinders, all the gears and chains and all that mess around when you could just design it so it just moves the one bar with all the pinholes instead? Thing two: You have to see if you can get ahold of a piano roll with the with that song from the HBO show Westworld. I think its called the Sweetwater Theme on the Westworld sound track. I had that song on loop in my head the whole time I was watching this. Awesome video.
There's a vacuum line hooked up behind each pinhole in that bar and originally these lines would have been made of lead. Even with modern soft tubing moving that many connections would be asking for trouble.
My college roommate bought one of these that was on a riverboat its entire life. When we took it apart we found loads of old coins and trinkets from the early 1900's. All of the tubing and bellows were hard as a rock so we never got it working as a player piano, still fun to work on though.
Used to see these in various places over the years, guaranteed never in working condition, in all honesty just looking at them, the paper rolls with punched squares etc and consideration to the manufacturing era - I had my doubts any of them ever worked? A different generation of skill, workmanship and ingenuity!
The "snake bites" holes are actually controlling part of the expression system emphasizing notes. (left ones for bass, right ones for treble) Not sustain. For sustain you can just make the hole longer in the paper. (Edit: No you can't as pointed out below correctly)
That's not the same. Holding a note only keeps the damper of that note off the string. Sustain keeps all the dampers off all the strings. This sounds different because of all kinds of harmonics sounding from strings that are not played.
Although I’ve never seen the “snake bites” holes before, I believe @Muiskkabinett might be correct about them. Player pianos do commonly have a pneumatic to operate the sustain pedal, but it would be controlled by a hole along one side of the roll, and the hole continues for the entire time the sustain pedal should be pressed. At least that’s the way it was on the rolls that I’ve seen. I grew up with a player piano built in 1971, and its “soft” mechanism (an upright piano, so “soft” was just moving the hammers forward to shorten their throw) was split into bass & treble halves, pneumatically operated, although in this case it only had manual buttons to control their vacuum signals. So perhaps the “snake bites” holes were an automated way to soften some notes just before they were struck.
Good idea to know the names of the parts of a piano. For instance, the damper assembly system is called the damper "action", and the hammer assembly system is called the hammer "action", and the keyboard assembly system is called the keyboard "action". I watched other TH-cam videos where professionals who actually work on pianos and pianolas and orchestrions know the names. And you are right to call the harp a harp. 😀
Thanks! Yeah I did it on purpose that. It's more a demonstration to show that words are not needed when you can put things together! I'm not a words person, definitions come second to physical demonstration. a demonstration that not knowing definitions should not stop anyone tackling projects respectfully.
You amaze me with your knowledge..... only very few people know that it is indeed called the 'boardy-woo-di-woo-woo'.... such a depth of esoteric knowledge!!
A pleasure to see you at the weekend Sam, you have done very well with getting it back together ! Interesting thing about the moving keys, we in the UK were not big on that as an idea, to the extent that most instruments actually had a physical lock to stop them even wiggling ! Yours has this feature, a moving paddle under the keys, so if you get any issues with repetition now you have lightened them (I really do not think you will notice a difference) you can just activate that, so best of both worlds ! They were much more keen on moving keys on american instruments, so anything you look at from over there will normally move. We will pop down and visit when we get five minutes ! C
I am working at the Grotrian Steinweg company in Brunswick and we have the same Playerpiano standing around waiting for restauration. So nice to see yours playing so well!
Oh, the self-centering is brilliant! It's like a little pneumatic line-tracker, like you'd make with IR sensors these days, and it compensates directly if the holes get covered. Self-sustaining equilibrium. That's awesome..
Ya know, you and a couple others on youtube have really inspired me. I appreciate that so ya know, thanks dude. Because of that I've been playign around with circuits, learning bits and bobs, and finally this week i've finished, all zipped up in a case etc, my first couple projects. A PCB project guitar distortion pedal, and more excitingly, my first proper from-a-vero-board-layout layout image stereo resonant low pass, with bonus in and out trim to let it overdrive itself. It's in an old drill bit box and looks awesome. And it's all because of dumb-ass vids of people making cool shit. You very much included!
It never ceases to amaze me the lengths that engineers went to when designing complex mechanisms. That vacuum engine is a work of art - I was so disappointed when I found out car engines don’t fire sequentially like that!
i think its more a balance issue when it comes to heavy things like pistons and con rods! 4 pistons the outside 2 are matched and inside 2, 5 piston is a little less even but 6 gets back to being balances laterally and so on. mainly balance and crankshaft load and what not. not such an issue with wood :D
Also, most car engines are 4-cycle and only fire on every other down-stroke, so a 5-cylinder engine would fire every 144 degrees of rotation. This 5-pneumatic motor can fire on every down-stroke, so it’s once every 72 degrees. So no flywheel is needed.
yes im not talking about the firing degree. more the literal mass of the weights laterally on the crankshaft, flywheel weight logitudinal. a 5 cylinder engine doesnt fire sequentally either, if it did it would shake itself to bits. its an over simplification im aware. @@kc9scott
That's so cool, love human ingenuity sometimes. And the putting it back together process just shows any plonker can do anything if they just give it a go, well done though Sam for figuring out where parts went.
I would have never guessed that they worked off vacuum, but it seems so obvious now. I love how complicated it looks but when you break it down in to its individual components it seems so simple.
My grandparents had a player piano. As a young lad I was fascinated by how it worked. Bellows, hoses, cranks... it had a funny smell. That little drop down door at the front of the keyboard on yours looks so familiar to me 🙂
I watched your channel for the past few years ,it was the telephone exchange that i first saw. 90% of the time i have no idea what your talking about when it comes to electronics but i find it all fascinating. Its great that people like yourself keep all these instruments and machine's alive.
What a great video! I never would have guessed that the way it reads the roll is by pulling a vacuum against the paper and the holes break the vacuum on the different notes to operate the valve. Also amazed at how well it stayed in tune while being moved. Obviously not perfectly so, but it wasn't as terrible as I thought it might be.
Amazing! I live in Boston, MA USA and in the early and mid 1990s (and probably for a long time before that) an old man would somehow bring one of these player pianos to Harvard Square (in Cambridge - not UK :-) ) and busk with it *outside* on the street most weekend nights. He would sit there pumping the pedals and people would stand around on the side of the road and put money in the ole basket. I never saw the piano get delivered - he must have had a small van of some kind.
If Tocatta and Fugue in D-minor is typically an organ's theme, then the player piano is The Entertainer. I'm surprised that one wasn't on a roll somewhere. But it still had a neat playlist none the less.
Wow, that mechanism is beyond complicated and wow to you for fixing it up - love the explanations as you go - thank you so much. You should add a big lever on the wall to one side so that Henry can take over from the peddling.
You could play it while it is playing, Throw in some harmonies and extra big chords. Is very cool, not how i would have guessed how thay work at all. A midi controler would be great. If you got a bit of paper with holes for all the D F and A notes you could play a 7 octave 21 note D minor (saddest of all the chords) as long as one atmosphere is enough presure
The red line on the rolls indicates tempo variations. You most follow the line wite te leve of tempo thats extacts below the red ondulated line. This is to add fell to the pianola.
8:24 - I know i am getting ahead of you but hot damn that paper tape reader is sooo cooool, what geniuses. the whole blimmin thing is pneumatically powered
thank you I was going nuts trying to find the name of the composition. It's been in my head on repeat since I saw the trailer for this episode on facebook 🥲
Hey. Great episode. I love all your work, as crazy as it sometimes get, but so much joy in electronics and mechanics. As a board member of the Amsterdam Pianola Museum I love it that you now showed a pneumatic/mechanical machine, with all the amazing technique created ca. 110 years ago. This is an 88-note system, with the in 1908 standardised roll type for common player piano's. You played every roll way to fast haha. Was fun to see. Every roll begins with a tempo suggestion, and that red line suggest where to slow down or accelerate. And the real fun is to carefully play with some tempo freedom and lots of dynamics (pumping more or less air). Then suddenly the mechanical sound disappears and it becomes music. Because that is the reason it is an air-sucking mechanism. It was the only way to accurately play PIANO and FORTE instantly by changing the pumping energy. Success with the museum, the crazy marvellous organ and now this ancient relic of old pneumatic fun.
I can't honestly say I ever looked at a self playing piano and thought "well that looks simple, I could knock one out in my garage!" hats off to you for your attempts as always
My grandparents had one of these. When i was a wee nipper I used to pump the pedals as hard as possible to make the tunes play ridiculously fast. I never knew how interesting the mechanism was inside.
Well! It's unsalted beef tallow for ALL my squeeky bushed bearings, from now on! This was a lot of fun, thanks. I learned today that player pianos have auto-tracking, and that's amazing. Do you realize that this is the very first recording technology? It's literally an analog recording of the performance. They even used to edit them by hand, cutting and pasting bits of paper together, and even punching out the glissandos and fancy trils by hand. I find it incredibly facinating to hear 100, 150 year old interpretations of music -- it's often different from how we hear the same pieces today. In partiular, it's always amazing to listen to the playing of the world's very first recording star, Scott Joplin.
When you see someone just casually tuning a whole flippin piano on the side of their actual complicated enough task, you know you've been looking at a special kind of crazy genius.
Seeing this video reminds me of some of the time I spent with my Grandfather as a kid. He was always fixing player pianos and recruited me to hold various nuts and bolts as he combined one of these pianos and a pipe organ. Thanks for putting this video together!
My piano, a 1960s Duo-Art Aeolian, pushes up on the keys at the rear where they meet the hammer mechanism. So by design, the keys go down. Mine also, thankfully, has a built in vacuum pump. They were advertised as the only dual play piano; pedal or electric pump.
Remember, i didn't restore this, im not sure who did most of it, i know lucien did the pipes from what i have heard, i merely reassembled it.
It is leaking. Lucien did say it needed work. Solution? Add a vacuum pump. 😅Don't mistake this video for me getting it to work! it already worked, it was just in pieces :D
DONT DO IT LIKE THAT....
honestly. i have likely done something wrong. comment below what it is, but don't be a grumpy git about it thats all i ask :D
a note. the midi mod will involve zero modification, it will basically be an overlay to the machine. got the concept down, but not all of the parts have arrived yet.
After the midi mod, please play the pianola using the game boy 😁
22:18 definitely wont be taken out of context xD
.. also an alternative idea would be a device, that stamps these rolls? Could be too big of a project tho.
@@DiverseGreen-Anonyep it has been spoken about! Hoping to find an older version to modernise as lasers don't seem to do great
After the midi mod, connect it to the organ for AIR MUSIC!
Guessing it would not be too much of a push to make an optical reader for the roles and link it to a MIDI out.
Be careful with that rewind switch modification: If you play classical music backwards, it'll de-compose.
😂 this comment needs more love!
Great, great comment.
You sir are a genius
🔥🔥
Or it will just sound like Boulez... 😁
With today's technology, you would be tempted to say that such a project is impossible without a microcontroller. And here is the thing, just pumps and pipes and a roll of paper. Look mum no computer, indeed. 😁
It's a shame now adays that also myself included opt for microcontrollers. It's such a boring means to do things haha
Where do you think they got the idea for MIDI? 😏
You could have argued that MIDI was an innovation that would have happened eventually due to its sheer necessity, but the piano roll system is definitely inspired by these rolls of paper
These "rolls of paper" *are* piano rolls. The originals. I wouldn't say MIDI piano rolls are "inspired by" them as much as they are a direct digital implementation of them, right down to the name.
Before the computers the paper tape mechanism was the way to automate complex machinery such Jacquard looms to weave complex patterns. Punch card technology used in computers to store programs and store data until the mid 1980s was directly inspired by this technology. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacquard_machine
I love this episode of Look Mum No Electricity.
I am beyond jealous. I love this kind of challenge. I'm sure Mr. Nunes would be smiling right now.
He was my friend for 40 years. It was hard to see these instruments leave his home, but he knew they were going to good homes. Thanks Sam!
That centering mechanism is so elegant 😮
right. I was following it closely and watched how it shifted left and right while the roll made its way through 🙂
It's actually very similar to the way the laser diode tracks the data spiral in a CD. There are four sensors in a diamond formation. The top and bottom form the feedback mechanism for lens focus: The spot will expand or contract, from a circle to an oval, when out of focus. The two sides are the servo for keeping the beam centered on the track -- exactly like the roll sensors here.
@@nickwallette6201 fascinating, I didn’t know that
Sam, quite a number of tunes were composed for the pianola in a lot of cases by little or unknown composers and quite a number of these tunes can be considered lost media so I hope you record them and archive them.
I've always wondered what the red line is on the rolls, and i just looked it up
"Young invented a wavy red line, printed on the roll, to be followed with a pointer attached to the tempo lever, so that the ebb and flow of musical phrasing could be measured and reproduced. The new device was called the Metrostyle,"
There were some smart people with limited tech!
@@morbidmanmusic Before everything turned into computer accessories, people actually had to do some *real* engineering to solve challenges. Look up how the first satellite pictures from the Moon were taken and sent back to Earth. It's mind blowing.
Hmm…I grew up (1970’s, US) with a player piano in the house, and never saw a roll with those lines until today’s video. I expect it’d make the roll-authoring process more difficult, since my understanding is that they typically start out with a human pianist playing the song into a recording machine. That person making the roll would normally put the phrasing and rubato into the music as they played it - it was already in the rolls that I’ve experienced. To make Metrostyle, they’d need to play to a strict metronome beat while recording the roll.
Some rolls were made from notes on paper to holes punched by hand and they were very mono-metric. It was a gimmick too.
I have a player with over a hundred + rolls. You know you can still get modern music on piano roll from QRS. Love the video as usual
!!!
❤ I grew up in Braunschweig and my mum worked for Grotian Steinweg 😊
These pre-electromechanical designs always stun me with their ingenuity. It wasn't even made that long ago yet it feels like some kind of lost technology, that steampunk appeal. Speed control and roll error correction implemented with completely analog feedback, I can't imagine the time taken to get that just right.
Great addition to the museum! I can't wait to see it play MIDI, maybe even along with the organ to have some kind of duet!
This museum is not an orchestra? 😊
@@backacheache it could be a full blown orchestra just one that you never have seen before.
Yeah, then throw some black midi at it like rush e
@@knightrider691 Might need to find some way to multiplex more MIDI channels than the 16 it allows normally haha. Although orchestra-scale MIDI was probably a thing and likely had some solution to having more than 16 channels.
@@backacheache MIDI orchestra yeah! next project street organ!, like with drums, strings, trumpets and stuff... Those also use punch paper rolls (or is it cardboard stacks? whatever it has holes and it plays stuff like a piano roll but on more mechanically linked instruments and pipe organ.
Mad scientist / inventor + music = creative awesomeness !
Fascinating that they used a five cylinder engine to provide smooth motion to the roll mechanism! Just like my old Volvo V70 T5!
For the vacuum motor, it’s more like a 5-cylinder 2-stroke engine, so there’s a power pulse every 72 degrees - close enough that it doesn’t need a flywheel.
Right in the feels. There’s something poetic about finishing somebody else’s dream like this.
I hope it will stay in the museum for a long time and delight many.
My uncle restored and collected player pianos. The are incredible machines. His house was full of them and he had no other furnature. Anyway thanx for this.
I absolutely love getting to see the insides of musical mechanical foofernoofers like this. ❤
Amazing!!!! Somewhere I heard that there are 'test' rolls that test each key and function -- handy to have. And I think that there are a few companies still producing the rolls -- maybe even with modern songs! But yes -- MIDI would be awesome, as well as a vacuum pump and no more pedaling!!!!
Very nice! I did notice a couple of notes during that Beethoven roll that weren't working, so it might be worth a quick check once you've got everything together in case there's a blockage or something. Still I'm very impressed and I really liked that demo of the player action before you fitted it into the case. Not seen a demo of a real action working like that before.
5 in the lower register are not connected due to a leak.
It's incredible how you just throw yourself into these things - a player piano, a pipe organ, a telephone exchange... - and apparently in no time, it not only works for you but connects up to other kit too! Re your comment about being criticised for 'not doing it the right way', I don't see any damage being done, and you get results while I'm still scratching my head and working out the theory 🙂
You should visit the mechanical music museum at Kew
Brilliant. All it needs is a Furby in Leiderhosen. Great sound too.
I have no idea how you manage to do these things. To me it's nothing short of amazing.
This thing runs on lack of air, the organ runs on a surplus of air, they sound like perfect companions! Have you tried connecting them, maybe they start playing without any outside effort! 🙂
Infinite musical power!
That idea really sucks....no, it really blows!! OK, it's both 😁 (absolutely no offence intended)
You've just invented perpetual commotion.
Ahhhh the "fumfa numfa" He knows all the technical blurb 👍
Seriously Sam, great that you can make use of it and hopefully he will be smiling down on your museum.. Wonderful video 🥲
Can confirm 🤣
Awesome job as always. Cute to see you use this old Tony's screwdriver too
I didn't actually use Tony's screwdriver in this vid funnily enough! Screws were either too big or small!
Absolute quality haha, one day I’ll drag the wife and kids along as we’ll visit your museum dude it seems weeeellllll koooolllll 😁😁😁😁
I bet there is enough vacuum generated off the intake of the organs blower, where you could split a portion of it off to power the piano. Organ powered player piano!
That is so fascinating, I always wanted to know how one of these things work. And it perfectly fits into the spirit of the museum!
Grew up in a house with one, not the same brand of piano but the mechanism looks the same. Really nice to see what was happening behind the scenes. I appreciate the work of the man who restored it for us even more now. Thanks,
You're doing such a service to humanity by preserving this piece of history so i salute you ✌️😎
Pianoroll puncher would be handy to make new custom pianorolls. You know, paper is a durable medium for information storage. Also, player piano can control other things, make it have not only MIDI IN, but also MIDI OUT :)
These are beautiful, beautiful machines, aren't they? My grandparents had one when i was a kid (1970s-early '90s). I remember how tricky it was to find and maintain the rhythm for songs at the start, especially if you didn't know the song on the roll!
I keep meaning to look up when QRS stopped manufacturing new rolls. It must have been during or after at least the 1970s, since one of the rolls my grandparents had was "Tie a Yellow Ribbon Round the Ole Oak Tree" from '73.
What a neat mechanism! No chips or transistors needed, just mechanics and air wow!
We had a Gulbransen player piano when I was a little kid. I always overdid it on the old pumpy pumpy do, which would break the bellows. Still, a magical initiation into the world of making music, and a lifetime of joy…
I think the reason for the weights in the keys is so that you can decide if you want the keys to move on their own or if you want to be able to play along the original tune. Maybe there were even tunes playing the second voice so that one could practice playing.
When I grew up we used to have a piano almost exactly like this, though before we got it the pianola mechanism had been removed. But it still had all the recognizable bits like the "window" where you load the scroll as well as a removable panel around the piano pedals where the pump pedals would've gone. It's awesome to finally see what our piano would've looked like on the inside when it was still a pianola.
I've owned one of these for over 45 years. Very expensive to restore all the bellows, vacuum lines ect. Mine has the foot pedal pump but it also has the electric motor option to drive the pump and the option to slow it down or speed it up. I noticed that many of your keys are not fully dropping. It sounds good so far but you'll need some calibration/tuning, to get it up to par sound wise and performance wise. I'll never get rid of mine. Only wish there was a way to turn the volume down since they play so damn loud :) Cheers
Glad too see someone with capable hands got hold of it and it's seeing the light of day again.👌👍
I have a 'Dale Forty' Pianola, had it 28 years and LOVE it ! You certainly need some practice on yours - no need to pump those pedals so furiously unless you have a massive leak somewhere. It always amazes me to think someone worked out all that mechanism to make a Piano play itself, over 100 years ago ! My machine was built in 1927 and started its life on Jersey, in a Rectory, but was brought over to the mainland at the beginning of the war, so it would be safer. I bought it from the original family that owned it, in Canterbury. They really are incredible machines !
I really admire your patience and technical ability...
Unbelievable a young guy like you with so many knowledge about this kind of instruments. Keep going my man.
Omg we had one of these in my garage as a kid forever and we had about 300 rolls all different sizes… some of the tunes were epic… such fond memories. My dad rubbed the whole thing down and pai ted it black laquer it looked lovely. Ended up giving it away as noone would buy it! It looks the exact model we had.
I had no idea I had any interest in self playing pianos but I was sucked into this video from beginning to end. What a fascinating machine. I have seen these things in person. I am aware they exist. I never stopped to wonder, "Hey. How does that thing work?" It's so elegantly simple. Two things. First, 10:43, why does the tracking mechanism move both cylinders, all the gears and chains and all that mess around when you could just design it so it just moves the one bar with all the pinholes instead? Thing two: You have to see if you can get ahold of a piano roll with the with that song from the HBO show Westworld. I think its called the Sweetwater Theme on the Westworld sound track. I had that song on loop in my head the whole time I was watching this. Awesome video.
There's a vacuum line hooked up behind each pinhole in that bar and originally these lines would have been made of lead. Even with modern soft tubing moving that many connections would be asking for trouble.
My college roommate bought one of these that was on a riverboat its entire life. When we took it apart we found loads of old coins and trinkets from the early 1900's. All of the tubing and bellows were hard as a rock so we never got it working as a player piano, still fun to work on though.
This is the best video ever. Amazing. Even after knowing that the keys auto press from gravity, it was still creepy to watch. Wonderful invention.
sounds so cool to assemble it without the dampers installed
Used to see these in various places over the years, guaranteed never in working condition, in all honesty just looking at them, the paper rolls with punched squares etc and consideration to the manufacturing era - I had my doubts any of them ever worked? A different generation of skill, workmanship and ingenuity!
The "snake bites" holes are actually controlling part of the expression system emphasizing notes. (left ones for bass, right ones for treble) Not sustain. For sustain you can just make the hole longer in the paper. (Edit: No you can't as pointed out below correctly)
That's not the same. Holding a note only keeps the damper of that note off the string. Sustain keeps all the dampers off all the strings. This sounds different because of all kinds of harmonics sounding from strings that are not played.
@@diederikvandedijk You are correct you'll be missing out on the harmonics. Forgot about that one.
Although I’ve never seen the “snake bites” holes before, I believe @Muiskkabinett might be correct about them. Player pianos do commonly have a pneumatic to operate the sustain pedal, but it would be controlled by a hole along one side of the roll, and the hole continues for the entire time the sustain pedal should be pressed. At least that’s the way it was on the rolls that I’ve seen. I grew up with a player piano built in 1971, and its “soft” mechanism (an upright piano, so “soft” was just moving the hammers forward to shorten their throw) was split into bass & treble halves, pneumatically operated, although in this case it only had manual buttons to control their vacuum signals. So perhaps the “snake bites” holes were an automated way to soften some notes just before they were struck.
Good idea to know the names of the parts of a piano. For instance, the damper assembly system is called the damper "action", and the hammer assembly system is called the hammer "action", and the keyboard assembly system is called the keyboard "action". I watched other TH-cam videos where professionals who actually work on pianos and pianolas and orchestrions know the names. And you are right to call the harp a harp. 😀
Thanks! Yeah I did it on purpose that. It's more a demonstration to show that words are not needed when you can put things together! I'm not a words person, definitions come second to physical demonstration. a demonstration that not knowing definitions should not stop anyone tackling projects respectfully.
You amaze me with your knowledge..... only very few people know that it is indeed called the 'boardy-woo-di-woo-woo'.... such a depth of esoteric knowledge!!
A pleasure to see you at the weekend Sam, you have done very well with getting it back together !
Interesting thing about the moving keys, we in the UK were not big on that as an idea, to the extent that most instruments actually had a physical lock to stop them even wiggling ! Yours has this feature, a moving paddle under the keys, so if you get any issues with repetition now you have lightened them (I really do not think you will notice a difference) you can just activate that, so best of both worlds !
They were much more keen on moving keys on american instruments, so anything you look at from over there will normally move.
We will pop down and visit when we get five minutes !
C
I am working at the Grotrian Steinweg company in Brunswick and we have the same Playerpiano standing around waiting for restauration. So nice to see yours playing so well!
Oh, the self-centering is brilliant! It's like a little pneumatic line-tracker, like you'd make with IR sensors these days, and it compensates directly if the holes get covered. Self-sustaining equilibrium. That's awesome..
Ya know, you and a couple others on youtube have really inspired me. I appreciate that so ya know, thanks dude.
Because of that I've been playign around with circuits, learning bits and bobs, and finally this week i've finished, all zipped up in a case etc, my first couple projects. A PCB project guitar distortion pedal, and more excitingly, my first proper from-a-vero-board-layout layout image stereo resonant low pass, with bonus in and out trim to let it overdrive itself. It's in an old drill bit box and looks awesome.
And it's all because of dumb-ass vids of people making cool shit. You very much included!
Ahh! So that's WHY the motor look like it does. I have seen it in other videos and has always wondered why.
Very interesting!
Thank you!
Always amazing to see how ingenious people have been in the past to build things
It never ceases to amaze me the lengths that engineers went to when designing complex mechanisms. That vacuum engine is a work of art - I was so disappointed when I found out car engines don’t fire sequentially like that!
i think its more a balance issue when it comes to heavy things like pistons and con rods! 4 pistons the outside 2 are matched and inside 2, 5 piston is a little less even but 6 gets back to being balances laterally and so on. mainly balance and crankshaft load and what not. not such an issue with wood :D
Also, most car engines are 4-cycle and only fire on every other down-stroke, so a 5-cylinder engine would fire every 144 degrees of rotation. This 5-pneumatic motor can fire on every down-stroke, so it’s once every 72 degrees. So no flywheel is needed.
yes im not talking about the firing degree. more the literal mass of the weights laterally on the crankshaft, flywheel weight logitudinal. a 5 cylinder engine doesnt fire sequentally either, if it did it would shake itself to bits. its an over simplification im aware. @@kc9scott
That's so cool, love human ingenuity sometimes. And the putting it back together process just shows any plonker can do anything if they just give it a go, well done though Sam for figuring out where parts went.
I'm in the US, I can't ever be a grumpy git. But I can say thanks for the journey. Great video.
I would have never guessed that they worked off vacuum, but it seems so obvious now. I love how complicated it looks but when you break it down in to its individual components it seems so simple.
My grandparents had a player piano. As a young lad I was fascinated by how it worked. Bellows, hoses, cranks... it had a funny smell. That little drop down door at the front of the keyboard on yours looks so familiar to me 🙂
I'm just waiting for the day you mess around with a full on fairground/dutch street organ :)
I watched your channel for the past few years ,it was the telephone exchange that i first saw. 90% of the time i have no idea what your talking about when it comes to electronics but i find it all fascinating. Its great that people like yourself keep all these instruments and machine's alive.
Wonderful engineering and technology for its time (and now) taking care of so much to keep the music going easily. No need to skip leg day now lol.
Check out the piano roll compositions of Conlon Nancarrow. "Conlon's work has been seen as the analog predecessor to MID music"
What a great video! I never would have guessed that the way it reads the roll is by pulling a vacuum against the paper and the holes break the vacuum on the different notes to operate the valve.
Also amazed at how well it stayed in tune while being moved. Obviously not perfectly so, but it wasn't as terrible as I thought it might be.
It would be cool to figure out how to print your own rolls. You could make complicated bass lines and play the higher keys by hand.
Amazing! I live in Boston, MA USA and in the early and mid 1990s (and probably for a long time before that) an old man would somehow bring one of these player pianos to Harvard Square (in Cambridge - not UK :-) ) and busk with it *outside* on the street most weekend nights. He would sit there pumping the pedals and people would stand around on the side of the road and put money in the ole basket. I never saw the piano get delivered - he must have had a small van of some kind.
Seeing the Dropkey Murphys' first live performace was a real treat!
If Tocatta and Fugue in D-minor is typically an organ's theme, then the player piano is The Entertainer. I'm surprised that one wasn't on a roll somewhere. But it still had a neat playlist none the less.
Wow, that mechanism is beyond complicated and wow to you for fixing it up - love the explanations as you go - thank you so much.
You should add a big lever on the wall to one side so that Henry can take over from the peddling.
You could play it while it is playing, Throw in some harmonies and extra big chords. Is very cool, not how i would have guessed how thay work at all. A midi controler would be great. If you got a bit of paper with holes for all the D F and A notes you could play a 7 octave 21 note D minor (saddest of all the chords) as long as one atmosphere is enough presure
Wintergatan could learn something from it ;)
Neighbor down the street from me had one when I was a kid.. loved playing it
The red line on the rolls indicates tempo variations. You most follow the line wite te leve of tempo thats extacts below the red ondulated line.
This is to add fell to the pianola.
You don't have to follow. Everything is optional in this world :)
Now , part 2, diy plotter that will "print" (i.e carve out the holes) a new roll based on a midi feed 😅
8:24 - I know i am getting ahead of you but hot damn that paper tape reader is sooo cooool, what geniuses. the whole blimmin thing is pneumatically powered
19:57 Moonlight Sonata MVT3 My Absolutely Favorite piece of Piano Music 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻 Good Choice Sam
thank you I was going nuts trying to find the name of the composition. It's been in my head on repeat since I saw the trailer for this episode on facebook 🥲
we had one of these in our house when I grew up, amazing rebuild. well done.
I was about to ask about the possibility of such a MIDI box, but of course it is already in progress :).
Sticking keys are usually swallon lead weights in the back of the key. Usually filed or shaved off using a chisel.
Hey. Great episode. I love all your work, as crazy as it sometimes get, but so much joy in electronics and mechanics. As a board member of the Amsterdam Pianola Museum I love it that you now showed a pneumatic/mechanical machine, with all the amazing technique created ca. 110 years ago. This is an 88-note system, with the in 1908 standardised roll type for common player piano's.
You played every roll way to fast haha. Was fun to see. Every roll begins with a tempo suggestion, and that red line suggest where to slow down or accelerate. And the real fun is to carefully play with some tempo freedom and lots of dynamics (pumping more or less air). Then suddenly the mechanical sound disappears and it becomes music.
Because that is the reason it is an air-sucking mechanism. It was the only way to accurately play PIANO and FORTE instantly by changing the pumping energy.
Success with the museum, the crazy marvellous organ and now this ancient relic of old pneumatic fun.
I can't honestly say I ever looked at a self playing piano and thought "well that looks simple, I could knock one out in my garage!" hats off to you for your attempts as always
My grandparents had one of these. When i was a wee nipper I used to pump the pedals as hard as possible to make the tunes play ridiculously fast. I never knew how interesting the mechanism was inside.
Oh man, I love watching that thing work.
Well! It's unsalted beef tallow for ALL my squeeky bushed bearings, from now on!
This was a lot of fun, thanks. I learned today that player pianos have auto-tracking, and that's amazing.
Do you realize that this is the very first recording technology? It's literally an analog recording of the performance. They even used to edit them by hand, cutting and pasting bits of paper together, and even punching out the glissandos and fancy trils by hand. I find it incredibly facinating to hear 100, 150 year old interpretations of music -- it's often different from how we hear the same pieces today. In partiular, it's always amazing to listen to the playing of the world's very first recording star, Scott Joplin.
When you see someone just casually tuning a whole flippin piano on the side of their actual complicated enough task, you know you've been looking at a special kind of crazy genius.
Thanks for showing how they work ! Took a lot of the mystery away for me 😅
Seeing this video reminds me of some of the time I spent with my Grandfather as a kid. He was always fixing player pianos and recruited me to hold various nuts and bolts as he combined one of these pianos and a pipe organ. Thanks for putting this video together!
I Love it ! Can't wait for it to have midi.
The most amazing thing about this video is that the pianola was still somewhat in tune.
I didn't know that that was something I needed to know. Awesome! I dug the pneumatic engine! Thanks again for the opportunity for vicarious tinkering!
I love the first waltz "Destiny"!! Apparently it was the last song they played on the Titanic
One should be able to 3D print a MIDI interface. Tuned up and in concert with the pipe organ will be a show indeed.
That is fantastic! So fascinating! Thank you so much for sharing this journey.
A-maze-ed! Inspired and educated. Thanks for your continued inspiration...
My piano, a 1960s Duo-Art Aeolian, pushes up on the keys at the rear where they meet the hammer mechanism. So by design, the keys go down. Mine also, thankfully, has a built in vacuum pump. They were advertised as the only dual play piano; pedal or electric pump.
"An der schönen blauen Donau" sound beautifull on it.
The things people can think up are amazing. All those pneumatic mechanisms! Thanks for showing all the parts, so cool.